Why Undertale's Genocide Path is JUSTIFIABLE | Undertale Theory | UNDERLAB 

A psychopath can apply this sort of logic to killing anyone in real life. Really, Sans admits that self-defense would be justified, but he doesn't understand why his harmless brother would be murdered.

Sans: he did not protec now he attac and you feel your sins crawling on your bacc

see, this is my reason for why the no mercy path is justified, not the genocide. because in the no mercy run, you kill things that try to kill you. but in the genocide run, you're actively trying to kill everything.

"Letting papyrus capture you is a death sentence," *papyrus letting me escape 10000 times*

Just a Note: Papyrus didnt know what would happen when he captured you.

Toriel just wanted to keep you safe from Asgore. Papyrus just wanted to impress Undyne. Undyne just wanted to stop you from killing anyone else. Mettaton just wanted to stall you so the other monsters could evacuate. Sans just wanted you to leave the undertale timelines alone. But you? ...you just wanted to complete the game.

There is a good justification: the war never ended.

On the Genocide path, Papyrus doesn't ever attack you, therefore there is no justification for killing him in Genocide.

Q: why do you do the genocide path? A: to listen to "battle against a true hero" and " megalavonia "

"Why the genocide run is justified" Goes by neutral route logic

UT's genocide route feels almost like an inverse creepypasta game. The game goes like any normal creepypasta game, where you try to run away and escape the threat. However this threat always finds you, and murders you. In Undertale this same logic applies, except you're the threat, and everyone tries to run away and escape you. But just like every creepypasta game, if you go with it, the threat wins. You win.

The thing is: on Genocide, Papyrus doesn’t try to hurt you. He doesn’t attack you, he spares you, and you choose to murder him.

When in Waterfall, is killing monsters like Shyren that justifiable when Shyren's encounter text is literally her hiding in the corner?

One problem with that, though. In the Genocide Run, Papyrus spares you immediately, with no intent of fighting you. By this logic there is no justification for killing him under the circumstances you describe.

In the genocide path, you are walking around and waiting for monsters to come. Frisk/Chara even makes a smiley face.

"Maybe the human doesn't know that you can spare others." I would agree to that if Toriel didn't say in the beginning of the game that you can talk to monsters instead of killing them

5:20 Err... If you are on a no mercy run, then he immediately spares you, saying that he can be your friend and steer you away from your dangerous path.

I have something against this. When you fight the glad Dummy in genocide he is well glad and has no content in attacking you. But you still kill him. Not very "justifiable". Also that's just messed up! After he finds happiness you have to kill him! And people say sans death was sad...

Vulkin actually thinks her magma heals you, she doesn't want to hurt you. And tEMMIE just wants to pet you but doesn't realize you're allergic.

Am I the only one that didnt know "proving you were strong enough" to toriel was gonna kill her. like I thought she was just gonna let me go but she died and now I feel really bad

*cough* Monster Kid.

This only justifies neutral. Genocide means you go out of your way to attack.

whoah, whoah, I was all for it until you said the (blue) magic word. "Papyrus". Papyrus is only "Hell-bent" on capturing you because it is his dream to join the royal guard, he says when he captures you, he will send you to the capital... and he doesn't know what happens next, heck, he probably doesn't even know what the royal guard does, also, he poses no threat what-so-ever, he doesn't even kill you, he just.... puts you in a shed.... that... you can easily escape from.... and even if you keep losing to him he just lets you go past, I mean I could understand the argument, "but he's trying to kill me so i'll kill him" if it was actually happening to you, but even when you attack him, when he's left with only a small amount of hp, he says something along the lines of "ok you win, you can spare me now". So either way, you basically are never FORCED to kill Papyrus.

6:13 I like how he leaves out the part where you literally attempt to murder an innocent child, who is then saved by undyne. 5:43 Also, Papyrus straight up says that he wants to teach you how to be kind and to not kill. Not to mention that all non boss monsters can be spared if you get their health low enough, meaning that even if you do attack, you can still end things peacefully. Plus, some monsters like whimsum don't want to fight, and can be spared immediately.

"Two wrongs don't make a right, therefore it's okay to kill asgore because he killed people." I'm actually dying from irony overdose right now.

Rebuttal: Killing Shyren is necessary for the genocide run. Her battle entrance specifically mentions her hiding in a corner yet encountering you anyway. Her attacks are completely pathetic, purposely so, unless you take the steps needed to spare her.

what about monster kid? why do we attack him?

This whole video says " how to be comfortable and not feel bad about making monsterkind extinct."

Edit: I think Toby Fox implied on Twitter that Undyne confirmed in-game that Asgore directly killed all of the 6 fallen humans between Chara and Frisk.

i just came for the drama the comments here didn't dissapoint me

5:44 not actually because Papyrus spares you on the genocide route

The thing is I want to agree. But I can’t. None of these murders are justified. The reason being is that in the Genocide route you are the bad guy (Sans attacks first when you usually do, signaling that you are the boss).

People seem to overlook why the monsters were sealed in the first place. If a single monster manages to steal a soul on the surface, they would become powerful enough to murder 6 other humans. Basically, it wouldn't take long for a monster with a gun and desire for power to become a god.

9:08 Congratulations, it seems Flowey has more emotions than you

One day, I drank an entire bottle of the Dead Sea's water. And it was not as salty as this comment section.

7:08 "Muffet is essentially the equivalent of someone charging an unaffordable price for medicine" Isn't that just America?

there's one thing you didn't justify. the fact that, in the genocide route, papyrus spares you. he doesn't attempt to capture you at all in the fight. he doesn't attack you. only sparing you

Am I the only nerd who decoded the Wingdings at the end of the video? xD it's "HE HAS GONE TOO FAR. THERE WILL BE CONSEQUENCES." if I'm not mistaken. I tried to go through all the comments to check if anyone else noticed that but I gave up after the first 100 or so lmao

When you do grinding, you are looking for monsters. You only grind when in genocide, so you are trying to kill them first.

When a Monster kills a Human: Meh When a Human kills a Monster: *Everybody goes crazy* Edit: wow, people are taking this seriously

Batman:"Self-defense"? that's an excuse. There is always a way.

Problems: Pacifist: From a human's perspective, the monsters are playing genocide at first. From a monster's perspective, they are defending themselves, stopping when they realized you are friendly/neutral and is reluctant to fight back. Neutral: From a human's perspective, the monsters are killing machines. From a monster's perspective, it is an act of self-defense, and also you are a human, and humans should die. Genocide: From a human's perspective, it is an act of self-defense. From a monster's perspective, the humans are nuclear bombs. And here's why: Basic History: Humans fear the monster's ability to absorb a human SOUL, possessing incredible powers. They declared war on monsters and won. Monsters got sealed in a huge rock cave with a magic barrier, which allow only ones with human souls can cross. The monsters believe that all humans are the creatures with the intent of killing every last one of them and wants to avoid that by killing them first. The idea became a dominant piece of their mind when Asriel died because of humans. Asgore declares war once more on humans, saying "Every humans that enters here, shall never leave with their bodies."just to gain hope once more among the monsters. Toriel disagrees and attempts to prevent humans from leaving the RUINS, because she knows that if you leave, you die to ASGORE. And when you do die to asgore, he goes to break the barrier and revenge on humanity for the murder of his son. By blocking you from venturing to the rest of the Underground, Toriel is saving both humans and monsters from dying to another war. Except that all monsters would be dead, including herself.

The Papyrus argument was pretty weak.Papyrus was trying to capture you its his job thats like saying its justified to kill a police officer because he was doing his job.

You can’t do genocide. Without grinding, you can do a neutral run where everything you interact with dies tho, so that’s what you are justifying

Asgore: He protecc He atacc And his son stabz him in da bacc

Loox: kills human Toriel: oh ok idk Asgore: says he will kill a human Toriel: surprised picachu face

Here's the thing: All of this is only justifiable IF you're playing for the first time and are totally unaware of the intention or back story of these monsters. Most people who do genocide run though usually do it after a pacifist run: After they're aware of the happy ending, aware of why the monsters are doing what they're doing, and are even aware that when they get to the surface, things seem to be working out for them. Most people usually do the genocide run for the sake of either completion or curiosity, considering the fact that in the context of this world, they can restart and undo all their previous damage and assume that once it's over with, they can just go back and do another pacifist run to get a better ending. I mean, think about it: If you had the power to rewind time and undo everything you did after you did it and restart from earlier points of your life: Would you not be tempted to abuse that power? Especially since there are no consequences (as far as you know) since you can undo any damage and no one will remember a thing? You could literally get away with murder and because you can bring that person back to life with out any memory of what you did, you'll be fine. I personally find it difficult to justify the genocide run considering how Toby has described other games: He always thought about the implications of slaying monsters/enemies mindlessly in other RPG's and felt that it made the heroes seem less heroic, which is why befriending the monsters in this game is heavily encouraged by not only the game itself, but also when the game was first advertised. Let's not forget how it seems like Toby Fox made the genocide route as boring/repetitive/grind heavy/redundant as he did: In order to make things less fun, and with how heavy handed the game is by either guilt you or scolding you for your choices. Also the fact that Genocide run has consequences and takes away the chance for another happy ending (True Pacifist Route is now called Soulless Pacifist Route for example, basiccly rubbing in what you did prior) I don't think Toby Fox would want us justifying the genocide ending when it appears that the whole reason Undertale was designed the way it was was to show the player that the genocide route isn't a good choice. Though I've heard people justify genocide run for other reasons: Reason 1: If you don't end the time line permanently, Flowey will just keep resetting to the beginning every time, making all the characters in Undertale stuck in a perpetual time loop forever (Though it's been proven that Flowey can't due this due to Frisks's determination out weighing their own, though I guess it can be determined that when Frisk finally dies some how or if Flowey themselves managed to gain more determination, then this is possible) so this means that killing everyone via genocide run is an act of mercy to finally release them from the time loop. Reason 2: That the monsters going back to the surface, since it's doubtful humanity will just let them integrate with their society and probably segregate them, and that they'll either all be slain by the humans and die anyway, or that this could be the cause of another human/monster war in which the causalities could be far greater than the mere body count of the genocide run. So by killing all of them, you're essentially sparing them and the rest of a surface from more wide scale destruction. Reason 3: The fact that the monsters might have destroyed humanity during the ending credits of the Pacifist Route because we don't see the monsters interacting with any humans on the surface, and the humans themselves seem to have disappeared while the monsters are roaming about the city (Though I'm sure there's another explanation for this) thus the monsters all need to be killed to protect humanity on the surface. I personally disagree with these three statements (despite how understandable they are) since the implication that genocide run is the answer goes against the whole point/message of the game, and the fact that we already have people who believe that wiping off certain groups of people from the face of the earth is the only way to make things better (In other words, they believe the genocide of certain populations is justified for similar reasons) which I think is BS because there's always another way.

Everyone: chara why did you kill everyone Chara: Hey I just wanted to listen to megalovania

I don't think there is a justification to the Genocide run, but I will say this. Asgore can kill every single human being that comes down there, children more or less and Sans doesn't bat an eye. The moment you start killing people though, you are a monster? What? They're so proud of killing, especially humans down there, but when a human starts killing, they start acting like heroes for trying to stop you.

Commit mass genocide because they hit first? Seems legit.

From the monster's perspective, attacking a human is self-defense. After all, the humans attempted to exterminate them in the past, which is the whole reason they're in the underground in the first place. Through legends and history, humans will have been made into this evil, soul-devouring menace that lurks even now just above ground, waiting to destroy them at any moment. You sparing them is them ceasing their attacks when they realize that you're not hostile and withdrawing. Toriel *knew* that if she let you pass, then not only would you die to Asgore, it would lead to Asgore ascending to being something on the level of his son at the end of the game, and then taking revenge on humanity for the murder of his son. In attempting to keep you there, she's not just attempting to spare your life, she's attempting to save all of humanity from a similar death. Eye for an eye, but Toriel knows that makes the whole world blind. And even *then,* she tried to put up *just* enough of a fight to discourage you from continuing onwards, and she doesn't even have the fortitude to keep THAT up when you refuse to fight her. She's obviously horrified when she accidentally kills you. Her hypocrisy is most likely her projecting her guilt and sadness onto Asgore. Papyrus only does what he does because he's naive. He thinks that real life works like anime (though, to be fair, life in the underground has some definite resemblance towards anime). He's been ordered to capture humans, but he doesn't understand *why,* just that he's been told to do it, and by a personal hero of his no less. Undyne shares the same opinion of humanity as the other monsters. Namely, that humans are the evilest of evils, and that the only way that monsters can possibly survive and thrive is if humanity, their worst and greatest enemies, were destroyed. She no doubt regrets having to take any life for this goal, but believes that it's necessary if monster kind, her friends and loved ones, are to survive. Alphys is... disconnected from the real world at best. She is rather like Papyrus, though from a different perspective: she doesn't really understand the consequences of her actions or why certain things might be bad for her or for others. Part of this very well might be escapism and trauma on her part from her participation in the experiments with determination, where a real, tangible attempt to save lives and resurrect monsters just so they could be with their families again failed due to things that she could have never predicted. Thus, her inability to correctly perceive the world, and her obsession with anime, is a coping mechanism that she uses to deal with her own psychological damage. She might not even really comprehend that she's putting you in danger. Muffet believes you to be a horrible person who wiped out the spiders that had been long trapped in the Ruins. She is honestly misinformed, and simply didn't know that you didn't actually *do* anything. She's angry and distraught, and is attempting to exact her revenge on what she views as a psychotic murderer. Additionally, her overpricing is entirely in response to this as well, and is most likely entirely restricted to you. Mettaton fights you for the same reasons as Undyne and all the other monsters: because from Mettaton's perspective, you're evil. Mettaton's earlier attacks were more or less due to Alphys' interference, given that she sent him against you. Mettaton's main issues are his tunnel vision and his obsession with fame, which lead into him abandoning Napstablook and then attacking and attempting to kill you. In the end, you help Mettaton realize that he really did accomplish what he wanted to, and that he doesn't need to fight. Thus, he allows your passage. Sans has meta awareness. Obviously, he's aware of things that none of the other monsters are, like the fact that you're neither evil nor hostile (except on the Genocide route). However, he takes no steps to warn the other monsters of this, because in the end, there's no point. He lost hope a long time ago. Him attacking you is a kind of empty resignation to the inevitable, and attempting to change your path by frustrating you, knowing that it's all worthless in the end. Asgore, in the end, is more or less just as justified in his campaign against humanity as you are justified in killing monsters that attack you. Asgore in the aboveground would be just like you in the underground: namely, that he would be more or less just acting in self-defense. It's just that he'd have a secondary motive: revenge. Flowey is a husk of someone that once lived, soulless and undeniably sad. Killing him is something close to mercy, in a way, ending his empty existence, even if it doesn't have the wonder of his redemption. Is Frisk fighting back against the monsters justified? From a meta perspective, absolutely not. From their perspective... they're a child, why would they ever think of fighting back outside of the player's intervention? Essentially, without the player, they wouldn't fight the monsters anyway and the monsters would relent when they realized this. With the player, they're not justified because the player possesses meta knowledge.

The best way to justify it is: I paid for the game so im the god of this universe

my theory is that Sans is breaking his promise not because you killed everyone, but because you're literally about to erase the world.

"Two wrongs don't make a right. Therefore it's okay to kill Asgore, because he killed people." ...wtf?

sans judges you not only because you killed litteraly everyone including his brother and possible lover, but also because in the game you enjoyed it and didn't give anyone a chance. some of the monsters doesnt even want to fight.

Pacafist: most memorable ending Genocide: most memorable boss (sans) Neutral: most terrifieng/intense boss

Why the genocide run is not justifiable: 1. One must actively seek out monsters to kill, 2. One must kill a pacifist, that being Papyrus who spares you, 3. One must try to kill a child, that is to say monster kid, 4. One must have the underground destroyed, thereby putting the entire world at risk, As for killing in general: 1. Monsters can be spared at low health, which makes killing them unnecessary, 2. Monsters can be spared if the character is of a high LV, making fights unnecessary, 3. Despite the fact that the monsters instigate a battle, the character always goes first, 4. While monsters do attack you, not all of them do so intentionally (Woshua and Blooky for example) 5. Certain monsters (whimsun, moldsmal) can be spared immediately, making fights unnecessary, 6. Toriel and Papyrus do not try to kill you, even though the former can do so by accident, 7. All monster encounters can be fled from, making fights unnecessary, 8. As a human, the character is immensely powerful compared to the monsters, the vast majority hardly pose a threat, 9. Rationally speaking, fighting the monsters isn't beneficial, one is better off sparing or running away, 10. Many monsters educate the character about sparing and mercy, so ignorance can not be used for justification,

7:13 American health Care system: "sweats nervously"

"its just a video game" How I was able to do the genocide run.

Pacifist: Fight Neutral: Fight Genocide: Lets have tea Ik why he says that but idk if y’all are generally trying to tell me or just saying that-

I like eggs

Underlab: Turns the logo around Me:Turns my phone around so i can see the logo normally Also me: Yeah, its big brain time

No, this isn't justified. Primarily, your argument is that you don't know better and are just retaliating. This is just not true. You cannot complete a genocide run if you never actively searched monsters to kill them. Random encounters are so rare once you get to a certain level that you cannot even consider them as attacking you. Plus, you know you have another possibility. The first "fight" you get into, with the dummy, shows you that you can do something else than hitting. You're told to speak to it. You have the act button -why would it be there considering enemies hardly take more than two hits to beat?- and the puzzles you meet along the way. Toby Fox designed the game not to be funny when taking that route, and he always gives you the opportunity to turn back. I can understand that you kill Toriel. You're played on, you have to go back to save her, understand the mechanics. But by Papyrus, you cannot be forgiven for killing anyone. He does not attack you and never wanted to kill you. Yes, if you think it through, that's what being captured would mean, but the game just isn't thought this way. However long you wait, Undyne will never get you in your cell. Never. Oh, and how about monster kid? Are you justified for killing him? There's no retaliation here. As I said, the game is less and less funny taking that route, and you can go back. Sans is your final warning -take for instance what happens when he spares you: he says "don't come back". Also, if you beat him then save, the savepoint tells you, Toby tells you : "If you're here, it's that somehow I did something wrong". Because you are not supposed to take that route. Everything dissuaded you to do so, and you always had the opportunity to go back and play it right. Final argument: if you could be excused for a genocide, you wouldn't be so awfully punished after a pacifist route if you have done a genocide. In pacifist, everyone is happy! You set all things nicely, surely whatever you could have done would be forgiven? No. You aren't meant to be forgiven, this is going way too far.Retaliation is understandable. That is why a NEUTRAL path is justifiable. However, a genocide route is way different. Remember the selling argument for that game: a game where you don't have to kill everybody. This game is a pacifist statement. The other routes are here to make you understand by trial and error how you were always supposed to act. Toby Fox puts you in a context of violence because you know better, you know what the game is about, and if you didn't, you're told. That's why we start with Toriel. The very intro, when she shoos Flowey away, proves you that he was wrong. She saves your life to show you how to play. She inspires you to pacifism, and I think that's what the final goal is: to inspire the monsters to love and peace. This is an incredible statement considering what happens in our world. You say we are justified to kill because monsters attack first, but let me ask you this: who started the war between humans and monsters? We don't know. There is no clue. In our world either, it runs from far too long, and it's far too complex. Are we justified to keep on fighting and killing because someone attacked first? Toby says no. Everyone is responsible for perpetuating the fight.

Are ya gonna justify killing Papyrus. *ＤＩＲＴＹＢＲＯＴＨＥＲＫＩＬＬＥＲ*

Random person : Jerry?! Jerry, where are you?! Me : FORGET JERRY, JERRY’S *DEAD*

now killing monsters dat ran into you that's alright,but randomly running around to encounter and kill them like you wanted... these are diffrent. look,you ran into monsters to attack them,but not all of them WANTED to kill you.

This really only justifies a kill heavy neutral route. In none of the zones, is EVERY monster trying to attack you. In a genocide route, you keep going around the map actually hunting for the poor monsters. There wasn't any justification for quite a few of these characters. For example, Papyrus. Papyrus was believing in you before death, and still forgave you and kept believing in you even after you decapitate him. Papyrus was trying to spare you. Papyrus even lowered his DEF and ATK by 17 points!

You know the BEST route? Obviously the "Don't be a idiot climbing the Mountain where nobody returns from" Route. That's the best

You WENT AND KILLED AND SEARCHED FOR EVERY MONSTER HOW IS THAT JUSTIFIABLE?

NO! THERE IS NO JUSTIFICATION FOR KILLING GOAT MAMA!

7:49 Froggit tries to run away from you actually.

Counter argument: Sans asks you to be kind and reset to bring his brother back. If you were an innocent child that is what you would do

Next week we'll be covering why Hitler's genocide path was... wait... no...

Okay, a couple things. A) Papyrus doesn't attack you in your battle against him if you've chosen the genocide path. B) Monster kid C) The justification is the fact that monsters as a race are inherently threatening to the safety of the universe. All it takes is literally 7 dudes to die near a monster to create the next GOD OF HYPERDEATH. Monsters are not as innocent as they make themselves out to be.

In my opinion, the game’s message of pacifism is made far stronger by the ability to rationalize doing the opposite.

A couple years back, I didn't have the maturity or growth I have today to have enough patience and listen to others' point of view, and Undertale made me somewhat understand how important it is to listen to people's stories and see the hidden pain, confusion, and blinded misinformation they were given and taught from bad experience and history. It's not always easy to let the burning hate of the ones of suffered, and it's easy to let your own pain lash out at other people because you suffered something in life too. Sometimes it takes self control and a bit of patience to see that there's a lot more than a facade that says "I hate you!" and screams "I'm hurting and I can't take the risk of being hurt again!"

Hey guys look! I found Frisk! 😑

Thing is you did not mention the fact that you have to keep running around to kill every single monster in the area , which is not really justified because your avidly trying to find monsters to kill. There for it’s not justified

Why do you assume the previous fallen humans were "innocent", we don't know what happened, some of them could've been violent, some of them could've killed Monsters, keep in mind the Yellow Soul had a GUN which you find EMPTY, of course, how and when it was emptied, we don't know, but, still, also, the Blue Soul's tutu is described as "Dusty" and the shoes quote "Make you feel dangerous". But, another thing that should be taken into account, some of the Monsters that attack don't recognize Frisk as human, also, a lot of them, namely most of the main characters, don't recognize Toriel as the former queen, nor does ANYONE other than the Monsters in New Home mention Asriel. It makes me wonder how many generations of Monsters have passed since Asriel and Chara died and Toriel ran away.

8:38 "Asgore declared war on humanity". Humanity declared war on the monsters Oh wait I just realized that in genocide you don't kill anyone on sight, you instead actively grind against them, so it's not self defense, it's a hunt

"Still perhaps we should look at as less why complete genocide is justified and instead more why killing every monster you come across is" The complete genocide that he isn't looking at is the Genocide run; the other part is the Neutral Run. He ADMITS that: A- He is justifying the NEUTRAL RUN. B-He is ignoring the GENOCIDE RUN. This video title, setup, and premise AREN'T EVEN WHAT THE VIDEO ACTUALLY IS.

Sans: *watches the king kill 6 humans* meh You: *kills a single froggit on accident in the start of the game cause you were scared* Sans: >:000000000

(A bit late to comment on this video I know, but I’m commenting anyways) - Going through the genocide run is not justifiable in any shape or form, Frisk is as self aware as the player is and that is immediately proven by some of the interactions you have when checking objects in specific areas and when Frisk moves on his own without you controlling him, when doing that, he essentially knows what his opponent’s next move is (and by doing that, it shows that you as Chara have the intent to kill without hesitation). - When you “aimlessly go around the room”, you’re objective by doing that is to literally find and encounter the monsters yourself and kill them, the monsters are trying to run away from you while you’re trying to hunt them down. - Even if you’re trying to prove that it’s justifiable to kill the monsters considering the fact that they attack you first, that wasn’t the case for some of the other innocent monsters you harm like Papyrus or Monster Kid, even with some of the other monsters like Froget that don’t even know what brought them in front of you (if you look at the text with Froget, it says something along the lines of “Froget doesn’t seem to know what brought them here” indicating that 1) you found him and now you are about to kill him 2) Froget accidentally went into an interaction with you and yet you decide to cause his demise). - It’s by the time that you’ve made it past Snowden and enter Waterfall when every monster starts running away from you. The smile that pops up when encountering a monster indicates that you wanted that encounter and you most probably was the one that started it due to how sadistic you are by that point and how terrified the monsters are from you. Undyne is only considered the “true heroin” once you try to murder an innocent child that didn’t even want to hurt you. By the point you’ve killed Undyne, every monster you counter is just trying to stop you from causing anymore harm to monster kind. - I’ve already mentioned that Frisk knows as much as the player does in my first paragraph, keeping that in mind would mean that Frisk is considered evil once you start a genocide run, since Frisk has gone through all the other alternatives and has practically studied every monster you encounter in the underground. Frisk is your desires to what you want to do and cause in Undertale, you quite literally make up Frisk, and what you want out of the genocide run is to discover the truth that you’ve never witnessed before and to see what happens when killing the monsters (which on its own is incredibly sadistic and psychopathic) which inevitably leads to summoning a demonic being (Chara) that was one of the biggest if not the biggest reason to why the underground has suffered so much, Chara leaves out clues telling you about her revival or at least telling you something bad would happen if you end up going through a genocide run throughout your encounters with certain objects and monsters. - You deciding to desperately fight monsters like Sans and Undyne is preposterous and outright dumb (that is if you attempt to consider genocide being justifiable), Undyne the undying is trying to desperately stop you from destroying her home, friends, and family while you keep flashing back from outside the spacetime continuum to deal more damage and to end up killing her. Once you’ve made it to the judgement hall and meet up with Sans, Sans makes it very obvious that there are better outcomes to this with you resetting and going on with the happy ending, but you still decide to fight and keep on trying to kill Sans even though all he wants is for you to go back in time and do the right thing for all monsters. By the point you make it to Asgore, you’re kicking a dead horse when trying to justify genocide because you can’t, it’s obvious why once you go through the route itself so I won’t bother explain myself.

This is the equivalent of someone shouting at you at a bar and you beating them to death. Also, you forgot about Monster Kid. There's no way that's self defense.

To be fair, everyone after Snowdin obviously knows you killed a majority of the monsters there since there was an evacuation, so the braver ones would most likely stay behind to try and kill you. There is also the possibility of previous humans killing a monster, making them feel uneasy around humans and therefore attacking you. I read everything I just like making counter-arguments.

“Yeah, sure! I’m just going to be nice to you and let you go when you are actively trying to kill me. Or on second thought, no I’m not!” The most relatable quote ever.

7:20 Mettaton NEO is nothing, but a complete joke. He has attacks that are unused, and dies in one hit.

The pacifist route is killing jerry (Chara: Did i do good?

I like how you completely ignore the fact that in the Genocide run, you actively search for monsters to kill. Y'now, the monsters who would've let you be.

You can also think about it another way All Neutral Runs: Monsters are trapped in the Underground forever and hate Humans even more (Frisk may have killed some Monsters + the Souls are gone + King Asgore is dead) All Pacifist Runs: Humans won't accept Monsters and another war starts Genocide Run: You're sparing the Monsters from a life of suffering by killing them Also, Monsters are a threat to Humanity, since it's confirmed that many Monsters want Humanity dead, and all it takes is 7 Human Souls to create a God capable of eradicating Humanity

While it might be justified to attack the random monsters actually killing them isn’t. This is because when monsters get on low HP you can spare them. if you have a choice between sparing a monster and killing it and choose to kill it then you’re acting unnecessarily violently

This sounds more like a au Than a genocide run from the pov of the human

actually when you encounter an enemy YOU get the first turn so YOU attack first and the monster attacks of self defence

To be honest, getting the genocide route means you actively went out of your way to kill every monster you found, even if they weren't attacking you. Though I see were you are getting at. Like you, I think if the human was just killing the monsters that came their way and attacked them, it would be justifiable. You are a lost child that stumbled into the underground and all of a sudden these monsters are attacking you. It's not as if you attacked first, why do they want to kill you so much? Most people's instincts are to defend themselves in that situation, it probably would have never crossed anyone's mind to try and spare them, much like when people do the neutral route on the first try. It's not fair to accuse them of being an evil murderer when the monsters were pretty much trying to kill you, a young child who had accidentally stumbled into the underground.

“THE MUFFET ATTACKS YOU UNPRVOKED!” HOW ACCURATE, CONSIDERING SHE THINKS YOU KILL SPIDERS FOR FUN! NOT TO MENTION THT IN THIS CASE, YOU COMMIT GENOCIDE FOR FUN!

on top of someone having already pointed out that this is more of a justification for the neutral run as for genocide you have to actively seek out monsters and kill every single one of them where most of them would have never attacked you normally. It also doesnt make sense why you would choose to kill the monster to defend yourself, as toriel has already given you a way of protecting yourself without having to kill a single soul, you can even defend yourself and fight back until you can spare them, but its never a neccesity to kill, so it doesnt seem very justifiable to choose murder over sparing for no good reason whatsoever

So, if you run into a bunch of cats and each of them bite you, do you proceed to kill every cat on earth?

Justifiable =/= the right thing to do. Also pointing out that you conveniently skipped Monster Kid, who you proactively attack by interrupting them mid-sentence. (And a detail that's easy to miss, but if I recall correctly one of the books in Snowdin's library states that a monster's attack is just how it communicates and expresses its emotions. They're proactively engaging with you...to communicate with you. They don't realize they're actually inflicting damage. The player, on the other hand.... One of the whole themes of the game is understanding not to judge others by appearances.)

Exept You Seem To Have Overlooked The Fact That One PAPYRUS WAS SPARING YOU In The Genocide Run And Two Before Undine's Battle YOU KILL AN INOCENT MONSTER Who I Might Add Was Helping You Through Waterfall There Isnt Really Justifacation For Killing Someone Who Was Trying To Be Friends Both Monster Kid And Papyrus

Ever notice how some characters are nicer to you when you kill everyone? EX. Flowey, Papyrus, Chara.