Elder Dragon Level Monsters: Part 2 - Monster Hunter Lore 

It's an arthropod afterall

There is actually a 3rd one for them as well but it's in Frontier which is Odibatorasu. Considering it lives in the Desert, it's pretty much middle ground since the Desert is Hot by day and Cold by night. So this would be the "Rayquaza" of the two monsters Also no worries, thanks for the clip as always (:

@@ChronoPinoyX laughs in Dalamagur

Yes but the other way.

@grim_ nah, they're killing monster which will probably mess up the nature, eg: killing nergigante which technically the effort of nature to balance things by keeping in check all the elder dragons.

@@Tea-Spin nature is messed up already. Hunters guild keep balance. Its the whole "thing" of it. There are also hunters that fight off poachers which is as bad as murder in this society. Nergigante is a think of World and only World relese. A "new player"

I'll take missed Splitters over missed TCS and SAED 😂

@@ChronoPinoyX I can respect that till this day I still can’t really use CB to save my life lmaoo

@@rotz889 It takes time and skill to learn those weapons. I can't for the life of me master the Longsword all that well. I can learn the CB and Greatsword and others but to truly master the Longsword as TDS did, it's not as easy as it seems.

@@Asriel_Cypher ngl i think longsword is def one of the easiest weapons to learn once ur able to get the hang of the counters and HS its basically a bread and butter weapon. Saying that my original comment wasnt a jab at his ability to use it. Just a light hearted observation/ joke theres literally no deeper meaning

@@rotz889 Oh, I'm not disagreeing. It's definitely the easiest to learn. It is, to me, not as easy as it seems to master it. You can't spam your buttons and expect the monsters to die or flinch by everything you do like CB or GS does. I don't see it as a jab either. It's just a fact that my man missed 3 times in a row. I was just pointing out that it's a different experience.

Glad to see you enjoyed it, thanks!

Hunters are Elder Dragon level before killing an ED and wearing it's skin.

I'm pretty sure we Hunters are pretty much Black Dragons

Akantor if im correct was classified as a flying wyvern for some odd reason lol

@@wanted2657 I mean literally being able to fly. Plenty of Flying Wyverns at Elder Dragon-level and flight-capable Elder-tier beasts, but Bazelgeuse is actually the only one from the main series that can fly without needing a specific variation to be considered at this level.

@@vaapad3092 Gore Magala is also an Elder Dragon due to being the juvenile form (and therefore the same species) as an Elder Dragon species, the Shagaru Magala. Meanwhile, Bazelgeuse is a Flying Wyvern fully capable of flight and, on its own without a Rare Species, Variant, Subspecies, Deviant, Frenzy Apex, or Rampage Apex is at that Elder Dragon-level. No other Monster in the entire main series has that distinction, which makes Bazelgeuse very unique indeed.

you lie, although classified as a brute wyvern the deviljho could defiantly fly, you think I jest but no, I have seen a deviljho fly all the way across an area and land in my face faster then any flying wyvern, not even the king of sky rathalos could manage a flying plunge that accurate that fast! I know what youre gonna say, it's jumping not flying, yeah you say that but when a pile of muscles weighing a couple hundred tons come flying at you from more then ten meters above ground at super sonic speed, that aint jumping as far as im concerned

I agree because they're huge

nah they are still the strongest even if you include frontier... well except ravi

@@vielvladimirvaldez6917 what, ravi is not an elder?

@@tonyhuwa641 yeah hes unclassified

@@vielvladimirvaldez6917 Wait what? Isnt the elder dragon class for monster they cant classify into anything else? So doesnt that mean unclassified would be elder dragon?

That would be insane to fight against. Imagine the destructive capabilities.

Ruiner Nergigante also proved himself to be a veritable Elder Dragon killer even among Elder Dragons, and yet he struggled to take it down; it took more effort to take down that Bazelgeuse than it did even the massive and powerful Shara Ishvalda. Bear in mind, this was a healed-up and fresh Ruiner Nergigante compared to the one that got buried and left for dead. And yet Bazelgeuse was holding out and even counter-attacked. Not many Monsters could take such powerful blows from such a physically imposing Elder Dragon and not be too heavily damaged in the process. But it makes sense, since Bazelgeuse can regularly challenge and withstand attacks from the mighty Deviljho who is a physical peer to Nergigante.

It was pretty one sided true, but with how regular Bazel handled a Variant Elder Dragon, I'll give it the points for landing those explosions properly and actually standing ground. It's rare to see a regular monster take on a Variant Elder Dragon in the series

@@ChronoPinoyX Not to mention that Nergigante are already evolved Elder Dragon killers, and yet this Bazelgeuse gave the Ruiner individual the most amount of trouble in a cinematic as an individual itself. Very few Monsters could last against a Ruiner Nergigante for as long as Bazelgeuse did under the circumstances it found itself in.

@@GunlessSnake very few monsters go near elder dragon most would rather run although lagiacrus is one I think has a good shot of handling one but there is no evidence

@@devinnewsom1972 Abyssal lagiacrus definitely but any other lesser form lagiacrus I dont think so

Like a ED level zamtrios?

"Actual legends like moltres and raikou" You chose some really weak ass legends.

@@justanotherhunter6634 that’s because their stat totals are 580, I can’t exactly say something like Dragonite rivaling Giratina stat wise, so I stuck with the lesser Legendaries

Well it's an actual Elder Dragon but... Yama Tsukami is a levitating squid soooo (:

@@ChronoPinoyX I am speechless

I'll be honest, I completely forgot to address it myself. I was meant to say that as of the latest info on Gore, it was categorised as Elder Dragon with the latest Evolution Tree. So yeah, I forgot about it, that was my bad😂

Gore Magala is an Elder Dragon, its simply just a juvenile. Also as Chrono mentioned it was indeed recently re-classified appropriately as an ED. So it doesn't fit into the ''Elder Dragon Level Monsters'' group for now obvious reasons.

Gore is an elder dragon tho, it’s kinda like Xenojiva compared to Safi, both are the same elder dragon just different age

The Power of Gameplay limitation compels them (:

@@ChronoPinoyX God wyverns could inflict possesion confirmed! But seriously their heads are gigantic and their KO weakness is one of the highest in the game! Ukanlos had one of the highest HP in MHFU but all you had to do is get a decent hammer and spend 27 minutes knocking it down over again LoL.

The elder dragon caregorization has always been a bit to varied to be based on a fictional evolutionary history with members like Zorah Magdoros, Jehan Moran, Cadeus or Kirin. I don't know if there is any lore contradicting this but I always thought the category was mostly based on their role in the ecosystem so if any fanged wyvern like kulve taroth clearly fills and elder dragon level role in the ecosystem and has no obvious close relatives it would believably be classified as an elder dragon in this world.

It's almost as if that's the subject matter at hand...

The Frontier Monsters were not included mostly due to the content being unavailable. If it's available at this stage, it would be great to do them as well! But until Capcom has any official word on them, unfortuantely I wouldn't be able to do any real videos for them

I really wish Seething Bazelgeuse could've gotten some Turf Wars with Elder Dragons like Savage Deviljho did.

@@GunlessSnake yep same but he got the shaft unfortunately

It has vestigial wings on its design. Super tiny but they are there.

I want insects and leviathans back, they got so close with lagriacus (fucked that spelling sorry), too bad they kept having trouble with the skeleton

@@loganburnette5485 don’t worries I I don’t know how to write it ether 😂😂😂

Until I can get further information on the latest lore behind Variants (this will come in when Capcom Releases their Dive Into Iceborne/Iceborne Official Complete Works), I opted to keep them out. Once that info comes in, I'll be making updates talking about any changes in lore regarding these creatures!

Regular Brachydios, no, as he's considered on the same general level as other Apexes in the New World. Raging Brachydios? Definitley, considering his size, enhanced explosive potential, and general attack threat level.

@@GunlessSnake It's already been considered that it is a candidate for Elder Dragon Level monsters due to the fact that unlike regular Brachy, Raging Brachy lives in areas where Elders and Elder Level monsters live like Ingle Isle back in the Old World and of course, Guiding Lands in New. Hopefully with the upcoming Iceborne Books, we can get confirmation!

@@ChronoPinoyX It's not even really like we need that confirmation given the THICCNESS and boom factor we see at play. Sometimes, you need a guidebook for that, like with Bazelgeuse being outright confirmed to be equal to Deviljho. And sometimes, you get something like Raging Brachydios where you just KNOW that this thing is above its normal peers based on the presentation itself.

No Reason: it has 5 stars It is more comparable to rathalos and zinogre

Bazel probably hurt nergi really hard with the landing, plus he exploded nergi's face mid air

Except its already been established by the Official Complete Works that Bazel is literally on even grounds to Deviljho... The cutscene is even more convincing because its taking on Ruiner of all things. An Elder Dragon, IN ITS VARIANT FORM. Regular Bazel took that surprise attack and stood its ground much better compared to regular Jho who literally got d*ckslapped by a Garuga

The Official Complete Works states the following regarding the Deviljho and Bazelgeuse being equal in power: "As they are both equally matched in temperament and strength, it comes as no surprise that there have been sightings of these two rampaging monsters locked in mortal combat across the New World" - MHW Official Complete Works: Bazelgeuse Page 317 Hopefully that helps!

@@SarazenX Exactly this. Bazelgeuse are noted to have kinda weak flight, so the fact that even after all these powerful blows from Ruiner Nergigante (particularly a divebomb ambush from outta nowhere) and WASN'T knocked out of the sky shows how freaking tough he is. Seriously, it wasn't until his actual wings were bitten down on that he finally went down. Not to mention that Bazelgeuse are rivals to Deviljho, a physical equal/peer to Nergigante and Rajang.

Bazelgeuse is explicitly called out as equal to Deviljho in the MHW Complete Works book, usurps Apexes when he invades, and has the sheer durability and strength to be on par with some Elder Dragons. Few Elder Dragons can withstand the kind of punishment a Deviljho or Ruiner Nergigante can dish out; in fact, Bazelgeuse can give more of a struggle to a Savage Deviljho and not take any damage until he's fully pounced upon compared to Ruiner Nergigante getting dragged around and seriously hurt. As for Seething Bazelgeuse, what differentiates it is its HEAT ability, as its description notes that it's able to push its heat production far past normal for its bombs. This can also be visually seen in its appearance in its base and seething states; its scales look to have been burnt out by how hot it can get, reflecting how its head and tail can enter a fully glowing heat state and how the explosive scales need time to heat up into purple explosives. If anything, it's more likely to do with the heated state going out of control than any Glowing Slime. As for Turf Wars, while the animations may not always be wholly representative (a fair point about the reused animations), the RESULT always is. Apexes always lose to Elder-tiers, Elder-tiers always beat Apexes, Apexes always tie with Apexes, Elder-tiers always tie with Elder-tiers, etc.

Seregios doesn’t have the raw strength to challenge Elders on its own.

@@noahgarcia2711 ^This. While Seregios is shown to be superior to things like Rathian, it's ultimately only on the same level as Rathalos and other Apexes, explicitly shown in how it has an even fight with Azure Rathalos in MH4U and with how MHW establishes Azure Rathalos is still Apex-tier like its famous cousin.

@@GunlessSnake true

It's a difficult explanation but the basics are they are direct descendants of the Origin Wyvern (the Origin Wyvern is the ancestor of Wyvern Rex, the first true Flying Wyvern) and from that relation, they were linked to Flying Wyverns. I would go into further details but that's a video in and of itself which I may cover soon

@@ChronoPinoyX oh, sweet thx, looking forward to it

Think of it as evolution. At one point their massive front legs were wings but over time they stopped flying and stayed on the ground to the point where they just devolved into legs. Sort of like how Tigrex crawls around despite having wings

Molten Tigrex would be part of the Rare Species category which was part of my previous video, hope that helps!

He is a deviant and that was on The Fist vídeo

You got like 5 of those -fatalis -crimson fatalis -white fatalis -alatreon -dire miralis And if you want to include frontier and online (that are not canon) you got: -disufiroa -duremudira -merphistofelim

Amatsu it's acceptable,but yeah,Nakarkos and yamatsukami should be from an unique especie,like "cephalopods" or something like that

Akantor and Ukanlos are related to monsters such Tigrex and Rathalos so... you can classify them. Elder Dragons stand outside of the other classifications, they aren't related other monsters except other Elder Dragons as far as we know so... If in future we may get a Cephalopods monsters class,you can bet Nakarkos and Yama would still be considered Elders because they may not be related to other cephalopods.

@@mattiaberti9160 what about Amatsu? It's clearly a Leviathan

@@yurei4414 Only because it looks like a Leviathan doesn't mean it's one of them or is related to them... Convergent evolution is a thing afterall.

Capcom have established their evolutionary tree for a while now and in said tree, they show that Akantor and Ukanlos directly descend from the monster that originated all wyvern types, this is simply dubbed as "Origin Wyvern". So Akantor and Ukanlos are actually the closest creatures we could see as being the "Original version of all Wyverns". I've linked below the two most up to date info on it (from BannedLagi cuz I can't read Japanese) and the Wiki version as well. Search for the term "Saurischia" in the page for the wiki for all the Wyvern types Evolution Tree in Japanese: twitter.com/i/events/1215403908601909249 Evolution Tree in English/Japanese (by MH Fandom Wiki): monsterhunter.fandom.com/wiki/Ecological_Tree_Diagram_(Phylogenetic_Tree)

Molten falls under Rare Species, Raging Brachy is a Variant which is currently under investigation (and by that I mean we're waiting for Dive into Iceborne/Iceborne Official Complete Works Book for details on the monster), hope that helps!

It's just a name for term they used for this monster category. Really could've been anything else, because "Elder dragon" really doesn't fit for all of them. But the first elder dragons were in fact dragon's and that's why they kept the term i guess

@@zimablue3166 Did Capcom confirm this?

@@Asriel_Cypher I've once heard an interview where they talked about that kinda confirming this. Capcom loves to leave us space for imagination in MH universe. They even said that themselves in a recent MH Rise interview when they were asked about the new village

@@zimablue3166 I see. Thanks for the info. I appreciate that. Have nice day.

@@Asriel_Cypher thanks man, you too

Stygian is only considered Elder Level as a Tempered Monster, not regular (Threat Levels in World/Iceborne only apply to Tempered monsters to know what they drop mostly unlike previous gen games). As for the reason they don't involve gameplay, it's because the instant gameplay is introduced, they are now in the realms of limitations. Gameplay limits the vision of what the lore is so from what I understand, they outright avoid gameplay mechanics unless gameplay can demonstrate the lore like what we see in terms of fights between monsters.

@@SarazenX I think you missunderstand something. The Threadlevel show how high a Monster ranks in the Ökosystem and that equals what Tempered Tier it is and what it drops. There isnt a Treathlevel for non Tempered Monsters at all. Also it doesnt say much because every Secret Monster in Guidinglands has it, because they afterstory Content, but hus Attackstat is as high as Elders.

I wouldn't put stygian in the same level It doesn't have a habit of fighting elder dragons and it doesn't seem to have a significant effect on it's environments

@@jaydeejay4166 And so does Gold Rathian. It may have not the same Impact on its Environment, but the Game counds him as that specific Tier, and in Gameplay he was allways stupidly taff, so I cound him in.

@@Sunaki1000 well stygian has traditionally been five stars while gold rathian has been 6 The only elder dragons that were 5 star were kirin and lunastra And based on when you typically encounter one it is kind of like 5 star+ since it is used as a slightly harder, slightly different from of a 5 star monster In that sense it is more akin to azure rathalos and brute tigrex which are also 5 stars but are considered harder than their normal species despite having the same difficulty rating

Deviljho has been directly compared to Elder Dragons in terms of destructive capability in its story quest dialogue in MHW, defeats Apexes who only lose to Elder-tier Monsters in Turf Wars, ties with Elder Dragons in Turf Wars via its Savage Variant (and we see throughout the DLC that most Variants aren't considered a tier above their base forms with a few exceptions), AND it has massive brute strength that can rival even Nergigante and Rajang who are specifically some the strongest Elder-tier Monsters around. Bazelgeuse is noted to have equal strength and aggression to Deviljho and similarly destroys Apexes in its ecology, AND it ties with Deviljho in Turf Wars.

Y’know rajang ties with deviljho right?

@@kingcrunchking In fact, Rajang even ties with base Deviljho! While regular Deviljho doesn't exist in Master Rank, using mods to bring the 2 together, it's been found that they have a hidden Turf War without any other outside influence. Same for regular Bazelgeuse with Savage Deviljho.

@@GunlessSnake i still dont see it. Deviljho has been compared to elder dragons in how devastating his effect on enviornmemts he enters and the destruction he causes around him due to his voracious appetitte. In the turf war between him and rajang that is not a tie. They both do damage to each other but that doesnt make it a tie. Rajang is the clear winner of the turf war by clearly visibly subduing jho. Jho also stalemates with elder dragons because of his dragon breath. They clearly pin him down and are about to fuck him up. He uses his breath to protect himself from them and then flees. Would i agree jho is close to elder dragon level sure but at it no. Rajang has more definitive victories over elder dragons in MHWI. In the turfwar between Jho and bazel jho clearly has the upper hand it is only through bazels blast scales igniting that allows him to be free of jhos grip. Monsters doing dmg to each other and stalemating doesnt mean they are equals. In these turf wars u can clearly see if a monster has an actualy advantage and that if theg were to continue who would win. Some are of course like Rajang and Ruiner. Now that is a visual tie and even in that case it appears that ruiner has the advantage striking rajang much harder. Bazel ingame cutscene takes on a ruiner and hus destroyed very easily. The ruiner barely exerts any effort and the entire fight the bazel is struggling. If u wanna argue he is close to elder tier or u know what if u wanna argue that he is low tier elder level then sure ill give it that. But smack dab elder level? No.

@@javi8905 The end results of a Turf War determine its win/loss/tie status, not the animations. If a Monster takes damage and is left flailing on the ground, they lost; if a Monster doesn't take damage, is standing, and roars in victory, they won; if both Monsters take damage, are standing, and roar at each other, they tied. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Those are the rules, every single Turf War follows it except for (Pink) Rathian vs. (Black) Diablos and (Ruiner) Nergigante vs. Teostra/Lunastra/Kushala Daora; with the former, Rathian gets away; with the latter, (Ruiner) Nergigante's opponents are standing up but left staggered. Deviljho, meanwhile, firmly ties with these Elder Dragon-level Monsters AND defeats Apexes just like them; he's not staggered at all like Nergigante's 3 specific opponents, nor does he ever actually lose to them. twitter.com/BannedDino/status/1271008174481571841 This Twitter thread is a profile of Deviljho done by the MH community's best researcher known as *Banned Lagiacrus* who has the various guidebooks and does extensive digging. It cites multiple instances in guidebooks and past games that state that Deviljho's threat level is equal to that of Elder Dragons. Its physical strength is on par with Elder Dragons (demonstrated in-game by the fact that it's in the same strength range as Rajang and Nergigante and overpowers the likes of Velkhana, Blackveil Vaal Hazak, and Namielle physically). Its hunger is such that it threatens entire ecosystems in a manner akin to an Elder Dragon's destructive capabilities, and it will even prey on Elder Dragons given the chance. All of this proves Deviljho is an Elder Dragon-level Monster, for it has physical strength that rivals and even surpasses powerful Elder Dragons, and it has a destructive capacity to rival them as well. And with Bazelgeuse, it is considered the true rival of Deviljho, cited here twitter.com/BannedDino/status/1270009666806956033 by *Banned Lagiacrus* where its strength is directly stated to be equal to Deviljho. And if it's equal to Deviljho AND usurps Apexes, then by proxy it is Elder Dragon-level. To go along with this, Ruiner Nergigante is a confirmed Elder Dragon killer who had finished off Shara Ishvalda, a massive and powerful Elder Dragon easily much larger and stronger than a Bazelgeuse. Despite the immense strength Ruiner Nergigante possesses to be able to kill it, it took Ruiner Nergigante longer to take down that single Bazelgeuse despite gaining the initial advantage with its ambush. Losing to Nergigante is not a sign of weakness considering the species is specifically evolved to kill Elder Dragons, so the fact that Bazelgeuse could resist most of his attacks without sustaining major damage AND land a counter-attack that forced the Extinction Dragon to fight smarter is a testament to the Elder Dragon-level status of the invading tyrant.

It is... but it's Apex level. In tirf wars it ties with monsters such as Tigrex, Rathalos, Fulgur Anjanath etc...

Because the Tier list in World is based on Tempered Monsters, Stygian Zinogre falls under the Tempered Monsters category of Elder Level Monsters which I covered in my previous video. Feel free to check it out! (Link in description)

@Buruguduy Stunstugudunstuy Ruiner wasn't phased by it at all, evidenced by him still bringing Bazel out of the sky. You're of those people to shout "don't believe your lying eyes!"

@Buruguduy Stunstugudunstuy Your proof that Ruiner was struggling is non-existent. Ruiner beats everything that's not at least a mid-tier Elder Dragon.

People really be here denying a factual cutscene of a Bazel standing up against a Ruiner. Its not that hard to grasp that a Bazel can take on an Elder. Its already confirmed by MH through cutscene AND their official book

@@SarazenX There's a difference between being able to take on a mere Elder and being able to take on Ruiner. Also, getting taken out of the sky is not really being able to stand up to something.

@@bluhmer1990 Bazelgeuse are noted to have quite weak general flight. Despite all the punishment that Ruiner Nergigante put Bazelgeuse through, including putting all his weight on him and forcing him to fly with the Elder Dragon on his back, Bazelgeuse is only properly knocked out of the sky by Ruiner Nergigante biting his wing. This shows immense durability on the part of Bazelgeuse, which makes sense since he's the only Monster that Deviljho isn't able to damage by swinging him around. And when Bazelgeuse manages to counterattack Ruiner Nergigante, the Elder Dragon is noticeably affected and switches tactics immediately; this can be seen clearly when the scene is slowed down, showing that he fears taking serious damage from the explosive scales.

Nope