Building and Discussing FEMALE Space Marines: PROBLEM? 

"Your Space Marines could be vikings, they could be medival knights, they could be ninjas, they could be blue, they could be vampires..." Bruh, I'm dying...

There needs to be more Guard ladies models. They are lore friendly and gives more options other then space nuns.

"They can be Vikings, they can medieval knights, they can be ninjas, they can be blue -" *And that is where I died laughing!*

Why not use Female Stormcast heads for the faces? The scale would transfer over quite nicely if you ask me. And you get plenty from a kit of Sequitors or Vindictors.

Female Primarchs more civilized? I can understand that Big E thought it was a joke by Malcador. The infighting by women is horrible. Especially if they are related at times.

I know it's not really something about the video but what paints do you use for priming and zenithal

Wow your paint job on their faces are immaculate! +1 success

See, I like the fact that the imperium is a fanatical and mostly idiotic theocracy, and so the idea of Space Marines/"brothers"/monks and Sisters of Battle/nuns being separate kind of appeals to me. Totally agree that the Sisters could do with more variety, though, if they're going to keep it that way. And obviously people should kitbash whatever the heck they want. Mostly, though, I'm just fascinated by the fact that you made this video and the comments section is... *checks notes* completely friendly and constructive and people are just talking about ways they would do it and what they like about it. Made me remember why this is one of my favorite Warhammer-adjacent channels on the Youtoobz.

I think some chapters could utilise longer hair styles, such as blood angels or space wolves

Nah, Deathwatch didn't steal those hyperphase swords from the Necrons. I know because the Necron hyperphase weapons aren't as good as what Deathwatch use. No, I'm not bitter, why'd you ask? ...I just want my Skorpekhs to be even more killy, is that too much to ask...

I've been trying to find a video on how to fix heads onto marines with a sort of collar - i can see you're using something like that at the end of the vid - have you got a seperate one on this? I'm a noob, sorry

I guess I should be extra thankful for the crowd that I hobby and game with, because we would just never have to have this argument.. I find being strict with lore and model customizing almost antithetical to what mini wargaming is for me, and I’m glad I don’t mess with such folk

I’ve been teaching my niece and nephew about 40K the past few months. Telling them about the lore & all, a few weeks ago they told me they want to play the game & in particular Kill Team. Grabbed some of my Orks & Blood Angels and we played a few games of Kill Team. Last week they asked me if I could help them paint their own armies & I said sure. My nephew went with Black Templars, my niece asked me if all Space Marines were male & I told her lore wise yes but if she wanted to make FSM we could kitbash & make lore about her FSM. She wasn’t to excited about that idea, she was thinking of going with World Eaters CSM & Khorne demons, we walked into the local hobby store; my nephew goes & grabs the Black Templars box set. My niece was looking around the store then she tells me to come to what she’s looking at. She was looking at the Sisters combat patrol box; she said “I thought there weren’t female space marines” I told her that’s the sisters not space marines. Then it clicked with her she remembered me telling her about the sisters & how crazy & fanatical they are so I got her the combat patrol. When we came back home I asked her if she wanted to kitbash & make the sisters FSM & she said no, there crazy & fanatical maybe as crazy as space marines but just regular humans. She said something along the lines of space marines need all the surgeries to make them super human & to fight all the crazy stuff in 40K, sisters just need the holy trinity & faith in the god emperor & the psycho nuns are ready to go. If people want to make their own FSM fine with that, gave my niece the option but it just made her more of a sisters fan since there regular humans. The idea of ol Fabious Bile making FSM would make for some interesting lore if GW wanted to do that. I’d read it some of Biles stories are crazy!

I'm super impressed by the way anvil industries were able to make those heads so feminine without hair. Love their products

▶0:00 Color me *_Shocked._* ▶6:36 Just because Malcador wasn't speaking *_FACETIOUSLY._* (i,e, wasn't joking) doesn't pre-suppose that it *_WOULD_*_ be _*_possible._*

where did you find the necron tomb world base ?

You handeled this topic far better than templin Institute, he took the low road and as a dick you were nothing but kind and you gave straight up lore facts not some pseudo philosophical bullshit about canon not mattering. Congrats man!

Funny how no one mentions modern day army.... For the most hardcore sections of the military, paratroopers/American Special Operations Forces, women make up less than 10%. Even then they are not generally front line combatants. The answer is actually very simply, strength. Yeah, they have trouble passing the same fitness test that men take. Even in other forces such as Navy/Army, women have an easier fitness test than their male counter parts. If the Emperor wanted his space marines to be the best fighters no question asked then they would all be men. I remember taking my fitness exam for the Royal Navy and watching women finish the running sooner than us (bleep test) because they didn't have high requirements like us. So no, women shouldn't be in the Adeptus Astartes unless the chapter that they are in are not fighters. A good example of sex difference from my history was in the RAF, the military was terrified of what would happen to a female pilot if she was shot down in Afghan territory that they made it so only men would fly recon there. A friend of mine loved flying but had less opportunities to fly than her male counterparts so she was regulated to test flying and local (UK) ops. In the end after they put her in Intelligence she just retired as it wasn't what she signed up for. I agree with the military's decision, if a man is shot down and captured, he is tortured and killed. A woman on the other hand is probably tortured, raped and then killed. Looks way worse in the eyes of the public. Also trans UFC fighter Fallon Fox (who was taking his blockers and following all of the rules set by the UFC) still one sided a fight that was supposed to be close. Her opponent suffered a rare case of a broken Orbital Bone. That is very rare to occur especially in female boxing. Fallon Fox was forced into retirement by the UFC as a number of female fighters began to refuse to enter the cage with her which meant it was hard to make the fights profitable.

oh and the faces turned out amazing, the purple undercoat is a great idea i havent done before, will give it a try

I'm surprised at how articulate you were. I like this take, and I hope you keep speaking your mind on things.

"The process by which Space Marines are created relies inherently on the hormonal and biological make-up of the human male, meaning that only males can be subjected to the transformation." -Horus Heresy 2.0 Rule Book.

I don’t want female space marines, because that means gw has an excuse to make more space marine models.

These gals are something I would ask someone to make for me because I can't paint faces I'm terrible at it

Hey Jay! I think your catchphrase should be "Super easy, barely an inconvenience"! I think it would totalllllly catch on :D

You put an extra effort in editing this video !

Excellent job converting them by a simple head swap. That is by far the most realistic way to do it!

Fabulous Bill introducing female Space Marines also comes with the interesting note that Bile isn't really a servant of Chaos. This actually leaves a lot of narrative flexibility for them to defect to the Imperium. (To spread the wealth) I've also heard it suggested the missing Primarch's could be revealed to be female. Heck even with Cawl's unlocking of Primaris it would be easy to say that he made some just because he could, very Cawl. There are a million ways to do it, there just needs to be the will on GW's side to do it. All they need to add is some head sculpts.

Why space marines choose to not wear helmets still confuses me

Why couldn't Archmagos Dominus Belisarius Cawl create daughters for Roboute Guilliman. Cawl does believe in using all of humanity to fight the enemies of Mankind.

“They can be blue,” that killed me 💀

stormcast heads are also perfectly sized to diversify your head options as well. people are throwing these at you as soon as you show interest anyway, especially from the dominion box

So the solution is to put very slightly female "shaped" heads on normal (male) Space Marine bodies? I dont get it.

I heard the emperor didn't want them because he didn't want them to have a method of independent procreation, as they would break off and be a threat to humanity like the chaos space marines.

Excellent head painting tutorial.

It's ok that Space Marines are exclusively male and are a brotherhood the same way it is ok that the SoB are exclusively female and are a sisterhood. They can both exist in the same space as the Imperial Guard who are multi-gendered.

While the job was well done, they don’t really look like woman, and that is sorta the reason I don’t see it really working in lore sense like, sure, go for what you want, power to you as a player, but, a space marine isn’t a human, they are soldiers, they lose their identity and become that, sure some have roles and personality, but that is the writers job, otherwise, at the end of the day, it doesn’t really matter, if you view the space marines as male marines then it’s not the point of the marines

This is always a loaded question lmao. The only correct stance is 'do what you want with your army.' You can ignore the lore and do what you want as it's really just loose guidelines and suggestions, but don't expect the actual Canon to change.

Honestly, bringing up Bile was a pretty decent point, because chaos is the most likely place to find FSMs. To my knowledge while there haven't been actual, technical space marines with their own geneseed and modifications, women in the traitor legions is already a thing. In Storm of Iron a guardswoman wound up bonding with the daemonic armor of an Iron Warrior (technically a possession but it might almost qualify depending on the definition) and in the Fabius Bile books the leader of the 12th Millennial of the Emperor's Children is Lady Savona, whose been granted mutations by Slaanesh that allow her to be tall enough to wear modified legion armor and physically capable enough to be accepted by the Emperor's Children (even if most don't openly acknowledge her authority as it goes against tradition). I think the most direct analogy would be in Harrowmaster where a dark mechanicus biologist created his own genetically modified soldiers who wore stolen power armor, some of whom were female (their mods weren't the same as astartes, its not really gone into what exactly the dark mech did to them, just that's different).

Well, now we know what jay was talking about at the start of the speedpaints video

There's a massive disparity from the consensus of agreement in the comments and the ratio of up and downvotes. Gross dudes get mad, downvote, and probably don't even watch. Whatever. Enragement is engagement too!

I built an entire army out of those two 'adventurer' figures - HEAVILY converted the poses, all new heads (mostly converted Dark Elf heads), weapons, etc. This was back in '94-'96. Jervis J was NOT impressed at Toronto Grand Tourney - he thought the idea of Female Space marines was bunk. THAT said, I should have just built them as Sisters. For those of a mind, we have the Adepta Sororitas -GREAT figs and lore. Those two figs didn't sell well as the were only advertised for the Timescape supplement for Talisman (!). The were only available in strangely distributed blisters. I ordered my 50 through GW UK mail order.

I'm not 100% against lady space marines but seeing as the lore leans so heavily into fraternal brotherhoods, I would expect something similar for lady space marines. Either that or a group of space marines that has abandoned the teachings of the Adeptus Astartes. I guess they'd be traitors at that point.

I mean, Option 2 for how to bring them into lore is... well, we have two missing legions. we know nothing of them. no one knows anything about them other then they existed and they don't now. easy as saying Malcador made the male Primearchs think they only had brothers, have the missing two be sisters who normally had males in the legions because the Emperor wanted to prove a point to Malcador, and that is why when they were taken in by the other legions without questions or other problems, have the reason they were forgotten be big, but so we keep the 50/50 split, have it so one was loyal to the end, but her gene seed was corrupted from the warp really heavily, and the other was a did turn her back on the Emperor, and fell to chaos in a different way to her brothers, waiting in the warp as she trained up a new army.

Malcadores quote enforces the ani argument. Th emperor would have to specialize the geneseed for the female genome

I truly don't believe people hate the Idea of female space marines. I think people are just tired of seeing the lore of every popular franchise being re-written and this adding absolutely nothing to said franchise. Dr Who. Star Trek. Tolkien. Star Wars. Scooby-doo. Cowboy Bebop. Witcher. How will female space marines make 40K better? Sincerely asking.

Love the thinly veiled slight on the Ultramarines 😂🤣

Here's my reason why I don't want female Space Marines, 1.) Make something cooler, Space Marines follow a genetic template and modifying them is heretical. I do have to call this weakish though as the Primaris exist but I also would've preferred they just upscaled old marines so we didn't have this weird old marine/primaris divide and vehicles unable be used between the two on tabletop. GW money machine gotta go brrrrrt though. We have too many Space Marine models, last thing we need is another subrange to this already model dominating faction. 2.) The Sisters of Battle exist. SoB are already practically female space marines. They use the same arsenal and are clad in power armor. If anything maybe they could get a heavier unit that is closer in style to Space Marine armor? It seems like old marines are slowly dwindling so maybe a redesign or refresh of all their old gear gets funneled to the SoB for some heavier infantry. It would be a great way to continue to flush out a faction. 3.) Chaos Lady Marines. Now I can definitely get behind Chaos doing female Space Marines. They are already heretics, why not just do more heresy to increase their ranks even further and be able to essentially now have their own pseudo sisters faction. I've been waiting for this to occur for quite some time and am honestly surprised it hasn't. 4.) Disclaimer: Yes I understand rule of cool is awesome and the lore isn't always exactly linear or set in stone in 40K and yes lore can change. Reason: The current GW lore doesn't allow their existence and for right now I think that's okay. I'm sure it'd be entirely possible for them to lore them into the faction as you'd stated in the video but I'd rather they do something cooler and better. Plus we already have SoB. Maybe something similar to the Votann can come along with a Matriarchy that uses amazing gene enhanced Space Ladies. The galaxy is vast and I'm sure there's plenty of human civilizations out there undiscovered. Obviously the above are a matter of opinion but I would just rather have a cooler "Female Space Marine" faction than another range addition/refresh. I'm not going to ever not play a game with someone if they bring 3D printed or kit bashed female models, I would just rather GW not add more to an already over-done faction model wise. Great job on the Kill Team!

This is just wrong. If you want female warriors in the grim dark universe, you have the sister of battle.

I don't need female Space Marine - and mine are all guys - I appreciate that they added female Astra Militarum tho. Also: Sisters of Battle are a much more epic representation, think about it, they have no body augumentation or extra organs - they're still much more human than a Space Marine Through Discipline, Willpower and FAITH they can go toe to toe with anything a Space Marine faces as well.

Love the vertical style of the heads.

As by much as people get all weird about it, there's a female cop in my area that is an absolute badass strong silent tank of a human. She could definitely be a space marine.

I've always wondered, if GW had added Female Space Marines with the Primaris upgrade would Primaris they be more or less hated?

I just don't see any need to add them honestly, if people want to kitbash their own narrative that's fine, but this is an aspect of 40k worldbuilding that's been around since its inception. Is it so hard to believe that the ruthless imperium of man would only select the biggest, strongest (male) individuals to become the absolute hyper elite of their military? Your suggestion for some Fabious Bile shenanigans is a better one than just shoehorning them in though

That green underglow is amazing!!!!

Lore wise? no. Custom wise? sure why not?

Personally, I think it is fair and right if a fictional universe has a fictional faction with only warrior men who do warrior men stuff. But I like your Fabious Bile approach and, if I am not mistaken, he already made early ubermenschen both male and female. There will probably not be a new Chaos Space Marine box until 2050, but maybe an upgrade sprew once Creations of Bile becomes a standalone faction. Around 2040.

Kitbashes are way cooler than lore friendly

You mentioned Fabius Bile, but also, Belesarius Cawl could probably do it and Crovus Coraax DEFINATELY know how to create Gene-seed... if he could ever get pause his Warp-rampage Hate-on against Fulgrim and get over the failure of his Raptors enough to try.

Maybe it's the beer in me but I felt compelled to throw my 2 cents in that nobody asked for. I served in the U.S. Marine Corps many years ago. It's a common statement to say that all Marines are my brothers. That doesn't mean that all U.S. Marines are men. There are a whole lot of female Marines. When encountering said females I will refer to them as my sisters, but if there isn't one around then it's still referred to as a brotherhood. A person can say that is misogynistic but it's not intended to be. It's just how things are said. I think the biggest argument against female Space Marines is due to how females have been treated in the past and what has been "beaten" into our heads. Today females can have combat jobs in the military. They have proven that they have that ability. During my time women were given jobs that were less likely to actually see combat but it was possible. Before my time they were given jobs that shouldn't see combat at all by the rules of war. As strange as it may seem, I think my generation is in a mixed mindset toward female warriors. There have been very few real ones, due to rules and laws, so when we do see some it's either super sexy and hot or an abomination that goes against everything we were taught. I know you were talking about game lore and not real life but I think real life is part of the reason people have problems with female space marines.

I remember making a female space marine scout unit back in the 90's using the original scout kit and escher ganger heads. Looked crap but made my marines look different

I swear the sisters of battle were meant to be female space marines or at least the equivalent of a female space marine

It could be because women are like old tribal times, where there too important to lose 15% more women in the process of creating space marines, they lose enough in the guard.

"Faces are... HARD". True, but, in all honestly, your result is why you are a pro (not sure you wish to define yourself as such but it's time to face reality) and I am not 😉

Plus 50 ESG points!

Really well done on the faces!

I wonder if Escher heads from Necromunda

There has been note within the Horus Heresy 2.0 rule books that the Space Marine augmentation process is reliant on male biology to function, but I do get that Jay doesn't enjoy HH as much so wouldn't have read them. As for my thoughts, I don't mind people's personal hobby having them just like I don't mind custom chapters or making their own force within a chapter. Just don't like it being pushed on people or acting like it should be canon. I'll probably grab some of the exo lord heads myself for fun. Given the existing lore, which has been retouched in 2022 in the previously mentioned HH books, I don't think there should be female space marines retconned into the setting. IF they are to be added, have it be part of a modification of Primaris geneseed and the new humans from Fabius Bill for the Chaos side. Given the physical potential which can be seen with women at their physical peak, compared to men at their peak, having the female primaris coming from a more involved process would be best to explain the rarity of them. In terms of the creative options and flexibility, I'd prefer for there to be more options on offer for the Sisters of Battle so it is easier to make a custom force or alternative force in canon.

nice vid. can't say I agree tho

Why female space Marines? Just make more diverse sisters of battle or make primaris sisters which would be gene augmented sisters of battle, so that the space Marines dont change and the sisters of battle become space marines lite.

Hell yeah, anvil head are the most perfect base for cool ass conversions!!!

Honestly don't hate your idea about Fabius Bile creating "female space marines" as part of his numen project. Also opens up room for more Slaaneshi body horror stuff and perhaps even corrupted Sisters of Battle. Neat idea.

I like your take on how they could be implemented in the lore at the end. Well thought out I'd say. I also love how they came out; very well done, especially the faces!

if there are to be female space mariens then there should be male siter of Battel

Ngl i feel like "Women Space Marines arent lore freindly" kinda lost any weight when Primaris Marines arrived. If Cawl can fuck with the creation of standard marines, then its easy to make Female Marines.

The only rule that matters... The Rule of Cool

why not or all female succession chapters of marines

"They can be blue!"

I recently assembled a bunch of Emperor’s Children and used Sister heads on some because of the reasons you said. Chaos/Slaanesh/Bile absolutely would welcome women with open arms and double an already limited recruitment pool.

We don't want weak women in our armies, why should the Space Marines? - However, if big chest, I don't care.

I’ve made a female phaeron for Necrons. Female models are easy in most armies. Problem with marines is you would need a female primarch. It’s not a sexist thing. It’s not a sex thing , only possible way is to ether have a missing legion primarch as female. Or to get new female primarchs. I would like to see female marines as so many women are in the hobby know and I love ❤️ it. But to do this you need a way in lore wise

This always seemed to be a bit of a mute issue to me. With one side trying avoid change because "change bad" and the other side being disingenuous and just trying to change it for the sake of changing it. I personally lean towards the don't change it side of things but that's just because this would presumably also come with an increase in space marine prices.

Why is this even discussed? Astartes can only be male due to biological reasons. Sister of battle are also super cool. Sisters of silence are also cool. No need to change 40 year old lore, just because the world turns fake woke.

2 legions have been removed from Terran history

"they can be blue" lol

I always had the impression that its not to have female space marine, but the fact that one you pump a body full of drugs, hormones and steroid to a woman, and add the gene mods, basically you end with a... "Male" space marine anyway i expect they start to grow beard and mustache too to the end, such how much combat drugs and so on they are on.

As a chaos marine player im using sisters of battle as the slaanesh female units to me the sisters work well but if people didn't know unlike space marines 100% men sisters of battle does have male units its like they just can't let it be full female tbh I like the way it is already but if you want female marines more power to you dont let anyone stop you. Like if you want something to help you enjoy your army do it. I am working on lizard marines as part of my chaos marines under khorne and I wanna do some slaanesh marines with tentacles maybe some more female units or parts maybe even female eldar units we shall see :) Anyway enjoy the game you want it doesn't have to be canon if your having fun still

How would you know? With that armor you'd never be able to tell gender. Maybe they're almost all women?

What will come first- Old World or female space marines?

In one of the additions of space Marine codex (believe it's the fifth) you did mention that the genetics for a Astrades is on the y-chromosome specifically.

Sisters are just cooler than female space marines. For sure. Do whatever you want, it's your army; but the fact that sisters exist is just awesome. And nobody is begging for men in the sisters of battle

Why are there no girls allowed in the Space Marines? Because they are brother monks, that's why.

Great stuff friend 👏 👍

I mean, yeah, if you go all they way back to the beginning of the primarch project and change the foundation of the setting for your fan fiction. Topic is a dead horse of a meme. Jay is good at painting, but the malcador quote reads like an Oldman hindsight joke.

If the Sisters of Battle had the same amount of themes as Space Marines (Example: Blood Angels being... Angelic, Space Marines being Furr- Vikings, Ultramarines being Greco Roman etc.) People wouldnt need to wish Femmarines

Super easy, barely an inconvenience!

plot twist all space marines are women

I dont think FSM would work for 40k, for both lore and meta reasons. - Inquisitors wont like it - Sisters DEFINITELY wont like it - They would end up looking the exact same as male space marines after all those enhancements - There is already an all-female human army that are basically female space marines - You can't just "change" the lore here, there's a lot of books that specifically say that space marines are all male... gonna be difficult to retcon that compared to "well necrons seemed like they were just chaos robots, but I guess theyre actually a part of this ancient empire". Meta-wise... Look, I think its perfectly OK for space marines to be the one faction in this one tabletop game set in a scifi/fantasy universe to have an all male group. I think its perfectly OK and I dont see why that, specifically, has to change. If you wanna make your own female space marines... go for it? Like, who cares, make your own army, why not? Anyone who says you cant is dumb and doesnt understand that 40k tabletop is about you making your own army and doing what you want with them. As for RT, thats pretty much an entirely different game. Lets be honest it can't really be used as an example. If GW does do FSM, they'd need to deal with a lot of baggage... and we all know that GW aint good at handling baggage...

How much of a firestorm will the comments be?

Pro Tip. Round shapes are feminine, hard edges are masculine.

What hubrus to even question the God emperors decisions. You think you know better than HIM?