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@Primeagen , I seen a clip where a creator named , ardens , made a python script , to use AI to visualize the image then type the characters, , then , throttled it down to not get banned. The guy is a mid level dev like me , point is , this technology will become obsolete if you wanna be for real for real , Image recognition and voice recognition with AI , will slam this eventually. I really just am about to make me a slanted board , with just LARGER KEYS , and assisted typing software 🤗😉
Please try that "keyboard"! Sounds very interesting for programming. Chorded keyboards have the problem that they're trained for English words, which often conflicts with programming.
@@DMWatchesRU-vid I've been programming on "dumb phones" with those physical buttons where you have to press a number button multiple times to get a desired character, it was in like 2008. That was still easier than modern smartphones with virtual keyboards where it's hard to hit a correct letter.
Thanks for your interest, always happy to be a 'strong reoccurring character' in anyone's story 😄The article is wrong about my accuracy in that competition; it was 100%, not 76%. The baby version is actually called BabyChorder haha, that video is on the CharaChorder RU-vid channel and my kids love it.
Really cool keyboard! How long/difficult is the learning curve on it? Seems like something you would completely suck at for the first couple of weeks lol
@@be12 Most pass average qwerty speed (40wpm) within 1 month of practice. We have built a free and open source training tool called 'Dot I/O' which utilizes recursive learning algorithms to generate custom tailored practice sessions.
I have been using the Charachorder as my daily driver for a couple of months now. It will definitely take more than a week for you to reach 40WPM. You'll love the ergonomics and lack of finger mobility-you can completely ditch your mouse, even if you already use things like vimium, this takes it to another level in which no app requires you to lift your fingers off of the device.
"my keyboard is too fast for typing competitions" "my keyboard is too good for gaming" is very good marketing. I think he was quite happy with the result...
I don't really believe the gaming one. I'm very active in the smash scene and I've never heard of this, and it definitely would've been blown up if someone was using a unique control scheme and won some tournaments with it.
Basically stenography, I really wonder how it would work for programming, how much you have to either train or configure the 'autocorrect' - I'd be curious to see how well it would work if you simply disabled the auto side and just typed with it.
You type something and stenography engine comes up with the stuff you supposedly wanted to write with 76% success, then you feed it to ChatGePeTe to produce even more unpredictable garbage. The future awaits!
Yeah it could be weird doing programming and/or Vimming with what's essentially an IME, I guess you can just do without the steno part and map every key to just one. 9 fingers in 4 directions, that's probably enough to get most if not all keys. Though it's also interesting that the keyboard itself having no fixed layout combined with Vim having no fixed keybinds creates a 2 free variable situation, which could be weird, if we are going to see more unconventional keyboards in the future, it might be a cool idea for (Neo)Vim to add features that support keycodes to unhook the keybinds to conventional keys entirely.
@@CielMC It's actually nine sticks per hand! Plenty of redundancy in the default layout for functions, especially if you don't need the chord variants for tense or plurality. Vim also discards the need for the dedicated arrow-key sticks and scroll sticks per hand, so there's plenty of room to play with
It's certainly not as effective. With good autocompletion and intellisense actual typing is greatly reduced and rarely require full word typing, which defeats the usage of steno.
As mentioned in other comments, predicting word when typing in english is one thing, predicting variableName is another. Not unthinkable but it would probably need custom software interracting with the LSP. Also, I've seen another channel trying it out and the way chord seemed to be implemented is by typing wrong char, then backspace over the incorrect char and input the proper word. Not sure if its still the case but 1) it would explain the 76% accuracy and 2) it assume backspace rollback 1 char which is not the case with shortcut or vim.
Stenography is actually pretty decent for programming. For example, Plover has special modes where you can basically turn on, say, camel-case mode so that word boundaries won't have spaces and will be capitalized. Search for "Can I use Plover for programming?"
It's not actually "70%" or what he got in the tournament. That number just gets outputed because of the way it inputs characters once you chord. It's actually 100% most of the time because of the chording, unless you're typing the entire wrong words. > Input multiple chars sloppy (artificial inaccuracy) > CharaChorder detects chord > Deletes chars and replaces with word
I mean the chorded typing is basically using macros, which should obviously be banned from any tournament. If there's no easy way to prove someone using this keyboard isn't using macros, might as well just ban the thing.
Wow chat really bunged the cheater poll on this one. Only one 420 and no 69s. Disappointing performance, chat. We'll need to have a talk with your supervisor.
Also just btw I used to type on colmak exclusively and it's amazing but ultimately switched back to qwerty because it became too embarrassing to type in front of my bosses and other higher ups at meetings while looking at my keyboard. Seriously I think it hurt my promotion prospects at one point. I also used an ergodox, still do but I also use a planck at work and laptop board when out and about. I can jugle all of those layouts pretty well now because I switched back to qwerty. On all 3 boards I can hit up to (only) 75 wpm on monkey type. I use the same layering system on the two custom boards. Just wanted to say this so you know you're not alone prime. The transitions were killer and I miss colmak so much but ultimately it has been extremely rewarding to not be tied down to my custom boards. Seriously it's been a stupidly huge improvement in my life I can't recommend it enough. MAYBE one day I will return and try to hold both in my head at once but that would be difficult now that I'm so into neovim. I know that you use Dvorak with neovim with no remaps (basically) but I briefly tried that and it just made my brain hurt. So I guess for me relearning qwerty also gave me back neovim. Definitely worth the trade. Again just wanted to share experience to you from a guy who's basically been in the same spot as you.
Knowing both layouts is pretty viable, I'm mostly on qwerty but when programming I use dvorak, where I do the majority of my typing, I'm mad inconsistent on qwerty cause I don't touch type on it so I get 80-120wpm on good days, and dvorak around 100wpm. I use emacs with evil mode and change the system keyboard layout when entering/leaving insert mode (also means I didn't have to relearn the vim motions on dvorak), I know you can also do something similar with neovim, but if you have a custom board I imagine having a dedicated key to change the layout would better, mostly for portability, like sometimes i want to use/test other text editors (aka helix, neovim) but not having the seamless layout change between normal/insert mode tripes me out, it also being tied to the keyboard instead of the software on a specific machine would make it still viable while using different computers, OS's and so on. I really would recommend trying something like this out, it feels amazing after you get it going
"too embarrassing to type in front of my bosses and other higher ups at meetings" Assuming you touch type on Colemak, confused as to why this is. Are you forced to type on other people's laptops?
I just watched a video on it, it definitely has an unfair advantage in that it auto-comples and auto-corrects based on software it comes with. As far as gaming goes, in order to provide good competition there needs to be a agreed upon standardization. If there is no standardization the competition has a good chance of dying off and will not be fun for the competitors nor the audience. Now, of course there could be a league that has much looser standards on what can be used and maybe people will like that more; similar to how any% is really popular among video game completion competitions.
Looked up a couple of vids trying to code with it and it seems to pair pretty badly with vim's command structure because it frequently "corrects" the commands to real words.
About half a year ago I don't think no one other than Riley has reached "super human" speeds. I'm really curious to see you try to learn it and see how it goes
Imagine this but with APL symbols, where 1 symbol means 1 algorithm... 500WPM let's say means 1000 special characters/minute that with APL's terseness means you can pretty much code up things that are equialent to 1000 line per minute in conventional languages. It would also mean a lot since APL is usually mapped awkwardly to an existing keyboard layout, which means it usually is tiped at 30% efficiency( using Lctrl+Rctrl for them, and a shift on top of that for the second layer and such).
@@mroik yes, and if you don't comment it sufficiently, no one will get it, including you next week. Too bad that those comments are probably longer than equivalent code in most other languages That's not to say there aren't exceptions, but there is a reason it's not widely used. I find it definitely an interesting form of notation, but not very useful for most code. Most functions don't reimplement the game of life after all, most code pushes strings or other data, and APL isn't very good at precisely that
The tennis analogy is funny. Because up until a certain point, there wasn't any rule defining what a tennis racket was. Which, yes, people started showing up with absolutely massive tennis rackets, and they were forced to define a tennis racket.
Steno has a bigger community it would be cool if you would do that, you can technically do it with your own keyboard already no need to buy anything, just search for stenography and steno plover
strager used it for a month and ended up not recommending it for a number of reasons. I don't think it works as well (especially the chording aspect) when you are programming or using Vim.
Oh, please do try it out! I've been looking at getting one for a loooong time, but always feared that it would be a waste of money with vim and the like. Colemak already is a mess to get working for all programs. If you can prove that it works decently well and that the improvements in your speed are significant I'll buy it immediately.
I looked around on RU-vid for people actually typing with the keyboard, and other than TikTok shorts that all seem sus, most videos of people reviewing the keyboard after a month or so of use are typing like 40 WPM. Like, sure if you practice chording a specific sentence you can macro it in so fast that the program tells you 500 WPM. I could write a macro that converts ctrl+z to input the full text of The Count of Monte Cristo but that doesn't mean I can type a million words a minute. Trying to find videos of people typing more than 12 words... none of them are even hitting 100+
It is if it works at all close to how android autocorrect works which pretty much always makes false assumptions about what I want to type in and "corrects" something I already correctly typed in.
I don't think that one week is enough to master this, and I'm not joking. I tried learning stenography and boy that was hard, specially cause I am a native Spanish speaker and steno was meant for English, not Spanish. But anyway, that's completely different than a keyboard layout, you should probably give it like 6 months or so to actually see results, but that would be amazing. Also, idk about charachord, but stenography isn't actually "predictive", it comes with a series of default chords, but if you have to set your own chords for some words that are not in the "dictionary" (as they call your configs). The accuracy is "crap" because you can set a chord to be a word (or sentence), but you can also set that chord, followed by another, to be a different word/sentence
6:51 it's actually worse then that. there are some games where you'll have a mixed environment that the controller players will not only get an aimbot but mouse and keyboard players will get an anti-aimbot. so when you move your mouse over someone's head and click, they will bump the trajectory vector so that you miss.
I know I am late to this, but what, there are games with anti aim, can you give me an example for curiosity sake, I am going to google it to, but that is crazy to me
Looks like the oldfasioned Datahand. Same idea. Cost a lot, and also needs to be trained a lot before you are good at it. I know someone who typed perfectly on it.
SMash tourneys will have their own rules, but often hitbox controllers, ones that replace all analogue controllers with many buttons on a flat surface, are allowed. there are controllers that are objectively more optimal for fighting games, and sometimes they are looked down upon for their competitive advantage, they are allowed in most competition as long as you don't map multiple inputs to 1 button press, as well as some rules for how your controller cleans simultaneous opposite cardinal directions (SOCD). it seems crazy but gamers have been through this rodeo long before this came along. People also are sometimes in favor of it even if only for ergonomic reasons, as nintendo gamecube controllers are nice to use but bad ergonomics
The obvious solution to this is an "open" division where nearly anything goes. This is how shooting competitions work. It's what allows people shooting an m1 garand to have fun with people shooting machine guns to have fun fun at the same time on the same course and competition
Proprietary, closed source, CEO kind of sketchy, inflexible for general typing, can still require a lot of memorization for things like anagram conflicts or keywords in programming. What this thing does really isn't that special. You could make it yourself and probably make it better. You'd be better off just building your own keyboard, putting QMK/ZMK on it, and getting good with the layout and layers. Maybe throw in some combos for really common stuff.
Okay, so i just looked up the video of him winning a smash bros tournament, and it looks like it was an in game randomly selected tournament, not a paid tournament like in the competitive scene of smash. As someone who has won a few tournaments, I can't think of a reason why this device would be better than a regular controller unless he was using macros to do something physically impossible. And then, in Ultimate, even macros wouldn't be super helpful if you don't have the fundamentals. It does seem like an interesting device for general computing and typing, and I'm very interested in getting one. However, i would to see footage of him playing.
I don’t like all the weird keyboard, if that can save on the keyboard then is ok.I don’t want to have software on the background to be able to type, because I need to use different computer all the time, that will be frustrating and impossible.
So just from taking a Quick Look at the characorder the issue is there’s a processor inside that seems to essentially alter your input aka if you hit all the keys simultaneously it will spell the work properly aka there’s post processing going on and at that point I think it’s cheating essentially macros
I don't think that he should be trying to compete in typing tournaments with the thing as it's not the same skill being used. On a different note the general consensus for controllers in fighting game tournaments is that they can only have the same amount of buttons as a regular gamepad.
I think for tournaments, the keyboard shouldn't be allowed. As tournaments are regulated. But, for world records, I think it should be allowed. As when you do world records you use any advantage you use. An example is holding your breath. They breathe pure oxygen to hold their breathe longer. But, there's also separate records for non-oxygen. So maybe records with and without this specific keyboard?
My biggest beef with that keyboard is the claim that it's banned for being too fast. It's not banned for being too fast it's banned because it's macroing
nobody answered to you, but I think that stenography is just that. I'm not really sure about the differences between one or the other, but there's the openstenoproject, you might try it (but believe me, it's not as easy as learning the vim bindings, it takes a really long time)
So you're telling me he tried posting a score of 500wpm on the leaderboard, but in another competition he was only able to do 276 at 76% accuracy... Sounds like he was actually cheating on monkeytype. Also, how fast does the average human even read english words? (according to google the average reading speed is 238wpm) So to get a score of 500wpm on monkey type he not only read more than double the speed of the average english reader, he typed 500wpm at the same time.. Sounds like he tried to cheat and get his name on the leaderboard for advertisement.
They can just make the tennis court larger!!! Others are going to suffer, but it's nothing new, poor computers and cheap keyboards also exist before the change.
