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(1368) Trapped by Dark Arts Lock Picking

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Another TRAP lock, these seem to be rolling in now. In this one I get trapped by a challenge lock from Dark Arts Lock Picking. REALLY nice work on both the pins AND the trap cuts in the core.
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Опубликовано:

27 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 202

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

I designed those tension wrenchs so they are perfect for light tension. I'm glad you like them Mr Bill. Thank you so much for attempting my Sherlock inspired locks. I have been waiting for this video 😁. Thank you so much sir. I did say no pin in pins this time 😉. I was so worried that you might have used your expensive pick on these locks. Till next time. Stay safe mate 👍👍👍🤘🤘🤘🍻

@funkeyfastdrawmonkey1483 5 лет назад

Awesome work brother👏🐵 nicely made pins and wicked core work.

@ZENMASTERME1 5 лет назад

Dark Arts Lock Picking That Was An Absolutely Beautiful & A Very Very Functional Designs! Truly Brilliant!!

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

Zenmasterme thank you mate 👍👍👍🤘🤘🤘

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

And im sorry I didn't know you would have a trap lock before mine sir. And I forgot to mention all the pins I use in all my challenge locks are home made pins. 👍

@Leonslockpad 5 лет назад

@@DarkArtsLockPicking great job Bruv well done👍😊👍😊😎✌✌

@drchancer1098 5 лет назад

engraving could be sherlock's pipe

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

peter it was meant to be but I can't engrave to save my life lol. 😂 👍👍👍🤘🤘🤘

@drchancer1098 5 лет назад

I could see it was a pipe straight away...... a one off! :)

@z4zuse 5 лет назад

Looks fine: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Treachery_of_Images

@voidofmind 5 лет назад

Bill was obviously making a joke

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

z4zuse the pipe that is famous for Sherlock Holmes is a calabash pipe.

@sobertillnoon 5 лет назад

What is this witchcraft!?!! 13:31 Bill reaches off screen right and his hand appears at the left of the screen! Bill, using sorcery to open locks is cheating.

@Prophes0r 5 лет назад

"...and that's my plan from now on" So we need to use a hardened steel trap pin. Good to know.

@dextrodemon 5 лет назад

bill's hatred of trap locks increases

@franklinshooter3050 5 лет назад

Kudos to your level of patience, sir. Also, I had an "aha" moment when I realized the fit of the ToK tension allows for better control when dealing with serrations and the like. Thanks Bill.

@chrisgr1999 5 лет назад

Another excellent lesson !! Even though Bill you don't like any kind of traps, it is very important for us the viewers to know about their existance and how they work !!

@MrV1NC3N7V3G4 5 лет назад

I'm totally against the t-pin/wafer type trap locks being sent in as challenge locks, but seeing as how both of those pins could have been reset by turning the core the other way with a little more torque, I'm gonna say this lock was legit. I think if this is how people have to beat Bill then it is definitely an acknowledgement of his talent.

@minmatenx Год назад

Bunch of cheaters lol

@wilneish6086 5 лет назад

I don't think those qualify as trap pins, just really deep undercutting. More likely the ball just got jammed when Bill tried to force the open after the deep false set. Trap pins generally render the lock unusable once they fall in. Good call on giving him a Paclock.

@paulv1498 4 года назад

A steamy worm lol!!! Don't give away your age there Bill, it's most definitely a tobacco pipe. I love your work on here, it makes me want to be a locksmith!

@ZENMASTERME1 5 лет назад

@0:56 Elementary my dear Watson! It’s a pipe!!!

@adamwest8711 5 лет назад

Zenmasterme I literally said almost exactly the same thing. Should have read the thread before commenting 🤦🏻‍♂️

@funkeyfastdrawmonkey1483 5 лет назад

Nice try Bill 👏 was wondering when we would see this vid 😊 He sure does know how to make an awesome limited edition set of tensioners.

@DonzLockz 5 лет назад

Nice tricky lock but I think Bill is getting pee'd off with darn trap pin's.😁 Go Aussie's!🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺

@caseylocke4474 5 лет назад

I would be too. The fun of challenge locks is to be able to open them. Trap locks are good for real world security, but not for challenges. That's just irritating.

@bosnianbill 5 лет назад

Not so much pee'd off, but disappointed in copycats. The whole idea of offering the PACLOCKS for challenges it to stimulate some creativity and let us all see some innovation in security measures. I have a limited number of these locks remaining (11) and don't want to give them all away to guys that copy other's trap designs. Traps are just devious because you've actually picked the lock when you hit one of these nasty boobytraps. The recoverable ones are OK because you get another try to use your skill to overcome it. The NONRECOVERABLE ones though, are the ones I find irritating. It is like being the first in a race and some SOB trips you right before the finish line, or teasing a toddler with candy, then yanking it back a the last moment... I'll still accept challenge locks containing trap pins and will continue to try to pick them on camera, but will not be sending a PACLOCK for them unless they contain something fresh or innovative. As I write this three kwiksets from three different people sit on the bench - each with identical, non-recoverable traps - and I'm sure there are more on the way. I don't want to "waste" our PACLOCKS rewarding copycats. Sorry.

@DonzLockz 5 лет назад

@@bosnianbill good point Bill, I understand your frustration and your explanation makes sense to me.👍🏻 I want a Paclock as much as anyone but I bought my own 2nd gen one and had them engrave it for me too.✌ One day I shall make some challenge locks and hopefully come up with a new idea to beat you fairly. May just send you a Protec2 and say it's a challenge lock.😁 On that note, do you accept disc detainer or lever challenge locks?... just out of curiosity?🤔

@fastcharlie4054 5 лет назад

While it at first seemed like a trap, after watching the gutting, I don’t see anything that would cause me to call it a trap lock. Maybe temporarily captured, seriously bound...stuck... seems like it could have been picked back to fully locked position and then opened with the key or just reset for another picking attempt. Hindsight is 20/20 though and I probably would have taken it apart, too - only to discover I should have been more patient. Looks like a fun tough lock to try. Dark Arts Lockpicking did a great job and those tensioners look awesome.

@funkeyfastdrawmonkey1483 5 лет назад

That's what I think too. Well said mate

@floorpizza8074 5 лет назад

Completely agree, Fast Charlie. To me, a true Trap Lock is one that you have zero chance of recovering from once the trap is sprung. It looks to me like this one can be recovered from if you're not 200LB Gorilla'ing the tension and jam it up. Dark Arts, you are an amazing craftsman... those pins look like they came from a factory! So much so that Bill even declared one as such! I really like your RU-vid channel, too, btw. Two minutes into the first video of yours that I watched I knew you were/are a hell of a nice guy. And I immediately knew that was a pipe engraving, and a very well done one at that. And don't even get me started on those tension wrenches! Just beautiful.

@derekdaggy3704 5 лет назад

Wow that was pretty. These are the things that makes tools fly when you're half way through a job.

@ctged 5 лет назад

Patience, Bill, sir. Maybe you could have picked it to sheerline and then twisted it very fast once it became clear that it was a trap lock. You set the rules, and the clock stopped once you had got it picked, and got caught in the trap. I think you should allow yourself time to figure it out, maybe another 3 x 10 minutes plus a cool down time for having an adult beverage, before you try to figure out how to get past the trap pin(s). If you would be in the competition and that was the last lock, would you give up or try to figure some other method. We believe in you sir. You are the best.

@MH-bv9kk 5 лет назад

Hey Bill, Just my 2 cents, but I don't think that was designed to be a trap lock. If I remember right, I think you've picked a challenge lock like this before, and the slots were just to give that obnoxious false set. I think it getting stuck was just an oops in the modifications. I get where you're coming from about locks designed like this, but I think you should make a bit of a distinction on the traps. If it's something like this that was intended to be able to get out of the trap with it still in the vice, then it's just a deceptive open. But if it's designed to be able to not be backed out of that insane false set with a tension wrench, then it's a trap and yeah, no soup for you. That grooved set up reminds me of the old Emhart interlocking pins, and how the core was grooved to accommodate them.

@DrigrX 5 лет назад

I don't pick myself, I've just found myself fascinated with Bill's videos, but I kind of agree. At first I was frustrated with/for Bill at having two traps back to back. However, I feel like in the case of being designed to be able to back out of the trap, they should still count as valid, this one just unfortunately got stuck.

@granadajason 5 лет назад

11:35 tink tink tink tink tink thump!....Bill you're lucky thats such a tiny hammer!

@jayeff337 5 лет назад

I was getting frustrated for you just watching this video! Very nice work by both of you guys!

@Ambrovious 5 лет назад

I just bought my first set of picks and a cutaway lock from Sparrows...and I blame it all on you and LPL ;)

@michaelkirk4252 4 года назад

Elementary my dear Watson. The pipe is a nice touch. :-)

@bradw0535 5 лет назад

Nice work Dark Arts! Well crafted and thought out! As much as I don't like to see Bill irritated, it does make me feel better that I'm not alone in my tendency to turn to destructive methods on an obstacle ticking me off! Thanks for the video Bill!

@joshdude2137 5 лет назад

so bill, i wanna thank you. ive been watching your videos for awhile now and i really like them. the other day i learned how to use a city rake properly from your lock attack video. then after 5 opens of a master lock my cheap pick broke in half. i watched your make a pick videos, i have made my own picks before from hacksaw blades but was super unhappy. but the metal choice video gave me an idea. i took the main bar from a bosch flex windsheild wiper and made 4 picks based on the rakes you carry using your attack a lock video. i copied them by pausing and screenshotting the awesome profile shots of the picks you included. the snake rake i made will open the master i have in a few seconds most times now, its like a perfect pic lol. thanks a ton for the vids and keep up the great work!

@MOKPT3 5 лет назад

You better send Bill another package with some candy..... NEVER forget the candy...

@Leonslockpad 5 лет назад

Well done bill my friend Dark Arts made very nice lock i have a set the tension wrenches as there limited to 9 sets👍😊👍😊😎✌✌✌

@adriansrealm 5 лет назад

Bill is pissed! Dark Arts should go to his panic room now.

@MattsLockPit 5 лет назад

Awesome lock :) those trap pins combined with the other nice pins made that a nightmare!! Great work by Dark Arts Lock Picking :) :)

@GavTatu 5 лет назад

i just idly SPP'd my first padlock whilst watching this vid !!

@doublejaylar 5 лет назад

Just curious...but are pins 1 & 4 really considered "trap pins", or did one (or both) just get unexpectedly wedged in the slot due to a milling defect? I guess I thought traps had to be released by disassembling the lock. I believe these pins should have allowed the core to reset. Oh well, it looks like I'll have to scrap one of the challenge locks I made for Bill.

@juanrendontorres174 2 года назад

I respect your honesty

@danromo635 5 лет назад

1st YES! Amazing picking & traps creativity on both ends, great job on both which makes watching this twice as good!

@voidofmind 5 лет назад

Who goes on a video and posts "first" when there is already dozens of comments? Weird.

@danromo635 5 лет назад

other side My Bad! It was a 1st “Like” only...

@JohnLeePettimoreIII 5 лет назад

Challenge lock traps should RESET. Not cool to have one that doesn't.

@johnfrancisdoe1563 5 лет назад

John Lee Pettimore III See A.A. B. 's thread, it the lockmaker is also surprised it didn't reset!

@kevinw9625 5 лет назад

I must say Bill, if the only way to beat you is by making a trap, then i would take that as a sense of accomplishment. Masterful pinning and good tolerances can't keep you out by themselves. Excessive low cuts and traps are the only way to get over on the wizard of the lock lab!

@ratatosk2515 5 лет назад

true! but I wonder how many challenge locks were gonna see if they keep making these trap locks

@jakobrosenqvist4691 5 лет назад

So Now I have to make a 7 pin lock with all trap pins made from hardned steel.

@MoseyingFan 5 лет назад

And then name it The Admiral Ackbar.

@AThreeDogNight 5 лет назад

A good job Bill, I thought you had it done as well. A well made lock there by Dark Arts. Next time Bill just get a beefy screwdriver like you said. LOL!!!!!!!

@imthesquareroot6125 5 лет назад

Again, what I feel should be done is a rule that challenge locks should now on be submitted under two different categories. Standard "Lock Sport" Challenge Locks and Non-Standard "Exhibition" Challenge Locks. At least this way there would be an expectation from the beginning that the lock is a trap or has similar "denial of entry" methods employed. With the exhibition locks I feel the viewers should then vote on whether the maker should be awarded a prize for creativity, etc

@ronreuwer5265 5 лет назад

Bill I dont believe they were snakes. Pipe sherlock Holmes. Elementary my dear Watson

@mikeh9395 5 лет назад

I'm impressed. Tough lock. I've just started watching you and few others. Made my own pick and tensioner. Not the greatest but works. It is very satisfying to feel each pin and finally pick it open. I had an older master lock and was able to open in a matter of seconds. Went to the store to buy a couple more. Was excited, sadly I opened those too quickly. The bug bit meh. I want more lol. Good vids tyvm Mike

@gilbertbros.cycleservice3486 4 года назад

Elementary my dear Watson.... it's a pipe...have a good one

@larryg7336 5 лет назад

I love those trench wrenches Bill. And I felt your frustration with that lock. You did say no more traps. Nice keeping cool. Now I'll email you

@DevCasey 5 лет назад

I think trap locks are the way to go if you don't mind having a semi functional lock after someone attempts to pick it.Just knowing that someone attempted it could be useful.

@MisterLongShot_Official 5 лет назад

I've been watching Bill's videos since around video 400, and I know he really dislikes trapped challenge locks.

@MrLaserburns 5 лет назад

Elementary my dear Watson. Lol

@vertigo72480_official 5 лет назад

Elementary my dear BosnianBill. Sherlock Holmes. :)

@ehsnils 5 лет назад

Six of nine. Seven of nine would be a lot more nerdy.

@joshdude2137 5 лет назад

six fears seven....

@WOWayne325 5 лет назад

I don't consider that trap pins... Very deep undercuts..! I don't understand why it wouldn't go back...

@dustysparks 5 лет назад

The lack of spring didn't help, there wasn't any additional nudging from the inside without the hammer, and since it was tensioning it while hammering it, that probably kept it captive. Little Houdini or WD-40 might have helped the metal from seizing...

@davidsenette5727 5 лет назад

where'd that third hand come from at 13:32?

@two_tier_gary_rumain 5 лет назад

I noticed that too. Had to watch it a few more times till I realised it was Bill's right hand. He had cross his hand over to pick up something on the left side.

@kevincorkery6292 5 лет назад

Yes, crossed over to pick up the shim.

@n07ju57hum4n 4 года назад

That shit tripped me out 😂😂😂

@MartinKrafft 5 лет назад

hi bill use a shim as you use it when disassembling. but instead of the key you manipulate the pins with the pick.

@MasterMindmars 5 лет назад

Amazing trap. Good job

@MyuFoxable 5 лет назад

Died at "Looks like a worm or could be steaming pile of snake."

@renehenriksen1735 5 лет назад

They probably make a Hound of Baskerville-lock one day where the dog´s "teeth" symbols the pins. ;)

@codemonkey2k5 5 лет назад

How were those traps? From the way they look, you should have been able to back out of the false set.

@wesdresen9994 5 лет назад

nicely done just getting to the trap.

@MichaelBerthelsen 5 лет назад

That's Sherlock's pipe. Looks like a meerschaum/calabash from the shape of it.

@adamwest8711 5 лет назад

It’s a shame the trap wouldn’t reset. I think traps might be ok but only if they can easily reset without the key. If you need the key or a hammer, not really a valid challenge lock. Good effort from dark arts though. Ps, what happened at 13:33. Your hand disappeared off right, turned up back in shot left than immediately back in on right... that’s some serious sleight of hand...

@grahampearson947 2 года назад

So the deal is. If we send you a challange lock, Bill. You have 30mins to open otherwise we win? Im up for that challenge. Ill be in the ChopShop tomorrow :D

@Bansheecat6 5 лет назад

great picking as always

@JimFortune 5 лет назад

When you mentioned smacking it with a hammer I envisioned a crowbar and a ten pound sledge.

@theblacklockpicker9083 5 лет назад

bill knew what happened that's why he sent the paclock

@hyperclearphoto6573 5 лет назад

Between this mans videos and the hacking videos I watch I will soon be a qualified secret squirrel agent!

@JC-11111 5 лет назад

A worm? A snake? It's obviously a pipe 🤣

@thorlancaster5641 5 лет назад

+1 for the screwdriver method. Or use a hardened steel key blank.

@johnpatrickn875 5 лет назад

RU-vid channel favorite

@V4Vendetti 4 года назад

Trap pins are not challenge locks, they are a while different category of locksport. Trap pins don't belong in challenge locks unless stated.

@8867348 5 лет назад

Fine job Mr. Bill.

@micglou 5 лет назад

Bill sounded a little pissed...

@x9x9x9x9x9 5 лет назад

11:36 ouch. This is the first time I can recall seeing Bill somewhat angry. That long pause when he finds out its a trap was kinda terrifying also throwing the key down. I thought "did the video just pause?" Mind you I would have been pissed as well and probably would have reacted much worse than that.

@cojones8518 5 лет назад

The little dumbells work by one end being still in the core and the other end is in the bible. The stem is laying in the groove cut in the core. That gives a very deep false set. It got trapped because the stem got caught in the groove or the ball got jammed against the wall of the bible. My best guess.

@WiliamBennettwildarbennett 5 лет назад

ELEMENTARY, MY DEAR WATSON, THAT MUST BE THE MERSCHAM PIPE OF, PROFESSOR SHERLOCK HOLMES.

@PeregrineBF 5 лет назад

Someday when I get time (so not that soon sadly) I'll make a lock by lapping the core, bible, & pins to sub-micron tolerance. A challenge lock with all standard pins & chambers, made difficult only by precision. Example of what sub-micron tolerances do: /watch?v=sFrVdoOhu1Q?t=38s

@charlesmartin8596 5 лет назад

Elementary my dear Watson It is a pipe

@pmheart6 5 лет назад

You know bills been to your house when you see a sharpie line on your lock

@chrism4008 2 года назад

It's a Sherlock pipe!

@waltv79 5 лет назад

I've been working on building a challenge lock for you. but it's sounding more and more like your more interested in it being an easy pick than a challenge, by the look of that lock it wasn't designed to trap it like it did yet your first though is to use a screw driver and ruin the lock. I'm starting to second guess myself on sending you a challenge lock for the simple fact I don't want it ruined in the off chance that the trap I am putting in it that would allow it to be reset gets stuck. R.I.P. naughty bucket locks.

@pawpatrolnews 5 лет назад

Yeah I think Bill's just salty because he didn't get an open.

@dough9950 5 лет назад

It’s your own fault bill, if you weren’t so good then people wouldn’t have to resort to such dirty tactics! Lol

@seavil1 5 лет назад

Well done dark arts.

@o0julek0o 5 лет назад

The engraving was supposed to be a pipe, and the elementary is a. 'sherlock Holmes' quote except it isn't. Fairly sure Mark from Peep show covered it at one point, explaining why it's not the catchphrase.

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

o0julek0o Sherlock Holmes never state's "elementary my dear Watson" it's just like Hannibal never says "hello Clarice" when they first meet in silence of the lambs.

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

And the elementary lock is named after my favourite tv show. 😁

@Narinjas 5 лет назад

hmm i was gonna say no PadLock ... but why war you not able to relock the undercut traps on these? ... they should be relockable...

@funkeyfastdrawmonkey1483 5 лет назад

I was wondering the same thing. But maybe the 2 combined is what caused it to lock up like a construction hole trap

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

It never did that when I tested it out or attempted to pick it. So I'm not sure why it got stuck. 🤔

@bmitch3020 5 лет назад

Only thing I can think of is a key pin didn't fall back down. Might need to push it hard into the trap, rake all the key pins to the bottom, and then it should be able to be reset.

@funkeyfastdrawmonkey1483 5 лет назад

@@bmitch3020 you maybe correct. I have used similar pins and core mods on challenge locks. Never had it seize up, only deep false sets.

@voidofmind 5 лет назад

He probably turned it too strongly and it got wedged @@DarkArtsLockPicking

@PaulSteMarie 5 лет назад

That's odd about getting stuck. The pawn shaped pin and the spool should have released from the undercut tracks as soon as you reversed tension on the core. Were there serrations in the grooves that prevented turning the core back to the locked position?

@DiHandley 5 лет назад

Yep, we’re crazy as a fox in Australia.

@adamwest8711 5 лет назад

It’s a pipe. Elementary my dear Watson...

@johnpatrickn875 5 лет назад

Dark art lock picking

@MerkDolf 5 лет назад

Great pick, interesting lock too bad it didn't work properly all that banging an beating to get it to turn back

@alloypaulson7520 5 лет назад

Do you think you could "pick" a master lock without a pick? For example using a tension wrench then hitting it with a hammer to bounce the pins?

@bosnianbill 5 лет назад

Been there, done that... 1. ru-vid.com?o=U&video_id=pU9MB5XPsp4 2. ru-vid.com?o=U&video_id=C_wNgp_L1Uw

@elonmask50 5 лет назад

Excellent work getting back out of that trap Bill, I learn so much from your videos and wonderfull work on the trap pins Dark Arts, pity the Pipe engraving went straight to the keeper, but Sherlock is a Pommie thing, nice tensioning tools, are they available for purchase by mortal men?

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

Michael Harman as I have explained to Bill and everyone else that keeps calling it a trap lock and pins. It was never designed to be a trap lock. I designed it so that chamber 2 and 4 acted like deep undercuts. When I tested the lock countless times and each pin. Making sure that the shaft of pins 2 and 4 where much thinner than the cuts. So that they wouldn't get stuck but for some unknown reason one of them did. And I'm first generation Pommie Australian lol. I only made 9 set's and I have two left for giveaways etc. 👍👍👍🤘🤘🤘

@Sargalenski73 5 лет назад

Crazy

@curthatt6461 5 лет назад

Nice pick! Trap pins are crap! Please people, traps are an unfair play. They prove nothing and are just an irritant to watch being picked. Bill deserves better!

@DarkArtsLockPicking 5 лет назад

Curt Hatt I didn't design them to be trap pins or a trap lock. I designed it to act like a very deep undercut but for some reason one of the pins got stuck. I tested and tested that lock to make sure they wouldn't. I even made the shafts of the two pin's much thinner than the cuts so that they wouldn't stick. It was a way to make a deep undercut that would also dampen the feedback from the pins. Mr BosnianBill and I have spoken about this.

@leweyfountain8442 5 лет назад

Elementary, my dear Watson

@tucstwo 5 лет назад

JFC, Bill...It's Sherlock Holmes pipe.

@ElindorBG 2 года назад

why would you need a light tension ? that doesn't make any sense ...

@busterdudefly 5 лет назад

I'm new to lock sport but I have a question are trap locks made commercially or is this just a sly way to stop Bill getting in to the lock if so htey should get nothing.

@hoverhead047 5 лет назад

You were a little afraid it was a Lockwood, why?

@plug4uk696 5 лет назад

FYI, the worm/steaming snake is Sherlock Holmes pipe, it's quite Elementary really lol ;-)

@nataliesilsbury1888 5 лет назад

No connection drawn between sherlock /elementary (my dear watson) /sherlock holmes / his pipe / etc etc?

@jeffreykropp7664 5 лет назад

Sherlock's pipe.

@i3130002 5 лет назад

How do they make holes for the springs? Can you please help me with this?

@ElindorBG 2 года назад

its a pipe ... obviously ... a worm .. xDD

@joshdude2137 5 лет назад

also, just curious. but do the people who win a lock from you have to prove they can pick it? seems reasonable to require that....

@joshdude2137 5 лет назад

i mean to prove they can pick the challenge lock that they sent in...

@HG-nv8fk 5 лет назад

Love your work Bill. Can you tell me if you know of have tested this lock, WordLock(R) KS-052-BK Stor-More Key Safe. Can it be by passed with ease? One has been fited

@caseylocke4474 5 лет назад

09:26 - Bill, what did you mean by this when you said no one else would be getting a Pac Lock? I think I missed the context of your comment from another video perhaps.

@bosnianbill 5 лет назад

In video 1366, which was ANOTHER trap pin lock, I said that any FUTURE challenge locks that used trap pins would not receive a PACLOCK. I've been receiving several trap pin locks that are easy to pick, but once you fall into the trap it is unrecoverable. No amount of skill will get you out of the trap or salvage the lock. The first one was innovative and creative, but all the copycats are just using it as an easy way to get a PACLOCK. Since I only have 11 PACLOCKs left, I didn't think you'd want to see 11 stock kwiksets containing nothing but a trap pin or two. The whole idea of rewarding challenge lock makers with a PACLOCK is to stimulate some creativity and out-of-the-box thinking, so the entire LockSport community can benefit from fresh ideas. I don't see the copycat trap lock makers as fitting into that category. I will still accept challenge locks containing trap pins and will try to pick them on camera, but won't be sending PACLOCK to the makers. THAT is what I was referring to.