I'm glad that Mr. Lewis discussed the different definitions of "democracy," i.e., the western world versus the Arab world. If only he had taken it one step further and included the definition of "freedom" and shown how that disparity in meanings is even greater.
Three excellent knowledgeable, wise gentlemen discussing in-depth one of our major existential problems of today and the future.. I appreciate their ending optimism and would like to feel I had it too. I am still struggling to figure out what I can and must do to meet the challenge.
It's interesting to glance at the comments below. It seems that almost nobody is interested in hearing what these men have to say - only in trying to characterize and dismiss them. So why watch? Why pretend to be interested in the substance when all you care about it maligning or praising? This kind of divisive, unthinking contrariness ie exactly what's wrong with the American political scene. Nobody listens anymore.
aah...ok...in that particular context... he was amazing...actually i think he should be back... to kick some asses around the ME...he s defenitely the kind of person to be president... of the wild snails association... sorry snails...
I am not pro america or anti america but.... Norman's views of american exceptionalism sometimes border on the absurd... when Beranard brings up discrimination and slavery Norman responds by saying that america is great because it fought a war to end slavery... the other way to look at it is that in every other country the criminalization of slavery was celebrated by the people...only america had a sizable portion of the country fight to keep slavery...
Peter Robinson has to learn that elderly people easily lose track and shouldn't be interrupted if you want to know what they think. He must also learn that it is the two men we want to hear, not him.
The biggest problem with Islam is the Koran they are using is not correct. In Arabic you can change the meaning of words depending on where you put the dots over the letters and many of the dots are in the wrong places.
On the one hand Podhoretz denies the Oil as a reason for starting a war Iraq. Then later, Lewis says the middle East is no longer important from an oil stand point because they are running out of oil. In other words it was a determining factor in the beginning. I agree that Podhoretz is correct about the lack of commitment to imperialistic endeavors. I think people listening could balance this discussion with some comments by say Chris Hedges who has a great deal of experience in the Muslim world. These guys talk from both sides of their mouths. It is too bad that people like this influence heavily the use of our tax dollars via the council on foreign relations etc. Unfortunately the spread of our type of Democracy is only but a front for fascism. This is given away by the use term "our interests over seas". Corporate interests over seas are not our interests (speaking for working class Americans who pay the bulk of taxes). When corporations (who pay little or no taxes) shipped our jobs over seas they ceased their alliance with America. There are no American corporations anymore. They are not even multinational. They are for profit corporations. Special interest groups running government=fascism.
chicle verde I agree they didn't. Lewis said the ME is going to get less important to the west with the advent of alternate types or sourcing of power. And Iraq sells most of it's oil to China now!
Edward Said tried to 'monster' Lewis in his book 'Orientalism'. Said opined that Western scholars had projected their cultural norms onto the Arab culture and had no right to put forth their opinions. To which Lewis responded: 'Does that mean that all the study of marine biology should be done by fish?' Elsewhere Lewis is asked his opinion of the effect of oil on the ME and his one word response 'disaster'.
Supreme leader Ayatollah Khamenei discussing the return of the Imam Mahdi. There is a youtube on him. He says: “the end of the world will come when Imam Mahdi (may God hasten his re-appearance) establishes ultimate justice in the world.” And the Ayatollah believes the end times incarnation of this man is alive today: “We know his family. We know when he was born. We know the details.” “Waiting means expecting an event that will definitely happen.” "We are waiting for someone who exists and is present among us". “We should know that a great event will happen… We can never say that the event will not happen in a few years.” “By Allah’s favor, we will be among the soldiers who will fight alongside Imam Mahdi and I hope we will be martyred for his cause.” So Iran’s leader speaks nationally about the second coming of their long awaited apocalyptic end times savior - already here, who will lead them to death and martyrdom in an apocalyptic war that will establish Sharia Law over the world. This from a country in two proxy wars, who support hamas and hizbollah and shia expansionism.
+MartinIDavies Professor Bernard Lewis will turn 100 on 31 May. As a long-time admirer of Prof Lewis I intend to send him a congratulatory message in the week leading up to the 31st. The Middle Eastern Studies Dept at Princeton has agreed to pass messages on to Prof Lewis. Accordingly, if any fellow well-wishers would like to do the same, these should be sent to the Department Secretary Ms Karen Chirik. Karen’s email address is kchirik@princeton.edu It would help if the subject line is ‘Professor Bernard Lewis’ Professor Bernard Lewis will turn 100 on 31 May. As a long-time admirer of Prof Lewis I intend to send him a congratulatory message in the week leading up to the 31st. The Middle Eastern Studies Dept at Princeton has agreed to pass messages on to Prof Lewis. Accordingly, if any fellow well-wishers would like to do the same, these should be sent to the Department Secretary Ms Karen Chirik. Karen’s email address is kchirik@princeton.edu It would help if the subject line is ‘Professor Bernard Lewis’
All Muslims should read 'What went Wrong?' by Prof Lewis. The push towards modernity and the inevitable retreat are the track record of Islam. Don't say 'what about the US or France?' Islam had the problems it has now, long before 'modern history' began.
You make no sense.. just rant. you vomit up verbal diarrhea. so if you have something of value to contribute to the discussion then go ahead and make a proper argument against what has been said here. However I doubt you will or are capable of doing so.. here’s an example you pen “socio-psycho mayhem” I have no idea what this means… I suspect it means nothing. Another you suggest that “ Islamic militancy” is a creation of modernity of the west.. no this is not the case .. Islam is very much a religion of the sword. The message being join (submit to us and our delusional cruel beliefs) or die or pay us to remain alive! Nice then you say “these groups are hated in the very same Muslim” no they are not.. if that is the case then why aren’t we seeing them in their millions shouting at the top of their voices and taking action to eliminate them… they don’t because they (ISIS et al) are living the life as prescribed in the Koran and huge numbers of Muslims agree with them. “Did any such groups exist 30 years ago or even 15 years ago?” of course they did the Muslim Brotherhood the root of the Islamic madness we are seeing came into existence in 1928. So yes, these mad groups existed and predate recent policing actions by the modern west.
MartinIDavies You must be suffering from serious short term memory loss. Your last para? Islamic Brotherhood was not even close to the rabid dogs that these ISIS were. You miss the point but then with your memory loss it is forgivable. Which other flag waving, madmen like ISIS existed 100 years ago, 200 years ago and even earlier? Without further ado, if you can rebut my earlier points, by all means do so and not wave a lunatic denunciation without substance.
MartinIDavies Muslims ruled Spain for about 800 years. The Muslims in Spain never used the sword to force the people to convert. Later the Christian Crusaders came to Spain and wiped out the Muslims. There was not a single Muslim in Spain who could openly give the adhan, that is the call for prayers. Muslims were the lords of Arabia for 1400 years. For a few years the British ruled, and for a few years the French ruled. Overall, the Muslims ruled Arabia for 1400 years. Yet today, there are 14 million Arabs who are Coptic Christians i.e. Christians since generations. If the Muslims had used the sword there would not have been a single Arab who would have remained a Christian. It took nearly 600 years for the Muslim population to exceed non Muslims in the Mid East. If by the sword, within one generation.
