Why Muhammad Ali Jr is so Weak in Baki 2020? 

Muhammed Ali Jr: What did i do wrong. Baki: Uuh, born as a side-character.

It went downhill for him, after the fight with Jack. It's like Jack whooped the plot armour out of jr. 😂

Simple answer. He was trained to be a sportsman not a warrior

I just realized that everyone in Baki when they fight had a red light in their eyes but ali has a blue one, which shows that he only fights to win, but never to kill

Simple reason: No PP training

The life of a side character, how tragic....

He wasnt just defeated, he was humiliated repeatedly. It's almost like Mohammad Ali took a loan from Baki creators and refused to pay them back.

I totally agree with you, his lack of willpower is his downside

Muhammad Ali Jr. is the closest thing to a “regular guy” that Baki’s universe can provide.

Some people have already said it, it wasn't his skills it was because the Japanese audience HATED him. He was built up to be a rival to baki... and I think that would have worked out if the author didn't also make him a romantic rival as well.

Well its easy for Baki to say " Ali was not ready to lose his life", because Baki literally cant die in his own Anime, even if he gets headshot the author will still make him survive.

He’s not even weak. The dudes he tried to fight were monsters.

finally someone who actully knows what he's talking about

Ngl they did Ali extremely dirty, Ali was one of the few fighters who'd be more than happy dieing in the ring, little upsetting that they just wrote his son to be a simp

Muhammad Ali: My son will carry in my legacy. Ali Jr: DAMMIT DAD IM A SIDE CHARACTER.

in the manga, baki mentioned to kozue that a single punch by ali jr. would have probably knocked him out.

Ali Jr. made Yujiro look like an idiot lol.

Real answer: Because the author needed stepping stone for Baki to prove his worth to his father. I would have liked the fight more if it was longer than 3 minutes.

You forgot to mention that he didn’t lose his pp

Here's the thing: Doppo says being injured isn't an excuse. Ok. So why didn't you go after Shibukawa after he fought Jack at the Maximum tournament, and get your win back, right then and there? Or even a few days later, Jack messed him up so bad he'd need a year to recover. And Shibukawa, why haven't you challenged Jack to a rematch, ever? The two can soapbox about being ready to fight any time, or fighting hurt, but they ONLY targeted Ali Jr. like this. They're sore losers, who had some fun with breaking the newbie. Simple as that. Makes me glad that Jack royally fucked up Shibukawa now, he deserved it.

Let's be real, despite his youth and lack of experience he went up against the Japanese cast and beat them handily. He's still easily one of the most terrifying fighters in the manga, and the second fighter with the most potential after Baki, even beating Jack.

Simple answer, he must learn to kick his opponent's balls.

The answer: The writer of Baki has always been inconsistent with his characters and changes dynamics to fit whatever new fantasy he has.

The scene where JR approached baki in the forest with the tree instantly gave away that theres something off with the writing. Changing the spirit of character consept of JR instantly. Also baki reacted to him and he approached baki like their decent allied relantionship with eachother was suddenly broken and mistrustful. The scene where JR trolled Yujiro for laying on his back was legendary, it had real wisdom about of martial arts. "If strong opponent lays on his back all you need to do is leave and neither gets hurt" JR was all about kindness wisdom and perfection of martial arts in a way of sport. He was never about deathmatches. and he would never agreed upon fighting to the death. And he should stayed that way. but in that scene in the forest turned him instantly to obsessed, misguided sociopathic who becomes nemesis for the main charachter by some impulsive idea in writing that baki needs and enemy to step on to reach his father.

I like the way you went about analyzing his character, but to put it short and simple: He's not Japanese, Doesn't have any sort of Japanese blood, nor does he have a Japanese fighting style. In Baki the rules are simple: Japanese relation to some degree, even if minimum, equals Good fighter that gets respect. If you're none of the above, you're just a punching bag.

"Art of Ali?" He may have surpassed Ali physically, but Jr doesn't have the emotional strength of his father. Ali stood up to an entire *NATION* for God's sake.

he wasn’t weak, he’s just not as strong as the strongest *follow me on twitter: HidMyGlock*

I mean the dude was literally on the ending cut scenes running alongside Baki and he was destroying everyone and then out of the blue he gets beat 4 straight times, never gets a chance to recover and then gets beat with 2 attacks after all this build up. Why even have him on the show? Hard work Bobby Walker gave top wrestlers more trouble than Ali Jr and he was a career WCW jobber lol

jr is the most powerful character in the series who doesn't just live to fight. he just doesn't have the drive to be the best fighter, and honestly that's okay. i feel sorry for him more than anything, since everyone in the baki world just sees this as weakness, when really being true to yourself and admitting that his fathers dream of being the best isn't his dream takes a lot of strength in its own right. if he gets reintroduced in the manga, i hope he has found someone he loves and that loves him, and perhaps he can eclipse his former self to protect that love.

Tried to steal main character's girl and main character's spot as main character. Baki showed him we can't have that.

I agree, Ali jr is an extremely powerful fighter, but the thing that separated Baki and Ali is mental strength. In the build up towards his match against Baki his courage declined dramatically.

he really wasn’t weak tho💀 they just kept beating his ass without any recovery, he was servin hands to everybody up until he fought Jack😴😂😂

I like Ali Jr; besides the whole love triangle they tried to push. It did not help him that he was going into a deathmatch on a losing streak. If I learned anything from playing video games competitively/professionally you never go into a match cold or on a losing streak.

Basically we've only seen like 50% percent of his true strength, since he really doesn't want to kill or hurt that much anyone, even with Baki or all the others fights, as much Knock out them.

During the death row inmates arc the baki cast was taught an important lesson: fights aren't always fair. The characters had to be able to fight anywhere, anytime, in any condition and thats something that Ali Jr never experienced being a sportsman.

I love how this anime tell us that Street fighting is different than Sport fighting..

Nobody: Hanmas: *dominates the entire human race if they want to*

I think Ali Jr. is actually pretty cool outside of his simping, and though I doubt it considering how old the manga is, I kinda wish Jr. would get a sort of redemption arc where he reflects on where he went wrong, and decides whether or not he truly loves fighting enough to try and get back onto the same power-level as the main cast

It was so confusing, cause they do an excellent job describing boxing as a martial art in raitai, it’s a lot faster than most martial arts, about being nimble and getting single hit’s often as opposed to trying to land one devastating technique. Using that the writers have him clapping kaioh punching bags, doppo and shibukawa, and he was a great way to mix up the fights, as well as building him up as a decent challenge for baki. Then they have him take an L to jack, but in such a way that they could easily frame it as him learning from it and again building to a close fight with baki. And then they beat his ass 3 more times and the fight with baki was humiliating, he was looking like a top 5 character at one point then suddenly just went rock bottom.

I hope his character gets an arc where he becomes an interesting fighter, I would love to see it because it seems, he actually took the time and got motivation he could be in the same tier Baki and Jack

1. Ali doesn't really know how to go for the kill, this was pretty obvious from the start. 2. Narratively Ali was the only thing stopping Baki from challenging Yujiro, I'm pretty surprised Ali jr is still alive, he was meant to put Baki's commitment and will in the line

Simple, he tried to steal the main girl of the protagonist.

Honestly I'll give you a real answer. That was a display of how Japan feel about African American athletes. They built him up first but all his opponents felt disgusted losing to him. Its like in real life when a person pretends to be humble yet the truth is revealed upon defeat. They rematched as cowards and mind you no other characters have been done this way. Also they gave you about display about kung fu unrealistic for yujoro to defeat a guy who was known as among the best in history. If doppo or aikido master lost to baki they never came at him like that. Also look at how baki was straight up was going to kill him yet he fought no one else like that. Its hidden that Japan has a dislike for China and African Americans. Always remember history is written by those who won so you will only get the winners version. But theres always the truth. Beat Muhammad Ali jr down don't give him a chance to improve and humiliate him. That's my truth and what I see. When u respect someone you want dog them out like that because a true victory in bikinis when u face someone at 100 percent. And that's Japan principles not mine. Watch dbz goku vs frieza.

An athlete trains to fight, a fighter lives to fight, a warrior fights to live. Jr is an athlete.

He's a skilled fighter, but he needs to become a skilled warrior, a fully trained killer. He needs to know the feeling of taking one's life and risking his own life. Ali jr's mentality is still stuck at being a sportsman. Even his father knows the fact that there is no excuses in a real fight, whether you're eating, injured, having sex etc. Ali Sr. understands how the underground world works, he knows the risks that they have to take and the sacrifices that they have to make in order to become the strongest. While Ali Jr. thinks that knocking them out is enough to be called a victory and he also thinks that knocking them out quickly is a sign of respect because for him, they are just old people who knows a thing or two about martial arts. He also mentioned that he didn't want to hurt them unnecessarily. He's literally belittling them. When he picked a fight with orochi & shibukawa, he acted like it was just a friendly sparring without even realizing that he's digging his own grave. Also, he just wants to fck kozue.

Why was he weak? Cuz the story needed someone to sacrifice to setup Baki being ready to challenge Yujiro.

another thing that separated baki from ali. jr. jr. wanted to be the strongest, which meant beating baki. baki had no interest in being the strongest. he just wanted to beat his dad, who just so happens to be the strongest. for baki, he just was happy being a little bit stronger than his dad. another reason i just thought of was something that should've been obvious. look at their bodies. baki's body is covered in scars while jr.'s from free from scaring. that should tell you enough about the worlds they lived in.

real answer: its not from japan

The fact Doppo and Shibukawa after fighting him said he could beat the Baki that they knew shows he was not weak at all. At the point in the story that he fought Baki it's pretty obvious he'd have beaten the Baki that won the Maximum Tournament. The thing was Baki's own growth didn't slow down at all despite the fact he's pretty much stopped training by that point in the story. He had gotten much much stronger by then. So much so he'd likely be able to beat both Doppo and Shibukawa 2v1. You can call me an idiot for thinking that but it's my opinion.

He let that chick get into his head and lost focus on the real prize. To win the right to fight Yujiro.H. # The Strongest. Or have you forgotten how it went for Samson when he fell in love with Delilah

I felt bad for him at his fight with shibukawa. I don't even know why he though it was a good idea to try to fight baki after having his body destroyed by those 3 freaks

He's really strong but he lacked the right mentality that Baki and the other fighters had.

only reason he got weaker was because he didn't do enough pp training.

It would be pretty interesting to see Ali go through a mental self-improvement of sorts. And then showing up and kicking some really powerful new guys ass with stoicism and a will to win even at the cost of his life...maybe when something he cares about deeply (besides Kozue fml) is threatened. Get that moment where he finally realizes he can't hold anything back and has no room to mentally give up. Everything is on the line and he HAS to win.

Ali jr. is not weak, Baki is just too strong

The manga is shaping him up for Prisoners Arc 2. How can he take on a pos like Dorian at his current state of mind?

Because he's an american and the author is a japanese simple as that

Arguments I've seen: His race cost him his failure. Him being a side character cost him being a failure. The plot cost him being a failure. Him trying to take Baki's girlfriend cost him his failure. The writer cost him his failure. Honestly, it feels like everyone is pissed at ali being humiliated or taking action at Kozuwa. I feel like Ali should be used again, but I doubt he will come back, since the "manga" does not show him coming back. I must say, this ark with jr was boring, most of the fights were one sided. Obviously, powerful characters mean quick matchers. Its obvious baki is going to win most or all fights, hell, the story is him reaching his goal to defeat his father. The first baki season was pure entertainment at its peak when it came to the fights. Here, it's rather boring. Its sort of like drinking your favorite drink, but most of it is water or something entirely bitter beyond human tolerability.

The real reason why Baki won is the mentality for sure. Ali was thinking of how strong Baki was while Baki was probalby thinking how after he defeats ali he will be one step closer to fight his dad on equal terms.

I think Muhammad Ali Jr still needs more experience to become a skilled fighter, sure he knows boxing and the style that his father has. But like you said, he definitely lacked experience against people who had other styles of fighting. Not to mention that....I dont even think he has had sex . Somehow sex boosts the proficiency of a fighter😎

Muhammad Ali jr wasn’t weak Baki just got a big buff from his last patch

he became a punching bag lmao,amd he deserved it,he was so cocky and confident that he even thought he could take on hanmas,like c’mon

As a one smart man said:" in the baki universe you are what you imagine." He had no imagination

Baki’s brief fight against Alai Jr. is the penultimate act of New Grappler Baki - bringing its story full circle. In the first series, aside from his battle with Gaia and the Yasha Ape - Baki’s matches are confined to the underground arena. He’s a martial artist, but in the vein of a sportsman - rather than a warrior. He’s earnest, entertaining, but we also learn that Baki’s able to empathize with people through combat. He firmly believes in the etiquette of competition, if you will. Yujiro fiercely rejects those sentiments though. The central narrative running beneath the entirety of New Grappler Baki though, is that fights aren’t always relegated to a “match.” There isn’t always a ring, there isn’t always a bell, and there aren’t always rules of engagements. The escaped death row convicts embody that reality. And, as the Most Evil Death Row Convict Arc progresses - we see Baki slowly accept that reality. Whether he realizes it or not, he’s slowly beginning to understand his father’s vantage. During the Great Chinese Challenge, we see this drastic shift in Baki’s character too. Without remorse, he sends Kaku reeling with a series of devastating blows. Baki shows no interest in introducing himself or familiarizing himself with Kaku’s technique - he just crushed him. Now, the Godlike Clash of the Children typifies this point. Muhammad Alai Jr. is a sportsman first: a competitor whose experience is relegated to the ring. He fights for things like Kozue’s affection. Not to survive. That’s why Shibukawa and Orochi both make the distinction between matches and real fights. That’s why Jack crushed him. That’s why in his rematches with Shibukawa and Orochi, he lost. Alai Jr. is meant to illustrate that metamorphosis in Baki. Alai Jr. is what Baki was, but what he was simply wasn’t enough.

I hope in season 3 we see an evolution change within Ali jr it would be amazing knowing one of everyone favorite characters is gonna get stronger would be great

All i know is they better turn his character around if their gonna use the best boxer of all time for a story line.

I hated how he was put into the storyline he could have been cool for Baki to fight but when he went to kozue I was annoyed that the writers chose to go that direction when that was totally unneeded

Doppo was betting on Jr to win the fight against Baki, and Baki also mentioned that Jr could have easily knocked him out with one punch. So yeah, it was all a matter of mentality.

simple answer : he isnt japanese

He didnt have strong enough plot armor

Felt like they spat on Ali's legacy.

He didn’t do enough PP Training

Another Possibility is that Muhammad Alai Jr. did not get PP training.

You lack hatred, Ali jr.

I'm very upset by how Muhammad Ali is treated in the anime. He was one of the greatest fighters of all time and an idol for many generations. It's a shame to see a representation of him get destroyed like this. It seems to me that the writers were tyring to represent how superior Japanese are in comparison with other nations. First they destroy 4000 years of chinese fighting tradition and then they humiliate the best heavyweight boxer of all time. If they wanted to tell a story of a boxer who isn't able to adapt to a fight without rules they could've created their own boxer instead of choosing Muhammad Ali for this. Next to that, what the anime is trying to say doesn't make any sense neither. Combat sports like Boxing or MMA give you a way bigger advantage in a street fight than Martial Arts and brawling. That's why most MMA fighters rely on combat sports than on Martial Arts. Somebody who uses traditional asian martial arts would get destroyed by a boxer. I think that's why asian movies and shows try to show how superior their own fighting is towards the western combat sport. But the reality is different. 4000 years of traditional martial arts are worth nothing against a professional boxer, wrestler or muay thai fighter.

Something worth mentioning is that the "Art of Ali" is only in its first generation after being completed. It doesn't have many techniques, so it's very linear and inflexible.

Yeah, you can see the difference when Ali does his crazy smile when he's facing away from Ali Jr. Ali loves fighting so much that he's still ready to beat down his own son (and even with his illness) and would love every second of it. Ali Jr doesn't dream about being the strongest man, just about being happy. There's nothing wrong with being happy - it's probably the better goal. But don't step in the ring with people who have already thrown away everything for strength. Go live a normal life, Ali Jr.

Baki is practically a martial arts series written by a Japanese supremacist. "America nuked the hell out of us twice in Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Let's make it so that the Hanma family kicks the American military's ass single handedly. Did Tenshin Nasukawa get his ass kicked by Floyd Mayweather in a boxing bout? Eh, how about we draw Muhammad Ali getting politely owned by Yujiro, and then 💩 on his legacy by creating a fictional son who becomes a body-bag for all of the main Japanese cast."

As much as i understand the "sportsman vs warrior" point, to me it looks more of itagaki just getting pissed at his own character for making Japanese fighters look bad than actual plot reasons behind his humiliation

So pretty much the writers hoed this guy to having any true potential. Lol

Thank you very much it really hurt to see him cry like he did im a fan of real boxing and when i saw them star Muhammad ali and gave him a son i thought the baki and ali jr fight was going to be awesome but i was wrong..

Because he is a real life character and real Muhammad Ali jr isnt even a boxer lol only his daughter laila boxes, and also this anime loves yo disrespect real combat sports athletes so that's the reason, these Japanese people dont like to make other ethnic people stronger then them.

Real answer: Baki has bad writing. But it’s so manly and epic we all love it anyway. But imo this is one of the biggest Ls in this glorious manga

because the author already decided that he is a chump when he wrote him to try to steal nozue for no real reason. The author was deadset on making ali look bad, he got rekt, and people can look to him trying to steal baki's gf as justification.

My guess before I watch to the end, He was a Simp

Here is my theory of what went wrong with Ali Jr. : The author got into boxing and suddenly found it a lot more interesting and wanted to shine his spotlight onto it, but then decided to NOT do that for whatever reason (maybe changed his mind on whether it's a good fighting sport) and instead quickly end this arc and go to the next. If you look at the Musashi arc and the Sukune arc you can see what happens if the author goes through with it. We get a full storyline about the best person with the fighting style and also a dive into the history of the fighting style. Which also affects strength levels in the manga. Sumo wasn't even fucking MENTIONED for the longest fucking time and all of a sudden we've got a guy with more grip strength than Yujiro and Hanayama as well as 5 strangers lining up against the top fighters of underground arena. Goes to show how the writer can change his mind of stuff so easily and fast. I think.

Hes a 1. Side character 2. *Simp* 3. Thinks hes strong because he perfected his fathers technique

I know what went wrong... The writers needed their asses handed to em for this absolute garbage storyline. They even had his father sucker punch him. Wtf.

He's not weak there just to strong 😂😂😂😂

They wanted to disrespect Ali without direspecting him directly.

I just finished watch that season. I still wish he was a least would fight on par with baki. But this is still a good video

Baki is on another league compared to him imo. He did pair and won against other fighters though.

basicaly it's because he isn't japanese. russian and american in this manga. any foreigner to this manga is basicaly punch bag for baki and any japanese fighter.

Doppo, shibukawa, and jack did their best to teach him but he wasn’t paying attention. Such a shame.

Title: "Why Ali.Jr is weak in Baki?" answer: Obviously he's a side character so he will lose anyway

not strong?! dude he got beat the f$$$ up by Jack

Baki storyline would have been more interesting if side characters had the ability to get stronger than yujiro and baki

If only Ali Jr was Japanese he'd be unstoppable!

Doppo, a skilled fighter who has fought both Baki & Ali Jr: "I think Jr. will win" This should've been enough to highlight how shitty the writing was here, at least he should've been given a better spotlight before being scrapped to irrelevance.

This won't happen in the series but an idea I think would be interesting and somewhat redeem Ali Jr is if he tried to get back into fighting but this time got coached by Yuri, the first boxer introduced in the series during the Childhood arc. It would somewhat be a way to bring Yuri back and try and lift Ali Jr back from what had happened to him.