Cardassians Live To Make War 

That was part of my problem with VOY, and ENT

@@50Golf123 I agree

As a teenager, I never fully grasped the power of photon and quantum torpedoes. Even though it was said that one photon torpedo exploding nearby without even hitting the unshielded Enterprise would destroy it outright, I never really thought about how they had more explosive power than nukes, and how quantum torpedoes probably exploded with a mind-boggling force.

Huh? Nuclear weapons are quantum weapons, what we discovered was the uranium was so heavy the weak force could overcome the binding of the strong force, which as the strongest interaction we know of unleashes enormous amounts of energy. Lasers also exist, and they are light, photons, the force carrier of electromagnetism.

@@randomchannel-px6ho my friend, nope. In Star Trek Quantum torpedos destructive Power comes from a mini singularity.

Agreed.

Yeah definitely. It was good to see him really get some great scenes and for O'Brien to have some great development mid-season like this. The episode before this one (Data's Day) gave him some more development too, but this is the superior episode of the two I think, and it gives more context to O'Brien. I'm glad he became a full-time cast member on DS9 even if his arc through most of the series was to be put through ALL the worst stuff :'D

You should check out his work on the "Hell on Wheels" series.

At the same time demoting him from lieutenant to chief (petty officer).

@@jad43701 He was an acting powerhouse in that series

Lovely, insightful comment.

Pretty wild how on the ball they were with PTSD decades before it really started to become appreciated as a debilitating casualty of conflict.

"How could you be so obtuse!"

@@spencergarrison8878 what did you call him?

@@magnusdiridian ~His judgement cometh~ ~and that right soon~

@@spencergarrison8878 I thought it was acute response

@@mrdave5500 It's just been revoked!

Same as maintaining age old voyegour traditions like the Marie time laws, code of honor and onboard protocols not to mention an actual Capts. Logbook! 🍷

i agree my fellow comrade! i agree!

And some of them are totally ridiculous. Native American vision quests in the Holodeck come to mind...

As long as we remain human, it will. And perhaps even beyond that.

The ships councillor really dropped the ball on that one.

reminds me of that episode in which O'Brien deals with the aftermath of having a lifetime of a prison sentence lived out in his mind...

No PTSD, Maxwell knew from experience that the Cardasians were getting ready to start something He just went about it the wrong way

War... War never changes...

Thank you for your service. May God be with all of us.

@@boilerboy He may be a baby-killing war criminal for all you know.

@@beingsshepherd that isnt necessary

@@SuperHarshm Nor was the invasion of Iraq.

@@beingsshepherd i don't disagree, i doubt the poster above made that decision however. He also merely mentioned he was a veteran, not a war or nation. You're assuming much, and the worst of much as well. Nothing can be gained here, so i say let it be.

Good post!!

Something that I always come back to... Is that no war can be averted forever. It will happen again. It always will. Cycles of violence, of warfare come around. The wheel turns. It has never been stopped. With Russia's invasion of Ukraine, War returned to my continent for the first time in my lifetime after decades of Peace. It was always going to happen someday. It can't be stopped. But it can be stopped for now. For a little while longer. Every peace every achieved, every diplomatic overturn. A war between China and the US is inevitable. It will come, someday. And hundreds of thousands will die. But not today. Not next year. Not the year after that. And that is how peace works. That is how you save thousands of lives. Day upon day, year upon year. Pushing it back. Setting back the clock a few minutes. Because there will always be someone, someone on the otherside to whom the prospect of War seems terrifying. Hopeless. Devastating. And whilst those voices prevail, on both sides, peace is secured. Tenuous. Picard isn't naive because he ignores the fact that War is on the Horizon. It is always on the Horizon. Men like Picard are the reason there is peace at all. Willing to sacrifice, willing to make the hard calls to push it back for a few more years. A few more months. Over and over again. That is how Peace happens. War, is Human. It is our default state. Which means, that Peace is *work*. Peace is hard. Peace requires effort, and maintenance and investment and a willingness think beyond who is wrong or right in the moment, and still make the call that needs to happen. Its not a fragile thing ready to be shattered like glass. Peace is a machine. That requires oiling, and smoothing, and sanding. Keeping the machine of peace going, keeping the flame fed.

Like with Russia right now. A history of war and peace only to start the cycle again. But that is just one example of many that still plague society today, syria, iraq, iran, colombia, and all others that are occuring.

But peace did hold, until the intervention of the Dominion, which no one could have foreseen. Yet even if war is inevitable, more years of peace is still a desirable goal.

I think all long time Trek fans think this.

What's funny is that people were saying all of this about TNG when it came out. Complaining about how terrible it is and how it's not real Trek.

Strange New Worlds is really terrific.

STAR TREK as you know it is DEAD.

@@jovetj Nah

More likely O'Brian beamed himself right outside the door, but I like your idea.

@@grayeaglej Thanks!!!!! :D

Except he wasn't crazy. He was right.

@@slade52 Well... yes and no. He was correct, but his intel and actions were really poorly thought out. And it's kind of a situation where he was coincidentally correct more than actually definitively knowing he was right.

@@kamalalsb7292 He saw the obvious for what it most likely was. So much traffic to a simple science outpost is very unlikely, and it location was extremely suspect. That combined with past experiences with the Cardassians, and it's not a stretch that he could deduce what was really going on.

Actually was interested into DS9 and started watching it from e1 because of him. Its the only ST i still rewatch from start to end. Every few years..

He's definitely playing his role as the everyman in this episode.

Lol agreed The "too perfect" act, is just that a act. And people do it now, and it pisses me off. Your live is so relaxed you can act like jesus? Then build the community, to hard? Dont act perfect till you can build bridges wile people try to burn yours at the same time

It is madness, people saying that just because it is better than today. Those are status quo slaves, wanting to just remain in statis in a miserable world. They like material that portrays the present so that it gives them training to deal with it and conditioning to accept it.

Well many episodes with an admiral often show human flaws

You stole the joke I was gonna do. Reported.

@@funkydozer Maybe next time lol

@@Steno316 Being smug: Reported.

I just realized why people are quoting that movie. lol

lol, I can hear his warden voice saying that

It also plays very briefly in the final episode of DS9 - O’Brien picks up the lost Alamo figurine, and chuckles. While it’s zoomed in on him, you can hear a very brief snippet of The Wondering Minstrel Boy

The french horn slowly rising over the sustained strings is gorgeous.

makes me wonder what he did when the dominwar war broke out. feds prob released him, gave him a ship and told him to wreck havoc on the cardissians

He still attacked without orders and without carrying any intelligence. He might have been proven correct, but his methods were still a breach of protocol and regulations. At the very least he should have contacted Picard or the Fleet Admiral. Picard did just that when deploying the tachyon net against the Romulans, not gather a posse himself and play frontier cowboy on the border. The Fleet Admiral gave appropriate orders and relayed it to Command. Maxwell, as a captain could do exactly the same for the Cardassians; even Gul Dukat was willing to stop an arms shipment to Cardassians in the DMZ, at least once the Federation found out. Maxwell did the right thing but with the wrong reasons.

No the biggest omission of DS9 was a halfway decent final confrontation between Sisko and Dukat.

In what way was he vindicated? Even if he was 100% right about the Cardassians' actions (he wasn't), that still wouldn't justify what he did. He doesn't have the authority to simply dispose of the Federation peace treaty and engage in warfare with the Cardassians (aside from defending himself or another Federation ship under direct threat) no matter what evidence he has of their actions. in DS9, the Cardassian empire was being ravaged by the Klingons in their war, so they allied with the Dominion to save themselves, and the Dominion already had designs on conquering the alpha quadrant. The Cardassians may have been happy to come along for that ride, but they didn't themselves initiate war with the Federation.

Maxwell going off half cocked and unnecessarily obliterating a shed load of Cardassian ships isn't really a vindication. He'd be closer to a "vindication" if he simply disabled a Cardassian ship and inspected it. But he started massacring them instead. Maxwell had certain sharp instincts but he was also quite mad.

@@boscovilante4068 exactly. Even if maxwell 100% knew he was correct, all his actions did was risk a sudden start to a war that the cardassians had been preparing for for a long time while the federation would have been caught completely off guard resulting I way more deaths.

😂👏

"When my son looks back on this day, the only thing he'll remember is that a Federation officer on a Federation ship invaded his home, and kept his father away from him on his eleventh birthday. And he won't look back with understanding. He'll look back with hatred. And that's sad." That's what Gul... Macet.. would say...

@@otomicans6580 If it's any consolation, the Dominion probably killed Macet's son, so we're safe there.

Rambo.

But both have murderous friends

Both are onmnipresent leather skinned tyrants

​@Joe Bob Oh come on, don't tell me you never once thought that when you heard the word "Cardassian."

Perfectly written?? 😂 Maybe on a certain level, but there's an omnipresence of lazy writing to push the predermined plot along.

Issues with life vs. issues with death, an interesting dynamic.

It also plays in What You Leave Behind when O'Brien is remembering his time on the station.

Too bad the cops didn't get there before he blew his brains out.

5 stars for the sheer effort, that must have been brewing in your head for a while.

Do those names mean anything, or are they from a non-canon Star Trek book?

@@mardus_ee As Captain Janeway would say: “There’s COFFEE in that nebula!” ☕️☕️

@@jimhills1920 I'm not a coffee drinker. Might you enlighten me further?

@@mardus_ee Maxwell = Maxwell House, Folger = Best part of waking up, Sanka=...uh, Sanka, etc.

The Minstrel Boy is heard again in DS9's finale, when Miles finds the plastic soldier on the floor of his emptied quarters.

The first time it was played in the series as actually at the end of the first episode about Mr. Broccoli (Barclay) and his holosweet addiction. Seems really out of place now.

No, but they could.

Please explain the origin of the beans joke in star trek.

@@Brain_quench This channel's visual theme is beans for some reason. So every video's got to have at least one reference to that in the comments.

@@Brain_quench you have to watch the beans origin story

Great great movie , and to think Caine and Connery were only the 5th choice by John Huston.....

@@koen8185 It was the British version of Butch and Sundance. Definitely a great movie.

Thank you! The hero worship of Sisko makes me want to puke

@@Mark-xh8md Captain Sisko initiated a retaliatory attack against the Maquis who had attacked the USS Malinche. If Sisko had not taken that action, the Maquis' ongoing genocide via biogenic weapons against Cardassians in the DMZ would have continued. I'm sorry if it sickens you, but Sisko made the right call.

@@shadowtheimpure - By that logic, you have no right to criticise the Nazis for massacring an entire French village, or Mladic for Srebrenica. Civilized people do not agree with that logic.

@@Mark-xh8md Except both indicated parties would be the Maquis in that example. They are the aggressors, after all. Srebrenica is a textbook case of ethnic cleansing, which is what the Maquis were attempting against the Carassians. The Nazis were trying to conquer Europe by any means they deemed necessary.

@@shadowtheimpure - It wasn't the Maquis that used WMDs against its own citizens because they had taken offense to one of them having outsmarted them. It was Sisko. So no. Sisko is the Nazis or Mladic in the examples.

I understood that reference!

Appeasement was not going to work? ... Prime example of war propaganda. AFAIK A.H. was offering a surrender but Churchill kept it secret and rejected it. And that was not the first sign of an agenda to keep war going. As Germany was betraying the USSR, the West was betraying Germany. And betraying the USSR was possibly in part out of fear of the pressure from the west. A big reason for WW2 was because particularly Britain but also others wanted to squeeze Germany dry after WW1 and that caused a lot of resentment. To keep things short, don't mistake the visible tip for the iceberg. The darkness runs much deeper. *Global long-term strategizing* could be a key term.

Not just personal. The conflict between the Federation and Cardassians resulted in a treaty that no one was happy about. Maxwell was also thinking about the waste of life from that war. SF Debris said that he wants the war to end but in victory because anything else would have meant that the deaths were pointless.

I was thinking the same. It's bright but cozy.

Thank you.

This is the best version on youtube: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-65RzGmMefnQ.html Bit more oomph to it than BHD's version which is otherwise really good as well.

they won't. frankly the feds made many errors leadign up and past this event

Does it matter? He decided he was right over the powers that gave him his authority, siezed that authority for himself, and was willing to kill for it. It didn't matter if he was right or not, he didn't have the evidence to know, he just had a prejudice that he wanted to murder with, and stole a war machine to do it with.

@@nickmalachai2227 It was merely an observation based on the plot of DS9, nothing more

I'd say somewhat complicit but also very disciplined is how I always interpreted it. Often times Picard and Kirk would openly violate Federation law and the crew knew it was a violation but had to take it on faith that the Captain was not off their rocker and acting for a greater reason as the person they trust. So perhaps at this point with the Enterprise physically attempting to stop the Phoenix that dissenting ideas started to set into the crew but due to their discipline would not defer to another authority. They still trusted Maxwell and still trusted that he was right but perhaps began to doubt his methods since I believe at the end it's stated his First Officer takes over to basically be 'towed'.

Maxwell probably handpicked Setlik veterans for his officers. Those officers would also be someway traumatized - like Maxwell. Maxwell is also very charismatic. O'Brien probably just beamed into the corridor between the bridge and the ready room.

Not all Starfleet ships have counselors, majority of them have doctors

"You are now cured of PTSD."

PTSD was only started to be recognized in the US around the time of this episode, I don't think the writers were aware of it. It _really_ exploded in terms of awareness after we started getting messed-up guys coming back from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.