Appreciate your honesty! Being in Japan, I am in the floods of voices that praises HHKB. I am currently trying normal mechanical MX switches, quite happily stuck in the "Keyboard Bog" as we say in Japanese (like literally), meaning being obsessed with mechanical keyboards and cannot get out of it. I am glad that I watched your review and do not have to spend too much money on this and just continue my journey with the normal mechanical keyboards. Subscribed!
Good review! HHKBs are certainly expensive compared to mx keyboards, but $200 is pretty standard for a topre keyboard. Considering how much better the cheap mechs and custom keyboard scene has gotten these days, the price is certainly getting harder to justify. For me it will always be MX for gaming, Topre for work/typing.
I bought the same keyboard earlier this year. I wasn't 100% happy with it in its stock setup so installed some silence-x rings, lubed the sliders and stabs with tribosys 3204 and fitted some Domikey caps. Massive improvement in sound and feel. Disassembling for the first time is a bit daunting as there are approximately 437857857348753 screws but it's definitely worth it.
still have my HHK that I bought in 2006! they do actually loosen up and get a bit quieter as you type on them every day. if you type really quickly like I do then the key travel actually works great because you never hit the bottom of the key travel, and after a while you memorize all the function combos. control, esc, and tilde are all “in the right place” for programming. its a very specific keyboard to be sure.
I'm thinking on buying a mechanical keyboard, and I've been on a marathon of your videos the past couple of days, your reviews are the best, well planned and trough, and I really appreciate the timestamps in each video. Thanks!
Wait you spent your own money for this review? Respect! I don't think I've ever seen a 22k sub youtuber spent over $200 on a product just to be able to review it as fairly as possible. I really don't understand people who say you need an HHKB for the proper topre experience. It's a very specialized board with a unique layout and it's built for being light and portable over being sturdy. Realforce or Leopold I think for the average person are the better topre boards, and you already had one. If sound is your biggest issue with them I think a silenced topre board might be the way to go, I don't know. I really like how Niz silenced their switches out of the box.
I have no idea why I watch these videos. I know nothing about keyboards and have never used a mechanical keyboard. But for some reason i cannot stop watching
@@andrew1983 lmao what? Ducky has and always will be a reputable brand. Varmilo makes extremely high quality board as well, along with leopold. I don’t think anyone has ever said that ducky is too mainstream (what?) all of these brands have been well known in the community for a while, so no sheep are flocking to anything. the keyboard hobby has been around for ages, you’re acting like new people coming to it is a bad thing. Stop finger wagging at a crowd who has nothing to do with your hairbrained complaints and suck it up that other people are getting to experience your hobby for the first time.
The placement of the Ctrl key is one of the most important aspects of a Happy Hacking keyboard and anyone who doesn't need that placement there is likely to find this to be the wrong keyboard for their needs. I feel that it needs to be mentioned that this historic location of the Ctrl key is a huge advantage for Emacs users and programmers. The target audience is likely to be spending most of their time in a shell and using either Emacs or Vim/Vi. If this does not describe you, it's likely you are wasting your time here. 🤓
@Alex Sustavov I recently got the HHKB Professional 2/PD-KB400B as I wanted to experience the Topre keys without gambling at the high-end of the range. Vim is my primary editor but I would not recommend moving the arrow keys to HJKL as the Fn key would be further away as compared to where the arrow keys are currently situated. I agree with online reviews that Fn access to arrow keys is a non-issue which was something I worried about due to the importance of arrow keys in Microsoft products. I would highly recommend that new HHKB users should not get the blank type versions as I refer to the print a lot for the special keys despite being a touch typist. Currently I've setup a Windows 10 US language mode to access the US keyboard instead of adding a US keyboard layout to the UK language mode because the key combination of Ctrl-Shift switches keyboard modes but also clashes with Ctrl-Shift-c and Ctrl-Shift-v needed to copy and paste out of Terminus/tmux terminals. Edit: quick mention keyboard picked up open-box on Ebay for GBP100 with a promotion so only slightly more than one stick of DDR4 16 GB ECC RDIMM at current prices.
For those absolutely needing it, one presses "Fn" in the lower right using the right pinkie and "Tab" in the upper left using the left pinkie so hopefully people who like shouting on the internet are not put off. 😁
Hi, I know it's been a while from this video but do you still planning on doing the silence version of hhkb type-s? I am actually really excited to see you comparing the three and also could you comparing three hhkb with Niz and real force as well? That will be absolutely amazing for a topre guide thing! I am just starting my journey on keyboard, and with a mechanical, I am really interested in Topre as well. Thank you for your honest and amazing reviews! Subscribed!
Thank you for your honesty and thoughtfulness. Thanks for not pulling any punches. You gave it a fair shake and saved someone from the hype and making an expensive mistake.
I use a full size real force keyboars with lubed silent topre switches, but I swapped out the domes for Heavy Redux domes and I love it. Been using it for about a year at work.
Yeah it's expensive, but I can't return to the other mechanical keyboards (I tried several times). I like the sound of this version more than type-s version. It's matter of taste. In general I love them, but they are very expensive. I guess they don't sell a lot of them so they have to sell them that way. It's a Keyboard for a very specific type of user. Good review.
Something for new HHKB users-heavy does not mean quality. The tolerances on these new boards are extremely tight and of very high quality from an engineering perspective. If all you want is heavy, just go to your nearest Best Buy and pick up any old Corsair or Razor Blackwidow off the shelf.
Thanks for another great video! I picked up a Japanese layout HHKB hybrid type s black from Amazon JP and the person I got it from added the foam at the bottom to help a little more. I really like it and agree with you that the black is hard to read in dim light but I think it looks cool and forces me to learn to touch type. I use the keyboard cabled with windows pc, Bluetooth with a MacBook Pro and iPad Pro and they work fine. The Japanese one has arrow keys and ISO enter key. I was worried about comparability when I got it but haven’t had any issues for me. Thanks look forward to more videos!
Thank you for this detailed review. these things are built like tanks. mine is 2009/1 and still work like day one. If you hesisate to buy one, just got for it.it takes time to get used to their particular layout, but after some practice, you cannot go back to anything else. I I have the old usb-b version and was wondering if upgrading was worth it but mine will likely outlast me.
I really appreciate the honest review. It's kinda talked me out of buying this keyboard (at least at this price). I still want to try the HHKB format, but I'll probably just go for a Keychron Q60 for the same price.
I like light weights keebs, my plateless PC case 60% cust is 400 gram (100 less then HHKB). Its flex and more soft to bottomout, it enaf durable when lay at deskmath.
Yup, not sure membranes or domes as a means to feel to confirm a press through the buckling of the plastic + the bottom out, the "thud" combo is the best way to indicate a key press coz' this is ultimately about feel, from: your fingers (which may have thicker skin if you play a string instrument) first, to the keycaps to the friction of the stabilizers and other parts that have friction like the keycap to the shaft of the done and it's shaft, to the spring's friction to the walls of the keycap, etc. including the slight friction on the lube if there is but then with mechanical switches it'll depend on the spring mechanism if has good metal (or plastic but I doubt a good spring plastic would be better than metal) such that it comes back fast but the mushiness would be when it bottoms out and will depend on what's underneath the switches and keycaps and spring mechanism (foam, dampers, etc. would be make it quieter but like a see-saw something will be compromised- the snappiness of key's return which will contribute to delay or lag to output on the screen (from the fingers). I think one day the fastest but most accurate keyboard (accurate coz' you distinctively felt you typed things) without the "thud' when it bottoms out could be: a really long new breed of tactile switches with a new metal alloy formulation if it's not a membrane (if it's a membrane a new type of rummer or non-metal springy material). The switches would be so long, the travel would be long that there is no bottom out, so no "thud" (a thock contributor) on regular very fast, competitive typing and gaming. No bottom out to take away the energy for the key return. This'll also most likely be a keyboard that's in a way built-into a table or the table has a whole with adjusters so that things can be accommodated for that long switch and dampers underneath and around it so the table does not become an "amplifier" of the net sound the '"thock". or it can just have a tall but long sloping wristrest coz' it'll be a very tall keyboard for sure. May Switch &. Click level up into the 21st century and Kickstarter this new breed of keyboard (and table) :-) to really level up and make the world a better place, coz' fast communication through typing like the invention of the watch, specifically the wristwatch is top 2 (after the gift of time and time keeping, time is the most important tool and resource, the no. 1 God's gift). It'll also be system that'll be almost at 0 decibels, coz' the "thud" even if it''s a "thock" (like a bubbling pond filled with cute Kois) is still like someone texting with the click for every character type sound ON/enabled (to determine a keypress which is ON by default by Apple and I think Android- it should be OFF by default). God bless, Rev. 21:4
HHKB - where less is (not) more and if you don't like it then you are dumb. I guess that makes me dumb. HHKB to me takes a sort of Apple approach to design...that is, "we know best; you don't need things like a normal arrows layout on the secondary layer, or choices with your modifiers layout; just use what we give you". Annoying. I wanted a Topre board so I bought an FC660c because it has a more normal layout - and dedicated arrows. 65% > 60% > HHKB IMO. Keep up the good work, Betty! Also, your ring is gorgeous. I'm glad you wear it in all your videos; it's classy.
I've been on the fence about getting a Topre keyboard. The cost for one these boards is about the same as a finished entry-level custom. Your reviews and insight are very helpful in the decision making process. I'm sitting on the fence -- maybe if they're on sale around the holidays, I may consider getting one. For now, pass.
I have the HHKB BT and the HHKB Hybrid Type-S. The silent one has much lesser tactility which makes it lose it's appeal. I ended up selling it and am now using Niz Atom68.
How do you find the bluetooth on the Niz Atom68? I am really interested in buying it but I am scared it might not switch seamlessly between multiple devices.
@@giuseppejoeramundo1452 The bluetooth on Niz68 is surprisingly awesome. I allows me to connect to 3 bluetooth device and 1 wired device. They switch seemlessly using the keyboard short cut. My only gripe is that there is no RGB on the 45g domes option.
Hi!! could you please review the Ajazz K680T? it's within a budget mechanical keyboard price range, and i wanna be sure before buying it! thank you for the reviews, and i love the videos!
HHKB switches and the feel is marmite, I use an MX for gaming on the PC and HHKB or real force for writing and photo editing on my Mac. I’ve tried loads of boards and switches but I keep coming back to this and the real force - it’s a daft cost but pushing out a tonne of words on it just feels great. I can understand the hate …it’s a lot of money and it’s not perfect but I find it never distracts me from what I’m doing on screen, an experience I’ve never had with any other keyboard.
Subscriber count +1. I'm sorry you got so much hate. I've tried all sorts of boards, and whilst I've never owned a Topre, I did get to use a friend's HHKB. My daily driver uses Omron Gamma Zulu switches, so I was keen to compare them. Aaaaand... I prefer the Gamma Zulus. And it's not even a close contest. There's slightly more sound dampening with the Topre, sure. But I'm a light typer. I like the shorter actuation points of the Zulus, which still offer a satisfying weight and tactile bump even at that 1.5mm actuation. The benefit of Topre seems to be when the keys bottom-out, and my typing style rarely lets that happen. Hard to appreciate a benefit I rarely even feel. For me the Topre wasn't bad by any means, but I'm with you: I just don't get the hype. I think anyone buying a Topre for the first time with the believe that these switches are somehow the last word in typing heaven are going to be very disappointed. I can't really compare price to my daily driver. On paper, HHKBs go for £250 here in the UK, and I got my Das X50Q for £100. But that was with a heavy discount during a sale - they retail for ~£169 normally, which puts it towards the higher end of the market. Topre fuckboys are gonna hate and HHKBs will always be coveted. I hope you recognise their inability to brook anything less than love for Topre is their problem, not yours. PS: Gonna review the Ducky Shine 7 anytime soon? My wife's looking for a new Keeb and we're eyeing it up.
I would like to own a keyboard with the same layout as a hhkb, not a 200 USD hhkb itself since i only got interested by this because for me it is the only 60% usable and with some smart changes like the backspace placement and with that a discrete tilde/grave keys, also after seeing the keyboard i changed "crouch" from control to capslock in every game i could and it is really nice to use it.
I must be in the minority here but I found this keyboard to be extremely overpriced and overrated. The keyboard felt cheap to the touch and the typing was very unsatisfying compared with my Filco brown cherry switches. I think you are paying a colossal premium because it's made in Japan. My Filco is also Japanese design and made in Taiwan, and I think the Taiwanese did a perfect job putting it together too, so I don't need to pay extra 100 dollars for someone in Japan to assemble it.
Very interested and well put together Video first of all. I was also very curious before buying this Keyboard because many People Reviews just said that the typing Quality is really good but the Quality is "mid". I bought the Keyboard in the white Version and im existed to get it. I hope tbe 250$ were worth it.
What are “g keys?” If you meant something like making macros and remapping keys, i use autohotkey. Its a computer program (free) so you can use it with whatever keyboard you have.
Will you make a video on a "Heavy Grail" unit? I can't find a good review on that custom board anywhere, I bet you would do a great job at reviewing it.
Like you, I need dedicated arrow keys. The Leopold FC660C fits the bill nicely. Mine is a two tone gray/blue with 45g Topre switches. I recommend you check it out.
I wish this keyboard had a red nipple mouse. so I dont' ever have to take my hands off the keyboard. If anyone knows one please let me know. BTW I love this keyboard, its great if you use alot of short cuts, everything is very close together, so your hands will not ever over stretch or feel tired. its really made for programmers, that spend half of their time, doing short cut combos inbetween writing a couple of lines of code. Sound and feel is really just an after thought.
You like the feel of the switches right? If so try the Leopold fc660c low noise. It is factory silenced and yet not a crazy price increase. It does feel different though to a Hhkb though. I do feel almost in the most ways it feels different, I prefer to the Hhkb though.
It looks so bulky and would probably feel that way as well due to being used to low(er) profile mechanical keyboards. I had one of those years ago and didn't like the layout at all. Constantly having to use the FN key gets old real quick.
@@piccolo6916 Then how is it possible that my K8 Pro sounds better than Topre switches? Can you explain? You must be living in the 1980s or something 😂
Printed black is for those pretend using blank keys. Right angle USB plug is good, plus Type C, users can decide which side to run the cord. Straight plug is easy to crush.
This keyboard does have a keymap software. That would help a lot with the awkward secondary function problem! Totally agree with you on the fact that this thing is overpriced though lol. I own one and I love it but holy shit it's a tough pill to swallow for a lot of people
You make some good points, just couple things: 1) Many people want their cable to go to the left or the right on their desk. Angled connector helps with that. So this is not a negative, it's a design choice and a smart one. I think it's easier to have an angled connector and to have your cable in the middle, than having straight connector and want to have your cable on the left or right side (latter requires more desk space than former). 2) I don't agree that topre switches are at the top of their game when lubed and silenced. I much prefer non-silent topre boards. I love how they sound and don't want to suppress that sound. I haven't tried lubing because I'm already happy with stock topre. But I have read many times that lubing can decrease tactility, so I'm not sure if lubing is top of their game. Also a question now that you've tried both realforce and hhkb, which one do you prefer?
Betty, what switch would you recommend? I’m planning to get a mizar mz60 so I can swap the switches with some better switches. I’m not very good when it comes to keyboards, thank you :)
Hey Bets ! For me tha sound test is a nogo (too muffled) and I hate the cable orientation too. Moreover an all plastic build @ 200$... C'mon. Great video. Love from France.
you should review a "navless" keyboard, it is the only keyboard bigger than 75% and smaller than 100% that i would use since the numpad is useful in games and you can put the navigation keys in a layer on the numpad itself making the num lock key great again
In which games is the numepad useful? I never used it in any games before going to TKL. Apart from that, I didn't know navless keyboard existed. I'm not interested in the slightest since I almost never use the numpad but I use Home and End a lot, and Pg up, Pg Down and Del also, but less, but it's still nice to know they exist.
@@Thagor95 it is still rare and the only company i saw making a navless keyboard is corsair and it will be expensive when i buy one. I like because of the layers and the games that is useful for me is CSGO to buy weapons, Arma 3 and Squad because it have too many buttons since they try to be a military simulator and with only PC in mind. But the other games that also have a console version doesn't have that many keys so for modern games with less commands in general you can even use a 60% keyboard or something like the Razer Tartarus Pro (compare the first Deux Ex to half-life 2 and try to play Deus Ex on a 60% smoothly with no problem)
"Anyone that if a fanboy' is either an idiot or a paid shill," (Linus Sebastian - LTT.) And I agree with him. You're reviews are your honest opinion and if the product doesn't stack up. You call it out. Like you I see Topre as over priced and lacking when compared to other offerings. I've never tried one. And when buying in Aussie $$ I'm not paying +$350 for any full sized board that doesn't have blue ALPS in it. Keep up the honest reviews and don't worry about the shills and fanboys.
Keyboard stabilizer is rattly af. have the same impression with your video about the form factor, its too weird for me to actually getting used to it. not to mention that you have to change the Topre slider into a compatible CherryMX switches if you want to look for a keycaps that are mostly available on the market because Topre keycaps is also expensive and rare. Nice video as always.
Excuse my ignorance, but this "topre" just looks like a unnecessarily complicated rubber dome, and sounds like it too. And it's all plastic fantastic, and it has a different layout for the sake of being different... is this keyboard trying to be bad on purpose?
Topre is about the feels. People with Topre boards are like "yeah I put on the rings and put case foam and all that in there but it messed up the way the keys felt so I took it all out and now it's perfect again" also you can get them in black and there are color keysets. But they are kinda old school yeah. They did have an RGB line a couple of years ago but those things sucked.
