Z for the 🏁🏁. Better value for the money you're spending. Not to mention, the looks of the ZL1 is bad*ss!!!!. You absolutely made the right choice!!!(for yourself!)👊🙌👍😁
$70k for a Mach 1 is insane. Definitely not worth it if I’m being honest. The upcoming Mustang is even more overpriced but I guess they will get away with it as they are the only muscle car left. Only Mustang I truly wanted was the GT350 which strangely was cheaper than the Mach 1 when new
Ya well "inflation" over the last three years its hard to compare 2019 prices of anything to 2023s. My gripe with the gt350 was the engine reliability. I know too many people that go through them unnecessarily. Few of them even traded for a mach go figure lol. Still great cars but not worth my gamble
@@motonviprMach 1 is better than gt350 sadly 5.0 is better platform in long run only benefit gt350 has is that nice sounding 5.2 and Shelby name the Mach 1 has all the same parts the gt350 has
Yes true The mach1 actually beat the gt350R on some tracks by 1/2 second. 350 is cool but ford took what they learned from it and the 500 and made the mach. Mach is a great car.
Dude just go ahead and admit that you're secretly Superman and the sales guy at the dealership with the black ZL1 is secretly Lex Luthor lol All jokes aside I get it, the ZL1 is an amazing car and compared against every car you were cross shopping it with the ZL1 is simply the better car and the price is justified, the only car that's on a higher level than the ZL1 in that price bracket at $65,000+ is the Honda Civic Type R specifically in boost blue 👀 Lol JK great video brother can't wait to see you and Bluprint1LE battle it out on the track to see who wins Superman or Beast from X-Men! 😎
Brooo 😅😅😅😅 you killing me 😂😂 thank you for watching man. The type r is a great car and im stoked you got it cause i cant fit. Ill live through your channel for a bit. Appreciate you hommie
@@Hot-1LE Lol I'm doing the same thing with you in your ZL1 Lmao I think you can fit though cause I'm 6'6" and I fit really well in the Type R I'm sure you can fit especially since you're not as big boned as I am lol.
@@Hot-1LE LMAO I feel like all of Japan got together and measured your legs then had a gentleman's agreement to build all their cars in just away so that you'd never feel comfortable in them 😆 they were like " Eff Youuu SUPA Mannn!!!!!!"
I think every car salesman should watch this video! Like you I sold my SS 1LE for a ZL1 and I absolutely love it! These cars are gonna be with a lot of money in the future. Good video and enjoy the ZL1
I too observed the same with the Mustang Recaro seats. I never been in the S650 but in the S550 was the same complaint for me. One of the reasons I went with the Camaro also. I'd like to see a video comparing the ZL1 to your old SS 1LE.
Ah im not alone! The s650 has the exact same seats (though the Recaros got heating and cooling now). I still talk to the owner of my sold ss 1le. That video will be coming after i reach break in a bit.
Another killer video bro! With all the points you laid out I definitely agree with your decision. Not being biased I think lol, but with the extra power and confort from the Recaros in the Zl1 you can’t go wrong. Can’t wait to see that thing being thrown around some corners 🙌.
You tube has basically covered up the reason WHY the Camaro is better than even the new dark horse Mustang, and its actually quite simple. The Alpha chassis has not been surpassed even by BMW which the chassis was originally based upon. All OTHER mods like suspension or motor CANNOT be integrated into a chassis that isnt that good to begin with. It is much easier to start with a good NEUTRAL chassis to make a sports touring car than relying on horsepower or power delivery tricks. The Alpha chassis cars are simply superior to Alfa Romeo, BMW, MERCEDES or Ford.
Thanks for the insights into why you went ahead with another Camaro. I haven't put many miles on my '22 2SS 1LE, but so far I'm in love with it and I'm really glad I was able to get one before they go away. I'm just about to leave for my road trip out west (leaving in about 10 minutes or so), and figure I'll be putting about 5,000 miles or so on it when all is said and done, so we'll see if I still love it as much at the end! 😉
@@BLUPRINT1LE LOL! Heading out to Utah for the Everyday Driver Utah Adventure, where they'll be driving some of the great roads they use in their videos. Made it to Missouri yesterday, and today's leg should bring me into Colorado.
HOLY CRAP ,That is the same reason i stepped away from the 2024 mustang Darkhorse ,I hate the interior ,if it wasnt for the ipads on the dash i might of had a 2024 Darkhorse ordered instead of a 2SS 1LE ,and im coming from Dodge ,They pissed me off with their ridiculous price increases ,and im not talking about markup im talking about they are literally $10-$11 grand more on msrp than they were in 2020 ,So i got a 2023 2ss 1LE m6 with red seatbelts for $53,490
Hell ya that 2SS 1le will be awesome! Sounds just like the last one I had on this channel. Glad im not alone on the new mustang that interior is just laziness otherwise I think i might have gone the route too. Gotta thank ford for pushing us to better cars lol
@Hot-1LE Thats the hardest part,Ford is actually doing the right thing ,and then they put stupid lazy looking ipads as a dash cluster,unfortunately i will never own one because of it,Same goes for the gt500 and i really like that car but i hated that dial for a shifter from day 1 ,still hate it ,And anyone who says this crap is the future,its only the future if Dummys keep accepting and buying whatever they throw at us,i have a simple solution for myself ,I just dont buy,I will spend my money on those who give what i want ,and that can mean buying used ,i have no problem with low mileage used cars,Most of what ive owned is just that
I actually was considering the Mach 1 way back in 2020 once all the details for it was released but after seeing the price point for the version I wanted (handling package and the appearance package with that fighter gray and orange accents and much nicer wheels) I was pretty shocked. Did a lot more research and began eyeing the 6th gen Camaros instead (was not a big fan of the 5th gens and mostly just skipped right past them). Was pricing out a 2ss1le initially and got with a dealer I found in the Camaro6 forums and I ended up building a 2ss1le and a zl1 and gave them to the dealer. He hit me up a few months later when allocation came available and I said F it and went with the ZL1, lol :D I don't hate Mustangs by any means (actually own a 2019 Mustang... the wife's car, lol) but just like you said.. for just about $70k for the best Mach 1 it's a no brainer the ZL1 is vastly superior!
@@Hot-1LE haha, awesome! :D Yep.. was considering it pretty hard back in 2020 or so (prior to them going on sale) but like you the ZL1 wowed me way more, lol.
6'4 273 pounds here, I can afford a C7 Z06 etc, the heating issue was my 1st biggest problem, 2nd issue is my size in any C6 or C7, the C8 are even smaller. I have the ZL1/1LE oem parts added, its rare, roomier, better interior and no heating issues. And the toque OMG ! Need I say more, 6.2 supercharged, all it needs is a cam, and 2650 upgrade, and were at 2019 ZR1 hp levels minus the weight.
The camaro is def the tall guy car haha! I felt so cramped in the c7 my head was in the ceiling. Zl1 is such a beast and comfortable for us you made the right choice!
I gotta come here in a sea of GM boys. But yeah, the value of a new ZL1 is better than a new Mach 1. Another point, that we hadn't messaged about either, was the fact that the Mach 1 and the SS1LE are so close in performance, that going Mach 1 wouldn't be much new of a drive. Now you have another step up of performance to push yourself on track further. Glad to hear you say good things about the Mach 1 HP. They're way too high though (new). And so is the dark horse, for basically 2% improvement.
Yup agreed man and ty for the support. If it was a 60k car fully loaded this might be a different convo but maybe not idk lol the base machs are still a good bargain though
ZL1 is my ultimate dream car along with audi r8. I have waited my already built Camaro 2ss to be delivered for 4 months and give it up by going with challenger scat pack widebody. Now its a year since I become a happy owner. No regrets yet, but next one will be either ZL1 or used r8.
I think the Camaro s the better car in a lot of ways. I like the looks of the ZL1 more than the looks of the Mustang. Obviously that is subjective. My mom had a 67 Firebird so the body style on the Camaro is very much something that pays homage to that. I’ve never been a Mustang fan with a lot of the models they have. There are a few I like out there. But some are just too over the top and look like something a rich kid would own. Hard to put into words, but I think some of the higher spec Mustangs try way too hard to be noticed. To me, the Camaro and the Challenger are more true to original muscle car roots. Obviously the Camaro is more of a sports car, but not so over the top. Unless you get the ZL1 1LE which does get a little crazy with wings and aero.
That’s what wrong with the mustang, it’s the fans of the mustangs. Mustang fans are the worst, bitters the desire to even get a mustang. When I do I’m not associating with them.
Haha i mean i came across some cool guys that drove them. Theres such a large audience for the car so you get all types. I never really felt welcomed in that community. Maybe cause it was so large and the camaros are much more niche and even then 1les. I guess ya get it with all groups though.
Being a teen in the 90’s, the Mustang was the car you bought when coming from the ricer scene, it was a gateway into V8’s and thankfully the horsepower was low enough that most didnt get themselves intp to much trouble. The Camaro had the 6 speed and the potential to be so much more. It wasnt until 2011 when Ford decided to introduce the Coyote, up until that point Ford knew it’s customers didn’t care about speed or performance, they just wanted the name, MUSTANG. Yes, Ford had its terminator, but that was a specialty vehicle.
Keep up the work man. Appreciate CCs that base their content on what they want and what makes sense vs what could bring them more views, etc. Just subscribed.
I'm not a big force induction guy. I like a naturally aspirated V8 hints why i drive A SS Camaro with a manual transmission. But there's nothing like A V8 the power. The sound the torque its really unbelievable.
I ended up buying a new 1SS 1LE for MSRP, about $48K. I just felt like you get almost everything the ZL1 has to offer, except the supercharger, and I didn't feel another 200hp was really something I needed for $22,000 more money. You already did the SS though, so getting somethng different is always fun. The ZL1 is brutally powerful no doubt, and I love the SC whine. Your car looks fantastic. I like how you went through the monetary decision in your video. I have had several Porsches, and I loved them, but everything always boils down to value for me, it seems. All of my Porsche's I bought used, usually about 3 years old with less than 20K miles on them, for about half the sticker price. I have never lost more than a few thousand on them, and the last two I sold for substantially more than I paid for them. To me, that is as much fun as driving them! Every man's budget is different, but the Camaro is proof you don't need a $100,000 car to have fun.
@@TC-zf1ji The suspension in the SS1LE and the ZL1 is the same other than slight calibration differences due to the extra weight of the ZL1. If I wanted a 600hp Camaro, I wouldn't modify an SS, I would buy a ZL1.
being that you're a canyon carver (and occasional HPDE driver?), any thoughts as to why you sprung for the ZL1 vs. the ZL1 1LE? was it availability/wait time, or the $7500 difference? it would have matched your username better at the very least, lol
The 1le package on the zl1 is like the last 2 percent of handling. The zl1 is extremely capable on track or canyons. I have a few friends with 1le zl1s that wish they got zl1s cause of the extreme bounciness of the suspension a lot of them hate driving them on streets. It would be difficult to move my dog around and continue to use it for daily use with that setup. The versatility of the mag ride makes this car a perfect all arounder for me and allows me to use it on long road trips and scenarios where Id want to take the camaro over the daily. Just different strokes for different folks. I dont feel like im missing out on anything personally 🙂
Hey man im picking up a ‘23 LT1 redline edition with dual mode exhaust this week! Im super excited. Im leasing it for 3 years because i only want it short term, but do you think breaking it in is necessary for a lease?? Maybe for the first 500 miles? What are your thoughts? Love the vids!
Hey congrats man! I mean its really up to you. If the car dosnt see the track it dosnt reallly need the 500 /1500 oil changes and diff. If anything just vary the speed and try to keep it under 4k rpm for 1500 miles so everything wears in nicely for the next guy. Or just full send it sht its a lease 😅 thats why you lease cars. Ultimately make it the experience you want out of the car. You might even keep it who knows. Congrats again man!
Totally agree . I think as they lose their base and discover the philosophy of go woke go broke (hopefully before they go broke) and come back . The only Turbo 4 I like is the Golf R .
I shopped for a Mach1 for months. Dealers wanted $66k out the door without the handling package. Instead I bought a 2022 preowned Camaro SS 1LE with 3300 miles for $50k out the door and the dealer had it ceramic coated including the wheels. After owning for 4 months I can say the car is absolutely amazing having the ceramic coating is a must have especially on a black car. The LT1 engine, Tremec transmission, magnetic ride, multi mode exhaust, forged 20” wheels made this buy a no brainer. I would never trade my SS 1LE for a Mach1. Love my Camaro!
I was wondering if you’re trading your old Camaros in or selling before you buy the next one. Since I’ve gotten my 2022 1le I’ve seen you with a 1ss 2ss and now the zl1 all within a little over a year. I was just curious how far upside down you are trading in like that. I’m considering selling my 22 1le and getting a zl1 is why I’m curious
Good question man and i really should make a video about this. The 1ss i sold to Vroom for more than i bought it. The 2ss i sold private party and only lost a grand or two. The Z i put a ton down on it. Wasn't upside down on any of them. Ive learned a few things over the years of going through cars and how to do this "logically" or as logical as you can be buying cars lol
That’s what wrong with the mustang, it’s the fans of the mustangs. Mustang fans are the worst, bitters the desire to even get a mustang. When I do I’m not associating with them.
Zl1 all day long... the mach 1 isn't even in the same league performance wise. I have a 2020 zl1 1le 6m in satin steel and wouldn't trade it for anything. I plan to keep it forever.
Well said brother. I've seen a couple of ZL1 on track (w/o 1LE) and it can easily win some podiums. The suspension is very balanced and never feel overpowered. But have you ever considered the new M2?
Glad to hear it man! Zl1 is very capable car. The 1le is like just a little bit more at the top and ultimately i needed some things the 1le didint have. I did consider the new and old M2. Seen one in person and it didint do it for me. Also v8. Lol.
I can appreciate your logic however I'll always buy the Stang over the Camaro, especially the Mach 1, as it's the best S550 built. (Like you, I'm not interested in the S650; the interior, the big screens turn me off.) I've owned nothing but Stangs since '88 and it's like "home" to me. The Camaro, for all its vaunted performance & I'll give you that the Camaro ZL1/1LE is a superior performance car, offers still too much of a coffin-like feel. The Mach 1 has excellent visibility, great performance- certainly more than enough for the open roads- and good comfort. Congrats on your ride!
Love my 23 5.0 premium roush supercharged 750HP lowered staggered 275 f 305 r new front grill / screaming coyote f and rear emblems got from dealer show room for 75k they wanted 89k .had a 2016 2ss which was bad in a good way , nice zl1 you got that was my 2nd choice.
Nice! I bought a 23 2SS last year (April 2023) and now I wish I saved a little bit longer for the ZL1, but I still love driving my car. I haven't even pushed it yet because it's my daily driver lol.
Hmmmm...you're going to compare a supercharged car to a naturally aspirated one and then talk about horsepower? Why didn't you compare it to the Shelby if you want a true comparison? Dumbest comparison I have ever heard.
Because a shelby cost 100k and the Zl1 cost the same price as the mach1. Because you know, they are the same price. I agree. Ridiculous a NA mustang cost the same as a built boosted OEM zl1. These were the cars that I cross shopped.
Except price (which matters when i got 70k and no more this is fords price comparison) Also there is no manual. And they stopped making it in 2022. And this is what i cross shopped for this reason.
My wife has a 2020 mustang gt and i have 2020 zl1 1le... no comparison in power. I second the seats. I feel like I'm sitting about 6 inches higher in the mustang. My ZLE i feel much lower and like I'm in a cockpit. I almost went with a C7 z06 but felt zl1 was more car for the money!
I looked at all 3 before I chose the WB Challenger Scat. I was looking right at 70k, as well. The ZL1 was my second choice. I didn't even really consider the Mustang because they discontinued the GT350, and the Mach 1 just felt like a bargain bin version... I went with the Challenger because as much as I like speed, I'm not going to a track, and I wanted comfort and space and a true muscle car. I did end up buying a used Mustang GT Premium with performance pack and Whipple SC a couple of weeks ago. I love it, too. I'll be looking to add a Camaro in the future so I can have an example of all 3 modern American muscle cars...
Greats point bro! I hear a lot of the same thing when people was cross shopping as well! It’s very hard to not choose the ZL1 it’s worth every penny for what you get
A lot of sales guys are terrible. I had a terrible experience at the Ford dealership in Long Beach. I hate “sales” salesmen. I do the same too. Just walk.
Agree about the suspension for the ZL1s. I’ve got a C8 Z51 and my dad currently has a 21 GT500. Previously he had an 18 ZL1 that we have both driven on track and agree is superior in confidence and handling to the Shelby. The Shelby is more fun but price/quality we feel the ZL1 is a better car.
I think your Camaro ZL1 looks terrific! And the specs are there, too. And I say that as the owner of a fully-loaded 2019 Bullitt. You can't really go wrong with any of these cars.
Nice comparison! I initially wanted to go JDM since my previous sports car was an s2k and was a blast on the track. But, I’m no pro driver. Seeing how the market is aggressively shifting away from v8s, I figured I should snag one. Didn’t want a challenger/charger since I wanted something that was more geared toward road course work. So I ended up with the Camaro vs mustang toss up as well. Mach1/Dark Horse for the Tremec over the MT82 GT and ZL1 over the 2SS 1LE simply bc of the better front end styling. The biggest draw pulling me into going blue oval was that amazing stock exhaust sound. Ultimately, ZL1 was the winner due to performance/$. I know the coyotes respond so well to mods, but I’m not looking to add more HP. I feel like the TQ figure is plenty for street use, red light to red light blasts and keeping it at legal speeds. Anything over that, and I’m going to the track where u need to check your ego at the door anyway. 👍🏼
Only got mustang because the price was pretty cheap but used with 7k miles for $38k 1 owner with the 10 speed cause mt82 wasn’t it…. Never drove the camaro which I should’ve done and the zl1 is the one I would’ve gotten but didn’t have the money for it at the time but now I do but I’ll keep the 5.0 maybe supercharge it but damn wish I waited I could’ve had a Zl1
Thats pretty much why i bought my 2015 GT. Good price. Got the auto cause mt82 and i shouldve driven the camaro but couldnt afford them at the time lol. The 5.0 sounds beautiful though that engine sounds so amazing with just a resonator delete and a x or h pipe.
I had the same experience as you back in December 2019. I was looking at replacing my Mustang with a Shelby GT350. The Ford salesman wouldn't let me test drive it. I told him "are you kidding me?" That really irritated me so I decided to look at a ZL1 at the Chevy dealership. I was shocked at how much better the ZL1 was and bought it on the spot. No regrets 4 years later
The mustang community isn't the most open minded in my experience. Chevy is top tier to me. My co worker is tall like you and he said the same about the S550 seats. He ended up getting a 2012. I really enjoyed listening to your story. Sucks that that one salesman was garbage. Glad to see you in a Camaro!
Ay que glad to be back in a camaro. You know you miss it come back! Haha. Those high seats drove me nuts in my 2015 and when the s650 came out they made no progress with that I knew it was going to be a hard sell. Thanks for watching bro.
Nah im 6'3 the seats in the S550 are great. The Camaro is terrible for tall people my head touched the ceiling. I did the opposite. I test drove zl1s and ended up with a fully loaded 5.0
Ryan Dono just listing height alone dosnt mean much people have different torso lengths and leg lengths. I owned a s550 and it drive me nutty. Glad it works for you
Damn bro, a real honest opinion and review 👍👍much respect, cause I feel the same exact way. I've been going back and forth with mach 1 and ZL1, and if it wasn't for the deal and because I'm a master tech, I would go the ZL1 route with you, but because of what I just said, Im getting a Mach1 with handling package, under MSRP,as if handling package wasn't added on, then I am purchasing a stage 2 wipple which will push it to like 800 hp, for around the same cost as the ZL1, Only because I will be doing the modes myself 👍👍. Great video though
Excellent choice man! If i got the mach first thing id do is whipple it too. In your situation def the mach makes since you can probably fix anything yourself on it. Haha enjoy the beast man its a special car n ty for the good words 🙏
I was looking at a Charger, Challenger, and Mustang. Ultimately, I wanted a 2 door manual, I was not a fan of the Challenger interior, and I didn't want a car that handled like my SUV. Bye Dodge. The Camaro's interior was more appealing than the Mustang's and the exterior ... just look at the thumbnail to this video. The Mustang also had no sunroof option. The turn-off for the Camaro was the availability. I almost gave up after waiting months for mine, especially thinking the 2023 might be the last year. I got it though and it's a beautiful beast. Agree with many of your points in this video. I'm actually about to help buy my lady a Mustang though if she likes it after the test drive.
Oh shes probably going to like it! Haha. Women lovvveeeee mustangs i think its a genetic thing sometimes. Agreed on the camaro availability its really a pain but stoked you got one!
hey guy, Good Looking car!! I am an older gearhead and I have had a 2015 Mustang GT That I did a ton of mods to that does the mile @185. Selling it now for the 2023 Camaro ZL1 that I have been waiting for for a while. I was going to get the ZL1 LE but with "supply chain" issues it wasn't going to happen any time soon. my dealer finally got allocation in May and I should be getting the car in July... stoked. it looks like you hit a home run on the price since these cars are hard to come by. I have some videos on my Mustang but never updated for the last run to 185. I blew third gear and had the tranny replaced. I decided on the Camaro in the beginning of the year and made the order in March. thought I would've had to wait a lot longer but now its almost here. trying to sell the mustang now its a beauty but I've had it for 7 years and i have done everything to it I wanted to. never mind all that, Congrats on your car I will post mine when I get it. Thanks for the video!!! BTW my order is the same as your car and I really appreciate the comparison. I am 6'2" and While my 15 has plenty of room and I really have enjoyed my ownership the ZL1 has the true WOW factor for me. I am a ford guy, I have a 2023 F150, 2022 Expedition and a 2020 F450 for my RV. I own a company and have all ford fleet but the Camaro truly has my attention and my money. Gonna follow your guidelines for break in and the mod it up a bit in about a year to get close to the 200 MPH in the mile.
Thank you for your input man! Thats awesome info and excited for you to get your car. Your going to love it. Great machines! Meet you at the 200mph club soon!
Uhmmm. The zl1 shares the same engine but fixes the cooling problems of the z06. Some say the zl1 is better for that reason. The corvette would be faster because of weight
Would love to get into another v8 but trying to find a decent example in my budget in the area I’m in is hard enough. Had a 2016 mustang gt California special and loved it, but to each it’s own. One day after college I’ll grab a 19 ss
Is there room for negotiation on a car you ordered? I ordered an m6 2ss 1LE. I’m happy to pay the sticker price since I specked it out. But, a little discount wouldn’t hurt. Do you think I should negotiate? Can i negotiate?
Haha i mean i disagree cause i bought it. But i understand this car isn't for everyone. Just like a mustang or any other car may not be for someone for different reasons
That's funny that I've ordered a very similar ZL1 to this, Red Hot etc, and it sounds like we had the same Cobalt SS too. Loved that car. Leased it on 06 until 2010 when I took it back for my black Camaro SS (which I still have).
@@Hot-1LE haha totally agree. I went from a 95 Z28 to that because it got written off, the only thing that was tough was to go from a 6 speed to a 5 speed. Was always looking for that 6th gear lol. It was so much fun to drive though. I always missed my Z28, but the Cobalt was the right car at the time to keep me having fun while I drive. It’s a shame most people didn’t take care of them, it would be a fun car to revisit.
I’m finally catching up but thanks for answering my question in a video lol. I def didn’t think u did it for the platform. U still made the best choice either way 😎
Not so much. The upgraded cooling. Gt500 rear subframe and much more parts would be a pain if not impossible to do. Mach is more than just some basic add ons.
Ive been in them and the lack of magride would drive me nuts. All my friends with them hate driving them on streets and the additional suspension is like the extra 2 percent. I had no interest
So let me get this straight! 1. a N/A V8 vs a Supercharged V8 2. new ZL1 6-speed starts at $68, 695 vs 2022 Mach 1 Premium started at $58, 365 (-$10, 300 difference) 1LE cost $7500 extra for the ZL1 & Handling Package $4500, Elite Package $1550 for a total of $6050 & $64, 415 all together which is still cheaper then the base ZL1 (how is the Camaro a better deal?)
Thats a lotta numbers you got going there. The mach 1 as shown in the picture that i wanted to get was 69800. The zl1 was 70500. Thats how. Base mach dont have leather or handling packages so thats an immediate nope from me. The zl1 dosnt need the 1le package its a track monster right out the bat the 1le is like the extra 2 percent. So conpare more apples to apples
For $69, 800 what was it equipped with? I ordered & purchased a 2022 Mach 1 Premium with Handling & Elite package, rear seat delete & TREMEC of course in Cyber Orange for $66, 735 plus tax
Like that pretty much. It was the msrp cost without markup or addons. I got the Z for 3k more than your car. To me thats a bargain considering the performance. Congrats on your car btw.
