Elden Ring Lore ─ The Greattree, the Crucible, Destined Death, and the Golden Order 

Here it is! A month of anticipation. Grabbing a tea, thanks for this mate!

Very well written! I'm convinced. Burying Godwyn in the roots and him transforming and infecting the roots and the world through them seems like a very simple and concise way to tie all of this together.

Nice video! I think it's fair to treat "Erdtree" and "Greattree" as synonymous in the larger scheme of things. They are different, but the same, just like Marika and Radagon are. If you took a branch from a tree, then cut down the tree and grafted the branch back onto the stump, it would still be the same organism, but you could also see it as a "new tree" in a more abstract sort of sense. I think that's what's going on here. As far as the reason between the disconnect between different parts of the Erdtree, I always come back to the idea of it being the previous "end of an age" where the Erdtree was burned before (one cycle before the current one where the Shattering happens). The Frenzied Flame ending shows a remaining stump, there's a discolored "crack" (or rather shard) in the current Erdtree that's not gold like the rest of it, and the relief over the entrance shows a tree sprouting from another tree. This, to me, seems to point to a previous mending cycle. For some reason, the parts were not able to grow back together properly, maybe for the same reason the union of Radagon and Marika produced "cursed" offspring. Trying to go against the cycle of life and death and establishing a perfect and eternal state/being etc. goes against the fundamental laws of nature, so it's always bound to fail in some way.

Man came back and casually put the whole lore community to shame.

Long lore post ahead: It is my belief that the sealing away of the Rune of Death and the seperation of the Erdtree from its roots to create the Golden Order are one and the same action. That is because I consider the Roots of the Erdtree to be the physically, naturally embodied place where the Rune of Death held dominion, where it's function was executed. There is much concrete evidence to support this: the Erdtree roots are connected to the various catacombs throughout the lands between. It is in these places that the dead would be returned to the roots, returned to the Erdtree, in a cycle of life and death. We know that, as you say, at the removal of the Rune of Death this became impossible. We also know that if the roots of the Erdtree are no longer connected to it's trunk, that there is no longer any pathway for the souls to re-enter the Erdtree and emerge as Grace which ensouls new life. They are stuck in the roots, unable to enter the trunk, much less the branches. There is more evidence to back the theory of association between the Erdtree roots and Destined Death. This is because, when Ranni has a shard of the Rune of Death stolen to perpetrate the Night of the Black Knives, this shard is afterwards let loose. And where does it go, where is this incomplete shard of death manifested in the world? In the Erdtree roots, as the Deathroot, the same Deathroot that you feed to Gurraq in order to recover the lost Rune of Death. This brings me to my final point. When we defeat Malekith, we release the Rune of Death: it looks like a Rune alright, but it is jagged, black, but also strikingly red. It is, simply, a vertical line with an arc at the top, with the top arc angled downward instead of upward, like the various arcs on the Elden Ring. It is my belief that, when the Rune of Death was part of the Elden Ring, it occupied a space below the Lower Arc of the Elden Ring we have today. This is for two reasons: firstly, that in the Mending Rune of the Deathprince ending, the location that this mending rune occupies on the Elden Ring is intersecting with the Lower Arc of the Ring. Because this Mending Rune is explicit that it's introduction to the Elden Ring is a restoration of Death as a part of the world Order (albiet in a different form, with the affirmation of Undeath as part of the Order), I associate the position of the Mending Rune with the former position of the Rune of Death. However, there is a much, much more important reason: That important reason is that the Elden Ring actually depicts the Erdtree in symbolic form as a piece of it. Specifically, the Erdtree is Marika's Seal: the Upper Arc coupled with the Vertical Line. This symbol is evocative of the Erdtree with it's outstretched branches and vertical trunk, and is mimicked by Marika herself and the various crucifixes throughout the land. Because Marika is the recipient of Grace from the Greater Will, and is also the provider of Grace for the world, just as trees are the recipients of light from the sun and of fruits for animals to eat. There is plenty of tree/crucifix symbolism in Christianity that I am also drawing on to make this association. Anyways, because of the Seal of Marika depicting the Erdtree, I find it wholely appropriate that the Rune of Death should find it's place under/in intersection with the Lower Arc of the Elden Ring, extending below it, stabilizing the tree and drawing on the power of Death in much the same way as the Erdtree branches can be understood as drawing on the grace (light) of the Greater Will. This new, combined Elden Ring would fuse both the deep red of the Death Rune with the bright gold of the Golden Order, leading to a complete ring which would be the color of the Crucible knight armor: red mixed with gold. Am I then suggesting, that the shape of the primordial Erdtree, the Crucible itself, is yielded with the fusion of the current Elden Ring and the Rune of Death? Maybe. There's one wrinkle here: the proto-Elden Ring design in the Malikith boss room at Faram Azula. This seems to me to be the shape of the Crucible referenced in Siliura's Spear. It is a unified whole, unlike the relatively artificial and divided Elden Ring of the Golden Order. I'm not sure if it's the color of the Crucible knight armor? It's a matter I'd like to try to settle, really. I'm unsure. If you made it this far, thank you so much for reading! I'm enthusiastic about interpreting the Elden Ring as a symbol on a way that sheds light in the lore.

So happy you and Hawkshaw are getting your hands on lore now. Finally, time for the professionals to get to work on elden ring

I think the Greattree might simply be all other trees in the Lands Between. There are real world forests where all trees within are connected by their roots. The world’s largest living organism is technically an aspen forest in Utah

4:59 I'd say more than rudimentary, considering that Demi-Human Queen Maggie can cast Crystal Burst which is 18 INT. They are at least twice as smart as my 9 INT Confessor, lol

So glad your channel is still alive, came for the bloodborne lore stayed for the high quality content

Thank you for the great video! The Golden Order and the Shattering would make a hell of an HBO series…

One thing of note: the beastmen are actually an advanced and intelligent species, who as stated in the description of the beastman cleaver have technologies which are beyond the scope of mankind.

It's not just the fact that there's sometimes a space in between. It's the fact that it isn't always capitalised that threw me off i.e. it isn't always presented as a proper noun. So I just thought that they were merely describing the Erdtree as a great tree.

I hadn't thought that the Erdtree could be separated from its roots, but that does make sense. If Godwyn were to corrupt it at its roots, then it might threaten its power, so it was separated and isolated(Radagon's Thorns) at the same time, I'd suppose.

The genetics of regression toward the mean are pretty easy to understand- For example, there are a million minute changes in your development that can make you tall, but it's unlikely that your partner has the same mutations, so your kid will have a mish-mash of different mutations that probably don't synergize the same way.

Another incredible video. The man cannot miss.

i always interpreted in a different way: returning on the erdtree trough catacombs starts with Golden order, it's the essence of it, after banishing destined death. you're enable to die and become decrepit, but if you return to the erdtree you will born anew, so tecnhically there is no death. the problem starts with the disconnetting of the roots, and i think that started with the night of the dire plot and all the Godwyn thing. now there are people decrepit that can't return to the erdtree (es the soldier etc) and people Who live in Death after touching the Death Roots (suggested by the item description of death roots and skeletons summon)...at least this is my interpretation

The Erdtree-Crucible relation and what the crucible actually was is one of the things I've been wondering about the most in terms of lore, also here because SmoughTown's shoutout.

I love the way your videos are structured, the concepts you highlight, your narration, all perfect. One of the best lore channels ever right here

I believe Marika's goal (for whatever reason) is eternal war. All actions she made by herself either resulted in some war or sustained it. Godefrey at first was fighting Marika's war and then was exiled by her, but after that he was known as Hoarah Loux, warrior. I doubt you get such a nickname by promoting peace. We as players follow the Grace but Godfrey follows one too, and we see his Grace directed on us after fight the with Morgot (and because of that intersection of Graces directions and results, I believe that Graces are given and taken by Marika only. We also know Radagon and Enden Beast don't do that, as Melina in the intro says that the Tarnished are to seek the Elden Ring even if it is against the Golden Order, and Graces direct us towards the Elden Ring). On the other hand, Radagon was send to fight Rennala, but he did find a peacefull solution, marriage. Which is when Marika called him in and made him her consort, what again resulted in Carian war. She also shattered the Elden Ring and that resulted in a war even named after that event, the Shattering, a war of all demigods for shards of power. It's very consistent result that whenever Marika takes an action there is some conflict. Her being a warlord would also explain Gideon's betrayal and why she parted ways with Radagon. We know Gideon crossed you specificly because he saw what Marika wanted, and eternal war doesn't really sound as something desireable. And as said previously with Rennala, Radagon was open for peace. After the conquest and establishment of the Golden Order, it would be the time to stop fighting and start ruling, what would some kind of peace even on conquered land. Also a small thing, Radagon doesn't really want to fight you. He sealed himself and the Elden Ring away, you force yourself in by burning the Erdtree.

People have complained that deeproot depths is not aligned with the Erdtree on the map, which is obvious when flipping between the world map undergroung and aboveground levels. This revelation that the erdtree is disconnected to its roots and tilted shows that they are misaligned on purpose, as a consequence of the erdtree being tilted. This brings into question that the current door and palace of the erdtree is newer because the erdtree moved, but then when you flip between above and below ground maps you realize that the location of the trunk of the erdtree in deeprott depths corresponds to the Roundtable Hold in Leyndell. As in the Roundtable Hold was the original entrance to the erdtree before it fell sideways.

This has been the most insightful lore video I've seen. Very well done and thanks for bringing some clarity to those translations!

I thank you for this. Though I have to refute a single detail: t'is not the Principals of the Golden Order which keep Godwyn alive on the Night of Black Knives. Godwyn failed to die utterly because of Ranni's simultaneous destruction of her body when Godwyn's soul, his spirit was killed, and to fight off the encroachment of Destined Death, Ancient Dragon Fortissax gave up his existence to mire in an unending struggle against it within his fallen companion, becoming the Lichdragon Fortissax, and Godwyn, the Empyrean Prince of Death.

This helps make sense of so many of my questions! Now I just have more questions though!! But they are better questions, as we fall deeper into the rabbit hole of course

Wow man great incites about the hues of the crucible knights, death and it’s lack in golden order incantations.

This is my favorite channel for learning about the lore of these games. You do a great job

I'm no holding my breath, if we get DLC it will bring more questions than answers

I always thought Melina was just a fan of some emo rock band and the lead singer was named "Dustin Death", they usually play at the same gigs as that group of Perfumer's that started a "My Chemical Romance" cover band.

This is an exceptional video. Well done! Instant sub

Just found the channel and enjoyed it all. Also having looked at translating different things before. I find it surprising how a literal translation can vary greatly from what it's meaning translates into.

This was a fantastic video! Really great insight and thoughts. This game really has been the culmination of everything Fromsoftware has been creating for a decade now mixed with G. R. R. M.'s style as well. There's not just one thing or theme that ties ER into a sentence. There's layers, themes and depth to this game' s world and story that take a while to unpack. Which is something I've always loved about the Souls games; they've lead me to learn more about other philosophys and cultures, all while having a hellava good time.

Oh I like this. It brings context to the "old" Elden rune and how it differs from the new, smaller Elden rune

Does anybody else believe that the seal placed by Marika was in fact the rune arc? Death Root is the literal manifestation of death and the Elden ring of the golden order looks very much like a tree pulled up from its roots in comparison to the Elden Ring in Farum Azula. Especially with the Roots being such a major part of the ancient ring. And with these roots cut, the Erdtree is separated from the Crucible. With Godwyn placed at the roots once again, in a twisted sort of way, death has been physically returned to the Elden Ring.

I have a little hypothesis that since Marika/Radogan basically embody the Elden Ring that this could mean that shattering the ring could be interpreted as a suicide attempt brought on by the loss of Godwyn and that, perhaps, the Radogan aspect was not in favour of this and tried to prevent it.

Amazing content! It’s so frustrating how they’ve created such a fascinating world but outright refused to tell us anything about it. We have literally no way to make a consistent story out of the lore than to leave it to our imagination to fill the huge gaps between the few hints we are given. Many lore hunters conclude by saying we might learn more in another DLC but I’m not optimistic. We might not get a DCL, and even if we do we’ll likely get more subtle hints without enough information to form a cohesive story (I’ll still play the hell out of it though)

How does this dude not have a million subscribers by now? I gotta make a few more accounts.

Excellent content and presentation. I look forward to more from you. Liked and subscribed.

Dude this my first time watching one of your vids qnd im glad i did.

I love when you do these

Really like the video!

This video cleared a lot of misconception for me

Nice to see you discussing Elden Ring lore - you give a fresh and well researched perspective alternative to most mainstream lore discussions. You have interesting insights and also seem to understand the tone of the game much better than most people who see it as a black and white story about fighting authorithies. Although with all lore youtubers I try to take what they say with a grain of salt and have my own interpretations (unless I have no idea what to think about a subject, then I take someone's interpretation and then confront it with data in my later playthroughs). Anyways, there is a very important factor when discussing translating Elden Ring from japanese - that is GRRM's input. From what I've gathered it seems that his short story was the base for From Software but he mostly set up the large scale framework of the world which then FS gave more details. That means in some cases English would be the original language. We don't know what was the exact process and how much From Software altered from GRRM's draft and probably most of the stuff we encounter in games comes more from FS than GRRM but we need to account for that. Also Shattering is confusingly not the shattering of the Elden Ring, but the war that followed it (intro cinematic)

Thank you very much! Hoping you'll bless us with a stream one day!

So excite. Can’t wait. Thanks dearly, sweet Tarnished.

Great vid bro.😺

Damn this was so well done

Maybe by the time we 'see' the tree it's already dead. Maybe we're only seeing the spirit of what's left.

I only care about why snails are so powerful. That’s the real lore

So I agree with you for the most part, but I’m not sure I quite by the idea that everyone is unable to die during the Golden Order. Erdtree Burial still existed during the golden age before the Shattering, so most people were in fact dying during this era. What exactly is up with the Hollow-esque enemies and the references to “unending life” are an intriguing mystery, but I do not believe immortality is something conferred on everyone during the golden age of the Golden Order. Perhaps the Shattering messed things up in this regard? I am also not sure if Marika’s goal really is to kill the Elden Beast. It’s definitely a possibility, but we certainly do not accomplish that goal in the game since while we do slay it, we put the Ring back together immediately after defeating it in the Elden Lord endings. There is some good evidence for it though from both Hewg and Gideon Ofnir. I also think the reason she removed the Rune of Death was simply because of her obsession with eternity and refusal to give up her seat as the current god.

I have a question about Radagon studying magic in an effort to be complete. I have seen the interpretation many times that here the word complete means not so much "perfect" as "whole, full". In addition to Carian sorcery, he also studied incantations with Marika. As far as I understand, when Marika calls him "my other self", in the original Japanese, it has a slightly different meaning 我が半身よ(My half body). Also, if look at the properties of such talismans as the seals of Radagon and Marika, it looks like they complement each other and together represent one whole. And half of Radagon just lacks those characteristics on which sorcery and incantations depend. That is, he did it more for personal purposes than in an attempt to improve the Golden Order.

Fear the old lore!!!! Fuck yeah!!!!

Ahhh rewatching this just cause

Nice video, as always!! I was waiting for someone with knowledge of the Japanese text to clarify the lore of Elden Ring and finally there's a video that gives me more clues and clear explanations! One question I would like to ask you, if you can answer, is: what are runes, in your opinion? They are the core of the level up system, and yet there's very little explanation of what they are in the lore. Are they all part of the Elden ring? If you answer, thank you! And again, nice video! Keep going like that!

I still don't why the whole "Erdtree is a parasite" theory was so popular. I mean, nothing in the game even remotely hints at it and the stuff that is there outright contradicts that theory. The game states that the the Erdtree is the Crucible where all life originated from. Why would it parasite off of something that originated from it to begin with?

Its my belief that (Elden Ring)'s entire theme is about simultaneously fighting and meeting destiny. That; Regardless of your own actions, free-will was always an illusion. You fight destiny in conceptual manifestation as (The Elden beast) boss. The game has predetermined endings, thus proving my point. Become Elden Lord. A Tarnished will again one day become Elden lord etc... and whichever questline or path you choose. You litterally fulfill whichever (destiny/fate/design/path) was divinely (or designed) for you. It is a theme in both West and Estern cultures to have self-fulfilling prophecies. Oracles. And/or the tragedies of heroes/villains meeting their: destiny and/or acheiving their fated future (glory or end). Woven throughout the narrative of this story is "destined death" "future and fates dictated by stars", "prophecies of the return of the Tarnished", guidance, paths and innevitabilities, etc... Essentially- if the GreaterWill itself symbolises ordered fate. Then must itself meet its end by its own hand. In a paradoxical - way, this does happen. Defying and denying fate, essentially creating the exact elements and situation that leads to you (A Tarnished of no reknown). To deal the 'End'. The guidance of grace - is some wierd way. Being the conceptual (string) of fate,destiny,prophecy etc...

The red tint of the crucible symbolises life, not death, as some items explicitly state. The erdtree never tilted, the door carved into it is straight and seems to be as old as the age of plenty.

I have been interpreting it as the Greattree is the Erd tree before the Elden Beast came. The Erd tree encases the great tree, you can see the normal bark and the doorway into the tree when going in. Also in each ending the color of the outside Erd tree changes based on your choice but the tree itself stays the same. My thinking was that the great tree became encased by the Elden Beast so they are the same but are now two yet one. Now that I think about it, it's not that different between Marika and Radagon in a way.

My man.

You are amazing I had the exact same thoughts and I get insulted if I don’t agree with vaatividiya

I've often wondered why nobody was talking about the likely connection between Omens and the Crucible, I think you raise a lot of points I've seen under-discussed but that one particularly seems significant to me. I don't fully understand how the removal of "Death" works, because some of the Spirit Ashes are clearly of people who existed after Marika had Malekith do his thing. If "Erdtree Burial" exists as a concept, how is death truly gone from the Lands Between? Is it something like they can't be touched by old age, but it's still possible for them to be killed? Until I saw other fans talking I almost thought the shackling only applied to the demigods, but there's got to be something about this concept I'm missing, I guess, because it sure seems like a lot of people have died even after Marika took over.

Can somebody explain why the erdtree has a huge gap not covered in gold where they installed the doors? Also why there is a whole branch not covered in gold in its top?

Perhaps once Godwyns body infected the Greattree the Erdtree dislodged its roots?

Oh yessss

I heard that the great tree roots being severed from the Erdtree refers to the Minor Erdtrees, so it means the roots of the minor trees are no longer connected to the Erdtree. Could this be correct?

Hey man great video. Can I ask a specific thing? What's the meaning, in Japanese, of the "grace of gold"? I'm intrigued about the significance of grace, especially because it looks a lot like a humanity sprite

It seems to me like the golden exterior of the tree could be a taking over or parasitaiton of the greattree, such that the regular looking parts of the tree reporesent what was there before. Still a tree, but with no 'will'. We know the lands between already existed pre-erdtree, and life along with it. In this manner, great trees could represent the raw nature of how these worlds in the setting work, or part of how they come to be, and the golden eardtree the taking over and re-structuring of that system by the greater will. The greater will itself, it seems, is just one of several outer gods competing for control over realm-spaces such as the lands between. For whatever cosmic reason. Maybe to do with absorbing the dead. Anyhow, if you're willing to entertain wild speculation...any evdence to the contrary comes to mind?

Wouldn't it make sense that the Erdtree was cut off from its roots IN ORDER TO stop the spread of Deathroot up its body? That also makes some sense of the stigma around the Omens, because of what it would make them omens OF: A presumed-impossible continued connection to the Erdtree's roots, and the fear of death that comes with it.

Total misunderstanding of regression to the mean. Yes, two taller parents will likely have a shorter child, but this Does Not mean that life's "extreme traits slowly regress" because the Total average variance does not change generation to generation. Regression to the mean is almost like a statistical illusion in this way: when you focus on the extreme's themselves it seems like the population is getting less extreme, but when you look at the population as a whole this is not the case. One way to think about this is as a signal and noise issue. If subject A in trial 1 gives a the most extreme value, it's probably the case that it has a very extreme value that carries over to generation 2, but it also is likely that whatever random noise doesn't carry over to trial 2 was also extreme in the same direction, so, in trial 2, subject A will most likely have a less extreme value. Again, this is a property of the "extremes" of a single trial, Not of the "extremeness" of the population.

Greetings.

I buy the theory that the Erdtree is a parasite feeding off the Greattree. The Crucible Knights' armor depict the Greattree with branches jutting in all directions, while the Erdtree more closely resembles a mushroom. The Erdtree's door at the Elden Throne also shows it seemingly speering through the Greattree and latching onto its roots.

I'm still not convinced Marika and Radagon were always a dual entity in a single body. The cracks on Radagon in the cutscene remind me of the cracks on Ranni's body and lead me to believe he was forcing himself spiritually into marika's form to steal control.

Urghhh, not this again... We know the Erdtree was born at the same time as the War against the Giants thanks to the text of the Smithing Stone 7. Isn't it sooooooo much easier to simply assume that this coincides with the creation of the Golden Order ? During the war, Marika makes this speech to her troops mentioning "a new epoch glistening with life" which seems like a pretty straightforward definition of what the Golden Order is. I don't see any strong indication that there was a big lapse of time between the birth of the Erdtree and the creation of the Golden Order. And the birth of a gargantuan tree seems quite in line with the foundation of an epoch glistening with life. And while, yes, people seem to be immortal under the Golden Order, they can obviously still be killed or perform suicide, so Erdtree burial would still have a role to play.

Interesting... the Erdtree is growing completely normally for an oak tree by the way, it's not 'tilted'. If it 'weren't anchored to its base' it would simply fall over, like any other tree. It and its roots are also entirely connected from everything we see in the game and they seem to be a crucial structural/geological element in and under Lleyndell. What it is disconnected from is the far far larger root system that covers the entirety of the Lands Between, being present on the surface and in the deepest depths even at the farthest points from the Erdtree. IMO that larger system is of the Greattree, and it is how Godwyn is spreading deathroot beyond the reach of the Erdtree's roots. It's also hinted that all of the normal trees are growing out of the Greattree, through things like the root resin - it seems it might be closer to an actual 'world tree' than anything else we've seen in the souls games, and possibly the original source of terrestrial life that the primordial crucible 'melted down'. I have a feeling the Greattree is the missing piece of a lot of the obscured history of the Lands Between, and that its obfuscation in the game as a text is in accord with its in-universe historiographical obfuscation by the Greater Will and its vassals.

Hey nice video! Just one thing, english isn't my first language but usually I don't have a problem understanding videos, don't take this the wrong way but I think It would be nice if you could speak a bit slower. It might just be me but regardless wanted to let you know. You got a new sub btw

waitin

10 mins? C'mon

Nice finds. The Great Tree and Erd Tree are dragon nests Everything is in service of the dragons, the OLDER gods, also the Outer gods because they did not come from the lands between. Marika the Eternal DRAGON Queen was always a god and the Numen are the new human dragon hybrids created by the prior elden ring(s) Radagon anagram for Dragon(s) Amber = Yellow (Marika) + Red (Radagon) Also fire has yellow and red hues Amber DRAGON (Numen) egg Marika and Radagon were twins, she has twin trait, twin children Miquella Malenia Malekeith Morgott Mohg (as Marika) Ranni , Radhn, Rykard (As Radagon) Marika = 53 in Gematria (5 kids as Marika 3 as Radagon) children born of a SINGLE god

I appreciate the effort you're putting in but the game's story is just incomprehensible even with accurate translation. In comparison to the Souls series, words or sentences might be missing from the branches but here it feels like whole pages and chapters are torn out from the roots and trunk.