As a signalman who currently operates a manual box (and was once capable of playing the first movement of Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata!) I found that most poignant. The rage at the destruction of those times continues. Thanks for uploading!
I trainspotted from 1979 to 1986 from Chelmsford, Essex. I travelled to London quite a bit to the mainline terminus's and further afield, but never saw a British Rail class 76 'in the flesh' so to speak. They always gave me a chill as they look gaunt and functional and design-wise not one bit pleasant to look at. I would like to have seen one or two running. Luckily there were the class 73's in Kent and class 81's, 82's, 83's, 85's, 86's and 87's to see in London so I got to see some electric traction. I even got to see a class 84 in the early 1980's before the class disappeared completely. They all had character, I think, unlike most of the functional, logo-splattered motive power we see today. Thank you for a great video that brings home the impermanency of everything, including one's childhood memoires.
Great video Ralph. When I was a driver at Workington one of our conductors was from Hadfield and spent many years as a guard at Guide Bridge. Working what he called the bo-bo's. He would recognise all that. I only saw the 76's once, on a trip to Manchester I had a trip to Godley.
such great post ww2 infrastructure all gone by 1981.Nothing wrong with the system even 1500DC is good. France runs trains on 1500 DC at 200kph . The vest thing they can think of for the Woodhead tun el is power lines. meanwhile the UK is clogged by cars and trucks.
It seems like we spent most of the second half of the 20th century destroying as much of our Victorian heritage and legacy as we could lay our hands on. While other countries post WW2 rebuilt their cities 'as was', and then got busy electrifying all their main lines, here in the UK we spent the 1950's and 60's demolishing Victorian buildings for the hell of it; while clinging onto steam for far too long. Other European countries always saw their railways as being a vital asset and important to their economies. We saw the railways post WW2 as being old fashioned and moribund. It's why there was a concerted effort to starve the railways here of money, run them right down, and then get rid of a third of them. Thus cutting off those in rural communities who lost their station (and rail line). Many didn't have cars, but that wasn't something that concerned successive post war governments.
@@robtyman4281 Your correct, and I love steam but the fact is Britain wanted to lead the world in steam whenxthe Americans had moved on, the Europeans had moved on. I think had Gresley not of died and the railways were not nationalised he would have electrified the ECML in the 50s. The French use 1500 DC all over the place and they manage 200kph on them by loco hauled trains. In the UK with 25kv they still only do 125 and the class 91s that are 225kph locos still only do 200. Still better than where I live now in Australia, we should buy the rocket to speed things up. The only time I saw the Woodhead route was 1970 at Ringing, only saw the EMUs
Except the equipment in this line was life expired and needed to be replaced and with the recession of the early 1980s in full swing, there was no need for this line.
@@neiloflongbeck5705 on that basis much of the rural roads of Britain should never be resealed or just torn up as they become expired and left unsealed as it’s not really economic to keep many of them permanently sealed with the cost of fixing them.
@@andyrob3259 except that the traffic levels on most rural routes are fairly consistent over the year. Many of the most slightly used rural single track roads in the area I live in have a strip of grass separating the strips of potholed tarmac the vehicles run on. This shows that the local authority responsible for maintenance is spending the money on the more important routes, a bit like what BR, the Big 4 and their predecessors did. The Woodhead route used non-standard equipment that was life expired in a period when traffic levels were falling and the other routes from Sheffield to Manchester had enough capacity to take all the traffic. In the 1930s the LNER removed the life expired electrification equipment from the freight only Shildon to Erimus Yard line, the first major mainline with overhead electrification at 1500V DC in the UK and replaced the electric locomotives with steam locomotives because coal was cheap and electricity was expensive AND more importantly the traffic levels were such to justify the retention of this line.
I was at school in Penistone and can still remember the route in the war years and just before. My first recollection of travelling on the line would be about 1939. from Penistone to Manchester. I remember it well because I had just learned to read, but couldn't understand the name on the engine - "Purdon Viccars". My father didn't understand it either! Closing the line was a stupid mistake. It was built to continental standards and could easily have connected the North with the Channel Tunnel. Just imagine a train from Manchester to Berlin or Rome. The mind boggles. Most of the track bed is still intact, though most of it as footpath.
Yeh I can remember the old Reddish sub shed which was back in 1958 known as 9h, we used to see quite a few of the old 26000 and 27000 class, I think one of the locos from memory was numbered 26000 and named Tommy, it's truly sad that this direct line to Sheffield was dismantled.
@UCrbrkgUqeWVJYBaOhXSVbTQ they weren't the ones that operated the signals there were a few that weren't connected to anything.You needed to be built like a tank to pull the proper ones.
Seems like such a waste to electrify the whole route in 1954 when the section beyond Hadfield was cut in 1981. They clearly (just as in the Beeching era) didn't realise that cutting a route was a simplistic way of doing economics, above all, it restricts the ability of the future to take traffic away from roads...
With life expired non-standard electrification equipment along with falling freight traffic volumes and no through passenger services this line had little chance of being saved. If freight volumes had been better then the line might have been saved like the first electrified freight mainline from Shildon to Erimus Yard, which lost its electric trains in the mid-1930s when the LNER reintroduced steam trains instead of replacing the life expired electrification equipment. The big 4 and BR cut around 5,000 miles from the network by either removing the passenger service of all services. Beeching just increased the speed of these cuts.
The whole point was to put traffic on the roads. The corrupt Transport Minister Ernest Marples had a vested interest in building motorways and made a lot of money doing so. He fled to Monaco when the going got tough and never came back. Beeching was just a bloke brought in to do a job, a professional manager from ICI who knew nothing about the industry he was managing. Soon after _The Reshaping of Britain's Railways_ was published a General Election was called and the Tories were ousted but Wilson's Transport Minister, Tom Fraser did nothing to reverse the cuts. After a year in the job, Fraser was succeeded by Barbara Castle who also did very little to change the situation and actually sanctioned the majority of the closures. Towards the end of the decade Castle admitted that the closures had done little to improve BR's finances.
@@johnm2012 that was certainly the case in the 1960's, but they clearly hadn't learned anything from that time 2 decades later, when they were running lines into the ground to exaggerate the case for closing routes down. Both decades had one thing in common, they were employing overly simplistic economics to close them down, rather than look at measures to make money from the traffic using them
@@SiVlog1989 It's easy to make a line appear uneconomic with statistics. You only need to look how other trans-Pennine routes that were considered basket cases, have prospered with investment. The Woodhead would be a vital part of the network if it had survived.
Remember since Marples got involved the whole idea was to poison the well and drive passengers and goods off the railways. Add the fact the line doesn't go to London and it would impoverish the regions it was easy for them to doom to closure
For a short while I was a secondman at Guide Bridge worked to Rotherwood via Woodhead tunnel many times one of the senior drivers (Ernie Batt) now sadly probably rip used to insist I swept the cab clean before the journey I willingly obeyed it was a privilege to travel with him
Brilliant upload,and yet so sad.Spent many happy hours on Sheffield Victoria ( We would travel up from Alfreton ) just to see the EM1 Bo-Bo's.They were always one of my favourite loco's,such a basic shape but yet with a timeless understated beauty and the sound was unique.Such a shame to see them being scrapped but thanks for some great pictures.
Very good comment Tim Powell. The sheer variety around in those days was outstanding. I grew up in the midlands so lots of classes of loco on all manner of trains. I am a train driver now, working for DRS in Carlisle, so have had a go, and still do, on some heritage classes. I'm happy to have driven a pair of 20's to Crewe before they all but vanished to the south. My big mistake was that I should have started at BR after school in 1977. Good video too !!
You are right David and I envy your job, it must have its moments of fun and you are in a nice part of the country. I still love railways and their huge potential but nothing can beat the BR blue days and the sheer variety of motive power we had back then.
i will be like that when the 59's go from the stone in somerset, i live right nxt to the quarry line at great elm and thats all i have ever known. great vid by the way, absoulutely awesome
Fantastic video buddy. I had the good fortune to live in Manchester at the time the passenger trains still ran. Then many years watching the freight trains roll by 👍🏻
Excellent video. Ironic, really, given the state and congestion of the roads today - an electrified inter city route closed. What price a northern power house?
A non-standard electrified route that was in need of new electrification equipment during a recession? The equipment was life expired. Traffic levels were falling across the entire rail network, and the other routes could handle the volumes.
The first train set I ever had I went out and bought a Class EM2 from Hornby. This came as a kit and it gave me many years of great pleasure. Sadly that was the nearest I ever got to the real thing.
The bad old days. BR justified closure on the basis that the power supply to the 1500V was life expired. The insulation on the feeder cables that ran along the lineside was a tar like substance and gravity meant that it ran downhill and the feeder cable at the higher points suffered numerous insulation failures. One major justification for the closure of the line rather than the conversion to 25kv ( I still have a copy of the internal report) was that it would not be possible to convert the line to 25kv. Imagine our surprise when a couple of years later that's exactly what they did with the Hadfield and Glossop lines.
Even if the whole route had been converted and kept, what was it going to do? The passenger trains were all gone. The coal trains were on their way out and they were the last reason for the line's existence. Keeping it around to carry a handful of general freight runs each week which could easily go via other routes would make little economic sense. It does seem though that if sentimentality funded railways, the Woodhead route would have been kept open forever. Sad though it was, I think BR made the right call. I could be wrong, and a new, profitable use for the line could have been found, but I don't really see what that would have been. I used to live in those parts, and the hills up above Glossopdale are as empty of people and industry now as they were then. The post-industrial decline of the region has only grown worse since the 80s. Maybe had successive governments given a crap, things could have been different.
@@CountScarlioni Yeees but. Ever since then the Hope valley has been a bottleneck with fast passenger, stoppers and freight all seeing growth and competing for scarce capacity, and the the Woodhead also catered for the larger size containers, Hope valley does not and with Northern Powerhouse requiring extra trans-Pennine capability it probably was short-sighted to close Woodhead......but it's done now and the equally short-sighted decision to reroute the power cable through the new tunnel makes reinstatement more difficult.
@@johnthomas5966 That I do agree with you on. It should have been mothballed not ripped up and sold off. Same dumb mistake they were making in the 60s.
Very good and sad at the same time. Was hoping to see some of the Worsborough/Wath branch on it. Was the emu cab that of M59404M? thanks for putting this on. Incidentally for those of you who haven't seen it there's a rather good BBC programme on YT -"Engines Must Not Enter The Potato Siding" (from 1969?) which compares the the Woodhead route and the Birmingham-Sheffield Midland route and their contrasting fortunes, there's even a bit showing the Dive-under at the southern end of Sheffield Midland.
The Class EM1 locomotives had trials in Essex at the time the Woodhead line wasn't ready to receive electric traction. Once the Woodhead DC overhead wire electrification scheme was completed were the EM1 Bo Bo locos allowed to go north. Passenger trains ceased to use the Woodhead line regularly in January 1970. The EM2 Co Co locos were sold to The Netherlands where they ran for a further seventeen years.
Something too often missed: The line stayed open 10 years after passenger services stopped. It carried freight for this time before the demand for that also dropped right off. I have driven on the Woodhead pass with my friend trying to spot remnants of the route wherever possible. It is mile upon mile of relatively hostile landscape with towns & villages pretty well spread out. Although I find it a bit odd that a route with OLE was closed, the line duplicated that of the Hope Valley so outlived its usefulness.
Because this line connected to Manchester, I say they re-open this line for HS2 and re-build Sheffield Victoria station to make it an international terminal for Eurostar services. There are rumours that this could happen, but it's not officially confirmed yet.
Some good shots there. I remember the 76 bodies at Reddish with most of them ply lined out to stop the souvenir hunters helping themselves. All sorts of reasons on here about the line closing but as a country, historically, it’s what we do here, we innovate and waste lots of money smashing it all up then realise it was a stupid thing to do.
With the cancellation of HS2 to Sheffield and Leeds, the Woodhead line should be reopened between the ECML (at Doncaster) the MML (at Sheffield) the WCML (at Manchester) and the Liverpool City Region. National Grid have stated that trains can still use the 1953 tunnel. However, if not then the 400kV cables should be moved to a smaller dedicated cable tunnel, to match the London area.
I remember being at Crewe works around 1964 the locos were being serviced, painted, new numbers applied and less than 15 years later the whole line was being scrapped and the locos sold off WHY?
Watching this I’m left thinking: what sort of fk in country spends millions on modernising and electrifying a major route than closing it down. A nation that once led the world and now can’t do anything.
I imagine if lots of big heritage societies got together they could reopen parts of the route as a heritage railway? There are quite a few preserved woodhead locos luckily
The passenger service closed for various reasons, not least the lack of integration between Sheffield Victoria and the rest of the railway once the rest of the GCR closed. Getting from Sheffield Victoria to Sheffield Midland requires a reversal. The line as a whole closed because the electrification was non-standard (only 1500V DC heavy rail installation in the UK) and life-expired. The Woodhead 3 tunnel (the new tunnel) now has power cables running through it, so it cannot be used for a railway. There is nothing left to reopen as a heritage railway, really. The 1500V DC electrification has gone, as has all the infrastructure on the closed section between Deepcar and Hadfield. The only viable tunnel at Woodhead for railway use is unavailable because it was used for power cables. Hadfield to Manchester has been converted to 25kV AC electrification. The most that seems possible now is restoring passenger service between Sheffield and Deepcar/Stocksbridge - though with a new terminus that integrates with the Sheffield Supertram or even using the line for Supertram. However, with the recent suspension (and perhaps permanent ending) of the freight traffic on this part of the line, that might soon be more difficult.
Enjoyed the video and the music. Woodhead had a character all of its own and I doubt we'll see the like again. Also noted the inclusion of my own photo of Class 76 locomotives 76033 and 76031 at Woodhead on 24th March 1981 with an Eastbound freight. It's a photo I placed in Wikimedia Commons for all to enjoy (Kevin Cooke) and I'm glad it is proving useful. I loved the trains and wish I could go out and photograph them again now with a digital camera!
Now just a pipe dream rest in peace woodhead railway I hope we hear the ghost sounds of the famous woodhead railway as I said rest in peace woodhead railway amen
Believe it or not it's now 40 years since Woodhead closed. And now the power grid cables have been moved into the later tunnel so there's no chance it will reopen. And there used to be a station cat at Dinting. And the old sidings there have gone now too.
I needed to know why they don’t dig a tunnel and do an extension for the main line Train so that they can extend the unused abandoned underground train stations. Why couldn’t they use the part D78 Stock train doors on the sides and also restructure the front face of the A60 and A62 stock that includes the class 313, class 314 and class 315 remix and make them all together and also redesign them an overhead line and also make them into Five cars per units and also having three Disabled Toilets on those Five cars per units A60 and A62 stock trains and also convert the A60 and A62 stock trains into a Scania N112, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXB, Gardner 6LXC and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Engines and also put the Loud 7-Speed Voith Gearboxes even Loud 8-Speed Leyland Hydra cyclic Gearboxes in the A60 and A62 stock, class 313, class 314, and class 315 and also modernise the A60 and A62 stock and make it into an 11 car per unit so it could have fewer doors, more tables, computers and mobile phone chargers. A Stock Train and 8 Disabled Toilets on those A stock trains. why couldn’t we refurbish and modernise the Waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel and make it larger and extend it to the bank station, making it into a Triple-Track Railway Line so those Five countries such as Australia, Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden to convert the waterloo and city line Triple-Track Railway tunnel into a High-Speed Railway lines? The Third Euro tunnel Triple-Track Railway line to make it 11 times better for passengers so they could go from A to B. Then put the modernised 11 car per unit A Stock and put them on a bigger modernised Waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel so it could go to bank station to those Five countries such as Australia, Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. The modernised refurbished 11 cars per unit A stock could be a High Speed The Third Triple-Track Euro Tunnel Train So it is promising and 47 times a lot more possible to do this kind of project if that will be OK for London Australia, Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. oh by the way, could they also tunnel the Triple-Track Railway Line so it will stop from Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex so that the Passengers will go to Australia, Germany, Italy, Poland and Sweden and also extend the Triple-Track Railway Line from the Bank to Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex Stations so that more people from there could go to Australia, Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden more Easily. Why couldn't they extend the Piccadilly Line and also build brand-new underground train stations so it could go even further right up to Clapton, Wood Street can they also make another brand new underground train station in Chingford and could they extend the Piccadilly Line and the DLR right up to Chingford? All of the classes 150, 155, 154, 117, 114, 105, and 106, will be replaced by all of the Scania N112, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXB, Gardner 6LXC and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Five carriages three disabled toilets are air conditioning trains including Highams Park for extended roots which is the Piccadilly line and the DLR trains. Could you also convert all of the 1973 stock trains into an air-conditioned maximum speed 78 km/hours (48 MPH) re-refurbished and make it into a 8 cars per unit if that will be alright, and also extend all of the Piccadilly train stations to make more space for all of the extended 8 car per unit 1973 stock air condition trains and can you also build another Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive Companies and can they order Every 67 Octagon and Every 37 Hexagon shape LNER diagram unique small no.13 and unique small no.11 Boilers from those Countries such as Greece, Italy, Poland, and Sweden, can they make Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive speeds by up to 147MPH so you can try and test it on the Original Mainline so it will be much more safer for the Passengers to enjoy the 147MPH speed Limit only for HS2 and Channel Tunnel mainline services, if they needed 16 Carriages Per units, can they use those class 55’s, class 44’s, class 40’s and class 43HST Diesel Locomotive’s right at the Back of those 18 Carriages Per Units so they can take over at the Back to let those Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s have a rest for those interesting Journeys Please!!!!!!, oh can you make all of those Coal Boxes’s 18 Tonnes for all of those 147MPH Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s so the Companies will Understand us PASSENGER’S!! so please make sure that the Builders can do as they are told!!!!! And Please do something about these very very important Professional ideas Please? Prime Minister of England, Prime Minister of Australia, Prime Minister of Sweden, Prime Minister of Germany, Prime Minister of Italy, Prime Minister of Poland and that Includes the Mayor of London.
Back in the pre war days of private rail the big four companies didn’t run at massive profit and needed government hand outs.Public transport is a national amenity not a business.
I see we have lost so much. Not just the railway but I noticed the Austin Metro at Torside which should have been the symbol of a manufacturing revival in the UK. We need to take our country back. This does not just mean a manufacturing comeback but mass ownership of land. Georgia did this after the fall of the Soviet Empire.
Nice video. Had to comment on about the line closure. Why did it close when it was already electrified & had modern signalling ? Seems a bit short sighted to me.
It had been electrified with a non standard 1.5 kv ac system which meant it was incompatible with other electric locomotives. While the trains where still in good shape when withdrawn, they were slow by standards due to being 30 years old. They decided it would be cheaper to close it than electrify it to the standard 25kv ac
lovely photos, nice video but could someone please tell me roughly, where this is in the UK? I am from South Wales, not familiar with this line, gorgeous though it is.
I went to Openshaw Tech in the 60's which was by Ashbury Station. All we could see of those locomotives was the top thirds because the line was on an embankment and behind a wall. Couldn't see the numbers!
This is just one example of what short sighted politicians can achieve. This route would have been as valuable as gold for future transport planning. The well chosen music on this video is just perfect.
Robin Moss Right, yet wrong. Dr Beeching did not murder the railways, that was Ernest Marples and the rest of the road, oil & car lobby. However, we pay more tax subsidy today, in real terms, for the railways than ever before. Further, why is it you take this attitude that tax funding the railways is somehow bad, that we must avoid it? We do the same for the roads. It is nonsense to argue the railways do not make a profit. We all profit from them, whether we ride on passenger trains or not, the nation relies upon them. This is the same for the roads. And yet, every government, since the Second World War at least, maintains the doctrine that the railways are not profitable, though does not do such for the roads...
...we could start with bringing the Woodhead line back, then there's the Great Central Railway in its entirety, ditto the 'Borders' line, the 'Cuckoo' line, the Liverpool Overhead Railway.....oh, there's so many...too many to name here.......all such losses - all unique in their own way. Tragic really.
This route was not closed by Beeching. It's demise was later than that purportedly due to the cost of modernising the worn out infrastructure and that money would be better invested in the alternative routes.
A628 Woodhead Pass is a crappy and congested road. Being in the middle of a national park there's no chance of it ever being upgraded. If only there was a railway line available as viable alternative....🙄
Could the Woodhead be opened with new tunnels ? I am thinking, I see queues of lorries at Mottram Moor heading over Woodhead. Can't a road rail service be operated, where lorries can go onto low loader freight wagons and taken over the Pennines into Yorkshire, with a lorry/container terminal (truck stop) at both ends (M60/M67) and M1 interchange, much like the channel tunnel freight/lorry operation, also cars. An all-weather alternative to the Woodhead as it is and the M62 which is frequently closed in winter due to snow, ice, high winds, especially around Rishworth Moor (J19). Would this be practical to relieve road traffic ?
What they could have done is that or have the Dutch and French engineers actually export their 1.5kv Substation technology to Woodhead line. Later on invite DTG for Train Sim World to develop woodhead line
With the railways on the up it`s about time the line was put back................. with the political will................ it can and will be done .................. just a matter of time.
Such a waste.. I hope one day someone can re-open this line or even just part of it would help relieve road congestion and improve connectivity in the North.
Yeah, they were brought down to form the newly converted AC services on the surviving commuter line to Glossop and Hadfield. We used to call them the jaffa cakes. I remember them being as clapped out as the trains they were replacing!
Short sightedness on a grand scale.. Too late now, but it such a shame it couldn't have been mothballed and protected for possible future use.. Cost too much to maintain even then I suppose...
Sad, the Woodhead fire finished it off I believe...I traveled across it on a railtour, class 40 I recall in 79? I swear some of the signal boxes appeared gas lit, maybe I got that wrong. Being from London, it was another world, disappearing fast!
Is it true that the Woodhead line was the highest 'mainline' in the UK? ....seems like it would be handy to still have now. Oh well........foresight has never been one of our greater strengths.
As much as it's sad to see and I'm all for rail over road any day but people never mention that the route was in decline it was loosing money and it made sense to close it. You can't expect a business to keep something maintained that isn't making money. And for the record Beeching didn't close woodhead it was never on his list.
Beeching wouldn't have touched it as it was still a bankable asset at the time. Besides, the bits of the route that did make money stayed in operation of course. A good job too for someone like me who grew up in Glossop! But yes I agree, the Woodhead line was a fast route to Sheffield that passengers didn't really need. Even now the demand for travel between Manchester and Sheffield is a tiny fraction of that for Pennine crossing routes like Manchester-Leeds. Even the coal industry is gone and were Woodhead still open it'd be a be a lightly used freight route, much like the surviving stub at the Deepcar end. It was sad that it closed and it was an interesting route, but economically it made sense to close it.
beeching never closed anything. he had no power. he made a report. when complete labour were in power and they closed all the lines and then gave beeching an award
Worked with a guy years ago who was a signalman at Woodhead. Always referred to the 76s as Bo Bos . Should have never closed this line. Would have been part of the new Northern Powerhouse politicians talk about these days. Total waste.
Yes and all the money is now spent in London. Northern Powerhouse!!! Junk Speak!!! Fast Intercity, Manchester Sheffield??????????????????????? PLONKERS!
