The devs wrote themselves into a corner with Hammerhead. They decided to have it finished, which makes sense, but it shoehorned them into reworking it like they did which is an unfortunate trade-off.
Mt theory is that they wanted to get rid of the grates so there could be more of an emphasis on the squid roll. Whether or not the redesign was poorly, I doubt it would make sense to port a fan favorite whose main feature conflicts with one of the biggest changes to movement, and making them solid for the sake of squidroll kinda conflicts with what I assume was the original idea
I don't think so, mainly because it being "finished" is mostly the upper portion of the map that you don't actually play on, where the road is. They can still bring back the grates and stuff, just maybe give them a more "finished" look somehow.
For Hammerhead, it would have made SENSE to bring it back still under construction for one main reason: THE NILS STATUE IS RIGHT NEXT TO IT. They made it so it was out of rotation durring Splat2 because it was complete, but wound up getting damaged by Pearl's Princess Cannon and needed to be rebuilt. It would fit with lore as to why it would still be under construction, plus it would help with the continuity of Pearl's voice destroying bridges lmao
@@glamxtimex In the Japanese version of the direct you could see it at the bottom of your screen but couldn’t in the English version as the name of the map covered it
I think that it’s so interesting to see how the maps have been designed with the zipcaster special in mind. Once you pay attention to it, there are so many features and details which clearly are there just for this special. From what I have seen so far, it seems there are two kinds of stages, open stages and closed off stages. By open stages, I mean those where the vast majority of the edge open without a wall, such as scorch gorge, hammerhead, mahi mahi, etc. In these stages, it is common that there are huge pillars across the map, notably hammerhead bridge, undertow spillway, and scorch gorge to a lesser extent. These giant pillars seem great for the zipcaster, they can be grappled to from any angle at any height enabling a variety of plays with the special which is obviously a good thing that the developers would want. There are exceptions, mahi mahi has no walls around the edge, but there are still these floating inflatable things and smaller pillars which offers different routes and plays for the special as well. Oh and museum’s rotating platforms obviously are great for the special as well. The other type of map is that with walled edges, like eel tail alley, mincemeat and inkblot kind of. Having most of the stage surrounded by walls is great and arguably better for the zipcaster, as it has more options to grapple to, therefore more playmaking potential and less predictability, we saw in the release date trailer how the special interacted with the wall on eel tail. I think analysing the stages like this can maybe clue us in to why the returning splat 2 stages were chosen. The easiest one to explain is probably inkblot, 2 huge buildings that are effectively pillars on either side of the map are great for it, the shell lamp posts are good as well, and the general verticality of the back sections are good. Sturgeon is also great for the special, the rotating platforms are great when in the up position, lots of verticality around mid sections is good as well, and the sections near spawn are good as well. I hate to say it, but wahoo is great for zipcaster, possibly the best stage for it out of the returning ones imo. There are walls around the entire mid section, access to the other side of mid when the bridge isn’t there also can catch defenders off guard, and attacking and defending had lots of opportunities with walls around most of the map. Mako seems like the exception, whilst there is a fair variety of height, there aren’t that many grappling opportunities, so it is the exception. Overall this is just my theory may be completely wrong but I’m trying to decipher why they picked wahoo 😅
I do have an idea for Wahoo World. How about instead of the bridge being on a timer you need to ink a button on a wall like they have used in The Switches shifty station. It would make the bridge be more strategic.
on the bright side, considering how drastic and simplified some of these changes are, I have confidence they could return saltspray and make it a more playable map
I really genuinely believe that we can't say that a stage is "ruined" until we play it, this is a new game and there is a good chance that things will play differently lending itself to different map design, we only have to wait
@@LuckyOwI777 EXACTLY the game will play out way differently with these abilities so what quantifies a good map will be even different, for example he was complaining about no changes to the right side of surgeon shipyard and it still being a wall, but because of the 2 ways you can exit a wall now that area doesn't necessarily need to be changed anymore
Exactly. I don't know if this is a case of competitive players thinking their opinions should be law, but all those pre-release tier list and whatnot are kind of funny.
honestly I think we'll have to wait for more images of hammerhead to make a better judgement. I'm wondering if in exchange for the grates ALOT more walls are inkable leading to more unique climbable paths. if I remember correctly the few walls you could climb would just take you up to the grate bridge and no where else
From the site images and rainmaker footage we've seen pretty much the entire stage so i felt pretty confident being harsh here. Its hard to picture because you have to stitch them together, but there is potential it might not be that bad. At least I hope.
Yeah Hammerhead got hit hard I’m afraid, those grates were my favorite part of the map and those being gone just feels like part of it’s soul got ripped away. Of course Splatoon 2 has shown that stages can be renovated so if it doesn’t get fixed by launch I hope it gets foxed somewhere down the line.
I find the removal of the grates in Hammerhead really jarring, like why remove the main gimmick of the level and simplify other great stages like mahi mahi
One thing to keep in mind is that these were probably all the Turf War layouts of the map, which tend to be the most gimmicky and don't want you to push into spawn. They might still be different in ranked and have better routes. No grates on Hammerhead is shocking but it would probably be DISGUSTINGLY cheesy in this game, especially Rainmaker - I hope the stage still works but I can see why they had to go.
I feel like they are changing the wrong maps. Old Hammerhead and Flounder were perfect and they are getting changed, while Inkblot still looks small and a little clustered and Wahoos gimmick doesn’t work in this game Edit: Ok y’all right hammerhead isn’t perfect but i’m still gonna miss the old version. the grates woulda been fun with dualies
I completely disagree with your Old Hammerhead bridge because players did not like the old version I Like the new Hammerhead bridge But everyone has their own opinions on Hammerhead bridge
@@newalbacore8352 new Hammerhead bridge is not Perfect but better old Flounder heights was nice and the new Mahi Mahi resort is also pretty cool with the new water texture
It's weird how they felt the need to change hammerhead for splatoon 3 even though it was already a solid map but when they ported Kelp Dome into Splatoon 2 they changed almost nothing about it despite being one of the absolute worst stages imo.
For mahi-mahi, I just hope the block that allowed you to take rainmaker to the enemy spawn easier when the water level dropped will still be there (the one that has red arrows)... It just creates so many come-back options. I also still hope you can still get to the enemy's corridor with the small islands without needing to jump on the ones on the back side. (you know, by jumping in the first island that is linked to the regular stage, then jumping to the big platform at your left and that way reaching the enemy's corridor with an unconventional path to avoid enemies when the water-level didn't drop yet)
Seems like people either love hammerhead or hate it, I hated it, definitely one of my least favorite maps in either game so I'm glad they redesigned it. I'm hoping Mahi is still a winner in 3.
Eh, if it’s lore reasons as to why the bridge is different, then I don’t really care as much for viability. The world and characters of Splatoon are far more intriguing to me than the competitive aspect. But I completely understand the frustration.
Museum still the goat. Hammerhead looks like walleye 2.0, so, not good. Mahi will be fine, not great just fine. Like, you wont look forward to playing mahi anymore, it'll just be like "Oh, Mahi is in rotation, whatever" Mako, Sturgeon, and Inkblot are definitely gonna feel worse in this game. You're gonna be able to do smart map movement stuff on Museum and then you're gonna play Sturgeon and try to do the same thing and realize you can't. Wahoo needs to burn down.
Mahi Mahi, hammerhead are definitely ruined. Flounder and museum are ok, but still aren’t as good as their originals. So I would say yes, they ruined splatoon 1 returning stages. The few changes to splatoon 2 stages are pretty good imo, so they are pretty good at the very least
They should have just turned the grates into a mini bridge, with expanded sides in hammerhead. So they can keep the verticality while keeping the completed bridge theme
My thoughts on returning maps Museum: Looks great and better than ever Hammerhead: Unlike half of the people in the comments are saying It looks fine EXCEPT they need to add more side area if not it looks insanely cramped Mahi Mahi: ALMOST PERFECT. Needs more side islands for ranked and we need more singleplayer elements in multiplayer Flounder: Straight up cursed. That stage looks SCUFFED and is the only one I don't have hopes for. Why get rid of the height when we have specials like zipcaster and taticooler? Inkblot, Sturgeon and Mako: Looks the same and they look good Wahoo: Im going to get absolutely bombarded by this but I LOVE WAHOO. 1000% agree with chara said about getting rid of those 2 buildings, hell even put something there like a drop tower for zipcaster and some cover for the sides, the potential for a wahoo revamp is nigh infinite and they can do so much with a renovation in the future. Did Splatoon 3 ruin maps? No. Questionable decisions with map design? YES.
@@jg_ultra5133 zones layout is fine but every other mode feels like it’s made by someone who never took a class in video game design before. I feel so bad for this stage. Hopefully it will get a rework
I wonder to what degree the tri-colour turf wars for the new splatfests impacted stage design. One team starting in the middle in those cases seems like it'd make for a tough design challenge.
Personally, I'm glad to have Mahi back. That one's definitely an old favorite. Even if it's different to how it used to be. (Also, Calamity Mod music in the background, nice.)
Okay but what if due to the whole chaos theme, and the fact that Hammerhead Bridge now canonically connects Inkopolis and the Splatlands, the stage can have a variant where it's sometimes broken and under construction again due to some random reason? Either that or some significant event in the future DLC story mode leads to its destruction and it gets a permanent change like some stages have gotten in the past.
Hammerhead is my absolute favorite stage from 1 and I was insanely hyped seeing it again. Having all that hype come crashing down when I saw the actual layout of the stage was heartbreaking 😭
4:38 I'm ok with it being 2 instead of 3 but i don't think flounder heights will be my favorite stage anymore, Definitely not as bad as wahoo world but something about the verticality in the map and all the different routes around the stage is what made it special and unique for me. I'm just really hoping that they bring saltspray rig back.
Huh. I didnt realize people dislike Walleye Warehouse, it's always been my favorite stage. I like how the center has just the perfect amount of cover to even out fights between weapons of varying ranges without making backline weapons obsolete thanks to how high the various platforms are, and I also like how the ranked variant allows for 3 approach options to the goal.
Everyone is already getting so mad about a game that hasn't even come out yet. Yes they have changed things, but you haven't even been able to test them yet and have seen barely any gameplay of these changes so maybe wait until it's released before you can start deciding if it's ruined or not.
But the point of a trailer is to make you excited for the content. If something looks bad, then why be excited for it. (Also, I like all the map choices as they didnt bring back skipper pavilion or salt spray which were two maps I hate)
Kinda bothers me how they barely changed splatoon 2 maps, considering that both games are in the same console, even if they are good maps, I don't wanna keep playing the same map I played during the second game.
I’d like to see more drastic changes to stages depending on the mode like what they did for rainmaker on Piranha Pit in Splatoon 2 - that one feels like a completely different stage.
For hammerhead I think the exact same. Your bringing back a stage that had a good gimik and got rid of it. Especially when it works better with how brush roller and dualies, maybe even brella function in the game now in comparison to splat 1
I feel like Flounder Heights might not be final because remember when Snapper Canal looked very unfinished in the Splatoon 2 Direct compared to the final version?
I didn’t go competitive until S2, (still got S+ like 80 in 1) but from my PERSONAL experience along with my pals we all despised Hammerhead solely because of the grates lol. They weren’t necessarily a problem on Zones, but TC and RM it was terrible. I could only imagine the horror of Clam Blitz running 3 pures of run speed with the basket being similar to RM pedestal 😭 I for one am happy the map is getting reworked.
I don't really have anything to add except that hammerhead bridge now looks a lot like that one bridge section in half life 2 where you needed to walk across the broken rebar underneath the bridge to get to the other side. Like it reminds me EXACTLY of that part of the game
I am noticing a trend of new, open maps for Splatoon 3 and the reworks being changed to have more large, open spaces. Personally, I like most of the reworks, but the over simplification makes the maps bland and boring.
I still think Splatoon 3 maps will be the all around best maps in the franchise because of the open feel and the visuals being more detailed with nice backgrounds.
6:04, personally? I prefer the idea of a wall route than another ramp route. I see it being a more committal route for attackers due to the fact that with ramps, it's just another pathway but on an decline. If you end up choosing the wall route, you gotta be more careful since you can't escape as quickly (especially if you get caught by a defender & forgot to ink up the wall).
this is not really related to the video but i havent seen anyone talk about this in the direct when theyre showing off replays, you can see at the start of the match that you have the invincibility glow similar to squid surge/roll it probably to combat spawn camping which is super cool!
After getting to play new mahi mahi... I think it feels much worse than the original, personally. Sure, it looks like mahi mahi, and it has it's gimmick, but it feels like a pale imitation of the original imo. Much less dynamic feeling.
you have very good background music selection when it comes to ur vids. it's not too overwhelming but also not boring at the same time. and honestly yeah, i agree with ur points about hammerhead. imo it's not really a "rework" as much as it is just a completely new looking stage with the only things comparable to the old one is that it being based off a bridge and the fact that it's long and slightly narrow (compared to other maps).
Changing Flounder Heights from three stories to two stories is blasemphous. That's like saying a high-rise building is the same as a mid-rise building (newsflash they're not). It lost what makes it iconic. So much fun jumping down from above and and ambushing unsuspecting people is now gone because I can see everything.
I’m a little disappointed that flounder is getting changed a little, since it being so tall is why I liked it. Though it’s only a story lower so I shouldn’t be so bummed about it. Edit: the maps here and its great! glad they didn’t change it too much
Just what is the deal with the devs’ mantra on stage design. They seem to heavily favor the Splatoon 2 design of “super condensed maps with minimal movement options” even though it seems like most competitive players clearly prefer the more expansive interesting maps. It’s like the opposite of Smash, like the devs want to make the game’s stages more competitive but don’t know how to do it. Does the Japanese scene have a different opinion? What’s happening here?
I dont even think condensed maps are nice casually either, stage design is something that matters for everyone and I don't get why they try to force that when all their fan favorite stages don't do it.
@@ProChara Yeah definitely. Casual players want stages that look and feel interesting and unique, and also that have ways to avoid the action in mid in case you don't like fighting (yknow, one of the selling points of Turf War to less experienced players). It's odd that the devs seem to be willing to undermine those players
Great video Chara! On another note, I think an intro could be super fitting for your videos, just a short animation saying "ProChara" after your initial talk, similar to Wadsm's intro. It could for example start at 0:33, be about 3 seconds long and then the actual video would begin. Just a small idea that i think might step up your content even more :D
Suggestion for wahoo: underneath the closing bridge, make a section of the wall underneath it inkable to get into mid. Instead of not having options to get to mid you just have a different option now. While we're at it I'd also make the tops of the arches on the spinning section inkable and possibly a bit wider. Maybe they could stop for a few seconds near where the bridge opens so there's less downtime. Wahoo has a big problem but it would only take a little work to fix it entirely.
Hey Chara, I just wanted to say you're such a champ for putting out this much quality content. Thank you. Like, do you sleep? I got into splatoon late, in 2020. It's basically become a personal top 10 game and the one I put the most time into playing "competitively" (as I can). And I came there from playing fighters like Tekken, and R6 Siege. Anyway your vids have really helped me out. I'm hoping to make the step into playing with a team in Splatoon 3. The game has been incredibly rewarding to learn to play and allows for so much expression...it's a mind-blowing IP imo.
(video isn't out atm) Ruined? The fixed Hammerhead which was my most hated Splatoon map, they also fixed some weird straightways in Mahi Mahi, this is a change for the better IMO
Now while I'm not too miffed about the changes to splatoon 1 maps I am extremely concerned if some of these changes exist just to try and balance missle spam by cutting off interesting bits and pieces to reduce inkable turf. The worst thing is that it could imply tenta missles have gone *completely* untouched from from their final form in splatoon 2
Nintendo Japan's recent video where one of the two teams featured - families being taught how to play Splatoon - had a coach basically go "yeah missile and tentamissile spam is really good!" is more concerning IMO lmfao, can we not promote this kind of gameplay Nintendo haha
Ngl, people are probably going to stop using tenta. Its gotten so much hate that i think (at least the players who played splatoon 2) will just not use it
Remember that just because Tenta Missiles are back doesn't mean that they're going to be op. In fact the op nature of tenta missiles were a thing of the late Splatoon 2 meta. Tenta Missiles used to be so much weaker during the early days of Splatoon 2.
