Yamaha FZ-07 / MT-07 Fatal Flaw and How To Fix It 

Fantastic and thank you for the leap of faith. I appreciate your sharing the results to inspire others to make the changes needed!!!

You could grind off the peg feelers fold them up with your calves and you could put you feet flat.

@@highlanderfreelancer4553 Could But You Feet is my A-1 clown phrase of the week.

@@gregp103 it was a typical put not but whoops

@@highlanderfreelancer4553 Typical Put Not But Whoops is my A-2. your* feet. Try another edit.

Dave: ....also, for the time being I'd add a few extra bounces on the rebound.

And a thicker drink

lmao

Random dude: my girlfriend left me, broke the tv, and took the dog. Dave: unbind the rear shock and you won't be riding a pogostick.

@Dar u mean the guy that looked like lorenzo?

@Dar sorry i have replied to the wrong person.haha

He said OK to everything haha

💀

Lol. He definitely seemed uninterested and zoning out.

and informative.

ShakespearesBruv same here bro I own Ducati lol

I had to make a comment to get him off of 666 though, lol.

@@billyballbell which town is that?

Like all you yanks .... loads of information that’s not needed you Americans are all about racing in a straight line !!!!! I watch how you lot go round a track and it’s funny , you Americans are slow !! What I will say is it’s good to see girls on the track ! No one in England uses a tape measure What a jobs worth!! Different ppl ride differently she seemed happy the way the bike was ! I ride a 03 Cbr600rr and I love it Some one comment here ! Come Europe I’ll meet u bet you go home faster,....£400 a day on the track with a new bike , r6 ,gsxr zx6 that is 400£ on the track 115£ a day with a bike , This man is full of bolloxed

careful what you wish for!

She may not know anything about suspension, she might be a nuclear engineer...........

He's not cutting the fork... There's an internal spacer above the spring ;-)

krazed0451 Issajoke

@@marcd7332 Repeating the video verbatim is a joke? Weird.

@@krazed0451 dude you are such a dumbstruck, ya cut the fork. Jeez

@@tonydiridoni1732 Ok, cut your forks all you like! ;-)

Thanks for sharing your experience and POV. I concur, some information on the very basics really helps.

She was cute though.maybe it felt like it moved around to much at the back so she stiffened it up a bit

There is nothing wrong in experimentation, most of the people never do any adjustments.

True, i lowered my handlebars just to look cooler, and it's actually detrimental by making my ride less comfortable..

@@chrisredfield3240 it's the preload that moves "weight" of the bike forward. Stock it's at 3rd notch. I moved mine to 6 so it became alot more planted in the corners. And still pop some wheelies.

He does sound like a douche and is pretty condescending when he speaks about certain things, for instance @5:08 (everybody throws those away), the majority of people don't throw them away, he makes it sound like just have to open your house door in the morning and find unused brand new springs laying around. I would be interested to hear what the Engineers at Yamaha think of this suspension criticism when you call it a " Catastrophically Bad Problem". A Catastrophically Bad Problem would not remain unsolved on one of the most popular naked bike in the World (and I don't even own one).

Thanks for sharing you results from the changes made so others can benefit from your experience! Enjoy the better handling you now have but remember that when the pogo starts again, the oil needs to be replaced.

@@catalystreactionsbwI need to make the same changes to my front forks. I already ran 15wt fork oil. But I weigh over 140 so I’ll cut the spacer 10 mm but then since I’m cutting that spacer about how much less fork oil to I use than oem specs? Do I use 10mm less of fork oil as well? Or still the same amount?

@@Lopez23300 I would suggest at your weight you use 3765cc/ml

@@catalystreactionsbw if I use my motion pro fork level measuring tool to the 162 mm after cutting the spacers down 10mm is that going to be too much oil? Or does that depend on the fork travel and etc? And then should I raise the forks in the triple clamps 8 mm?

@@Lopez23300 Oil level assists with bottoming out. as an air spring effect - compressing air slows down the compression stroke. It is easy to add oil so start low.

Exactly why don't motorcycle dealers do this when they sell the bike? What exactly do they do for their 30%?

@@truantray They want it to break. Just like how car dealership want parts on the car to break to make money.

@Bob Sacamano "Don't do any modifications to your bike unless you can be certain it is appropriate for your riding conditions" tell that to Yamaha, who decided zero rear sag and a near solid front end was a good idea on a bike ridden by predominantly beginners. Or do you think having suspension that is not compliant at all and wants to bounce around enough to throw you from the bike is better for the road? He's not giving the girl in a shop carpark a track recommendation, he's giving her a better baseline that can be fine tuned for whatever work she wants to do after the fact.

Bob Sacamano That's blx. Sag setups are a no brainier for any bike track or road. How many bikes had no static sag. Do you have that on your road or track bike ?

@@DenvarShay I am willing to wager that zero sag is blown out of proportion. If this was absolutely true, you will see a lot of deaths and a massive class action lawsuit. This is only one man's opinion.

Chameleon wrap bought for $20 on amazon. Wrapping a bike is pretty easy

@@cindyorellana6025 Send link, please and thank you. ;)

@@cindyorellana6025 Can i get a link please

@@nomanhaider2742 www.amazon.co.uk/Protection-Chameleon-Metallic-Vehicle-Changing/dp/B07QMD27XJ

@@keremcolakoglu1 Thanks, Kerem. Piss off, Cindy.

Loved the shade!

Only took $20 from amazon. Bought the wrap and used a blow dryer.

@@cindyorellana6025 Is that your bike? So how does it feel now?

Dzimka Bujiashvili The girl looks better. The FZ....its ok

@@andrewford80 less bouncy hahahahaha

Why?

i know some of those people

Maybe he doesn't have a pipe cutter

Thanks for adding some information. Would you be kind enough to share with everyone what the static sag in in the 2018 and newer models? Is it over 25mm? Thanks for helping all MT07 owners with those year models.

@@catalystreactionsbw i worked only on the rear shock modifing the preload, for my 83kg, on the 4° notch (if i remember correctly) and the value of the rider sag is exactly 30 mm. The static sag is only 13 mm on that notch. For the fork the static sag is 24mm and the rider sag is 37mm, with stock springs (and oil). I measured the value of the static sag with the bike on a stand.

Thanks for taking the time to get that done and share how much better the bike handles now! I appreciate you paying it forward by posting.

Does it reduce bikes ability to powerwheelie? Is it noticeably less wobbly in corners? Thanx

@@TheBalija1 Power wheelie is throttle control so no it does not. Less wobbly in the corners? 100% yes.

@@catalystreactionsbw But power weheelies on this bike are possible mainly because of bikes geometry rather than it's power. There are bikes with more kW and Nm but they cannot wheelie as good as mt07 does. So I will ask more precisely will lowering front decrease bikes power wheeling ability. Thanx

Did you cut the spacers in both forks or just one?

All the way.

🤣 same here... facepalm moment for Dave 🤭

Basic stuff most mx racers know but road riders dont. Great video.

How much oil do the front suspension rods carry when changing the oil seal on Yamaha MT 07 2015?

Yes, you forgot to rise the height of the fork about 10mm ;)

@@davidfpv4969 eight mm.

@@datpat2475 415 cc.

Is that a British accent

They did the same thing with the MT-09. Boggles my mind how fucking stupid it is that Yamaha lets their bikes out of the factory like that. Whoever is in charge of suspension tuning down there should not be getting paid.

M. B. The thing is the suspension experts only work on the supersports, and they don't really give these any focus. They ain't even cartridge dampers

@@ruikazane5123 you dont need to be an expert to have appropriate spring rates, damper rates and sag rates on cheap suspension for no extra production expense.

M. B. But manufacturers just don't. AND it is a mystery why they do that.

@@ruikazane5123 it sure is. They design these incredible engines and chassis' but then they fuck up something so simple seemingly on purpose

This should be standard knowledge for bike enthusiasts

Perhaps Yamaha should employ him.!

Well I’m cutting mine this weekend

Same task with fork oil viscosity, fork geometry change and at some point a rear shock change.

Get a z900

@@RidingNomad get a turbo busa

@@RidingNomad Does it not suffer any of these suspension designs?

@@catalystreactionsbw I just finish what u said even cut the spacer at 10mm with 20w going to test it tomorrow morning wish me luck 🤞🤞🤞

Congrats - will be back in Cobb next week for a couple of days. If you are over 200lbs, 20w and 400cc. No on spacer trim due to your weight and yes to geometry change.

@CatalystReactionSBW thank you! I will stop next time I see your van around! I set psi to 29f / 30r for now.

Thanks for watching!

I appreciate you learning form the work we do. Thanks!

Martin Leon no you didn’t

@@guywelch656 its a common complaint so its likely he knew

BIg G he did - litterally everyone knows it’s the bikes biggest problem.

@@guywelch656 mt07 suspension is infamous. I'm sure a lot of people knew.

You can't teach an old dog new tricks

Teej 🤣🤣😅

Well, both bikes are older versions, and so are correctly called ‘FZ’.

AT2 Productions its not about old version or new .. they always been called the MT in the rest of the world but here in the us they always call them the FZ .. and most of them still do now . Even it official as the MT bike

Wawan Blondy Where was the video filmed? The US. Where are the majority of viewers for this channel? The US. What is the official model designation for the 689cc variant produced prior to 2018 for the North American market (not just the US)? FZ. Quit your bitching about a person in the video using the correct name of the bike for the market it was delivered to and being ridden in. Names change often enough, or do you also complain about the change during the life of the Ducati Monster? They were originally designated as the M600, M750, and M900. But then in the early 2000’s the “M” was dropped and they became officially the “Monster (insert number here)”. And yet there are still issues and discrepancies between the sources motor vehicle registries use for the product line. Some have my 2005 Monster 620 Dark listed with a model number of M600 while the others have it correctly listed as Monster 620D. So do you have a legit problem, or are you merely whinging to whinge?

Thanks for sharing what your learned so far! I will normally go in 3mm increments so once the fork oil and spacer are done start at 4, 8,12 and see what you prefer then.

Yeh, never good when your suspension goes cock-stiff...

So, use 20w to the same volume as stock and hacksaw the spacer down 10mm BUT clean up the cut end prior to install. Do you have a machine shop that can use the lathe o hacksaw to cut the spacer for you?

Canadians and brits do this all the time.

@@truantray So do Americans. It's not like we don't work on our Japanese bikes! Cheers, cousin from across the pond. I'm dreaming of the day I can afford to get over there and attend the IOMTT!! P[>

It's very simple, 20 weight oil is thinner than 30 weight oil you get the picture the millimeters don't have anything to do with the oil per say as to what he's doing to the front by cutting cutting off what he was talking about

Metric is for authoritarians.

The modification we are suggesting is $30, some time and getting a preload spacer trimmed. For those that cannot swap bikes out due to financial constraints and love their MT07 and want to keep it, this an excellent upgrade.

@@catalystreactionsbw Okay so i may have gotten ahead of myself. I'm not saying your fix is exspenisve but: 1) its not a "Fatal" flaw, just plush for everyone. Fatal makes it sound like you can die. 05 GSXR 1000 Frame recall 2)As your beloved viewers get better, your fix has no adjustabilty. They are faced with the decision of investing, you touch on that here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-3qA3Ja7yxcQ.html . But with used 2000's sport bikes fairly cheap a 2008 gsxr 600 will be a better investment because you will eventually out grow the fz-07. Depending on what you want to get out of your track experience of course. Didn't mean to sound like a __________.

@@eatbreatherace5918 Agreed - the next step up is a pricey one comparatively if they want to step up. If not, R6 fornt end and shock make for a better handling MT07. Thanks again for your contributions!

Dave Williams, editor, replying here. The guy in this video, at 5:15 came close. You'll see he hits 2 bumps as he enters the corner and this causes the front to fold. The bars suddenly turn to the right and then he crashes. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

how many did he strip and round in this video? What is your count?

Hi John. Fantastic work and congrats on the end result. A tip of the hat to you sir! I too am excited to see what you find in regards to ride quality. Make sure you test geometry as that is a big part of the end result. Start with stock and lower by 4mm, then lower another 4mm. Don't forget the cable tie on the right fork tube.......

How did it turn out?

To date, the flaw is the same through to the 2020 model, having worked with riders. A simple easy and cheap fix for any owner. In answer to your question, one definition of fatal is "leading to failure". Read the comments and see how many riders have had rebound failures creating handling issues and accelerated tire wear. .

@@catalystreactionsbw What about after your mod and 20000 klms with no maintenance , Fatal for the next or existing owner , Fatal geometry !

Dave Williams, editor, replying here. The guy in this video, at 5:15 came close. You'll see he hits 2 bumps as he enters the corner and this causes the front to fold. The bars suddenly turn to the right and then he crashes. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

OOpppsssss :) Start with a cable tie on the front fork and mark bottom out to see how much travel you are using. Look at the shock shaft coming out of the shock body to see what is dirty and what is clean. That will give you the foundation of knowledge to work from. Next, change fork oil to 15w to the same volume as stock and test ride - was it more stable. Thicker oil moves slower so you may use less fork travel. Check shock travel again and ideal is 2-3mm of dirt above the bottom out bumper. If there's no dirt, you may need a stiffer spring. Game on! Please report back to help others and pay it forward.

Dave Moss Tuning Mate, I’m chuffed you found time to reply! I shall do as advised hopefully this coming weekend and will certainly report back and do my bit of paying it forward. You’re a gent and a legend. Cheers mate.

@@mt07toooldtowalk42 Thank you! I look forward to hearing about your thoughts and experience once the changes have been made.

Thank you for sharing how you feel. You are not alone. Thousands or riders like yourself trust in the engineers to get it right. So - if you look at the bell curve across humanity how can it be right for every rider on the planet between height, weight, shoe size, hand size etc. If it were a car, it would be much easier. With two wheels, we need to find what works for us and spend the $$ to get ourselves comfortable so we eliminate fatigue. Then we need to evaluate if the springs we have been give work for us, the owner. Start with one of these videos on fork travel and see what you can learn to help yourself: ru-vid.comsearch?query=fork+travel:

Dave Williams, editor, replying here. You can see the problem in action in this video, at 5:15. You'll see he hits 2 bumps as he enters the corner and this causes the front to fold. The bars suddenly turn to the right and then he crashes. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

Street focused.

@@catalystreactionsbw Is there a video on the difference street - track. So given a well tuned street bike, what to do when going to the track?

@@Max-yy3lz Street depends on levels of aggressiveness. Track depends on skill and ability. Sometimes the street set up is very adequate. Fork and shock travel used will indicate if it is not and needs to be changed to be stiffer as the forks and shock are too close to bottom out.

Dave Williams, editor, replying here. You can see it cause this guy's crash at 5:15 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

Thanks for sharing your experience Matt. What "stronger fluid" did you use and how much? Stunting is a very unique set up indeed so sharing more information would be very helpful for those who have your skill set.

@@catalystreactionsbw 15wt for the fork fluid to make the front suspension more stiff and less chance of bottoming out/ blowing your fork seals. If anyone is truly interested in how to set up a stunt fz07 I will be making a video on my RU-vid channel

@@Deadman_stuntz Thanks for confirming the change from stock to 15w oil and volume to meet your needs for endo's etc.

looks like it was was vinyl wrapped to me

Looks to me like 3M 2080 Satin Flip Glacial Frost Vinyl Wrap

Westwingturbos I thought so too.

Westwingturbos i think thats just to precise to be wrong fella ; ]

@@ph5056 Eh, could be close enough.

Great post and thank you for sharing your upgrades and what a difference they made.

@@catalystreactionsbw You said that the stock shock wears out after 12,000 miles, I have noticed that. I carry side cases and a top case 95% of the time. I am one click off from the stiffest rear spring setting and I wight 180# though I did get down to 160# in 2020. I finally did my first track day this summer. I just took all of the luggage off but left the spring pre-load the same. I should have thought to check the sag. I had lowered the forks in the front tubes because I have very short legs, then I chose to go back to fully extended while riding on the tail of the dragon. I thought the Geometry was better with the forks extended out. When I got to Tail of the Dragon and put my tent up .. I took 80 Pounds of gear and luggage off from the bike. I know this because I weight all of it when I got home from my trip .

@@mikeskidmore6754 Great post to help people realize their bike needs their preference for settings!

Dropping the front end makes the 'attack angle' of the steering (aka steering angle) steeper, thus making the bike steer quicker, more razor-sharp. One thing you want to do is whether you bottom the entire front end with that much drop on the front, you can be preventing full travel of the shocks. If travel is unaffected just check whether fenders or such will rub out in full compression. This mod is commonly used to lower ride height, but increase the steering head angle when the rear shock is not adjusted accordingly.

I tend to chose 3-4mm increments. It is known that most Asian countries lower the front end dramatically but I am not sure if that is done via testing per bike or the social norm as it is a legacy practice from decades ago? As per Rui Kazane's comment, lowering can take away travel so you have to mark bottom out and make sure that you do not go any further than that.

Yes I do! Set sag on the rear and see if the forks pogo and get that resolved.

Thanks for sharing that critical piece of information. Have you checked static sag to see what you have in your 2018? Standard is 20-30mm.

Correct!

Dave Williams, editor, replying here watch. And here's video proof at 5:15 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

Thank you! 20w fork oil, forks at stock height. Shock at 3 notches from the highest point and rebound at 1 turn from closed.. Start at 42 front and 44 rear cold psi with your weight.

Is the salty langue necessary? Kids watch these arcane suspension upgrade videos.

Hi Jason. Step 1, check static sag on the forks. If you have less than 10mm, the spacer needs to be trimmed. At 200lbs or more a 7mm trim makes sense and 20w would acceptable to the stock volume. With the forks, mark fork bottom out with a felt pen (ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-eds3dn1LBkw.html) and visually check travel used via a cable tie on the forks and looking to see how much of the shock shaft is clean. If 100% clean, the shock needs to be stiffened. If it cannot, the OEM spring needs to be replaced. Hope this helps!

Yes it does and you might find that even at the softest preload settings for the rear shock, you cannot get any static sag: davemosstuning.com/?s=static+sag

@@catalystreactionsbw can you tell it step by step for us not screwing anything? İ never disasssmbled a fork. Can it be done by not so pro guys like me?

Hope you are doing as well as can be expected Dale. Still sending riders to your site!! :)

@@catalystreactionsbw Hi Dave, Just finished 42 day of radiation so at least that crap is behind me now. Feel terrible, but I plan to kick this cancer ass, to get back in my car and on my bikes ! ? Do you still own your shop and do suspension, or only the track clinics these days. Have you done the forks on the 2017+ SV 650 and a rear shock yet. I have some stuff I do with Cogent, but a good friend of mine lives in Concord CA with the new SV. Thanks much .... DW ! You can also shoot me an e mail please ... dlwalker@holeshot.com

Well where are you to get an idea for the set up. It's not like that information is easy to comprehend without background in it. You want to ride a bike, take the course, buy a bike and ride, thinking the manufacturer set it up correctly... Blown away that people are blown away about people not knowing everything...

Why are you blown away? This is a skill set that not everyone has. It has to be taught. Maybe you were just born with insight about bike setup. Do you own a fridge? Can you re gas it? I can't believe that people own fridges and can't re gas them.

My view on suspension is don't touch what you don't know. Having said that I did the same as he did in this video to the rear suspension but only because my backside was aching after a few hours ride, I just wanted a comfier ride and not too concerned about cornering on 30mph gatso infested London roads tbh. Also I'm not sure I like the idea of bike going into a corner more easily, it's something you get accustomed to I wouldn't say one is better or worse unless you're talking lap times, think about how different the bike handles when you had low pressure tyres and then you inflate them back to normal and it feels like a different bike but you got used to riding it on flats. So it's only something you have to experience, he could've adjusted that suspension and the girl could've gone home hating it, just saying.

I will check a 2019 next week in Wellington to be sure.

@@catalystreactionsbw I would love to know this too thanks in advance

Dave Moss Tuning hey mate while your in nz will you be flying across to Australia? Brisbane

@@catalystreactionsbw awesome, can't wait to see a video on this as I have the 2019 model and want to see if I have to make any such changes!

also does this apply to the Tracer 700?

One of the words used to define "Fatal" is distasterous. That is highly applicable and relevant given how the bike handles off the showroom floor and it degrades from there as the oil ages. There are plenty of comments supporting this POV and more positive comments of how cost effective and beneficial the change is.

Dave Williams, editor, replying here. The guy in this video, at 5:15 would not have crashed if he'd done the fix. You'll see he hits 2 bumps as he enters the corner and this causes the front to fold. The bars suddenly turn to the right and then he crashes. All because the front rides too high in the stroke (no static sag), and the fork oil is too thin (pogo) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Dglu0Wsf80k.html

According to recent video where Dave is fixing the issue. Bike still has the issue, however there is higher weight oil in fork I think.

There is no issue with warranty if you change spacer length and oil. This has been proven many times by owners that have made changes to the forks. Changing the rear shock to a different one does not invalidate warranty either. The main concern of warranty is engine and electronics. You might ask a different brand dealership what would invalidate a warranty on say a Ninja 650.

Yes

Thanks for your post and question. The first generation MT09 needed 15w fork oil to the same volume the manual requires and that transformed the bike's handling

@@catalystreactionsbw awesome, thank you for taking your time to awnser my question 👌

The FJ09 has the correct spring/spacer combination. I use 10w for both forks at 150mm oil height. Helped a lot. Shock spring is far too soft. davemosstuning.com/?s=tracer+gt

Welcome! Thanks for discovering the channel and I have no doubt you will enjoy the content and make some changes to your motorcycle(s)!

Very long time lol. Manchester originally.

Which bike?

@@majormassenspektrometer I now have a Honda Rebel 500. Haven't done much to it yet, ebc brake pads front and back.

@@ifrit35 Nice bike! Hope you have fun with it. ;)

Ideal is rider sag at 25 and static at 10 for max 40mm. At 33mm with no static sag would suggest the spring is perhaps too soft for your weight, let alone you ability. So - we need to know how much travel you are using. If you have zero static sag and the shock is bottoming, the spring is certainly too soft.

If static sag is 15mm or less, yes it is for spacer length. If the fork bounces three times with new oil, yes for oil viscosity.

R7 is completely different set of forks. We tested the R7 and made some changes. Depending on weight and skill, 10 to 15w worked well. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-vAwmdDFt6qs.html