Dr. Craig's Response to Andrew Loke on The Origin of Humanity and Evolution | EPS/ETS 2023 

The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.” (Proverbs 18:17). See my examination of Craig’s response in the full panel discussion (the video recording is available at the link posted in the description of this video, my reply to Craig starts from 48:10 onwards), where I pointed out Craig's misrepresentations and false assumptions, and notice that Craig did not have a response to my arguments during the discussion time with Swamidass and Averback.

didn't you notice that Craig committed a question begging fallacy? At about the 4:30 min mark, he appealed to Genesis 1:26-27, Genesis 5:1-3 and Genesis 9:6 - none of which actually define 'human' or 'Man' as Homo sapiens. He claimed that none of those passages differentiate between 'anatomical humans' and 'image bearing humans'. But it's not the position of the Bible that there is any such thing as an anatomical human who isn't an image bearer - so why would it differentiate between the two? The verses he quoted don't mention any characteristic of humanity - whether that be anatomical, cognitive or image bearing. He is literally stating his conclusion in his premise by assuming that when the Bible speaks of 'Man' it means 'all members of the genus Homo' - and as Craig himself places arbitrary limits on what he considers a human to be (because in fact he definitely doesn't include all members of the genus Homo in his definition of 'human') - this seems doubly egregious. Why do you folk admire Craig so much? He might be a charismatic speaker - but it's like you don't actually listen to a word he says.

​@@bengreen171 Bible says that mans duty is only to do Gods comends here on earth.

@@jesuscaresaboutyou100 leviticus 25: 44-46. Sorry, but I'm not obeying that command.

@@bengreen171 , Bwahahahahaha Interesting that can you can actually convince yourself that such a learned and experienced published philosopher such as WLC would make such a sophomoric error. Please site your published articles or your published rebuttal to Craig. Thanks for playing convinced thinking for yourself actually works for you.

he also made a more detailed response to Craig in a discussion on the channel 'Thought decoder with Sean Mixon'. In it he did nothing more than reveal his own failure to apprehend the entailments of common ancestry, the scientific perspective on the concept of 'humanity' and a tendency to make logical errors.

Good luck

I mean the Bible says nothing died until Adam sinned. Seems to me many animals existed and died long before humans ever did...

@@travissimpson7829 where in the Bible does it say that? I don’t think it does

@@hollon1697 Have you even read the first chapter? The Bible says man and all the animal "kinds" were created in 6 days. Death is the wages of sin...All the evidence points to animals existing millions of years before humans Romans 5:12-14 New International Version Death Through Adam 12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned- 13 To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law. 14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

@@travissimpson7829 As your own quote from Romans 5 shows, death came to "all _people"_ as a result of Adam. It says nothing at all about animal death. You will look in vain for anywhere in the Bible that says animals didn't die before Adam sinned. To nit-pick just a bit (since you asked "have you even read the first chapter?"), Gen. 1 does not say all animal kinds were created in 6 days, but rather in just 2 days (the 5th and 6th). Given the video we are responding to, you should be aware that there are multiple hermeneutical approaches to Gen. 1 (and to Gen. 1-11, more broadly) which would not see this as literally referring to all the creation happening in a short span of time. If any such approach is even possibly right, it follows that the Bible-believing Christian is not committed to Young Earth ideas, but rather is free to follow science where it leads.

Is there a full video of this someplace? It looks like the current video was trimmed.

claims of healings and signs are not actual evidence of healings and signs.

Cool, but the flood never happened.

that's unfair. I would trust my plumber to put in a new heart valve way more than I would trust Craig to educate anyone about evolution.

are you trolling? Evolution is a fact. The theory of evolution is the best supported scientific theory we have. While there are aspects of the theory we don't yet understand fully - there are no gaps that are in any way problematic for the theory, and certainly none that could contain anything that disproves evolution - which, as I said, is a fact.

@@bengreen171 It is not a fact. No intermediate fossils. No evolution happening today. No evidence of DNA coming out of nature. No evidence that a dinosaur could have new DNA for a new lung system, feathers, new eyes, new bone density, being grafted in or changed inside - out. No confirmation as to the earth's age with the erroneous rock-aging methods that not only contradict one another, they make their predictions based of biased assumptions of initial conditions of the forming of the rock, as well as the state of the rock during it's entire forming process. i.e. nothing ever messed with it. DNA needs enzymes. Enzymes fix errors. But, the DNA needs coded into it, the idea, the concept of protective enzymes. Nature isn't a mind, DNA isn't alive, yet it spawned, perfectly capable of fixing itself?

@@ethanrichard4950 _the bullet hole filled bucket of evolution_ Evolution, like gravity, are scientific theories. You don’t get to be a theory of you are a “bullet hole filled bucket” _No Intermediate fossils. No evolution happening today_ Have you told the museums? Have you told the scientists and doctors that evolution isn’t happening?

​@ben green Adaptation is a fact. Evolution is assuming history that you can't prove, from assumptions that are unsupported. Like assuming everything is progressing in nature as opposed to digressing.Which the laws of thermodynamics completely disagrees with, this universe had a beginning and will have an end which even the most secular scientists believe, explain to me what's beyond that? What was before the universe and what comes after it? The universe is made up of matter energy and in space and time. So whatever it originated from has to be immaterial, outside of time itself, extremely powerful, and intelligent.

@@ethanrayment8157 I know that's what your favourite apologists like to tell you - but let's actually think about this. Do you know how adaptation occurs? I mean - can you tell me the biological mechanism that causes an organism to adapt?

Agree on the simultaneous population. Sketchy on the first Christ part. The Bible notes that Christ was the second Adam, not that Adam was the first Christ. Christ was about redemption, Adam had no such role.

@@SpaceCadet4Jesus I wrote that about to be purposefully provocative. Jesus was the second Adam, so I inverted it. (I did not intend to suggest Adam was divine or part of Trinity.) If there were already humans, then the question is, "What was the purpose of Adam and the garden." While in the Hebrew Bible, there is no specific reference to Adam being considered a high priest. However, in some Jewish and Christian traditions, Adam is sometimes associated with the role of the first priest or the first mediator between God and humanity. One example of this can be found in the Book of Jubilees, an ancient Jewish text which reflects Jewish thought during Second Temple period, which Jesus was born into. In Jubilees 3:27-29, it is stated that God appointed Adam to be a high priest in the Garden of Eden and to offer sacrifices on behalf of himself and his descendants. This idea is also mentioned in some rabbinic texts and in the writings of some Church Fathers. So Adam was created by God to reach the world and be the priest to the world in the Garden of Eden, the precursor to Israel and the temple. Once he failed, Jesus had to come to be the perfect Lamb and Adam.

@@obcane3072 The Bible clearly speaks of sacrifices connected with death, and death with the fall. This idea that God wanted and demanded sacrifices while everything was still perfect, is simply overcomplicating the scriptures, which so elegantly state Adam as being man, just a man. The first ever mention of man is in connection with Adam, and yet he's not the first? There's no clear teaching against the view that the Bible says what it says, Adam and Eve were normal humans, who fell and took the whole world with it. I.e. thorns and gambles becoming a part of creation. They had children who could marry each other without defects and they all lived a long, long time.

@@ethanrichard4950 Thats a good point. Jubilees does state that he offered sacrifices while in Genesis there is no mention of it. There is mention of Cain and Abel offering sacrifices in obedience. Jubilee mentions sacrifices as a form of obedience and as a form of worship as a natural part of human existence even in the absence of sin. By offering sacrifices Adam recognizes God's authority and his desire to love in harmony with God's will. By appointing Adam as high priest, Jubilees emphasizes the importance of religious worship. By appointing Qdam as first high priest, God established a system of religious leadership and oversight that was intended to guide and support human beings in their relationship with God. This isn't to say that I agree with Jubilees view, but that there was an idea of Adam being a high priest in the context of other humans on the planet. The idea of a pre-Adam civilization is Biblical and part of Jewish thought and it goes to why God created Adam if there are other humans already in existence.

@@obcane3072 You didn't, you brought up tradition, which should be cross-referenced with the Bible. There is no priesthood constructed or taught before Exodus, I think it is.