We met Walter several times when I was growing up. He loves telling fans in “Space Seed” Chekov was “holding up the toilet” when Khan had to go. Khan told him, “You. I will never forget your face.” Koenig is a great guy and super gracious. DeForest Kelley, Takei, and Majel Barrett were amazing and lovely too. ❤️ Grateful to have been raised in a Trekkie home. 🖖🏼
It's always good to hear that actors you admire and respect are down to earth in real life. I would love to meet Walter Koenig. I did meet John de Lancie once, he was very nice.
I think it's stupid to say Chekov never met Kahn. We don't see every single moment of a character's life. It's plausible that Chekov had a lower position before becoming a bridge officer.
this ^^. Every time somebody says "Chekov wasn't in S1" I chuckle and ask for the entire crew manifest. That of course gets people pondering... Sadly you often have to spoon feed them and remind them that there are far more people in his department who _don't_ work on the bridge than those who do before they catch on that he may indeed have met Khan, just not on screen. Indeed, since he would have been a very junior officer at the time, he may have been one of the people assigned to babysit the guests, so they may remember him even more than Kirk.
I always thought Joaquin was Khan's offspring of sorts. He did not much cared for the other augments under his command but him. And the relationship is quite different from the others as well.
Joaquin is believed to be the son of his friend from the Space Seed Episode. The big dark haired guy who slaps Uhura... He was going to pay for it if Khan hadn't stopped him from slapping her again. She was coming up at him with those talons out.
Check out the woman behind the camera at 1:01. That's Catherine Coulson, aka The Log Lady. She learned how to be a camera op on "Eraserhead" and was the first woman to hold the Assistant Camera position on big-budget film in the U.S.
That optical printer that the proto Pixar group at Lucasfilm where charged with creating is basically the most important invention in the film industry since Color.
It was to be assumed that since the Enterprise was already on it's FIVE YEAR MISSION when dealing with Kahn, Chekov 'was' already a crew member of The Enterprise. Chekov just was not a senior officer serving on the bridge yet. And Kahn only recognized Chekov's face from memorizing the Enterprise's data logs and crew manifest.
Koenig had a joke at conventions that Chekov working on the lower decks of the Enterprise took his sweet time in a bathroom stall one day without realizing that Khan was impatiently waiting outside with a digestive emergency brought on by his heightened, augmented metabolism leading him to suffer an embarrassing accident. Upon Chekov exiting the stall Khan locked eyes as he shoved passed him declaring: 'I NEVER forget a face!"
Yea, it’s really popular to hate Roddenberry these days - guys dead, can’t defend himself anymore Leaking the script is Classic Roddenberry - he was protecting his baby - pissed that he had lost creative control and not liking the more militaristic take and the death of Spock Take it for what it is
study the lantern corps..... Rage, Fear, Greed and Death all feed off of and into one another, until the cycle is broken we're screwed...... rage caused fear, fear of loss leads to more greed, actual loss leads to rage which in turn can lead to death in the conflicts that erupt.... the ferengi might be a part of it, but they aren't the prime drivers of greed.... 👿
Yep, the Ferengi were based on Hollywood types, including Gene himself. You've heard about the lyrics to the Star Trek theme song that Roddenberry wrote to get half the royalties.
05:09 Sulu was not in that particular episode, either. It never occurred to ANYONE that Uhura could have given a 'Ceti Eel scream' better than even Chekov (she was in both the season and the particular episode, FTR).
I don't know, Checkov is an excellent screamer. See "Mirror, Mirror", and I think the episode where everyone but Checkov gets an aging disease. And when he touches the flower on Eden in 'The Way to Eden". He's great at this.
Movie studios still probably continue to skim money from their rightful owners. Maybe there should be an independent auditing process for every movie to ensure fairness.
Paramount: "Sorry, guys, we just didn't make any money at all... nope... not at all..." Shatner: "You know, I'm sure Ricardo still has some of those brain eels around..." Paramount: "Haha... those aren't real... are they?" Roddenberry: "Very real." Paramount: "We'll... send you a check."
the old studio BS .... oh the film has not made a profit is well known, more than one TV show or Movie has had the same thing claimed about it. even though it is repeated sent to video dvd blueray etc etc year after year. Sony is another company that is known for fudging the books and have been taken to court the old Sony trick is ok we have you on an exclusive contract to work for us, you are arguing about money sure go sit at home we will call you when we need you, more than one star sat at home unable to do anything until the contract they were locked into ran out and could leave. some stars even took them to court to get the contracts broken by a judge... and yes they won
Roddenberry was no saint about hiding profits. He did that with the Original Series, to avoid paying $$$$$$ to his first wife after their divorce (the one he divorced so he could marry Majel).
Regarding the design of the Reliant, it is also interesting to note that in the original concept drawing, the ship’s nacelles where intended to be above the saucer section, not below. When the drawing ended up on someone’s desk for review (can’t remember who), this person was looking at this drawing from a short distance, but the drawing was upside down. They liked it and went ahead with it.
The same was true for the Constitution-class starships. The Enterprise on the original series was almost nacelles and saucer facing down with the engineering section sticking up.
I'm surprised they didn't mention that the cadet that Scotty brings to the bridge and later dies in sickbay is actually his nephew and that all lines explaining that were cut from most versions of the film.
@@eddieegan9887 True about the only thing it added was the reason Scotty was so upset about the death but for a 2 part Things You Didn't Know video I would of thought it would of been in there.
Nimoy and Sgatner both wanted that scene cut along with Savik crying when Spock’s casket was shot out of Enterprise which REALLY should have been cut because it conflicted completely with what the audiences had been told about Vulcans since the original tv series.
If you are using the fictional star date timeline rather than air date, Chekov's character appears before Space Seed. The random nature of star dates was noticed early on, with four episodes having an unknown star date. Even in a single episode, star date progressions didn't align very well with customary Earth calendars.
I can still watch the movie years later and enjoy it, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the passage of time. I was literally a scared little kid at the thought of one of those ear worms going into Captain Kirk's ear. I literally started bawling at the thought in the theater as I watched the movie. I was 7 at the time.
I didn’t get to watch it in theaters, but in my dads air force base rec room, they had HBO, and I saw it there... shame I didn’t get to see it wide screen, but loved the show.
I’d heard that the Reliant was originally was supposed to be the same class as the Ebterprise, but not an “older version” of the same class (I.e. a TOS looking Enterprise), so it was metaphorically a battle of old Trek vs new Trek.
I have a better explanation for how Khan knew Pavel Chekov’s face. In the sickbay, Khan had full access to StarFleet “tapes” and a viewer and being Super Human, with a superior intellect and a photographic memory. He scanned the personnel records of all Star Fleet personnel and cadets! There he found the records of a young Pavel Chekov and a photo of his face!
@@iandowall153 Which is why the Hovercraft Division of the Hungarian Tourist Bureau has made it a centrepiece of onboard catering, as their main market presence seems to be with the brits.
Chekov's earliest episode -- going by stardate -- was "Catspaw" [3018.2], whereas "Space Seed" happens on stardate 3141.9, which was 123.7 stardate units LATER. Since 1,000 stardate units equals 1 Earth-year, that means Chekov was on the Enterprise at least 0.1237 Earth-years -- or 45 days + 4 hours + 19 minutes 52 seconds -- before they discovered the BOTANY BAY. It ain't a mistake if you put the episodes into stardate order.
If Scotty's nephew was given starting credit, then the Phoenix deserved to be there too. Personally, I think only Khan and the regular cast deserve start credit. Just because Checkov wasn't shown in the first season, doesn't mean he wasn't on the Enterprise then. Presumably, he was there, and was later promoted to "day" shift helmsman. Maybe he was on the swing shift in the same role. I don't remember anyone saying to him, welcome aboard the Enterprise, Mr Chekov.
If you think about it the Enterprise was close to if not a top of the line ship so it wouldn't make sense for someone fresh out of the academy to be at a major station like navigation. It's far more likely he happened to be stationed on the ship, possibly when it launched with Kirk, and he showed dedication and talent over the first year so he earned the position of primary navigator despite still being an ensign
"Look, there isn't any money. We're basically a non-profit organization. Most of the studio execs are on food stamps" "Ok, so you won't mind then if our court ordered accounts take a look at your books" "Hold on, we just got some new numbers in yesterday. Will ya look at that - turns out we did have some profits - here's your check"
Ooof, I love the idea of a little kid. Just plonked there crawling round innocently and oblivious while adults are going on a destructive revenge fuelled rampage. Particularly sitting there googling at the blinking lights of whats about to explode and destroy them. Although in my rewrite after the torpedo explodes the screen would display the text "THE CHILD REPRESENTS ALL OF YOU! DO YOU GET IT?!"
If he hadn't been so good at screaming, there are scenes and entire episodes he wouldn't have been in. I wrote a fanfic one time in which Chekov is asked by an alien what his function is on the Enterprise. Chekov's reply: "I scream, sir."
*I have to admit, I never expected you to expose the fact the 1978 iridescent Paint work on the Enterprise Refit Model was completely destroyed by ILM for ST TWOK, that is an extremely rarely known fact, only known within the studio scale model miniature collectors industry and Refit superfan Pro model makers.*
Why didnt or hasn't Paramount released archive footage or interview's of BEHIND SCENES - MAKING OF Newcomer's Kirstie Alley & Merritt Butrick in Media, DVD, BLURAY or 4K ?
It's been a very long time since I read the Vonda McIntire novelization, but my recollection was that Joachim was named as Khan's son in the book, and I don't recall a mysterious child in that version of the story.
In Vonda McIntyre's magnificent book, there WAS a baby among the Ceti Alpha V survivors. He is seen only when Terrell and Chekov first enter the cargo carrier that was the "home" of Khan and his people. The baby is never mentioned again in the novelization. Apparently, they filmed a young child in the Reliant transporter room, watching as the Genesis torpedo was armed. The footage was never used, but there are photo stills.
If Joachim was Khan’s son by Marla McGivers, he would have been no older than 15 at the time ST2 took place. Judson Scott looks far older than that. He could have been Khan’s son from another woman and been one of the crew revived from suspended animation in the original ‘Space Seed’. (Additional note: Khan calls one of his crewmen by name in the original episode-‘Joachin’ but the spelling is slightly different and he was considerably older than Jud Scott. Plus, they look nothing alike).
@@Cydonia2020 there is a great book by Greg Cox called "To Reign In Hell" that covers Khan's 15 year exile. Consider it carbon or not, but the author explains Khan's youthful followers as second generation supermen and superwomen, children of the original 72 survivors. Their souped up DNA made them mature much quicker than normal, so that's why those 15 and 14 year olds we see in the movie appear to be in their 20s. Joachim, in the movie, was the son of Khan's henchman Joaquin from the TV show. Joaquin was killed by rebellious supermen in the novel.
RE: Leaks. I still remember reading in, I believe, The National Enquirer, that Enterprise was going to be destroyed in the "upcoming" new movie. It detailed the captain's orders, explosions on the bridge killing Spock and others, and the captain's orders to abandon ship. I went to the theater expecting to see all this -- just not so soon. It was the Kobayashi Maru simulation. I wonder if this was Roddenberry's leak.
I remember going to see Star Trek The Wrath of Khan with my cousin he was in the sixth grade I was in the eighth grade and it was the first time we had been allowed to go see a movie on our own. It's sad that Paramount tried to cheat them out of prophets by lying about how much the film made. CBS did the same thing by not trying to pay them for licensing fees for their image is being used and Leonard Nimoy refused to do the motion picture until that lawsuit was settled and of course they settled with him.
One of the ideas for a 2nd Star Trek movie was the Enterprise crew going back in time to the assassination of JFK. The end of the movie would have Spock taking the final killing shot with a modified phaser from the grassy knoll.
That's a popular myth but it's untrue. In a couple of stories pitched the Enterprise went back in time and had to undo changes to history. JFK appears but helps Kirk even knowing it will probably mean his own death. We have the scripts. :)
I love the concept art for the captains chair in Wrath of Kahn, that big barco lounger idea that you're the captain you should be infinitely comfortable is a great motivator to ascend to the captaincy.
Maybe, but think about it, if that kid lived, you WOULD have had ANOTHER Augment with augmented ambition and megalomania as an adult, this time wanting revenge for killing his father! MORE Augments given birth to!
The child is also a Genesis Device. It is how you can make a new world. But, like you said, Khan was so stuck in the past, he would sacrifice the future for it.
Maybe if they expanded it more, maybe give Kahn another monologue about how after his wife died he was left to care for his child hoping that it would fill the hole in his heart that his wife left behind but after years of trying he knew that the only thing that could fill it was his need to get revenge on Kirk
They also do the fir tax purposes. Often the studio owns the production company too. The production company then charges the studio some ridiculous, arbitrary amount of $ for its services so that thebstudio can claim a net loss.
Same accounts that claim Star Wars a New Hope still as not made any money. Or at least a few years ago when in came out that the studio still not paid David Prowse for his work in the movie before his death.
I've always considered myself a Trekker (and will never change), not a Trekkie, but I guess Trekkie has stuck as I hardly ever hear the noun Trekker....
I don't know he'd necessarily didn't have to be part of the bridge crew at that time so he could have been on any part of the ship during we just wasn't following his story yet but he could have been there and it could be written that way it was just off camera
So if Trek II broke Superman's record, that would mean it was financially more successful than Star Wars. Like this list, not for just the information on the movie, but even just for the behind the scenes VFX info.
it was HIGHLY plausible that Chekov was onboard the Enterprise when Kahn was there although just not on the bridge crew...Kahn only said he Knew Chekov and he did memorize the manifest during Space Seed
It makes Khan even more chilling as a character,if his genetic augmentation allowed him to totally recall a junior officer who had not been promoted to bridgr vrew.
The paint job dulling explains a lot. By the time we get to ST3 it looks so bland and detail-less like a very low energy light-bulb. You think ILM could have lit it more sparingly to compensate? 🤪
Grear video. May I suggest for your next revision of this video to please include James Horner's cameo as an engine room crew men? He is the one running down a corridor holding a rather bulky piece of equipment when the enterprise is getting ready for the mutara nebula battle. I don't recall John Williams doing a stormtrooper cameo... :-P
IMO, Star Trek Wrath of Khan is the best of the original series movies, Star Trek First Contact is the best of the next generation movies, and Star Trek Beyond is the best of the Kelvin movies.
Luckily I have a copy of the novelization of Wrath Of Khan. There actually was a segment about the kid. I have to read the whole book now. But from what you say, it would’ve been odd having the kid there and it would’ve been messed up if that toddler crawled up to that device, then the ship exploded, especially when he couldn’t be seen since Ceti Alpha V til that point. Glad they didn’t include it, personally. But I will now try to find time to read the book.
The one thing that always bothered me was the fact that all of Khan's surviving followers in the film looked to be less than half his age and were all white and mostly blonde.
Agreed. Especially if you include all of the, now non-canon, books that take place after the original trilogy. Still pissed that Disney wrote them all off.
Great video, I would love to see you do a ‘20 Things’ video for the rest of the ‘mini trilogy’ of Search for Spock and especially The Voyage Home. Keep up the good work!
Cost = Budget x 2 due to marketing costs which are not part of the budget. In order for a movie that cost $44 million to be profitable, it would have to make more than $88 million.
@@richardvinsen2385 This is from a 2014 article by Hollywood reporter (RU-vid doesn't allow links). "In 1980, the average cost of marketing a studio movie in the U.S. was $4.3 million ($12.4 million in today's dollars). By 2007, it had shot up to nearly $36 million. If the MPAA still tracked spending on P&A, that number would be north of $40 million today for medium-size films like The Fault in Our Stars or Tammy."
I look at the Child and whilst it’s story wise out of space I have to say would have been extremely dark for a Sci Fi action film, they’d in terms of tone already skirted the lines with the eel, as that is a horrific little moment, so a child being at the centre of the explosion I can imagine would never have gotten past censors, and I feel like that only the comments that it’s never clear that the child just disappears for the film does fly in the face of that
There's a deleted scene in the movie between Kirk and Spock that included the reveal that Saavik was half-Romulan. Another one in the travel pod indicated that Sulu was up for the command of the Excelsior (even though the model hadn't been designed yet). Furthermore, the Regula 1 space station was a reuse of the Orbital Office Complex from TMP, only turned upside down and with the smaller office modules removed. Additionally, the shot of Spock's casket on Genesis wasn't in the earliest test screening for the movie, and was added for the final release. 🖖😎👍
While I'm loath to defend hollywood on anything, the last entry is nonsense. You cannot simply take the production budget and box office number and say that's what the studio made/didn't make. First the box office has always been split with theater owners, who get a %50 cut of the box office, no ifs ands or buts. Second, besides the production budget there's the marketing budget, which is usually equal to %50-%100 of the production budget, especially for a AAA studio made movie. So yeah 7 mil sounds about right with those numbers, maybe even a little too high actually.
Wow to me that's the shocking thing. I always thought of Star Trek and Wars ultimate sci-fi rivals. But now I see Lucas had an incredible direct impact on the most successful Star Trek Movie.