The automatic Focus ST has really long gear ratios compared to the manual, I think the manual is something like 2 seconds faster to 200 km/h despite being slower to 100.
The automatic slushbox kills the Focus ST's performance. The manual version sprints from 100 to 200 km/h in around 14 seconds whereas the auto does it in around 18 seconds. Above 200 km/h the manual will keep piling on the numbers whereas the auto makes an otherwise excellent car feel gutless. It's a shame Ford didn't bother to develop a proper DCT for the Focus ST, especially one that works unlike the PowerShifts of old...
@@mikerelvas - that is not the issue, the actual gear ratios/final drive ratio are since the final drive is fixed at the transaxle whereas the i30 with its automated manual the final drive shaft can be either tall or short which has massive benefits once speed has gone beyond 80km/h all the way to around 165km/h. Ford does have a DCT that it could use which is "wet clutch" design however Ford made it very clear that torque converter was the only option here for the Focus ST and its the same transmission beefed up top handle more torque (can easily handle 600Nm) so there is lost of room for improvement especially at more higher revs, Ford have clearly tuned the engine for launch and top end while mid range suffers.
Lovely video, chaps. May I request if 80-120km/h, 100-200km/h times could kindly be posted (if recorded) as these would give a better idea of the real world accelerative performance of this trendy pair?
I for 1 wud never say that the i30N is a better car. I felt the DCT is stupid in i30N. Its fast when U go in straight line and the engine has more top end power than the Fords.. But the STs TC auto felt far more like an honest and regular predictable AT than i30Ns. It also felt like it handled long and mid sweepers better than i30N, i30N felt superior at short twists though. Also the manual ST I drove felt like it was going at least a sec faster than i30N Performance despite having less hardware to do so. It also felt like more mature handler than i30N/Performance
@@1989rs500 agree to disagree. Extensively tested both cars and the Focus ST didn’t hold much of a candle to the i30N. Even just the Custom N mode makes a world of difference compared to the Ford. The Automatic in the Focus is also terribly geared, the ratios mean the manual ends up being much quicker past 100kph, and 5th gear is practically two gears in one. Should also mention that the DCT is incredibly intuitive, being able to automatically recognise whether you’re putting around town or driving around on a track, it will change the way it behaves. i30N does practically everything better in my books: • Drivability • Sound • Looks • Acceleration • Comfort • Handling
@@cooper9777 In ur book ok.. But not n my books.. I ve been a hot hatch owner for past 13 years.. gTi and Fiesta St owned. So for me the Ford s more dynamic and more capable car. I do agree the AT Ford is sluggish.. But the manual is ever so slightly better than Hyundai
The i30N is a very impressive car... especially this DCT version... really good gearing. When I drove both Focus ST auto and Manual, the auto did seem quite sluggish... The Focus ST does need the M330 Mountune upgrade... hopefully Ford will release a Mountune based ST Focus version soon. At the end of the day, I have to have a manual, so while the DCT is what makes the difference on the strip, the ST Focus with the manual is the better car... as is the i30N with the manual batter than the DCT version.
Haven't come across this vid or your comment before. Yes indeed the ST does need the M330 why I installed it on my orange fury ST 2020 I bought from new the map later after a fwe miles on the clock. At that time Ford thought they were still going to market the RS so purposefully detuned the potential of the ST. With hindsight a terrible mistake and now effectively you can't buy a new Focus ST edition perhaps 4.5 defo so.
That I30N is faster and quicker than a majority of the older domestic V8 and turbo 6’s from circa 2000-2015 from stock. Sure there were a couple that were quicker and there were some infamous unicorn timings that owners couldn’t replicate. Launch control, DCT and excellent torque spread makes a big difference.
@@351tgv - I think you’ll find a large number of XR6 and even the FPV will struggle to get in the low 5’s. A lot of them have shit tyres, worn bushes and transmissions that have past their optimal working efficiency. 6 secs is the average. - to the disappointment of their owners. This is the fundamental basis why the domestic owners have not embraced dragys or Vbox’s - and relied on dynos as a KPI
Can probably mod the ST easier if that’s your thing. I loved how angry the i30 felt in a test drive but hated the interior compared to the ford. Felt cheap …
I was tossing up between both these cars and opted for the i30N in the end. Apparently has better resale value. Thanks guys, I feel validated after watching this!
sure on the track but in day to day real life situations? Good luck with the maintenance repairs, someone said close to $8,800 due to clutch pack shitting its pants. But yeah don't let that stop you.
@@351tgv The dual-clutch system is a robust, smooth and efficient transmission. If used properly, it should last 10 years without a problem, even with hard driving I have i30 turbo diesl dct,already 225k and not single problem
@@BlueSky-sz9pz - Yeah and if you don't change the fluid and clutch sensor? Big difference with a DCT that is designed for turbo diesel over a performance turbo petrol. DCT are junk regardless if wet or dry, they fail and when they di they are expensive to repair, FACT.
I'm not too familiar with the auto, but the manual ST also pops when in sport- or trackmode. You probably did the sound check in normal mode. The i30N is just an absolute beast with that transmission, shame the interior is quite a bit behind the rest of the competition.
@@niklaschmid Yeah I figured. Honestly I think it's a bit cheesy anyways. At least the manual st isn't as over the top obnoxious as the i30n. That thing pops like 6 times even at 3000 rpm.
@@cy9nvs A friend drives the ST, myself the i30N. I think both are really good, but I don't like the sound generated by the speakers in the interior of the ST at all. The manual I30N doesn't pop as often as the DCT and if it gets annoying you turn it off in the settings. The interior of the ST looks better, but unfortunately the typical Ford quality...
@@niklaschmid I deactivated the sound symposer with an OBD II Adapter. Personally I liked the interior quality of the ST more. I test drove both but went for the Ford mostly because of the interior. At the end of the day neither is great though.
@@cy9nvs That's an improvement for sure, the real sound is good enough. Unfortunately, I'm not satisfied with Ford, at work we have a few normal Focus station wagons, sometimes with just a few Thousands of kilometers and the coatings on the interior door handles come off, the panels vibrate and the air conditioning often causes problems. But I like both cars by their performance, I don't really care about the interior. Ultimately, I liked the i30 Fastback N better because of the exterior design and a more "raw" feeling. I wanted some fun before it's just bland electric cars.
Gear ratios and final drive are the keys here. Remember Ford have removed 2nd gear (it's there but not active) so launch will be good but the shift to 3rd hurts it. Dual clutch are quick but they are prone to damage faster Would still take the Focus ST as it's a proven vehicle.
to further add to the gear ratio and final theory here are the gear ratios and final drive for the i30 N 1st: 3.714 - Final Drive: 3.800 2nd: 2.261 - Final Drive: 3.800 3rd: 2.174 - Final Drive: 2.714 4th: 1.621 - Final Drive: 2.714 5th: 0.927 - Final Drive: 3.800 6th: 0.767 - Final Drive: 3.800 7th: 0.878 - Final Drive: 2.714 8th: 0.698 - Final Drive: 2.714 Info provided by the i30 N specifications PDF Which explains a few things 1: launch appears to be torque limited in 1st and 2nd gear which explains why the Focus with the conventional torque converter gets a better launch, by 3rd through4th gear (so 2 gears) the i30 N has a taller final drive which probably allows full torque (and thus BOOST) which explains why it's catching the Focus down the 400m run and then 5th and 6th it has shorter final drive which allows it to stay in redline even though the gears are over-drive. I can't find the Focus ST gear ratio and final drive ratio but to me this explains why the i30 N has a somewhat sluggish launch but catches the Focus ST with more speed. But of course Motor and Wheels are not what they used to be and this level of fact finding is lacking, insgtead we get "oh look at what I am doing" instead of providing info which backs up what we are seeing.
There wasn’t a noticeable difference in the 0-100 times Reuben. Track surface and getting the perfect amount of wheel slip play a greater role. We wanted to test NGS in the roll race but sadly the tyre went flat before we got a chance.
The ST is a more old-school driving style because you need to drive the car within the power band in order to deliver the power, however, the i30 auto is a new style easier to drive it delivers the power in a low power band. Albert Biermann the former BMW M engineer jump to Hyundai N. The i30N is a very good price for a hot hatch i30N is the iconic car for Hyundai. The DCT someone says is a wet clutch that is very smooth very quick for this price and is very value for money. i30n is a European car made in South Korean for the cost of South Korean price.
Get manual ST- results totally different. Also the specs are not the same, since, ST engine comes from old RS engine that can develop 350hp; they limited it to 280 but still has the highest torque- its still a 2.3 engine.... The engine its quite good, only the automatic gearbox is not adapted and manual is better adapted. With some extra money you can get factory soft upgrade to 330 HP and around 520-530 NM ( predator soft) just like mine. It can go beyond 270km/h easily, and i think it can reach 290 in some instances.... Generally speaking, ive seen a lot of youtube videos where ST was not driven to its full potential...
That’s a very big (and I’d have to assume fairly biased) statement, “in every way”. It’s certainly geared to be faster off the line in most scenarios than Focus ST with these upgrades, but in other ways the international motoring press praise the superiority of the Focus. Hyundai have worked hard with (German) engineers to upgrade what is a fairly basic architecture under the i30 for the N, whereas the C2 platform under the Focus is widely considered to be the best (and one of the most expensive) mainstream C-segment platform available, so it’s base dynamics are stronger. I don’t own either but have test driven both and I find the Focus to have a stronger feeling of “solidity” that only cars designed in Europe seem to have - the i30 feels tinnier - that’s purely subjective on my behalf and not “superior in every way” though…
If the i30 has less torque but makes the same power as the ST, then it must rev higher. That's probably the reason it was better at the top end when both cars were moving at speed.
Its more the way the torque bands are tuned the flat power in the i30N allows it to pull for longer and ealier too... the NGS is a secret weapon not sure if he used it though
@@xIcarus227 that's like saying the BMW beat the Benz cause he had more power... whose problem is that? Ford made a product which is not great... Hyundai are making leaps towards VW and Honda the two kings of the affordable warm to hot hatch market
I have a Toyota Crown Athlete 3.5 that has the same engine and transmission as the is350 and it smoke's those i30n easy as and pulls away easily they would be no match my old is350 did 4 seconds flat to 100 kmh videos on my channel
Hmm someone is lying about their power figures. No way the Hyundai should have pulled away with such ease given basically identical power and weights. Sure gearing is important, but either the i30N is more like 220+kW or the Ford is more like 180kW.
Looking at getting one of these 2 cars in the near future, wouldn't by an automatic hot hatch tho, does the manual i30n get the engine upgrade benefits of this facelift as well?
@@Madest_Max What? The P4S are the some best non semi-slicks you can get and they last for a VERY long time, compared to sth like Continental (20tkm vs 50tkm!).
@@xXYannuschXx Michelin tyres may last longer due to the way they were made (soft shell, hard filling). However they don't give you as much grip due to that. Continental tyres may not last as long, according to you, but are far more reasonably made. Same with Good Year tyres. Good Year's are bloody brilliant.
@@Madest_Max And yet they have the same lap times according to Tyre Reviews. Why should I buy a tire that destroys itself far quicker, without any performance benefit?
Verry simple i30n has 305 dyno as stock focus puts out275stock just as the golf 8r puts out 340+- focus is still superb on feeling driving overal grip moose test 83kph did it perfect golf 7.5 failed at 75
@@Madest_Max I’ve never driven the automatic version of either as auto hot hatches are pointless, manual vs manual the ST is better, the interior is nicer, the seats and infotainment system are crap in the Hyundai. The electronic diff in the ST is better and the ride is better, I’m pretty confident I’d be faster in the ST. Plus it’s got a lot more tuning potential. Mines just been rolling roaded at 334bhp with only a stage 1 map and an induction kit.Best of all it’s a lot cheaper on a PCP deal.
@@thatfocusguy well... I did watch another hot hatch test in which the i30N still had a DCT and the Focus ST a manual and the Focus still lost, as the i30N just has that little bit more punch to it.
ford, after escort cosworth .. all their newer "fast/hot".. awd/fwd small sporty cars, were WAY SLOWER than power/weight would say and SLOWER than ALL competition in own class.
Really stupid to compare the automatique ST which nobody wants to the i30. The automatique is slower and does not sound as good. Bad choices made guys.... fail
Prendi la Focus ST con cambio manuale. Cambia olio del cambio con Royal Purple Sinchromax. Metti MST PERFORMANCE induction KIT e Scorpion CAT BACK SYSTEM non resonated. Con pochi soldi hai una bomba da 300 cv che distrugge la I30N
@@fale892 yeah nar peanut educate urself before making blurting out embarrassing garbage. Do you want a few lessons in trolling to make urself relevant?