I swear just rushing this is the play. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ★Watch live on Twitch: / day9tv ★Check out my Website: day9.tv ★Day[9] Merch: shrsl.com/2g4l1
I like the effect upkeep has on WC3, namely the anxiety of knowing I could get a larger army, but it would cost me something. The execution? Abysmal. It doesn't feel like a decision. It feels like a kick in the balls.
Gotta love Day9 just destroying everyones nerves with these high APM macro-micro god plays. I find myself constantly asking "why!?" when he goes for mass production over efficiency or spamming transport ships instead of clearing the path safely with battleships. :D
tyrs hand is one of my all time favs in wc2, the vibe of the orc bases is pristine, and they are reletively passive but build up overtime, so you can rush it or you can take your time for fun
Did you ever play the WC1 campaign? The first mission only gives you enough gold in your starting base for 2 extra workers, otherwise you have to build EXACTLY what the objectives asks for. Otherwise, you're too broke to finish it and win.
@@Niclmaki Yeah there's one extra mine on the 1st mission. It's not nearby and there are relatively large numbers of enemies on the map. If you don't know exactly where it is and just wander around finding it, it's entirely possible to lose all your combat units to attrition and run out of money. It's fascinating how the mission design in WC1 and WC2 were very much oriented to the idea that you would beeline directly to the mission objective and not do ANYTHING else.
Your upkeep rant is 100% equivalent to my thoughts on weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. It’s the one mechanic I can’t stand in that otherwise wonderful game.
Man I love Warcraft 2, hopefully you play the expansion campaign as well it's really fun and challenging. Also I couldn't agree more with that upkeep rant, it's just an anti-fun mechanic, in single-player at least, I don't play Warcraft 3 mutliplayer.
Upkeep in the single player campaign is really really annoying. All it does is make you build towers until you mine out and then finally build an army.
24:30 Preach Sean! Upkeep is the worst part of wc3. It's just a mechanic that says "stop having fun beyond this point." You shouldn't be punished for being successful at the core mechanic of the genre i.e. building an army in an rts.
Pretty sure the "I'm a medieval man" thing counts as a cheat code, which would change your rank to "Cheater!" when you win the mission after enabling it.
so for the upkeep system ... i thought for years that it was a good idea then i played (later in life) a similar RTS , quite competitively, that had the exact upkeep system in place ... and for a long time we all assumed it was good for the game one day , an update came along that gave the players the option to play the game as normal, without the upkeep mechanic (removing the mechanic was optional) took about 1 week and there was not a single game played there (including competitive games) that still used upkeep later the button was swapped over from ... "disable upkeep" to "enable upkeep" and no one ever activated it since, not even the competitive scene you never realise how impactful (in a negative way) it actually is , until you actually remove it (yes the competitive scene adapted suuuper quick to no upkeep with little to no complaints)
for anybody interested, in my channel you can find out plenty of new generation WAR2 MODS. Plenty of playthroughs while testing the mods I've been doing since 2020, including playlists with proof of the featues. Please feel free to join the live broadcasts!!!
I just ask because i played w2 as a child and dreamed of being able to make a living in it ...but now i watch streams like yours insteadof television programs to keep my self entertained
Honestly, I NEVER knew that you could fail the start of the Tyr's Hand peasant revolt XD. I knew that they would attack and try to kill the peasants, but I always assumed it waited until you were closer to try
I dislike upkeep. Feels bad. That said, catchup mechanics are important in games. You note that yourself. In RTS's, a big part of that is usually movement/distance. When you're winning, you have to move your units further, or invest resources into pushing forward (which trades their dead units for your building costs in resources, while you're still winning because of map control). In Warcraft III though, because the army is so small and movement is so easy (vastly available teleports and such) upkeep then serves a function at least. But yes does it suck. And from my experience, it makes new players play worse because they play slower and gold is just more scarce to them. So they usually overcompensate and avoid high upkeep, making them lose without good space to learn intuitively what to do. I feel upkeep was a flavor idea that ended up integral to balance.
"My deck is 59 cards but I dunno what that is in metric" "I haven't used it much lately" "We're gonna need more wood guys" God I wish we could see twitch chat 😭
39:10 you can see how blizz made that movie in warcraft 3 credits... with failed cuts ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-19avS9zSRRY.html 1:47
I wrote out a whole thing about the upkeep 'issues'. I deleted it as it's pointless, I believe. But needless to say. It promotes thought and therefore strategy. Something that is sorely missing from modern RTS. Something you would think is natural to the genre. But isnt.
"Upkeep is like if you leveled up in an RPG and your weapons got weaker." In any RPG with level scaling, where most of your stats and abilities come from your gear-- For example, Diablo 3-- this actually IS the case. You literally do get weaker for leveling up in Diablo 3, until you start finding higher level loot that matches the enemies' new stats. There's a good reason for you to hate level scaling! It's like upkeep!
WoW has level scaling AND had iLvl scaling for a little bit in BFA. You’d get to max level, get your ass kicked by some cranes. So you run some heroics, get better gear, then REALLY get your ass kicked by those same cranes. They reduced the effect of iLvl to mob power, then just got rid of it eventually. What a strange time.
@@Niclmaki that's so weird... They really messed up that level scaling system huh. As a player of WoW, I was pretty disappointed that dungeons and raids and stuff can't be scaled past a certain point. But, the more I look into level scaling and RPG design as a game designer, the more I realize it just ain't worth it. It's so easy to mess it up, and it literally just makes the game less satisfying, that's all it does. I'm still not settled on having a flatter leveling curve, optional level scaling, or no level scaling at all...
Upkeep isn't even like that at all. It is more like as you get better weapons the cost of repairing them goes up. Which is pretty much universally true in any games with repairing. Upkeep has no effect on the performance of units, only how quickly you can build new units, buildings, or upgrades.
I remember playing Borderlands 2 and farming some items for too long, so when I jumped to the highest difficulty it took all my ammo to kill a single pack of enemies - wasn't even possible to get to an ammo machine for refills. I locked myself out of the highest difficulty by being too high level. If I'd played a melee build, as I found out months later, then my damage would scale with my level and I'd just have to not get one-shot while killing everything quickly. Then there's most WoW-style morpags (or however you'd pronounce mmorpg) I've played where at the end of an expansion you build up tons of good gear, but then leveling up at the start of the next expansion means you lose crit chance / haste / etc because the value of stat ratings on gear goes down as your level goes up, that is, you need more crit rating for the same amount of crit chance.
