Had to get a taxi today, my car was delivered to a garage for scheduled service and maintainance. The taxi was a battery car. The driver and owner of the taxi said that he liked to drive the car and that it worked great on local trips. On longer trips he was not too happy about it because of the range. It's -25C outside today, and he said that the car reported mileage at 50% of maximum range. He also said that the car would not charge to 100% in cold weather no matter how long he had it connected. He said he saved a bit on fuel cost compared to his diesel cars. In Norway electricity is rather cheap, also at charging stations because of tax credit incentives. My reply was, my old Toyota RAV4 diesel would go about the same distance regardless of the outside temps, and I would always get a full tank no matter the temperature. I also told him that outside Norway it might be more costly to operate a battery car as electricity prices are higher and tax incentives lower.
In Norway EV cars cost half or less of other cars due to the idioticly high taxes on cars... In UK a Nissan leaf cost the same as a BMW 3 series diesel, in Norway the same BMW cost more then double.
To be fair the reason Norway has cheap EVs is because they have so much oil that they have gotten rich from by exporting to other countries over many years. This has in turn allowed them to now invest in and favor EV technologies more than the other Nordic countries. However EVs are still not profitable alone just because there is a lot of them in Norway.
The automotive industry definitely jumped on the idea of making cars heavier across the board because it drives up cost in all sectors. Heavier cars means brakes and tires wear out faster, more energy is needed to push the heavy mf, and more high damage collisions happen more often as a result of the increased weight hindering maneuverability in emergency situations, leading to more money spent on insurance, repairs, and new cars.
The local (U.S. of A.) Nissan dealer had 3 power stations installed that could charge 6 cars at one time. This was when my wife purchased her Nissan NV200 van in 2019. A few days ago I picked up my wife at the Nissan dealer after she dropped her gas powered van off for service. There was only one charging station left and a sign on it that read, Out of Order!
I'm curious what the economic opportunity cost is of having that many people stand around waiting to charge their car. Many of these people could do remote work from their phones but lots won't have that option.
As someone from Europe, charging stations are often broken or out of service. They have also now introduced hefty fines if you leave your car after it is fully charged (people leave their cars overnight at the charging spots because they don't want to sit in the cold). Because people just leave their cars, those charging stations are going bankrupt, which means they have no money to repair broken chargers. It is a vicious cycle with more and more broken chargers, an utter mess.
@@sophieedel6324 And where is that in Europe? In the Benelux charging stations tend to work fine. Good thing fining those that mistake a charging spot for a parking place.
@@SuperDirk1965 In the Benelux. Most appartment blocks do not have charging infrastructure, so what people do is drive their car to the nearest charging spot and walk home. So the car is left at that spot, and the charging company doesn't make much money since those cars occupy that spot all day. So they introduced fines (60 euros per hour iirc) for every hour you stay beyond necessary, cameras enforce this. But this doesn't help since almost all EV are company cars and the company just pays the fine, so those charging companies are going bankrupt and what they're doing now is removing the chargers, and turning them into regular parking spots with meters, which makes them much more money.
yep 400kW - (Mechanical) per Charge stand... Well, it appears that NSW currently generates around 13,500 MW (13,500,000 kW)... How many Fast Charging EVs simultaneously can ALL THIS CAPACITY - - presuming a good bit of it is currently used for day to day power needs allowing 300kW per Fast Charger (electrical power, allowing for losses) Lets call that 45k EVs on Fast Charge.. Wonder if ?? - some simple maths, add in some residential and industrial loads... If we have 3M AirCon units chugging away at 3kW (lighting is insignificant, Electric Hot Water is already switchable according to demand)- there is still ~15k Fast Charge electrons in reserve POSSIBLE on the grid at full capacity. - We can probably provide the power (noting that an EV on "residential power" usually charges at around 3-5kW - not the 200-250kW on a futuristic fast charger) - BUT we definitely need more 500kV interconnects ( ~1000 hectares =2471Acres, of NEW land- easement clearing per 100km) to get the power up the coast and across the centre of this wide brown land.. Land ownership and people disliking HV lines in their back yard, makes trucking diesel across country (or pumping via pipeline) an easier pill to swallow - Let's just provide Elevation assistance as needed to Tuvalu etc.. (sending over shiploads of fresh water - or higher capacity Desalination plants - to avoid emptying their freshwater lens would have helped reduce subsidence - decades ago...... Note also: residential daytime Air-conditioning, energy usage can easily be supplied by solar - obviously this is real infrastructure at landowners expense (Make the most out of one's investment by only exporting what offsets grid connection fees and evening imports
Why not with 120 fuel bowsers and 98 EV chargers Buc-ees in Tennessee in the US does it and the Polestar that did a publicity run from Sydney to Perth had a diesel generator with it to recharge. Fun fact even with the support crew and mechanics the Polestar shit itself part way and had to be flatbedded into Perth. 😂🤣😂 John Cadogan did a story on it so I’m guessing the story is credible.
A relative is an HGV trunking driver and regularly uses motorway service areas. He regularly sees queues of cars at EV charging points. However these are rarely more than five or six cars long. If you have so little charge left and cannot reach another charging point and you are fifth in the queue at a bay charging point you could be wating for one or two hours for your turn and than another hour or so to charge up to 80%. Most of his time you have to be in your car to make sure you do not miss your turn. Try managing your journey times and appointments around this.
I live in Vancouver Canada arguably one of the safest cities in the world with the most polite people. I go for walks/bike rides all the time right by this gas station down the street from me that has EV chargers installed last year. I have seen several shouting matches and a few fights there and the manager says he calls the cops all the time to break up fights. If people in my country are getting so upset at these chargers I can only imagine what it is like in the USA for example.
@@kellyeye7224- would you sleep soundly knowing that underneath you is 7000 cells any one of which could potentially go into thermal runaway setting off a chain reaction?! I doubt that's a recipe for a restful night.
Would you travel on the channel tunnel or a car ferry knowing that there is a potential fire bomb EV onboard that could not be extinguished by the the existing fire suppression system?
For $1.5m you can either: put in a petrol station with 12 pumps has a peak ability to service 600 cars an hour with $30,000/hr revenue, or.... a 6 EV super charging stations that will charge 8 cars per hour and bring you in $1200 per hour revenue, if you are lucky. The only reason charging stations exist at all is because the government gives them free land. The chargers would not even raise the rent for the space they occupy.
Too bad you calculations fall apart because 95% of charging is done at home or at the destination. So we need only 5% of the charging stations compared to fuel stations.
It's funny but in Australia, the number of public EV charging stations has increased from 464 charging locations, to 800. That's around a 70% increase in the last 12 months. Now I did work in a service station once. Now 12 EV charging points will take up about 300 sqm, 24 about 600 sqm. No operator required. Lease costs for the site - maybe $1000 to $2000 per month or $1.39 to $2.78 per hour. For your 12 pumps, you would need around 2000 sqm land and that will cost you around $15,000 per month in lease costs, about $1.25 million to purchase the lease, wages for at least 4 people (1 x 3 8hr shifts plus 1 for backup/overlap/manager) or about $28,000 a month. These figures are real figures. The revenue from this service station (actual service station, regional city) is $6.5 million per year including non-fuel income. That's around $700 per hour in real income and a profit if the servo is well run/lucky. BTH, if you have to borrow 50% of the purchase price of a fuel station, you are never going to make a profit.
Maybe so, I don't live in Australia so I can't comment on costs....but you clearly have no experience of EV ownership. Most EVs are charged at home overnight when rates are cheap so there isn't so much need for rapid charging. When I am on a long trip I never take an hour to charge, 20 to 30 minutes max and my car is now old tech with a max charging speed of 75 kW, newer EV's can charge at 150 kW plus so with one of those it will be a 10 to 15 minute stop to grab a coffee, use the bathroom, add 200 km and I'm on my way. So your idea that 6 chargers could only deliver 8 charges per hour is way off. EV drivers don't hang around on a rapid once the car is up to 80% as its the law of diminishing returns on charging speed and 350 km of range is enough to finish off most journeys if you've already done 300km after charging from home
It was on the itv news about a month ago how pathetic it all is. They said EV's in the uk outnumber chargers by over 30 to 1 and it's getting worse not better. It wouldn't be so bad if they wasn't so laughably slow to charge up, who wants to sit in a scummy carpark waiting for a poxy car to charge up unless you are mental. The pro ev motoring journalist on the news said they have got reports of EV lemmings waiting up to 6 hours at public chargers. For anything other than charging from home for short journeys EV's are way too slow to charge up, then even worse after 80%. The battery technology on them is wank.
@@esecallum You can use the battery from 0-100%. But you should charge shortly after discharging and you should continue driving after a full charge to avoid charging states below 20% and above 80% for a longer time.
@@esecallum You don't waste any time if you can charge at home, at work, at the supermarket or any other location where you have something to do in the meantime. You drive an EV if comfort and sportiness matters to you. An EV is quiet, no vibrations, no stinking, no engine stalling, 1 gear automatic and a fantastic acceleration from the beginning. An EV is cheap to operate with low maintenance costs and cheap electricity prices. I can charge my EV for 0,25 €/kWh or 3,75€ for 100 km with 15 kWh/100km consumption. Diesel costs 1,62€/Litre in Germany where I live. With 5 Litres/100 km that makes 8,10€/100 km which is more than double compared to the 3,75€ for the EV. If you can charge at home and the EV takes 15 kWh/100 km or 24 kWh/100 miles how much would it cost for you and how much would you save compared to a fossil car? If you can charge at home and have solar panels on the roof, you can even charge for free or for the costs of the solar panels devided by the kWhs produced over the live time to be precise. And of course no CO2 or toxic gases are directly emitted. You don't drive an EV if you often drive long distances without the possibility to fast charge on the route or if you often have to pull a heavy weight trailer which exceeds the allowed tow capacity of the EV.
@@gerbre1 yeah i am gonna spend 21000 on crappy solar panels.news flash.Frigid cold, broken chargers leave Chicago area 350 Tesla owners frustrated and stranded.. haaa haaaa . have you been invited to DAVOS for your indoctrination session? or to sample Schwabs dongle?
Let's not forget that EV charging stations capacity and speed are dependent on how many cars are there. If you have 10 stalls connected to one electrical input source, and one car charging, it'll get the maximum. Add another car and it drops. Add another, same thing. Whereas with liquid fuel filling stations, each dispender/bowser assembly contains a 22 GPM fuel pump drawing from a large tank (or tanks) underground, and refueling speed is consistent, regardless of how many vehicles are there.
@@rattusfinkusJust shows that 95% of EV owners have the financial clout to live in a property whick can have provision for personal charging facilties, equally, the cost of buying, insuring and depreciating costs of the EV is probably also of no concern. So 5% of owners are left with the lottery of : a) being able to get to charger with the charge remaining in the battery b) hoping (praying) that the charger, when found, is in working order c) praying again that there is not a lengthy queue d) they have the correct app to allow charging e) there is enough food and refreshments available to sustain their stay f) worry about how much weight they are putting ion at charging stations That is forgetting the huge carbon footprint for the average EV car outweighs that of an ICE car in the first place and that the charger is not powered by a diesel generator or that the vehicle is not written off by a small insignificant collision, again doubling or trebling the carbon footprint, or worse, increasing the carbon footprint manyfold caused by a spontaneous combustion incident.
one reason imho it has been hijacked ( our democracy has been)politicians arent in charge anymore ( maybe they we never be) GLOBILISTS are. YES, Albanese is one . Hence piss 450 mill up a wall for a referendum NOBODY wanted
Saw a vid recently where a uk ytuber did a range test towing a caravan. The van halved his range which was kind of expected, but the other interesting point was that to charge you would need to unhitch the van. Idiocy.
@@joshcheck7532 Because the charging bay is the length of a car and not the length of an HGV. The caravan would block the road. The EV chargers are usually where the handicapped bays are right next to the door of the service station building.
@@joshcheck7532 The charging point on the EV was located at the rear & the leads won't reach. OR, the caravan would block the path of other EV users who want to get past it.
@@subwayfacemelt4325 Just try to imagine taking your caravan into any normal car park if you're having problems with the reality of EV charging. Now try it on a bank holiday weekend with EV cars on 50% of the normal range. Please send a Google Maps reference of any Australian charger set up for trailer tow vehicle charging. Plenty of petrol stations can handle it. Something I never even had to plan when towing my boat which I could fill at the same time.
Imagine charging somewhere in remote areas and you're approached by a team of 5 well behaved locals who just want to get to know you and talk to you about your wonderful EV experience.
True hey, and they're well behaved until they get really close then they get very angry because you tell them the battery in your EV is almost out of charge and it's going to take 3 hours to charge back up again. They then storm off in disgust looking to chat to someone who owns an ICE car.
wouldn't get too excited - he's putting out content that goes against the approved narrative - only a matter of time before he starts picking up community violations, demonetized and shadow banned once he's on the algorithm radar.
Everything he says is fundamentally wrong. His estimates of how long it takes to 'charge your car' are incorrect. Yes, if EVERY time you charge your car you are going from 0% SOC to 100% SOC it could well take 30 minutes @250 kW...but no EV owner ever does that. My typical routine is to plug in once a week at home overnight when the SOC gets to around 25%-30%. Do I care if it takes 8 to 10 hours to charge?...No, I'm sleeping ...I take it to 80% overnight so I wake up with another 350 km of range, more than enough for most people's week of driving. That costs me under €5....try filling your ICE tank for that much money!...On long trips I charge to 100% overnight and stop after 2 to 3 hours when I've done about 250 km...that was always my routine in ICE cars anyway. By that time the car is down to between 30 and 40% SOC so I plug in for 15-20 minutes while I grab a coffee and use the bathroom...that gets the car back up to 80% SOC..so I have 350 km of range again, plenty to finish off a 500km drive.
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 Totally unsuitable in Australia , where trips are longer and electricity is in short supply and rising in price due to an irrational supporting of unreliable renewable wind and large solar generation instead of coal generation.
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 Your drive is clearly shorter than mine. Per 5 days of travel my car goes 400km. Also tonight's temperature will get to as low as -18C, which would be dreadful on the batteries with the heater also using up range. EVs need to be better than your experience to meet my needs.
I live in rural Scotland, we had a 6 unit charging station installed in a central car park this summer, I park near it most days. So far the only time I have seen anyone park a car next to one of the charge points it has been a Diesel when the carpark is otherwise full. The problem is this small town is 75 miles from the next so an EV is hard to sell when a "local trip" is 150 miles return as a minimum. About once a month I need to do 800 - 900 miles in a single day, which I doubt is unique round here. Even if there was an EV that could fullfill my needs I wouldn't even be able to afford the VAT aspect of the purchase price.
@@sugarnads a regular 150 mile round trip is an ideal case for an EV, particularly if you can charge at home off peak, you'll save thousands on fuel bill, which is why EVs are popular for high milers.
Do I want to have to rely on my smart phone to find an available charging site? No! Do I want to have to rely on my smart phone as my only method of payment? No! Am I comfortable with my wife using a remote, unattended charging site? No? Am I comfortable with leaving my vehicle unattended for an hour or so while charging, as I go about my business elsewhere? No! It's as if all the knowledge of refueling from the last 100 years of gas (petro) stations has been lost or ignored.
Interesting… my Tesla is connected with the Internet, so it knows where the SuperChargers and Destination chargers are. When I plug into the Supercharger, the car identifies itself with the charger, and the billing to my credit card happens automatically. No smart phone. Is involved. Hmm… I leave my vehicle unattended while I’m shopping or doing chores all the time. I really don’t understand why you would feel uncomfortable why it makes any difference that it’s also charging at the same time I’m doing my grocery shopping? As for my wife charging? She buys gasoline for her car now, I’m sure. She’s capable of inserting a charging nozzle into the car. Oh… you’re worried about safety!? Tesla puts in SuperChargers near to where there are restaurants and/or shopping. After plugging in, she could go shopping! (Or sit in the car and watch Netflix or RU-vid).
@@adairmartin Confused, I park my truck at the station, go in for restroom break and a coffee (once a week) hand the guy $60 bucks and drive off.. what else are you gibbering about?
@@rrnonya5472 Confused, I park my Tesla at their Supercharger, no money passes hands, my car is ready to go before I finish my restroom and coffee break...what else are you gibbering on about?
@@rrnonya5472for real. These guys boasting about using a Tesla superchargers are dumb. They get an EV without a daily place to charge at home/work and then go through mental gymnastics about thinks they can do while their Tesla is fast charging 😂😂😂 the biggest benefit of getting an EV is to charge at home every day and start the next day “with a full tank”. You should NEVER have to use a Tesla Supercharger unless you are traveling. If they’re irresponsible enough to get an EV and rely on Tesla Superchargers, they deserve the consequences for their reckless actions. Fast charging can damage the battery too
Simon, You would be aware of the " Twin Servo's " an hour out of Sydney on the pacific Highway. One either side which probably have 50 or more pumps each. Every weekend and holiday plus many peak times, these petrol stations can not only be full but in holiday time, have a long line of cars out onto the slip road. How on earth are they going to replace facilities like these which at the outset have vehicles there for 10 Min from the time they pull up till the time they leave the pump with chargers that are going to take 30 Min at very least. Obviously some people will want to fully charge and be there closer to an hour. 50 stalls at even 100KW ea is 5 MW..... on each side of the road. Plus you have the use of the restaurants and whatever in the main facility itself. That alone will take enough power to run a heavy industrial area and it won't even come close to being enough. You would want 3 Times the charging stalls to equal the throughput of vehicles to the pumps as a bare minimum to just be as inadequate as the places are now. No possible way you are going to even get onto a stall in 30 Min PLUS charging time. That 5 MW per site just blew out to 15MW+ Each, so at a bare minimum, 30 MW for both....... and you will still have long cues, absoloutley longer than now. You are looking at putting in enough power to run a small steel works or over 1.05% of the biggest thermal power station in NSW... which is slated to be closed next year....... In just 2 facilities! and that would be a fraction of the power requirement for the central coast in EV charging let alone Sydney which that power station also serves! Obviously another power station of similar size is going to be needed to just supply power to the EV's on the central coast and Sydney if they even hit 50% of vehicles and that's not even taking into account the massive power trucks would use. And this is from a grid where they get on the media and tell you to turn your AC up to a higher temp to cut down on power useage on a hot day! just wait for a wet week in winter!! This EV garbage is NOT going to happen and with the green mania hell bent on destroying reliable power and relying on the very thing the industrial revolution over came over 100 years ago, the weather, this is all beyond a farce!! Don't even get me started on the stupidity of the " Charge from Home solar" stupidity. Sure, charge from a 5 KW system at home when the car is at work..... and even if it is at home, what is powering the house while the EV is sucking down everything the soar is generating and pulling from the grid at the same time as well. Anyone that believes in this EV BS is a brainless idiot incapeable of doing their own critical thinking!
Why is it brainless? The simple solution in Australia is to build coal-powered power stations next to the charging station. You petrolheads need to think outside the box. 10 coal power stations in each city would be enough to do it.
Putting that sort of unbelievable energy consumption into perspective, that is more power than what an averaged sized electric arc furnace consumes. The cost of the transformer and high voltage transmission line infrastructure to make just a small area with 50 chargers will be astronomical.
@@diecastb lot of unfounded IF's in what you say but the bottom line is, the electrical demand from EV's will be massive and the Grid is falling behind in supplying regular demand now. There is NOTHING planned to meet that increased demand and don't give me the Big battery BS because that is STORAGE which is NOT the same as generation nor has the reliability of coal or gas power plants which are weather independent.
Want to experience owning an EV without having to pay for one? Try filling your gas tank with an eye dropper and see if you can adapt to the rate it takes to fill the tank. Now picture everyone filling up to that rate.
@@hobo1704 Hyundais and Kias with 800V system take 18 minutes from 10% to 80%. Of course you can charge only for 15 minutes to gain additional 240 km range.
The whole EV con is coming to light with never ending flaws - it will starr to fall apart. I pass a small retail park carpark evryday going to and from work and back in August they installed 4 charging ‘stations’ which is ridiculous considering the size of the relatively small car park. But not only that but they are STILL covered up and not working as of this week… such an effective job, obviously Great video
The 'con' can go on for a very long time, longer than your or my patience limits. I have seen cons go on for decades without crashing or people still believing lies. Like, Mainstream media lies O9/11 lies Esteen story lies Odama birth certificate lies
The con is defending a fuel system with an artificial price, and a delicate global supply chain. Oh and if you use the word "Tesla", none of your statements about charging systems means anything.
Electricity can be liquified. It's called e-fuel. However you need 5 times more energy and therefore it costs a lot more compared to direct charging. It is assumed there is no market for it as no one is willing to pay so much more.
Its a battle between realism and ideology. Engineers live in the real world because thats where their solution lie. Unfortunately, the people who make the decisions like local authorities, are often in those jobs for ideological reasons. They have a kind of infantile way of seeing the world. To them, economics has no input as even if it means having to have permanent subsidies thats ok because it meets their ideological objectives.
@@ghost307 Boeing is a case in point - who needs bolts on a plane door, why employ a western engineer when an Indian can do your MCAS software for $7/hour, and pressurized bulk heads let the sub-contractor drill the holes anywhere they want.
@@rwlewkoI think it’s people who have enough brains to understand how charging a car works that are fine. It’s a simple process that subtely different to the mentality of going out your way to find a petrol station and paying loads all the time.
It also wastes power in higher electrical losses. For a fixed sized plant those losses go up as the square of the power drawn. Or to keep losses the same material required for a similar design go up as the square of energy delivered.
It depends on how well managed the batteries are. The degradation has been studied, and after 100K miles it tends to be in the 1% range, below statistical significance.
@@darrennew8211 This would literally defy scientific laws. And has been proven false as we get to see actual cases over time. There is a recent case where someone using it for Uber over the last year had the battery completely die on them and then Tesla claimed that always fast charging it was battery abuse and refused to cover it under warranty. And the worst part is Tesla is right. Fast charging is extremely damaging to batteries. One problem with the "studies" is that this damage isn't linear. It happens much more suddenly when it finally dies.
1st and some 2nd gen batteries sure and probably cheap batteries; but modern BMS mitigates this to ~2% loss (vs 6-10%) in conjunction with modern batteries.
There are some government subsidies for charging stations, but to date, most have been funded from private equity. What you and many others are missing is that the stations require transformers and the lead times on these are typically years! You can't just decide to install a station. Furthermore, we are closing in on the limits of existing grid infrastructure, so that adding new high demand transformers stands to require grid upgrades that can make the pr9ject completely unfeasible. There's also an increasing demand for copper that will raise the metal price, making everything more expensive.
Them transformers are specially made overseas and shipping costs are enormous. Imagine all of the added towers and overhead high voltage transmission lines needed to make this feasible.
@@terrancecloverfield6791 Sabine did a piece on the infrastructure. Globally, it would cost about $27T to get just the grid up to par to support a global EV demand (and charging stations on top of that, IIRC). There was another article on the problem with the economics of charging stations, especially because the hardware is very expensive and e- delivery is *way* too slow right now! EVs are great for city use by rich people, but the governments really should stop pushing them. They could be spending the incentives monies on infrastructure for transportation, water supply and renewable electric generation. If the electrons are cheap enough, they'll price gasoline out of the market. Incentives are effective at prompting social change, but in many countries, they're being put on the wrong items. The auto manufacturers are simply appropriating the incentives with overpriced product offerings, so that spend isn't getting to consumers. This has been a boon to Tesla, but their party is just about to sing its swan song. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-UNBLhGsjHQI.html
Fun almost-irrelevant story: When fiber optics were invented, the phone companies in the USA said "Wow, we can replace all the copper with fiber, then sell the copper, and we'll make enough selling the copper to pay for installing the fiber!" What they didn't realize is they were the companies that were buying the vast majority of the copper, so the price plummeted as soon as they went to sell it. Moral: All this sort of cause-and-effect trouble is way more complicated than you can analyze just by looking at one or two things.
@@mikafiltenborg7572 Which will do nothing to provide normal people with transport which should be the purpose of a car. Is your crystal ball run on electricity or diesel?
@@davidvanderklauw There was no alternative where I live... The choice was big aweful party or big aweful party or the green aweful party... So I spoiled my ballot. I wrote 'None worthy of my vote'
“Turn off that light switch when you leave the room to reduce energy usage” “Turn down your thermostat in winter to reduce energy usage” “Use a lower temperature on your washing machine to reduce energy usage” …“Buy an EV, which consumes about as much power as half of your street, to save the planet” 🤡🤡🤡🤡
I've just fuelled up my vehicle with petrol. The whole process took 5 mins. The computer tells me I have a range of 930km. Give me an internal combustion engine any day !!
@@thosoz3431 Filled up my work company vehicle diesel with 192L currently $1.71 AUD cost $328.32. Range is approximately 2,023KM but also carry 40L diesel onboard tray. Love to see an EV complete this work with the weight, outback conditions and towing a 2.3 Ton trailer.
I own a diesel Ute with about 750km range and a EV and the EV is preferred for long distance travel. ICE still has a future for commercial vehicles and outback travel but EV passenger cars are already the best choice for the new car buyer.
Imagine the amount of land and concrete needed to build massive charging stations to accommodate all those ev wanting to charge. Not forgetting the ones sitting having to wait as well. 🇬🇧
EVs are not the answer. Chemical batteries are very poor at storing energy. Weight for weight diesels holds 5000% more energy and does not go into thermal runaway in a volcano of toxic gasses.
And yet they are being built, at least all over Europe and Tesla certainly do make money from them. The big money losers are the oil companies who are seeing petrol and diesel sales dropping off a cliff in Norway, Sweden, Netherlands...as EVs become a bigger and bigger percentage of cars on the road the decline of the oil industry is inevitable...and a good thing for everyone.
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 Aren't the plastic bodies of EV's made from products of the petro-chemical industry? and...The global appetite for oil is set to reach an all-time high this year, with purchases growing by nearly 40 per cent. Battery electric vehicle (BEV) adoption, expected to make up over 10 per cent of global auto sales, has not curbed oil consumption. According to a report by Morgan Stanley, the dichotomy between the rise in electric vehicle purchases and increased oil demand challenges conventional expectations. Norway, boasting the highest EV penetration globally, serves as a compelling case study. Despite EVs constituting 80 per cent of new auto sales, the country's oil usage has not collapsed.
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 Norway is reliant on the wealth fund built from selling oil and gas in order to subsidise those EV sales. That golden goose will lay fewer eggs eventually.
Nicola sturgeon's flagship hybrid ferry runs on diesel (you tube ) as battery will cost 1.5 million pounds to replace and will take 18 months to replace. Scottish ferries.
"A hybrid electric ferry hailed by Nicola Sturgeon is now only running on polluting diesel because a £1.5million battery is taking 18 months to replace. The MV Hallaig was the first in the world to use a system which cut carbon emissions by 20 per cent when it was launched in 2012. "But the battery broke on the £10million vessel in September and bosses have admitted it could be April 2025 before it’s fixed because the replacement part is no longer available."
Nobody wants to use public chargers. Its a "last resort" situation. On top of that the power draw is ridiculous. A single ev charge park can pull the power of a village. The cost of that the station has to eat is insane. And people complain about "high bills" during summer. Imagine your power bill if you had to pay the bill of you and your entire block
Yes. I've been telling the pure-plug-in zealots for years: "No one wants to charge outside the home." That means two things: 1. Range matters (600 miles EPA range minimum, or the market won't be captured). 2. Long trips would still be taken only with vehicles running on gasoline.
You have no idea what you're talking about. Public rapid chargers are for trip continuance only. They consume a tiny amount of the total energy for driving an EV.
Once Tesla open up their network to all EVs, another of their USPS disappears immediately (and as their claimed range predictions have now come under scrutiny, this further diminishes their appeal to the potential car buying public) and the chances of using their Superchargers without queuing will narrow exponentially with the massive increase in demand, for Teslarites as well as those idiotic enough to buy an EV. It’s a pity somebody hasn’t invented a cheaper, more practical, widely available, more efficient alternative to EVs. Oh hang on a minute, how about Fossil Fuel?
your statements are baseless. After nine years of Tesla's YoY growth, I've never waited to charge. Wait, maybe Tesla keeps pace with its sales when it comes to chargers? Could that be happening? Funny thing, planning. Hang on a minute, how about fossil fuel? Hmmm...physical fuel that must be carted to purchase points. Highly explosive, artificially priced, wastes about 75% of its energy as heat when it's burned. Oh and the tailpipe emissions will kill you. No thanks.
Fossil fuels are more expensive than renewable electricity. They are less practical than EVs as you can’t charge at home. And they are less efficient to the extent that they are non renewable. Oh and we are running out of them!
The funniest thing is that the same people who pushing for EV are the ones who says you can't have a AC at home coz that monster uses about avg. 0,5kW and thats ends mother gaia, while a car charging at 0,2MW is great coz thats saves it.
EV charging points need maintenance or repairs which obviously costs money. In the UK some supermarket installations started off all sparkly but quickly started to have the 'Not in use' signs appearing as they developed a fault. Service maintenance costs very quickly became an unwanted burden that some supermarket chains found unattractive.
Tesla really was the only one to figure this out. To sell cars, you need chargers, so we'll install chargers too. Then since it's all together, we'll tell people how busy the chargers are, whether there's any broken, and build the routing software to account for that.
Did you hear about how the Tesla chargers worked during this weekend's cold snap in America? The chargers stopped working but the Tesla app kept directing drivers to these stations. Imagine getting there with almost no charge and finding out the chargers don't work. Thanks Elon. Please get your brain implant. Actually, weren't they supposed to have rolled those out by now? I guess it's just like his Hyperloop, Boring Company and Robotaxis. The man's a pathological liar extraordinaire.
@@bunsw2070 By all means, tell us how the Tesla chargers failed in cold weather. Given that I've charged in all kinds of weather at a Tesla Supercharger, and that the Tesla mapping system has been dead-accurate with how many stalls are operating and available, I'm VERY INTERESTED in your information. Enlighten us with your PROOF, please. Prove that you're not confusing an Electrify America or EVGo system with Tesla. I can show you videos taken by EV channels where their Rivian went to multiple non-Tesla charging stations, all of those stations reporting "live", but wouldn't charge in the cold.
Having been into radio control cars. Planes. Helicopters etc my entire life I know that fast charging batteries is the best way to drastically reduce the life time of your batteries. Always better to trickle charge them. Presumably it’s the same with EVs. Fast charge all the time and knock 10 years off the life of your battery.
@JaxTellerRC: Retired EE agrees completely. Anyone who designs or works with batteries composed of Li-ion cells understands the limits, And the need for battery management systems to limit operation is excessive charge/discharge currents. If you exceed the limits of the cell chemistry, you will learn.........the hard way.
@@justsomeguy934 There's nothing more sophisticated about an EV battery. He knows exactly what he's talking about. And there's plenty of evidence already showing up that EV batteries die in as little as 1 year after being rapid charged too often. The laws of chemistry don't magically change because of "sophistication". Electrical batteries are a horribly inefficient way to store energy. And they always will be.
@@Cdaragorn "There's nothing more sophisticated about an EV battery. He knows exactly what he's talking about. " Really? A battery has no moving parts, uses a stable electrolyte, lasts 300,000 to 500,000 miles before degrading to 80%, and it's more sophisticated than, say a car engine? I'm not sure what your point is, you weren't clear. By all means, show your "plenty of evidence" that EV batteries die in a year. I can absolutely prove otherwise. RU-vid will delete any comment with an external link, so I can supply you with deconstructed links if you need. Oh and please explain why batteries are "horribly inefficient" at storing...ELECTRICITY. I'm not sure I know of any other means of storing...ELECTRICITY. Do you have a supply of dilithium crystals for the USS Enterprise or something?
I have been many years in several Aust govt elect supply authority & in a department where new supply is regulated from ie new development upgrades & building. I can unequivocally tell you there is nowhere near enough capacity now or in 10 yrs. They think you can put a 50mm garden hose on in your backyard when the water pipe from the street is 12.5mm & run 12 lawn sprinklers. It can be done but who is going to pay to rebuild underground & overhead in all major cities ? Under bore city streets, thousands of bigger transformers from massive 300mva substation units to units in buildings. No high rise transformer can support 200 cars jumping on at 30-40 amps each at 5pm & let’s face it ev owners always plug their cars in. Good luck finding room to upgrade Pitt St
@@jackmorganfiftyfiveThose Australian streets still need that upgrade. NSW,Vic authorities already load shed in summer for hot days on A/C’s so try adding cars onto it & yes I’m fully aware of relay knock on switching yet it’s massive draw regardless. Europe is yet another big issue for Europe. All street parking out in the cold (depleted battery from low temps). It’s a mess of an idea. Hybrid & then onto Hydrogen eventually once tech catches up is the only answer.
No one in government takes a moment to even think about a real-world problem like this, with the result that national is set more by political ideology and faith in narrative spinning than in grid-level power engineering.
The bigger underlying problem is grid capacity.........for Australia......if we replace all our gasoline and diesel consumption with electricity the grid would need at first glance, an increase in capacity of 70%. BUT........electrical grid systems have "Apparent power" and "Reactive power"..........which is equivalent to a schooner of beer.......not all the volume of the schooner glass is beer,a chunk of it is useless froth. The Aussie grid would in fact need a 100% increase in capacity.........generation,poles and wires,substations, down to the street transformers. Really big $$$$.........but hey, who doesnt want to see their power bills double with grid expansion infrastructure charges added onto the normal bill.
Exactly. The UK government keeps on going on about decarbonizing the grid by 2050, but in the last 30 years low carbon electricity has gone from about 20 per cent (mostly nuclear power) to about 40% on average, nearly half of that still coming from nuclear power. It's obvious to anyone with half a brain that they're never going to meet existing demand with low carbon electricity, let alone power a whole new generation of EVs and electric boilers as well. (The electric boilers, expensive to buy and run, bulky, noisy and not very warm, are supposed to replace gas boilers). It's all smoke and mirrors, the politicians haven't got a clue what they're doing.
@@philiphumphrey1548 You are correct. Politicians never pulled a power engineer into a conference room for even a feasibility study. They said "let's mandate EV's and sort out all the impossibilities later."
You are 100% wrong on all your statements. No, 100% more capacity would NOT be needed, please cite your source (I already know your source...it's something you "read" somewhere). First, 95% of all EV charging is done off-peak, at night, with no concurrent demand added to the grid. Second, of that 95% of EV charging, it can be done using house current. No rapid charge required.
Apparently GM has shut down their EV production (or stalling it) because demand is falling off.... you know, because consumer enthusiasm for fully electric vehicles as a whole isn't there!
GM's Zero plant is still running here in Detroit, I will have to ask my buddy how many hours they are actually up and running. When they made the Volt in the same plant, they only operated a few hours a day, four days a week, sometimes only two days a week, and that was it. I would imagine it is back to those same hours. And there has been at least two battery related fires there in the past couple of weeks. One was reported, the other was not. I am sure there have been a few, and we will never hear about them.
Don't forget in the summer when the kids are off school the chargers had queues over 7 hours long. Nice place for your summer holidays - the car park of a motorway service station.
They’re dumb for getting an EV without having a place to daily charge then. If they’re going to make such a reckless decision then they should suffer the consequences. Fast charging can ruin your battery too if they rely on public charging
@@thehairygolfer Charging queues for Teslas are very rare; after 9 years, I've never waited to charge. Tesla is keeping up with its demand on building chargers.
@@JacksonWalter735 Whoa, Nelly. People aren't "dumb" for buying an EV without daily charging. Almost ALL EV charging is done at home/residential, but it's not impossible as an apartment dweller. You go to a weekly fill-up just like you do at a gas station, with a longer refill time.
Most people drive more than 18 miles per week. If you are only driving 18 miles per week then you shouldn't scrap your current vehicle. I'm retired and drive infrequently and I still put 50 miles a week on my car ( about 7 miles per day average).
The level of power required for large charging stations requires a electrical SUB-station to be installed and, preferably, connected directly to the nearest pylon/pole. I get the impression that this main cabling requirement is being passed on to the grid providers who are having to do this as a 'service' (i.e. unpaid) and then passing on the costs to the domestic consumer rather than charging the EV power station providers.
Yeah - the reality is that this is a business decision based on the benefits of electric. As a rental dealer, they don’t benefit from cheap fuel. And people are less likely to hire electric when they don’t know what’s around.
@@Audioremedy0785 They were very clear and open about why they made the decision. It had nothing to do with not seeing benefits from anything. The EVs were much more expensive to maintain.
Every EV owner just assumes they don’t have to pay for electricity to charge their cars. They also assume that electricity prices aren’t going to be jacked up through the roof in the future
EV charging is not that simple. A 250 kW charger is not always twice as fast as a 125 kW charger. The maximum charging speed is higher, but your vehicle cannot charge at the maximum speed when it's almost empty, almost full, or when the temperature is not right. At a gas station, you can have 5 liters left and fill up to 40 liters in five minutes, so from 12.5% to 100% in five minutes. In an EV you want to try to stay between 20 and 80%. And with a powerful charger you might be able to do that in half an hour. But you cannot compare it with a gas station. If you push your battery too far, it will take you a lot longer to charge your EV. So, drivers not only have anxiety to drive to 0%, but if they have to charge at a fast charger, driving down to below 20% is already going to cost them a lot of extra time.
Not exactly… on road trips, I try to arrive at the Supercharger with a little less than 10% to get that 250kW speed as much as possible. The Nav knows it’s going to the Supercharger, so it preconditions the battery so that it can take the charge at the max speed. It is true that charging slows as the battery fills up, so I typically don’t charge over 70% because it actually faster overall to leave at that point, and drive to the next supercharger and arrive at a 10% state of charge.
Once no company will ensure, repair, store, park or transport EV's they will be costing the owner "at least" $10,000 each just to get rid of them. Then they will collectively become the biggest TRUE environmental disaster ever recorded. This is coming just around the corner.
I wish this was true, our local out of town shopping area has just installed 12 units in one corner, taking out at the same time to fit them, 36 spaces. 36 essential spaces at busy times. And the bonus, in the 3mths they've been installed, they've probably had only 12 cars use it. Lunacy.
Central Spain here (Madrid). Not only have they stopped installing new chargers but now they don't even maintain the ones they have, many of which are simply not working. I use to drive from Madrid to Valladolid (198 Kms) and now it is common I have to go to 3 or 4 chargers to find one working. It's simply becoming impossible to drive an EV outside of the city. I can't wait for the day I return it and get a hybrid car (230 days still to go 😢)
I've never understood why they build chargers like car parking spaces. It makes it impossible to queue for a charge, so fights over 'who's next' is inevitable. If each charging station had a queue and an in and drive straight through out it would remove this issue, and the issue of having to unhitch a caravan while charging. Once charged you would just drive forwards straight out.
Charging can take hours, so people leave their cars. You could end up behind a car that is parked for a day with no way to get out forward or backward! And if the battery went into thermal runaway while charging, then you don't want to have parked anywhere near it!
Actually, there are only a relatively small number of locations where the 5 megawatts is directly available. These are near substations, which may not be anywhere near where the charging station is desired Some small towns MAY NOT HAVE ANY LOCATION WHERE 5 MEGAWATTS IS PRESENTLY AVAILABLE. (without MAJOR expensive transformer additions!) This is going to get very EXPENSIVE very quickly!
Do not forget the real hero in EV charging situation. The diesel powered generator for rural and outback EV charging. A large quality gen set in not cheap to purchase. But if you are going to travel away from a capital city or large regional city...The diesel generator will become very important. I do find electric bbq's useful though. Gotta cook that red meat.
@@SylvesterJcat The beauty about using a diesel generator in out back and rural locations is that the extra carbon dioxide, water vapour and carbon particles are quickly absorbed by the local flora and greens the scrub around the generator. Certainly helps going green.
EV + Heat Pumps + AI Datacenters. There is no way energy grids can handle this increase in demand. Yesterday people in Alberta Canada were told to to lower their thermostat and turn off lights, it was -35C and the energy grid was about to collapse.
I heard that the some Tesla charging stations in remote areas here in the western United States (No mans land )are powered by Diesel generators. Why not buy a Diesel powered vehicle instead and save yourself the hassle and anxiety of the EV. ITS CRAZY DIESEL ENGINE TO CHARGE A EV.😂
At a realistic continuous rating of 0.2 Watts per Olympic-standard mouse, you would need 25 million mice per charging station. Peak output might provide a fast charge, but could they maintain that for a full 30 minutes? Just trying to be of assistance to a guy with "watts" in his name. 🙂 On the plus side, the carbon footprint of, say, 125 million mouse poops per station per day would provide plenty of plant nutrient, so be good for the planet overall. Given our government's propensity for putting a positive spin on U-turns, they could probably sell that as a good idea.
Don't be silly, mice don't have the energy to generate the required wattage for fast charging, upgrade to hamsters and guinea pigs. The obvious solution is to fit pedals in front of every seat in an EV and have the passengers pedal all the journey and keep going at the charging stations to support the rodents. There, I've solved it. Where's my Nobel prize?
In addition to the power generating rodents, we could as a back up plan offer a team six horses to hitch onto your EV to get you home if you’re located within 10km radius. Really there are so many solutions to these EV problems. Even offer 2,000 lithium battery (torch size) packs at the service stations, probably take while to install plus 😮😮😮😮a bit expensive atm.
@@grahamwatts8836 Absolutely, great idea! We should start a political party together and get that into law. We just need to make sure that the horses are fed and watered ready to go at all times, you know like your EV needs to be when you have an accident at home and need to get to the hospital quickly. See, just as the EVangelists always say, it'll all be fixed in the next release, no problem. I don't know what we were bothered about, it's roses and chocolate all the way running on fairy dust. Just like the next release of Windows, all the problems and vulnerabilities will go away and no new ones will be introduced at all, never ever. 😁
I considered placing one at my business, which has a large parking lot. However, even considering government subsidies, It was going to cost an estimated 250,000USD, just for the chargers. This did not even account for the infrastructure I'd have to supply to power them. There is no way this would be remotely profitable within a reasonable amount of time.
Would you be placing chargers to benefit your employees? Who would be there all day? You don’t need Superchargers, just install Level 2 chargers like someone would install at their home. They don’t need to be able to charge in 20 minutes if they are going to be there 8 hours!
They have another challenge -- the resale market. People will wise up to the horrific costs of the inevitable battery replacement, as well as the lack of range performance in inclement (both heat (A/C) and cold (range)) weather both of which can reduce the range as much as half in cold and a quarter with AC. As more-and-more figure that out, the demand for used EVs will start to plummet.
Peak Demand Charging Rates, there was a cold snap here in North Texas homeowners who were on flexible rate electric then found it cost them around $900 USD to charge their EV
When calculating demands from chargers, the total demand can only be 80% of the transformer capacity. Also, heavy truck charging wants 1.2 to 2.0MW. So, put in a bunch of 350kW vehicle chargers and a few truck charging bays and that’s a LOT of demand. Consider that a 35MW transformer station (yes, a full station coming from high voltage transmission lines) will be able to supply 28MW of infrastructure. A 35MW transformer station costs $12 million USD. That doesn’t include the station or the chargers or interconnection to grid, etc. So looking at maybe $20 Million for a large car/truck charging station. Loan interest on $20M at 5% is $1 million a year. In what world does this make economic sense?
Gas station pumps have a flow rate of ~13 gpm. One gallon of gasoline has about 33.7 kWh of energy. Demand = 13 gal/min*60 min/hr*33.7 kWh = 26,286 kW. So, gasoline pumps are effectively equivalent to a 26 MW charging station. If we take into account the inefficiency of ICEs, we can say it is about 1/3 of that or 8.8 MW (about 1,200 average homes). In any case, there is no way that the charge times for EVs will ever be equivalent to refueling times for ICE vehicles, because of the insane electrical output that would be required for each charging station. Just 10 charging stations (similar to a typical gas station with 10 pumps) would require the electrical infrastructure of 12,000 homes (a large town or a small City). You can't get around Physics.
People should stop freaking out about Australia's power grid. It is powered by one hundred percent renewable kangaroo farts as a constant energy source.
Here in Alberta it's been around -40 for the past week(this is normal for our area, happens usually twice per winter). A couple days ago for the first time in my life we got an alert saying the power grid was near failure and we needed to conserve electricity(no doubt the green agenda's effects on our power grid). I have a feeling no one was using EVs for this past week around here.
HMMmmmmmm i can snag a used 250kw Diesel genny for about 8k. wonder how much money i could make charging electrics with it! Mobile Rapid Charging Station. I come 2 u!
My buddy has a friend that bought a Tesla, he sold it in short order as he was on a first name basis with the tow truck drivers in town. He was also suffering from range anxiety, which is easy to see why, and it was affecting both his personal and business life. Find a few folks like him, and you could probably turn a nice profit.
We really like our EV for local area driving, where we do all our charging at home. We don't really road trip it much. Our home has had many energy efficiency upgrades, so that our annual electric usage, even with EV charging, is less than half of what our friends spend. I am absolutely against government mandates of any kind, EV and HVAC mandates come to mind. I believe if you want one, buy it. If you don't want one, don't allow some politician to browbeat you into buying one. It's your money, you decide how to spend it.
One thing that I don't often see clearly mentioned, is that there may not be enough electrical infrastructure near by because charging stations co-exists with existing service stations along a highway far from any existing cities or towns. Here in Denmark we have had charging stations along highways, that required 20-30 km of new, very high capacity, power cables to be established. Paid for, in part, by the company installing the charging stations. That's a huge cost up front before you start earning money.
My local bus company has one electric bus. Nice ride too. I spoke to the driver, and he made the same point. They would get more, but the grid couldn't handle overnight charging for...wait for it...160 busses. No wonder. That would be a small town of electricity! The chargers' installation would cost, on Mguy's figrures, about $16 million! That assuming 2 busses would be handled by one charger overnight.
You are driving west and charge your battery at the motel in Winslow Arizona, half way across the desert you battery dies due to the load on the air conditioner, radio, etc., the car stops in the middle of the mojave desert a hundred miles from Barstow, you call AAA and they are too busy charging the thousands of cars with dead batterys in the middle of the Mojave Desert. Let's say you make it over the San Gabriel Mountains at 6:00pm and look down on the inland empire and it has gone totally dark due to millions of electric cars plugging in their batterys after they come home from work, the freeways are all parking lots with dead cars. the grid finally recovers at midnight and the people plug in their cars in the morning after making coffee and cooking breakfast, 8 hours later your car is fully charged, then you make on the freeway which is a parking lot and never make it to work. California is a snapshot of liberal democrat America will become. The only people left with jobs will be illegals picking lettuce for 20 dollars/hour.
A Tesla dealership is being built 1/4 mile from my house. They've been working on it for over a year. I think the power company was digging up the street to tap into a main power supply (as the lines are underground on this street). What a fiasco.
I just drove from Canberra to Perth and back (8k kms/12days) saw thousands of trucks, cars and caravans but not many charging stations. How the hell do these green dreamers think they can electrify all of these vehicles and have enough stations literally in the middle of nowhere to keep them all running to schedule- especially the trucks. This trip really opened my eyes to this ridiculous, expensive and logistically impossible plan.
My local pharmacy are already experiencing problems with range of their new EV. The charge lasts less than the daily business, so cannot complete a full shift. And that's just driving in residential streets in a small town.
Here a charging stations, the energy supplied by diesel powered generator. Don’t worry you can build more EV stations with diesel powered generators if you are lack of supply in electricity.
Lol total fantasy world, i come from recycling industry, people forget what drives everything is cost versus profit. Ev charging for vehicles which want to charge awsy from home chargers are not going to work. Admit that ev's are only a local solution not Commercial or high km. Noticed when i leave my town to drive 200 km away almost zero ev cars seen.
Well, there you go; it's only 2024 and the wheels are falling off the predicted takeover of EV's. I predicted this many years ago and never jumped on the bandwagon. Forget the fires and the charging time. The costs are higher and will only get worse. Insurance, charging fees will only get higher and the whole industry will fail. Toyota was right.