Minor correction that I also posted to the Discord, but the height of a dead player (unless crushed) is actually 14. As such, not every small gap is passable by a dead player. In fact, if the height were 0, the Icon of Sin method would probably work, but most death slides would not because 0-height players cannot trigger lines. Furthermore, a zero-height player doesn't even need a gap to go through things and would go through solid walls too, as long as there isn't too high of a height difference. But, with no ability to trigger lines, this is all but useless. :P
Is the height of a crushed monster (crushed by a door after dying) 0? Because when I was young I had fun with ghost (noclip) monsters that got crushed and resurrected :p.
I'm generally unfamiliar with Doom terms, so here's my stupid question: why is ability to trigger lines crucial to "route" attacks to the Icon as described?
@@Red_was_The_Imposter um..stronger in the sense it can produce more enemies, i guess... But by that logic, A pain elemental is stronger than a Cyberdemon as well? Doesn't a Cyber have a life of, like, 3,000? 🙃🤓 Edit: i just double checked, it's 4,000 hit points lol
@@expendableround6186 No. The bottom line is most people just play video games for entertainment. They don't give a shit about some guy who spent years practicing Doom.
If AI ever truly achieves self-awareness and decides to eliminate humans, there won't be a resistance like in the Terminator franchise bravely fighting back against all odds, because all the odds will be calculated and thoroughly manipulated. It'll be humans vs TASbots. Absolutely hopeless.
It’s honestly really poetic how, in order to finish doom 2 pacifist, you need to sacrifice yourself and die to kill the icon of sin. Basically you’re given the choice: do you give up now and give up your pacifism, rendering the past troubles of your playthrough useless? Or do you do the ultimate and permanent deed of having to die in order to prove your cause. I just thought it was really interesting
All such things are possible, you just need the right tools. Doom's code has routines that render the view of the area from given point. Player is visible just like NPCs (otherwise multiplayer wouldn't be possible). Then there's the code that determines what's going where, etc. The tool just needs to use all that to follow the demo and position at the cyberdemon for rendering.
Imagine coming so close to victory only to have your hopes crushed by a random idiot lost soul after *179 ATTEMPTS,* yet still having the willpower to keep going for another *650 TRIES.*
@@coincident so, will you make such more videos again? sorry i'm being annoying with encouraging you to upload stuff, but in my opinion you are one of the best doomtubers around, and tbh? I think that you are even better than some of your inspiring figures.
@@yoya8373 Thank you so much for the compliment! 😃 There is another cyan video in the works but it has been a LOT of work; even more work than this one. I wanted it to be ready before the end of the year, but I don't know if I'll be able to meet that goal. But anyway: yes there will be more, soon 😎
Of note is that the reason Pleymo could influence the lost soul's movement was because he was punching. Lost souls forget their targets after completing their charge attack, and will target the player instead if they made a sound. Even though punching with your fist is actually silent, it still technically counts as making a sound, so the lost souls would immediately began to chase Playmo after attacking the cyberdemon.
Love how, though you can see the muzzle flashes on the Cyberdemon's arm, when the video's slowed down it's clear the rockets are coming out of his crotch XD
Great video, coincident. I had seen the Pleymo video but your explanation gives me more understanding of the details of the strategy involved. It seems terribly harsh when archviles are spawned by an Icon of Sin because it's difficult to find cover, but if they weren't ever spawned we would miss out on the pacifist possibilities entirely.
Holy shit the dedication that goes into these specialisation is absoltely mesmerizing. And to tell about it like it's science is also very impressive 👌. You deserved a subscription my man
I've been playing the Icon since 95 on my PC, and I now play it daily since my 4 year old loves the game and level. I've gotten more than one Arch-Vile plenty of times. This is possible folks.
More than one, sure. But how about 30? All on the top floor? Without dying to any other monster that may or may not spawn on the other floors? Then again, I hope you're being sarcastic, because that's hard to tell on the internet, especially with some of the people that roam it.
technically a TAS is also made by human hand, just with access to to tools like frame advance, memory viewers, etc. that's why it's called a "Tool *ASSISTED* Speedrun", as the player is only assisted by the tools, not replaced.
As a recreational TASer, I have a quick correction on one of your visuals in this video, a TAS is actually made by a human. The inputs are just manipulated frame by frame, and using many tools, such as save states, rewinds, frame advance, and memory watch (a ram viewer)
I just want to help eliminate the myth TASes are created by computers. Very occasionally, very small windows, (maybe 50 frames) are calculated out by a computer for optimal time. All the possible variation in an entire TAS is just so exponentially huge that having a computer solve one that's just around 5 minutes long would take probably decades if not centuries.
I just find it fascinating how players can build tool assisted speed runs But damm that strategy for the icon of sin in doom 2 is simply incredible, if anyone does pull it off, I reckon it will be one of the greatest gaming achievements ever 👍
Great video. The ingenuity and infinite patience of Doom gods like Pleynmo and Zero Master never ceases to amaze me. Just subscribed to your excellent channel.
It should be mentioned that Romero's head has a very short height that doesn't match its sprite, so that is why it is impossible for any monster projectiles (ones that don't do splash damage) to hit it.
Persistent and dedication.... I think that first of all these words refer to those who were able to complete Okuplok without save/load, spending more than 5 hours on it. Where practically any mistake ruined the whole run.
As a kid, I thought it said "I am Emulix and welcome to the end of the world". It was probably 10 years later before I learned it was reversed audio lol
Heh, I see you'll probably use cyan thumbnail for future videos. I think this also involves Lost Souls having the mechanic of hitting something and turn to you in order to manipulating the movement. Also, that 248 damages attempt, I think rocket deals fixed amount of damage according to the distance to the center, so probably it's not random (after thought: maybe it's a random event that the Lost Soul is in a weird angle, so the rocket didn't hit the dead center of the wall.)
Precisely - the randomness has to do with slight angle variations that make the explosion be a bit away from the center and splash damage being reduced due to distance.
Sorry, I didn't explain myself well. It's what you described in your parenthesis: the randomness comes from the lost soul movement alone. If the lost soul is not completely aligned with the center of the brain, the rocket goes inside with a slight angle variation, and hits a corner of the wall, instead of the center. So there's a greater distance between the center of the explosion and the center of the icon of sin, and the splash damage is lower.
I'm always surprised people seem not to know this. You can shoot rockets at Romeros head from the uppermost level if without having to stand on the moving pillar.
Funny how the Plutonia Icon looks deliberately designed to be killable in just that way yet no one pulled it off until 24 years later when Eternal, the game that brought back the Icon, was the big new Doom thing.
Actually there is way to hit icon of sin on pacifist other than this. 1. go on the pillar 2 wait until there is cacodemon slightly higher than you 3. let him shoot at angle pointing downwards 4. dodge and let the shot hit the icon, because shot is done in angle it can hit nonetheless possibility of anyone pulling it off is infinitesimal
decino tested that scenario extensively in one of his yellow videos. There is no angle in which that would work. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-nlk022mO83k.html
how come I missed this amazing video of yours! saw something similar about pleymo achievement, but not this one. untill now.. also I just realized you finally got the subs you deserve.. keep the work up!
Hey blob! Thanks for the comment! In case you missed it; there's a second analysis video that I released just last week: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IYz6-KnvWU.html
@@coincident yea the infamous bug, actually I just kept a demo in my latest playing of doomzero, where a chaingunner ignores pain and survives several bullets and... oh well. guess what I discovered pressing G on map. I always knew about the grid, never knew the use. You never stop to learn new stuff- even tho I dislike all the "new era strats" like glides, etc...
@@coincident that's another reason for which I only record uv max, or uv fast demos. Btw I have a little spare time for a couple days and I'm testing the viddump on my channel... Its simply great, I wish I had used it in past moments 🤦🏻♂️
Revenants can't kill The Icon of Sin, they don't deal splash damage with their rockets, hence why the Pacifist tactic in Doom II uses Arch-viles, they're the only enemy that can be summoned that deals splash damage.
On regards to map30, I'm no speedrunner but I think "impossible via human hands" is tough to say about speedrunning. I've heard times being impossible so many times and I've seen so many games with WRs being only frames apart that I feel like there could be some sort of multi frame perfect strategy that exists out there. There must be a little bit of slack when it comes to rng calls and the like to be able to manipulate the table, considering things are so rigid in regards to how the rng works. Maybe I'm just being hopeful but I think it would be worth it to lab that level with a real time rng table open. If mario speedruns can be as down to the wire as they are, I think doom runners could figure out some sort of strategy, perhaps external cues, visual or audio, that could result in making archviles appear with somewhat greater odds. Probably not worth the pain though lmao
an insane feat! very well made and edited video one question on that - how’d you get the view from the cyberdemon area of the things happening? it’s not “camera” flying around it seems, as doomguy is there. either 2 player, or most likely a demo?
Thanks! Yeah it's from the demo of Pleymo's run. When playing back a demo in dsda-doom, there's a keybind to change the "camera mode", and you can scout around the map and see stuff from any perspective.
