Ok, people, what's the worst argument someone has used to try to convert you? For me it might have been, "You just deny God because it makes you feel better about being gay. Just go to conversion therapy and you'll be able to believe in god again." My wife would be shocked if that were the case.
“You’re just angry at God”...it bothers me because they never say what I would be angry about. It feels like a personal attack on my character, appearance, or lifestyle.
Genetically Modified Skeptic there is much more nonsense coming from carnists like: “canines tho” or “plants feel pain tho” .... what’s your best defense of the animal products industry or the entire practice of killing animals for food ?? It’s clearly not the best thing for the experience of conscious creatures if that’s what we care about
I’m number 1. Although I wasn’t a very extreme Christian as it was my granny who brought me to mass every Sunday and my parents weren’t bothered to go cuz I don’t think they had a strong belief.
Funnily enough, that's pretty much my reaction as well when I learn that someone is religious... Maybe not that funny... But I always keep it to myself, at least.
@@-eternal Yeah, how could anybody not come to the conclusion that there is God?! Clearly, the evidence is all around us and points to there being EXACTLY one god and no other! It's so obvious!
technically but then he would be encroaching on our free will Edit: I was wrong here. But he already came down and told everyone, that's what the new testament is about.
@@volcryndarkstar If the CEO of a corporation has his secretary take down a letter, who is the author of the letter,... the CEO or the secretary? Pay attention and you'll learn something.
The toughest question I got were "what if you're wrong?" I found out later that 10,000 religions exist worldwide and Christianity has 33.000 to 40,000 denominations, so any Christian has only a 1% chance of following the right religion.
Not all are created equal, after accepting that 99% have been started by heretics looking to justify their messed up personal beliefs, it becomes much easier to decide.
That god comes across like a mobster, doesn't he? (read in a Don-Corleone-voice): "Nice soul you have there. Shame if anything bad happened to it, wouldn't it? Better pray really, really hard..."
So then i give this question to any atheist who see's this. Why dont you believe in God? Now its hard for me to try to relate because when i use to be athiest, what changed me was seeing with my own eyes (probably most hated answer) and to try to explain to someone who has never seen anything spiritual is quiet hard because they cant relate. And from my point of view, most times when i try to bring up questions to athiests, they have always ended up with, "IDK" eventually and that's also hard to fight too because "Idk" and pride go hand in hand. It has been very rare for somebody to tell me "idk" and really consider why they dont know instead of saying "idk" and leave it at that because they dont understand. We all fall guilty of casting out anything and almost everything that doesnt agree with our understanding as stupid or non sense and that doesnt only apply with God. We all have seen and believe in the work of God and have names for them that most people i know, believe. That's *Luck* , *Karma* , and *coincidence* . These are the top three names that keep people from believing in God simply because they have a different name to them. Now idk anybody who has been able to answer these and debunk them without starting with, "I dont know" But all our life, we are told that we are limitless but the truth is that we are LIMITED. Both physically and mentally. How many times have you heard, "you can do anything if you just put your mind to it"? That's a root of pride. Your understanding can only reach but so far and because most people believe that lie, when something comes to try our understanding of things, when we can only answer with "i dont know", that pride comes into play and we cast it off as stupid or non sense. Now if you read this far, that shows me that you're willing to listen. And now i ask you, with all the theories that i come up with during our debate, if you can explain to me, or show me a video that debunks my theory, please do. But i do say, most times, when something seems like it debunks a theory, its because we havent seen the "debunking" being debunked because we stop when it seems like we're the victor. So again i ask the question. Why dont you believe in God??
Atheist is your word for us and yet you get it wrong. We do not worship immiterial creatures, practice magic, believe in revealed wisdom or concern ourselves with delusional notions of life after death. We do wish to work together and progress toward better outcomes through planning, cooperation, implementation, review, revision and correcting errors to modify the future in ways that surpass our individual abilities and lifespans in order to benefit untold generations. We refer to ourselves as secular. Thank you for your attention.
@@drew506 This is a concept that actively works against religion, but this has nothing to do with the existence or nonexistence of God. An antitheist is always an atheist, but the atheist does not necessarily have to be an antitheist.
@@drew506 No. As I sayd. These are to differend concepts. Atheism is just the belief that there is no God. Antitheism is against the belief in God. Huge difference.
@@DeathKillingFile and yet atheists spend almost every moment saying how religion is retarded and the people who follow them are mindless idiots. Don’t believe me? Go to r/atheism.
@@MrMarco855 Well that and the child molestation, obvious corruption of power, the violently stupid followers who attack whoever doesn't believe in a particular version of their master that lives in the clouds and generally being a moral pestilence to humanity.
"But what about Zeus and Ra and the godess of life and fertility? How can you be sure those don't exist but your god does?" "No, those are fake gods. I'm talking about the real God." Sure thing pal
The abrahamic God is more of a philosophic concept in modern day understanding rather than the ancient superhero characters that are called god's in other cultures. Even though we use the same word, they're pretty different ideas. You might be able to compare God with some Buddhist concepts of higher power, but at that point it's more just different attempts at describing something fundamental rather than one disproving another.
What makes you think all the other God's ar efake but the one that you first learned about and the first God you were told to worship is true? There's over 4k religions on this planet, and each one of them says that their God is real. If your God was real wouldn't you think way more people would change religions?
@@andrewprahst2529 my point is that there are thousands of religion and each one makes the same points. "This is the one true religion" "Our God is the real God" "All other religions are fake" etc. If there was oen true religion, wouldn't there be a lot of people converting to it? Wouldn't there be physical evidence for the existence of the one true God? It's like giving 10 people an ice-cream, each person has a different flavor and each one says "This is the best ice-cream on the planet" and will refuse to think otherwise.
The worst argument anyone ever presented to me was almost beautiful in how flawed it was. First, the guy asked me if it would be wrong for him to cheat on his wife. I said it would. He asked why. I said that it was because he had made a commitment in marriage to do, and not do, certain things, and so he shouldn't break that commitment. He agreed, and said that by being born, I had made a similar commitment to my family, and that part of keeping that commitment meant not leaving the church.
Out of curiosity, what if the baby was born to a Muslim, Jewish or Hindu family? Did the baby somehow sign a contract to never leave the church if their parents aren't even Christians xDD
Just trust me bro, it's just a phase. Another 60 years and you'll be believing in god Edit: the joke is that he's at least 63 years old, so in 60 years he's gonna be at least 123, which means he's either gonna be real dead, so he can't believe anything, or in heaven so he'll believe in god. I'm also an atheist please don't dunk on me
LOL. Being serious tho, all these christians invalidating your lifetime experience like they know better than you, just shows why atheists doesn't listen to them.
you know what they say..."once a catholic always a catholic". What they don't say, is they couldn't care less whether or not you believe or not. They just want you against God.
as someone coming from a catholic country I hate it so much! I'm not catholic and I never signed up for this, them forcing that identity onto me makes my blood boil. I got baptised without my consent as an infant and now there's no way to make the Church remove my personal data from their archives even if I apostate, they're literally above the law.
@@baizhuwaitingroom7057 i feel you, looks the same in my case, i'm Polish, baptised and raised catholic as a child simply because it's the default here, my family isn't even that religious
In the philipines its a lot worse even kids basically ridicule you for not the believing at a young age because that occured to me my friends literally prayed I would become a theist again basically Atheists there are a minority
“The Bible says XYZ...” Me: Okay, what if I don’t believe the Bible is the infallible word of God and think it’s just a collection of stories written by men? “Um...Well...Then there’s no helping you. Off to hell with you.”
Actually, if you doubt the Bible, have a talk with God about it. "The pure in heart will see God." An atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a police officer; we are born as rebellious God-haters. Yet, if you ask God to show you what is so great about knowing Christ, He will show you. Jesus Christ is the light of the world.
@@kenshiloh Alright, let's test that. As I'm typing this, I'm saying these exact words aloud: God, show me what is so great about knowing Christ. Please, I want to know. I'll report back on the results, but I'm holding little in the way of hope that I'll get anything meaningful.
@@kenshiloh That's sweet, just like in Peter Pan. Ofc if he doesn't answer, that doesn't mean he's not real, it's just that you didn't believe hard enough, or didn't sprinkle enough fairy dust.
@@esbenm6544 God will answer every prayer! Whether it’s obvious or not God will ALWAYS work it out! And to say that prayer is like pixy dust is way out of perspective. Prayer is led by a relationship with God. All can pray, anywhere, any time, any reason, anything! That’s the beauty of it. However, to compare it to pixy dust is assuming prayer is to gain something, in a sense. God is happy to listen to your request, but he may say no. If you ask God for a million dollars and expect it is very unfair. Now, I am certain God will lead you to a relationship with Him with great joy! So, I ask that you pray with genuine want for a relationship with God, it will come. Also, honest question: Do atheists that grew up atheist avoid God? Or are they genuinely trying to love God? Please help me understand your perspective better! God bless!
Someone: “How can you look at trees and not believe in god?” How. What. Trees? Yeah trees are cool. How do you look at the moon and not believe an invisible two-headed unicorn named Aria pulls it around Earth?
Although im against religion (unless it's not influencing as much as it now and is a choice) i do respect the people who follow it. I've talked with some theists and some constantly made excuses (i showed bible verses which are disturbing in nature from the old testament from non censored bible versions) and other said although they don't fully believe in the bible that the Faith in god gave them rest they need. Which i can understand since the world can be stressful for people. I think religion can help people but it shouldn't be forced and shouldn't influence area's of society which the future relies on. (science, education, law, government, politics and so on). I don't think the majority of religions people these days are bad, they just choose to follow it and use it actually make themselves better and live free.
The worst argument is “you’re just angry with god and secretly believe in him”. This statement automatically discredits itself. If you don’t actually believe in god, hearing someone say this shows that they are factually incorrect, they’re trying to convince you of your own thoughts.
@@Hariester Why would I say that though? Him? Her? It? Them? They're accusing me of hating something, and I'm trying to get them to see that I have no idea whatsoever which something they're talking about. There are thousands of the things, apparently. I don't know if I hate their god because, at this point, I don't know for certain whether I've even *_heard_* of the one they're talking about. It's like someone saying, "You hate food because you don't eat it even though you secretly like how it tastes!" Which food? I don't know which one they're talking about.
@@stickiedmin6508 let's be honest here. If they say "him" then it's 99% Abrahamic god. And that it's fictional character doesn't mean that you wouldn't hate it. There's many fictional characters that I honestly hate.
I usually call them out for heresy when they try that. After all, how else would they know my thoughts and beliefs better than me if they werent witches or servants of the devil in some way? Most of the time they shut up lol.
I, as an atheist, DO hate god. The mere concept of it. If there WAS a god (which I am quite happy there isn't) he was our worst enemy by definition. If there is a LORD, then WE are his subject. If there is a master, we are slaves. If GOD is anything good, WE are everything bad. Yes, one can hate someone else he does not believe to exist. Like Ramsay Bolton*. *chosen that one, because just like the biblical god, he's a fictional antagonist from a written story. And comparing those two by their deeds, I'd rather meet Ramsay.
@@rumpelstilzz *You* hate a god. Atheists as a whole do not. But that's one of the problems, atheists are a very heterogenous group, any generalist statement outside of the obvious "They don't believe in gods" is unlikely to be accurate.
All I want to know is why it’s so crucial to believe in something bigger than ourselves. Why do so many people need to be reassured of their worth, and to believe they are an important part of the world we live in. We are insignificant in the grand scheme of things, but that’s okay. I’m just happy that I was born into this world and that I can spend the time I was given with the people I love, that’s all I need to know that my life has a purpose.
yes exactly!!, there's this one argument that christians use against atheists that 'you can't prove that God does not exist' but they don't understand that lack of solid and observable evidence is actually the proof of his absence at least in SCIENTIFIC LOGIC
@Localhost83 yeah i know and that's why i said "AT LEAST IN SCIENTIFIC LOGIC". lack of solid evidence and observable evidence of a claimed character means it does not exist until solid and observable evidences are provided. It's pretty much the same thing christians mean when they tell you to prove the non-existent, "'"just because I can't prove doesn't mean he exists"'" and so they conclude that 'UNTIL YOU PROVE THAT HE DOESN'T EXIST THEN HE EXISTS' you get my point now?🙂
I think it's because if we accept that nothing matters, it means that good and evil are equivalent in the eyes of nature, and that's pretty hard to stomach.
I had a conversation with a Theist once that kept mentioning that I was "mad at God" and I "had blind faith in science". I then stopped the conversation and explained what "Atheism", "Faith" and "Evidence" meant emphasizing what "Atheism" meant just to be 100% clear. We then continued the conversation and he kept making the exact same claims so I stopped him AGAIN and said "I already explained to you what Atheism is, why do keep referring to Atheism incorrectly? Just so we're on the same page can you confirm what Atheism is?" and he came back with "Yes, yes, I know. Atheists are Darwinist scientists who are angry at God because they feel betrayed because they lost their connection with Jesus"
The reason is probably that for a lot of us, the reason we temporarily lose faith is being mad at God. I was raped and couldn't hear my calling anymore at 14. I still haven't gotten it all the way back. And in the past few weeks my youngest brother found my other little brothers suicide note and a knife by the computer. He's only 15 and I got so angry, not necessarily at God, but at the world. I straight up told him in prayer, "do what you want to me, but how dare you do this to my little brother. We're not on speaking terms right now." For a lot of christians, they assume that trauma is the only reason to leave God. It's not true, but it's common
@@msjkramey sorry to read your story girl, but yeah that's basically the same for all religions and those who were brainwashed from childhood with religions. Usually something traumatic (or just against their intelligence) made them question their religions and eventually left them.
napoleonic sp007rz I was about to get emotional, thinking you were giving some compassion. But then you slapped me in the face with it by saying "yeah, that's what Christians do"
@@msjkramey whoa I don't follow your logic, sorry if I offended you, but that's not just what Christians do, that's all human do. I was a Christian and I'm familiar with your story about traumatic experience, but now I can only make peace with the fact that reality is just as it is, and we are all not alone in that sense, whatever paths we take in our lives, others have walked on the same paths, whatever and how ever the end of those paths eventually reached us.
“Atheists believe the world came out of nothing.” Wrong. We’re just willing to admit we don’t know where it came from and that we are not convinced by the explanations offered by a century-old work of literature. We keep exploring. That’s all. Simple.
Interesting how you speak for all atheists. Are there not atheists who believe in a universe from nothing? Clearly you don't, but atheism being the non-religion that it is should have a diverse set of viewpoints, right?
@@stevemswendy86 What about mega anti god? Equally valid. Anti god punishes everyone who just follows orders from god. Prove he doesn't exist. That's the problem with that point. Ad now we haven't even addressed super ultra anti god, don't get me started with that fella, very unpleasant. He wants you to drink nothing but pickle juice. Or else you will be boiled in it in the eternal afterlife that can't be proven.
Hell's existence makes sense. If a judge here on Earth was to let a criminal go that committed grand theft auto he would be looked as an unjust judge not a righteous judge. Adolf Hitler killed millions of Jews because they were Jewish and then offed himself. Tell me where is the Justice for those people. Sin should be punished. God came in form of man to redeem mankind back to himself and die for the sins of the world. What makes a person miss heaven is not believing in the only one that died for the sins if the world. His name is Jesus. Everybody has sinned except Jesus because he was God in man. If you want to know what God is like it's in the person of Jesus. People need a savior. Can't be justified without him.
@@arthurtfm yes that can be only understood by experience so when you are your grandfather's age you would have experienced much more than you have experienced now
@@calebbalzer4518 That is a good point, and it complicates the issue. But if somebody tells me "I'm going to get my pet dragon to help you, just hang in there until the dragon arrives," I'm going to feel a bit insulted.
i swear that Lord of the Rings argument is so silly. LOTR has never foretold future events, nor has it ever told history or spoke of scientific understands that we're only recently finding out to be true through modern scientific testing. yes they are both books, but one is fantasy (LOTR) while the other is a Biography. Yeshua Ben Elohim (Jesus) was an actual person, as was King David, Solomon, Isaiah, and everyone else mentioned in The Book.
@@brooklynvlogs9396 But there's war in LOTR, it predicted war in real life. What did your "biography" predict? What about the transplants technically depicted in Frankenstein? What about credit cards in Looking Backwards? The nuclear-esk hand grenade in The World Set Free? And wow, things like fictional movies and games (and books too) also can include people that actually exist or existed. What does that have to do with anything?
@@thederogativeworld yeah nit picking doesn't work for this argument, oh the main character was short with dark hair and my cousin is short with dark hair therefore he is Frodo! not a good argument. and just to name one Jesus predicted that the world will eventually legalized all forms of Lust, Homosexuality is legal and soon the legal age of consent will be drastically lowered, in California they're already treating it as a gender/sexual preference, after that bestiality will become legal. and it has everything to do with it because you were comparing The Bible to Lord of The rings and now your changing your argument of full fantasy to semi fantasy.
@@brooklynvlogs9396 Guess what, it's still fantasy! There's also a clear difference between me using fiction with some realistic elements to show scientific predictions, and entirely fictional mediums to show real people in fake works. Oh, and please tell me how Wolfenstein 2 is "semi fiction." Also you clearly missed the sarcasm in that first sentence. It was never intended to be an actual argument, it's too absurd. Just like your arguments. As well as none of those things you said your book "predicted" being, what was it? Ah yes "scientific understands that we've only recently finding out to be true through modern scientific testing." Where are the scientific breakthroughs? Cause those examples look like social changes that ENTIRELY depend on feelings/emotion and can easily change, and thus mean absolutely nothing as "predictions"
@@thederogativeworld um no the Bible talks about Relativity, Atoms, explains to us that the earth is round at a time when people thought it was flat, and plantly of other stuff. But I'd like to know why you think The Bible is semi fantasy, tell me some of the stuff you think is fantasy, cause it's certainly possible that you misunderstand it.
@@andrewsealey2236 the clue is in the noun 'theism' I.e. belief in the existence of a god or gods, specifically of a creator who intervenes in the universe. I am a naturalist, I don't believe in anything supernatural. If alien life exists, it (they) will follow the natural laws of the universe. Scientific principles and laws will apply. They may be so far advanced as to appear 'godlike' to the theists. Who, let's be honest, only 250 years ago, burnt amateur midwives as 'witches'.
@@xxreidxx2362 I classify myself as an agnostic humanist. An agnostic believes 'human reason is incapable of providing sufficient rational grounds to justify either the belief that God exists or the belief that God does not exist'. Humanism which is a ' life stance that embraces human reason, secular ethics, and philosophical naturalism while specifically rejecting religious dogma, supernaturalism, and superstition as the basis of morality and decision making' I may at some stage or another find irrefutable evidence to change this view either way and will inevitably lead to a evidence based belief that nether religion or atheism cannot satisfy.
@@leowulf5280 What would you define 'Scientology' as. Although I don't subscribe to beliefs it is accepted as a religious movement. Any belief that believes in some higher order way or another can be, regarded as a religious belief. Why would it nor be considered to be acceptable to have a belief in aliens as a following a some form of higher order. Even Nazism can be construed as a religion especially with its fascination with the occult. In a modern twist American republicanism could also be considered an religion based on some of the beliefs they align themselves with.
At approximately 7 yrs old, sitting by my mom in church, I really noticed the preacher for the first time. The gestures, the tone of voice, the facial expressions ( but probably not what he was actually saying) and something pinged inside me, I could do that! I had that skill in me. So I tugged on mom and told her that I could do that, I wanted to be a preacher when I grew up. Ok it's 1962 and I haven't quite noticed the great divide yet, seeing all my mother did at church I was sure women ran the place. They did everything needed to make Sunday morning happen. I thought my goal would make her happy, but she looked at me with a sad face and said, "Girls aren't allowed to be preachers." Totally shocked. Later she gave me the 'talk' mothers gave to their daughters, different genders, different gifts, and jesus was a boy so the really 'important' jobs had to be done by men and boys. Well, I thought, if god doesn't like girls then I don't like god. Things change and as an adult I finally led prayers, served communion, collected offering, and one Sunday when both pastors and the sub pastor had to be out of town I was asked to lead the service. I should have felt vindicated, but I had learned by then what was wrong with god and theology. How could a god of love not love all of his children equally and accept them equally? I am a mother now and I think, how could a god of perfect love, all knowledge, and all power not love and accept 'his' children as equals for who and what they are? Don't tell me anymore that this puny god, so hateful, weak, and ignorant that he can be compressed into a finite set of human rules is worthy of worship. Also, (isn't that enough?) the arrogance of a Christian thinking that simply because they believe, then what they say is just so obviously true, no matter what anyone else thinks or believes. Comes across as if god really doesn't care what anyone thinks or feels, it's all about him, the great egomaniac.
That woman who talked about her fear of death, I sympathise. I grew up in a religious family and never really believed beyond vague ideas. I started to really think about religion and question in my pre-teens/early teens, but my fear of death eventually pushed me to get baptised in my late teens. It was really more of a Pascal’s wager situation if I’m honest and, in the end, rational thought won out anyway.
Or you could accept that everyone dies and there's nothing you can do about that, beyond trying to extend your life as much as you can, but you may still be hit by a bus or have an unexplained brain aneurysm tomorrow, so you may as well stop fearing it and go about the business of enjoying what life you have, especially with no smidgeon of proof of souls or an afterlife.
I completely agree. Honestly, that's the reason I want all people to become atheists, so they fear death, so we all can work together to make all people's lives better and longer. I think we would advance much much faster than we're doing right now
1. Atheism is a religion. Any time you have an "ism" it is a religion if you broaden the definition a bit (ie, contains dogma, advocacy, does battle with opposing viewpoints). 2. It might be.
@@jackmatthewtyson If I don't have a car, then I don't have a car, but I might still have "one" depending on what is being enumerated. There is no law to prevent a car brand "By Foot" which would be interesting, somewhat like the Chevy Nova (No Go!)
@@thomasmaughan4798 So if you have no interest in football and never played football and you never will, you are a footballplayer of a team existing from people who don't play football?
@@jackmatthewtyson Yes, something like that. A team that is not a team; where members that have no knowledge of other team members nevertheless speak for the team. When I was in the Navy one of my co-workers decided to form a club. It had no officers, but in order to be a club it had to have officers. So there was a Non-President, a Non-Treasurer and a Non-Charter that defined many things we did not do.
"You can't prove god doesn't exist." - Always so funny because they can't prove god does exist either. Why potentially waste thousands of hours of your life going to church, praying and discussing religion if there's a good chance it's completely pointless.
People have widely accepted that the burden of proof is on those making the claim (i.e. you don’t have to prove you aren’t a criminal), so anyone making this argument in an attempt to convert others really is stupid. On the other hand people go to church for psychological reasons, usually it’s a way to seek comfort which is a rather strong insensitive.
Pretty much Devil’s proof. Of course I always lean toward the more logical side. Though we can’t prove the existence of gods, science has came pretty far and debunked a lot of his stories and the Bible. I’m not saying I hate religion and Christianity/god, I’m just saying the Bible is a really sketchy book.
Honestly a lot of people simply believe in it for the sense of comfort that it could bring and how it might actually improve their life. One of my real life experiences is how my uncle was actually a horrible drug abuser until he found religion and after a year and a few months he was a completely different person. May not be real but at least it provides proper comfort to those In need
Not only that but there is no greater probability of one god’s existence as opposed to any other. There are thousands of gods. In the absence of any empirical proof, what makes one god’s existence more likely than the thousands of others?
@@devilsadvocacy Completely agree. Who's to say the ancient religions that had gods for the sun, moon, sea etc weren't correct? Or any of the many religions in India? People believe their religion so fervently but the only reason the vast majority of people follow their religion is because they were born into a family/town that brainwashed them as a child.
As a Christian, I don't understand why other Christians shame atheist, didn't the bible said to spread love and not hatred. Showing hatred is a way of deglorifying God, by showing hatred towards atheist, others will view that this religion is full of hypocrites, unloving people, which in turn pushes atheist away rather than making them closer towards God. My whole point is showing hatred will not help people go towards God. Because the main goal is to pull others towards God through love.
Same man,I'm gonna comment about this also,I'm a Christian and I don't blame why other atheist hate some Christians because some Christians force our religion to other people instead of spreading love to all people as that Jesus wants us to do,stay safe always and God bless
I'm pretty sure in the bible there is a saying called "the path was before the bible" or something(rough translation, not American nor English) which basically means "being a good person is more important then being religious" Then again, the bible changes between religions, even if they're about the same god and the same thing...
The church my parents attend have a gay couple among them, and no, they are not shamed or said they are wrong. In fact they encourage their relationship, as long as they are happy and grow their espiritual growth, that is all it matters so yeah, they all are different
Talking about rationality: Our thinking only make sense if God is there as the Maker and Sustainer of our brains. For mere chemical reactions cannot be trusted more that a bottle of coke
@@eenpersoonlijkeuitnodiging6028 they are also bad things written in the bible like sexist verses written in the new testament, not everyone agrees that men are superior to women, so why should a god tell me what to do, when he is wrong?
@@pauliusmscichauskas558 lol. I guess we can add "people in wheelchairs" to the list of people not allowed into heaven. Along with any man who's had his genitals damaged (which is kind of ironic because God also demands circumcision). Wow... God really is an able-ist, isn't he?
What’s funny is every church I know has gotten new followers that are down in a rough patch desperate for anything to help their misery, the human psyche does anything it can to get comfortable.
One of my favorite counter arguments to theists whenever they ask “How do you know your right”? is to ask them “How do we know that any religion is right? Who’s to say that your religion is right compared to, let’s say, Buddhism or Hinduism or maybe even the ancient Mesopotamian religions?” It’s pretty effective too since it leads to some of the more predictable arguments.
@@hitemwid1t Isn't tribal cannibalism pretty much a religious belief itself? (As opposed to that done out of extreme situational need or mental illness)
as an atheist who grew up in a semi-strict, mostly-relaxed christian-religious setting, not all theists are over imposing of their beliefs, I would consider myself lucky on that front. I was free to choose my path, but I know others are not so lucky, and I send good vibes to those in hopes that things get better.
Worst argument I've heard is just a simple proclamation that I'm going to Hell. No appeal to reason. No trying to explain how their deity is good and worth worshipping. Just that I'm going to be damned for eternity because I don't believe a storybook.
I always love that one, its basically conceding the argument. And it really pisses people off when you start laughing when they pull they hell card which for some reason they think is a big gun.
@God's Child Id love to know what a Bible base scientific evidences is, I've had clergymen admit there is no such thing so I'd love to have you show them different.
@2consider I've been listening all my life to Muslims, Christians and others. Not one of them can actually prove the basic tenant of their belief, that there is a god.
*Once you discover that The Great and Powerful Wizard of Oz is actually only a little man pushing buttons and pulling levers behind a curtain..., you just can't go back to believing it was real...*
Or... Once you've been pulled out of the Matrix and shown "what the Matrix is" you can never go back to believing that it's anything other than a computer simulation
And once you figure out that people who want to convince you anything goes want to profit from the collapse of society, then you won't believe their atheist lies any longer.
My favorite phrase someone has used to try and argue with me was: “You can’t prove God doesn’t exist.” It’s so simple, but it’s amazing because I always get to clap back with: “You can’t prove God does.”
@@markwitcombe2119 So why is it our responsibility to provide evidence for you? We don’t think he exists, why would we believe anything that you say comes out of his mouth? Also, you can’t cite the Bible dude, there is zero evidence that it was actually a truthful story, and even less evidence that your God wrote it.
You are welcome Drew! It's been my honor to be able to help this channel grow. I have been very pleased with the content both inquantity and especially in quality. I am condfident that you will take this channel to even greater heights. I plan on being a devoted fan for as long as this channel is around. I hope to eventually get to hear you speak in person. Alas, i will miss being a lord and savior. I have tried to get my employees to address me as such but they aren't buying it. Lol. Good luck!
how many of these people who were atheist and then started wondering "is there a god?" thought about ancient gods like zeus, osiris, odin, ereshkigal etc. instead of gods worshiped in their community/family/surroundings?
sarasthoughts that would be a theory/view regarding gods and trying to connect them to God; it presupposes that they are different concepts. The very fact that someone might take gods to be manifestations of God shows that God and gods are not identical concepts. And they're not; any study or reading of theistic religious or philosophical traditions can show this.
@@sh4dy832 I don't follow Him. I'm spiritual but I'm not religious so I don't carry the belief that God is all good or all evil. I think of God as being a more neutral creator figure, worthy of neither worship nor hatred. I think of God as being fundamentally opposed to organised religion and the idea of defining any one thing as objectively good or evil would be against how I perceive God. And so as God is neither good nor evil, why would He prevent or make happen any specific thing?
@@royanque8374 Essentially, yes. However, I would phrase it more as that we defined the things that we are naturally repulsed by as evil as a logical response to our emotions. I believe that ‘God’, or whatever you want to call it/Him, wants us to figure what is good and evil for ourselves. Many religious people say that evil exists because of free will and that we require free will to be truly good otherwise we would simply be slaves of God doing what He told us was good but not understanding the concept of good. I sort of agree myself but I don’t think that God has any specific definition of good laid out for us and so we have the free will to both DO GOOD as well as DEFINE GOOD.
Atheism isn't a religion, and neither is theism. They are simply the belief or lack of belief of a higher being or beings. Theists just don't get that.
I'm not adherent to the idea that there could be higher beings, after all, we can't know, but I'm atheist because I can't accept the contradictions in most religion.
That's interesting actually. Generally if you want to know if a belief is true, a somewhat effective method is to try everything you can to prove yourself wrong, and if that fails, you're probably right. (If x is false, y result will probably occur > y does not occur > x is probably not false).
I listened to a lot of pastors at a LOT of bible studies, then I kept having even more questions, because they sure have a lot of interpretations of the same thing. Like in Genesis, one guy says there were people before Adam and Eve, but they were like prototype kind of people. ??? One guy says Jews won't go to hell even if they don't accept Christ, because God favors them, one guys says all people will go to hell if they don't accept Jesus, one lady pastor says once saved always saved, another says, you can lose your salvation after being saved, same guy has a play that shows someone smoking cigs and going to hell. Some people say women can preach, some say no, it's against the Bible. WTF! And this is all in the same protestant sect. I'm like WTF is wrong with this.
I eventually became an atheist, ironically, because I was a fan of Greek mythology as a kid. The first hint that something smelled fishy was when I read about how the sons of Poseidon could walk on water. Basically, the children of each Greek god inherit a specific innate superpower, kind of like the X-Men. Water-walking for the sons of Poseidon, super strength for the sons of Zeus, etc. Secondary powers required divine intervention. The sons of Poseidon needed to yell for daddy if they wanted to _breathe_ water. And the sons of Zeus had to ask their daddy for a lightning strike. And then I thought about how Jesus supposedly walked on water, and I imagined a conversation where the Christian was being told about the powers of the sons of Poseidon, and countered with "Uh, our guy could do that too!" "My god is bigger than your god." That was when the leak sprung that gradually let all of my faith dribble out of the tank.
@@EEE-kg3vy I read stuff about evolution and its just bonkers. At the time, it was used to explain how Africans were more closely related to monkeys on the humanoid evolutionary spectrum and lead to some serious racist stuff like human zoos! And thats why I am a Christian, because the way the way the bible depicts the creation of humans is far more easier for me to understand and far less racist for that matter. Science is all about looking at the possibilities rather than caging ourselves with facts. Because facts can always be disproven in the next thirty or forty years. I mean, look at freakin Einstein! He opened up a whole new way of looking at reality and that was because he was always looking at possiblities.
Most theistic arguments go like this: "There are mysteries about life and existence that we cannot understand yet, so therefore God." Makes no sense whatsoever.
My favourite counter argument to that is "well, turns out the Sun isn't pulled up by a chariot". Just because we don't understand something, it doesn't mean it's magic
and then whenever god can't explain something or becomes logically inconsistent, they just say he 'works in mysterious ways'. so even if you're looking for a one size fits all solution to the gaps in science and modern cosmology, god aint it. Might as well just believe in pure science at that point.
Yeah most of these "i was an atheist videos" are from obvious liars... they speak in this very weird fake schizoid speech pattern that only religious people seem to have .
+Greg. I agree, because brainwashed people really tend to have the view that the goal justifies the means. Just take a look at who they vote for in USA.
It's code for "I felt really bad and wanted to believe and believing made me feel better". Good for them. Unfortunately a comforting lie is still a lie.
As a Pagan witch... I'm perfectly fine with the fact there might be no deities at all. I just like to think there's something out there, ya know? This is just something I'll find out once I die because I simply don't know.
This right here. Thats why i cant fault religions. Theres a comfort there. I want to believe. I just don't. Im quite jealous of believers sometimes. If i could just believe, i would.
I believe in science. I believe in empathy and having compassion for one another. I believe that, no matter what else, doing good for others is its own reward.
One of my acquaintances from high school said, with a straight face "What you think my kids are just going to grow wings?". The argument pretty much ended there, not because he won, but because I had no idea how to counter it without explaining the entire theory of evolution from scratch.
I think I could, it would take a while though. Maybe an hour or two of dedicated reasoning, albeit I do not have the exact information nor references ready. But the basics of it? Still, I can't say I blame you for not bothering with that.
One day I told my mother that I didn't want to go to church. ...The conversation ended with a comparison of atheism to homosexuality, and homosexuality to pedophilia. ....And she also knew I'm gay. I feel like she's accomplished her goal in teaching me about religion.
@@tomislav6923 There are Christian's that believe homosexuals are demons who also are attracted to children. That's what Sarah Williams is talking about. I've seen this before myself.
lmao. Of *course* you had to be gay. The puzzle pieces always fit together. It's easier to pretend not to believe in God because then you can sin in peace.
@@RilfDanielson there no reason to say Sarah Williams is pretending to not believe in God, like she didnt say she was athiest in the comment but probably is
A Meme Conservator-what an utterly moronic argument. This is analogous to saying people pretend not to believe in law enforcement so they can rob banks in peace.
Amy Xoxo I’m gonna be completely honest with you, I have know idea why I made that comment, I hate grammar nazis and I wouldn’t usually do that. So maybe it was a troll, but it was so irrelevant that I didn’t care to remember it, maybe you shouldn’t either.
One of the things I hate is just “we don’t need proof we have faith” like no, I have faith that a guy named blorblog the ancient is standing right next to me, i don’t need to see him, I have faith he’s there
Have faith in blorblog. If you do not accept him into your heart he will eat your dreams when you sleep until you inevitably die and get sent to blogland.
the virgin jesus wants you to believe in him smol muscles you could see him before he died gross crown of thorns vs the chad blorblog loves you no matter what you believe in jacked & lifts every day still alive & invisible sweet-ass shades
As someone who has never believed, I spent the first 21 years of my life in a very Christian area of the Midwest. My parents did not put me through childhood indoctrination, which brings forth the superstition, fear, and guilt essential for dogmatic belief. However, these Christians blew their chance at reaching me when I was young. It was found out by other kids in first grade that I did not believe, and this was shortly before I learned of the consequences attached to not believing, or not even trying to appear to believe. How these Christians blew their chance is simple to uncover. NOT ONE of these "good Christians" ever took the time to show me their "god's love," or anything resembling nurturing, caring, community, or concern. Not one. Instead, they called me names. They threatened me. They dehumanized me, which opened the doors to getting beat up and otherwise abused. You're a heathen, a sinner, broken, a failure, filthy, satanic, and less-than-human. Imagine grown adults cornering a first grader and screaming at them about how they're evil, satanic, less-than-human, and informing them that they are hell-bound for eternity for the "sin" of not believing. To call it scary would be an understatement. My grade school years were when they had a chance to convert me, by showing me a life lead by example. But none of them lived a life of example. None of them were truly good people, in the non-religious view of good people who are good based on doing good things and not labeled "good" because they believe something. None of them extended a hand. None of them engaged in "love thy neighbor." To be clear, and to put a point on it, they failed in their Christian duty to save my soul from hell. That is on them. I still see no reason why I should believe any of it, and then choose a segment of it over choosing another segment.
DrumWild , I grew up also in the Midwest. But I was raised and schooled all the way through high school in the Catholic religion. I remember getting out of church one Sunday and watching a parent slapping and yelling at their child because they needed to go to the bathroom and the parent was angry they didn’t use the bathroom before they left. I was very young at the time but that was my first realization that something was not right about this whole religion thing. I would watch that parent each week bow, sing, genuflect and do the sign of the cross and then drag their children out of church always yelling about something or another. It unfortunately took me a long time to get over the god thing. I raised my children by asking questions of them instead of giving them answers about a god that I never understood. They are grown now and have children of their own and I’ve spoken to them about how they felt about an “ungodly” upbringing because I felt I was just playing by ear since my upbringing was so different. My parents were not happy with the way My husband and I brought up our children. They were baptized after birth because it was easier to acquiesce than listen to the “ but you must baptize them. What if something happens?” I’m so sorry you had that kind of experience growing up. My heart goes out to you. (((Hugs)))
+DrumWild I do not share your story, but I share your conclusion from it... The best proof that there is no biblical (quranic) god is the believers "defending" that god and no deity intervening and stopping them from fundamentalism and discrimination of other worldviews. No god worth it's salt would let ignorant zealots talk for him without setting things right. Where is the fucking "ssmiting" of sodom and Gomorrah with the Westboro Baptist Church or Steven anderson when they insult their god by shouting out hateful sermons with frothing mouths... ?
The adults who threatened you with hellfire and brimstone were clearly maladjusted human beings who were also abused throughout their childhood. Indocrinating children into faith based living cripples them for a lifetime. The adults who bullied you literally did not have the moral compass to show them that they were being what they would call "satanic". They weren't given the chance to develop critical thought or their own code of ethics. The thing about "good christian ethics" is that they're not wrong about everything, it's the exclusivity that turns christians into devils. It's not wrong to love thy father and thy mother, obviously, but it's pretty fucking wrong to threaten children for not believing in god, it's pretty fucking wrong to threaten children or adults for being homosexual, it's not wrong to love thy neighbour, but is your neighbour islamic? well fuck that dickhead then. Islam is satanic if you're a christian. Send that cunt to hell. What about your other neighbour? They're protestant,l but you're Catholic. Well fuck that cunt too. Don't send your kids to school with the dirty protestant cunts. Catholicism is the one true path. you know that because your daddy told you that as he beat your mother and sister bloody for showing off too much ankle. You get the point. A christian is a walking paradox. If they were given a chance by their community to grow up and develop properly, they would never have hurt you. Religious practice is like the Oroboros eating it's own tail for eternity. Religion is self perpetuating. If you get them when they're kids, they'll be awful abusing parents, and then their kids will grow up to be awful abusive parents, etc etc
"If you really want to convert an atheist, you're probably better off being genuinely open, loving, and ready to listen rather than argue." Thank you for this piece of advice. First video I've seen of yours and this one quote really hits the mark of what every theist needs to know.
Same. Best part of the whole vid. Im going to try to do this to everyone I meet. The best part is that it lines up with what the bible says. I dont remember where but it basicly says, show everyone the love and compassion of Jesus Christ. I'm going to try to do this. Im glad you took away the important part!
So true though, if I ever were to adopt a religion (not likely though) it would probably be something like hinduism or buddhism only for the fact that every hindu or buddhist I've ever met has been so open minded and never militant about their beliefs, one hindu coworkef of mine told me that despite the fact that I don't believe in any gods she believes that I will still go to a good place because I treat others with dignity... I can get down with that style of thinking if I had to choose a faith to roll with
@@horsepuncher95 same tbh. At one point I actually got a bit bored and started looking into buddhism alittle bit because it seemed more like a way of thinking about the world rather than a belief in god and that appealed to me
@فهمي كتاني Even if the afterlife exists, it would be still a scam, and a lot of people should immagine why by simply by the term eternity and the princiles of their religion, but instead of hell then maybe. I hate your username because it makes the writting section weird
Them: "You might as well believe, what have you got to lose?" Me: Wow, I never thought of that! How could I have been so blind? You have convinced me with your argument. Now that I believe Odin exists, I have to make sure I die gloriously in battle, so I can enter Valhalla. Them: No no no, all those thousands of other deities you could believe in aren't real! Only the deity I believe you should believe exists is real.
Maybe not the worst but the most annoyingly often repeated by my Christial friends: "Atheists refuse to believe in God, because if they had to believe, they would need to change their lives."
Alec Chaidez you just explained the lunacy yourself lol. why can’t the universe be eternal? makes more sense than it being spawned by an eternal being, because beings have to be made. rocks are just there
Alec Chaidez that’s not ‘literally the only way it could make sense’, if god could exist infinitely why can’t matter? that makes way more sense, plus, we can see matter. it can’t be created or destroyed so maybe it just is why does some human figure from an old book have to be the creator? why weren’t the egyptians right, they were first after all. we are not special, we are just organic matter, a factor of the universe. no one made rocks for us, unlike coke bottles which have an obvious function, we just made use of rocks to form tools.
Alec Chaidez I’m not doubting a man who bore that names existence as, you are right, there are multiple historical accounts, however none state any sort of supernatural occurrences. He was likely just a preacher, which doesn’t prove anything
@Keylanos Lokj I honestly never think about god, that's something that doesn't bother me. Its much easier santa to exist than god. There could actually be someone very rich who helped the poor every year.
Hah! I'm a pagan, but they'd be right. The Christian god is depicted in the Bible as a reprehensible monster. Why would I worship that when there's easily thousands of other, far better gods depicted in other stories?
@schneidy81 For the same reason I don't want people beheading chickens and dancing around in their blood, or any other silly superstition that takes the place of actually doing something useful.
He actually does, Jesus does that trough believers, it’s like he wants to show u he's real (but ofc also so u don’t have to live in pain). Search for Tom Loud and Todd White in YT, what they did is not edited and can be done by any believer.
"I don't know" isn't the same as "nothing." Why is that such a difficult concept for some people? Just because I don't know where the Universe came from doesn't mean I think it came from nothing. Also, can I mention that if someone joins a religion in traumatic circumstances, you can't exactly use them as evidence that the religion is rational. Human brains get hella mixed up in traumatic circumstances.
That's fine and all until you tell someone else they are incorrect for believing in any sort of explanation for the universe (or anything for that matter).
Because it means your argument against God is based on what you do not know. Whereas a theist's argument for God is based on what we do know scientifically, or is at least the scientific and philosophical consensus, which still puts you very much on the back foot.
If you don’t know then you’re not an atheist, maybe by definition but definition doesn’t define culture. Just like a lot social movements don’t represent what they claim. To be agnostic is to be unconvinced of any evidence of anything. Atheists *usually* claim they definitely believe there is absolutely no God or deities and all scripture is inherently false. It’s semantic labeling I know, but figured I’d explain what it sounds like if we’re to tell a theist that you are atheist.
“You either have a God who sends child rapists to rape children or you have a God who simply watches it and says, "When you're done, I'm going to punish you." If I could stop a person from raping a child, I would. That's the difference between me and your god.” - Tracie Harris
@@you-in5iy I mean, in the majority of cases today people describe or write about their God as an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and omnibenevolent necessary being. If that kind of deity couldn't stop a person from raping a child, then it either doesn't exist or people are making up this being's properties.
@@you-in5iy If a "God" can't be bothered to save people despite being written as "omniscient, omnipresent and omnibenevolent" then it doesn't have the right to be called one.
The main difference between atheists (particularly those of the skeptic variety) and many christians (particularly those of the proselytizing variety) is that any atheist can tell you EXACTLY what would convince them god exists, while the christians usually counter that with the assertion that NOTHING can convince them god does NOT exist. In other words, if nothing can change their mind, and they can't give you the evidence you seek, continuing to argue is rather pointless.
"Believing in (insert deity here) makes humans good people! Without GOD there would be rape/murder/assault/etc." No, being a good person makes you a good person. Being afraid of Devine Punishment (hell) makes you a bad person pretending to be a good person.
SharxTheGuy I don’t do good to get into heaven, I do Gods will because I’m going. Salvation is a free gift to those that receive it, they don’t lose it, but there is covenant commitment to those that receive it.
heard this one on reddit a teacher was speaking to his pupils and says "pay attention to the world around you for god has placed everything in its place to teach you a lesson." one of his students asks "even the atheists?" the instructor says "yes even them" the student, confused, asks "what could god hope to teach us from them." the teacher says "god placed them to teach us about true compassion. see when an atheist preforms an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world they are not doing it because of some religious teaching. the fact that he does this at all is because of an inner sense of morality. and look at the kindness they can bestow simply because he believes it to be right." he continues "so when someone reaches out to you for help do not say 'I will pray for you' instead pretend to be an atheist and say 'I will help you.'" not exact quotes bot close enough
@@waifu_png_pl6854 good deeds are good deeds if god denies entry because of what someone believes instead of what they do then that is not a god worth following
I don’t like the idea of being an invisible puppetmaster’s tool to teach someone else a lesson. This totally contradicts the “free will” argument as well. My life choices were made by me and for me. I don’t exist so that someone else can feel better about themselves.
3:00 "... this amazing universe of ours, of incomparable beauty, harmony and order ..." The universe, practically by definition, is incomparable. There is literally nothing else to which to compare it.
uh how about Abstract Objects, such as numbers? math in itself is Order and the fact that we can find mathematical equations in the universe is a clear piece of evidence that the universe in itself has order and fine tuning for life. every mainstream atheistic scientist openly admits that the universe appears to be fine tuned. they say appear though because they don't want to risk sounding like the universe needs a creator when it clearly does.
@@TheKyrix82 but the fact that it works means that those things in themselves needed a maker who has a mind similar to our own. the only thing that creates code or information is a mind that can put things in the correct order, so because we have that understanding that a mind is the only thing that has the ability to do that, we have to conclude that a mind is what put the universe in order. at a time when we believed the universe was eternal this wasn't a problem, since we had an unlimited amount of time and an infinite number of tries to get things right. but because our universe has been discovered as finite, we no longer have the luxury of saying order was created by random chance. 13 billion years is not enough time for the universe to be exactly the way it is, where if the slightly thing was off the whole thing would fall apart.
Girl in video: "If theres a god,... omg, all the things I did in my past were horrible!" Me: "annnnddd, your solution was to convert and worship a god who has been a thousand, or a million times more horrible than you, throughout time? Sounds about right"
Mr. Meow right?! How can see claim te be a atheist and suddely released that see never thought about god? She wasnt an atheist she was just plain stupid.
"If theres a god,... omg, all the things I did in my past were horrible!" To put it simply, she bought Pascal's Wager. She was probably only an atheist because she was never introduced to religion. The moment she got a whiff, she immediately changed her ideals.
But how could she only think of ONE god, one religion? My brief crisis of faith (I am born and raised atheist) was in my teenage years, it was very short and went like this: What if the believers are correct??? Wait... believers of which religion though? How am I supposed to pick the *correct* and *true* one among all those that exist? And that's the story about how I stayed atheist.
I once told a friend that if I ever had children I would raise them to be atheists. However if they were ever interested in going to church/doing church activities, I'd be happy to go with them. Then my friend told me I would "have to take my child to church for a while to give it the opportunity to 'get to know god' and make an informed decision". While I understand where she's coming from, I'd have to take my child to every church of every religion for them to make a really informed decision. And I won't force a child to attend (insert number of different religions) services.
Yes, I didn't take my kids to any church either and they are the healthiest most balanced people ever. They are completely free of religious superstitions nor are they scared of sin or hell.
@@dekuboidonut4552 as someone who has been indoctrinated with the concept of hell, sin and a divine dictator that sees all your thoughts. I can assure you it is not healthy. So it might not be the reason for them being emotional healthy individuals, but it sure as hell (pun intended) helped to not indoctrinate them with that nonsense.
Heaven ⭐⭐⬛⬛⬛ Top reviews: "Eh it's alright, I'll never see my family again, and none of my friends will be allowed in, but at least I can play basketball forever" ⭐⭐⭐⬛⬛ "No booze" ⭐⬛⬛⬛⬛ "Literally can't do anything, it's all banned because it's a 'sin'. We can't even use profanity!" ⭐⬛⬛⬛⬛
@@strangerr13 Paganism generally applies to religions that spawned out Nimrod's empire, it refers to non-Abrahamic religions, (often polytheistic however they don't need to be, Buddhism is pagan and is atheistic) originally the term used was Gentile however that became more a non-Jew culture then a general religious application.
Theists emotional arguments are usually “God is Poggers because he helped me out of a dark place”, no outside force can help you out of that mental state you help you out of the mental state
Can confirm. God helped me through a rough patch in my marriage years back, now that I've deconverted, I realize that my partner and I did all the work. It was hard work, not a genie granting my wish or religion fixing my behavior so God would reward me with a happy relationship. We rolled up our sleeves and have a healthy relationship now because of it, instead of thanking God anymore, I pat us both on the back.
@@neonnatella4632 Still it can be a good psycological trick and I don't think it's bad since it can help people do the things they need to do to get out of a bad situation. The only cases of people who believe in God, but were "atheist" at some time were former drug addicts (they needed anything to believe and they grabbed onto that). I think some people need to feel like they have a purpose and religion provides that, but it's only a psychological trick that may be accompanied by a community. Expecting more than that is foolish.
Any argument for miracles. Then they just get mad when I point out the flaws. My roommate said it was a miracle when his aunt finally had a baby after like 5+ miscarriages. You dont need me to explain why that is wrong in so many ways. I point this out to him and he shut me out.
Trav Rad Good, I agree then. It would have been kinda a dick move if you had just turned him expressing excitement at his aunt not having a miscarriage into a debate about religion lol.
@@datfisheboi6519 I agree, that would be a dick move. I was upset at the same time that he praised his god for something that was clearly an evil, sidist act.
Tbf i think most atheists don't engage with sophisticated religious thinkers and instead just watch videos like this that confirm their biases, or watch videos of dumb Christians. (Same with religious people, vice versa). Most people are super hesitant to really listen to arguments that go against a core element of their self image/tribal belief
Are you familiar with Cold Case Christianity? There's a website & various resources under that name, but IMHO, the book is the best. It's all from an atheist cold case homicide detective, who applied his evidence-based approach to determining truth from fiction...and as the title suggests, his belief in Christ comes from the evidence. Look up God's Not Dead--Courtroom Scene for a 5-minute intro for how carefully examined evidence leads to belief...and the book is much more thorough than 5 minutes could be.
My favorite theist argument is that God is all knowing, all powerful, created everything, controls everything, knows the future of everything and at the same time is not responsible for our choices or where we go when we die. He’s suddenly helpless to prevent us from going to hell because “free will” lol.
@@omnitroph1501 free will is an illusion. Every decision is made entirely based on circumstances, be they genetic, based off of memory, or are the current situation.
@@omnitroph1501 but cause and effect is also true. Since nothing can happen without something causing it, there is no way anything could happen differently than how it has. I'm not saying destiny is real, because that would be stupid. But logically, unless its possible for something to spontaneously happen for no reason with no cause, then there's no way anything could ever happen differently. Everything you've ever done was determined by a combination of your situation and how you reacted to that situation, which was determined by a combination of personality, and also the situation itself effecting said personality (tiredness, emotion from the previous situation, stress, drunkenness etc.) Your personality is determined by two things, those being genetics (aggression is a genetic trait, and if course various genetic mental traits or disorders exist, and other stuff like that), and your experiences and memories, which have already been part of this process. And going back to science, I'd like to point out that as far as I am aware, there is nothing that is random. Even percentage based things like the positions of subatomic particles are because seeing them displaces them, so we have to guess where they are with statistics and not because they themselves are random. And finally even if the universe can have alterations, that doesn't change that you yourself go through the process mentioned above, and become a puppet to everything that's ever happened to you, the only instances of which you had control over being determined by you and therefore by your circumstances. Randomness in the universe wouldn't change your lack of true agency. Not that its bad. If you could really choose whatever you wanted you simply wouldn't want. Because you only want what you want because of your personality and situation. To have free will would mean having no personality, because its your personality that controls you, itself being determined by circumstance. Every action you do is meaningful because although you were guaranteed to be that way, if you weren't then you wouldn't be anyone. Of course, the issue is is that, its not people's fault when anything they do is done. Not that its good that they were done, but rather that punishing anyone for things should only be done if no other way of stopping such behaviour would work, so if a god is letting people be tormented because of things they had no real control over, then that's fucked up. Even murderers kill for a reason or combination thereof. And even if some of them are just messed up in the head and are born pure evil, its not their fault they were born pure evil. Not that I believe in evil, but you get my point. A psychopath doesn't choose ti be a psychopath. The only difference between Gandhi and Hitler is that they were born with different genetic traits, in different circumstances (time, place, the exact people and objects around them, how thise other people acted etc.) If you took their consciusnesses, erased everything all they're memories knowledge and traits, and them sent them back in time to be born in each other's bodies, and didn't change everything else, history wouldn't change. Once again I'm not saying Hitler was good or Gandhi was bad, but simply that none of them had choice in the matter because choice is impossible. The brain is a complex machine but it still follows rules. Even computers cannot create things that are truly random, only create the illusion of randomness. Our brains are no different.
my friend is very religious, and I'm not religious at all. sometimes they'll try to convert me by going on and on about religion. I was listening to their argument for hours but it got old after the first two arguments. and they're like "ok, tell me your side" and I'll say what I think is true and they'll say "nope, heard that before. say something else" over and over and over. like bro, how do you think I feel? edit: sorry this comment is worded horribly, i was feeling a lot of emotions at the time and im too lazy to change it now. but some good news for anyone who cares: i did leave those friends behind, for this and many other reasons. after i posted this comment, the religious ramblings continued, and i basically told them to shut the fuck up. i told them countless times before that i respect them as a person but i do not and WILL not believe in any high being, and i won't tolerate them trying to convert me any longer. but it was all useless in the end because i broke apart from the friend group a few months after. feeling a lot better now
I don't think that person is a good friend/actual friend. Either that, or he's missing a point, or it's someone else. If you still want to be a friend then sure, but I don't believe it's a good idea.
@@ssjcrafter8842 of course, someone must be bad just because they're trying to convert someone into a belief that's beautiful and absolutely harmless (sarcasm, fuck you)
That's genuinely ignorant.. It's no more than an assumption that is implying all theist have no understanding of their religions.. If you're white and tell a black dude he doesn't know shit about being black he'll likely reply by saying you obviously know nothing...
@@Bigghewi OK... So, God creates 2 humans; Adam and Eve. Than they have 2 sons, Cain and Abel. Then Cain Kills Abel. So, how were all other humans created? Who slept with who in order to create them all? Why are there different races if all come from one and the same? Or, a guy builds a boat and puts all animals on it and then after watter pulls back, he taxis them back to each continent? Or maybe how God full of love and mercy sends a death to kill all first born sons, lamb's blood etc? Or maybe another religion, one founded by a warlord who married a six-year old girl and "consumed the marriage" when she was nine? The religion that states "why seek peace when you have the upper hand", calls for "holy war" and say it's OK to kill those who don't share your beliefs? C'mon...
@@ivanstepanovic1327 I'm familiar with the teachings of man, they made me atheist..The God of the old testament is a jealous, and vengeful God. The God if the new testament is a hippie.. Most people also think Jesus was the only son of Mary and Joseph. Islam and Catholicism are corrupt echoes of the Bible and Torah, which are but small shreds of truths filled with the contradictions of man. We still live the same as we did thousands of years ago.. Arguing economics, religion, and even the shape of the earth, while most are oblivious of truth.
@@ivanstepanovic1327 Adam and Eve had 3 sons, Cain, Able and Seth. Adam was the first named man on the planet, but not the first. On the sixth day, go created man and woman and gave them dominion over all he created(genesis 1:26 read up and down a little for context). On the seventh, he fished his work and rested (genesis 2:2 read down for more context). Part of that finishing was to create the garden of Eden and Adam and Eve. This is what the Vatican wants us to believe anyway. www.vatican.va/archive/bible/genesis/documents/bible_genesis_en.html. This of course is open to interpretation because the bible seems to skip around in time saying things like "before the rivers/plants (depending on version) sprung to life.. god gathered dust to make Adam. So it's a little fuzzy on whether Adam was created on day 7 or much earlier. The bible goes through so much direct time this happened, then this, then this, then this... But before maybe this happened or maybe not because something happened day 7 other than rest, which strongly implies gardening, but it happened on day 7 before water was added on day 1 or vegetation on day 2, so... It is that confusing if you actually read it. I simply call bullshit.
Oh and if you really want to screw with their belief, don't argue with them. Have them explain any of the common bible stories. The Flood is good, so is creation, doesn't really matter what, but something big so they are comfortable talking to you. Ask questions, but not ones meant to trip them up. Get them used to explaining but not defensive. So avoid asking how Noah built an Ark with his family needing 2 thousand man work years when those idiots made the Ark Experience with power tools and heavy equipment (yea that took 2 thousand man work years with modern technology).... Ask how he fed the animals, that's not too threatening, and let them off the hook with whatever they say. You want them to expect you to ask hard questions, but accept what they say so they are not threatened by those questions and are willing to help you understand. Then get something from Deuteronomy and have them explain that to you. (Deuteronomy is one of the books of the bible and the source for nearly all of the "god is a fucking asshole way worse than Hitler and Genghis Khan multiplied together" stories. Dashing infants into the rocks(throwing babies at the ground to kill them) is what god wants you to do... Go rape your neighbors daughter then kill her for being a whore... This book is fantastic for breaking beliefs if you can get someone to try to explain it).
krillin6 This is exactly the conclusion I have come to. Apologetics was never intended for converting non-believers. It is a defense mechanism designed to help doubting believers, and hence need not be all that convincing. It’s target audience “wants” to believe. They use childhood indoctrination, and love bombing people who are down and out for proselytizing quite effectively. Believers think that apologetics arguments are quite convincing because they already want to believe.
I always think of 'converting' to atheism as 'waking up'. Enlightenment, as others would call it. And who the hell wants to go back into the dark once they come out of it?
@@Acc_-rh8tx and @ Jamers 1217 Yeah but cmon, lets be real for a second here, don't both you guys think that most atheists are "glass half empty with a bad attitude" whiny complainers all around in a shitty religion themselves? I mean, God still made them but wow, are they not the epitome of ignorance? I am talking specifically about people who call themselves "atheists"......
@@Acc_-rh8tx From teachings of Christ, our free will to choose or reject Jesus is one of the keys to our lives, that's one of the reasons why Christians wanted liberty, to give themselves less excuses to ignore God and be held accountable for themselves. (ditto to those around them as well)
@@evolutionisbull5h1t No. Just like you don't need to see someone's brain to know they are smart, you don't need to know their religion or their beliefs to know their personality. The people you are talking about are just shitty people to me. There are shitty atheists, Muslims, Christians or just shitty people in general. At least to me
During WWII my maternal grandfather served on a Destroyer Escort that hunted submarines in the Pacific and my paternal grandfather carried a flamethrower in Europe. Unlike the women in my family, they were never religious. They didn't say grace, our pray, and they never put a dime in the collection basket. They only attended church to appease their women. They both told me that when you understand how horrible the world can truly be, then you can understand that nothing benevolent ever designed it. It's easy to believe in God when you ignore all the suffering that he allows.
@@mpmh3 There's pedos in the mainstream, sure, but that isn't proof of any god. In fact, it's a better argument as to why there isn't a benevolent god.
And then make everything out of nothing? Theist often say the energy and hydrogen that caused the big bang makes no sense, but look at the way god just wills something into existence.
no he was "always there" with "no beginning and no end" because ofc he can, but if *my* universe starts off from nothing (again not the case, that is just a strawman theists make) it's suddenly not ok, as if one half-explained and proven hypothesis is better than a completely unfalsifiable guess
I had two Mormons at my door one hot summers day. I looked at them, them obviously being on the streets since sunrise and after they introduced themselves and the reason why they were at my door, I asked them if they would like to have a (non-alcoholic) beer and rest in the shade a little before anything else. They thanked me and I got them the cold ones, seating them on two garden chairs, so they could rest. I did a J and asked them if they were on the move all day, obvious smalltalk, that kinda stuff, nodding here and there, just being a chill dude. Told them, that their "job" sounded very exhausting and frustrating for everyone involved. They asked if I was interested in hearing about Jesus, I just said no and let them finish their beers before letting them continue on their quest elsewhere as soon as they seemed stable enough to carry on. I never met two people so releaved, yet so uncomfortable and awkward at the same time, but hell, being kind "for no reason" never felt THAT good. Maybe they thought I was the anti-christ, trying to challenge their faith by being chill, or they were just not used to hedens being nice to them. Seemed to be a shock to their system, but maybe I'm just looking into their odd behavior too deeply. You guys had any similar experiences?
My sister just told me the same thing about fairies, goblins, Nephilim and all sorts of her down the rabbit hole characters. It's sad how the delusion and bicameralism get worse. Maybe she'll work through it and come out atheist once every bit of bullshit is exhausted.
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
"I was interested in truth from the point of view of salvation just as much as in truth from the point of view of scientific certainty. It appeared to me that there were two paths to truth, and I decided to follow both of them." (Georges Lemaître)
Nice quote! Works very well from a Christian view and from an atheistis point of view. I am a Christian, but I also believe in science and evolution. "Coincidence is God's way of staying unonymous" ~ Albert Einstein
@@theegyptiangamer2530 -- Einstein was actually making a joke. He also emphatically stated that he never believed in God as a personal savior. And I quote "It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."
@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic , this comment may be a tad unusual, bc I'm a Catholic school Theology teacher who used this video in my class to help them understand that atheism isn't always a matter of ignorance, hatred, or any other label far too prevelant amongst us theist folks. Legit, you're one of the most articulate atheists I've come across, and easily the best at rational counter-arguments. I appreciate your openness in the intro to this video to the challenges theists have given you, and you're welcoming more of them. As such, I'd like to offer you a challenge to atheism called Cold Case Christianity. It's the name of a book by a cold-case detective, atheist, who looks at the Gospels as eyewitness testimonies, and evaluates them like all the testimonies he evaluates professionally in homicide cases. There's also videos & a website, but the book has the thoroughness that I think you would enjoy.
Im sorry but mentioning doesnt work in comments unless you reply to someone, and since this is such an old video you will probably need to email him if you want to have a chance in him seeing your message
