Configuring our Presonus 32SC console with a Presonus NSB 32.16 stage box. This is a simple setup due to only one console needed. We will still use analog snakes for some events, but will plan on using the digital snake for other events.
Regarding the x32 - (from memory) instead of that, you can also select a channel and hit sends on fader, and then the busses appear on the right and you can send that channel to the bus. It’s a bit quicker. I like on the full size that you can use the knobs above to send channels to a mix (kind of how an analog mixer works, or the M7 knobs)
Thanks. This would certainly reduce the amount of button pushing. Interesting, the Presonus has something very similar to that called "Aux Sends" for each channel. Had no idea Behringer did as well. I'll check for that functionality the next time I'm at that venue.
It can be a long way round for the X32 to send to Monitors, but there is a bank of assignable buttons to the right of the master fader. I usually head into the settings and make these my Monitor/FX sends so I can stay on one layer for the whole show. I don't like having stuff hidden in layers either!
In the x32 select the bus you want to send to and then sends on fader, no need for any other button. This will show the mix os the bus layed out in the inputs faders
The X32 Compact/Producer boards just don't have as many buttons on them to directly access things, therefore of course it's going to take more steps. Another solution for the X32 monitor issue is to use an iPad in conjunction with the main board just for monitors. I do this regularly which also gives the ability to dial in the monitors from the stage during sound check.
Yeah the x32 was one of the first consoles in the pro-Sumer market and opened the door for other manufacturers to do really well and know what to do better. It is definitely an odd workflow to use their compact or full size desks. However being an x32 rack user every weekend, I’ve become extremely efficient on the Mixing Station iPad app which pretty much fixes all the workflow issues.
@@jessecoonen7881Hi Jesse, I'm very new to mixing A/V, etc. I help at a very small church and they just purchased this PreSonus board and a 16 in digital stage box. I'm curious about your comment on using an iPad with the Mixing Station app. The church also purchased an iPad to connect with this board. I'm sure there's more you would want to know about how we do what we do. Sometimes we have 1-3 , singers etc. and sometimes I have 9 mics on stage asking with a couple of DI boxes for guitar and bass. How does having an iPad help me? Thank you, Richard
3:27 i use the Behringer X32-compact on a daily basis back home, and ur Bus 1-8 and Bus 9-16 Buttons for your Right fader bank would be where u would have ur Monitors, and then ofc you DCA's and Matrix. To send something into a monitor u can do it two ways with the "sends on fader" button. if u select a "channel" then press "SOF" then u can pull up the faders in all the monitors you want that one input to go to. Likewise, You can select one "BUS" aka Monitor send, then press "SOF" to send all the channels you want into that one monitor. so technicaly its 2 buttons and one fader movement or multiple fader movements depending on which way around you use the "Send On Fader". And ofc you can also do this thru the Screen as well, but i would consider that the more hard route of doing things rather than just using the Sends on Fader.
I have to chuckle a bit. Not so long ago you made a video about all the ways a digital set up was more trouble than it was worth. And now we're here with a digital snake, ethercon, UPS, etc. The Canute of analogue live sound appears to have drowned in the digital sea. 😊 I still love your work, Bob (it's another great video). I hope this new kit works out well for you.
Thank you! I'm glad you saw the humor in it! You are correct, no so long ago was that video. I did that video to show the costs (and gear) involved, which were far more than what the many marketing firms were "selling" to the people for a digital snake solution (i.e. "all you need is a Cat cable"), which clearly is not all that is needed. I have never opposed digital... it's a great tool for some of the events we do. We still use analog sometimes. Thanks for your comment!
Thank you for your comment. I don't recall where I got the cables from... you may want to take a look at EliteCore. Though, some of these cables may be found on Amazon.
It depends. If channel 32 is local, then yes... channel 16 can be reassigned to channel 32. If channel 32 is a network only channel (as in the 32SC), then no. However, channel 32 could be set to analog and re-assigned as channel 16; though, this doesn't accomplish much, because channel 32 would simply become channel 16 (i.e. a copy of channel 16). Whatever takes place on channel 16 will occur on channel 32 at the same time. I'm not aware of where a network connection to a console can be converted to a local (physical) connection.
Hello, I see that your mixing console also has the same problem as mine. The Subgrp button is also off instead of being dimmed. Is that normal or is it a common problem with this 32SC mixer
Good observations. The subgroup button should always be off, unless a channel has been assigned to one of the groups. All it takes is one channel to be assigned to any of the groups (A,B,C,D), and the button-light will turn on.
Do you have digital stage box also? Based on what you provided, are there levels showing up on the output meters of the console? If so, you have a routing problem for the main output. If there is nothing showing up on the output meters, the channels you are using to test with are not routed to the main output (or an AUX) output. Make sure the "Main" button on the Fat Channel is illuminated on the channels that need to be routed to the Main output bus.
Thanks so much for this presentation! I'm sorta new at A/V at a small church and they just purchased this board. It will be used with an analog snake (8 inputs) and a PreSonus 16 input stage box. I've been looking at various YT videos and hope going from a 25 year old Mackie to this is not too steep a learning curve. It seems there are some amazing features. Any tips for a newbie?
The learning curve for Presonus is rather manageable. The Presonus consoles are (in my opinion) the easiest consoles to transition from analog to digital. And in my personal opinion, the work-flow of the Presonus consoles are much better than other digital consoles. There's a lot to know about digital. But once you understand the basics, digital becomes easier to use. Here's a few tips to get you started: 1. Do not run a digital console the same way you run an analog console regarding setting the channel input levels (the gain). Zero (0 db) on an analog console is actually close to negative 18db on digital consoles. Digital consoles do not have the headroom that analog consoles have. Therefore, you will probably want to set the gain (based on the channel meter) lower than you would for an analog board. Digital distortion (from over-driving an input) sounds very bad on digital consoles! 2. If you have different acts or services that regularly perform at the church, save these acts/services under their own "scenes". When the act/service is scheduled to perform again, just recall their scene and their settings will load into the console. This will greatly help with ensuring a consistent audio service for those acts/services each time they perform. 3. On the back of the console, there are volume knobs for the analog outputs. Make sure these are set accordingly (at least to there 0db markings). 4. Learn what the button colors refer to... these colors will help you know what "layer" the faders are on (i.e. what layer you are currently working on). For example. the SELECT buttons (at the top of the channel faders) are blue when the faders are in the FOH mode. If the SELECT buttons are yellow, the faders are in the AUX-mix layer (same yellow color as the buttons on the left of the console). Spend a little time to make sure you understand the colors... it helps when running the console. 5. Do NOT place pens or other writing instruments on the fader area of the console. When the faders move (when changing layers), the pens will either fly off the console, or (worse) get stuck between a few neighboring faders and possibly burn out a fader motor. Pens on analog consoles are most always a non-issue! 6. To ensure the mute button (red buttons above the faders) function the same way across all layers of the console, make sure the "Global Aux Muting" is enabled in the system configuration of the console. If Global Aux Muting is NOT enable, the channel muting may only affect the layer you are on when a channel is muted. By "enabling" the Global Aux Muting, when a mute button is pressed for an input, that input is muted everywhere in the system. 7. Use the "Soft Power" feature of the console (from the main screen) to shutdown the console. "Soft Power" ensures everything is saved before you power off the console. Hope this helps.
@@stageleftaudioHello again. We're just a couple of days out from installing the 16 input PreSonus stage box and this mixer. I've hired a young guy who owns a studio and also does live sound to help. I haven't researched many folks in this field locally but he came to me on a recommendation from another church A/V person. There are lots of opinions in this field about how to setup and run sound but from 2 meetings with him, he seems pretty chill about his approach. I wish I could have you here to help, as your knowledge and delivery are WONDERFUL. I'm so grateful for all the tips offered a few weeks ago and wonder what you could add with regards to the install. Currently we have the old Mackie as mentioned, an old snake with 8 XLR and 8 quarter inch connectors and a bunch of other XLRs randomly running under the stage and crawl space to the A/V room at the back of the sanctuary. Are there things I should be prepared for or devices, equipment, adaptors, etc. I might need in making the transition from the old Mackie analog board to the new Presonus? I just want to be well prepared and not get into it all right after the Sunday service, when we plan on doing this, and realize I needed or forgot something or wished I had something. Thank you! Richard
Richard, thank you very much for the kind words! I'm glad you were able to locate someone that can help you with the install. You are correct, there are a lot of opinions on how to run the systems! For installations, there's a few things you might want to consider (if not already). 1.) The 16.8 stage box, as well as the 32SC, are computers. It's usually recommended to place these devices on their own UPS. The idea with the UPS is to ensure the equipment gets continuous power. The UPS would not need to be so large as to run the system for a period of time... but to handle the occasional momentary drops in power ("blips" and anything less than 1 second) for either the stage box or console (or both). Losing power to either piece of equipment will result in a loss of connectivity between the components. They should be able to reconnect in a few seconds without intervention, but during that time, there will be no audio. Also, a drop in console connectivity sometimes produces a loud "pop" to the speakers (passive or powered); depending on how loud the amplifiers were set, a loud pop could damage a driver (usually the tweeter, then the mid-rage). 2.) If the 16.8 stage box will be in a back-room, it should reside in a room large enough to dissipate its own heat. If there is other heat-generating equipment in the same room, you may want to place a fan in the room to ensure nothing gets too hot; a vented (or air-conditioned) room would probably be best. 3.) Ensure the firmware on the 32SC and the 16.8 are up to date! The console and the stage-box work together... their firmware will need to be current. 4.) If your FOH location will have a talk-back mic and/or something like an MP3 player, or anything else that may need an XLR input, these devices will need to plug directly into the console. To get these devices to work at FOH (while using a digital snake), just change their input from "Network" to "Analog" (on the fat channel), and make the inputs are set to "Main" (or L/R). There's nothing else that will need to be done. So, when someone talks on a mic at FOH, it will route correctly to the main speakers and to whatever monitors you need it routed to. Also, it's common to use the upper channel count inputs (from channel 16 and lower) for analog input devices. Of course, they can be placed wherever needed! 5.) As part of the initial network setup of the console ensure all the inputs are set to "Network". This can be done directly on the console, or through the touch screen. So, if it looks like everything is setup and you can't get any sound from the speakers, check to ensure the input is set to "Network". If you are testing an analog input, make sure that input is on analog. 6.) All AVB information is stored in a "Project". If you find that you are needing to modify/change some AVB (networking) configurations (maybe to support different acts), it may be best to make individual "Projects" for each act to ensure different AVB configurations are saved. The "Scenes" storage locations (as I referenced in a previous post) will not store AVB information. Any "scenes" that contain AVB information are stored in a "project". If you don't think you will ever change the AVB/networking setup, there will probably be no need to save more than one (the default) project. 7.) In my experience using digital snakes with Presonus, shielded cables caused some issues with audio drop-outs. To managed this, I had to convert my network cables from shielded to non-shielded; this corrected my problems. I removed the ground/shield from only one end of the cable. I'm not sure of your setup, so audio drop-outs may not be an issue for you. Congrats with the installation! Hope this helps,
@@stageleftaudio My pleasure. You have been incredibly kind and a model of community. I am printing all your tips and reviewing this video for more notes or questions I may have tomorrow with the guy helping us. Thanks once again for your help and I look forward to seeing/hearing more of your work!
How can i use my FOH on mix 7-8 and get the FXs to be heard on those mix 7-8? Please help i can only hear it on main mix so far 😢 there has to be a way! Thank you.
You can't use a FOH mix on a mix 7-8. The effects will work on mix 7-8. All you need to do is select mix 7-8 and use the page button to select the other mixing layers. After selecting mix 7-8, select the "page right" button a few times... it will then show the "effects return" faders for the effects.
We do live events in mono, therefore, only one FOH output is needed. However, (depending on the size of the sound system we are using), that single FOH output could go to either an active crossover (i.e. DBX 260), which would result in a low and mid/high output to the speakers on both sides of the stage... or directly to a powered sub that contains a crossover; which is how we run most all of our smaller events.
Ok I have this issue with presonus recording. I have the 32sc. I am using NSB 8.8. Some channels record or shows signal on capture some don’t. Let say I can see the signal meter on channel 8 but I don’t see it on Channel 4. If I copy channel 8 to channel 4 I see the metering (it records) but if I put back the previous setting on channel 4 it won’t record. I don’t see patching difference. Any idea why is doing that?
Good question. Sounds like the input source for #4 is not set, or is set incorrectly (compared to #8). On the Fat channel, look at the "Input" section when #4 is selected and compare that to #8. From your setup, sounds like all the inputs should be set as "Network".
@@stageleftaudio I think you just fixed my problem. The input was on Network but I don’t know how the input sent it was on analog instead of digital. Thank you so much.
Yes. Stereo is best used for recordings and for small rooms. The choice of using mono for live sound relates to the physics issues of trying to run stereo.
The Presonus in this video is not yet placed into a rack. There may be some custom racks available for it; we have not decided how to rack the console just yet. However, there are some custom cases (not racks) for that console. Look at Thomann Music for a case.
The X32 is trash, you didn't do anything wrong. I don't know what they were thinking when they were doing the routing setup on that mixer. I use a lot of board and find non ANNOYING like the X32
Why would you ever want to run mono? You also have a strange approach on digital, inputs/outputs, and how to use it. I think that in the end you would be better off using a setup like the sound couple with a stagebox and a iPad. Would save you a lot of money and unnecessary complication of your system.
What most people do not know, is live sound is most always run in mono. There is a big misconception that sound systems are in stereo because there are speakers on each side of the stage. Stereo imaging works great for recordings and listening in headphones as well as in small rooms in houses. However, stereo does not scale for large events (due to physics). Stage Left Audio has never run an event in stereo in the past 35 years of service. If a sound system is setup as stereo for a large event, only the people sitting directly down the center of the seating area (the area between the speakers) will get the best sound... everyone else will be hear sub-standard sound (due to physics). iPads have their place, but not with us. We will never use iPad mixing as part of our services. iPads are great tools for some setups, but not for all; many bands that have their own PA usually have an iPad they give their sound person to mix with (we have mixed many bands on iPads). iPads are just a tool; they are not an answer for us. Thanks for your comment.
@stageleftaudio I can tell you that in 25 years of being a "sound guy" the only mono gigs I have done were speech only with very limited resources. Everything else in stereo. With modern days bands you would be fired on the spot if you would try to run mono. And as for your comment on large events only being mono: Maybe you should contact Dave Rat for some tutorials in mixing. Or RG Jones and ask them why they don't run Glastonbury in mono.
Running a true stereo setup (where there is phasing between L/R) exposes the issues with the physics of sound, which results in one side of the seating area not hearing the same thing as what is being produced on the right side. The best "seat" in the house when running a stereo mix is FOH. Running mono allows for the entire crowd to hear the same thing. I agree with you on the "modern bands"; many of them use heavy keys, computers, heavy effects on guitars, where their shows may require a true stereo and even a quadraphonic sound to fulfill their "sound"... Though, I do not provide services for those types of bands. I recommend reading Bob McCarthy's article called, "The Emperor’s New Stereo" (1998). He does a great job explaining the problems with running stereo for live sound. If you are not familiar with Bob McCarthy, he is an "authority" on sound.
