Why We Remember Bioshock's Fort Frolic 

RogueCrusader because now you are in control

And most interestingly Jack does what Sander wants. Excluding player from the equation, what do you think Jack could have done? Would he leave him after it all or kill him?

@@masterzoroark6664 I don't think jack would have killed him, since he wasn't a treat at the moment, even offered him a tonic, where other people tried to gut him, sander was one of the few (if a complete psychopath) allies jack has at the moment ...you know before he has a meltdown in his apartment because you decided to touch the damn piano when he told you to just watch.

It sometimes doesn’t appear when Atlas says Would you kindly and sometimes he does say it and it doesn’t appear it’s not consistent so I don’t think they intended it to be like that

Bubbles McCarthy it was definitely supposed to be like that, the guy who made this video doesn’t understand the true meaning of this level

Wasn't it called Irony?

I don't think it was like rain on your wedding day.

That remaster was like a free ride when I already paid (on pc anyway).

If you kill him in Fort Frolic, you'll be able to open the locked chest there. But later in the game you won't be able to get into his apartment. Just FYI.

John Thorgard how is that a spoiler?

Same, that part was new to me. I was 14 when I got the game and probably would have shit myself if I had found them.

I was around 14-15 when I get the game. Trust me those bastards are scary has hell. And I say ARE and not were Cuz every time I replay bioshock I save that gun upgrade as my last task to do in fort frolic so I can literally just run out of there as fast as I can. I'm 25 and still do that. I made a mistake of getting the gun upgrade relatively early my first time and goddam did I regret that.

Honestly, I knew those Plaster Splicers were gonna come at me during my first playthrough, however, I thought they only came at ya on Harder Difficulties. I had mines on Normal. I know I know, it's kinda noobish to put it on Normal. I realize now that they only attack you if you go to that PtTP Station at Sinclair Spirits.

Brian Colfxire holy shit... already 10 years. I'm getting old. I was 12 years old when I got it...

Derek65645 Normal difficulty is not "noobish". Normal is how most games are meant to be played, and honestly, play whatever suits you mate. Nobody became rich and famous by beating a game on the hardest difficulty.

Actually I though that it was arcadia forest, that game is full of levels with unic identity, unlike the others in that all levels seem the same.

This game overall is just so ridiciliuosly memorable due to the great world-building and immersiveness. The art style is so consistent across every level that you feel immersed

@@geckoo9190 I love that place too. Also I much prefer the Medical Pavilion for the sheer amount of Well made jump-scares

YES! i did the very same thing!

I was interrupted by a big daddy. good thing i had spec.ed wrench!

Yea I didn't feel like a butterfly, I felt like I had butter on my shoes though

I didn't even know you were supposed to dance...all I did was dodge and attack... wish I watched this video earlier.😑

Ok, Bon Clay.

I wrenched him. Nearly died.

your thinking was right though: put him out of his misery, the poor sap 😁

spinningninja2 never just do the missions, wonder through map there’s a lot of things that you’ll probably find interesting.

i was too fucking scared to wander around. i used to play them when i was a kid and was horrified at every turn.

spinningninja2 yea I'm bummed out about that too

You're lucky, then.

I missed them too. Guess I didn't notice the gun upgrade station.

It's been years since I played the game and I'll never forget that room where they just appear behind you.

There was a similar thing in Bioshock 2 that scared the hell out of me. I think that one involved a Gene Tonic that teleports around throughout the game, and when you finally catch up to it you turn around to see a group of Splicers staring at you.

Sort of like the weeping angels from doctor who. Maybe it's the idea of a statue chasing you trying to kill you.

Yea I never allowed them to get me, shoot first, see if they die, later.

Frostbite Gaming I didn't know there were plastic splicers in the game now I gotta replay bioshock to shocked once again.

A Man choses, A Slave Obeys -Andrew Ryan,1960 Rapture

The people who finished Bioshock were the ones Andrew Ryan technically did beat.... They were slaves to the game's objectives. Mind fuckery gold.

you're reaching

I'm reminded of a Rush song that itself was paraphrasing Ayn Rand that said "You can choose not to decide, but you still have made a choice".

I hate geese

Interesting thought

Jugal nice write up will keep this in mind

Never thought about this, but since the whole game was a theoratical comment on videogames itself (and so was Infinite), it seems kinda obvious.

***** I guess thats the "room of improvisation".

It's actually the whole point of the game I think. Like Andrew Ryan said at the end of the game: "would you kindly" were the magic words so that Jack (the player) would do anything he wants, like a puppet. The story of the game is kind of a metaphor of the relation of power the developpers have on the players, making them do willingly what they want, like puppets, as we, as players, interestingly fully accept it. Don't quote me on that, it's not my theory.

I literally looked up if you fight him because I didn’t want to waste all my ammo just before I fought Ryan

@@Th_Riddler_ And what a fight that was with Ryan, eh?

@@diamondheadify-v5i Hardest boss fight ever, how could the devs only arm you with a golf club that's just plain unfair

He straps a guy with explosives to a piano, made human statues out of a family, orders you to kill for his sexual necrophilic desires and take photos of it... it shows commmon sense of you to shoot first and ask questions later.

@@icecold1805 I hesitated but was ready to drop him if he tried to get froggy. I let him live. Not sure why. But Cohen was freaking insane.

I let Cohen live during my first playthrough. The way I saw it, I’ve gone through this whole game slaughtering countless people. Being given the choice to prevent one death, I decided to let him live. Besides, part of me did almost feel sorry for him. It almost seems like Cohen represents the corruption and evil of Rapture itself. He was just an artist who wanted to be loved. And I have a feeling that he only became psychotic after he came to Rapture, seeing the city as an opportunity. Later in the game, when you see the dancers, I always took that as a reward for the player, if they let Cohen live. So yeah, that’s what I did. But I can completely understand why people kill him upon site. He’s pure evil at this point.

@@ianbeach23 Or you can kill him in his apartments? I alwaya do that cause I'm like "bitch crazy asf better dead than alive here" ...... He's also sort of difficult to kill.... If you're playing Survivor Mode that is.

I actually didn’t know you could kill him, like I was like dafaq when he popped up behind me with his grand entrance, and I was waiting for him to attack me, but he didn’t so I didn’t bother to, that was my first play through and I’m about to start a new one this time killing him

That is just amazing XD I guess he didn't think to take a picture of the corpse or didn't think it was worth mentioning.

Also if you kill him in his apartment and return to Fort Frolic and then Photograph one of his protege's corpse he will send a congratulation message through the radio. Just to emphasize: *HE CONGRATULATES YOU AFTER HIS DEATH.*

@@istvankovacs4154 How can you return to Fort Frolic after visiting his apartment? Isn't the way back there should be cut-off by this moment?

Oh yeah i remember that lol the only thing i missed was the clay splicers

@@borob.5168 At any point in the game where you have access to a bathysphere, you can go back to previous levels, even as far back as "Welcome to Rapture".

HAHA that sounds hilarious, I wish I could see that

"YOU SICK FUCK" *boom*

I like to shoot the piano before he gets to say his last words

"Again, Fitzpatrick"

Odd 'n Strange Games same Lmao

dark, twisted humour

+

He was also lead writer and director on bioshock 2 and went on to make the magic circle. Talented man.

***** He also has a RU-vid D&D gameplay series called "Dice With Death RPG - D&D 5e with PERMADEATH". Jordan is the Dungeon Master. I haven't yet watched it apart from a quick look but the character permadeath with player being removed and replaced in the group is an interesting take.

FilmGamer play prey

Me too , i've never encountered them

Iirc it's in the basement of Fort Frolic

Yeah, I never found out about them on my first play through. I guess I thought the door to Sinclair’s was locked or something.

I never saw them either

It’s actually quite easy to miss. There’s a small switch you have to press in Sinclair Spirits (the place where “How much is that doggy in the window” is playing on the speakers) and it doesn’t really jump out at you.

He is easily my favorite antagonist, if not my favorite character overall.

I don't wanna force anyone!

no

Extra little tidbit about Sander Cohen; If you kill him and take a picture of his body, you get an achievement :D

Even better, the achievement is called "Irony."

LOOOL. FUCK I ONLY KILLED HIM XD

Robin Powell ITS MY FUCKING CURSE!

Honestly, that audio log made me really sympathize with Cohen, to me it read like a plead for relief from the insanity his splicing has caused him, he's no longer able to create genuine and beautiful art anymore (ala the little scene at the bathysphere Which I think is quite amazing despite its morbidity) only dark and honestly drab tributes to his lost passion.

You gotta activate a well-hidden Gun Upgrade kiosk.

Kytota If by "well-hidden," you mean, "easily findable," then yes, it's well-hidden.

The only way to activate them is if you go into Sinclair's liquor store which is in the very back of the map on either the first or second floor of Posiden Plaza and then open the trap door to upgrade your weapon.

Gotta explore harder, lol

I've played it about 20 times and see them every time

Same!

XD

Missed it too.. haha! :D

I missed it because I killed Sander Cohen. That was my only disappointment in killing that sadistic monster.

Please don't murder him with bees.

If you do decide to murder him with bees, please feel free to take a picture of his corpse to present to the world.

What happens if you kill him with bees in the game?

Thanks!

Mark Brown​ your welcome keep the content coming! 👍

agreed! One of my favourite channels at the moment! :)

I accidently "interrupted" the dancers' rhythm in Cohen's apartment because I wanted to play some nice notes on the piano for them, and then I had to fight him and actually was sorry for doing so :(

@@dgrunklesamiii4615 wow, Karma's a bitch.

me too. i just blatantly murdered him.

Sander Cohen is also prominent in Bioshock infinite, burial at sea. Out of all the twisted characters in the Bioshock series, he is one of my favorites

Thanks! Really pleased to hit that goal.

are you a codexer?

?

I'd like to do a Metroid-style Boss Keys in the future!

is that a good thing

Mark Brown I did say good work didn't I? lol ;) But seriously, you made a subscriber/patreon patron outta me.

:D Thank you!

Yeah, wait until you get to his apartment first.

Frik now I cant

I killed him on fort frolic then i saw him at his apartment wth

Better gameplay-wise, but not a better story. Infinite and Burial at Sea was a masterpiece

Never liked the original Bioshock. I found the gameplay boring and frustrating at times, and the story had this SpecOps thing where they want to make me feel bad for some things when they didn't give me a choice to avoid them. Bioshock 2 and Bioshock Infinite had more entertaining gameplay and actually made me care about the story. Specially Infinite managed to make me really care for what could happen to Elizabeth. All of this is my opinion, of course.

The Lizard Wizard We don't talk about Bioshock 2...

Evan we do now, specially since now we have a remaster of it So yeh....

I know it's popular to claim Infinite had better gameplay, but I fail to see how, and usually no one explains why they think that. Bullet spongy enemies that just run straight at you, a Halo-style gun system that is for some reason mixed with an upgrade path that feels counter to it, and redundant and infective plasmids(I mean vigors), player customization is heavily reduced, etc. I feel that BI actually has the worst combat (it felt like a slog to me, and I would frequently try to rush it get to something more interesting), and that B2's improvements give it the overall superior gunplay. That said, I never had a problem with the first game's systems, or the choice of gun vs plasmid-power. BI should have either removed the gun upgrades (easier to balance, easier to make sure the player doesn't end up with subpar weapons for some particular encounter where the ones upgrade nicely are not around), or should have allowed you to carry a lot of weapons as in the first one. Restricting to 2 guns works in Halo because the guns are always the same (one needler is the same as any other, for example), and so the choice is a strategic one of which two to carry from the ones currently provided (and enemies can be balanced around a set group of weapons). Eh, whatever - opinions and buttholes and all that.

spoil how?

There is a certain achievement called irony that you get by doing something that is completely unnecessary at the end of this level. The developers recognizing the players actions with that achievement is one of my best gaming memories. But Mark didn't even mention it in passing, I guess so he wouldn't spoil it.

oh i must have missed that in my playthrough o_O

Dash Jubei irony is an achievement you get if you take a picture of sander cohen after killing him

Wologan B. The level design , graphics and AI which I would say has even more depth than all the Bioshock games. Chaos Theory was ahead of its time in terms of AI as a stealth game and it has pretty great level design with lots of ways to manipulate AI and complete your objectives.

Same

Exactly my thoughts. He is good in concept but it felt like filler. Like an episode of a TV series that sits in between two major plot heavy stories that go together. For whatever reason everyone stops what they are doing to focus on villain of the week who is not mentioned going forward. In fact if you were to watch the two episodes it separates back-to-back you would miss nothing, it is as if the episode never existed. It only served to pad the length of the season. Sander Cohen is an interesting set piece, a cool level. But it feels like they didn't know where to put him so they just put him in a side-room to waste your time before you can progress to more important matters. There are instances where this is done to a positive effect, in that it doesn't feel like a waste of time at all. The Witcher 1 comes to mind and the events of Chapter IV. Right as things begin to come to a head it transports you away from the action and questions you were dying to ask are left unanswered. At first I felt put off but I knew if I pushed on I would find those answers. In this process I began to appreciate the deliberate pacing and tonal effect Chapter IV had on the game. There can be value and quality to an episode like this and there is, it just comes at a time where it feels as though you have been cheated out of your progress as this is just before you meet Andrew Ryan. This story was worth telling, the quality is evident as laid out here. But the relationship this story has with the player depends entirely on their disposition and their relationship with the game as a whole up to this point. You are either going with the flow and down for anything or are presented with a lengthy fetch quest that feels like a chore because of where it falls in the narrative structure. People play games for different reasons. If you are all about the gameplay then the action of Fort Frolic is a playground. If you are still a fan of the gameplay but you are conscious of pacing and the overarching story, this can be seen as a slog and merely a diversion which diminishes your enjoyment of the level. I feel like the placement of the level should have been earlier at a point where Atlas and Ryan were being overbearing and hostile. Pulling you towards objectives that might not have made sense for your character or you as the player. Then suddenly you are taken away from this tug of war and given a mission that creates introspection about your actions and allows for a reprieve from the role you have been forced into due to your reliance on others to survive. You are given a task but not one that is rooted in conspiracy and devious intent. As you begin to play you see this is nothing more than a game, a show you are taking part in. Your relationship with Cohen is what makes his tasks feel different, there is no threat of the world ending, no opposing forces enacting their will upon you. He isn't trying to shift the political status quo and he is given more character than someone like J.S. Steinman who is just an obstacle. This section is a story isolated from the rest of the game but ties into it thematically. It acts just like a filler episode, but when you choose to use this format you have to be conscious of its placement in the story.

Don't forget the part where Cohen first sends spider splicers after you and their A.I.'s pathfinding can result in one clipping through part of the ceiling, leaving it unkillable, thus preventing you from entering Fort Frolic. The only fix? Hope you have a save from before you went to Fort Frolic, as leaving and returning does nothing...and even if you have a save prior to your first trip to Fort Frolic, the bug can still occur, with no real rhyme or reason. This STILL exists in the Bioshock Collection, as well.

Sometimes, when shoveling thru RU-vid comments, the shovel says "clank!" and you instantly think "did I hit the treasure chest here?!". This time my friend I feel like I hit the chest alright. Thank you for a very inspiring analysis, especially on the matter of placement of story/gameplay beats in the whole concept. :)

I think the main problem, ignoring anything wrt to the content itself, is where it is placed in the game. The narrative is headed straight to finally getting to the big man himself, and then your pulled off track. I was fine with this as sometimes when I enjoy a game, I don't want it to end, so something delaying the conclusion that is in itself good makes me happy. However, I can see why many other players might not like having a pit stop shoved into the game right before Ryan. I feel the level should have come sooner in the game - perhaps more towards the middle or early-middle, so it could have felt better for more people to be doing something that seems secondary to the main plot.

I couldn't stand him. I always killed him then moment I got the chance. Slowly.

I remember Sander Cohen, and shooting/bashing his face in after he put me through the wringer, and had people killed for "art". I was annoyed that I missed the gun upgrade though, but didn't regret my earlier choice too much.

mechbgum You must get confused easily.

Exactly the same for me!

The Medical Pavilion, I felt, was FUCKING POWERFUL. Not only did it give you insight into the world of Rapture and how shallow and insane its people had become, not only did it give you worldbuilding on the many ways Adam was used, but it was a great way show how pressure, monotony, and unrealistic personal standards can destroy a person. I will remember that level till the day I die.