E85 vs Gas Performance Testing | Stage 2 Predator 212 Comparison 

I feel like you guys need a little dyno to test the actually WHP of your builds.

Topspeed is probably because 4mm bigger carb on e85. and look at the ignition plug at gasoline.. it is running to rich on gasoline meaning less power.

The 2% increase is due to the 26mm vs the 22mm carb more air and fuel equals more power. the e85 advantage is more timing and less chance of detonation. Also when the fuel atomizes it gets colder which helps drop intake air temps for a slight gain that way.

E85 has less energy than gasoline. This in practice means its essentially higher octane. When run through a flex fuel vehicle, this shows itself as less power and lower mpg. When used in an engine that has a proper tune however, it allows for high compression, higher boost and more power. That said, a car tuned for e85 shouldn't be using that same tune to run traditional pump gas.

It's been found out, crank case presure due to increased blow by (High RPM'S) & INCREASES in compression cause extra stress on side cover & bolts tend to loosen up ??? The stud kit & Billet side cover. Tends to cure the problem. Venting the case is extremely important. Large vent hose & catch can. Good show guys.

That 1mph extra is within margin of error for the GPS chip in side the phone. You would need to do multiple runs to truly see if there is a difference. You could also look at measuring the engine RPM to see if E85 has a slightly higher RPM as that would also give the extra 1mph.

Just a random thought... y’all need to buy your folks a few fainting goats to go with the chickens; it would be totally awesome to see them faint every time y’all run through the yard! 🤣 Congrats on the new C&CGP lap record!

Holy cow! That first pass John did on the pump gas was amazing! Drifted every corner perfectly without losing power, over steering, or under steering. Oh yeah, it'll be fine! Edit: the first comment I posted was before I saw the second run with the E85. That was an absolutely Stellar run as well! Great driving!

Some feedback for you guys the reason E85 makes more power is not because of the fuel it's because it lets you run more timing it doesn't detonate as early as gasoline

I was going to watch your video but I spent an hour at ridgewallet and another hour at Go power sports and my wife took my phone because she thought I was shopping again. I have a bad habit of buying merch from your sponsors. Wish Harley Would sponsor you. Bahahaha Bahahaha Got my phone back, I paid her shoe bill.

You guys should consider a transponder set up to get proper timing. Inconsistency in start/stop presses will give you 1/2 second variations easily. And then time flying lap times to eliminate time variations due to clutch bite, engine burble/bog.

On the record CCGP run, it was faster because your driving was that much smoother. Smooth equals speed. Watch your steering input when you play it back....it's darned near perfect. You basically willed it around the track. Ike was a bit slower because he slid around a little more. Still good driving on the part of the both of you. Well done.

Is no one going to mention "banana sauce"?😂

John:"Talk nerdy to me."

The first ride John did in the grand prix looked so fast i thought it was at least 25 seconds

You guys should get a hold of a mychron 4 or 5 timing system with the gps module. It will track speed, rpm, temps, lap times, and position on the track. The gps in the these things is accurate to 1 foot and as someone who has participated in national (wka, uspks, Route 66, Florida winter tour) racing series this data is crucial. Give aim a call and see if they will send you a setup. They are pricey but a good company and will get you up and running. Upvote so they will see this and we will get real data!! Thanks guys and great videos

The thing I don't like about most go-kart is that they don't have a multiple gear transmission and without one the engines potential power is very limited now I do know that shifter karts do exist but if you're going to put in the time and energy for a single geared engine whenever you can have an engine that could be half the size with multiple gears give off more power and speed it's just not worth it if you ask me I mean don't get me wrong it's still fun but multi gear transmissions were built for gasoline engines to optimize their very limited span of power within the RPMs

You didn't alter the timeing. And also a good excuse to skim that head . Should still be a fair test because your just setting it up properly for the new fuel.

You guys should run gas in the 26 mm. I bet itll run faster then the e85

WOW...You guys are RADICAL...!!!!...Love the Builds!!!

John, how would your parents feel about a nice wide concrete walking trail in the yard? You guys are going to hit one million subscribers this year, time for a real racetrack.

Just to let u guys know the e85 only allows for better tuning not speed

Hotfoot It'll be Fine is looking great, sounds great and is running like a bat out of hell. Ya all just be careful running that thing. I want to see more of your videos.

Nice driving!

Hell yeah that first run on gr. prix was stellar.

Where E85 really shines is with specific mods. If you increased the compression to the point where gasoline would pre detonate, and then ran E85, you would have better performance gains over 93 or 95 on whatever compression it can tolerate. It also reacts to boost very well.

E 85 is not designed for small engines but it works

I love when ads are actually in the video. RU-vid isn't getting any of the money AND I can just skip it.

I LOVE the mix in of the data you've collected. It's just enough to not bore me but gives me another way to compare and decipher the information.

Great job guys! Me and my son have seen every one of your episodes. You guys build on a budget like we do. Keep up the awsome work!

Gas carb not tuned correctly is the reason for the speed difference. With more intake vacuum you need to lean the carb out some. I’m really liking this series of videos great job guys. Would you be willing to do your pitbike motor to e85?

That was impressive and it sounds great. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

John: proof is in the pudding. Me:mmmm pudding.

just wanted to reflect a bit at how far you guys have come in only a couple of years. hell yeah guys keep at it!

In that first lap when John picked up the left front hitting the bush after crossing the driveway, my heart raced lol. you guys are cookin! Something that might help eke a little more out of that engine would be to vent the case with a catch can and if the timing hasn't been advanced already, bring a few more degrees of timing in. Also sounded like it was still breaking up during the top speed run. maybe add just a little bit more jet? Thanks for posting guys. Have fun, keep the rubber side down! Cheers!

After you do the 212 on e-85 you need to get a Stock 212 NO stage 2 mods Thank you for the Great channel. I’m 58 now, when I was 14 I had a 2.5 hp Briggs Supercharged using a MG midget air pump , Buick 231 V-6 pulleys on my mini bike... it was a Lot faster then a Honda cb 125 .. When it died it blowing oil out of spark plug hole .. oh the plug was Tight

Hello, Fun video. Fine presentation as always. Test results arguable. That's not a real test, only good entertainment. I admire the fact this team stays together for this long. Cheers from Belgium.

I have't made it to the end yet but I have to say, I love the American Express frame and the wheel/tire combo you guys have on it is like the cherry on the gasoline sunday. Someday I'd like to have a garage and the spare cash to get one myself.

One thing to note is that you launched the cart over the drive way. That to me at least is where chain stretched the bolt backed out a little. That little cart is a real performer.

Love all the vids

You guys are friggin great...just started watching a couple weeks ago. Picked up some used go-karts for my boys and I'm looking forward to working on them with my boys. 10 & 8. Keep it going 🤙

Love John he loves this stuff sometimes he cant talk right from the happiness of the drive of the kart

It sounds like you ran out of gear at 7:05. It's nice to know that you gained a 10th off of a carb and fuel change nothing else. Love the videos keep them up.

Why am i not getting notified

You two should do a go cart build off against each other

Wow! at about 4:47 in the video... I think that's the fastest I've seen you guys take that corner by the driveway... by a lot!

That was the fastest looking lap by far. Those trees were getting pretty close. Love the video , but be safe.

that thing is crazy fast love it

You said it in the last video, E-85 runs cooler, that always makes power.

Either way, looked like y'all were having too much fun on the Grand Prix. It was bookin' with both fuels though!

That intro was fire🔥🔥🔥🔥

Thats the fastest ive seen john go around that lap

Even withoit the e85 this thing seemed like a rocket

This is why i think you got the result you got. It all has to do with the size and nature of the ethanol molecule: First: Althought gasoline have a little less than dubble the energy density (gasoline: 47,3 MJ/l, Ethanol: 29,2 MJ/l) than E85, the etanol molecule is about 6 times smaller than the avarage gasoline molecule. This means that you can fit 6 times more etanol molecules than gasoline molecules in a cylinder. This is why etanol produces more power although it has a lower energy density. You can fit 6 times more power producing molecules with just a little bit less energy density per molecule. But the total power produced is increased compared to gasoline. This might explain the increased acceleration. Second: Diesel fuel is heavy, gasoline is a bit lighter and E85 is the lightest. The lighter the fuel is the faster it burns and the faster it burns the higher RPM can the engine produce. This is why diesel engines can’t turn at very high speed because the fuel burns so slow. So the probable cause of the top speed gain is probably that the E85 allowed the engine to turn at higher RPM because the E85 burns faster than gasoline. Also: This might not be relevant to you but it might be interesting to know. E85 also have a much higher octane rating than gasoline. This allows engines to have higher compression ratios and more turbo boost when running on E85. This increases the efficiency of the engine and, if the engines is tuned for power or efficiency, increases either power or fuel milage.

I love the videos guys, I hope to be building with y’all soon

Larger air flow and the 15% alcohol will act as a coolant resulting in a denser air charge going into the engine. During WWII Fighters used methanol injection for that exact reason.

I would be so happy just to ride one the master piece

I think it sounds way better with the e85 set up wish you could actually take em on a dedicated kart track and get them tires sticky and see what times they can do there

Race with the 200cc shifter!!

Wats up guys love all the vids watch every monday and wenesday keep it up and be safe

Man... That cart is gettin busy! I like to see it on a minibike. Ether way, I like it!

Everytime you guys bring out the American express 2.0 it makes me want to buy one from go power sports

its the 2 best friends that anybody could have

Good video y’all 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👊🏼🙏🏼

E85 or not, that kart is a beast!

Failing to put in an offset key to run e85? You would see more gains with more timing.

Wow, that 22mm carb was running rich!

Its sounds so good guys this is a great lil build

Isaac got that Dracula hair lol

You need to continue this build. Shave the head, deck the cylinder, weld up the combustion chamber for high compression, E85 despite being 96 octane can withstand higher compression than 96 gas because of the cooling effect and higher combustion efficiency (cleaner, less carbon build up means less hot spots). 14:1 or 16:1, if you can't, advance ignition timing. I know the EPA modified the engine of a car to run efficiently on E85 and got 22% better MPG despite the fact that E85 has around two thirds the energy of pure gasoline by gallon. A combination of better volumetric and thermal efficiency.

The different sound came across on cam, almost a hollow raspy cackle instead of a "popping" detonation sound.

So you asked why the top speed increased with E85 over gasoline. Most likely it was the carb set-up, but E85 can give you higher horsepower gains through overall tuning and setup. E85 can accept higher timing advancements than gasoline without pre-ignition due to a lower flashpoint, it can run cooler is some cases, but it does burn a lot longer than gasoline because of the flashpoint. This was proven through Unbox Therapy with one of his see through motors. E85 ran cooler, cleaner, and the burn is much longer. In many cases with E85 you can get afterburn out the tail pipe with the right setup. So at higher speeds, you are getting a good, long burn. Try adding a little more fuel if it's running lean by the looks of that plug. The engine will run cooler and better. E85 really could be a great option, but because of the viscosity and lower flashpoint, you need more to burn, so MPG's can be less. Now, in a car, in town you won't notice because you gain power making you use less, but highway you see a huge difference. And by using E85 in cars, now the cost of food is going up since the grain used for E85 is the same that feeds Cows and other animals, along with fertilizers. But Corn and corn oil is up in price because E85 is now being used in cars. Catch 22.

It’d b fun if you guys could find an old PTO dyno sitting around some old AG service shop. It’d be great for testing and tuning these engines

Sure would be cool to have John's Parent's Yard in a karting game.

Its sounds way different on e85. P.s. wheres the drag mini bike

First love your videos keep it up

Ike lookin like a proud dad 😂 😂

We need something like Cleetus done with leroy,only not as much power.300 hp big go kart would be awesome.

That thing is wild!

I've been following you guys for a while, keep it up. Love the video's

The only way you could have gotten more speed on the same sprocket set, is if you gained rpm on the e85. It sounded like it had a little more “scream” in the second speed run.

When you compare different fuels, you should use the exactly same setup for both. And yes, with E85 you need more fuel, but with bigger carb you´re also giving it more air, thus giving it more potential for power. You should redo test, E85 with the smaller carb and regular with the bigger carb, I bet the results will also flip.

Idk if y’all Peeped but ol boy was air born there for a second 🧐😂

Get a wideband with a clip on 02 sensor so you guys can properly tune your stuff. I'm sure plenty of power gains could be had if you were able to nail your afr's.

E85 allows higher compression before detonation. That increases cylinder pressure, and if ignition and cam are correct, you get more power.

The driveway is becoming a big jump now. That turn is scary!!!! Have either of you guys ever hit the satellite dish pole. That looks like game over

You guys should do a Volkswagen smog pump supercharger build!

I am pissed I just bought that wallet full price but I will be sure to use that code for my next purchase thank love the vids and bye

That first Grand Prix lap... that was some good driving... maybe you have the course down well, but from expierence racing karts, holding a slide like that in a kart isn’t easy.... and it wasn’t just controlled, it looked like the fastest line... I’d love to see you two wheeling some karts on a track one day...

Love you show. I’m in nc also. Did you see the giant fireball at 950. Fookin. Crazy. Was below the commercial airlines

I’ve decided I’m gonna build one and I’ve got the motor. You guys should do a video of where you got the parts and how much it all cost to build

You all should do a one wheel drive go kart with a stage 2 or 4

My theory on the higher top speed is that since ethanol allows a much wider and more lenient tuning window, that means your engine has a better chance of running better while on ethanol and more forgiving of not having the perfect air fuel ratio and timing set. Also since ethanol runs cooler than gas that means the whole engine is cooler which is good because that means the air and gas coming in is cooler and denser.

What I learned when I built my engine. Use the old-style single electrode plug. The multi-electrode doesn't work as well. I picked up 8 hp by changing them. Small block chevy Have you ever thought ethanal injection? Also e85 runs cooler.

The white plugs are an e85 thing, with e85 it makes it very hard to read plugs correctly

SICK drifting on the first one bro

Damm that cart looks fast

I'd love to see another test, the smaller carb, and E85, how about it ?

My moms Dodge Grand Caravan takes E85, but every time she uses it, 2 of her cylinders misfire and it has basically ruined the car. Whenever it’s in a lower idle it is really shaky. It is also quite shaky whenever we’re driving on the highway. I was wondering if Isaac can help determine what might be wrong with it. Also it used to be a rental car so I don’t know if that would affect anything.

Good stuff guys.