Biblical Giants | Clans, Sizes, & Supernatural Abilities | Episode 3 with  

At this point Joel is just an honorary co-host of Haunted Cosmos

I'm glad this conversation wasn't suppressed with the death of Michael Heiser. It was a big part of his life's work and his Divine Council Worldview. I came away from it feeling far more enlightened about the supernatural realm. As a result it made it easier for me to understand the most complicated chapters and verses in the OT, but in the NT as well. Thanks to Joel and his colleagues, Dr. Heiser's work is carrying on.

14 feet is the about size of both the average Autobot and Decepticon from the 80s Transformers cartoon.

In 2002 the US army sent in a 2nd party to Afghanistan and encountered the Kandahar giant who had 12 toes and 12 fingers and double rows of teeth who was 1100 lbs and 12-15 feet tall and self healed instantly, that's why it was so hard for the army to take him down. He was red haired and stunk.

I googled the height of cedar trees in the Middle East, and it says that the cedar trees of Lebanon grow to heights up to 120 ft!

I got 16 minutes in, until you said that Ham had sex with his mother. If you’re going to play that fast and loose with that passage, how are we supposed to trust anything else you say? Ham did not “uncover his father‘s nakedness,” he saw his father‘s nakedness because, as the preceding verse said, Noah was uncovered in his tent. The entire context would indicate that Ham saw his father in a naked, drunken stupor, and went out and mocked him to his brothers. The subject of Biblical giants is interesting, but the Scriptures deserve better treatment than you’re giving!

The whole manatee/mermaid discussion just made me start singing 'Veggie Tales 'Barbara Manatee' sing in my head and imagining a sailor of old singing it to a manatee. 😂 I'm a bit silly 😊

Thanks for the show, loved it.

Appreciate you guys talking about this subject! The world is not just stuff

Awesome discussion gentlemen. Ready for the next one asap!

🎉Great conversation guys.God bless.

I just found your channel & I am All In! Right up my alley :)

David cut Goliaths head off in order to prevent him from regenerating from his wound. The Jews understood that The ancient Giants some had healing abilities to self-heal.

The world’s tallest man in modern times, Robert Wadlow was born, weighing an average eight pounds, six ounces. Though Robert was not your average infant, by the time he was six months old he weighed nearly 30 pounds. So Giants could have easily been born slightly bigger than a normal baby and still turn out to be Giants

They had long lives and they never stopped growing they would become 60 feet tall.

Maybe the nephillim were born normal human size but unlike regular people they may have continued to grow longer even as adults If someone regular human size at birth grew until they were 35 they’d be giants

Watching from Wisconsin ❤❤❤

Theres a fossil dragon the size of Florida in the US. There a trail named after it called black dragon canyon head trail. Look it up

You know what grows continually throughout its life? Snakes, and other reptiles.

That David could effectively wield Goliath's sword is proof that he wasn't 40 feet tall.

I came for the 13 year old girl banter, stayed for the giants

Great conversation until Brian said that bodybuilders are ghey. Have you actually ever trained with bodybuilders? I trained bodybuilding for over half a decade, and was made a far more effective fireman than when I trained powerlifting and strongman Because bodybuilding trains for strength through muscular endurance, which also trains cardio. We would frequently work out until we were beyond tired, nauseous and shaking from fatigue, and then we kept pushing past that. It was the perfect training modality for the fire service. I challenge you to find a man who is serious about bodybuilding, and then train with him. Try to keep up. By the way, I’ve really appreciated the Ogden boys don’t fawn over one another in this series on this channel.

I’m 5’3”, 100 lbs (then), birthed babies OVER 9 lbs; naturally. Labor was under 3 hours. Imagine better genetics, better health… my daughter was wearing size 4 toddler clothing at 2 months. Another lady I know had 13 lb babies, but she was 5’6”. My guess is the mothers of giants had the children before 9 months- possibly as early as 3 months. Yes, I have reason for saying 3 months. TY Gentlemen

Adam and Eve and many were known to be normally 20 feet tall and long life spans but as time went on, life span became less and so did their height.

I appreciate your detailing the various theories, explaining where they might come from, and debunking them with scriptures.

I do like the Christian Whyfiles I just taught 1 Samuel 21 to our Sunday school and David was given Goliath’s sword by Ahimalech when he went to get food and a weapon. David didn’t day that it was too much for him to bear and unusable. He took it gladly and said what a good sword it was.

Giants had reptile DNA... allowing them to continue to grow all during their lives

One explanation is that when the author(s) of Genesis are talking about nephilim they are referring to all the legendary heroes of old(or at least contemporary with the original audience reading Genesis) who still persisted as 'gods' or demi-gods in lore. Many of the legendary heroes or deities worshiped by the early post-Flood civilizations were based on passed down stories of those figures from pre-Flood history. Literally hybrid angel/human offspring - some were giants but others had other gifts/abilities/power. Nephilim, in my opinion does not have to equal just giants, but is meant to say beings who are like demi-gods and almost never die, who grow to tremendous heights or are very strong, etc. When it says they existed after the Flood too - I believe that these post-Flood nephilim are referencing the Canaanite clans of giants descending from Anak. I believe it is possible that the spies who give the bad report say they saw the sons of Anak there - that it is possible Anak's literal sons were still alive at that time (100's of years old). TLDL - Nephlim were originally angel/human hybrids and some were really big, some very powerful/famous and in general were committing grievous enough sin that God cannot allow it anymore and destroys the earth. After the Flood, there are legendary ones existing too - but likely just the result of genetics passed down (longevity + some giant genes expressed by at least a few like Anak or Og). The first few sets of generations after Noah all lived to be 400-500 years old, and still had a much more robust immune system. These grandsons of Noah were also worshiped as gods (nephilim) by the later generations after Noah's grandsons all the way to the time of the Canaanites who are still in some relationship with the giants (cannibalism, etc). Canaanite giants, grand children of Noah like Nimrod, Anak, Og, etc were all nephlim but not as a result of direct angel/human breeding.

The comment, 'He's like a tree,' was said of the Daniel Boone tv show actor Fess Parker.

I appreciate the conversation between you men. I think the whole giants kept growing theory is plausible. The same thing happed to Robert Wadlow who was documented as the worst tallest man. The theory is that he had an abnormal amount of the human growth hormone and just kept growing. He sadly died at 22 but was even still growing at his death.

JOEL IS NUTS

To another comment, it was NOT a local flood. Genesis 7:19-23: Regarding the waters, “They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than twenty feet. Every living thing that moved on the earth perished-birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; men and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds of the air were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark."

The Giants do indeed exist today! I’ve seen them. I’ve recorded them speaking…

You guys are cool dudes! I would love to sit in the room and talk with you guys!!

The author of The Witching Hour, Anne Rice, describes a supernatural birth between a Mayfair woman and a supernatural "stranger" that has been a watcher and helper of her family for many generations to insure their wealth and position.The resulting pregnancy was incredibly short, the unborn infant grew so insanely fast that it forced itself out prematurely; continued to rapidly grow then ran off into the woods moments after. Rice certainly had some insights into the Watcher's.

✨I can’t wait to see what you say on ep 5. I am pretty sure that you may know , what I know. Nice work , keep 🙏🏼 we need as many people to wake up as much as possible today ! Our time is getting shorter here . The signs 🪧 are all before us . Stay repentant and truly committed to the word . Jesus Christ is the way , truth and the life❣️ May you all be Blessed 🕊️✨ ✨🫧🌲🦶🏿🌳🧚‍♂️🌲🐕‍🦺😊🕊️✨

I wrote an article years ago about the LXX cubit compared to the Masoretic cubit. And wrote about this exact thing about Goliath's size. I'm happy to see you guys got this right.

I would love to hear you guys discuss one of the other common objections to giants. Which is that they would just be too big to even be able too move effectively. You see really tall people these days get joint issues, heart issues, etc. I'd love to hear Ben address the square-cube law objection to giants as well. Love the content!

Checking in

"I like it because it fits neatly into the narrative" is not a good reason to make any decision.

I like you guys, but this is nuttier than a squirrel

Robert Waldow was the tallest Man in recent times and he was 8ft 11. A man of average height would seem tiny. Mr Waldow had a pituitary gland genetic issue he lived until he was 22. If did live it's possible he could grow more.

Some bulls are known to throw off seed that is born small-average and grows very large as opposed to ones that are born large and grow large. I've heard people call them good bulls because they don't hurt the cows who carry their children that will eventually be huge.

Also, when you were talking about the strong man and sword, I did some body mass index calculations on Goliath. Now I assumed he would be muscular but not to the point of being immobile. So I compared him to a 5'10 200 pound man who is just naturally farmer strong and if comparable Goliath would weigh about 560 pounds in shape able to walk 25 or 30 miles a day if the army needed to do so not a man who is strong, just so he could be strong and his whole life revolves around it so he can't move hardly. But a man strong simply because he's a giant. But even a skinny and thin person at 9'9 would weigh over 440 and have the ligament and tendon strength far beyond any man alive today.

I check on Patreon for the series but it’s locked, wondering if they were free for just that day?

52:43 Demolition Ranch!!

“In giant culture…” 🤣

Joel is the Right Response Giant…spiritually speaking. This W is definitely as big as Goliath.

Regarding Goliath's height, 6 cubits and a span is approximately 9 feet 9 inches, according to Google.

Look into the “liger” lion tiger hybrid. There’s a gene that tells it to stop growing that is lost in that mixture…. Perhaps similar occurrence in human angel mixture

In every lie, there is a kernel of truth

There are 3 cubits, standard cubit is 17.5". The others are shorter and longer

Actually, the women who mated with the fallen Watchers, were turned into Sirens, a bird with the head of a woman, with long hair. Also the babies born, would’ve been normal size at birth, then rapidly grew.

If you google Shaq and giants, there is a picture of Shaq up against a wax figure of some guy who was 8'11'', he comes to his shoulder. It is an incredible picture.

21:24 could it be the gods of the nations, that fell? i know you had Heiser on, and he talked about 3 fall, Gen 3, Gen 6 and Gen 11..so could it be the fall in Gen 11, that resulted in more Nephilims?.. It looks like the Rebellion was not a one time event, but gradually over time. that could explain it. (they might not have seen everything that happened to those who fell in previous rebellions). Thanx for the discussion, it is great to hear about alternative possibilities.

I HOPE... that in heaven, we still have knowledge of our former life, and we aren't just wiped clean and start over. Because these are things I NEED to know !!!

I’d be curious to hear your take on Joel 2.

Inca say the ancient ruins were from previous civilization and that they found them, if remnants survived that is understandable. Giants were known and documented by many explorers and old cultures alike. Also many mounds and tombs contents of giant skeletons and the later destruction and coverup of their existance is well known (and denied by the quackademics).

U guys taught me a couple new things I'll tell y'all how the giants survived great deluge ancient submarines. I seen the hieroglyphs

I hate to retype my view multiple times, but I believe they are important to share. One is that Noah /Utnapishtim/Deucalion, Uranus/Oannes/Dagon/Dagda/Poseidon, etc. became deified as Uranus among other names, and Ham/Cham became Chronus. The Greek myth about Chronos/Chronus Castrating Ouranos/Uranus is a mythologization of Ham raping his mother or possibly stepmother Naamah/Gaia as a way of usurping his father authority as king. The Sumerians tell us that Noah/Utnapishtim was king of Shruppak, which explains how he had the means to emply people to help build the ark. His sons helped I'm sure, but I think it was more of a supervisor role. It would appear from the archaeologicak record, that very quickly when sites like Golbekli Tepe were built, Noah's descendants had already descended into paganism. By the time City-states like Ninevah were built and assimilated into the Akkadia Empire by Nimrod/Ninurta/Gilgamesh/Dimmuzi/Osiris/Orion, their mythology had evolved further, but the Bible also states Nimrod "began to become a giant." There is a lot of the epic to unpack, but if he was born and then literally, not metaphorically began to become a giant, to me it indicates something ritualistic. If many Christians make the argument that God would not allow the wives of Noah's sins to have corrupt genealogy, then in my opinion, that also implies that something like ritualistic sexual practices involving demonic possession and conception, may have supernaturally been able to corrupt otherwise perfectly normal genes. While it may not be clear in the mythology, it is possible Titea refers to the wife of Shem and he may have been Titan. Simultaneously the Titanomachy wars may refer to intertribal ears between the descendants of Noah. Strangely Japheth/Jupiter(Ja-pater/Prajapati, Zeus) becomes head of the pantheon of deified patriarchs instead of Ham/Chronus, which seems to imply the Titans or line of Shem is who he was at war with. It may also imply that giant Rephaim tribes descended primarily of Shem at he time rather than Ham. It is unclear. Nimrod/Gilgamesh visited Noah, who seems to have moved to the island of Cypress to ask him about immortality, but apparently leaves disappointed. Not because he lost the magic plant, but in esity because Noah probably told him about the gradual decline of their lifespans. Father Martin via Demmon publishing, released his translation of a privately owned text, which seems to be one of the original accounts passed down from the scribes of king Of of Bashan. In it, it talks a bit about the giant wars and many fascinating details that tie into Enochian stories and the war with Abraham. Even in it, we can see a gradual decline of the bloodline which may have lead to the 8 foot tall Native American skeletons described in turn of the century articles, as well as stories from Conquistadors, and the Lovelock Cave giants. There are stories from the Aenid and Odyssey down to the present day Kandahar and Solomon Island giant stories that make us wonder what of the Rephaim bloodline survives today. Personally I believe there are many branches of the Nephilim family tree that are humanoids ranging from lizards and alien greys to hominids like Bigfoot, but it is hard to say. While some encounters are more like a spiritual mirage; allowing spirits to change form without physical restriction, the ones that are tangible, are the ones we need to focus on. Og mentions Anak as his scribe and eventual heir after the death of Og's son Ogias I believe. He also mentions summoning Jotun as a military conscript, which ties back into something else important. Norse and Celtic mythology do not reference those geographic areas or early medieval times. They actually reference a time roughly 3000 years ago before they migrated out of Scythia and the Near East. Jotunheim is in Syria, not Germany. It appears some Rephaim left the Mediterranean and Levant to escape persecution and eventually fade out of public conscience. Juan has to remember that while these books certainly have elements of historical truth, they are not as reliable as canonical texts. Another ancient fragment translated by Father Martin, is the Book of Lamech of Cain which also gives us a bit of insight into that time period. Any ancient texts that comes from a pagan perspective, can confirm some elements of the biblical narrative, but where they disagree one should rely on the Bible. Regarding height, at least in the time of Og, I believe he doesn't describe anyone over 20 ft tall, but I don't have the book with me at the moment. Tell me it seems more logical they would transition from 20 ft at the time of early megalithic sites down to the 8-foot average in the Iron Age, or something along those lines. If the Solomon and Kandahar stories are true than it seems there are however, exceptions to that rule.

I'm also leaning towards the nephalim, never stop growing theory. How do Crocodile and alligators grow? Small enough to be more then 5 at a time, hiding in theirs mothers mouth for protection, when small.

So, with the ability to trace genetics, do we see anything in current genes that would point to the giants?

28:24 Were humans that tall (5’6”) then with that eco system or were they taller? Just thinking. 🤔

What abt the possibility , since the sons of God defiled every living thing including fish the flood did not wipe out, that water wouldn’t wipe out that remnant.

This was a really heavy episode. Definitely has a lot of weight to it. Wasn't a light conversation for sure. Real tall order to cover this topic. No small matter this discussion. Very appropriate having giants of the faith to discuss this. 🤣🤣🤣

When the Bible says they were there in those days and after. Read the context he's talking about the days of Jared.

No way on a second incursion. If you read Enoch 13:5 the angels were terrified and even asked Enoch to try and obtain forgiveness. There is no way any angel would fare to do it again but then again would angels learn from others mistakes, or, like humans, they have to make them, themselves.lol. they know it's a eternity of punishment. But you never know

I've come across enough evidence to lead me to the conclusion that RH - blood IS fallen angel blood.

The only thing these discussions are missing is Dr. Heiser. Heavens gain was our loss. 😒

The tallest woman to have ever lived was Zeng Jinlian, who was 8' 1 3/4", was born weighing a little over 7 pounds and was 22" long. Her mother was 5' 4". So it's not a stretch at all to believe a normal human woman could give birth to a baby who would be a giant. My catching point was how a normal human woman could have physically MATED with a giant! That's the difficult part, I would think, assuming everything is proportional. And just to correct something the guys stated incorrectly, the woman who gave birth to the largest baby ever, Canadian citizen Anna Haining Bates, gave birth to her second child, a boy, who actually weighed 23 pounds 9 ounces and was nearly 30 inches tall. Even as tall as she was...yeouch!

If you wanna push the connection of the giants to serpent worship they allegedly propagated: you know what also continues to grow throughout their lives? Snakes! (and all reptiles)

These Giants spread to north America and were encountered by the HAWILAH, AZAMA- Olomatika, and much latter NOOCHI-Punt, Meshech peoples migrating from south America 3600bc, and Siberia, -until-AD1000.

53:27 Strongmen also take certain supplements to compete at an elite level. Folks then did not

34:15 or some of the babies were also girls and she grew up to be a giant. Enabling her to give birth even larger babies then the previous woman. The first generation grew to 8 -10 feet as we have seen then breed with other giants to make larger children.

If these “monolithic” structures were built by “Giants,” why are the steps made for people of average height?

Could there have been a recessive gene of the giants in one of Noah's family?

Ever heard of Robert Wadlow

I seen where people claimed that they found Noah's wife grave and the woman in it was 11 feet tall in turkey

Because of their angelic gene traits, they have no growth inhibitors, they where born the size of a large baby birth today, and grew very quick, hence their insaciable appetites.!

My bed is about 7ft and I'm 5'7. I don't think because OG has a 14ft bed that means he is at least 14ft.

I have a friend who’s just barely over 7 feet tall very broad very heavy, he was 6 pounds when he was born. Almost considered a preemie. Size at birth, it has absolutely nothing to do with this size that you’ll grow to. In Sampson like Manor, he also has hair down to his waist! lol

I believe that after the flood, some of the fallen angels did it again . Mt hermon and thats where king og came from as well.

My father weighs 16 pounds 6 oz when he. Was born. His mother was 5 Foot 6. She had ten kids

I believe they came through Hams' mother. She had the seed of the serpent in her jeans her geans

20:18 In the book of Enoch, the leader of the Watchers negotiated to have I think 10% remain to influence the humans. Additional giants could have been born post flood. It might have been the book of Jubilees but I think it’s the book of Enoch.

I'm open to giants as per the Bible being in other parts of the world. BUT the Incan ruins being built by giants strikes me as the ancient version of aliens did it.

The problem is Goliath's height is the same in the dead sea scrolls as the Septuagint. 🤷🏼‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️

What if man was taller like 10 feet and shrunk after the flood?

Nobody knows what kind of tools they had. Theyre technology made ours look like kindergarten

Do we have to assume that the first generation of this unholy offspring was the final result? I breed dogs, so I'm thinking sometimes it takes a while to get the result you want and you breed for certain characteristics or physical traits. Couldn't the fallen angels have used that approach? Using larger female offspring to birth even larger nephilim?

I get the angels and women procreating, but it doesn’t seem physically possible for the giant offspring to procreate with an average size female.

Robert Wadlow?

Okay guys... I've been asking some similar questions... and I noticed that Noah was 500 years old before he fathered his 3 sons... and we don't have exact dates on that. So I'm thinking... what man could resist procreation for 500 years? Or did he and his wife just have daughters up to that point? Strange... seems unlikely... but not impossible. If I remember correctly, the Bible doesn't mention Noah's wife... but we find out through other much less trustworthy sources that he married his sister (Namaah?) IDK... but we don't have a statement that she was perfect in her generations... though if Noah was then she would have been also unless she had a different mother? Neither do we know much about Japheth's, Shem's, or Ham's wives - but it would seem to me that if God intended to cleanse the bloodlines of the living, he would not have overlooked an adulterated bloodline... right? I agree that a second incursion seems unlikely... and I too thought that perhaps there were some fallen who had not yet fulfilled that oath they allegedly took when they all agreed on this course of action. They were stuck... they had to fulfill their oaths at some point - but in the meantime it would seem that many of them tried to repent and atone... but God wasn't having it just then. The watchers were the teachers of mankind if I'm reading all of this right... so there were some who took human form so that they could interact and educate? The other thing that I think I remember is that Lamech was very concerned when Noah was born because he appeared as one of the Angels... and so he went to ask his Dad Mehtusalah and elsewhere we learn that they both consulted with Enoch somehow... before they got an answer that in fact Noah's genes were not contaminated... but I wouldn't put it past God to have some hand in which genes ended up in his DNA and what characteristics or traits were expressed. Perhaps mankind needed a little tune up or something in order to deal with the remainder of the evil that would still be infecting the world after the flood. Anyway... I'm glad someone is having these conversations. The whole divine council worldview has MAJOR implications if it ever becomes widely accepted.... and it seems to me that it makes a whole lot more sense than previously held worldviews. SOMETHING should account for the spiritual warfare... right? So... yeah... thanks for putting stuff like this out there.

What if they were already fallen?

How about the theory of falling angels using flying machines and leave earth during the flood and inhabit the black side of the moon, and come to earth to experiment with human race again

Marylin Monroe had six toes on her right foot. Nephilim?

Did I hear a "bong pipe" in there?

Babel. The 3rd divine rebellion. That is how the giants returned; the events at the Tower of Babel. That top of that tower was essentially a giant ouija board.

Lugal means literally 'big man' and was a title taken/given to ancient mesopotamian rulers. The story of Goliaths 'length' is problematic and does not correspond to our standard idea and the unit was not standard. If you take the LXX and some Masoretic texts record 4.5 units of the distance from the kings hand to the elbow (other most often used 6.5). Putting Goliath between 7 and 9 ft 'long' or 6 and 8 feet tall (from tip to tip vs head to heel). The use of Sauls or Davids forarm unit would also matter by about 1.3-1.8 ft given that Saul was a head taller than most and discounting the fact that David was likely less than average in stature. Then there is the short and long cubit which is the difference between curled and straight fingers. There is not a question that he was a big man warrior, literally and figuratively. But the giant angel baby myth is just gnostic garbage. Dynastic rulers and their supporters have solidified their power and authority claiming some link to heaven for a long time.

The One you call Jesus was about 5'7" and 145lbs.