Beginners Guide to Building a Thief Rogue in Dungeons and Dragons 5e 

The thief is probably the only subclass in the game that encourages you to mess with and or search for mundane equipment. I mean the amount of stuff you can do is actually crazy because you can literally become a semi-controller while still having normal actions like attacking and what not. You can never underestimate what a bag full of ball bearings, caltrops, flasks of oil and acid can do. Heck, even the artificer until 10th level has no actual motivation to use normal equipment and even then he only gets encouragement to mess with magical items!

It looks like that 15 went rogue. 😂😂

First-timer friend: I want to play D&D. Me: Okay, here’s Dungeon dudes playlist.

I like taking healer feat as a theif so the "use an object" as a bonus action turns you into a combat medic!

When talking about Hiding as a Bonus Action, I think Kelly missed the opportunity to talk about his Lightfoot Halfling's Naturally Stealthy ability and when he might or might not be able to use that. I'm currently playing the pre-rolled Halfling Thief from Lost Mines of Phandelver, and my DM has let me hide behind bigger characters during fights as long as the monster is reasonably distracted by the fighting. Curious on how other DMs might rule that.

Seeing these new beginner friendly tutorials is really cool! I'm pretty familiar with the game myself but I have some dnd-noob-friends that will definetly be using these video's to help them get started!

While the rules on hiding are 'up to the DM', it's important to keep game balance in mind. Before TCE gave Rogues access to Steady Aim, hiding with your bonus action was the primary way to generate advantage for your *one* attack per round that you get. The best way to look at the 'hiding behind a rock' scenario is NOT the Skyrim-logic of "You don't know where I am". At your table, if you want to pop out, stab someone, and then run away and hide, you COULD look at it as the hiding retroactively making your previous actions that quick and stealthy that the enemy didn't know where you were, but more practically... Regardless of whether the enemy knows where you are or not, being hidden means they cannot 'clearly see you', and gives you that advantage on attacks. That's all it means. An enemy *can* always just walk around the rock and 'clearly see you' to break your stealth, but if they are engaged with your fighter/paladin/barbarian friend, doing this whack a mole strategy just means you're so quick and sneaky with your attacks that they cannot easily react to you popping in and out of cover, and that's why you have advantage. If an enemy wants to pursue the rogue who is hiding behind the rock, that's fine, because all being hidden was doing was disguising your next attack and your movement to make you sneaky. They're allowed to remember your last known position. But they can't see you popping out of cover very well.

Hey Dungeon Dudes! Here's a like and comment for the algorithm. Thanks for all the amazing D&D content!

With Monty's build, depending on party composition, I would consider the ritual caster feat(wizard) gaining Alarm, and Detect Magic as ritual spells to improve on the perception theme. At the first opportunity, I'd add Find Familiar(delayed because of the material cost) and Comprehend Languages to the ritual book. Leomund's Tiny Hut at 5th level is a definite goal. Supplementing the thief's skills with magic also fits the high elf theme. I would still take Elven Accuracy, just at a higher level.

I like your guides. I started playing dnd after watching your videos about the character classes and they helped me understanding what they can do and what is possible to make.

Great video. Love Thieves. My go to Feat for them is definitely Martial Adept in orther to use Disarming Strike against a weapon-wielding enemy, then Fast Hands to snag their weapon from the ground on the same turn.

Grabbing three levels of Bard gets you another Expertise feature AND Jack of All Trades. Four skills with Expertise and half proficiency bonus, rounded down, on everything else is insanely good.

I really wish the use magic device feature came online sooner. It is an awesome ability to have, but in most campaigns your barely going to have the chance to take advantage of it.

I know most of the rogue subclasses like the back of my hand, but it was still enjoyable just listening to you guys describe my favorite subclass (due to my love of old AD&D thieves and assassins) while painting up a mini for my new thief. His name is Jackalope Higgins

Fantastic video… love this series and hope you guys keep pumping them out.

I'm glad you guys are doing these beginner series. It really helps newcomers get acquainted with the class mechanics.

These beginner-builds are such a good idea. Most def going to use these as instruction-videos for new players. Keep up the good work dudes!

I love these beginner builds you dudes started. I already know how to do all of this, but I was able to show this to my dad who hasn't played since First Edition. I also like this style for even the other builds you've been doing because of how thoroughly you explain the features of both the class and subclass.

6:35 I like how the 15 is over the Monty/Kelly instead of below dexterity, really gives it character

I'd love to see both of your takes on thief rouges with a full build! Thief is so versatile and I'm always looking for unique ways to build them

There are two must have feats for a Thief Rogue. The first is the half-feat Tavern Brawler. This allows you to be proficient with improvised weapons like acid flasks and alchemist fire. Which means that you can use Fast Hands to sneak attack from a range of 20' as a bonus action. The second is Healer. This lets you use Fast Hands to restore two downed companions to one hit point each round, once using your bonus action and once using your regular action, with only a healing kit. The third feat you should take is Ritual Caster (Wizard). This gives you Find Familiar, along with a host of other awesome ritual spells. When you put these feats together with the abilities that the Thief Rogue gets, you have an extremely powerful and flexible support class.

Great video. I'd love to see where you go with both characters to lvl 20. I'm currently playing a "Karmic" Thief. This is a trope where you only steal from bad people, but unlike robin hood where you give to the poor, you keep it for yourself. It's a fun middle ground so you don't need to steal from your companions (which annoys everyone) but can still dastardly enough to run your paladin friend the wrong way lol. He's more of a gentleman thief (Think Lupin). I love the Thief subclass as I like the challenge of not having to rely on magic. In fact, my character has a strong distrust of it. Great stuff as always, keep up the great work.

It is so weird to see someone make a video without using the not-so-optional rules presented in tasha and am extremely grateful for that, as that is the way we play at the tables i run and play in. That fact alone has picked my interest to see other vids of this series (i was already watching some of your other vids anyways, but wasnt really gonna watch the builds until now)

Taking proficiency in Alchemist's Tools can play like Rorschach, letting you reliably nail someone with Sneak Attack and douse them with drain cleaner, oil, or homemade incendiaries with a bonus action.

The one time I got to play a rogue, it was as a Scout archetype with the City Wacth background. I envisioned them as an archer well-versed in working with others, able to stand on the backlines and land Sneak Attacks because of their training with the local city guards. It was a Rogue who did not brood or lone wolf, but instead reveled in their chance to add hard-hitting arrows to a fight, and help investigate what was causing the local disturbances. Your last few notes on how to role-play are exactly what I was aiming for, and I'm glad you're pushing that over the typical brooding rogue who sits in the corner.

I think my favourite segment is towards the end when they mention that their character is still a team player, that's important :) Good stuff, Dudes!

I'm really liking this series. I am further into the nitty-gritty of the rules myself, but this is an awesome resource for newcomers

I know it’s pretty simple but this is my favorite song class! Thanks for the video!

Might have mentioned that you get sneak attack damage on opportunity attacks as well as it is a different turn. As you went in depth on disengage.

As a DM I really like this style of video. Gives me a crash course on what my players may choose and what to expect. keep em coming!

I allowed a rogue to use the Hide in a face-to-face combat (with a quite high TN), he used it to get behind the enemy or other combat trick, on other times when they were fighting with a dragon he used it to hide under the dragon and get out of the sight of it, so he could land a nice sneak attack. It was a very fun experience to DM the fight with the player who described what he is doing exactly.

A player in my current campaign is playing a Tabaxi Assassin Rogue, and given the fact she's the only non-magic user in the party I decided to give her a little oomph by giving her an Assassin's Creed like Hidden Blade that can be modified with different things, gives a little flavor and lets her have something cool to play around with.

Thanks guys! Very informative! I just subscribed. I am new to DnD and am creating my first character, a cute little red-headed female lightfoot halfling Rogue/thief.

Love the videos guys

Can't wait to watch this!

This series is sublime!

Haven't been able to support the patreon lately but wanted to say that I received my book and things and am so ready to start running this game!!!!

Great job lads Their video is great

You two are the best! I love all the RPG knowledge delivered by these dudes, but wouldn't be the same without the cool interactions between them.

Played a thief rogue in my first campaign ever and i was such a dnd novice!!! i would have benefited so greatly from watching this video and especially from hearing the advice about working together with your party and not just being brooding and standoffish. I probably would have had a much better first experience with roleplay. Awesome video guys!

it's so clear and supportive for new players

great job as usual guys! live out your bilbo baggins fantasy!

Would be nice to mention in the video some nice ways to use Swift hands, like oil flask as a weak bonus action ranged attack or healer kit with healer feat

I enjoyed my first module rogue (Scout). Deep gnome for an Out of the Abyss game. Leaned into being the scout and skill guy that knew enough about nature to keep his companions alive in the Underdark.

I never played a Rogue, so this video was awesome for inspiration

Lucky is really good... but you do have to remember to use it :)

Yay I got my Dungeons of Drakkenheim book!!! Thanks dudes!

Great video

Ahh, "Rogues"... Fun... Here is mine: Ruby "Silver" Argenti was born to shopkeeper parents who specialised in all maner of homewares. Her father blended smithing and carpentry to make metal fittings, locks, and completed chests. Her mother leaned more to the decorative side of things, making silver candlesticks, mirrors, and other more aesthetically pleasing items. Ruby was raised helping out both of her parents doing their tasks, deloping and knack for fine detail, and an avaricious eye for anything made of Silver (even if more "valuable" things were availible). More than once she would see her farther getting yelled at by upset customers trying to blame him after their valuable had been stollen from chests/safes/etc that he had made, and this gave Ruby her focus, and her dream - To design an un-pickable lock! She would work with her father to make this happen, combining novel designs and exotic materials, and creating numerous designs... But no matter how hard they tried, each new design was targeted and circumvented, sometimes in a matter of mere days... Rather than getting upset, Ruby got motivated and decided to infiltrate the local 'Theives Guild' and find out how they were doing it from the inside. So she faked a story about running away from home 'to join the winning team' and sold her skills at making both locks and lock-picks (A side effect of testing her previous creations). That they in turn taught her the 'tricks of the trade' was a bonus... As was the fact that she now had the perfect excuse to steal as much Silver as she could get her hands on! As a result, Ruby has the 'Artisan' background, with proficiency in Smith's tools. and would take the "Thief" archetype to really double down on the whole "locksmith" thing. She has an level of optimism that just CAN NOT be darkened and is friendly to absolutely everyone - Seemingly 'to a fault', but the reality is that she is VERY careful with who she trusts fully, giving just enough of herself to stop people from 'digging deeper'. I even made a figure of her on that 'Heroforge' site: www.heroforge.com/load_config%3D9734341/ ~JD

I love your guys passion, its awesome and contagious. As for rogues? At lower levels they are critical to basic combat, lose such at Middle levels and gain it back in spades at higher levels. Why? Because at higher levels, the only way your party is annihilated is from impetuous sixth level hack and slaughter mentality. While this may, for example carry you through a "Temple of Elemental Evil" it will NOT carry you through a "Tomb of Horrors".

I swear litterally every time I'm about to build a character, you guys post a video about the class I was going to make them.

I’m currently playing a Swashbuckler/Swords Bard multi-class. It’s some of the most fun I’ve ever had playing D&D. And this makes for an amazing Gish multi-class. The only additional thing I may do is add another multi-class with Hexblade Warlock just to give me that even slighter edge in combat as well as Eldridge Blast

My physical copy of Dungeons of Drakkenheim arrived today, gonna run it as soon as we finish with our current campaign

My first DnD character was a Thief Rogue. Man I miss playing that character. Definitely wasn't optimized but I had so much fun.

I was super surprised you both took Con as your 2nd ability score. This is literally the only class in the game that doesn't need a good con score to frontline or for concentration saves. Ending your turn near an enemy is VERY dangerous for a rogue because your AC will always be bad. A couple extra HP is fine, but isn't going to mitigate that, so you might as well lean into your strengths. The closet you get to melee should be moving to attack, then using your BA to disengage back behind your mestshield. Dual-wielding means not using your cunning action or careful aim, which is usually a bad idea. You should only be doing that instead of ranged attacks if the enemy is prone. With range, you can use your BA to attempt to hide instead of disengaging.

Heads up guys, the 15 isn't in the right place. It's hovering over your names

I'm playing a thief right now, and we're using the reduced rest rule (one day is a short rest, one week for long rest). I hadn't thought about it when making the character, but my mastery over skills is extremely valueable.

The #1 ability is use object bonus action to healing potion a downed party member and still be able to attack with a regular action or healing potion a 2nd downed party member if the shit really hits the fan. It rarely comes into play, but when it does it's absolutely clutch and S+ tier action economy.

In a futuristic campaign, using a pulse rifle with the brutal feature totaling 5d8 on a crit, I crit a sneak attack with it and dealt something like 35 on the attack before sneak damage and then another 25 in sneak. Helped expedite that combat along lol

My current rogue build is amazing, though multiclassed one level thus far. Tabaxi scout rogue investigator. Playing him like a bounty hunter. Currently sitting at lvl 11, 10 rogue 1 fighter has a +12 attack bonus(ranged using revolver from dms guide) 6 expertise skills 4 of which are above +10. He really saved the party with his survival and nature skills durring exploration. Feats taken are gunner, skill expert, and sharpshooter. Was gifted magical gunpowder by the dm.

My first Rouge Thief was a Tabaxi. It was super fun! :)

And Monty’s beard is majestic

At 25:15, Monty says that, on average, 2d4 is more damage than 1d8. That's exactly right. Of course, the probability of doing maximum damage (i.e., 8) with 1d8 is higher than the probability of doing maximum damage with 2d4: 1d8: p(8) = 1/8 = 0.1250 = 12.50% 2d4: p(4) x p(4) = 1/16 = 0.0625 = 06.25%. But the average damage of 2d4 is nonetheless higher than the average damage of 1d8. We can calculate this with the dice average formula, where N is the total number of dice and M is the maximum value of each die: ((M+1)/2)∗N = average score. That gives us the following for 1d8 and 2d4: 1d8: ((8+1)/2)∗1 = 4.5 2d4: ((4+1)/2)*2 = 5. So, the average damage of 1d8 is 4.5 and the average damage of 2d4 is 5.

Admittedly I haven't played much 5e, and I like the scoundrel rogue idea. I was also thinking of adding a club to the weapons, because sometimes you don't want to kill, just subdue or knock out the guard. I also like to add a couple of items to most of my character's inventories. Namely, Signal whistle, steel mirror, and chalk. Signal whistle to communicate or create a distraction, a mirror for signaling or observing something without giving away your position, and chalk for marking your way through an unfamiliar area, drawing a layout of some place you've scouted, or to leave messages for the rest of your party.

So if you find out a way to get good initiative and take a couple levels in battle master you can become a controlling monster. Expertise in sleight of hand and before battle begins no enemy has had time to draw weapons, so steal their weapon. Spellcaster? Steal either their components pouch or focus, and battle master gives you the ability to disarm with an attack and to boost initiative

360k subs, it feels like 60k like a year ago. Keep it up dudes

I’m just here to say I finally got my copy of Dungeons of Drakenheim in the mail. It had been so long I completely forgot and didn’t know what this package was. I had planned on doing dishes, but eh, dishes can wait

Skip the second shortsword and go with the bow and arrows. You can dual wield just wine with one of the daggers and a shortsword and the bow adds a lot of versatility.

Halfing Rogue/Thief is my favorite character. It's classic, packs a good punch in combat, and there's so many things you can do out of combat.

That flow chart at 22:06 is awesome.

I too like to have Monty as my highest stat

In regards to dice math: rolling 1d8 means you have the same odds of dealing any number between 1-8. Whereas rolling 2d4 turns your dmg charts from just a straight line of probability into a small bell curve. Your max and min will happen less often, but the average will be higher.

the use of acid, alchemist's fire, holy water, and oil are all actions (not attack actions)... once you take the action to splash or throw the item you get to make a ranged attack roll treating the item as an improvised weapon... the Fast Hands feature allows you to do this as a bonus action (Use an Object with Cunning Action)

In my brothers campaign, that crit would hurt even more again, because he's house ruled that any and all crits additional damage is max possible damage. So that crit you mentioned there would be 4d6 plus 27! :-P

I recently built a thief rogue that's a combat medic. His background is a hermit and he essentially just runs around the battlefield with from the battlefield with like healing potions and healing kits to bring people up

Just got my copy of dungeons of drakkenheim today and since I have not been able to sleep I have been reading it.

1st charter I made in 5E.. got to the point where I could move, attack, and use a wand of fireball, all in the same round ^-^ had so much fun. Not to mention being able to use potions on the party as a bonus action, Other mentions, bonus action disarm a foes belt, so there pants fall down mid fight.. open a door, fire arrow, close set door.. slight of hand the archers quiver mid fight. stab one crossbowmen, bonus action disable the others cross bow xD too bad he got turned into red paste by a fire giant :(

I am playing a thief right now. I am open with my party about my intentions and work with them so I don't make anything worse than things already are. I like to be the "Send in the expert" kind of character instead of "Where's the imp?" kind of character. We started at level 3 and I will be happy if we reach level 5, ever. I don't have great luck finding groups who retains interest past session 5. I am a Lightfoot Halfling in stats, hellborn in flavor. Cast out of hell to survive in the material realm where I learned the virtue of teamwork. I might take the Skilled feat or anything that allows me to pick invocations (there probably is some feat for that). Invocations of Devil's Sight would be thematic. Speaking of thematic, my GM allowed swapping Proficiency in Rapier with Whip.

Cool idea for a video here( one of y'all comes up with the strongest good aligned party and the other other comes up with the strongest evil aligned party) maybe see what party is stronger

Another fun fast hands combo you can do is run up a wall 30 feet and pitch yourself with a climbers kit, kind of like casting levitate if the monster cant climb

Poor goblins. :( But another great video, making Rogues sound compelling and teeming with possibilities. I may even have to make one myself.

I have a plan to make a rogue that uses lots of gatgets like Batman but more aggressive. Like using ballbearings, caltrops, even Holy water and bombs. That'll help me to control the battlefiels in a small way. Plus shenanigans home alone style

I'm currently running a thief rogue build based around the mobility feat, hit and run attacks, and spamming caltrops/ball bearings/oil. I play him as an adrenaline junkie stunt man prankster. I'm basically playing Johhny Knoxville

Still haven't played a rogue. I really look forward to playing a reformed rogue with heart of gold.

The choice between the Rogue being torn over selfish desire and doing what's right reminded me of the best line in the animated Treasure Planet when Jim's surprised that Mr. Silver chose him over the treasure, "It was just a life-long obsession, Jim, I'll be over it shortly."

In terms of hiding as in say, the whole behind the barrel scenario rather then in it. Personally, I'd allow them to roll, and based on the situation and general alert level of the guards, not to mention there facing as they go down the passageway. It wouldn't really matter if it was dark and/or guards hard darkvision. as there is a mechanic in 5e that helps balance things out called Passive and Active perception. Passive perception being the creatures Perception score (ability modifier + Proficiency (if any) +and other bonuses and penalties) + 10. Active Perception is the creatures Perception score + 1D20. As to what I meant by "Alert Level" would be based on what's going on at the time. Low Alert would just have guards patrolling around and relying on passive perception. Medium Alert would mean they are actively searching and thus making Active Perception and/or Investigation rolls. High Alert is bit of a toss up as there is likely some battle going on. So either using there Passive Perception as they keep eyes on there surroundings or, given the time, reason and available action to do so, opt to actively search around for some enemy that may have mysteriously vanished from the battlefield. Now, in terms of Facing well, depends on how much cover that barrel is giving you from the guards position, and even if the guard were to walk past the barrel, he still might not notice your there based on the direction he's facing and how alert he is. On Low Alert, the guard is likely to walk past the barrel without bothering to see whats on the other side (unless you rolled bad on stealth or he has really high Passive Perception and notices someones foot sticking out or some strange moss sticking out over the barrel). On High Alert, the guard might end up running back the barrel and not bother looking back as he's rushing to join the fray (Passive Perception might still spot you though). Medium Alert however, it might be wiser to hide in the barrel than beside it as the guard is actively searching and is most likely to find you beside the barrel rather then in it. All in all, would rule it based on the current situation, facing/cover and level of alertness, and of course if they were able to see you duck behind that barrel.

Thanks.

I once played an arcane trickster rogue/armorer artificer. With +5 dex, proficiency at +4, advantage on stealth checks thanks to the infiltrator armor, expertise with stealth, and another party member casting "pass without trace," I got a 43 on a stealth check. By far the highest skill check of anyone that I have ever played D&D with. That was probably a year and a half ago, and we still talk about it at the table (and it isn't just me who brings it up). Unfortunately, that campaign has ended so the character is currently retired.

I hope we get a guide on the Arcane Trickster. The whole half caster thing can get a little confusing.

I want to make a Thief with the healer feat (physician), that healer's kit on bonus action sounds sweet, specially for rest healing. Background: an aristocrat medic that steals some trinckets from their patients

Just a question, how do you manage feat like "skulker" when hiding in the dark? Is the character still in "plain sight"?

that tales from the crypt shirt is fire

I think the 13th level ability of a Thief is super useful. I also love the thought of stealing mid-combat using their Fast-hands.

Thief pairs well with an artificer in the party once they get spell storing item. Spell storing item is an object interaction.

I've been planning ahead and writing the backstory for my rogue that I hope to one day actually play if I can find a group for a long campaign, and he's going to be either a Thief or Inquisitive rogue. A second generation cobbler and single father moonlighting as a thief to make ends meet, he was forced to flee his home city after a supposedly simple burglary commissioned by the local thieves' guild went south, and he ended up accused of being a notorious serial killer that was terrorizing the city at the time. Stuff happens, and he ends up having to abandon his close-knit group of friends and his daughter to flee as far away as possible or be executed by the city guard or maybe even a bounty hunter for being this serial killer. Then some time later he stumbles across his new adventuring party wherever that may be, and hopefully with time and in addition to the overall questing the group does, he gets to uncover what actually happened back home, deal with the actual killer, clear his name and be reunited with his daughter and friends.

Hey Kelly and Monty, how about a beginner build video for the Oath of Vengeance paladin, which you two have both played to very high levels in each other's campaigns?!?! One of you could be a Half-Elf and the other could be a Dragonborn!!

Thieve's cant is an awesome role playing tool, right now in a Ravnica's campaign we have 2 rogues and we usually speak between us with stupidly funny ways that NPC's cannot understand or we can create secret signals.

Especially with rogues, I feel like we gotta find archetypes that can be achieved with class abilities without following the intended play style. We know that clerics and paladins are interchangeable. Swashbuckler can be played with battlemaster levels. Battlemaster can be monk or ranger too. Druid can be full combat medic if we ditch the nature connection.

Aside from creating a "Thief" rogue, the notorious Arcane Trickster is my favorite rogue archetype. For the infiltration means, I chose Changeling as a race and use a point-buy rules for his ability score. I give him STR 8 / DEX 16 (+1 from race) / CON 14 / INT 8 / WIS 12 / CHA 16 (+2 from race) which make him a decietful backstabber for the enemy. I also hide my true race from my party members because changelings are a taboo race in the game we're playing, and I could be killed on sight. FYI : I also tell my friends that I am a human rogue so that I may concentrate on deceit and create an impact when I expose my true race. (My DM allow this 😉.) I take deception and insight skill from Changeling's instinct then take acrobatics, athletics, perception & persuasion from rogue. Also get sleight of hands & stealth from urchin backgrouds so I become a Decietful Arcane Trickster Rogue who can blend in any situations. I've had a blast playing this character. His name is Lés, my best DnD character. ☺

And now with the One DnD unearthed arcana both hits when duel wielding is just an action opening up your bonus. Now you can hit twice, sneak attack and then disengage.