I'd like to thank you for this and add one thing, if your cheap and don't want to buy the tubing use a fired 22lr case instead. Hope you find this helpful
Years ago I was looking for a way to reload 7.62x25mm cases.. After that Starline came out with Boxer primed cases.. Starline hinted that they might produce the 7.62 x 54R, they never did. Enjoyed your vid, very educational!
This was truly an informative video. I congratulate you on your resourcefulness and tenacity to get this right. I also think it's great that you're making your own cast bullets and working up our own loads for accuracy. But like some other posters, I'd be interested to see how long a copper washed steel case holds up to a full load with FMJ bullets. Thank you again for this informational video.
Hi, thanks for watching. The cases I did in this video were steel. I have never personally had any brass berdan cases, all steel. But it should work for brass too. I hear you, the reason I have been working on these videos lately is because of the ammo availability and pricing issues... hoping to help some people out with other solutions. :)
The copper insert is VERY slick. I bought some 7.62 X 54R steel cases, just in the off chance I would buy a Mosin Nagant, but had no idea how to re-prime that huge primer pocket with boxer primers....
This is an excellent of good old American ingenuity. I will be watching and studying every move on this video. This is a money saver for me! Thank you sir.
Corrosive ammo doesn't bother me one bit, if I'm shooting a gun I like then I simple clean it when I'm done. Ejoy blasting your way through that spam can then enjoy reloading and shooting it all over again! Also, thanks for watching my video. :)
Tip: you can also use a flat-bottom center-cutting end mill to mill off the anvil, if you're having a hard time getting a drill bit to not slip/wander off the point of the anvil. Then you can drill out the flash hole, with a regular drill bit, after you get rid of the pointy anvil. "Center-cutting" means the end mill cuts all the way to the center, which a lot don't. A lot of them don't have cutting flutes wall the way to the center because the center most part of a drill bit or end mill has zero surface speed; which leaves a poor surface finish. The further out from the center, the faster the surface speed.
I loaded cast bullets into them, which you typically don't fire at jacketed bullet velocities. So, a bit below standard charge. I'll try some full charges when I get a chance. Thanks for watching.
Great video, well thought out and well shot. I have one suggestion though and that would be EYE PROTECTION. I realize that with today's modern weapons failures and blowback are almost things of the past, except they aren't. It takes so little effort to put on a pair of shatterproof glasses and not only may it save you an eye but others may be influenced to wear eye protection by seeing you use it in your videos. Not being preachy, I was just brought up with shooting eyeglasses as a way of life. The one time I had a failure my face was all that got peppered with pieces of debris. The eyes were untouched. Thanks again, great video.
great idea. i have a couple bags of brass surplus that i haven't decided what to do with yet. i am getting pretty tired of reloading the same 100 rounds of boxer primed 54r that i have. maybe one of these days i'll experiment with your ideas suggested on this video. i guess the first step would be to simply remove the berdan primers and see what kind of size difference i am dealing with. as long as i have been reloading, i have never seen your hydraulic primer removal method....awesome stuff!!
I did this with 7.62 x 54 and it turned out great with cast bullets and reduced loading's. Good stuff for a Saturday afternoon just shooting reactionary targets.. Thanks dude for putting the video together. Dave.
What a truly sweet idea ! With the current absence of large rifle primers on the market, I'm seriously doing a similar conversion on all of my large primer brass to use small primers, which are back on the market in my area. Plus, I have a big pile of Berdan-primed 8mm Mauser brass that I couldn't bring myself to throw away.
xzqzq Thanks for the offer, but no, I don't want to sell any of it. It's getting very hard to find in my area, and expensive when it can be found. However, I do have some new, unfired Hornady cases I may let go of in the near future, about 500, and about as many bullets. If I do decide to let those go, Ill give you first choice on them. I've made a note of your YT Username in case I do decide to let those go at a price that's fair to both of us.
That was a very good idea for sure.I would suggest one thing though. On a rifle case the flash hole can not be too big or the pressure on the primer is too high. The Berdan primer pocket should be cleaned up with a flat bottom drill bit or a milling bit the the correct size. Then you can drill the flash hole with the right size bit.
Good video, however I would strongly advise Not to use a grinding wheel for copper, brass or aluminum. I would much rather suggest the use of a sander as a better way of removing the excess copper. Either a disk type machine or a vibrating type with a fine or medium grit. Using a grinding wheel for that type of metal will load up the wheel, the heat buildup will cause the metal to expand and the wheel to fail (explode). Last thing you would want is to eat some of the wheel. I've seen this happen a few times, usually ending with a trip to the hospital. I've been a machinist for years, though you can get away with some very light grinding of those metals it is strongly not recommended. Same goes for using the side of the grinding wheel. That type of wheel is not designed for a load on the side of it. Again, you can get away with some very light stuff but even that can cause the wheel to fail and all manufactures will tell you not to do that. Don't get me wrong, I love it when people can think out of the box and post ideas here. However it will do no one any good if you wind up loosing a finger or two, in the hospital or worse, dead. Lets all use common sense and be careful out there!
EIBBOR2654 I was about to write a reply as well about clogging a grinding wheel with soft metal. If having a grinding wheel explode in front of you doesn't sound like fun than I beg that you do a little research as to why it's a big no no.
David, I know why it is a big no no. Like I wrote, I've been working in machine shops for years. The best way to remove the excess of those metals is to use a sanding disk or a file. I am not advocating in any way, the use of a grinding wheel to grind off brass, aluminum or copper. I just chewed out a kid in my shop 2 or 3 months ago for trying to grind the end of a brass rod on our shops 12" grinder. Had to check and redress the wheel because the face of the wheel was loaded up with some brass. Thank God it wasn't bad or or cracked, then I would have had to buy another one to change it out.
EIBBOR2654 Sorry for the confusion, I meant to second your comment but after reading how it was written, I can see that it appears that I'm telling you not to grind soft metal when I meant to tell the author. I had to redress a wheel a few weeks ago because someone either ground brass.
David, no problem, I took no offense to it. But I've seen a lot of ignorant people that do grind those metals thinking it is alright. Many videos on RU-vid, sends shivers up my spine seeing that and knowing what can happen. Even using the side of the wheel to grind is a big no no and can cause it to come apart. I've gotten in to the habit of checking the grinding wheels before I even turn it on to make sure there are no chips, chunks or cracks in the wheel. Can't tell you how many times I had to redress a wheel because some knuckle head, was to lazy to cut off the damaged end and heavily ground off a half inch of metal, leaving a big grove in the middle of the wheel. Oh, and of course they leave it for someone else to fix or change out the wheel and clean up their mess. Oh the machine shop stores of knuckle heads I could tell that escaped death somehow. Like the time the arbor wrench came through the office wall because the dink forgot to remove it before he turned on the mill at 2000 RPMs. Well David, y'all take care and stay safe.
Doubt I'll ever use this for 7.62x54Rmm, but this tutorial very helpful for odd calibers such as 11mm Gras, .450/577 Martini and other cals where original rounds or fire cases available but in current state non-reloadable. Very low-tech, very simple, and easily within abilities of most reloaders.Thanks for vid.
Pretty cool. I have 70 rounds of WWII 8 X 57 fodder for my 8mm Mauser on the way. I plan on breaking the ammo down and swapping out the corrosive primer, and of course switch them to boxers. I am retired, so the amount of time and effort involved is a moot point to me, I enjoy the challenge. Thanks for sharing the information. One complaint with your video, (and a whole lot of others I have watched). Shooting/reloading without safety glasses. I only have one peeper left, (cataract surgery), and go to the extremes to protect it. Safety glasses are cheap insurance. Not trying to sound like Bullwinkle, just trying to do a public service. Protect your eyes, the alternative blows.
John Archer Just had cataract surgery on my second eye. Have 20/25 now (toric implant). It was about $1,500 an eye (surgeon, implant, hospital, medication and all office visits) but, spread out over a few months, doable ... and the surgeon tells me that I will never need another pair of glasses (I use Walmart reading glasses for up close, bare eye from about 12" to infinity). Find a good eye guy ... cataracts are NOT the problem they once were. I can recommend my Doc if you are anywhere Lexington, NC. Cataracts in both eyes were closing the door on my shooting, reading, wood-working, driving ... etc. days. Now the door is wide open again.
7.62x39 has a smaller primer pocket that is almost the right size for a large rifle primer, which I have used before. See my other video "SHTF Reloading Steel Case Berdan" for more info on that. 7.62x39 doesn't have enough room to swage a bushing unless perhaps you take it down to a small rifle primer size.
That is really smart man. thanks again for all the diy videos on this. I really need to reload for my dad of that ammo. I bought my dad a mosin for his birthday a couple years ago but he is up there in years and the regular rounds are just too powerful. So I need to make a light load for him.
Just getting my 1st Mosin and will be running milsurp steel ammo in it for the most part. Thanks for showing me how to save a bunch by converting & reloading the steel cases.
You can use the same 2" Harbor Freight trim cutter chop saw to cut that tubing that we are all using to chop 5.56 brass into 300 BLK brass ... and it makes clean precise cuts on brass and copper. And thanks for this video! Oh, btw, save your old primers and reverse press them back into the primer pocket then drill a hole in them just as you did the primer pocket.
Very nice process! That WAS copper; in the tubing; you were grinding on the side of the wheel. I think a countersink tool, on the drill press is good for that one.
I have to agree on those grounds. I just get tired of seeing some people mindlessly drooling over their smart phones on Facebook all day just to read that one of their friends just sneezed. I guess social networking has its ups and downs. It is nice to be able to keep in touch with people outside of your home country.
This is awesome man! I have a ton of Iranian surplus 8mm Mauser that is about 90% click bangs. It all has bad primers but good powder and now I got to get to it lol. Thanks!
Thanks. My viewers kept asking for 7.62x54r so I got into it and I love it. The Mosin Nagant in this video is a POS but there is something respectable about it that I enjoy greatly. It has history and some class... it's been there & done that. I loaded the ones in this video with a light load of unique just because I had not worked up any loads for this caliber yet and needed to wrap up this vid. The recoil was very low, would probably be great for your dad.
Excellent idea! I have tried a few other ways, including reversing the primer & using it as a shim, but never this way & with the swaging tool. Great idea thanks! I am going to try it!
Great video and thanks for sharing. I would like to bring up one safety concern though. As a Millwright of 18 years in a steel mill, please do not grind on soft metals. Copper, aluminum and soft metals like them should never be ground on a stone as the material will build up inside of the pores and could cause an imbalance leading to a catastrophic failure. Only files and belt sanders should be used on soft metals. BTW I never weed out the steel cases in my brass. Can't even tell the difference when sizing.
If you have a lathe (lucky me, I have two!) you can set the lathe up to trim off the excess copper and leave a lovely finish in one hit, and with great precision. If anything got taken off the case head during grinding/sanding etc. it could affect the headspace (not good!), so that's something for which to watch out. Now I am regretting throwing all those steel cases out! Mind you, at that time I was buying 7.62 x 39 at about 11c (in the 2500 round case) a round so it wasn't worth reloading.....
Now that is a great question with a few answers and I'm surprised no one mentioned it sooner. Primarily I was just showing a bit of diversity but I also think lead cast bullets are more appropriate in the Mosin Nagant. The lead cast reloads should function fine in the PSL too but there is a good potential for lead fouling in the gas system after sustained used. Fouling shouldn't damage the firearm but it is something I don't want to deal unnecessarily. Thanks for watching and commenting.
Kids, I have loaded 308 British cases for use in my 34/40 kraig! I found a 303 Brit. casing and thought it to be 30/40. Looking in an old Hornady reloading manual I noticed the numbers were very close. Case length was the biggest difference. This was back in 1975, And I still load this case! I have 'fire' formed many of these cases.
I am really impressed with you for your ingenuity in figuring out how to do this! So many people have told me that reloading steel case ammo - to say nothing of Berdan-primed cases - is not something the home reloader should attempt. ! question, though: With the 7.62x39mm case, is it necessary to use the copper pipe solution, or is the size of the primer pocket close enough to use a standard boxer primer of one size or another? Thanks in advance for your help.
This genius, I love this! as soon as my swager gets here I'm doing it. If anyone tries this be very careful not to remove any metal from case head when removing the excess copper from the primer pocket. That will make more head space and the case could rupture. My only contribution is: to use a 5/64 or #47 drill bit for making the flash hole to keep things uniform. In appreciation, I would like to send you the book "Cartridges of the World" but you probably already have a copy. Let me know :)
I think that this will work well for the large Primer based Berdan primers. If you are fortunate to find that you have the smaller Berdan base primers you can use the same decapping method and I then use a punch and Ballpeen hammer to flatten the anvil, drill the primer hole and chamfer, then use the large rifle poket forming tool to set the proper diameter hole for the Boxer Large Rifle primers.
My co-worker and I bought a case and split it up. The shells worked great in my Rossi side-by-side, but wouldn’t function in his Mossberg pump. The nomenclature indicated that they were 2.75 inches shells and they did fit in both my Rossi’s three inch chambers and my 2.75 inch chambers of my Baikel SxS. They did have a serious drawback. Sometimes the primers were duds. These I would disassemble and put aside. I used my metal hulls competing in Cowboy Action Shooting and collected lots of style points but they weren’t reloadable being Berdan primed, so I found the right size drill bit, fifteen-sixty fourths of an inch, and drilled out the old Berdan Primers, counter sunk the hole to insure that the # 209 shotgun primer would fit flush and reloaded several to see how they’d work. I wasn’t impressed with the performance of my reloaded metal hulls. I did use Circle Fly wads and was able to snag a five gallon bucket of Alcan 12 gauge fiber wads, but I lost interest and put both the empties and loaded rounds in storage in my reloading shed. Fast forward to 2000. I had decided to switch my shooting discipline from Traditional to Frontier Cartridge. I bought an 1866 “Yellowboy” from one of my shooting partners who had upgraded to a ’73, and started to reload my .45 Colt, .44WCF cartridges and Plastic 12 gauge hulls with Black Powder, Pyrodex, or 777 and more recently with Goex Pinnacle. Then I remembered my stash of Russian shells. I disassembled all the Russian shells and separated the shot, wadding, and smokeless powder into separate containers. I was surprised to see the powder was a square flake and a pale green in color. The shells that still had live primers I charged with 4.3cc’s of Pyrodex and reinstalled the heavy felt wads and replaced the #5 shot with 1.5 ounces of #7.5 shot. The Russians used a plastic cup that fit tight in the mouth of the hull that held the shot in place. I used those until I found about using white glue or Duco Cement to hold the over shot wad firmly in the hull. Typical Black Powder clean-up procedures work well with these cases, but the copper plating does darken up very fast and green corrosion sometimes formed around the hull and had to be cleaned off before you could load or shoot them. I did try to shoot a few that had this verdigris around the case mouth and had to resort to using a cleaning rod to punch them out of the chambers of my double barreled shotgun. So from that point on I coated the hulls with Brasso, let them dry and threw them into my tumbler. They came out nice and shiny. Out of all of this, I found that any #209 shot shell primer works with Black Powder or the subs. So what does all this have to do with modifying these Russian hulls for use in repeaters? Well you had to get the background so you can see how much work I went thru to bring this information to my fellow shooters. I’ve had a lot of time on my hands since I returned from Iraq and started hunting for a job, so as I was getting ready for the next Cowboy Shoot I thought I’d see what I could do with this stash of metal hulls because I wanted to use them in my IAC Lever Action 1887 12 gauge Shotgun. The original length of 2.75 inches of the Russian hulls and I modified the hulls that were shortened to 60mm and cleaned up with Brasso. the tarnish that covers them. I used a tube cutter which causes a slightly crimped look to the mouth of the shortened hulls. The next time I start shortening any more hulls, I plan to get a small chop saw from Harbor Freight. Once I had 25 hulls shortened, I tried to see how well they fed thru my 1887 lever action shotgun. All but eight chambered. I attributed this to old hulls that were fired using smokeless powder and the pressure expanded the hulls so they only fit in my double barreled SG. I had to go through my stash and find eight that would chamber freely in my 1887. Once I had all the hulls shortened, polished, and ready to be reloaded, I retreated to my reloading shed. I did not have the disposable funds to get the Chop Saw, so I bought an eighteen inch length of three-quarter inch PVC tubing and measured and cut a 60mm length off of it to act as a case length gage and used a hack saw to score a ring around the circumference of the hull and then used the pipe cutter to shorten the hull to the proper length. They worked well and I bought a 12 gage sizing/decapping die from C-H and lubricated all the hulls and ran them up the die sans decapper. The hulls are st2ill in use and every once in a while I have one that splits. It gets stuck in the chamber and I have to pound it out with a cleaning rod. I have had brass shells do the came so I am not worried. I scrutinize every hull after a match and while they are being cleaned. .
Berdan to boxer conversion is work but it's too easy to say "why don't you just buy boxer brass." I believe many folks like to be resourceful, working with what they've got. Whether its a shortage of supplies, funds, or just wanting a DIY project. Also, being resourceful could translate into survival someday. I totally respect your suggestion of buying boxer, it's good planning, but if you're sitting on a pile of berdan brass it sucks to ante up for boxer, especially 7.62x54r. Best Wishes, MJ.
Hi, I haven't done super in depth testing but I have reloaded these steel cases about 5 times so far without issue. They go through the dies fine, of course lube them just like you would brass. I haven't seen any signs of the bushing back out or get loose. I have not tried anything but cast bullets in them so far. I'll provide updated information when I push the limits a little further. Thanks for watching, subscribe?
Hi, the copper bushings do not appear to back out at all after repeat firings. After 5 reloads the primers still fit well. Thanks for watching and for subscribing. :)
Chuck the drill bit as deep as you can to prevent flexing. Also go very slow at first with almost no pressure so it can get started. It took me time to get it figure out but once you get it it's not bad. Supposedly much easier with brass. You'll get it.
It is normal to be apprehensive of something out of the norm. I wouldn't suggest doing this, only an experienced reloader will know their comfort level and how to inspect the materials and identify potential issues. I hope you find some gear soon and get in the game! Best wishes.
The Mosin was originally designed to shoot 210gr lead ball rounds. They went to a jacketed round ball shortly later and then after war with Japan in 1908 went to the 147gr jacketed ammo we still use today!
This is cool,I was looking for a way to reload corrosive brass from Yugoslavia in 7.62x39 when I ran into this video,very creative to say the least,excellent video, thank's Amigo!!!...
Brilliant man. You're who I want as a friend when the Zombie apocalypse comes. I will never try something like this, unless there is no other way, but its nice to have in your back picket. Also, someone said Magnum primers are larger. They're not larger, Magnum just refers to mor priming compound. All boxer large primers are the same size.
Any safety concern with powder ignition/burn rate changing with drilling your own flash hole of basically random size? Thanks for the video, this is pretty awesome. I enjoy the challenge, and also knowing there's an option for down the road when the gun control crowd makes it even harder and more expensive for us to reload normally. And if you pay attention to politics at all, you know this is coming sooner rather than later.
I did something similar. I opened up the primer pocket to fit a 12g primer. no copper pipe needed. it works great.. thank you for your video. try it with the 12g primers with no copper added. just have to resize the primer seat..
Hi, have some norma boxer 7.62x54r brass that I haven't gotten around to cleaning up yet, I will use that when I get into precision shooting. For now I'm just frigging around with the guns so the steel works good. So far I have reloaded these steel cases 5 times with no signs of issue. I do carefully inspect them between each loading like any reloader should do with any cases. I always clean my brass but have never bothered cleaning steel cases yet. Thanks for watching!
Voy a expresar un agradecimiento muy significativo dado que el video es muy didáctico y ayuda a cualquier emprendedor que no tenga conocimientos y le guste aprender y a realizar la recarga de su propia arma. muchisimas pero muchisimas gracias por el tiempo dedicado a enseñar porque esta muy claro todas las especificaciones técnicas
Sir, You are genius..... I am being serious. I don't have your skills. And I am in awe of your capabilities. Thank you for putting all of this out there.
Hey mainejunker, thanks a lot! I was thinking about that a lot. I see now it's quite easily doable. Good I didn't throw all those Berdan primed 8x57's to brass scrap :)
Nice. It appears that your flash hole's going to be significantly bigger than a normal Boxer case flash hole would be, so you can't just use the loads you were putting into your Boxer-primed cases - you'd have to work them back up from scratch. Of course looking at the primer pocket it's easy to tell which case type is which, so the chances of a mix-up are reduced.
Well Im glad a little fab work can make this possible. I picked up steel cases from the local DNR ran range for 9mm without knowing anything about the primers or reliability of the steel casing. Primers arent gonna be easy to find anyways but I figure once they are I can try this out. Even if I end up throwing out those cases afterwards.
For whatever reason everytime I'd go shooting when I was a high school student I'd always collect and bag all my empty 7.92 cases, and my brother the same with his 7.62x54R. It'll be cool when I get back from college to be able to repurpose the massive stockpile we'd collected rather than by new brass for the press.
I leave the primers in. Center them up on a drill press in an easy to make jig drill through the primer and creating the flash hole for the boxer primer. Then swage whats left of the old primer as the bushing.
Hi Mr. Egli,Thanks for your comments. Your points are valid however I wonder if you watched the video because you said that the boxers won't stay in place because the large berdan pocket is too large when that is exactly the issue this video resolves... converting the large berdan pocket to fit a LR boxer primer. I find that converting to boxer makes future reloading quicker, simpler, and doesn't require tooling to seat large berdan primers or the aquisition of those primers. Respectfully, MJ.
Dmitri, I don't dispute your response, it's just that I have thousands of rounds of 54R & much of it is boxer primed brass cased. I have been stashing this caliber for about 15 years & already have several lifetime supply. I previously agreed that this was a viable approach for obscure brass, but not worth it to me for something as common (at least to me) as 54R.
Cool video. I have read some people putting this idea down but if and that a big if it comes time when the importation of any ammo is stopped this concept will come in handy. People have become way to used to just running to the store and buying what they want. If that's not a choice then videos like this will be the only way to feed your firearm. Thanks for the video and thinking out of the box.
Thanks. Like colinmoriarty I too want to use my Swiss brass as well as the million or so 7.62x 54r steel cases I have collected over the years. I throw nothing away.
Some years back I did the same thing with some .30-06 FA Berdan cases only I was using spent .22 brass for the bushings. Later I starting using Shotgun primers and drilling through the case. The Shotgun primers worked great and I didn't need the bushing. However I kept the loads to mid range. Locktite med strength helps too and you need to chamfer the pocket so the S/G Primer sits flat. Never had one back out but again I never used hot or mag loads. Another idea to reload Berdan cases.
I have a re-loader friend who is apprehensive about trying this technique. If only I could locate re-loading equipment at this point, I would try this myself. I won both a Mosin Nagant and an AK47 and this would be MOST usefull. Time to serach. THANK YOU!
Hi there, I haven't had a steel case fail yet. I have loaded them 5 times so far. I checked out your channel, specifically the video on blueing. Pretty neat, keep it up!
You shouldn't need the tubing swaged in though, its standard LR size primers, just berdan unless you drill the anvil out to convert to boxer but the RCBS swager will work a peach on the little peened in crimps.
The issue never discussed with this conversion is berdan cases have two or three flash holes depending on mfg boxer cases have one flash hole. Extreme caution has to be used when this conversion is used to prevent pressure spikes and blowouts of the primer pocket. Stating charges should be used to verify pressure and pocket stability prior to working up full loads.
point, however. I have heard that there are Berdan 7.62mm with smaller primer pockets, but have not encountered any. I will remember your method for the future, but for the present I will continue to use Boxer-primed brass 7.62 cases Thank you for your "thinking outside the box" and your response to my comments. I hope the present shortages of primers, in general, does not persist, because I have not come up with a method to replace them yet. Rick
I you have a small metal lathe then you can do a much cleaner job of prepping brass or steel cases by cleaning the flash holes on the inside of the cases and trimming the neck thickness to a standard and concentric size ... this often greatly helps accuracy and of course ... to do a much neater job of the excess copper around the swaged bushings
It is, but all it takes is one tiny imperfection in the case or bushing, or one overpressure cartridge (which can be caused by something as simple as high temperatures) to blast brass and high pressure gas right back into the shooter's face down that bolt. It's also worth noting that he kept pressures significantly lower by using lead instead of jacketed bullets.
Hi, the 7.62x39 in my opinion is easier... just pop the anvil and put a drop of glue, takes about 15 seconds. The pocket on the 7.62x39 steel seems too small since it almost is the right fit for a LR primer. Might be able to swage it for a small primer with some other material?
