Why stop there. All government data should become public domain and they should be forced to live stream everything they do at all times while serving.
we should replace people and have an open source AI algorithm to rule the world, where our votes would count towards new implementations (like pull requests)
@@Petersilie161 how do you suppose he does that when it's END TO END ENCRYPTED... They don't know what their customers are sending through the platform by design. This is exactly what the comment OP means by criminalising E2E encryption. By going after the creator they're sending a message to other E2E apps that they're not safe.
@@Petersilie161how can you do something against it if it’s end to end encrypted? You don’t know anything about what’s being discussed. Are you going to ban whispering in someone’s ear too then?
That is something applyable to the real world. Market laws are not equal to moral laws. Just because you can sell something it doesn't mean you should sell it.
No. What you said does not go by their logic. Telegram can prevent most illegal activities by cooperating with the officials but a knife maker cannot install a camera and a tracker on a knife. Makes sense?
@@coffeeScryer Simple answer. It can be taken out or you can physically mess with the parts and not be held accountable because it is a knife and will be used against tough stuff. Can you enable E2E on a social media platform that doesn't support it? You can't. There's nothing you can do about it. And apart from that, you need to work on your analytical skills.
exactly what I've been telling. if those law enforcement agencies want to access our data they should share their messages first and show us what's on their devices.
Criminalising end 2 end encryption is basically like criminalising privacy, it’s like criminalising people speaking quietly or going to a different room to have a discussion in private, something thats basically a human right.
Are you kidding, what kind of extremism and terrorism? The fact that Pasha does not give away the keys to the TG does not mean that he supports it. On the contrary, he protects ordinary people from draining correspondence and personal data!
I actually heard TG gave the keys to Putin years ago, thus ending, also with The Internet Soverignhty Act, the end of free Russian internet (very dangerous). Now Im hearing Putin doesnt have em?
Well he gave keys and has been banning anti-Kremlin materials, so telegram is not free. Remember the last "free" elections? Well so-called "smart voting" was banned by Telegram. Remember the movement of wifes of mobilized Russian vatniks? Their telegram group was banned as well. Durov is in a very tight connections with FSB and Russian government. + Telegram officially collaborates with the governments of Iran and Indonesia. Why shouldn't it be collaborating with democratic countries while having tight connections to totalitarian anti-humane regimes?
exactly, people are failing to graps that... a more exaggerated example would be that u can't invade people's houses with the excuse of stopping terrorism when u just want private data... similarly u can't criminalise encryption because that would be criminal to all other people.... 😅😅
their rhetoric is "he doesn't cooperate when we try to capture criminals". Not "he supports them". The same was in russia, and russian government get off of his back only when he cooperated to catch terrorists
The russians are currently urging their elites to delete their communications on telegram so they probably had a backdoor and are afraid the french now have it too.
I love it how everyone constantly talks about how he left Russia because Russian authorities wanted him to cooperate with them, but nobody mentions that he left USA because U.S. authorities wanted him to cooperate with them
Anyone capable of critical thinking is aware of these Western double standards. There is another issue, however. Pavel Durov has always been a US government asset. VK was literally created by US Big Tech for the US government as a bridgehead in the Russian internet, and Durov was just a figurehead.
Funny that the Russian government wanted access and he said no, they let him leave the country peacefully. Now the French wanted the same thing and he said no, so they decide to imprison him. Clown world.
This is an attack on western society. They want our privacy gone, our money controlled through CBDCs, they want us in a cage, a tiny one at that, doing nothing more than the little we're allowed in our future 15 min cities. Tools like telegram need to be gone. If successful, then tools like signal will be next. Ultimately they want privacy to be outlawed and any1 insisting on it will be deemed a criminal because "u can only want privacy if u have something to hide". The future is bring.
@@Exoskel2 Because Russia relies on Telegram to spread it's propaganda about war etc. They banned the signal app that provided true encryption. The Russian government is exactly the same as the west.
By this logic, the inventors of cellphones, planes, automobiles and even electricity should all be condemned and held accountable since they faciliated so many terrorists attacks
If they were repeatedly asked by the authorities to block public terrorrist/drug dealing communication channels that are supposed to be under their moderation but declined this totally legal request, then yes.
@@yuriy5376communication providers are not responsible for what is communicated over their networks. They are protected by having common carrier status.
@@Diablokiller999 The "law" has become so convoluted with so much different crap shoved into it that you can literally be charged for anything and jailed for anything if there are enough lawyers and money involved.
But Telegram is the only place I could find a lot of uncensored study materials for free😢, and it really help me a lot in my studies especially in biology
Dark web Got a lot of research papers and stuff on that one website i can't remember the name of, but it got so much That's the only option if this is gonna die
Stop being idiots. It's just basic french laws about responsabilities of publishers. Internet social media owners are treated like newspaper editors over here and need to follow the same rules regarding the content on their platform, very basic stuff. Unless there's a risk he'll flee the country, he probably won't spend a day in prison.
The feds tried to ban PGP back in the day, classifying the cryptographic algorithms as “munitions” to prevent them from being distributed. The creator got around it by publishing the code in a book which was protected by the 1st Amendment. It’s crazy that the war on encryption is still raging on.
to be fair. government should be the only one who can judge what was legal or not under cypher. But modern wester gobernments are politically corrupted, so they can use your messages against your political career.
everybody claims the chinese and russians steal american tech but the US govt and its stupid fucking corporate lackeys do the same shit from actual american citizens that come up with stuff
Encryption was classified as munitions since encryption was used in war. Meaning always. PGP can be distributed today because the limits of "war grade" encryption have been raised. This is a really badly understood interpretation of what happened. Nobody banned PGP specifically, the laws had been in place for decades. Pgp just broke them, but it was important enough to change laws (at the usual pace of law making)
His situation is an interesting illustration of the price one might pay for seeking true freedom and unfiltered information flow. His pioneering work with Telegram, while controversial, has made a significant impact on how we perceive and use social media.
I wish having privacy was illegal and the systems in place wouldn't allow other to take advantage of it, like some automated LLM that would see everything and if something illegal was going on, either by in real life conversation/actions/body movement or online, it would take notice and law enforcement would take action.. unfortunately that is too utopic
He won't face anything at all. And no it's not about 'having encryption' or whatever. It's about not moderating his social media and not allowing french courts to access personal data when a case is underway.
He's been charged with fraud, money laundering and sanctions evasion. The telegram stuff is basically because they tho k he's using the platform to facilitate this activity.
@@azertyuiopqsdfghjklm Jesus, bot, calm down and stop shitposting under every comment. Yes, you can try hard, but Macron daddy won't accept you to his harem, unless you're not a fresh lunopopik.
That Mike Lynch bit is crazy. I saw the headline, but never read the article. They literally took him, his character witness out on the yacht, and then his co defendant in a car "accident". We are officially living in the Bourne movies.
I mean they really are going a bit too far, we get it, you're the ones in power, but they're getting impatient with it... Absolute joke of a world... NOT AN ACCIDENT!
They can express their opinion, they should just make sure it's end to end encrypted when they do so we don't know who is saying it. Otherwise you know, going to be consequences for these kinds of people eventually, assuming they don't end up in a bunker taking the easy way out like others of their kind.
@@akirathedog777 There you go. You showed your hand. I dislike Musk too but you don't care about injustice. You're just a brokie hating on people who have money. inb4 you call me a bootlicker or some dumb shit because you have no actual counterargument.
The struggle for privacy and unfiltered information is more crucial today than ever before. This case clearly marks an essential divergence between two ideologies, corporate/government control and individual freedom.
In 1848, there were revolutions across Europe that fought against government overreach and police states. One of the outcomes was the right to privacy - the government was henceforward forbidden from opening your mail. All this progress has been rolled back since 9/11. If the government is forbidden from reading your mail, why should they be allowed to install a trojan on your phone to read your electronic messages?
If Telegram is in trouble for "lack of moderation and cooperation with law enforcement", that means that messaging service that is not in trouble is actively moderating and cooperating with law enforcement. Which means they can read your chat. That's supposed to be news, I guess.
If you host a meth lab in your house, the police asks you to give access to the premises, and you repeatedly decline it, would you play victim in this situation?
@@yuriy5376 imagine you are a pig in a den and american authorities come to slaugher you for salo, but den keeper stops them and gets arrested for it. Oh wait, you don't need to imagine😬
@@epajarjestys9981I'm fairly certain he did. Calling 3 letter agency workers glowies comes from Terry saying they glow in the dark when you drive at night
I plan to retire at the end of 2025 at 62 after 36 years in Telecom as a sales engineer. My wife will retire in May 2026 and she's loving life! But walking away from a good income stream and building the nest egg to living from the nest egg is a scary proposition couple with the alarming recession and CPI report
I feel your pain mate, as a fellow retiree, I'd suggest you look into passive index fund investing and learn some more. For me, I had my share of ups and downs when I first started looking for a consistent passive income so I hired an expert advisor for aid, and following her advice, I poured $30k in value stocks and digital assets, Up to 200k so far and pretty sure I'm ready for whatever comes.
My advice: for newbies to grow financially this year, invest. Saving is good, but investing elevates your finances. Why newbie make huge losses on trade is because investing without proper guidance can lead to mistakes and losses. that will stop you from trading, this has been one of the biggest problem to new traders, I've learned this from my own experience
Tracy Britt Cool Consulting was my hope during the 'bear summer' last year. I made so many mistakes but also learned so much from it, and of course from Tracy.
Uh.. the mainstream newspapers that I religiously read everyday and that never lie say it was a suicide and there's nothing else to talk about it, I guess I'll trust them..
@@ceoatcrystalsoft4942 they tried to. basically failed to do so, and then somehow Telegram wasn't banned anymore. even official news channels were using it so their channels names were shown on TV screen. I don't know why they switched, but it sound sus.
@@ceoatcrystalsoft4942 Telegram isn't blocked in Russia. There was an attempt by some retarded politicians in 2018 or so, then the executive department tried to block it but failed miserably and fell back
With all its problems, "the West" is still infinitely more free than Russia. Russian propaganda literally has a talking point of "West is evil censoring everything, Russia is actually more free!!"
Fun thing... they actually did share data of suspected terrorists on requests. Thing is EU tries to pass the law where police and such will have access to your personal data at any moment without any kind of requests and paperworks. Why? Because they want to get AI to analyse personal data, creating profiles and analysing people's mood so they will know what should be changed in propaganda to make people calmer. So yeah, the worst cyberpunk dystopia is already here.
If you're an FBI agent and you need a backdoor to access users' private chats on some platform, and you're risking the freedom of others to stop terrorist attacks and illegal activities, then you're a really bad FBI agent (because the terrorists will just use another method to communicate, and the only thing you'll leave with - is a fucking backdoor in the app that another criminal will use to steal the user's data) And "it's complicated" is not an excuse. We pay taxes so that the government can solve complex problems, not take the easy way out, which will expose us to the risk of data leaks. Free Pavel Durov
>Pavel refuses to hand over information on Ukrainians using Telegram to the Russian government and has to flee the country >West cheers Pavel refuses to hand over information on other countries' citizens for the same reason >West enraged LoGiC
@@LLlap Pavel Durov refused to comply with the Russian government requests to close rival politicians pages on VKontakte, the company that he created with his brother that is similar to Facebook. He was eventually forced by the Russian government to sell the company to them and flee the country under fear of imprisonment, torture, or death. That's why he moved to the UAE. Please don't speak about things that you have no idea about.
What a fking mess, it's the same as saying that the creators of weapons are involved in murders. Durov gave you freedom, and how you use it is your responsibility
This lack of subtlety is a tool of intimidation. Dictators force people to do absurd things and say absurd lies not because they hope that people will believe in such behaviors, but to remind their servants that they are so completely dependent on the dictator's whim and they must accept them without protest. This is why all evil people in power like being so comically obvious.
He doesn't risk too much in Russia, tho. He deletes Russian oppositional channels or mark them as fake. He just f*** around with western countries, not so much with the FSB.
next is 12th grade maths. Polinomials can lead to you inventing encryption again. Everyone who gets an A in high school is now on a list for potential future terrorist activity.,
No their reason is that he doesn‘t do enough to prevent those crimes, that‘s a different thing. Still does make zero sense, what should he do against it
@@apacheaccountant9757 What exactly is going on? He owns a platform that enables drug selling and terrorism and does not cooperate to moderate it. Ofc he has to be punished then.
@@werryl7448 You can make your own end to end encryption. Its not that hard you think the drug sellers and terrorists don't have this? And how is the fight against those going? There is still drugs. Terrorist attack are getting worse but less reported by media🤣 Those thing will keep going even with no telegram.
But you need to verify your channel first for minimum req Its "channel" not your "ID" After that you good to go Downside! Payment go through Ton token not cash or visa
@@yuriy5376 stop spam, are you government bot, hater, idiot, or what? And why you use few different opinions as your own, depending on the comment you're anserwing to?
Haha, you're right. The funny thing is that there are many Western agents in Russia who are trying to look like the media and the opposition. They criticize everything in Russia, but now they are silent about Durov’s arrest.
@@yyyy-uv3po, и присел он, кстати говоря, не за свои политические высказывания, а за свои финансовые махинации. по тебе видно, что ты не следишь за ситуацией, но тянешь за политику. ты дурачок, не лезь сюда)
What I don't get is why the Telegram guy got arrested but not the Signal guy, even though Signal is supposedly way more encrypted and private. To be honest, it just makes Signal a little sus to me... of course, I have no evidence. But never underestimate state actors
Durov : I’m leaving Russia where free speech and human rights are not respected to the west The West : 😂😂 we don’t respect it either, we just make it our value in books so our citizens know we’re the good guys and Russia is the bad guy
West: tries to criminalize e2ee russia: 1 step forward in this race - already banned Signal, multiple attempts on banning telegram in the past so it's more like "we're becoming bad guys, but look at russia, it is even worse, so we are still good in comparison"
i agree, but it does not apply to the United States (there were some exceptions but those were exceptions). the US is the only free country, unironically lol France, the UK and such - are just EuroSovok (EuroSovietUnion), unfortunately.
No, Russia truly is the bad guy, not just making them seem this way. If you don't believe me, go to Russia and start criticizing the government or their invasion of Ukraine. You'll be instantly thrown in jail without any option to defend yourself. Buuut, what the west is doing is not good either and they're supposed to protect our freedoms. The problem is: what are we going to do when no country on this planet truly allows free speech 🤔 PS: I really don't think any acts of terrorism should be allowed to be organized through an app, but governments can't hold the platform owner accountable for this.
@@youknowwhatlol6628 Snowden? Assange? Chelsea Manning? These are not mere exceptions, these are very big cases. The US is not actually free, it just gives people more superficial freedom than some other countries, but I don't think that it's better than Canada, Japan, Sweden or Finland in that department.
and if he disagrees he suddenly becomes suicidal or has a deadly car accident🤷🏼♀️his co-founders also have deadly accidents around the same time⌚ these things may look designed but are actually not designed🤫
The more politics take over private life, the more people forget the most important phrases that found western society: "mal usum non tollit usum" and "nullum crimen sine culpa", you cannot be blamed for other peoples actions.
The problem is 8 out of 10 people are okay with losing all privacy because of "think of the children and I have nothing to hide". So this will continue...
Huh. Do you really want those videos of people getting their heads cut off and other sort of violence exist on such messaging apps like Telegram? If yes, then good luck man. I find it funny btw how many people take his side without even realizing the point of his detention. You all want everything to be private, but you don't even think about the consequences.
@@advance5189I don't want beheadings to happen in general. Video recordings of those are gross, disturbing and inevitable on the Internet, and I wouldn't want to be around a person that I know watches them and finds excuses to keep watching them, but that's why I DON'T WANT TO KNOW if someone watches that stuff, and snuff in general. I know there can be a perfectly adjusted member of society whose oddity is watching gore on the side, I just find it hard to let my bias not guide me once I know something private about a person I have a strong opinion on. The solution is allowing people their privacy, now knowing about a person more than they need to, and expect the same courtesy be extended to me. Privacy is what maintains identity and diversity of thought, and both of these are vital if you want a people-centred political system when you put different opinions in the ring and see which wins out. Homogeneity of thought because nobody is allowed to think differently or support different thinkers for risking ostracization means there is no opponent in the ring, and only those in control of the information ever win.
@@jaideepshekhar4621 I don’t, but at least I want Telegram moderate content itself. Anyway, everything should be always open for security services. If Big Brother comes to Pavel Durov and says “Here’s a warrant for you, please give us the keys to your ciphers so we can find a person X who’s engaged in terrorism ”, he’s obligated to give them that info. Every country has its own set of rules and you must adhere to them, no matter what.
The motto is older than the USA. It used to be like this, but we've unfortunately grown very socialist and authoritarian since then. Particularly in the last 50 years
Your understanding of liberty is childish. No country, not even the USA, allows for infinite unquestionable, unlimited freedom to do or say whatever you want. In french laws, social media owners are treated with the same law as newspaper publishers and as such are asked to moderate their content. Simple as that.
It was only free and open long enough until the Overton window brought freedom to a sufficient number of people who learned to think for themselves. Then... well... they cracked down.
Europe: freedom of speech, we're "civilized" Also europe: criminalize end to end encryption - the last bit of tool people have at their disposal to be truly free! Wow! ✌️
@werryl7448 Maybe you should watch the video and read his comment again. EU does not only want to ban e2e, they also are hard at work to suppress freedom of speech under the mantle of "hatespeech"
I noticed that when talking with Americans on the internet, Europeans are very proud of how they don't have free speech. They consider it an advantage lol.
Absolutely eye-opening, encapsulates the delicate dance between tech pioneers, privacy, and governmental authorities worldwide. The spotlight on Telegram's functionality and its accusations are particularly interesting.
Lincoln's often quoted lines “ You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all of the time “ means that ( one could tell lies and get away with it but not always .)
when are they gonna arrest zuck, gates,musk, bezos, Dorsy, google guys since all their companies have also abetted in some crime. if they want to make an example put of telegram guy then why wouldn't they go for the big fishes
Musk was actually pressured for Twitter not going for political censorship as it was before he bought it. So he might be next. Zuck and the rest - they are the one who pull the strings in the government to end their rivals. Heard of Blackrock? Check its relationship with western IT giants and news outlets.
Zuck works directly for CIA, literally was financed by them (and so his social media). And most of who you mentioned are part of the system (the Oligarchy).
Those companies already cooperate with them and give them whatever information they want and more. Some of the higher ups in these companies are working with the Pentagon. Bezos even tried to get a seat at the Security Council. And both his and Musk's space companies have contracts with the Pentagon. Also, Assange wrote a book about Google I'd recommend if you're interested in how interconnected big tech companies and government is.
@I.K.illedThatBeardGuytransplants don't grow new hair, they just displace from the back to the front. If you're too far gone the only option is to shave it because no money in the world will save you (ie: Bezos)
@@TypeScriptTV Mike Lynch was an avid James Bond fan. He did not die as the media is saying. He publicly died at sea but instead escaped to a nearby submarine. From there, he was fired in a specially modified torpedo to New Zealand where he will link up with Zuck and others before they finally dustoff for Antarctica. It is all part of the plan.
Noooo, Telegram is literally my cloud. I upload everything on it, even big files as splitted rar file and I have been using it for 6 years. Also I really love stickers it offers.
You thinking and understanding is constrained by the media. Both the government and courts are controlled and owned by the corporations/oligarchs. As well as media and most of social networks.
