Douglas Murray Goes Full Fash Speaking To Dave Rubin 

Stephen Fry once quoted Bertrand Russell: The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people are so full of doubts.

A bonus fact for anyone interested in history as opposed to reactionary fictional rubbish - The only reason we have such good preserved works of the Ancient Greeks are because of the great translation and preservation efforts of the early Islamic World (~700-800AD)

Oh that's the Racist guy, unfortunately he gets about making people around the world dislike the English too :(

Stating that western cultures "took interest" in others misses the point of that interest: mainly exploitation.

Typical Spectator, full of nonsense puffed up with long words.

Murray is talking about last 30-40 years, especially the last 20 (not how we were in previous centuries) when he says we have been polite and its not doing us any good.

Very revealing when he said he'd no longer pretend to respect other cultures

God, people who go to Eton really are taught to open their mouth and let whatever half-formed ideas are in there just pour out, aren't they? Not only is this hateful bullshit, it's incoherent.

His grift is easier in the US, when he came back from his last US visit he was telling everyone that the election was rigged until his fellow Brits started laughing and caused him to back pedal lol There's a certain type of American that thinks a posh British accent means you're smart, it couldn't be further from the truth.

I love how right wingers claim they're "done being nice" as if they've ever been owt other than violent and abusive

Algebra was discovered in Iraq, which if I’m not mistaken is somewhere east of the UK 🤔.

While the west was languishing in the 'Dark Ages' after the fall of the Roman empire the middle East was positively thriving during the Islamic Golden Age. Scholars preserved and translated ancient Greek and Latin into their languages without their cultural interest and preservation of ancient 'western culture' and science we would have never got the Renaissance or the Enlightenment those historical events were contingent upon cultures beyond the west having enough interest and respect of foreign knowledge to choose to preserve it for future generations.

I find his pretentiousness really annoying, I just can't stand listening to his BS, he really imparts zero knowledge just biased opinions.

Some cultures were far too polite when western interests turned up and began constructing their empires.

When did the British empire respect anyones ancestors Douglas?

Thanks

Their 40 year economic experiment has come to an end and this is all they’ve got. It simultaneously great and terrifying to see

Feels like a fan fiction Bond villain

Murray has always been the polite face of the far right

If it wasn't for his crisp public school accent, Murray would've been dismissed as just another yob long ago. I've read enough of him to know he's a pseud, and a dangerous one at that.

He speaks of tolerance with no knowledge of Popper's theory of intolerance. I'm intolerant of his intolerance. Against the wall.

He's saying the bit out loud you're supposed to keep quiet if you're a fascist. This is the mentality that built an Empire, as it slaughtered its way across the planet.

Beginning to sound like Rees mogg sister in law.

Absolutely hate Murray’s performative face pulling in this clip.

In fact we do go to 'aboriginals' for all sorts of things - there are chemicals derived from plants in the Amazon jungle that we are exploring for their medical efficacy that have been used by indiginous tribes for centuries.

We've taken much from other cultures, as Aaron points out. In addition, medicines taken from native peoples. And I use the word 'taken' deliberately. Ghastly man.

"We don't go to them to learn their languages", and "It is time to be discourteous" What language is he going to speak to them in when he tells them he is going to be discourteous?

Looks like cherry picking, what is the context of this?

So, when I see bullying and intimidation and implicit threats outside cinemas, when I see a mother with 14 year old autistic boy who scuffed a Qu'ran responding to death threats in fear and the local police capitulate, tell me Novara, which do you think I should do 1. Pretend to be respectful ? 2. Actually be respectful ? As usual Novara: no bigotry or bias here on your part ( ppppphhhhhhtttttt!)!! Oh, the Japanese are an unusually courteous culture but then Japan has no record of international cultural diversity.

The boot won't always be on someone else's neck. Something to keep in mind especially if you've gone from "World's Greatest Naval Power" to "aircraft carrier with no aircraft".

Poor attempt to rubbish the perfectly sensible things Douglas Murray said. As usual, the presenters come across like superannuated student political activists.

Why does the Western Nations culturally appropriate from all of the countries that they have colonise and never credit them for the advancement

He use that word 'tolerate' like he's some kind of 'god' or some superior being ,when he really is a psychopath.

He went to Eton - that almost always tells you everything you need to know about someone.

What an absolute ringpiece.

Doulas Murray why should I respect other peoples ancestors, history, cultures, people. Nevermind colonialism showing that the west has not been respectful to other cultures. Whats he's saying that we need to be more racist?

The method of immunizing her children used by Lady Montagu came from India.

Far right? Until yesterday he was a traditional liberal

Our numbers are actually Indian. The Arabs got them from India and we got them from the Arabs.

Whenever I hear some right-winger say that non-Western cultures have contributed nothing of worth to us, I can't help but think of the following: corn/maize, tomatoes, potatoes, chocolate, vanilla, manioc/cassava/yuca, chile peppers, Phaseolus beans (which are most of the beans we eat), peanuts, rice, bananas, chickens, turkeys, rubber, on and on. And if you look into just the domestication of corn and vanilla, those are some of the most complex domestications in the history of humanity. We still don't know how it was originally figured out, but we do know that not a single white person was involved.

I have very little sympathy with Douglas Murray. As part of a jet-setting international liberal intellectual elite he can afford to be as disrespectful and ignorant of others' cultures as he likes with little consequence. The rest of us, living in multi cultural communities, understand how destructive chauvanistic that kind of cultural imperialism can be. His insufferable sense of superiority shines through whatever waffle he is spouting.

True accurate views. Douglas Murray sees Britain being taken a ride by racists.

When has he ever been “polite”?

Have a discussion with him then.

Douglas is purely making the point for mutual respect, you just hurl insults and of course he's a "fash" because he doesn't subscribe to your world view....perhaps you're the "fash"?

Scientists believe that early mathematical functions, like addition and division, can be traced back to the Chinese, Indus, Mesopotamian, and Egyptian civilizations. The oldest clay tablets of mathematics are at least 4,000 years ancient, starting in Mesopotamia, and the oldest written findings on mathematics were Egyptian papyruses.

What he is not thinking about .we can take the same attitude with the rich

I Agree With The Man Speaking On Respect.

"Respect my history and I'll "pretend" to respect yours..." That would be classed as a Freudian Slip with any other person. Full fash as the description accurately states. Lmfao

I think it's fine to disagree with his point of view, but not to misrepresent it. He is expressing that it's not ok to be racist against white people (although you wouldn't have known it from this clip) I don't think it's OK to be racist against anyone. Racism in all forms is reprehensible and should be opposed by all non-racists - that is the opposite of Fascism in my view. For example, when Michael Eric Dyson labelled Jordan Peterson a mean angry white man and stereotyped him/presumed he knew nothing of First Nations due to his "appearance" (JP is an honourary member of a FN tribe), Dyson was objectively being racist. Normally I trust the content from this channel highly. Please don't go down this path. It will undermine your credibility and your message. Represent his argument truthfully and challenge it honestly.

As a boy I spoke with my grandfather, at great lengths, regarding how we allowed the Painter to do his deeds and why the people didn't stop it. He said (paraphrasing) Fascistic behaviours mean it happens with out you even seeing it. You know it feels wrong, but you are told everything is fine... You do not believe your own eyes and ears. Then one day you see a small child shout an awful slur to another human with different beliefs and skin. Then you realise it is already too late. ☮️💚🙏

when were "the West" courteous? As an hobby historian of African and Native American history, I haven't seen much courtesy from "The West"

He is going to be shocked when he is told what an algorithm is.

It would look like colonialism where Britain went around the world destroying everything they touched.

Pity all those polymaths such as Averroes, Al-Farabi, Avicenna, Ibn Al-Haytham, Ibn Tufail, Avempace, (just to name a tiny few) wasted all that time preserving the likes of Aristotle's works in their writings. Of course, Mr. Murray is a far wiser and more open-minded man than any of those scholars. Perhaps someone should write a book about how ignorant he is of other cultures (as well as their influence on the west) but alas; that would take too many volumes. The pompous twit is in love with his own voice - but what can you do - his un-skeptical audience will lap it up and believe everything they hear from this pretentious toff.

The way he presents himself as some kind of intellectual while talking absolute bull is disgusting. Americans probably lap this right up

Courteous when uprooting people from their homes and torturing them? As for mathematics, where does he think the word algebra came from?!

What is it with these people? Did the fall of the British empire do it?: they missed out on their manifest destiny?

The problem with the "What about Japan" argument is these people would very much consider Japan *as part* of "the West", as they're inoffensive to them culturally and admirable to them capitalistically. Same goes for any non-muslim successful capitalist country. The West is not a geographic place. It's a list of countries with "acceptable cultures".

We are tolerant of people like him. If he wants intolerance, he'll suffer more than most.

Thanks!

We were very courteous as we stole they lands, subjugated them, committed genocides, and sold them off as slaves. Why are you complaining? We are being polite, you savage! Did not no who Murray was, and now I wish it had stayed that way.

The man seems to say a lot without actually saying anything.

The scientific method itself was pioneered by a Muslim, Ibn al-Haytham! 🙂

What exactly is he saying? Does he want to go back to the crusades? Someone needs to tell him the world has moved on. If he’s not happy he should get off the world merry go round.

Aaron left out Africa's seminal role in the development of mathematics. Some of the oldest - if not oldest- measuring instruments were found south of the Sahara, as well as prototype geometrical systems etc

He's clearly an expert in the field of Dunning Kruger.

Arguing for intolerance .Well we all know where that leads.

Interesting that he should mention vaccines. Actually the West were very late to the party when it come to the principles that underpin inoculation. It is believed that the techniques were first developed in China, India and West Africa possibly in some instances as early as early as the 10th century.

“A thick Englishman with a posh accent” expertly sums up Murray!

"If you don't respect my history" means that he demands respect for his load of bollocks which is, at best, pertial and often outright lies spiced with bigotry and racism. No, I don't respect that. It's not history, it's class propaganda. The scientific method? Who first adumbrated and rigorously practised that? Ibn al-Haytham, as both Francis Bacon and Johannes Kepler acknowledged. One or both of them are sometimes wrongly cited as the instigators of the scientific method, yet they both had the "courtesy" to point to the person who was, long before them. Much of his 7-volume Kitab al-Manazir (Book of Optics) contradicted current ideas in the early 11th century, mostly derived from Greece, but he established his ideas by repeated experiment and a great deal of it stands uncontested to this day. Mikolaj Kopernik (whose name gets mangled into "Copernicus") published a list of the Muslim astronomers and mathematicians to whose work and observational tables he was indebted for being able to show the solar system is heliocentric, not geocentric. . As for being widely travelled and deeply interested in other peoples and cultures, Murray should really study the life of Al-Biruni. He not only learned the languages of Northern India (i.e. including what is now Pakistan and Bangladesh) but Sanskrit, too, so that he could read the ancient texts of India. Apart from measuring the radius of the earth more accurately than Eratosthenes had been able to, using a huge astrolabe, he also discovered America. I don't mean he went there (which Leif Erikson had done about 12 years earlier, though neither knew of each other's existence) but that he calculated its existence, location and approximate size, again in the 11th century. He had invented the concept of specific gravity and was trying to calculate the earth's specific gravity. In doing so, he realised there was much more land than had previously been realised, there was a "missing" continent, and only one place it could be. Unlike Leif Erikson, he knew roughly how big it was. He hated the courts of the Khalifs and was no ivory tower academic. He would have been welcome in the House of Wisdom in Baghdad or the Libraries of Cordoba, but he was a traveller, a practical geographer and respectful student of other cultures, and must have been a very physically tough man, too. How does Douglas Murray reckon science and mathematics began to be studied in Europe? From reading people like Al-Haytham and many others in Latin translation, that how. Apart from science and mathematics, does he deny the strong influence on Thomas Aquinas and his ideas, as well as the wider Scholastic Movement, including John Duns, the oft-quoted William of Ockham and others of the work of Al-Ghazali in Latin translation? If so, can he cite any credible scholarship to that effect? Murray is not only pompous, entitled, arrogant and racist, he's IGNORANT, too!

Murray is gay … wasn’t it a tolerance society which which changed in order for him to live his life the way he wants to?

Bush fire prevention management in Australia was influenced by practices of Aboriginals. We get bad fires here but they’d be much worse and more frequent if not for us doing seasonal burn-offs.

Lmao we don't go to other cultures for mathematics? Has he heard of algebra or الجبر‎ as it's written in the original Arabic?

The clip of Douglas Murray made me so incredibly angry. Michael and Aaron did such a fantastic job of taking apart every single thing he said.

I don’t think Douglas Murray and Dave Rubin are fash, sorry. He’s a conservative exploring the paradox of tolerance.

"IF we stopped being tolerant" Who is we?

Douglas will say anything he wants to say to anyone who will listen. Rubin always makes time for Dougie and Peterson.

"If you don't show any respect for my history, I don't see why I should *pretend* to respect yours." Telling.

"Other ways of doing maths"? Excuse me, what? Does he know that there's only one way of "doing maths", and that cultures all around the world have contributed to it, or is he just an idiot? "Anti-racist science"? You mean science? What specifically does he mean? Does he want to bring back phrenology and skull shape measurements? And I don't know if he's choosing to ignore centuries of colonialism and genocide against indigenous people across the world or if he for some reason doesn't think it has had an impact on their technological and cultural output. It's telling that he mythologizes "the West" as tolerant, scientific and rational compared to (presumably) the savage non-Western (read, non-white) cultures. Completely ahistorical nonsense, ignoring the very reason the great divergence in the wealth of nations occurred in the first place. Truly a great example of how far your accent and manner of speaking can get you, rather than the content of what you're saying

Douglas Murray is repeating the Steve Bannon / Breitbart / Cambridge Analytica playbook which is manipulative and disgusting.

I had a friend who read the Spectator. His views shifted dramatically since he stopped.

I'm just a mechanic, and a graduate of the NYC public school system but isn't it because of the "First peoples, First nations, Aboriginal peoples, Native peoples, Indigenous natives, or Autochthonous peoples" early European colonies survived their 1st winters and learned to harvest the local crops like corn beans and squash and the reason we celibate Thanksgiving? The Mayan and Aztec cultures built mighty cities in the Americas. it seems too easy for Mr. Murray to discount their contributions.

It really doesn't matter which culture wins or loses in which imaginary stakes, surely. The point is that humans are supposed to behave the best they can because such behaviour IS the best they can manage within their appreciation of reality, not because it racks up points in some interracial game. If you cease to be "courteous" for whatever reason, it means you are going down in your own terms, your values have been proved unserviceable and illusory. Surely Mr. Murray understands what "noblesse oblige" means?

Upper Class again. It's sad but obvious to see now who proliferated the worst of the British Empire back in the day......sigh, to be honest i really hoped these attitudes and views were largely done with and that we could move past them....but it seems now that is not the case. There's only one good thing to come out of the past few years in Britain and that is that it has allowed us to see just how hateful the vast majority of the Upper Classes still are. Not just that, but that their hatred isn't just reserved for minorities but also ANYONE who is not of their own overrated class. They call themselves the ruling class, and it's now plain to see that many of them actually believe this to be the case. Well.....we shall see.

Well done, Aaron!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He's the living embodiment that if you sound posh, people automatically give weight to what you say, despite talking bollox. Americans, especially right wing ones, love these types.

Ways if doing mathematics we dont yet comprehend. Will it come from the middle east or africa? Will islam discover it? What exactly is the contribution made by the aborigines?. We use arab numerals - not arab mathematics. Please give facts not facile name calling

Dave Rubin will be lapping it up.

Well said!

You guys wouldn't last 2 minutes actually debating Murray. And here you take a clip out of context and then straw man his argument. You are both a joke.

Disrespect as a matter of foreign policy for 1,000 years, but God Forbid your stiff upper lip be put to the test. British Museum inspected for looted goods? The score is not even just because you say so, Douggy

It's amazing and frightening that when someone speaks so eloquently and calmly that people will absorb and believe their incoherent garbage. Please explain how a culture built upon centuries of genocide and colonialism can be considered to be courteous and polite.

Courtesy is often shielding the brutality underneath. This dude's just an old-school Imperialist/Colonialist living in the wrong century.

What a horrible individual. Grotesque.

He wouldn't have a voice if we weren't highly tolerant society, we tolerate his views but we do not agree with them, I find it really hard to listen to these people, as soon as the plum falls out of their mouth you know they have no concept of reality

The only thing that told me is he's starting to get worried, good.

Imagine Tolerance & Courtesy ohh perish the thought what what

Sounds like TRUE FAIRNESS to me. I like the idea of ppl just being brutally honest. Saves time.

I will say this: Japanese cultures and the others you mentioned are certainly courteous, however they are by no means “tolerant.” Far from it. If you don’t conform to their cultural and social standards you are absolutely an outcast and not tolerated. As a foreigner you are never fully accepted in their society. They hold their people to a standard.