Did Goku Become Dumb in Dragon Ball Super? 

it kinda reminds me of how the spongebob in the newer seasons is practically braindead compared to older ones

Akira took inspiration from TFS's goku

Goku was never unintelligent. He actually learns incredibly fast. He's just naive and uneducated from living a hermit life. Well until Super....

Dbz goku-wants to fight but wants to save the world at the sametime Dbs goku-just wants fight strong people

Goku is stupid asf in Super.

I truly believe that they made Goku's character dumber in Super but why this is I believe traces back to Toriyama being a comedy writer (which still baffles me to this day how a comedic writer would come to make the most popular, action packed, and intense anime series.) I think Toriyama is wanting to go back to his roots and is writing Dragonball Super more like the original Dragonball which was way more comedic than DBZ. He does this clearly by making Goku act like his child version than his DBZ teenage and Adult version. Anyone who denies Goku isn't stupider than he was in DBZ is kidding themselves. The amount of stupid things he did in the Trunks arc should be a concrete proof. Forgetting the Mafuba seals really?! I don't even think Kid Goku would have forgotten to do that cause even Kid Goku wouldn't have been that dense when there was innocent lives and the fate of the world at stake.

As of Super, Goku has turned into the anime equivalent of Peter Griffin.

Yes

Yes! Goku is pretty stupid in Super. He wasn't always intelligent but this is a complete dumbing down of little intelligence he had.

my favourite moment will always be when goku turns super saiyan for the 1st time and says "I'm gonna make you suffer!" it just comes out so intimidating.

Goku isn't as intimidating in super -Have to say this is a good point

Goku was always a doofus. He did fall on his head when he was a kid, which made him forget the plot to take over/ destroy Earth lol.

Hell yes he's not the Goku we grew up with.

It's because DB Super is trying to be funny and failing hard

Short answer: Yes.

Theres a difference between occasionally making a dumb move like in Z and CONSTANTLY acting like a mentlly stunted 13 year old like in Super.

I'm surprised you did not cover Goku's idea of bringing together the two Zeno's to be playmates as a sign of his intelligence. That was a genius move on goku

the most smart/serious goku was gt goku ssj4

Yes, he is a caricature in Super, where he had a real presence felt in DBZ and DB. Even GT did his character much better. In Super, Goku showed so much disregard for the wellbeing of those around him and acted like a toddler any time a fight wasn't happening. They also made him so single-minded in his obsession with fighting that it completely ruined his dynamic as a father, husband, and friend. He lost so much depth.

I agree, goku being intimidating is something we all miss. It frustrates me to see such a good character being stripped from this. Incredibly irritating that this still happens and that the writers have just completely forgotten this character trait.

Goku was educated by Master Roshi. Goku is a genius ln the battlefield. Goku is gullible, because he thinks the best of everyone.

A lot of characters in DBS have regressed in personality.

DBZ - "Power comes to a need not a desire" DBS - "Tingly back feeling"

"Were you rejected because your chest is a butt?" DB Goku Quote of the fudging year

GUYS lets talk about the REAL issue here! the MUSIC! they don't use serious music to fit serious scenes they also keep the same happy starting intro when its an episode about people dying and the whole universe is in trouble. this needs to be FIXED!

Goku losing his intimidating factor was something I hadn't really thought about but makes a lot of sense now that you mention it. His appeal in DBZ was always those moments when he was finally there after everyone else had been given a shot at defeating the enemy. Though it did get rather boring in the sense that you could always expect Goku to take the lead and defeat the enemy after everyone failed, it was still great to see. Not so much now tho, but on the other hand, there's also the benefit of actually seeing Goku rise up in order to meet the challenges that face him, like Hit in the latest episode.

Goku was always a little slow but he was no idiot as he he is in super

What people don't understand is that we aren't talking about the dub when we say Goku is dumb. We're talking about the writers. Sure Goku is naive, uneducated, motivated and jolly, but he still used to, USED TO, get serious when needed till the end of Z. The writers did make him dumb in Super. In fact they made him an extreme moron. They shat on the little bit of seriousness and character development he had. No matter how you guys try to analyse and describe how we misunderstood the character, its the writers who actually misunderstood the character. No amount of RU-vidr sugarcoating will change this fact. Goku was once a loved character. But the writers made him dumb.

DB Goku - Something happened?! DBZ Goku - What's up! DBGT Goku - Play time~ DBS Goku - I'm actually here bro

Kakarot was always a dimwit

Hard to believe that's the same guy that lectured Tien on fractions in Dragon Ball...

Goku can act smart if he wants to, it's just that he doesn't need to. Beerus and Whis the literal strongest of the universe are protecting the earth- no villain makes it a threat to earth and one of the strongest is living rent free on the planet eating food- Buu. So why does Goku need to be serious and smart when he has nothing to worry about? DBS simply follows Goku and Vegeta striving to get stronger to fight better enemies not necessary enemies unlike DBZ enemies that were a threat to earth.

my frustration with Super is that goku was never that stupid. He was oblivious to social norms, But he is battle smart.

he watched to much netflix

I mean he hit his head when he was a child

Goku went full Peter Griffin in DBS

All those things you said that paid off for Goku were pure absolute luck. Goku never expected Fat Buu to become an ally or spat out by Kid Buu. And he originally gambled wrong with Gohan, because ultimately it was only due to Mr. Satan tossing No. 16's head over to him that initiated him to transform into SSJ2. That said, it's obvious the writers of the anime are trying to make Goku a little bit more like Luffy of One Piece.

At least someone gets he's not dumb he's just free spirited. Someone actually knows he isnt stupid and it's just how he is! THIS TUBER EARNED MY RESPECT!

Fuck even Vegeta doesn't feel as intimidating anymore in super.

How can he be considered dumb? He literally now figures out a fighter's technique mid fight. He even figured out Hit's advanced techniques..even Vegeta never showed he could do that.

Goku's character is supposed to be a genius when it comes to fighting, and clueless when it comes to anything else. He's right on the money in Super actually.

I dunno man,Goku did figure out Hit's time leap skip,I mean thats pretty smart.

He lived his whole life in the woods? I think you mean twelve years...

GT Goku is smarter than super Goku

This is true , I can't take Goku serious at all in Super and also I find Goku annoying in Super as well , but in Z or even in Dragon Ball I can watch with no problem of being annoyed by Goku and I can take him seriously.

In DBZ, Goku was a virtuous fool. As in, he fought a fair fight even if it reduced his chances of winning (gave cell the beans, let Freiza transform into final form, sacrificed himself to save the earth from Cell, etc). In DBS he's just a fool, period.

I agree with his intimidation being lowered. Now when he fights he is more like he is playing. But back in Dragon Ball Z he made more serious comments like "I will end you" and "I will not let you get away with this!" but now he is like "hehe u punch hard".

I totally think gokuu regressed as a character. (by the way this is an awesome and highly thoughtful review). Even though DBGT had kind of the same problems of gokuu being less intimidating by becoming a kid again, the ssj4 transformation kind of made up for it. And especially the mysterious death he had in the ending which made him a legendary god-like character. Unlike the super saiyan god transformation which I think really disappointed us fans. Everytime a new saga came in DBZ we couldn't wait to see the new bad-ass transformations, but in DB Super, all we had was different hair colors and a new ssj-beyond-god that was just a mild change of haircut. Vegeta too, he changed. He is no longer the bad-ass super saiyan we saw in buu saga. He is way less intimidating now. I think it`s Toriyama`s fault. He isn't really an action fighting manga writer but more of a comedy manga writer. So he probably thought the bad-ass gokuu we saw in DBZ was becoming too different from the silly unintimidating friendly gokuu he was familiar with. (there was a different concept for SSJ-God but he changed it to its current form to look `more like gokuu`.) I also saw somewhere that Toriyama likes his strongest main characters to be the small weak looking guys, and the weak ones be like big and intimidating dudes (thus we have the Nappa types). He went out of that in late DBZ sagas, but returned to this model in DB Super unfortunately. The dragonball franchise became a success fighting manga/anime as a fluke actually. It began as a childish comedy manga and because of Toriyama`s wide ranging imagination the franchise almost became a sort of `space opera`, then followed a super-android apocalypse with time travel, and then the concluding buu saga. The franchise became too great for a simple comedy manga writer to keep up the good work. But we fans asked for more, and what he as a writer could have given us was only DB Super, because it`s what he is best at: writing silly comedy!!!

Haha Goku Never kissed Chichi... Kiss my f*ckin' Ass DBS. Then why the f*ck does chichi looks so happy on their wedding pics. She would look like Satan if that actually never happened. BTW everything that was said in this video is exactly what I thought about Goku in DBS. Thumbs up.

If you see the recent hit vs GOKU assassination episode you will understand GOKU is still smart AF

"Oh, so you also get stronger by screaming a lot" lmao im dead

"Do what everyone else does, And wait for Goku!" -Cell, Dragon Ball Z Abridged

I've read some of the Manga and watched the Original Japanese version of DBZ. Also did you know that Masako Nozawa the seiyu of Goku is a science teacher?

Of course Goku doesn't seem as intimidating in Super. Goku by himself? Yeah, he can be intimidating. If you put him next to a GOD OF DESTRUCTION and several other gods who could turn him into Japanese sushi in a second, then no, no he's not.

Akira will eventually write off his mistakes by saying he had a brain tumor. The series will turn into a hospital drama for a short time as filler, and it will be surgically removed then they'll fix his his dumb-ness in episode 130. This is confirmed by akira.

So what you're saying is that Super is not giving enough time to the other characters and focusing on Goku too much, which is the same mistake GT made. That's ... kind of funny.

Dbz goku: 10% stupid Dbs goku: 30% insane Tfs goku: FFS 100000000

Goku is smart, but he likes to act dumb (while hes still young). There was a scene in the hyperbolic time chamber with Goku and Vegeta.

XD your description of Goku near the end was highly reminiscent of Saitama with him only arriving near the climax of a fight

Long story short: DBZ Goku - prodigy. DBS Goku - moron.

Putting Gohan against cell was not selfish. Gohan would die if Goku lost since cell would destroy earth. This way Gohan can at least fight before the inevitable conclusion, especially since he was the strongest. The senzu bean part is pretty difficult to digest. However we can say that if Cell at his state found out that Gohan was more powerful than Goku, he might've attempted to go all out and not take chances. By giving the senzu bean Goku made cell more confident to stall time to let Gohan bring his rage out.

The fact that Goku went to the future and forgot 3 thing on each trip show how dumb them made him in Super. Goku never forgot Sensu beans in Z. Super Goku make Abridged Goku look like Elbert Einstein.

HE AIN'T THE SHARPEST TOOL IN THE SHEEEEED

Agreed. On a side note: I've not kept up with all of Super but to an extent, could Vegita be the new main character? There has been talk about this from back during the tournament arc but Vegita's character is showing the greated amount of growth as he has gone from being a merciless destroyer of worlds, to creating friendships and rivalries, to learning love and becoming a father. Now he seems to be taking a more serious attitude towards not only training but personal discipline. His very nature seems to be turning/continuing development into the image of the father/king he looked up to and thus is becoming a more balanced and some would maybe say benevolent hero or anti-hero. With the Goku becoming simplified and Vegita continuing his character development, I saw argue he is the main focus of the show despite Goku still being used to fill the role of the good hero that saves the day (which is becoming very tiring).

The impression I have had is that Goku became a lot more mature as a character after he suffered his heartattack. He had died before, but this was the first time it had nothing to do with his own weakness, and it gets him to start thinking about what will happen after he is gone, and what makes him really try to get Gohan to go Super Saiyan, because the Earth will need a protector. One way of putting it is that he has entered into the Knight of Faith stage of life, as described by Soren Kierkegaard- he is living for something other than himself.

Being irresponsible and rash is not the same as being stupid. Vegeta is equally irresponsible and rash yet no one says he is an idiotic manchild like Goku. So the examples of Cell and Majin Buu don't count as stupidity, they are irresponsibility which is different.

Really good video. And I have to say, it's really nice to find someone who isn't super-passionate or disparaging about the dub vs. sub.

It's not goku's fault it's the writers fault

TeamFourStars will improve Goku's intelligence.

goku is very inteligent, he just acts dumb

Well with giving a senzu bean I believe Goku knew it was to keep cell from regenerating

Dbz Goku=acts like a real man Dbs Goku=Acts like an idiot

didnt goku figure out hits fighting style

Kid Goku was like ultra smart with his fighting compared to his adult self that is ergo freezing that monster

GOKU: is mayonnaise an instrument? Patrick: Hey! That my line. (New eps) The dummies battle..

I just finished watching super… and man… didn’t think goku could annoy me 😅

The same happened to Picolo in the Majin buu saga. Picolo was portrayed as a coward as opposed to be serious and cautious.

At least in DBZ he knew when to be serious, he juggled playfulness and seriousness well. He took the fights against Frieza, Cell and Buu seriously. Sure, he gave up at Cell and he didn't kill Fat Buu, but when things were dire he was serious. Against Goku Black and Zamasu, where things were at the most absolute dire, he was exactly what was described in the video..."A deranged maniac!"

Why does a grown man that is one of the greatest warrior of his whole universe sound like a kid with a weird voice ?

TFS is arguably more popular now than the OG series. Toriyama would want to continue that hype train

I've always think Goku is dumb in everything but a genius in martial arts, I thought that was pretty clear. P.S.: In the spanish dub offered old Kai a date with Bulma, that makes him more desperate in the english dub. I agree that Goku is less intimidating now, I feel it even if the spanish dub didn't change the soundtrack, but they did give him a man's voice.

4:46 This alone makes me want to rewatch dragonball

This was very interesting to watch, nice job!

and then he unlocks ultra instict.......

Goku was always stupid in Dragonball, not so much in DBZ but Super wants to go back to Dragonball ways

6:50 You're welcome.

I finally figured out why he is so dumb in super. He got hit in the head so many times while fighting kid buu it basically reverted him back to db season 1 levels of intelligence

MoodZi around 9:00 you said that it's almost like Toriyama was scared to give Goku screentime... while that's true, it's also slightly untrue. Goku's non-presence was because Goku was not the main character of Dragonball Z. It was Gohan. Z was all about Gohan and his coming of age. Goku was merely a deuteragonist done exceptionally well.

I think he was actually smarter than he should in Z, since like you said, he didn't have that much screentime, so when he showed up, it was always to be the one that solved everyone's problems or better said, only to the fights instead of real interaction. There's also the fact that again, despite the existence of Goku representing improvement and to grow as a person, his personality was the same. which is being an idiot in a social perspective. I always look Super as the real sequel of the original Dragon Ball, since Z was on a completely different direction where it was more about action than real interaction between characters, while Super takes what it can from both sides and the result for Goku is being a strong and smart fighter, but socially speaking, he's a complete idiot, as he has ever been. Because everytime he was involved into a real interaction, even on Z he was dumb or selfish or not able to understand social behavior (the last filler episode is the proof of that since he cared more about dinosaurs than having a party with his friends), but again, there was not a lot of actual interaction other than combat back in Z. But just as everyone else, this is just my opinion.

The Dragonball Z series that you so love was a forced collaboration between Toriyama and the editors at Shounen Jump. Toriyama was a contract slave while he was writing Dragonball. The editors were the final say on the tone of the manga, who winds up with the most screen time, and the amount of comedy that was allowed. Without their input, you will end up with something different. For better or worse, Dragonball Super is Toriyama with free reign over his creation.

I knew he was uneducated, but he still had some sense. Super just made him dumb. The point that made me scratch my head was when frieza returned. He was happy he got to fight frieza's new form. Like what??? The one person you hate the most, and now you treat him like a buddy.

Also I’ve never heard your opinion on how Goku’s absences throughout the arcs have added to his character and allowed the others to shine and develop. That’s a brilliant observation. Thanks

I feel Goku is watered down, because of the question of the video. We wouldn't question the uneducated side of him if they would let his overall character flourish, rather than being shadowed by high beings and unnecessary comedic acts. Hey, at-least I'm ready for the dub in January. :D

someBODY ONCE TOLD ME THE WORLD WAS GONNA ROLL ME I AIN'T THE SHARPEST TOOL IN THE SHED

Remember when Z Goku led Gero away from the cities to keep people from getting hurt but when Black showed up Super Goku fought him right next door to capsule Corp in the middle of West city?? Super Goku is a scumbag.

Love how he saw it coming when the series was ongoing

He's always been dumb af but he knows how to fight

Goku was a saiyan (who aren't smart to begin with) who was literally raised in the mountains and dropped on his head as a baby. That IQ is only good for battles.

As a long time fan of dbz, I would think that the points made in this video are so obviously true. It blows my mind that so many fans fail to see this. Who ARE these turds who lap up dbs like it's a worthy successor to dbz?

well thats what happens when you hit your head when you were a baby