I wasn't sold that Martin really had to give up on this machine, but seeing how much work had to go into it just to play the original song definitely puts everything in perspective.
@@Steiger08 Yeah the timing is pretty bad in this example. Not sure if it's dependent on the operator, but this absolutely isn't ready for play on a stage. Only for recording, where you have a chance to quantize a bit after the fact.
I think Martin made a mistake not showing the machine how it actually is. In all of his videos it looked like it was working well and nearly ready to go with just some minor kinks. This video really shows how far away it was from actually going on tour.
It’s a precision machine that was disassembled, traveled, reassembled and now is being carted around everywhere to different environments then designed in; played by a different musician (now staff). It’s a beautiful exhibit by the museum but different sound completely.
Yes, and a long time ago, while still trying to justify the needs for yet another Marble Machine, he mentioned that was the case, explained it, said he realized it was a mistake that he regretted and pointed to it as being one of the main reasons there was a considerable backlash for his decision to abandon the MMX.
In all his videos? You mean for the last month or something? It was constantly failing somewhere. It would work briefly well enough, then something would fail.
I disagree - when I read a book with it's story telling, that is exactly what I was looking for - if it's a good book of course. I don't care about the years it may have lay around in the authors home or head half finished, with parts that didn't work out, with the failures that were in there, before someone redacted it. Martin made the impossible marble machines, that are impossible to play - for normal people. He made them shine in the format, they got famos in the first place: on youtube video, himself playing it, squeezing every possible quality out of it in the process. Martin made even lessons on mechanical tryal and error fun, story like, and filled with great music. If you just show how the step plates looked after the recording, it would be boring at best, a bit messy, unfinished. For me the marble machine of winergatan is not only a music project. It's a dream, brought to us by video, manifesting in the art form that only Martin can achieve exactly like that in style.
in the kindest possible way, the way the MMX struggles so much to play a simple song puts EVERYTHING into perspective. I was one of the many people who were heartbroken to see the project abandoned, because what we got to hear in progress videos were only small snippets of things that worked well, edited and enhanced. It made it seem like, of course the whole machine works perfectly! but wow. The amount of work it took to get it just to this state makes it all make sense. It was too much for one person to do, and I'm glad you guys are all working together on it now, with fresh perspectives.
Yes, Martin didn't show the real challenges of the machine very well. I think part of that is due to his desire to create good videos but seeing it raw and unedited here really shows the issues at hand.
It's pretty impressive when you consider he didn't do any 'engineering' when building that thing, like all the gears are sized based on like his intuition. Martin is just now learning basic highschool physics, lol.
Also shows how brilliant Martin is as an engineer of all of the MM series. The first machine plays, but if you watch some of the behind the scenes videos he tells of how unstable the machine is. Knowing the MMX was to take things farther and the lengths Martin, alone through a large chunk of it, went through to get the MMX to a point where others could continue is outstanding within itself.
Watching the song finally play was both cathartic, and painful. Big props to the team for getting it to this point, and for providing the context as to how and why we arrived here.
I love how many people were quick to judge Martin for abandoning this machine, then after an entire team had to work together to get it functional enough to play something, it becomes immediately apparent why Martin didn’t pursue with this design.
Yeah, the big issue was that Martin never actually showed the state of the machine. All the videos were about how well it's going and that only a few little tweeks were necessary. All music he played on the MMX sounded good, probably due to editing. So when he stopped the MMX it just looked like he was throwing away a perfectly working concept. If he showed the actual state of the machine, I'm pretty sure most people would have agreed with the decision to discontinue the work on it.
That is great, I can see you are still using the angle grinder, paying tribute to the legacy! It took one Swedish dreamer to start this project, but some proper German engineering to finish it!
To be fair, it's international engineering by this point. The volunteer team has people from Germany, France, Switzerland, the USA, the Netherlands, Spain, Belgium, the UK, and I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting several more.
Yes! I was gonna comment on how very well edited this was. Only - very minor - thing is that it's somewhat creepy when the speaker is not facing the camera in use. (-=
Watching all the work being done by Martin, and then even more work being done by this crew really shows how huge of an undertaking this machine was/is, but hearing it play a live song without any editing really solidified that point. Wow. I got a huge feeling of intimidation just thinking what it will take and the amount of tiny tweaks needed to go from a semi functional current state to something that could be heard as a live instrument playing Martin’s ever chased “right music”. Great work, it’s a pleasure to see.
This just shows the engineering prowess of the designers of the workable and usable machines of the past in the two museums. Those old machines still sound great today. Martin should spend a couple days visiting the Music Cabinet and shoot video and resurrect the Music Machine Monday series for your display. A "season 2" so to speak.
@@billkeithchannelAnd how the machine is analog in its function. The only electronics to the machine are for drive of the motor and amplification to the sound, there isn't anything else electronic driving the marbles or the works. That's an achievement within itslef.
Even with all the highly appreciated work put into this, I can't help but find that the machine still sounds so "sad", whereby we can clearly hear why this design was still not ready to tour. It is still wonderful that this iteration had graced this planet.
I find it very interesting that at the time he made this machine, he was thinking on taking it on tour with him. CRAZY to think that, it wasn't so long ago, but long enough to know that this engineering accomplishment can be put to rest, complete with people who want to show passion for music and engineering. Thank you to all who've made this possible!
The first house you build / renovate by yourself is for your enemy, the second one for your friend, and only the third one for your own family - At least that's how we say it in our country.
Hearing the MMX play the original song made me so happy! I've been following Martin on his journey for years, and it felt like the true end of a chapter. Looking forward to the MM3!!!
There's definitely the idea to get a few more songs recorded, but it's not set in stone yet and it is unlikely that they will be written by Martin or Wintergatan. Stay tuned!
ya. i remember martin talking about how much "editing" he did to make the machine sound great, so hearing it unfiltered like this gave a really good perspective into how different the reality is. a crazy feat to get it working, but brings even more clarity as to why martin decided to start working on one that is actually reliable (and tight)
And the fact that even to play this on it takes 3-4 people constantly fiddling with the machine to stop it from breaking... I was following the MMX videos for a few months before the cancellation, and I had no idea it was in that bad of shape...
@@Muddytony20 The marble swoosh with its amazing over-rotation does not help as it can trap marbles, and the silicone tubing in the divide-by-four does the same. It really needs somebody to stand guard up on top of both sides of the machine to clear any blockages before marbles drop down.
Absolutely. So much wonder, joy, and inspiration has come from this project. It's a brilliant example of the age-old journey vs. destination question. Even though it's disappointing and painful to discover that you've been traveling towards like Mordor when you thought you were heading to Rivendell (and it's OK to mourn that), it doesn't take away from all the wonderful experiences along the way. Now you have that much more wisdom for your next adventure.
Seems like a foundational issue (almost literally) is the frame isnt beefy enough to hold the machine without shaking a lot while being hand cranked. Fixing that issue would require a total rebuild... A band aid solution could be to run it off the electric motor, but that defeats the hand powered nature of the MMX
Martin seems to have failed right at the inception: the machine was always too compact and built without shock absorption or self leveling in the frame, and with no counterbalance for the rotating assemblies.
@@Musikkabinett Good to know, and something Martin needs to consider. Probably most stages aren't the most solid of platforms, so the variable quality of stages needs to be considered... Especially considering how heavy the new MM looks like it will end up being.
@@FamilyHomeTheater definitely going to be hefty, but the load is more spread out over a larger area. The MMX puts a ton of weight on just 4 tiny pressure points. But it will still need to be an important consideration for the stages where the MM3 will be presented
This is so dang amazing! Thank you all for undertaking this, and of course, thank you to Martin for creating the machine and the dream in the first place, and allowing you guys pick up where he left off!
This just shows the engineering prowess of the designers of the workable and usable machines of the past in the two museums. Those old machines still sound great today. Martin should spend a couple days visiting the Music Cabinet and shoot video and resurrect the Music Machine Monday series for your display. A "season 2" so to speak.
Somehow this makes me think of the Voyager spacecrafts. Technology a bit outdated, performance a bit wishywashy, but the granddaddy (or -mummy) of a lineage of machines that would never have been if not for them. Source of inspiration to many, pushing boundaries of what is possible, daring to imagine. Really wholesome and emotional to come full circle, even if the destination isn't fully reached yet and the desired final perfection may forever be unachievable.
First a praise comment to the people that had to reassemble the MMX from pieces. You people having never seen the fully assembled MMX, in person before. You managed to put the mechanical puzzle back to gather, fix/improve many issues discovered and have it play a song! That's huge! I bet it was fun. I'm not going to read all 303 comments. What I have read said little about all the work and energy these devoted fans put into making MMX play a song in front of an audience. I salute them. Performance points about the played song. I really don't hear the timing errors. I did hear the change in tempo and marbles striking the floor. I did notice it took two people to power it. Lastly. I could hear a marble bounce off the drum heads through the acoustic mics but no synth drum sounds played. Was the bass guitar even programed to play? It was all xylophone. Lastly. In the video someone made a comment about how much MMX shakes. I'm not surprised. The first day I saw that frame with the programing wheel mounted. I thought to myself. That's not sturdy. Say we turn that frame into a table. You have to stand on it for some task. Would you feel safe with secure footing? That's why marbles landed on the floor. It shakes.
After years of analysis I am ready to conclude that dropping marbles onto a surface and hoping they bounce predictably back into a mechanical system is a terrible idea! Thank you for attending this lecture.
Well, it took only 60 days of filming plus 60 days of post production to get that video done…. So, „complete“ is also a big stretch for the first machine.
I didn't really get why Martin gave up on it at first. It sounded great in his videos. But now that I can hear it live without any post-processing, I can see why he's starting over. It's still a beautiful machine, and I'm glad its being shown off for what it is.
I saw some mechanical machines in Taiwan / Tainan / Chimei Museum, 100 years ago they used "weights" to charge the rotating handle. Before playing someone had to spool up a rope with weights and push play. This ensured that the speed was probably right all the time.
It probably needs a lot more fine tuning taking several days everytime it is moved or the song is switched... But it surpassed expectations in one aspect above all 100% no doubt: Looking cool. Belongs in a museum, definitely.
Thank you so much for all the work you put in so this machine could play! I really want to go to the 2024 meetup although I am in the USA, but I'll see if I can make it
Just to save you a trip: please be aware that the museum has its winter pause right now, and the machine will only be on display later in the year. If you don't go to Frankfurt often you could try to reach out to the museum, just know that showing up there unannounced won't work.
if Martin didn't have this grand idea of a world tour on his agenda and making the machine look as good as it plays, it would've been completed by now, and a third iteration of this machine wouldn't be kicked around like it currently is. having something that just works and works well with minimal maintenance is ideal, but not what he wants. sacrificing that simplistic and effective design for something that looks better instead, and that will need a lot of time to implement and won't be as reliable. this is where it all came undone, in here you can see how badly some of it unravelled.
13:50 mmhmmmm, not sure what I saw and heared 🤔 If this is unfiltered and unedited how the MMX was then I can understand why Martin gave up. I always had the impression it was near to perfect working but not like this 🥺
Ball bearings have oil on them from manufacturing process. They are tons of funto play with the sound they make when banged togetherbetter than glass marbles.
Leute, ihr seid so großartig❤ vor einem halben Jahr stand ich in Rüdesheim andächtig vor zwei Ruinen... ihr habt Wunder vollbracht😂🎉 Und wie ihr sicher wißt, hat Martin für einige Probleme (4xDivider!!!) inzwischen eine Lösung!
I am soooo sad that it will be in August again... I wanted to come last year, but as an Ausbilder, I can not take time off work in August because that's when my new apprentices arrive. So I had hoped it would be in July this year, but again, no luck for me 😢 Still, I hope it will be an awesome event for everyone visiting as well as for those organizing it!
I have allot of love for the MMX. No its not perfect, and you know what, it doesn't have to be. i don't care how many marbles hit the floor... or how much it vibrates or how loud its moving parts are, It was a labor of love and a critical step for Martin. I don't fault Martin at all for realizing it was too much and abandoning it, clearly it had a plethora of problems and yeah it took a whole team just to be able to play one song. But just to hear it play that one song in the end.. i wont lie i shed a tear :D it may not be the perfect playable instrument... but its definitely a masterpiece of artistry and engineering. Worthy of a museum.
Dragon Skin (available from Smooth-On & Amazon) silicon would be a far more durable material than latex for the vibraphone pads. Good to see the Marble Machine X community coming together to make this performance a reality, well done and thank you to the entire team.
We have a computer history museum here in Silicon Valley (California, USA), and I think these marble machines could have a very good place near Charles Babbage computing machine. Seattle also has a music history museum, that might be even better place.
I’m not saying it would be any different, but this feels like a problem of engineering approach. It’s like building spiral staircase but with only designing the next step. Each new step compounds any issue and then you spend a lot of time on that step trying to fix issues introduced by previous steps. Instead designing it all up front might be better. MMX was designed based on the original design, which also didn’t work live. I’m not engineer but I think about the fly wheel and how much rotational energy is there. It’s on the side of the machine, which I think would mean it will always be off balance and wanting to torque the machine. A center flywheel might be better. Etc etc. it’s an amazing machine and work of art but I think it struggled since it was designed linearly vs holistically. Idk I’m a marble machine believer and hope one day to see a production version play live.
@@Musikkabinett Here is a song suggestion: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-rn-nM4CxXkQ.html It is a song called _Music Box_ and it was written by Stewart Copeland of Police fame for an 80's American television show "The Equalizer". A simplified version on the MMX would sound great.
Try giving it more legs/a wider base to help reduce crank shaking. Another dumb way to reduce shaking would be to crank it with not as much force. I can only guess that the crank needs a fair bit of strength to turn, but putting too much strength into it will easily cause shakes
Demonstrates how well edited the video of the first Marble Machine was, and neither that or the MMX was anywhere near going on any tour. The aestetics of the machine is great and it was no doubt a great and fun project for Martin, but it is so clear why he had to abandon this version and focus on something more reliable. I see he went to the polar opposite in the start of his new project, making it reliable tech before aestetics, but has eventually found back that the machine needs some aestetics too. The videos of Martin making the MMX was entertaining because of this focus on also making it look cool, but alas it became too cool without actually working well. Let's hope he finds a good compromise, and no doubt that he can spice his videos with great music which the first videos were so full of and make us "believe". :)
