Electronic Wastegate Control Is Here! | Turbosmart eWG At SEMA [TECH TALK]

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Get the lowdown on how Turbosmarts new electronic wastegates are going to change the boost control game in the aftermarket industry including why this offering is superior to what you can currently get your hands one from OE applications, which were never manufactured with the idea of running being able to withstand 60psi to 150psi of backpressure depending on the wastegates physical size, which of course depends on your setup.
Chris from Turbosmart explains the eWGs strengths over their already capable mechanically controlled wastegates when it comes to speed and boost range and why this will see your wastegate springs retired. Chris and Andre also talk about the use of a butterfly valve instead of a poppet valve (aka mushroom valve) and if there are any negative effects from this change.
The power requirements and control options of this system, which operates similarly to your DBW throttle body, are also discussed with Turbosmart likely to release an intermediate box to assist with control, but ultimately putting the ball in aftermarket ECU companies court when it comes to the long term planning for pins and connectors that can handle the 20A current or alternative ways to split and reduce that over multiple connector pins instead.
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#highperformanceacademy #learntotune #turbosmart #electronicwastegate #ewg #eiwg #sema #semashow #sema2019

Опубликовано:

17 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 113

@hpa101 4 года назад

Are you excited? I'm excited! Let's be excited together in some HPA t-shirts: shop.hpacademy.com/ - Taz. #sharingiscaring

@mrctuned2844 4 года назад

High Performance Academy, why can't we use a high quality PWM solid state relay like is used for nitrous oxide to handle the high current loads?

@Danger_mouse 4 года назад

Sometimes you see something and think 'Why hasn't someone done this already'?..... this is one of those times 👍👍

@skylinefever 4 года назад

I had the exact same thought. I'm glad that the staff at Turbosmart explained why racers needed to wait so long. Actually, I never knew why any computerized engine ever needed pneumatic controls of any kind.

@neomeg2232 4 года назад

I'm still waiting for vgt's to become mainstream in the performance world lol

@skylinefever 4 года назад

@@neomeg2232 I have heard that VGT turbos don't handle the heat of gasoline engine exhaust very well. That is why they are typically found in diesels. DPF Diesels that frequently go into active regen often wear out their turbos.

@neomeg2232 4 года назад

@@skylinefever they had problems with the heat decades ago, but metallurgy and cooling solutions have come a long way. And I worked for a Mack truck shop when I was younger. That's how I actually learned about vgt's. The only problem dpf regen systems had were on vocational trucks that had frequent starts and stops with drivers that didn't understand how they worked and constantly cancelled the cycling until the truck disabled itself. Only took a little while for them to stop doing that and getting stranded part way through the route. Lol. Otherwise otr had no real issues Edit: as a side note, they're on diesels because that's the industry that needs to push the technology. And also, that's not how a regen system works. They're not any harder on the turbo than the earlier systems. Besides, regen wouldn't even be a consideration on gasoline engines, so it doesn't apply

@teamallyracing1780 3 года назад

I know this just sprung to my head and started googling and guess it there already

@daveyclarke 4 года назад

Aussies killing the game at sema and pri!

@hpa101 4 года назад

Big year for the Australian aftermarket industry for sure and a lot to deliver in 2020. Much excite 🤘- Taz.

@YZFoFittie 4 года назад

HPI guys area Kiwi not Ozzy...lol

@daveyclarke 4 года назад

YZFoFittie products I’m talking about not the presenters lol

@timburton1080 4 года назад

I imagine lots of sentences being started with "look...."

@InNoTime3377 4 года назад

Biggest advantage i see over the conventional gate is no more changing springs!

@gcalfuture3119 4 года назад

This channel deserves more subscribers.. very informative topics in automotive sport

@tylertc1 4 года назад

Learned something new...back drive. Pro interview status by the guy at Turbosmart as well.

@1truzilla458 4 года назад

I like this product, I'm looking at building another R34 GTR with a gtx5544r. I'm always looking to control boost better. Currently, my RB30 R33 GTR is making usable boost on a 76mm turbo at 3800 rpm because of new advance control technology.

@jarvenpaajani8105 4 года назад

This is awesome product, finally we can get rid of the last vacuum hose in the engine bay! (if using intake mounted map sensor)

@WickedTRX 4 года назад

We need a driver that interfaces the ECU, receives PWM/Duty cycle from the ECU and the position through the encoder on the actuator and has a H-bridge to control the motor. That's a lot of current for a inbuilt, design for TB driver. Looks like the actuators are liquid cooled

@sanityd1 4 года назад

Even if your ECU can drive enough current, you are going to shorten it's lifespan, plus you you are better off having the H bridge closer to the motor. I suspect it's a BLDC anyway from the way he was talking about it.

@AustinBartz95 4 года назад

@@sanityd1 It's a brushed DC motor. At least from the photos they have shown, and how they are describing it, since there are only two wires going to the motor. The three wires for feedback sound like a typical hall effect or potentiometer for position feedback.

@AustinBartz95 4 года назад

@WickedTRX Adding something in between that handles the closed loop control is just asking for trouble in regards to tuning it. Since if you are trying to use an existing PWM output on an ECU that would've been used for controlling a WG Solenoid, the closed loop control within the ECU could end up fighting/oscillating with the closed loop control inside the eWG driver. IMO, there are two good solutions. 1) A "dumb" H-Bridge amplifier that simply takes the H-Bridge outputs from the ECU and use them to drive a stronger H-Bridge. That way the PID control loop remains inside the ECU without a second PID loop or something that would add excessive delay. 2) An all in one eWG controller that has its own tuning software to set a desired boost vs rpm,gear,etc. That controller would have the PID loop built in, and would only have one purpose, to control the eWG to meet the desired boost.

@MR__JUSTIN 4 года назад

Totally cool! Opens up many possibilities, some practical, some fun. I could see the butterfly "straight gate" valve doubling as an expensive electric exhaust cutout so you can sound mean when cruising the boulevard 😎

@jacobturner3648 4 года назад

Too small for an exhaust cut out but I like your thinking

@MR__JUSTIN 4 года назад

@@jacobturner3648 it would just be a "bonus" feature to artificially make your car sound louder. Also having this full open would make it take forever to spool your turbo - another plus if you're in "all show no go" mode 😄

@manitoublack 4 года назад

More great Aussie tech

@darcy4744 4 года назад

Will be interesting to see how people package the butterfly WG, Will definitely need to be decided from the start that you're going with that style. I see mounting straight onto the turbine housing being a popular solution.

@brianbrigg57 4 года назад

Heat is the enemy of electronics. I have run some downhole tools in the oilfield that cost over US$30K each rated to 165C and sustained temperature's of 130C in the wells would still kill them in a couple of weeks of use. Granted, the tools being used had FPGA chips in them but simple things like inductors and even resistors were the first things to fail. Keeping these things as cool as possible will be important if we want the best useful life from them.

@samuelmdouglas 2 года назад

I wonder if you can bleed off drive pressure and run a smaller a/r turbine housing, so you can get on boost earlier and then start to bleed off enough exhaust to lower the drive pressure but still keep the turbo at the desired boost pressure.

@thomasiturraran3623 2 года назад

Where does one acquire the adapter to make this work on an internally gated EFR exhaust housing?

@davidcerven5072 3 года назад

00:03 Are those turbosmart internal wastegate actuators already for sale ? Or the actuators can be interchangable between external & internal wastegates ?

@aydenplaten9279 4 года назад

Keen to seen some guys test these at UCC. I wonder how they handle 200 psi. I'm think they would make compound set-ups easier to work very efficiently

@skylinefever 4 года назад

I wonder what would happen if you could instantly retrofit these devices to existing turbo engines. By having faster motion, people could get the most out of stock or near stock levels. I'm sure someone would invent something that goes between the OEM ECU boost control solenoid wires and the Turbosmart electric WG actuator. It could draw current from somewhere else in order to function, there could simply be another relay that activates when the ignition key is turned.

@ChasingTheeDragon 4 года назад

Those inline gates are dope as

@felixthecat1672 4 года назад

Alactronic, ey bro? 😂 Loving the videos 👍

@hpa101 4 года назад

Chur bru! - Taz.

@dougyoud5944 3 года назад

Do these exist still? I cant find them on the turbosmart site?

@tjdriftking2156 4 года назад

So if something goes wrong and your wastegate stays shut; boost cut should protect the engine

@joe5boost 4 года назад

top vid thank you for sharing , keep up the good work

@tylertruitt377 3 года назад

i wanna get one cause they're out but there's like no info on how to tune them, what they're compatible with, setup or maintenance. I read they have to be water cooled, what's all involved with that?

@ShinMufasa 4 года назад

I hope for a eboost3 gauge to help interface with this electronic wastegate.

@thehappytexan 4 года назад

Very good idea. Their horizontal waste gate is almost identical to a Paccar Diesel engine egr valve and Cummins egr valve as well. That tech has been in the trucking industry for years. Cummins came out with the vertical style in 2007 and plumbed it into the coolant system for longevity. I’m curious to see if these aftermarket valves will be run on a can network for speed and precision as they are in the diesel world. Looks pretty similar- www.bigmachineparts.com/collections/peterbilt/products/cumming-egr-valve-2881762nx

@Alteris85 4 года назад

I want one of those electronic internal wastegates. Just can't find where to get them at.

@hpa101 4 года назад

They're not available just yet, but will be next year. Make sure you are signed up to Turbosmarts updates or at least their FB page, or simply just check in on their website from time to time - Taz.

@romibuilt4boost 4 года назад

i waited a long for this

@deadonarrivalparanormal981 3 года назад

So I can buy one of these and fix my p256 3 code?

@taicr80 4 года назад

Andre, do you have any info on the e-IWG version at all?

@hpa101 4 года назад

Hey Tai, what specifically are you after info wise on the eIWG? I'll check for you once Andre is back from PRI - Taz.

@taicr80 4 года назад

@@hpa101 Thanks for the reply Taz, I guess the same info that has been mentioned about the others. Back pressure limit, current limit, water cooling, etc. And if it will be released with the others or at a later point. The EFR's with the large internal gates suffer badly from exhaust back pressure, so very keen to run one 👍

@Alteris85 4 года назад

I'm wondering the same things

@skylinefever 4 года назад

I also think about this, as many people may be better off using a stock frame turbo, a stock frame turbo with different wheels fitted, or a different turbo that lines up with the stock plumbing.

@lkinchen101 4 года назад

Can I order one for my car. I have a scion tc 2006. How and where can I order the setup for my car?

@SimRacerTum 4 года назад

this is dope

@69BETSY69 2 года назад

Hi, Is there an Electronic WG available for an internally gated EFR7163?

@hpa101 2 года назад

Not sure sorry, we don't sell any hardware so you'd be best to reach out directly to Turbosmart or your local supplier :) _ Taz.

@dreednlb Год назад

As far as I've been able to find, the e-IWG shown at 0:23 never actually came to market. 😥

@spooler7828 4 года назад

Much better boost by gear or boost by speed tuning capabilities.

@darcy4744 4 года назад

Any idea on target temps for the Electronic wastegate? Is the lack of air from the boost reference gonna be a factor?

@johnnason7019 4 года назад

He didn't mention it in the video, but the actuator on the butterfly valve had coolant ports on the housing, it even had a little coolant icon.

@darcy4744 4 года назад

@@johnnason7019 Yes I am aware of that, Hence why I was curious regarding target temps. Wondering how taxing it will be on the cooling system

@brianbob7514 4 года назад

Great video

@hpa101 4 года назад

Cheers Brian, glad you enjoyed it - Taz.

@brianbob7514 4 года назад

@@hpa101 Do you think these will take off? They sound like they could be potentially easier to program and more accurate as soon as they can be integrated into ECU's .

@marcusmoore8927 4 года назад

Will this be available in the USA soon?

@hpa101 4 года назад

Unsure sorry Marcus, if you ask Turbosmart directly they might have a bit of a planned timeline - Taz.

@justa_dude 4 года назад

I love it

@e34boat88 4 года назад

solid state relay between the 20 amp unit would be easiest and cheapest way to run it on any ecu

@sparky173j 4 года назад

You need 4 drivers to produce a H bridge. You also need to have a blanking period between the high and low side switch, which isn't so easy DIY. The encoder position sensor isn't common in aftermarket automotive, so not many aftermarket ECUs support that.

@shaynegadsden 4 года назад

@@sparky173j they explained that the feedback encoder is common basically the same as the feedback used for drive-by-wire throttle bodies which most modern aftermarket ecu's

@unionse7en 4 года назад

It's cool , in some ways not as elegant as using "free" dead-ended boost pressure as the control FORCE. 10-20 amps of electrical power of extra load that ultimately is being taken from the crankshaft and not going to the drive wheels. So only use an electrically POWERED 'gate if you can't get the control one requires by pneumatic methods.

@otm646 3 года назад

At max current it's going to consume 240 watts. Add in some alternator inefficiency and you are no more than 1/2 of a horsepower. You will never be able to detect that on your runs. In fact the weight you save by not going to a CO2 driven system, with a CO2 bottle, probably negates any horsepower loss charging system. An extraordinarily high performance car is 2 lbs per horsepower. A CO2 driven system is about 4 or 5 lbs.

@YZFoFittie 4 года назад

Looks like any other exhaust cutout?

@hpa101 4 года назад

Fire as a link. - Ben

@sexyfacenation 4 года назад

But it doesn't

@YZFoFittie 4 года назад

@@sexyfacenation yes it does... lol

@ham003latechedu 4 года назад

Hurry with the electronic blow off valve

@ashteregg2133 4 года назад

seems to me like this will require lot of maintenance and jamming after carbon build-up

@sexyfacenation 4 года назад

Perhaps, but hardly an issue for intended market. It's not going to be on daily drives

@jimbrown563 4 года назад

Why are you talking about the ECU providing the raw electrical power for the Actuator Motor ???? The Actuator Motor should be connected to a ~20 amp fuse, which is connected directly to the Alternator/Battery System, through a relay controlled by the Ignition switch. With the ECU simply providing a very low current, 5 volt, PWM control signal, to the Actuator Motor Controller circuitry.

@shaynegadsden 4 года назад

Because it doesn't work like that, the unit is only a servo and encoder so it requires an external driver and provides feedback some tech's may be able to do this directly just like controlling a drive-by-wire throttle body and others will need an external h-bridge to control it

@jimbrown563 4 года назад

@@shaynegadsden Ok, got it, The controller is not built-in because of the high temps expected around the valve, the motor can take it, but common semiconductors start dying at around ~200F , and it's not uncommon for under-hood temps to exceed that, and high-temp semiconductors can get expensive real quick. Also, they probably shouldn't call it an "H-Bridge", simply call it a Motor Controller, very few people actually know what an H-Bridge is, or how it works. And, I wouldn't want to depend on a generic H-Bridge Driver circuit for a high current motor, it needs it's own dedicated, stand-alone, controller, mounted anywhere but under the hood. These valves can pull 4X the current of an Electronic Throttle Body, that would mean a very specialized ECU to have a built-in, ~20-amp rated, H-Bridge, we're talking 4- 16ga. wires minimum, with 4- 14ga. wires preferred, for powering the Motor, then 2 more heavy wires to supply Battery power and ground, 6- fat wires total, too big for practicality on an already crowded ECU connector. The ECU should only need 3 or 4 small wires, to the Motor Controller, Valve Position-In, Motor Drive Out, and 5v+ and/or ground. .

@shaynegadsden 4 года назад

@@jimbrown563 The driver only outputs 2 wires and as for the current rating that 20A figure is it's max rated number and as they said they over built it to minimise the chance of falure from memory they said in most cases the current draw would be around 12A

@jimbrown563 4 года назад

@@shaynegadsden They overbuilt the motor. I case of a serious malfunction, the H-Bridge should be capable of the continuous handling of "Locked Rotor Amps" of the Motor. This is assuming that they are NOT using a "Stepper Motor", but just a straight "Brushed DC Permanent Magnet" Motor, either one can be made to work satisfactorily, but the Brushed Motor, when locked, can pull serious over-current, A Stepper Motor is virtually "Always On" and it's controller has built-in current limiting circuitry, so, you save 2 wires between the controller and Motor with a Brushed DC Motor, but have the potential for much heavier currents. The video was not clear on several pertinent points. If the Motor only has 2 wires as you say, it's not a Stepper Motor, so the controller either has to be built for "Locked Rotor Amps", or have current limiting circuitry built-in, NOT something any ECU mfr. is going to provide internally. It sounds like they found a nice motor they could bolt to their valve, but haven't really figured out how they're going to control it yet.

@joshlewis5065 4 года назад

Back drive issues? Really? Use a damn Worm Gear. How is that so hard

@4G12 4 года назад

Worm Gears need to be built and mounted strong to avoid breakage and tooth skipping. They're also slow to react and suffer from relatively excessive friction.

@hobby_dude_ Год назад

just build the controlller into your electronics and give me CAN control :)

@thunderbirdizations 4 года назад

7:44 what is she doing xD

@chriskelvin248 4 года назад

It would appear that she has him on a very-very short leash

@neomeg2232 4 года назад

Keeping hold of that wallet lol

@thunderbirdizations 4 года назад

Neo Meg omg ❤️😂

@JH-jo9wt 4 года назад

Awesome work Andre - get some sleep bud you sound crook

@hpa101 4 года назад

He's had a big year! We don't want to teach him bad habits though.... #whipcrack - Taz 😅(P.S. Andre will take a well deserved break over Christmas ☀️🏖🍺🏎 )

@km6832 3 года назад

So basically a solenoid...

@Travelcheap19 4 года назад

WOOOOW...the TSI engine has this since '05

@hpa101 4 года назад

Have a watch. This is the first topic covered =) - Taz

@ibstar82portage94 4 года назад

Well if ain’t broke don’t fix it, one more problem🤦🏾🤦🏾 to worry bout

@hpa101 4 года назад

Where do you draw the line? Unless you're walking naked and barefoot everywhere then you're using something that could be viewed as a potential problem rather than a solution to be fair =P - Taz.

@ibstar82portage94 4 года назад

High Performance Academy a turbos a fucking turbo if ain’t broke don’t fix og

@BillB8 4 года назад

thanks, i hate it

@hpa101 4 года назад

Interesting. What specifically do you hate about electronic boost control? - Taz.

@BillB8 4 года назад

@@hpa101 seems completely unnecessary in 99% of applications. I could see how it may help with launch control instead of c02 on huge power applications but again that's like 1% of cars.

@hpa101 4 года назад

@@BillB8 this product is designed for the 1% :) Not going to be useful to most. - Ben

@timcasiglia2064 4 года назад

@@BillB8think more creatively. There are a lot of applications for this. Alot. I personally want it for ramping boost down at higher rpms on a unbuilt motor. But this is going to be great for those switching between street and strip application. Remember u can only get less than1 bar greater than your spring pressure with a controller. U could have a valet mode with no boost or limit to very low for shake down or economy. More accurate speed or gear dependent boost.

@muntz0r 4 года назад

You silly billy

@rjl110919581 4 года назад

bullshit there help service on isuzu turbo which have a electronic waste

@hpa101 4 года назад

I recommend you watch the video before commenting. This is covered in it and also in the first line of the description. You don't get all the facts from just a title nor should you try. Hope you enjoy it =) - Taz.

@StabyMcStabsFace 4 года назад

But why? I can't really think of a use for this.

@TheEsseboy 4 года назад

So you can adjust boost faster and with more precission, improves tunability and will make the turbo feel less spiky and easier to handle because it adjusts the boost so fast to avoid spikes and dips.

@sexyfacenation 4 года назад

It's not for you then!

@mrctuned2844 4 года назад

On a drag car with a huge power output, we struggle to find a spring that let's us leave the line with low enough boost to control wheelspin, yet enough boost to make the power we need. This product is absolutely perfect for us who need more boost range than a conventional spring setup would allow.