Will Robots Make Us Poor? Universal Basic Income And The Robot Tax [Automation, Pt. 3] | AJ+ Docs 

@@victorywarren5342 Yup, the planned DEPOPULATION is coming, within the next 6 years. 2025, I think the global population will have been culled by HALF.

Do you believe in free school? Then you are a socialist. I don't understand what you guys in the states know as socialism. It's so strange and yes our taxes play for a National Helth System. Still, don't understand how you guys don't have a simple system as that.

SDPRZ ether that or revolution and violence in the streets when people cannot feed their children

We already have socialism but only for the rich do you think that the mean spirited people in politics and power will have any mercy on the people that they will call useless eaters they will definitely cull the population they claim they are against abortion but have no problem killing children with drones in other countries not much of a leap to do it in the United States to the poor people who are considered useless eaters and a drain on the tax money they could be stealing for themselves

And are we still going to need all of the useless politicians that do nothing for us anyway??? Let’s get some robots to take the place of the jerks in Washington first thing and let the robots sort out our country because the politicians are so divided corrupt selfish greedy mean spirited jerks and we can definitely get by better without them so let the robots become politicians LoL

Yes, I wish it could happen faster, but it takes time for people to adjust to new concepts and social change

Lei P That's my point, and it's going to continue getting worst until we change the system we are in now.

You’re naïveté is BREATHTAKING .

that sounds great, but we are NOT heading in that direction sadly. But we should be.

WAKE UP people. There are people starving in Africa right now. Meanwhile, some people say that humans need to pull a load, that humans need responsibility. Modern Americans are focused on survival instead of thrival. Some, both American and European, resist robot UBI society and want to hold on to their jobs. But we NEED to help the starving people of the world. What better way for people to still have to work, while also having a robot UBI? Robots do most of the work of the first world, while all the humans that lost their jobs get new jobs in Africa. Its the ONLY rational thing that makes any sense. To delay the advancement of robots, is to prolong the suffering of humanity.

This is why we need Andrew Yang for President in 2020! He has solutions that will not slow progress but will help humanity transition to a future world.

Randy Hutchinson Not true at all.

Sylph Moon Its better then not doing shit about this economic technological transformation. At least someone’s got an idea. Better than watching the country going into poverty.

@@garyrodgers7883 Look, don't feed the Troll, or he won't get back under his bridge... I think OP put it quite well. You ever seen "The Expanse", by any chance? Where they went to Earth?

@@Alexander_Kale No, sorry. I've never heard of "The Expanse." You recommend it?

Exactly, we don't need 90% of the population to be innovators, infact I beleive UBI will be a catalyst for innovations as it will remove the road blocks for people who want to innovate,

"No one works under UBI" is a false statement. Politicians will still work, engineers who service robots still work, artists will still create art. And if no one would work there's would be no point of having money or prices. Most likely robots will abolish tiring, repetitive and not creative jobs which are not dream jobs anyway. Robotisation will reduce prices of basic commodities so everyone could work less and have more time for themselves. Nathan Patrick is right, though no one would force you to work with whip, but if your UBI will depend on politician decisions and politics decide not to give you UBI no more, you would either die from starvation or do whatever job to survive which sounds pretty much like slavery for me. Next time think more than one step ahead.

edmundas919 When it comes to humans as a group, there is no absolutes. So you're right, the word "nobody" cannot mean 100% zero people work. I used it as a metaphor in everyday language to mean many many people. I suspect there will always be work but it will no longer be based on the need to feed ourselves or provide for basic needs. The government does not have a choice but to provide UBI, which they take from robots to give to humans (therefore fair, not like welfare). No UBI will result in revolution and bloodshed no matter how powerful the government is. Look what happened to the Russian Czar, the Emperor of China, the King of France, etc. back in the day. Were they able to "enslave" their people for long? Also, today's technology allows people to switch to using crypto-currency for the few niceties that require human hands to produce, hence will cost. The government cannot control crypto-currency. Anything robots can produce will be (must be) free or death will result for those in charge. History has shown that to be true. Even slavery in America did not last forever, did it? YOU, my friend, need to think longer term than just a few years from now. I am talking 30, 40, 50 - 100 years from now.

edmundas919 Creative jobs are not dream jobs? Tell that to the musician, to the artist. Most "dream jobs" involve creativity.

nonreligionist You are right. When AI takes over most jobs, the only ones left would be creative jobs - jobs that cannot be done by AI (at least in the foreseeable future). That is actually wonderful because we are supposed to be civilized humans, not animals that must salvage for food every single day. Most people today have not realize that yet. They still think humans must labor for our existence like animals. Shameful!

Agreed! Let's fight for common ownership of the machines so we can build a world where everybody's lives are better!

The Rambler I'm glad that there are comments like yours. It gives me hope

but you need to think backwards and connect every possible sitatuation that has ever happen in human history that will fit the puzzle of the future, sure its easy to think ahead but what about all the wires that leave a messy trail that lead you there??

It is necessary to understand the problem. This new innovation is not just some funky clunky machine that just improves the work of a human , for example street cleaning car improved the capacity of cleaning workers which means same amount of workers are working but cleaning more surface area. When fully robotics comes ALL JOBS will be replaced which means all cleaning workers will be jobless. This will not happen just for the jobs like cleaning driving warehouse workers , low skill required jobs but will happen to ALL JOBS doctors engineers lawyers . It will pass the point of a person is just being unable to have skills for the job but there will be NO JOB. I am electrical engineer. I designed comissioned installed automation systems which improved efficiency of workers, same workers who was working for that job was just geting educated about the automation system and he starts to operate the automation system and his efficiency is improved and all facility produces more and becomes more echonomical and profitable. But the new industrial revolutions will totally replace the workers. That is the main problem.

That is a very good fact.

people will buy stuff with their robot tax funded UBI

to systematically transfer wealth to the elite. you have to keep spending (either via inflation or normal means) but have no income. 80 people now own 50% of the worlds assets, that wasn't true 100 years ago. Do the math.

Ubi duh. Everyone will earn 200k annually if everything is split equally. It won't even be taxed if robots run everything. That won't happen though because of the rich 1%

ahahah you don't understand, that' exactly the reason why they give you money, its not to live , but to make economy keep going.

Thats what UBI will be for

Andrew yang not going to do anything he just saying that for votes

@@dreamteam2320 Read Andrew Yang's book "The War on Normal People". He's believes UBI is necessary in moving our country forward and he is personally funding a $1000/m UBI for 3 families. This is not a lie, he puts his money where his mouth is.

What about Tridium controls in Hvac made simple

Yeah.. my wife said it cant happen, shes a bit older than me.. so I'm doing Research on Andrew Yang's claims.. hes Legit.

wow three families, Yep that ought to cover it.

Schools are more outdated and broken.

Shit always breaks. Im guaranteed a job. Call me Master Tech of all trades.

Ashish It’s not the guns in America we should be worried about, it’s the humans operating those guns

its better that people has the guns instead of having guns in hands of few. If i was in america i would start stockpiling rpg-6 by masses :D Old tech that would destroy any shıt hightech bot with old style aiming.

With Feminism they destroyed the family, if they take away men's ability to live and work and don't replace it with anything, for sure there will be a civil war unlike the world has ever seen.

Guns won't be enough if the drones are used. They won't even need solders to kill people anymore. It will be a hell of a fight though.

Ashish bullets costs money.

yes UBI should be enough to take a new course, learn, or work on a new project or a service, it is more like govt is investing in you

actually theres already been social experimentation with this UBI style system. And it's largely failed....as it will in the future heres one story of it failing to produce results in Finland www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-43866700

But what happens when there are no more jobs at all if AI replaces them all?

unless UBI covers normal way of living i'd say societal collapse and all out chaos all around the world.

It’ll have to gradually be more. The goal shouldn’t be to sustain work, at least not traditional forms of work. People should be freed up to do what they want.

Eventually, starving people will revolt, and most likely, win.

@@TheLambdaTeam 10,000 starving people vs automated machine guns, I'll let you be the judge as to who wins.

@@nathanoconnor421 We're talking 'bout millionz of starving people. And sooner or later, automated machinegunz will run out of ammo.

@@TheLambdaTeam not if you have automational reloadeders

@@ypsawbones3646 Sure, and automational bulletmanufacturers too?

Sanders also likes UBI

cog in a wheel

Correct, here is the end game: Once (practically) unlimited production is achieved, mass de-population will be enacted by the elites against the 'useless eaters' so as to conserve the resources and ecology of the planet for the genetically enhanced super-rich to enjoy. 99%+ of humanity will be done away with.

@@lastsonofkrypton3918 Fingers crossed

@@lastsonofkrypton3918 That's why they're rolling out 5G without testing it for health effects first. Because 5G and I.O.T. (Internet of Things) will be used as a WEAPON. Many scientists, physicists, weapons experts, and such like (tens of thousands of them) are warning about the biological health effects of millimeter wave frequencies on the non-ionizing spectrum. They will not only be used to track, monitor and even reprimand you remotely, but the closely connected antennae and towers next to homes along with small chips on every device or even piece of clothing, will emit too much for our bodies to handle, especially children and babies. A weapons expert from the UK named Mark Steele has already won a court case in Gateshead, U.K. stating that 5G is a weapon and will not only kill us humans, but will kill all biological life, such as birds, pollinators, animals, trees, etc.. We all thought the Terminator Sky-Net would come equipped with anthropomorphic steel skeleton robots with glowing red eyes, when it was really just these cell towers with LED streetlights, which would soft kill us within the next decade, due to cancers from the frequencies. The 1G through 4G of telecommunications and WiFi were just the frog boiling us slowly in the pot, until they whipped out 5G which is the true NEW WORLD ORDER and will wipe out 95% of a humanity anywhere that it's allowed to be rolled out. It officially rolls out in most places, especially in China and America, next year in 2020. So we don't have much time left!

We NEED to start helping Africa more. Some people believe that humans need to pull a load, that humans need responsibility in their lives and to work. What better way than to send people to work in Africa while the robots do most of the domestic jobs?

Yes. That's about how long he'll last.

Andrew yang not going to do anything he just saying that for votes

What's necessary is online accelerated, self-motivating education. Staring partly at secondary school with practise in companies. Which would drastically reduce cost, man hours put in teaching people as well as time spent learning. So it would be totally possible to drastically cut expenses for education and finally stop supporting that money printing school system... We could make those people pay for it, cause it would be far cheaper and equally available to poor Bangladeshian and middle class kid from USA

Hear, hear!

If you can choose to opt out, it's not socialism, but libertarianism.

LIFE DOES NOT COMPUTE HUMANS MUST BE TERMINATED CRUSH KILL DESTROY What a wonderful future awaits us...!

How is that a solution.....just reducing work time? How do you make up for the lost income?

It may work

And we won’t be able to pay bills, its always the people with no jobs that say that shit all the time.

Who controls the time we work anyway? Why don’t business let us go home after 4 hours a work a weak for the same amount of money

If they can save 10% by replacing you, they will replace you and save 10%. After all, if they could buy fuel for 10% less, wouldn't they? Ah, but here's something: right now, they can't replace you with an AI at any price. The tech just isn't there yet. And when it first becomes available, it'll probably only save them 10% or even only 5%, even with no "robot tax" at all. Add the tax and it probably isn't worth it to replace you with the first AI which, technologically, can. Taxing robot labor will make automation more expensive, which means you're still getting replaced, but it'll take longer, which means you might hit retirement first, or at the worst you have a little more time to retrain. And, since it takes longer, the tech will be better when it finally does happen and, if it's driving great big trucks all over the road, then I want it to be *very* good first.

In a place as vast and unforgiving as Australia, said automation would have to literally be a humanoid robot behind the wheel. Why? Because in places such as northern Australia, mechanical assistance could literally be hundreds of miles away. It could take hours, sometimes even a day to get help. Something as simple as a blown tyre or an oil leak suddenly becomes a big issue This is also a reason why electric trucks in their current form won't work here either. The range is way to short to make it. That fancy Tesla truck doesn't have enough armour up front to keep kangaroos, cattle, camels, wedge tailed eagles and other animals out of the grille

Again: Even if you have to have a human being on board, because Australia big, you only need ONE whereas now you have TWO. You wouldn't need to have two humans taking turns, just one human hanging around for those few times that he's needed. And how often does that happen? Sending a mechanic a thousand Km every dozen or so trips might be cheaper than having a human being on *every* trip. And again, even if you must have Mr. Human on every truck every time (probably not), you only need *one* aboard each truck, not *two.*

Lots of people work after they are retired. Lots of people have high end jobs but are still lazy.

Absolutely. If only the people in noticed things like the fact we're suffering from Nietsche's Death of God problem and so on. I really relate to what Socrates/Plato said: "Until philosophers are kings, or the kings and princes of this world have the spirit and power of philosophy, and political greatness and wisdom meet in one, and those commoner natures who pursue either to the exclusion of the other are compelled to stand aside, cities will never have rest from their evils - no, nor the human race, as I believe - and then only will this our State have a possibility of life and behold the light of day."

sounds great...however its just not going to work like that. they're going to kill our jobs. then were going to kill each other; as they watch from their computers. hell even music and video games will be automated in the future do your research pal...we're all becoming obsolete farm/manufacturing equipment. And just like the lions of south africa we'll be left to feed off of eachother. i mean look robots are already doing lots of art, music and entertainment; they're even taking sex worker jobs already?! wake up folks! 2030'S shit will get real and 60% or more of existing jobs will be gone on a planet with 9.5 billion people!!! the only thing you'll see making a come back is cannibalism and genocide.

Nathan Patrick Not having to work to be able to access goods and services is ''the worst possible outcome for humanity''?? lol Your fear is extraordinary. Productivity is a good thing. Sharing that excess productivity in a way that people no longer have to suffer and live in fear is a better definition of wealth than whatever greed-filled world you're defending. With the freedom a UBI brings, free education, internet, 3D printer access, etc, we will all be empowered to be creators and producers from home or wherever we want to be, and yes, we should all grow a lot of our own food too including in our schools.

Under "free education" and "free healthcare", how do doctors and nurses live, since nobody pays them? How are hospitals built? Oh, I know. Because it's actually not "free". It's built by the money that is forcefully taken from the people by the government.

@@utku8233 You have a problem with the roads the government builds for you ? Or the fundamental research the government pays for ? Those are the same kind of 'free'. Lots of countries have been doing that for decades for healthcare and education and it works just fine. But let's be very clear: computing, automation and machine learning and robotics will take away a whole slew of tasks doctors and nurses do today. So it's possible we'll have less of them in the future as well.

sorry pal even free education and health care wont save us from this automated future. the internet is already making universities and colleges obsolete

Communism, capitalism, socialism, etc will become outdated concepts of no worth. UBI is the lie we are being fed to keep us complacent. End game: Once (practically) unlimited production is achieved, mass de-population will be enacted by the elites against the 'useless eaters' so as to conserve the resources and ecology of the planet for the genetically enhanced super-rich to enjoy. 99%+ of humanity will be done away with.

But why should those companies make huge profits? Their wealth is built on the work of all of us, whether its those of us that work for them, cook for them, pick their foods, harvest their resources, manufacture their goods...This world is so interdependent. No one deserves to be making so much while so many still have so little.

libcom.org/library/the-conquest-of-bread-peter-kropotkin

I agree with you, but I don't think we'll be able to get there without some intermediary steps. A change like that would be hard for a lot of people to handle.

Osiris Malkovich so if someone basically "fined" you for coming up with a new idea, how encouraged would you feel to continue to brainstorm?

The Rambler Taxes aren't fines, "basically" or otherwise. If you don't want to contribute to your society, you're free to leave.

Jorge Nino end is near, future is the present

Socialism doesn't work

"When freeing people from mindless/repetitive jobs that turn them into zombies of depression is a bad thing, lol."

Solidarity

true enough.

No, we still need money. How else are we going to buy that fancy watch? Or food. We just go into a store and take it? And what happens if someone gets the bright idea to just take everything for himself, or for his group? This is why we need a UBI, so everyone gets a basic level even share of the goods produced.

You’re so naive it is jaw dropping . You have no sense of history or of human nature . You people live in bubbles. 🤦‍♂️

@@ethangray8527 with a fiat currency?

capitalism is what drives productivity increase

I don't think there's anything to worry about, population wise.. The planet could easily sustain twice the population we currently have, if we did things right.. Tho thankfully some data seems to suggest the birth rates are already starting to level off on their own, and won't get much above 10bil simply due to human nature.

This planet can feed over 34 Trillion (yes, with a "T") people if we start farming vertically in 10+ story buildings.

Their is a long history showing 4 distinct stages populations go through. Pre industrialized economies generally have high rates of birth and high rates of death. Industrializing economies maintain their high birthrates but have lower rates of death, this is commonly what stokes the flames of fear. As the economy becomes mature industrialized the birth rates decrease as the demands of women reduce child rearing and the cost of children increases. Finally countries become post industrialized in which the birth rates go down to the point in which the population stabilizes. This process took over 150 years for Great Britain and the US but it happened in 50 years for China. The birth rate is no longer accelerating and we will continue to see birth rates grow slower until the global population stabilizes over the next century

You also need to buy the robots and maintenance for them.

What makes you think that other countries won't have UBI?

Follow the rich white man. That's never gone wrong...

all hail Musk right? but i will still take the UBI money it can't hurt .

I'm a MUSKeteer. 😳

Even if he is right with UBI and other ideas do yourself and whatever republic you are a citizen of a favor, don't get into personality cultism we have enough of that already.

No, no we shouldn't.

That's because there's no need to talk to a Socialist to solve these problems. A robot tax is very similar to owning shares in companies using robots. In a way it would be like part nationalisation or even direct ownership of some "automation share" or something like that. In a way it is like owning part of the means of production. You can see from this video that the tech giants themselves are bringing this up as a problem that will have to be addressed with UBI. They aren't fools, they know if they don't do anything about this problem there would be social upheaval and they would be primary targets.

Marx thought that innovation in his time would lead to no one needing to work. Clearly 100 years later, he was wrong. 100 years from now it will still be wrong. People have been fearing technology forever, all it does is raise the standards of living for everyone, not just a few. Pretty sure AJ+ did a video on this a year ago and now they have this completely contradictory series to promote socialism is kinda funny.

Exactly. And so then it would make sense that they're going to propose ideas that will mitigate the problem while forcing them to make the least of a sacrifice: a UBI. A robot tax is far from owning shares because the money would go to the government, not the people, and we'd still have no control over what happens with the technology. The same for shares in a company. The goal should be for technology to be the property of no one and every one. Just like Jonas Salk gave the polio vaccine to humanity, so should automation. Then we can finally live in a world in which no one is restricted from having the basics of survival and everyone can have a decent quality of life.

Except this video didn't promote socialism at all. In fact, it did exactly the opposite. That's why all the people they interviewed were capitalists. Marx did not think technology would leave to the end of work in his lifetime, he didn't even live until the 20th century. What he was right about was that we are now able to produce more than enough that the people world needs to survive, yet there are still so many that are hungry and suffering. The problem has never been about whether or not humanity can create enough for everyone, the problem has always been who owns that production and who gets to benefit from its creation. That will be the central problem of automation. All these discussions about government taxes or social welfare are just window dressing.

Karsten Syversen I'm totally confused. Hmm, if I automate a robot for my factory I should give the ownership to the people? Whatever happened to free markets? I'm not going to invest and build automated robots just to give it away.

Cucho Ushi ayyyyyyyyyy

Cucho Ushi seizing those means amirite?

Do you realize how hard it would be to just "drop" an entire social economical system, especially one that affects the very large majority of all humans on Earth?

Zach Crawford I do realize that, and I do realize that it becomes harder by the day. So now 2 questions for you: 1. Do you realize that the way capitalism affects all humanity (not just a majority) is through monetary coercion? 2. Do you realize how worse it will be too wait for capitalism eventual collapse?

A1) I does not affect all humans there are uncontacted tribes that have not interacted with the rest of humanity since they split off in the stone age. But for the majority of humans, yes I am aware of how it affects them. I am also aware of how it much production it has generated, (almost anyone can acquire a computer that fits in there pocket than is millions of times more powerful than what all of NASA had access to when it landed people on the moon and the majority of can access a knowledge base that is millions of time larger than any physical library). I am aware of the mass panic, anger and civil unrest there would be if you just one day told everyone that their money is worthless (it's happened several times). The fact is we don't even know what to replace capitalism with yet. UBI at least gives us some breathing room to find and try out a few new systems until we can find some that seem to work well and gives us time to transition into these new systems.

Then what the hell do you suggest? You can’t just put these things down without a better solution.

Money is not the primary driver of humanity. People want to do well for several reasons, whether it's to learn how things work, to impress the masses or experts with their excellence, to be the best, to actually help people, or even to just have a fun and engaging activity. There's plenty of incentive within our nature to work outside of obligation and there's also research indicating that being forced to do things can actually decrease our motivation.

"They want us all to be equal ie equally poor." - its more scary to see capitalist apologists still spewing this old horseshit

so automating everyones job is a good thing???

When automation takes job to that large extent UBI will save economy not hurt it. In the end till ASI takes over democratization of means of production is only way to keep masses free from tyranny of few.

2007 was 11 years ago