wouldn't it be fairer to have a BAC8000 , EBMX controller etc next to it and compare all? A lot of speculation in this video based on presumptions. Some good points also. I just see a lot of it as a non issue if warranted, pain in the arse for the hopefully very few that would need it. Would be great to have the quality you expected, but aint nobody paying for that(are they?). Please do that side by side comparisson for clarity.
You can see how long it takes to do a comparison like this. I may do that, but one at a time. I did these 2 side by side because so many people are comparing them against each other. 29X more resistance is pretty significant! The KO fan club can't comprehend what I tell them about these controllers being very poor so I showed it in another way next to the product they cant accept is so good.
Had to subscribe to follow this great content, before you removed the top board I couldn't work out why the standoffs was moving till I realised it's a multiboard controller, I bet someone with a solder iron and solid core copper could beef the traces to make it handle the current better but Iv seen cheap Chinese square-wave controllers built better
You are correct in that the KO cannot execute true FOC motor control. That is why the controller is not buttery smooth and has failed miserably in competitive enduro and trail races.
Have you opened up a lot of other controllers? Kinda curious as to how some of the other Chinese controllers compare. Like the fardriver, sabvoton, votol ones.
Sabvoton yes, Votal and Fardriver no. The Sabvoton was better reinforced with copper than the KO, but it's a very different design and it has it's own significant issues. Sabvoton used copper braid instead of copper sections or custom made single bars. Braid is flexible and you can bend it in different directions so that you can lay down a single long section. It's also fairly inexpensive and the total amount of copper is highly dependent on the size of the wire braid used.
Hi, It will get used, but not long term by me. I have a BAC8000 and an EBMX controller all with similar ratings. They will each get used on the same EV to do a butt dyno comparison. Before that happens, the 3 controllers will get taken apart like I do here for the KO Pro to expose whatever goodness or badness they might hold.
How is the controller switched on? It looks to me like the fets and the caps are allways powered on?!? If this is right, I would expect some top brand first class longlife high temperature low esr caps on the h-bridge.
It is very common that the caps and mosfets have battery voltage applied to them all the time. The mosfet gates are pulled to an off state so there is nothing conducting. The cpu is really what is powered off and that is what disables the controller. In the KO, you see all those Chinese caps. Not much "top notch" about them!
@@de-bodgery yes, I know the concept. It's the same in my ninebot scooter. It has some perks, because there is no spark or big inrush current during power on. But if you mod the scooter to more voltage you have to take care of the specs of those caps. High temperatures and/or extreme ripple might end with exploding caps or a short. This can even happen during charging. I would never sleep well with no name Chinese caps in my ride.
@@PeterPan-gy6kq Any inrush when you power up the CPU is very small since the amperage involved is very low. It's only when you need to charge the large caps in the controller and don't use precharge that you have the massive spark from inrush current. This is very hard on everything and should be avoided. Charge current is much lower than discharge current in most cases. The caps won't suffer much during charging and even if the controller support use as a BOOST converter, they still see very low use compared to running the motor.
some great points mate but - 13:30 - that narrow trace may not actually take much current, depending on what's around it... its connected at either end to the board below (and thus battery+) so the vast majority of current will flow out the 'end' standoff points... if it was only connected at 1 end you'd be 100% correct but being that there's connections at 2 ends (well, appears so) then this is kind of like the parallel connections across cells, its not likely, or shouldn't, to see the same current as the 'series' connections... depends on the impedance between the 2 connecting posts though obviosly, and the fact there's uneven #s of caps on either side means it will have some current flow, but may be adequate as a result. good to see you do what I'd been tossing up doing, buying it to see if its bs or not... at least with their motor. Just was hoping for some better data before throwing money to see if my suspicions are correct (that there's too much inductance for it to push the current needed for higher power, thermal issues aside - haven't ever confirmed but guessing this was the issue with their earlier MX version).
You may be right. I'd have to put a current sensor or at least a temp sensor there and see what happens to be dead sure. What I can say is the middle phase has to get current from somewhere and it's likely to pull from either direction and there is still no copper reinforcing anywhere so it's all very likely to get way too hot anyway.
@@de-bodgery certainly not suggesting its all good haha. Have you checked the traces aren't some specialist 'super thick custom job' ? though if they were the reinforcements they do add wouldn't be needed so... probably not. Whats the sqmm on the bridges with all those little cutouts? Did you get one of their motors? im still waiting for any solid info on them. the 35kw number is obvious 'china ratings' like you get on hobbyking et al, but could actually have some promise overall. The lack of a transition from the enameld copper phase wire (and their explanation of it) was hilarious though... its never fun to have to bend relatively thick copper wire several times, in the knowledge every time your work hardening it...
@@sn0wchyld They aren't special, just standard thickness copper traces and not beefed up in any way. IF they were, you would see them really stand up tall against the fiberglass. All those holes in the copper reinforcing is just reducing current carrying. It is done to make soldering down the copper easier. I mean, lol, it's hardly the bottle neck when there are total gaps in the copper reinforcing that are far worse!
@@sn0wchyld I am trying to get a KO motor...we will see. They are seriously over priced for a rather average motor that doesn't meet it's pie in the sky specs! I watched the video on the KO FB page for making those motors. They are using some good practices and some poor ones in their construction. I do like that they are wound in house. It ought to be done by a machine, not a man that uses a screw driver on the strands!
Not sure why you asked these questions when they have been answered repeatedly in my many other tear downs. *** I'm not a guru and have never claimed any titles of any kind.
hey man can you please help. I got my controller but the plug on my harness does not fit the plug on my sur ron harness @2:54 can you tell me which pin is power from the key switch., i dont want to tear my controller open to find out
I have one and I'll soon have an FSPEC from KO too. I wouldn't buy from KO. Their controllers are very poor quality! Please watch the rest of my KO videos. Once I have the FSPEC, I'll be doing the same kind of tear down that you see for the Pro. It's an equally poor design. If you are looking for something for a Surron, the EBMX X-9000 arrived to me yesterday that's a really good option and I'll be taking that apart on camera soon. I'll be showing the Tronic 750 very soon. That's less expensive than even KO and also a good design. Shul makes the C700, which I will have for a tear down soon too. These are all far superior to anything from KO.
@@juzeljames7793 any controller that delivers more amps to the motor will get you more torque and speed than the factory controller. Your motor will becomes the limiting factor for speed and torque. If you were to buy an X-9000, it can deliver far more amperage than your motor can use and the rest it might try to deliver if set to its maximum will simply be wasted as heat. The up side is that the X-9000 uses FOC motor control and that's the best and most efficient way to run any motor. Basically, you get less losses and amps in becomes torque more efficiently with less losses than any other form of motor control. This will help range, if you left the power at the same levels as you have now. However, you want more power and speed and that means more amps from the pack. This will draw from your pack more quickly so range will probably be less than you have now. This is just how it goes when you up your power draw regardless of FOC control or poorer forms of motor control like is in the KO products. If you want more range, you will need a larger pack. I don't have a Talera or a Surron, but I deal with this issue too and so I have 162Ah at 82v on my EV so that I have 100 miles of range. This is all a balancing act between several things. Upgrade one thing and you will need to upgrade something else to accommodate the increased power.
@@juzeljames7793 I know it's not the answer you wanted, but it's the answer that exists. So to that end, join this Discord forum. There are lots of good folks there and a dedicated section jsut for VESC! discord.gg/TKd3PkXK
you could buy the entire Pro controller. Did you see the video I posted a few weeks ago where I reattached a stud? I bet I can reattach them. Do you use facebook? Are you in the USA? PM me on Facebook and we can talk further about your controller.
