Ahsoka contradicts herself a shocking amount throughout TCW 👀 Here's our Patreon link: / alibi_me We would immensely appreciate your support! 💕 #ahsokatano #theclonewars #meme
For real, it is such a moronic idea to have a fourteen-year-old in command. The Jedi in general should not have been treated as military superiors. It doesn't make sense.
@@OmegaCT55555 I mean, peacekeeping *can* mean fighting in some cases, which is why Jedi carry the most powerful weapon in existence, so they can effectively put an end to conflict, BUT I highly doubt they're taught military strategy or anything like that, so they should not be the ones in command.
@@OmegaCT55555In the EU thats was Palpatine desires. Putting the Jedi as generals they would became more arrogant and lose their main philosophy of peace...Palpatine made the Jedi do a lot of evil things in the name of the Republic. Palpatine twisted the Jedi from inside. And Ahsoka as general sucks. Ahsoka was a poorly writen character to fill the gaps, but we had the Clone Wars multimedia project and clone Wars animation that was much better than TCW.
I guess that happens when you have a episodic and anthological series. I won’t say you’re wrong, but I don’t think Ahsoka was necessarily written badly, it’s just the clone wars show had a lot of writers and directors that contradicted each other. And it’s not just Ahsoka it was all the characters. Mace Windu is a cool character in the movies, but in a a lot instances he’s portrayed as a chump zealot, but when he’s given his own solo stories, he’s a completely different character.
Yeah, inconsistency is rampant throughout the series. Having a lot of writers/creators all contradicting each other is a great recipe for bad writing, honestly. It was the same with the Star Wars sequels.
Many writers or one. I don't think it's decisive about the story will be good or not. More than on writers can have the advantege of different perspectives if they work together well.
1) The contradictions are not shown to be intentional; the narrative entirely ignores them. I assume you have had people comment on your contradictions, or you've even admitted it yourself, but no characters ever comment on Ahsoka's. 2) Characters are not real people. Solid characterization requires reasonable consistency. I explain it in Part 1 of our "How to Develop Characters" series, if you're interested in learning more. ~ M.E.
Obi Wan hahahah ah he gets it now Qui Gon sigh i think my Master may have been right Dooku what a waste of potential such powerful force users but most of them are clowns so uncivilized Yoda i may have Royally F***** up 5 Generations of Jedi
As soon as I saw the title, I knew I was going to enjoy this. I wonder what kind of mental gymnastics the Ahsoka fanatics are going to come up with when they see this video. But yeah, she’s just as inconsistent as the show is. Edit: Well I called it, Ahsoka fanatics are rushing to the comments section already doing a bunch of mental gymnastics to defend their goddess.
If anything this further emphasizes that she really was just a child. I see myself in that. When I was her age I was CONSTANTLY switching up my decisions.
@@mackenzy.mp4 Ahsoka isn’t a child. She’s a teen. And she is not a teenager from our world. She is a teenager who was part of the Jedi order ever since she was a toddler. Age doesn’t guarantee who you are and how you will be in your life. You must have made inconsistent decisions because you are you. It’s not just her decisions. Who she is also inconsistent and it changes for the sake of the plot. It would be fine if there was an explanation. But there never is a good explanation. And age is not an excuse. And this doesn’t work for Ahsoka because she is supposed to be a character who goes on a journey of growth supposedly. But she keeps being so inconsistent and falling back throughout all of her existence. Inconsistency does not work when you want your character to really get somewhere. Especially if it never stops.
@@mackenzy.mp4 I never said there can’t be a variety of personality. But I do not think the Jedi order counts as a religion because it is based on something proved to be real. Ahsoka did not necessarily need to be a stereotypical Jedi. But at least one who actually respects and follows their values. And she could have had a nice sense of humor instead of being disrespectful. Not to mention the Jedi do have expectations one must follow if you want to be part of this order. And Ahsoka has violated many of them. She should have been kicked out long ago. Or at the very least go through meaningful consequences. Instead of a short instance that never affects her in the long run.
Thank you for this. I’ve been saying for ages that TCW is not well written if you look at it critically, especially when it comes to characterization. Everyone has only enough personality to suit the plot and becomes inconsistent when that original personality is not convenient for the plot. What’s worse is their favoritism towards ahsoka compromises every other character’s personality, motivations and abilities, making them illogical to prop up ahsoka. Then the whole story ends up bending to ahsoka so that no real arc can ever take place, even when she’s about to learn some valuable lesson). Another thing the (incompetent) writing does that goes over most peoples heads is how safe they play it with characters they want you to like. they do this with anakin so much so they won’t even give him a real arc (it somehow becomes Ahsoka’s arc so they never have to actually do a deep dive into Anakin’s emotions for fear it will make him (gasp) unlikable). You only see the most superficial personality traits of anakin displayed only for entertainment purposes (for example: when he gets angry, impulsive, reckless, it is only because it looks cool. They’ll never look into the underlying issues of these behaviors like they do in the movies). TCW compromises real character work to the point that there’s no logical reason for the cartoon Anakin to turn. He displays no psychological inner turmoil that would drive someone down a dark path. In fact, turning him into the cool guy completely absolves him of the very necessary quality that makes him fall - insecurity. Hence, they now have to make the Jedi look incompetent too, and even then their reasoning does not make sense. The show ultimately has a real problem with giving the characters realistic motivation, so they keep the storylines fairly shallow to avoid having to come up with answers. An example of this is when anakin finds padme and Clovis. They don’t want to answer for any of the characters’ intent - is anakin dealing with feelings of insecurity of his wife with another man? Is it because of their marriage being a secret, he feels he has no control over what goes on in his own home? Does that conjure up feelings of inadequacy? Or is it the fact that a man was forcing himself on his wife and he felt a need to protect her from literal sexual assault? They don’t answer this. Because the latter would not be able to show the surface level approach of “oh something dark came over me and I snapped” because obviously it is actually very reasonable to get angry at sexual assault. And also it just looks cool to see anakin beating up another man and we really want to put that in the show without thinking too hard about the dialogue. If they did actually think the scene through they would realize how utterly ridiculous it is to have him say “I saw you about to kiss him” and have her “regret” it while also showing the audience that she was yelling “no.” But who cares about details, the scene looks “cool”
I feel like the series is aiming for something "deep" a lot of the time, but the creators can't be bothered to put in the effort necessary to actually make something that's both coherent and meaningful. It's so much wasted opportunity, smh
@@imyouralibi6208 yeah and that’s exactly why there are no real arcs. Because in order to have an arc, the characters must face repercussions for certain feelings they acted on, which inspires change (whether good or bad). The writers would have to delve into the point of the feelings and how it is channeled through behavior. You’ve shown this a lot in your videos: ahsoka (and most of the characters) cannot evolve because there is no consequences. They are not impacted by their decisions and mistakes - not long term and not in any real way. Any experience they have is forgotten by the next episode (even in chronological order). The repercussions of their choices is what builds character growth.
Ashoka is a child, she is very contradictory and is in wartime, it's even worse when her master is Anakin Skywalker who would soon become Darth Vader. The point of the show was to explain the clone wars , not build character growth and that's what the show did and it's arcs were Amazing idk what's your problem "plot convince" I can say this about Young Justice and JLU doesn't make them bad , does it ?
@@user-lp8im7ow8s the contradictions are not a character flaw they are a writing flaw because the tone/narrative of the show doesn’t support it being intentional. An example: her being against the Jedi helping Palpatine in season 7, only to contradict herself and worry for Palpatine because the writers wanted to give her the “good lines” even though they are incongruent with the feelings she had prior. Ahsoka is not an ordinary child, she has been in the Jedi temple since she was three. That is a very important detail because it means she was equipped with the early life discipline of a Jedi (exactly what Anakin did not have; hence, he turned to the dark side). Ahsoka is supposed to embody the religion of a Jedi (and why they are taken so young in the first place). They have spent their lives dedicated to this higher purpose. So she should have been trained in mental resilience to not succumb to the dark personality traits that anakin has. In fact, she should be able to resist those impulses because early life discipline is what aids self-control. It’s exactly why anakin was too old to be trained. He did not have this discipline in his most formative years; he grew up in chaos. The entirety of the prequels is that Anakin was not trained to get a handle on his emotions early enough to give his life over to such a enlightened cause like serving the galaxy. It’s his ordinary human-ness that is his downfall, giving into the qualities that a Jedi would overcome (such as jealousy, fear, insecurity, anger, revenge, possessiveness). For ahsoka to be influenced by him would contradict her entire life’s teachings. And it wouldn’t work as an excuse because the show clearly gave her these illogical personality traits before she met anakin.
@@imyouralibi6208 Hm. Perhaps you’re right. I’m still a beginner when it comes to writing stories so there’s still things I’m working on. I try my best to remain consistent.
Well I’m not sure about you, but I’ve met plenty of kids and teenagers who are not contradictory like you say. Maybe there are a few who are, but it isn’t because of their age. It is more likely because of their personality, mentality, issues, and the way they were raised. Being a kid or even a teenager does not dictate what kind of person you will be.
@@imyouralibi6208 yea, but well written contradictory characters make characters more realistic and relatable for audiences, and make more room for character growth. I respectfully disagree that it’s a very important part of writing.
NGI, i’m kind of like this. Indecisive, forgettable, bipolar (Even tho Ahsoka isn’t bipolar) And I constantly contradict myself. Maybe the writers were trying to do something more realistic and different? Since she is a minor, I guess it kind of makes sense but I digress
Although real people can be (or at least seem) random, characters should be constructed with reasonable consistency. That's true even when writing a neurodivergent or mentally ill character. (Obviously, their consistency will look different than a neurotypical character's consistency.) If being contradictory is intentionally part of a character, it should be acknowledged by the narrative/other characters. *That* would be realistic. (I think it's safe to assume you have had people comment on your contradictions, and/or you've even admitted it yourself.) But Ahsoka's contradictions are entirely ignored by the narrative, herself, and other characters. Which suggests that it was not intentional, and thus just more evidence of bad writing. ~ M.E.
Idk thought the video was funny, but um idk in my personal opinion charackters contradicting themselves is not bad writing, id say in Ahsokas Arc its more of a sign of her inmaturity. Didnt Expect so many people here hating her tbh.
It's good writing if it enhances the story/character. But these constant contradictions only detract from Ahsoka's character by undermining the beliefs/personality the narrative *wants* us to think she has. I'm also surprised you would label it as immaturity since most people claim Ahsoka "grows" over the course of the series, yet these contradictions appear right up until the end of Season 7.
@@imyouralibi6208 she grows, but that doesn't mean she is perfect, I'd argue these still appear but not as often or the ones that do appear reinforce other traits, the one you are mentioning en here so often, is one of them. She acts this way in front of the prisoner because in her eyes there is no way the jedi could be the bad guys, and she just killed alot of them. That and also her being there with anakin and a desire to impress him, as well as simply not knowing how actual people people, live their lives. But yk i don't have the time to argue atm so agree to disagree or something.
@@timoth4529 Oh, I was hoping you might be open to a conversation, but if you're busy, that's understandable. Though, when you get the chance, could you maybe explain what scenes you were referring to by "She acts this way in front of the prisoner" and "her being there with anakin and a desire to impress him" because I have no idea 😅
@@_vez Nope - she's badly written because her personality changes randomly from scene to scene with no explanation whatsoever. Nor does she develop over the course of the show.
@@imyouralibi6208 They literally aren't. Did you watch any of the clips you uploaded? The vast majority of these are people giving Ahsoka advice or orders, only for her to obviously go against them. Some of these clips aren't even that, just random scenes where she doesn't act the way you want her to, I guess?
@@JP-yf2fk Okay, I'm getting the strong impression you didn't pay very much attention to the video. What part of Ahsoka disobeying numerous orders doesn't contradict her claim that she can follow orders? What part of Ahsoka blatantly going against the teachings of the Jedi doesn't contradict her claim that the Jedi values are sacred to her? What part of her refusing to help people in need on several occasions doesn't go against her claim that you should help people in need *no matter what* ? Etc. Etc. Etc. At least have the decency to actually pay attention to the video before commenting.
@@imyouralibi6208 She says she *can* follow orders. That's pretty clearly a deliberate choice of words to show that she doesn't always follow them. Teachings are not the same as values. And when does she actually refuse to help someone in need?
@@JP-yf2fk "That's pretty clearly a deliberate choice of words to show that she doesn't always follow them" Sure, that's *your* interpretation. Doesn't mean my face value interpretation is suddenly moot. "Teachings are not the same as values" Seriously? Are we really gonna start splitting hairs? Anyway, if you still can't be bothered to pay attention to the video, then I'm not gonna waste my time. Goodbye.
@@imyouralibi6208 Yeah, the original depiction of the Clone Wars in the Dark Horse comics was far more inline with the movies. Especially when it comes to Anakin and his relationship with the council. Not to mention how characters like Ventress and Grievious were handled far better in the Dark Horse comics
@@Alexzander1989 For sure. It's honestly hilarious to watch people try to pretend that the 2008 Clone Wars is somehow so perfectly in line with the films. And yes, especially in the case of Grievous, comparing the 2003 and 2008 versions is like night and day. Give me the unstoppable killing machine any day over the laughably useless coward who can't even defeat younglings in a duel.
@@imyouralibi6208 Oh yeah, don’t get me started on how they fucked up Grievous… or them constantly running into Dooku… 🤦🏻♂️ The funny thing too is that the Dark Horse comics had events of the war chronicled to the month, so we knew when certain events or battles take place. And it felt like an actual war with both side gaining and losing territory and the Republic struggling in the beginning. There is no such thing with the Filoni Wars, we have no idea how the war is going or when things take place. Kenobi even flat out says “How is it we can win every battle yet still be losing the war?” I don’t know Kenobi, Feloni doesn’t seem to wanna tell us 🤷♂️
Thank you so much!! 🥰 Yeah, the writing was on the wall as far back as 2008. There's little hope for Star Wars now, especially after Filoni's promotion 😞
I guess all teenagers are whiny brats. Age is definitely an excuse for someone’s behavior I guess. In all seriousness, nobody acts like this just because they are a teenager. I can confirm as a former 14 year old and a current teenager that I acted far better than Ahsoka ever has. Yes I was mean to certain people, but only when they gave me a reason to not be nice to them. Like if they were mean to me or other people. I actually respected my elders, and did not think I knew everything. Ahsoka is not supposed to be an ordinary teenager either. She had been a part of the Jedi order since she was about 3 years old. If their values mean so much to her, she would have never had such a behavior when we met her. And Anakin is not the reason for her behavior. Since the TCW movie makes it clear she was already meant to be like that. And I thought people keep saying she grew as a person? Here I see that someone is quickly falling back to the excuse that “she’s only a teenager” and just forget about her supposed “growth”.
@@bravestraven4650 She's a Teenager and does grow throughout the series. She is a flawed character and that's okay. And no, you didn't. Because you didn't have her shoes to fill.
@@_vez I'm sorry, but she definitely did not grow throughout the series. This video provides only a taste of how blatant her lack of growth is. But if you want to see a more in-depth breakdown of the issue, my sister has an entire video series on Ahsoka's lack of growth.
@@_vez Well, how convenient of you to remind yourself she “grew up” after being reminded. And yet you’re stuck between making excuses for her because she’s a teenager and that she still grew up. Flaws does not mean growth should be hindered and as inconsistent as shown here. She’s supposed to grow past them. And she certainly did not fill in her shoes well at all. And I have no reason to lie to you about my life. You don’t even know me well enough to assume you know me better than I know myself. I’m just not a walking teenage stereotype. How is that so hard to believe?
As you should! Never let anyone or anything change how you feel about a character! Unless that character is a bad person. Then rethink things. But for the most part yes! Still love Ahsoka! I still do! She’s one of my favorite Star Wars characters!
It’s really not her fault that her Master (the only one who was REALLY her “role model” or who she looked up to) was always showing overconfidence. Anakin did the opposite of what he taught her pretty much all of the time (being a hypocrite and “contradicting” himself). She quite literally had to overcome these flaws by becoming independent later in the saga. I do agree that she made some bad decisions, but she was in a developmental stage throughout all of TCW. This really helps highlight her maturity later. The difference that Ahsoka asserted was that she cared, truly cared about everyone.
You really can't blame Anakin because Ahsoka's personality was what it was from the moment she stepped onscreen. And she never showed any admiration for Anakin, except perhaps in throwaway lines. She constantly looked down on him. What maturity? Ahsoka is exactly the same character from the beginning to the end of the series. She doesn't undergo any growth whatsoever. And she most certainly isn't shown to care about others.
@@CrjF1010 By "her show" I'm assuming you mean the AHSOKA series? I haven't watched it but I've seen in-depth reviews so I'd say I have a pretty good grasp on it. And yes, I've seen Rebels. Just started rewatching it some time ago though I'm currently only halfway through Season 1.
@@CrjF1010 I mean, did you miss the part of this video where she literally refuses to help people in need? And I'm hardly inclined to believe she cares about the clones in general given how quick she is to turn on them on multiple occasions. She beat the crap out of clones when she was on the run and sicced Maul on them once Order 66 was in effect. Not to mention the numerous times she willfully endangered her clone squads by acting like a reckless, overconfident idiot (despite being warned of imminent danger).
Cant say i like ahsoka but damn I clicked of this channel and its actually sad lmao why do you have 3000 videos on why you hate a fictional character 😭😭😭
I'm not even sure such a bizarre exaggeration on your part even deserves a serious answer, but here goes: 1. Ahsoka is a character who appears in about half the episodes of a seven-season-long series, meaning there's a lot of content to analyze, so obviously it's going to take more than one video. 2. Building on the last point, there are also multiple aspects of her character that need to be addressed. Again, that obviously can't be covered in one video. 3. Ahsoka fans are stubborn as hell and need things spelled out for them in multiple different ways. So that, again, can't be done in just a single video. Not to mention, there are really no other channels covering these issues, so we don't have the luxury (like most RU-vidrs) of just directing our audience to other channels that discuss these topics.
I’m a fan of Ahsoka but I find this video extremely accurate. Ahsoka is flawed, extremely so. But her growth in my opinion is brilliant. She stops contradicting herself as much coming season 7. I think the circumstances matter for these too though. When she was framed for murder she wasn’t getting listened to. She listened to the other girl. It makes sense that Ahsoka in this case would prefer to run. Besides, people contradict themselves all the time. I think the “don’t I always?” Is sarcastic. Her growth is definitely slow but isn’t everyone’s? She definitely has a sort of fight with her personality before and her personality after her growth. So she sometimes goes with 1 or the other.
I mean, this video shows that she contradicts herself just as much in S7. And there's a bunch of examples from throughout the series that I didn't even include because they would require more context and ultimately wreck the fast pacing of the video. Also, when she was framed she literally didn't even give anyone a chance to hear her out. Anakin tried to see her but was turned away, though he was literally coming back with Rex to make sure he'd be let through when Ahsoka broke out of prison. She didn't even wait for the trial. And even after breaking out, Anakin, Obi-Wan, and Plo Koon were still clearly on her side. But she didn't give any of them a chance to help her. Anakin literally begged her come back and make her case to the council. He begged her to let him help. But she refused. Even after she was brought back and finally put on trial, she wouldn't tell anyone anything. She was purposefully cryptic when the council asked her questions and held back vital information which could've cleared her name. So her actions really don't make sense at all, it just makes her seem self-sabotaging. Though the narrative just ignores this clear flaw in her behavior and paints her as courageous instead. And character flaws need to be acknowledged/dealt with by the narrative, otherwise they can't really be considered as true flaws. Anyway, while I agree that people do contradict themselves, nobody contradicts themselves *that* much unless they're incredibly fickle. Not to mention, fictional characters can't be viewed/treated as real people. A character needs to be consistent in order to be well-written. "some of these are people telling her not to do something and her doing it, that isn’t really a contradiction" I had this conversation with another commenter and I'd really rather not rehash it, but I'll clarify again that all the examples I used are *clearly* instances of Ahsoka contradicting her own words/actions.
@@imyouralibi6208 how was she cryptic? And sure she didn’t want to come back but it was only because she knew that “this is a military operation” and solving it on her own made more sense to her. Plo and Obi didn’t do anything to seek her out from what I remember, they were on her side sure but they weren’t there. Anakin was and Ahsoka probably should’ve tried to talk to him, I agree but Plo and Obi, though I love them, didn’t reach out. Characters exist because of people. Characters need to be like people. Contradictions are something that give characters psychological complexity, a lot of good characters have contradictions. Zuko for example. Tons of characters, good characters have contradictions. A character shouldn’t always have the same exact reaction to something. They should have different reactions and that’s what makes Ahsoka interesting to me. She has different reactions. But a lot of her reactions have one theme: selflessness. You can see that right? As the series goes on she tries to save as many people as she can. So she at least has continuity in one big trait, being selfless.
@@gailasprey7787 When asked about Ventress, all Ahsoka said was, "We had a mutual understanding." And beyond that, all she really said was that she wasn't guilty. That's hardly being forthcoming. “this is a military operation” I have no idea what you're referring to. And if Ahsoka thought she could solve things on her own, then quite frankly, she was an idiot. All she did was make herself look more guilty. FYI, Plo helped lead the search for Ahsoka after she broke out. And neither he nor Obi-Wan should have needed to "reach out" in the first place. Ahsoka should've gone to trial like she was supposed to, and they would've heard her out there. Can you offer any examples of Zuko being contradictory as you claim? We must have watched a different series, because Ahsoka most certainly is not portrayed as a "selfless" character. Quite the opposite. And it's actually pretty ironic that you claim "As the series goes on she tries to save as many people as she can" because her last act in the series is literally causing the deaths of thousands. She releases Maul, tells him explicitly to "go cause chaos" and him doing so causes the ship they are on to crash and kill everyone onboard aside from Rex and Ahsoka. That's hardly the mark of a selfless character, especially since she later tries to paint herself as completely faultless, claiming she doesn't want to hurt/kill the clones when her actions led to all their deaths. I would recommend watching Part 2 of our video series on How To Develop Characters since we discuss there how Ahsoka's character is clearly established as one more self-serving rather than selfless.
Do you say this about channels that are constantly positive about Ahsoka? Or do you praise those channels? Not a Gotcha btw, as I genuinely don't know. If you do though, you show clear double standards, but if not, then your stance makes sense.
@@ECSOrder66 I havent come across any channels doing this, I clicked on this video as I thought it would be a funny silly video and then got weird vibes half way through that its literally just hate, clicked their channel and its just videos upon videos of weird ahsoka slander. If i come across a channel blindly praising characters for videos upon end it'd also be very weird and obsessive. Just like how this channel is
@@user-yh7gr5fb4q Not really hate, just writing critique. The point was to show the bad writing of her character. As a reminder, the reason this channel is "obsessive" with Ahsoka, is because the moment they realized Ahsoka is a bad character, everyone ganged up on them, even after presenting evidence for their claims. As a result, they try hardest to show the fanbase that Ahsoka is a bad character through their videos. To a new viewer, it's obsessive, but when you have context, it does make sense.
@@ECSOrder66 I just scrolled back 4 years to look at some of their first hate videos, everyone agreed with them about their opinions, everyone also bashed Ahsoka & her fanbase... so I'm a little confused as it seems they are very much just a Ahsoka hater hence the constant posts for over 4 years. You can dislike a character without having to put her into most videos you make. There are very much so worse characters they could have focused on but they specifically focus on one of the more liked characters. It really screams that they are trying to rage bait or something along those lines which isn't working, as they just come across as biased which I'm assuming is why their channel hasn't grown at all in the past 5 years. "Moment they realised Ahsoka is a bad character" That's their opinion, which they have used as an excuse to just bash.
@@user-yh7gr5fb4q Their first "hate videos" as you call it CLEARLY say word-for-word "She's annoying now, but don't worry, she gets better" 2 videos that I found in which they said that are the first episode of the Ryloth Arc, and the episode where Ahsoka threatens Nute Gunray's life. There are more, but I'm lazy. So either you aren't watching the videos, or you're only hearing what you want to hear. "You can dislike a character without using her in most videos you make" Tell it to the fans who got pissy that their favorite character isn't well-written. If the fans weren't so arrogant, the sisters wouldn't need to make so many videos just to nail it into the fanbase's dense head. Very few agreed with them. Just look at the Ahsoka meme videos they made, including this one! Or look at how if an entire comments section is only those who do agree with them, the comments are only up to 5-10 people. Out of millions of fans. So many fans of the show ganged up on her even after she presented evidence.
