Do Vintage Guitar Speakers REALLY Sound Better?

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Does speaker type matter? In this episode we test whether speakers of different types and from different eras actually make a huge difference. Rhett Shull, Dave Onorato and myself compare a NEW Celestion Vintage 30 12" Guitar Speaker vs VINTAGE 70's Celestion G12H 12" Guitar Speaker inside the same Orange 4x12 Cabinet. Using a 1972 Orange Overdrive OR 120 we recorded the V30's then swapped them out for Vintage G12 H's. The results will surprise you! Ley me know your thoughts.
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Опубликовано:

26 июн 2020

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Комментарии : 1,7 тыс.

@ronnieDshman18 4 года назад

I actually think that Rick’s part sounds better with the newer speakers but Rhett and Dave need the older ones for sure

@jkbaca41 4 года назад

I was thinking the same thing while listening to the back to back section.

@joelspaulding5964 4 года назад

Can only agree with this. Actually, will emphatically agree😉

@markfernandes9627 4 года назад

Even I was thinking the same

@ianwillett4009 4 года назад

I agree too!

@gtrplyr67 4 года назад

I thought the opposite. I liked Rick with the older and Rhett and Dave with the newer ones.

@launder0 4 года назад

Easy way to make it WAY more controlled: record a loop (on any looper pedal, like a ditto or something) and play it for both speakers (or amps, or whatever you're trying). This is the best way to test anything that comes after the pickups. Also: blind test. Record both and then make the other guys listen to it blindly (if they can't see your face when choosing, even better). Make it blind for us for some time too!

@qua7771 3 года назад

There's an entire recording studio. I couldn't figure out why they played twice.

@jscan 3 года назад

Exactly what I was thinking! Especially when Rick said "scientific" .. This would have allowed a direct A/B as well, switching back and forth between tracks.

@Noah-gq7pq Год назад

that makes sense fernando,,then its the x-act same input same guitar same player

@davidpggarrett 4 года назад

If only my smartphone had Vintage 30s, then I'd be able to tell the difference!

@patthomas9547 4 года назад

Lol

@qua7771 3 года назад

They do have a headphone jack.

@fusermonkey 3 года назад

Yup. Were all hearing what these amps and guitars sound like through Logitech computer speakers really ;)

@ahackbutitry 4 года назад

honestly don't think one sounds better than the other. Just different.

@andyrichardson9039 4 года назад

This, basically. If you'd have told me that the second set of speakers were new-production G12H 30s, I'd have gone 'yep, fair enough, bit different to V30s' and that would have been it. For most of what I play, I could use either quite happily.

@kylegrossi8175 4 года назад

I agree. If i ended up with a tone like either of those i would be happy.

@ivanfelipechavez2693 4 года назад

Yep

@rowbags3017 4 года назад

I listened "blind" while doing paperwork and, barring one section of Rick's playing, I found I'd preferred the '70s set-up when I went back and saw the on-screen captions. It's just a more "open and fuller" sound that, for me, works better on most of the samples here. Purely subjective, of course, and there's no "right or wrong" - and, as Rick said, he'd have sculpted anything we've heard here before it got anywhere near going into a finished mix.

@remco2777 4 года назад

I like the Vintage 30s over the G12H. More crisp and the definition is much better and more together sounding. (I listened to these over studio monitors)

@johngrant5749 4 года назад

VIDS2013 likewise.

@CurtHowland 4 года назад

"More crisp" is a good way to put it.

@VBshredder 4 года назад

I agree, although the difference is not as much as I expected. The V30's just have that cut and bark that cuts through the mix live like a knife.

@N2F1 4 года назад

Me too. I thought the V30’s sounded better with all three guitars and players. To me the G12H’s sounded just a bit buzzy in the high end. I could see those getting irritating sounding very easily.

@jbognap 4 года назад

To me the V30s sounded controlled and focused. The G12Hs sounded more hairy and open.

@flugelbinder80 4 года назад

This right here is why I fitted vintage blackbacks in my Marshall cab.

@natlparkdude 4 года назад

I much prefer the vintage speakers. The modern ones sound too harsh and biting, for lack of better words. P.S. Love the banter and these "team" videos!

@sirsuse 4 года назад

Vintage 30's all day long. Sounded crisper to my ears.

@Oborowatabinostk 3 года назад

Same, the Gs sounded muddy to me

@incubrian 3 года назад

So, Vintage 60s?

@WildBillQRO 4 года назад

The common folk will never know the difference , they both sound good to me , cheers from Canada

@EpicStuffMan1000 4 года назад

@@TrashcanGarage Too right. Old silvertone amps were the equivalent of those monoprice amps nowadays, and people loved them for sounding weird and less pristine than Fenders of their time. Hell, Fender were always looking to save money. It's entirely subjective. Personally I prefer playing V30s, but those G12Hs sound great.

@alanfunt4013 4 года назад

"Common folk". From the lips of a guitarist? LMFAO!

@scottreynolds6317 4 года назад

I do like the G12 H’s a little better due to the mid-range coming through a bit better. As usual, Dave is right.

@charlesbranch4120 4 года назад

Probably why Rick and Rhett call on Dave so often... We know who has the "mad skills"... but no youtube channel.

@davidjonorato3554 4 года назад

Hahahahaha Thanks!!!

@briandwyer7339 4 года назад

Good to see all you guys together again! Really enjoy the content, expertise, and seeing the love of music you guys share. Keep up the great work!

@AdamGotheridge 3 года назад

The vintage g12h speakers really have that same vibe as the current g12h speakers to my ears.

@gerryjamesedwards1227 4 года назад

The black-backs do sound better to my ears. The sound is more cohesive without the scoop.

@ThrowinRowan 4 года назад

They probably shouldn’t have used orange since they’re one of the only amp companies that just keeps getting better

@JonNewquist 4 года назад

Especially with Rick's chords.

@void4256 4 года назад

Warmer with more depth on the vintage sound it stills rules.

@fredfirth3834 4 года назад

I definitely agree. The new speakers had a little too much high end for me.

@Dimythios 4 года назад

I agree.

@gmf2112 4 года назад

I'm a classic rocker, so for me the old speakers sounded tighter, and a little clearer than the new. Thanks for the video guys...it was cool to hear those speakers back to back like that.

@jud62 4 года назад

The vintage speakers sound surprisingly warmer to me. Amazing!

@jonathanblackwell42 4 года назад

To make the experiment apples-to-apples, record into a looper so you always get the exact same input.

@gangofgreenhorns2672 4 года назад

I was wondering why they didn't pump the same audio through both.

@abrackas1 4 года назад

Add try vintage vs new of the same speaker kind. V30s vs GB or whatever, of course there will be a difference.

@hairychris444 4 года назад

@@abrackas1 Yeah, my thoughts. These speakers are voiced differently anyway...

@leiferickson3183 4 года назад

Yeah, G12H Heritage instead of a vintage 30 which is a modern speaker that is not a copy of any older speaker. But really I think they were going for comparing what Orange had back in the day vs what they have now.

@jscan 3 года назад

Indeed, that would have been the real test, along with perhaps some non-saturated licks/chords?

@RisikoAO 4 года назад

Vintage 30's are more clear and have more definition, G12h more punch but also muddier. I really prefer V30s.

@j.cameronbrett2660 4 года назад

Only honest opinion on here

@zackhagains3739 4 года назад

I completely agree. I preferred the V30s as well.

@richclips 4 года назад

I also preferred the V30s overall, especially for Ricks part, they are much cleaner and I didn't feel that the originals offered more mid, they simply don't seem to have the benefit of the cleaner more detailed V30s

@EphemeralTao 4 года назад

Got that same impression, the G12H were muddier in the mids and highs; they'd be better as bass speakers, while I'd prefer the V30s for lead instruments

@Ron4885 4 года назад

@@zackhagains3739 Me too. The G12h sound like they're a recently constructed ruin. The V30s like finding a real dinosaur fossil. I know that's a weird analogy but hey.... :) I'll go with the *real* bones.

@seattlesauce 4 года назад

Rather evident (and impressive) the thought that went into designing these speakers to meet the needs of each time. To me anyway the vintage 30's sound like they were designed when guitar was the star of the show. Current speakers sound like designed to take a more supportive role and to fill those frequencies (narrower range overall when including the low end) and would sit better in the mix accordingly.

@GoldenGateNum9 2 года назад

Yeah just what I was thinking, makes a lot of sense as I was wondering why they sounded so different.

@thedondeluxe6941 4 года назад

That Les Paul DeLuxe sound freakin' GLORIOUS.

@buzzbabyjesus 4 года назад

I have a 76 Deluxe, all original, and it's the best rhythm guitar in the world. I use a Standard for leads.

@droobie_ 4 года назад

I’m convinced Dave is just Rhett from the future

@davidjonorato3554 4 года назад

I could very well be...🤣

@l-wook 4 года назад

That’s pretty darn funny

@ErvinandMFantasyFootball 3 года назад

LMFAOOO

@Warbizzle 4 года назад

The vintage speakers have a much dirtier sound. I do like them more.

@suspicionofdeceit 4 года назад

w b They do,seem to have more break up.

@wraieghaeien 4 года назад

I was going to say, the modern speakers sounded cleaner to me. If that is good or bad, that's your bag.

@RogerThat902 4 года назад

Agreed, but that's why I personally like them less. :)

@amerixantrash3620 4 года назад

Totally agree. Would love to hear some Volbeat put through those!

@richardhighsmith 4 года назад

I liked the Vintage 30s because they weren’t breaking up as much in the higher frequencies.

@BadCat1990 4 года назад

It's weird to hear real amps, cabs and mics. It really does sound different than the digital stuff. I love it. Both of the speakers sound great to me.

@jambothruster 4 года назад

This is right up my alley! I’ve got a newer Orange cab with vintage 30’s, a 70’s Marshall 4x12 with Black Backs and for years my main amp was a mid 70s Orange Overdrive 120. Knowing first hand what these combinations sound like, I actually expected a LOT more of a difference in your recording! The difference is obvious, but I just expected more. My experience is that vintage 30s work great with modern amps, BUT when paired with a vintage (or even vintage type) amp... nothing beats the black backs.

@andyracksthecams 4 года назад

It'll never work. You've let the vintage air out.

@swampdog1592 4 года назад

😂😅😆

@jaybefaulky4902 4 года назад

yes new electrons and different air..no chance

@plym1969 4 года назад

Not enough cigarette smoke, marajauna smoke, joss sticks you mean?

@andyracksthecams 4 года назад

@@jsullivan2112 Silly me.

@jasonmullinder 4 года назад

even a smoke filled room wont help, weed is different these days, acid gives different buzz... we don't have the tools to recreate the classics

@ThrowinRowan 4 года назад

7:55 thus might be my new favourite sound clip.

@jasongress8764 4 года назад

The vintage speakers were definitely "warmer". The difference, to my ear, is like the difference between an MP3 and vinyl. The MP3 is louder, less dynamic range and thin. Vinyl is warm, more range but the upper frequencies aren't so overbearing.

@vanessafletcher6710 3 года назад

yes

@willstan2670 4 года назад

First, thanks for all of your efforts in putting this test together. I really enjoyed participating in this exercise. Second, my personal preference is for the G20 vs the Vintage 30s. The reason for my preference is that I am the same age you are Rick and the G20s is the sound that remember growing up with in in the 70s. I thought they both sounded good and was skeptical that I would be able to tell a difference, but was surprised that my preference was consistent across all of the listening tests. Thanks again for putting this test together. I enjoyed being a part of this test.

@jamesreniche9692 4 года назад

Did this really answer the question "Are Vintage speakers really better?". It certainly demonstrates that different types of speakers effect tone (was that really in question?), but to answer the original question shouldn't the vintage G12H have been compared to a new G12H?

@robgraham5016 4 года назад

That's a good point.

@EverHappyDude 4 года назад

This.

@abrackas1 4 года назад

Exactly what I was saying with my comments

@TheChadPad 4 года назад

It did. The answer is, they can be. Also, that question is really hard to answer, because rarely are speakers made the same way they used to be

@soundboy57 4 года назад

Indeed...

@jaycon8662 4 года назад

Surprisingly I prefer the vintage speakers. They had more of that thick Jimmy Page-y tone to them, which I think makes the sound a lot more cohesive.

@billklement2492 4 года назад

Rick, Great video! It'a amazing how much different the speakers are! It's not subtle. I'm listening on PC speakers (admittedly very good ones). It really shows why you need several cabinets. I'd love to see more of these comparisons. I'm rebuilding an 80s fender amp and figuring out what speakers to buy is challenging! I design and build HiFi speakers for a hobby when I can get to my woodworking tools and the expectation is the amp does not color the sound, but the speaker absolutely does. But with Guitar, the combination of amp and speaker make such a difference! Thanks for the great videos!!

@jghillstudio1857 4 года назад

Great insight and fun to watch you guys carry on...

@soejrd24978 4 года назад

That was a fun podcast you did with Christopher Ryan

@lordvermintide4441 4 года назад

Should have recorded your parts into a looper pedal, so we know the only difference is truly the speaker, and not your playing dynamics.

@Guitarisforgrins 4 года назад

I mean, it's a pretty substantial difference that simply can't be playing dynamics.

@ryans9029 4 года назад

@@Guitarisforgrins just takes any potential playing differences and dynamic differences out of the equation. I agree. Reamping through the different cabs would be the better way to go. But it's obvious enough

@Guitarisforgrins 4 года назад

@@mikeanaro Jesus dude... settle down. At least Rick would unlikely call someone a "huge idiot" because they did something differently than he expected.

@jonpowell4157 4 года назад

Also they could've recorded the DI signal and then re-amp the recorded DI signal into the testing takes.

@gr500music6 4 года назад

Agree. Playing is a very sophisticated, brain-modulated, feedback loop and everyone adjusts their playing to the sound coming back to their ears. Can't be helped.

@Stratguy10NZ 4 года назад

New subscriber - totally love the whole vibe around this. Great guys and awesome fun (really looking forward to Rhett's live shows). Its exactly the kind of conundrum I've debated my entire playing career - For the record I felt the G12H's had that mid range omph that I love.

@PhilAlbinus 4 года назад

Dave really needs a youtube channel for his killer riffing.

@repeatatron1 3 года назад

He get's service at the guitar store faster than Wayne

@dewdew34 4 года назад

Vintage sounded warmer to me and the new sound a bit "tinny" to me ? jm ear....

@manfredmarth5825 4 года назад

i wouldn't have called it tinny, nice term so, i call them more transparent :))) but tinny does the job

@thobina465 4 года назад

I agree.

@robgraham5016 4 года назад

Agreed - I said "richer" but warmer is also what I meant.

@BustedJunkStudio 4 года назад

The new speakers sound tighter than the old ones just as one would expect, time takes it's toll on paper. Nothing profound about that.

@annunacky4463 4 года назад

Busted Junk Studio I was an engineer on tissue paper machines for two decades. Our large rolls of paper went into storage sometimes vs going straight to the equipment that cut it and rolled it into the small toilet rolls. The operators constantly told us the stored paper degraded over time and under tension. We tested the stuff and they were right. It loses elasticity, strength etc... So this makes scientific sense to me.

@grilledspaghetti 4 года назад

Well obviously you record on busted junk anyways.

@TheChzoronzon 4 года назад

Tighter???!!! Are we listening to the same recording?

@thetoddkeith 4 года назад

THE OLDER SPEAKERS SOUND LIKE THE 70’S THE NEWER ONES SOUND LIKE A TYPICAL GUITAR CENTER ON ANY GIVEN DAY.

@visionlandmusic 4 года назад

Good to see the guys back together again!

@RC32Smiths01 4 года назад

You guys always make these sound the best and high quality equally! Also very pleasant to see the 3 Amigos make a comeback!

@travisfigg8337 4 года назад

I feel like this is a matter of context. Different sounds for different songs.

@adamlewis5765 4 года назад

This is the correct answer.

@8MinuteAxe 4 года назад

I really enjoyed this guys. I like the chord voicings you used to really work the full range of the speakers. It's good to see Dave back in action. I had a brief moment of panic. At first I thought that Rhett had an ascot around his neck. Lol. Thankfully, it's just his mask. Not everything from Scooby Doo is cool. I was also thinking that having Rhett and Dave opening the cabinet only to find a couple of wise guys in there would have been a priceless moment. Seriously, another well done video.

@rossturpen495 4 года назад

Would love to see this type of video on the impact of the effects loop on overall tone!

@kensteckelberg7013 4 года назад

It’s like a mic shootout. Hard to say which one is “better”. I can hear both comparisons useable depending on application. Plus, isn’t “better” really a subjective analysis? It depends on what your ears like. I think both sets had great sound. I can hear that scooped sound on the newer speakers but it sounded good still. You all play well too so that helps. With Ricks lines, I too think the newer set sounded a little more pleasing to the ears. Great comparison. It sounded to me like someone flipped a “presence” switch to on with the older Celestion’s. Cool vid. 🤘😎

@ThePmfan 4 года назад

I think it's "which do you like better". I like the old ones. Obviously both are perfectly fine pro level speakers.

@thomastucker5686 4 года назад

I can't completely agree with your thought about depending on what your ears like because if you haven't heard or more importantly, experienced both sounds or even many different sounds, you might not even know or understand there is a difference. When I plug into my A rig it's golden, but if I heard it next to one of Rick's A rigs, or Rhett's, I might think I have trash for tone. I'm just sharing the first thing that came to mind while reading your thoughts. My ears don't even know what to like with certainty. I'm starting to realize, I like the wide variation of possibilities, but until youtube, I wouldn't have known as in my example. I have only owned maybe 8 guitar amps in my whole life including some really basic stuff, yet I always made music with them, while wishing for the killer guitar tone. Now I realize, there was some serious value in even the lower quality stuff I wish I had back, oh and the guitars I wish I could have back, nother topic.

@emo65170. 4 года назад

The objective question would be "Can you tell a difference between them", and apparently there is a noticeable difference. I like the old ones, personally.

@kensteckelberg7013 4 года назад

Thomas, good points. I think what I was trying to say is “better” is such a hard thing to differentiate. It is always fascinating to hear the differences between these speakers and it’s amazing how much difference magnets, paper, and coils can make. But when you’re recording or playing, you get used to a sound that is pleasing or acceptable to your ears. That becomes your sound per se, so to play through a different cab or speaker and change your tone with a more expensive speaker for example, may not be as pleasing to what you’re used to. So i think taste would be more important than better. I think Ricks comparisons were really fascinating and what a great thing for them to take the time to do. I can’t even tell you how much of my gear I wish I still had. Especially some of my earlier basses. There’s something to be said for history, quality, and the way things were made back in the 70’s and 80’s versus now. I can’t even think about some of it as it makes me deeply sad. The real beauty is that we have so many choices these days. So achieving our “best” in sound and gear is something that shouldn’t be too hard to do. And with videos like this one, it really helps us to make informed decisions. 👍

@thomastucker5686 4 года назад

@@kensteckelberg7013 I love these guys taking the time to make these videos. They even go scientific with tape. I always use tape, just but without the science part.

@Infinighost 3 года назад

My takeaway from this is that Orange makes the best amps ever. Wow, beautiful sounds.

@Skoora Месяц назад

Too bad they don’t make an amp that sounds like that now. 70’s Orange vs. Modern Orange might as well be two different brands.

@ER-yq1lc 4 года назад

Dave Rocks! Love that riff around the 10 min mark.

@PLively 4 года назад

Love that riff at about 8 minutes that you play, Rick! I might nick it!

@TheGuitologist 4 года назад

The V30s sound lifeless by comparison. The 70s speakers have much better midrange response. Less choked off. Less "refined" but with more life. Nice video, dudes!

@heathdaemon2763 4 года назад

ok boomer ;)

@You2ubeTool 4 года назад

u are correct sir.

@mikedenkinger9570 3 года назад

Agree.

@user-rc4re5fo2f 3 года назад

I think other way around...the 70s ones are duller and more mid scooped ie lifeless and less/worse midrange response, you may be listening thru laptop spks if you cant hear that. Better yet I have in person, I have these exact 70s blackbacks that came stock in a 70s orange 4x12. Didnt like em, knew they were weird in the mids. Dont like the V30 either tho...too sharp and crunchy hot in the upper mid spike. Greenbacks too dull. Ended up w/ a WGS veteran 30 for now that seem to be a nice balance of all the above, tho still looking at others

@MikeBaars83 4 года назад

Going al Johan Segeborn here.

@edwardmonsariste4050 4 года назад

Yeah! Johan shows up with some 80 grit sandpaper and Rhett gets a woody. Tone.

@kbkman7742 4 года назад

Brb getting sandpaper

@RodrigoOrellano 4 года назад

Love this channel. Both sound amazing, I headbang like you 😆

@thomastucker5686 4 года назад

Rick, that was a great experiment. As I explained to someone else, if I had the new cabinet and had never known about the other speaker possibility, I would live my life thinking this is how this cabinet is supposed to sound. What would also be interesting is to see if EQ could make both so similar as to not notice unless it was pointed out?

@HofTheStage 4 года назад

Vintage 30's sound better to me, less muddy, I feel that just like this, without additional processing, they would sit in most mixes better

@kylec2761 4 года назад

The whole point is the mix. I don’t see much point in comparing them solo. A lot of tones that sound good in a mix sound weird when isolated.

@HofTheStage 4 года назад

@@kylec2761 true

@scottaumann 4 года назад

I wonder if the new Vintage 30s we’re properly broken in before the test. That might make some difference. Otherwise, I prefer the older speakers for the styles being played here. I also thought Rick’s stuff sounded pretty good on the new speakers. Great test!

@VirtualWoodshed 2 года назад

I had the same thought. Un-broken in V30s are terribly harsh and that’s what my ears heard here. Not sure this was really a fair fight.

@nellayema2455 4 года назад

I want that '72 Deluxe! I had a '60 something Wilshire 12-string with mini-hums. I loved the sound of those pickups.

@BigJohnnyMoe 4 года назад

I'm kind of drooling at the sound of that v30 to hear in a full band mix, double tracked and slightly panned. That said , I would use them both, the G12H's for detailed passages and solos. Thanks for doing this Rick. A pleasure to hear these.

@michaelianchampion7968 4 года назад

G12H for me, Vintage 30’s have a spongy feel that I’m not keen on.

@TheChadPad 4 года назад

Spongy is a good word for it. Spongy and slightly...hollow?

@jimimac1340 4 года назад

The new speakers sound washed out compared to the bite of the vintage ones.

@trippgoldsberry2694 4 года назад

Well, there you go. I thought the Vintage 30s had more bite than the G12Hs. Another example of how it's pointless to try to declare one sound "better" than another.

@marions.120 4 года назад

I use a early 90’s Marshall 4x12 with vintage 30’s powered by an Orange AD30HTC. With a Plimsoul pedal, everyone seems to love it! (Including me!) Everything from a clean tight sound to an incredible classic crunch. Oh yeah, my original Marshall 30th Anniversary head, well it was stolen. Great stuff guys!✌️🤪🎸🎵🎶🎵🎶🎵🎶

@spywithme 3 года назад

The focus on the mini humbuckers is interesting, I love it.

@tomasagustinveravicentin7789 4 года назад

I prefer the blackbacks, it has that old school rock tone for sure

@mudwiser1391 4 года назад

I'm geeky enough to love this.

@derekmc9580 4 года назад

I like the older ones for sure. More grind and definition in the mids. Really cool video guys.

@peterswing8263 4 года назад

Love the added punch with the speakers changed out

@aaronklein1490 4 года назад

I feel like the older speakers honestly sounded a lot more bold then the vintage 30s did. I feel like even metal players would appreciate that strong mid-range.

@dkhemmen 4 года назад

Never mind the speakers, that red Les Paul sounds absolutely phenomenal!

@dkhemmen 4 года назад

@@wingracer1614 Well, we can be blasphemous together then.

@fylbennett944 4 года назад

Thanks for doing this stuff for us. Please continue the great work. Quick question were the new speakers broken in or was the cabinet "straight out of the box". I've heard, and it does make sense to me, that new speakers are mechanically a little tight when they are brand new (much like a motor or new jeans lol). Unfortunately I have not had the financial ability nor the work environment to allow me first hand experience with this. So I ask you guys, "Is this really a thing and do you think it may have skewed the results?" Maybe, if they were new & you believe breaking in speakers to be a thing, you could add a third reference to your recordings with the new speakers "broken in". Anyway thanks for doing these A/B comparisons. Please keep adding them to your content.

@randalb7930 4 года назад

First I saw some ear training from your kids, then I saw some recording vids at a friend’s house, then I found your RU-vid page and subscribed, then followed on Instagram, and I still didn’t feel like buying your book. But then when I watched “I helped the fall of rock music” I thought harder. And now this. I thought surely no way, they’ll mess up the study, or won’t be noticeable... but damn! The vintage was so much clearer hearing your major 6/9 chords, which get hard to pick out when overdrive is used. The new ones were much muddier. So, in other words, thanks. Just bought your 4.0 book. See if the book will help find the holes in my voice leading skills.

@rogersonger4454 4 года назад

I am always disappointed when comparisons like this are done without comparing the cleans.

@KevyNova 4 года назад

Yes! It’s pointless to do comparisons without playing clean.

@louderthangod 4 года назад

This is a non-master volume amp. It's not like you can just switch to the "clean channel", you'd have to radically change all of the settings on the amp and then hope you get them back. It would have been more of a nuisance than a help in this case.

@eightfootmanchild 4 года назад

You can answer every "Are/Is vintage X better?" the same way: No.

@adamgillespie3393 4 года назад

Lol, yeah. It's pretty simple. Maybe modern lower end stuff aren't great but any solid piece of modern tech is miles better than vintage stuff

@davidyates8880 4 года назад

@@adamgillespie3393 how do you define better?

@EverHappyDude 4 года назад

Absolutely true.

@eightfootmanchild 4 года назад

David Yates Since there is no such thing as an “objective” tonal advantage to anything vintage, I would say it comes down to material things like price, design, availability of components, and ease of maintenance and repair. Modern is better than vintage for all of those. But value is subjective, of course. If you really want to shell out 75 grand for that particular 50s strat because you saw your favorite player had one on a record cover when you were thirteen, knock yourself out. Just don’t try and tell me it sounds or plays “better” than a $600 mexi made yesterday.

@davidyates8880 4 года назад

@@eightfootmanchild I thought this video was about speakers, not collectible guitars. Now to these ears, those vintage speakers sound better than the modern ones. Not dissimilar to my experience of owning vintage Marshall 4x12 cabs from the early 70s, as opposed to ones I bought new in the 1990s. So, in that respect, vintage can sound better than current. And if modern is so good, why do all these manufacturers try as hard as they can to recreate the technology and sound of the past? Why is the plexi circuit so revered? Why do so many boutique amplifier brands make amps based on that circuit? Why are the vast majority of guitars based on designs from the 1950s? If modern tech is so good, why do they struggle, like modern rock music does, to come up with something different and groundbreaking?

@MarkPritchardGuitar 4 года назад

Hey guys good to see you three making another video, i love your scientific experiments, i did prefer the vintage speakers apart from Ricks parts i actually prefered the new G12 H speakers. But lets be honest they all sounded fantastic. Great video Rick. Will we see a video on your Mrshall Plexi you recently purchased?

@VCustomShop 3 года назад

Outstanding video! I actually loved both sounds, each for it's own attributes. The vintage set had that killer warmth and texture that most of us only hope to get out of a guitar rig, while the V30 allowed all of the harmonic texture and subtle overtones to come out. With that being said, the V30's would definitely need so EQ sculpting to get the "quack" out of them on all but Rick's part..... and quite honestly, if Rick had not played those cool interval chords that made the v30's come alive (12:08-12:23), I would have said vintage takes the prize hands down.

@BenjaminHSmith 4 года назад

I actually think they both sound great though the vintage ones have a bit more heft. It would be interesting to do this test and not tell people which speaker is which and see their reactions. Honestly, the think I was most struck by was how much better than Les Paul Deluxe sounded than the other two guitars. Mini-humbuckers, who knew?

@cdamiano100 4 года назад

Vintage 30’s all day. Such a more rounded sound.

@vspa 4 года назад

i did the same test at home and when you play your own gear the differences are much more evident !

@rars0n 4 года назад

I had a Peavey Classic 50 combo, I replaced both the preamp tubes with tubes from my parents' jukebox (both the amp and the jukebox sounded better due to the swap) and the speakers themselves with Weber speakers. I rarely played it full volume, but that thing sounded sick every single time before I sold it, which was a huge mistake.

@RobBaartwijk 4 года назад

I like the G12 H’s a little better, the mid-range is more pronounced.

@weixianng 4 года назад

The last time I was this early I was being super jealous at a kid's perfect pitch

@evileep 4 года назад

When I was growing up a lot of musicians had JBL 120 speakers, especially in their Fender amps but I don't see that too much today. I wonder why because they sound great.

@nonebiz2132 4 года назад

I think JBLs sounded much better than all the Celestions I ever heard, at almost any volume level... I know lots of people still playing them, but they're getting expensive.

@steveisolis 4 года назад

Great topic!!

@libertyresearch-iu4fy 4 года назад

You could start a series called Music Mythbusters.

@edwardmonsariste4050 4 года назад

Johan does that in many videos

@PJ1R 4 года назад

I prefer the modern speakers as they have a much cleaner / brighter sound, you can always dirty a clean sound if you want but you cant clean up a dirty sound (if that makes sense)

@BradPham 4 года назад

Makes sense to me. But can you add mids to a scooped sound?

@kevinennis1631 3 года назад

Phil Rogers is this Helicopter Phil?

@qua7771 3 года назад

@@BradPham somewhat, but it's not the same. The V30's are only scooped in the lower mids. There's an upper mid nasal sound to them. I mixed 2 G12H-75's with 2 V-30's and thought is was amazing for any music and easier to EQ. The V-30's seem to have an upper mid spike that is nice when you need it but hard to EQ out when you want less of it. The mix of speakers tamed the V-30's while retaining what I liked about them. Of course this is an opinion but one many others share.

@BradPham 3 года назад

@@qua7771 I hope to try a G12H-75 at some point. I do recognise the honk of the V30 cab. Presently I'm mixing V30 with G12T-75 which is nice to my ears but perhaps not for everything.

@qua7771 3 года назад

@@BradPham I never tried a G12T-75. I have 4 Eminence clone AX-75 that people say sounds similar. They were in a 4x12 particle board Marshall cab that arrived, destroyed by shipping, over a decade ago. I ended up getting it for free and stripped the speakers and hardware. The G12T-75 V-30 combo sounds like it would be an exclent combination for high gain and metal. I think it would lack some warmth in the mids for southern and classic rock. The T-75's have about 3 db less sensitivity than V-30's so the V-30's will over power them (not necessarily a bad thing). H-75's and V30's are the same 100 db/ watt @ 1 meter so they have the same volume. The tone that I get from the H-75 and V-30 is sort of granola with bass, plenty of creamy mids with a little fizz on top. Articulate. The combo still has some of the honk from the V-30's. It works with my amp (Bad Cat Cougar with Raython 12ax7's and les Paul). I can scoop the mids with EQ for metal but I usually leave it alone. It's a matter of subjectivity, but I hopes this helps.

@brianingram2068 4 года назад

@Rick Beato, I can tell you going from having modern Celestion Alnico Blue speakers to hearing the original T530's (and the mid-60s silver T1088s) was just-about a life-changing experience. I immediately sold the modern Blues (and some modern clones), and picked up 3 more pairs of silver Celestions as fast as I could find them.

@flyingp830 4 года назад

"Good thing it's not heavy" - made my day :D As for my assessment, I'm not sure what I like better. For me, when comparing one against the other, regardless which way you look at it, there is something missing from the other. The new drivers are missing mid-range and highs, the old ones are missing low-end. One example of the latter is in Rhett's sample, the new speakers have a definite rumbling low E in the in-between spaces that is missing on the older ones. I think, barring electronics issues (matching impedance et. al.), in a live setting, you might be best with 2 and 2. Mic'ed up in the studio might be different though.

@anthonynelson6029 4 года назад

To my ears, the vintage 30s had a thinner, crisper sound. The G12s had a fuller, muddier sound. Admittedly, the sound was out of my phone. I prefer the sound of the 30s, but they both sounded great.

@messy113 4 года назад

vintage speakers. all the way! more nuance, musicality and more even timbre.

@yocraigst 4 года назад

Hats off to Dave and all the knowledge he has in that brain...damn!

@martindeleonardis4616 4 года назад

Put a rag between the terminals and cone when soldering. Great video, as always, guys.

@ziccuj 4 года назад

Pardon my nitpicking, but actually the G12H's on this video are from the late 70's, not early as Dave said. Amongst guitar speaker aficionados they are called "blackback" speakers because of their black magnet cover. The date code on the speaker frame (appears to be "MK22") reveals that they were made on December 22, 1977. Those are some great speakers though, but just to point it out. Early 70's - as well as late 60's - Celestion speakers used to have either green ("greenback" anyone?), cream or grey magnet covers. The most important difference sound-wise though is the cone: Celestion speakers up until around year 1974 used Pulsonic cones. Unfortunately the factory burned down and the original cone formula was lost. Celestions with Pulsonic cones are very sought after nowadays: they do exist, but are scarce, so prepare to pay top dollar for ones in good condition.

@mediumtalented9250 4 года назад

Not hearing what everybody is talking about. The G12H speakers sound like crap, like a blanket of fuzz over the top of it, so much added distortion. The newer Celestions sound high definition and clear, and less added distortion. I feel like im hearing the amp more and less of the speakers.

@danielj_music 4 года назад

The different speakers call for different gain and EQ settings in my opinion.

@TheChadPad 4 года назад

It's a different eq curve. There is all the same treble to my ears, but there's some BALLS to the sound now, ya know?

@davischip 4 года назад

There is more clarity in the new speakers but I love the way the Vintage 30's seem to break up a little more. Could be the difference in speaker power rating. I do agree what Rick was playing sounded better with the new speakers. Different styles led to a different sound. Thanks guys! Great video!!

@birdybutch 3 года назад

best trio on RU-vid! Rigby Atto, Rat Shelf and Dave Avocado!

@pawnhearts8785 4 года назад

What makes this song great? The King is Half Undressed by Jellyfish

@johndcoffee632 4 года назад

*Music equipment exists* Rick: Dave? What is this?

@Andersabjorn1 4 года назад

Hahaha 😊

@jonwillis6464 4 года назад

I prefer the 30watt BlackBack. Also glad to hear Dave get some more camera time. He’s an incredible guitarist. Smokin ‘

@patthomas9547 4 года назад

I think they both sound fantastic but I’ll go with the V 30s because of the slightly darker, fuller sound with awesome crunch. Also great playing guys and I love that cord progression Rick did!

@fandlpetroleum 4 года назад

The confirmation bias is strong in this comments section.

@jamescpotter 4 года назад

30's because they have more definition and clarity.

@Vince_Tasciotti 4 года назад

Agreed, my thoughts exactly.

@2010georgian1 4 года назад

There is a thing called EQ... and its on your amp...

@jimfranke2856 4 года назад

What a great experiment.. thanks for doing this. Personally, I like the G12's. While it does depend on the tune, I really feel that they could cut through the mix with more clarity (probably the mid boost I'm hearing). They also seemed louder, but that could be the tonal shape creating the sensation of loudness. Thanks again!