Because you're forgetting , that banner made a promise to the supreme about the infinity stones being returned. Steve fulfilled that promise, and had access to the supreme and the time infinity stone. Same magic as doctor strange using the stone.
@@Chavanun555 in endgame they said that time travel works differently. everything that changes in the past just brings an alternative timeline but doesn't change the future
@@aprid8503 i get that so what suppose to happend is since Thanos left 2014 then from that point there is an alternate version of of 2014 with no Thanos so that timeline would had no Infinity War. Is this correct? Also in the Looper vid they confirm that Cap married Peggy and just waited to meet Buggy again. Wtf is that? Doesnt that mean he would have created an alternate timeline and not the one we are watching?
When Steve went back in time to be with Peggy, he created another alternative reality, and its different from the one where Peggy falls in love with Daniel Sousa and has children with him.....it’s different. Edit: I just realized...if Steve is the father of Peggy’s children, then Steve would’ve been Sharon’s uncle, meaning Sharon would have known Steve as her uncle growing up. That would make it weird since they kissed in Civil War.
Diamondgolem225 Maybe the Time-Space GPS that Tony created could only travel through time in the time line it was created... Ex: Tony, Steve, Bruce, and Scott went to 2012 and messed that one up (they lost the tesseract, thus creating another alt. reality where the tesseract never made it back to Asgard) and they were still able to go back to 2023, in their own alternate reality, where they did not mess it up. Thats probably how Steve was able to go back to 2023 to give Sam the shield, even though he created another alt. reality with Peggy......
When Steve went back in time to be with Peggy, he created another alternative reality, and its different from the one where Peggy falls in love with Daniel Sousa and has children with him.....it’s different. -> I do not think so. Agent Carter was on the main timeline after Cap was iced. 2014 - Winter Soldier, we saw the photos of Peggy and 2 kids, how about her husband, why was it secret when her husband was Sousa ? Writers confirmed those kids are of Steve. That means Steve back to 1945 on the main timeline. He married Peggy and they had 2 kids, because of Steve's role so Peggy had to hide the person she married. But I confused, Steve back (1945) , the time of Agent Carter was from 1947 to 1952 and Peggy had a relationship with Daniel Sousa. Many problems.......
Summer Tyme the directors have their opinions, but the screen writers and Kevin Feige himself say Cap was always the father of Peggy's children and he was suppose to go back in time. Russo's thought different, but Feige is the overall vision of the MCU.
martyc909 : The director’s make the film. The screenwriters don’t. And the film says Cap is living in an alternate timeline. The screenwriters have acknowledged that, because they *cannot explain the film* EndGame in terms of what they wanted to happen in Winter Solider.
GrobanWorld News yeah that would make sense but then the kids they had together, would’ve been left in the alt timeline, because the kids in the main timeline aren’t his so 🤷♀️
i think that was an alt timeline where they didn’t have kids and the timeline where civil war and wintersoilder and the so tore mcu takes place that’s where he lived with peggy and had kids
But it doesn’t see sender how old cap shows up and reveals that he’s been there the whole time. It implies that he didn’t create a timeline and stayed in the regular one.
Makes zero sense. He created another timeline when he went back to Peggy, so he's the father of her kids in that alternate timeline. Sousa has to be the father/husband in the main MCU timeline. The writers either have no idea what they're doing with these plot holes, or are just really lazy right now. Edit: AOS confirmed that Sousa is NOT the father. But my opinion still stands, I still think Steve got with Peggy in another timeline.
Shanata Sukhu It’s an Ego trip. the writers didn’t create Sousa and so are happy to ignore him. They started with the fantasy that they would use Back2theFuture B$ to make Cap always be Peggy’s guy. But when they tried to use B2TF in Infinity War the result was nonsense. Feige hired physicists to help with the time-logic. Here is exactly what the physicists said: “Back to the Future is Bullshit.” You can’t go back to live in your own past. (Grandfather paradox). And you can’t go back to ‘loop’ your past (predestination paradox). This means Cap is living in an alternate timeline. Period. The writers can’t argue this, and can’t refute it. Whether they can *accept* it or not, is purely a function of their egos.
Summer Tyme Just check the newest episode of Agents of shield that will most likely make sense on how in main timeline ,, Steve is married to Peggy and has her kids .
@@lemonade_011 that is because Kevin F. now owns the tv shows too. Now he is trying to keep the storyline of both mcu and aos together(merged together) and not separate (mention of Bruce banner, project insight) and is ignoring what happened in agent Carter.
Ha? And what do you know about alternate timelines and different realities that these writers don’t. If their movie was going to make sense, they had to know what they were doing, and they freaking did. So, in other words, I doubt you know more about this then the writers do.
Russos said that Steve was NOT a father of Peggy's children and I agree with them, cause it makes sense. I just watched Endgame again, and Hulk said clearly "Changing the past doesn't change the future" so Steve going back to 40's to live his live with Carter doesn't change what happened in MCU, it just creates another timeline, which don't affect original timeline. So, screenwriters are just breaking rules that they made by themselves in this movie.
@@NicholasThyDank69420 The time travel makes fine sense if they stick to the premise that time travel creates divergent timelines by default. The end scene with Cap putting the stones back had nothing to do with their own timeline and everything to do with maintaining balance in those altered timelines and thus keep the multiverse stable. The only way it makes sense for Cap to have always been the father of Peggy's kids would be if a Cap from yet another earth had traveled back in the same way that this one did, thus this timeline was ALWAYS impacted by time travel in some way, just not by the time travel we saw.
Or the Marvel Cinematic Universe took place in the branched reality created by Cap staying with Peggy from the beginning. We just didn't find out until the end. If a branched reality would have been created by him staying with her then that's the reality all these movies took place in. We just didn't know there was another Cap there. Why was there no picture of her husband. Because as Doctor Strange said to Tony.. It won't happen if I tell you. Old Cap had to keep quiet about it to be sure the same events took place the same way.
@@DrFranklynAnderson Marvel's time travel paradigm doesn't support closed loops, though. The only way that Cap is the father of Peggy's kids is if this entire branch has always been one where Cap had traveled back to the past from some nigh identical present that was also affected by a version of him traveling to the past. There's no room for Bootstrap paradoxes here.
When Steve went back in time to be with Peggy, he created another alternative reality, and its different from the one where Peggy falls in love with Daniel Sousa and has children with him.....it’s different. -> I do not think so. Agent Carter was on the main timeline after Cap was iced. 2014 - Winter Soldier, we saw the photos of Peggy and 2 kids, how about her husband, why was it secret when her husband was Sousa ? Writers confirmed those kids are of Steve. That means Steve back to 1945 on the main timeline. He married Peggy and they had 2 kids, because of Steve's role so Peggy had to hide the person she married. But I confused, Steve back (1945) , the time of Agent Carter was from 1947 to 1952 and Peggy had a relationship with Daniel Sousa. Many problems.......
It could just be that Steve returned to a point in the past AFTER that relationship. The more important thing is that Sharon was perving after her uncle.
Tony Stark did say "If you mess with time, it tends to mess back." Everyone involved in Endgame should have been on the same page so they don't keep spewing their own theories and confusing the fans. 🤦
@@abdizzll Not really, since the Russo brothers have confirmed that Cap went and lived out his life in an alternate timeline. And directors > the writers when it comes to telling the story.
@@mieroth It makes more sense for the story though... the point of Steve going back to return the stones was to prevent new timelines from happening, he wouldn't do something that would create a new one.
I think Steve was already in the past and lived his life and the photos were taken to cover up for present Steve so he wouldn’t find out. That’s why he was already sitting on the side waiting to be noticed after present Steve went to return the stones. Notice he never came back through the portal he was already there.
@@shivanieramoutar4711 that is simply not possible. As HYDRA was active all the time. And Peggy didn't retire and left everything to live a secret life. She founded SHIELD and was active all the time. Anyone like Howard Stark would have noticed. Most importantly HYDRA. Moreover, in CA: Winter soldier, she was crying remembering that she never get to live a life with Steve. He definitely created a new timeline
Augustus McGovern yes we do, and it’s not low. What’s makes y’all so right? Well, if not messing around with a family member is wrong, then I would surly hate to be riiight.
Allow me to interrupt my friend you know they never showed his picture in those pictures on her desk so Peggy knew she was just protecting the timeline that's why his picture we're since it out of her photos once she found Steve then came back he explained everything to her he also explained about timeline integrity and trust me Peggy will keep a secret
charles neely but what about there children? They most definitely knew Steve Rodgers was there dad. It’s hard to believe they never told anyone or even recognized that hey my dad looks like Captain America
FastTurtle115 it’s like that for all marvel movies when the digital copy cons out it’s usually on The Internet in hD Like A Day Sometimes Two days before but always a day never on the day it’s released it was like that for cap marvel spider verse and pretty sure far from him will follow
It doesn't break the rules if Endgame was *already* an alternate timeline created by alternate Avengers and Peggy's children sired by an alternate Steve.
Nothing has been contradicted because the time travel rules haven't been broken. The time travel rules would only be broken if Steve Rogers did anything else other than to live his life with Peggy when he returned to the past. Did it ever occur to you that Steve Rogers was always meant to end up in the past to be with Peggy in the first place? If such a thing is the case then nothing would be altered in the first place because it was all destined to happen.
My own conslusion to the whole "being with Peggy in the same timeline" is that because he returned the stone to the same timeline, he made up for those lost 25 years pretty quick and started a family. living in obscurity while she lived the life of a S.H.I.E.L.D agent. Also a decent explanation as to why there were no other photos on her desk when he and Stark went back to 1970. No married woman would have a photo of a man long dead instead of her husband..unless it was her husband Also, a theoretical explanation of time travel is that "what will happen has already happened" and by that I mean, whatever will be will be and has already been...therefore, Peggy's children, infinity, endgame...all lead to Rogers travelling back to place the stone back there in 1970 and then to reconnect with Peggy and live his life in obscurity that has already happened..further evidence is that her husband has never been seen or in the spotlight. Working for shield I believe this was doable. Peace
Makes no sense. The Ancient One confirmed to Banner than their time traveling creates alternate timelines, and that removing the stones creates gigantic divergences in the timeline. Versus the small ones from them just being there. The only thing that makes sense is that Steve stayed in an alternate timeline.
What if returning the time stone and seeing the Ancient One was the first thing Steve did? The Ancient One could then have helped him in returning the other stones (in the form they were in at the time they were retrieved) and finally used the time stone to send Steve to Peggy.
The Cap who got frozen in ice stayed frozen and the cap from future married peggy carter. The only thing is the future cap had to stay hidden despite he knew eveything that'll happen. The husband of peggy steve grew old and showed up at the end of endgame where he gave falcon the shield and at the same time the young cap went back to time to marry peggy. That creates a perfect loop of events. Why cant you see that.
ISHAQUE MIA that not how it’s works based on what we see in the movie. Past Thanos literally dies but it doesn’t cause the events of infinity war to changed because it is a alternative timeline Thanos. Steve spent time with an alternative timeline Peggy, not the same Peggy we saw grow old and die. They can go into “their pass” but that immediately creates an alternative timeline which means it can not be the original meaning Steve can not be the father.
@@ishaquemia121 Except that Hulk says ON SCREEN that the timeloop version of time travel is not how it works in the MCU Universe. Time is unmovably lineal.
But if Steve is the father of Peggy's kids, how was he able to travel to the past of the prime MCU time line and didn't create an alternate one? EDIT : THANK YOU FOR 125 LIKES!
It makes absolutely no sense you can't break your own rules...also the Daniel Souza does not deserve to be disrespected like this. Steve and Peggy being together is a different timeline
Don’t worry Daniel was plugged in at a time by the agents of shield team and fell in love with Daisy Johnson a.k.a. Quake. Look up Dousy, they’re quite adorable
The writers and russos can't agree on cap's backstory but i think the russos made more sense peggy's main timeline kids don't exist in the alternate timeline cap and peggy had their own kids
Serene voice: "It was always their intention that Rogers was the father of Peggy's children :)" *video shows Steve beating the shit out of Hydra agents in an elevator*
@@yungsantiii Nope. Agents of Shield confirmed that was not the case for sure. Sousa was supposed to die, however he was saved and fell in love with Daisy Johnson/Quake.
The time loop of this whole MCU is unbreakable for now... Peggy always had kids, Rogers always went back in time to be their father, Stark somehow created himself by talking to his own dad and giving him his most famous quote and the Mobius time strip will forever be unbreakable till Phase 5 when the Fantastic Four figure out a way to traverse the multiverse and time travel backwards and forwards hence Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness alongside Loki's shenanigans across the multiverse. Just my theory so far. :)
digitalentity90 Totally agree. Had the same thoughts myself too (except the Tony creating himself part. Need help on that one). I really think Marvel set up their Reboot in Endgame which will occur obviously after Phase 4.
I respectfully disagree. I believe these time jumps were both backwards and adjacent to alternate, ever so slightly different timelines as to not affect the original timeline the Avengers are travelling from. Therefore, I believe the kids Peggy has in the prime timeline aren't Steve's. But when he goes to the 40s to live the life he never could, then he does have kids with Peggy. What I like most about this theory is that it could be an open door for the MCU's version of the Ultimate universe. Not 1610 per se, but a take on that idea within the context of the MCU.
@@spideralexandre2099 I like your theory waaaaay better than what I've been hearing/watching. I hate time travel movies that have never ending loops and chicken before the egg story lines.
I wish the collective of people who created Endgame could keep things straight. Because we’ve been told that Steve lived out his life in alternate timeline. Now he didn’t? Oh Marvel you’re making this messy each time someone who made these movies clarifies something.
I always believed in my theory, that there was always two Caps, the one leaving to a alternate Timeline forever to live with Peggy and the Old one who came from a Alternate Timeline living a secret life with Peggy all along.
@@brucedoyle4055 Or there are two caps, the young one who is in the ice or just come out of the ice, and the old one that travelled back in time to live a life with Peggy in the same universe.
He was one of the 150 men.. and he did save himself technically. Plus Agent Carter was a spy, how better to keep Cap's secret than to tell a statement that is both true and yet not specific.
@@aikaterinechase9106 Yeah a misdirect, Souza also would have known about Cap.. pretty sure he was the old guy taking care of Peggy when Cap first goes to visit her after he wakes up. It's a shame Agent Carter ended.. would have made this whole thing easier to explain to most people, the tie in was really easy to figure out. Souza as a will they, but never will was the best choice.. shows rarely end well when the tension ends. That was what really killed Castle and a few dozen other dramas with similar setups.
If Peggy told him then that might have changed the past when he time traveled. He might have tried to get her pregnant thinking it was supposed to happen inadvertently causing the kids to be born at a different time effectively creating different kids. Peggy could’ve lied to preserve the timeline she knew.
@@TechRefreshed1000 damage what timeline? Dont you remember the "flawless" Philosophy of time travel in endgame??? You make branch timelines whenever you change something. That makes 0 sense whatsoever
@@SparrowValentine No different timelines won't be created whenever u change something, that's how branched timelines work in general but Endgame has both Self-contained & branched type Time travel, to branch into new timeline there is something big should happen like removing stones from Original timeline, that's why younger Gamora & older Nebula is alive 'cause they don't influence each other as they are from different realities... Cap lived out his life secretly to avoid unnecessary conflicts in Timeline & grown older which is Self-contained time travel as he kept the stones at their places & earased branched reality, it should go exactly as it supposed, to be where he's right now.... Unless they have some other retcon to make us think otherwise...
To those who don't understand how filmmaking works and think the screen writers are the last word... Remember the writers had Captain America living with Sharon Carter at the beginning of infinity War. But Kevin Feige and the Russo brothers took that out of the film. 😊
This completely contradicts a statement in winter soldier where peggy goes on to say in a pre-recorded message that steve saved the man who would eventually become her husband, not to mention alzheimers does not work like that at all
Also, as bruce banner has said, thats not how time travel works. what most likely happened is that after steve was satisfied with his life in the alternative timeline, he went back to his original timeline. even then though, its confusing because steve didnt come back the way he went in. this ending has a lot of plotholes and i just think they didnt think it through.
Am I the only one who is absolutely in love with the idea of Steve and Peggy finally living the life they deserved... but still, low-key, wants Peggy and Daniel Sousa (from the Agent Carter series) to still be a thing?
Are we going to ignore the fact that they actually said themselves “it creates a time travel loophole”? It’s a nice thought but the loopholes and inconsistencies
They broke up prior to Steve returning in 1949. Their jobs were more important. This was confirmed by Daniel himself in Agents of Shield. Daniel was supposed to die in 1955, however he was saved and traveled through time to the future where he fell in love with Daisy Johnson/Quake and is on space mission with her. Watch Agents of Shield season 7. It ties up a lot of Agent Carter loose ends.
Chris Marcus, one of the screen writers started this entire controversy. Here is what he said: Marcus: “We are not experts on time travel, but the Ancient One specifically states that when you take an Infinity Stone out of a timeline it creates a new timeline.” ⬆️ Sure Chris, you wrote that, so you would know. Here’s the part you didn’t write and are tying to ignore..... BRUCE BANNER: *Think about it: If you travel to the past, that past becomes your future. And your former present becomes the past. Which can't now be changed by your new future...* ⬆️ This is the film’s explanation of how *time* and multiverse time travel works. It is the *only* explanation in the film. It does apply to Infinity stones as the ancient ones says.... it applies to everything. Marcus wants to pretend it applies only to Infinity stones, but that’s completely idiotic and here is why: ➡️ You travel back to the past, to the eve of the American Civil War. You take - not a stone - but Abraham Lincoln to the future. Now Marcus would have us believe that this takes place in the main time line. Fine..... The result of this per Chris Marcus is as follows: A) Abraham Lincoln is now alive in 2019 somehow. B) Abraham Lincoln disappeared from the the past, somehow. C) The Civil War - as we know it, never happened, somehow. By changing the past - you’ve changed the future. That may be fine with Marcus - but the film literally states that this is impossible so apparently Marcus isn’t paying attention to the parts of the film he didn’t write. The actual results per Professor Hulk, per the filmmakers, and per the film itself would be as follows. A) All events occurring in the past occur in an alternate timeline - this is the precise meaning of *if you go back to the past you create a new future.* New future = alternate timeline. B) If you take Abraham Lincoln from the past - > He is from an alternate timeline, alternate reality, branch timeline....all these terms have the *same exact meaning.* C) All events from the main timeline are unaffected, Abraham Lincoln from our timeline would still be dead, history is unchanged. This is multiverse time travel and the entire film is based upon this. Refuse to accept this and the entire film structure falls apart which is why the filmmakers are not having any of Christopher Marcus’ bullshix.
in the winter soldier, peggy said “cap saved the man whom later on became my husband” which is the reality then in endgame, cap travelled back in time and live his life with peggy, it becomes the future of that present not changing the past that peggy married to a man and have 2 children, it’s confusing but try watch endgame again and listen to hulk’s explanation. in the comics james rogers is actually cap and nat’s son, his parents were killed by ultron then james wanted to revenge his parents then fight ultron along with other avengers kids.
The Cap who got frozen in ice stayed frozen and the cap from future married peggy carter. The only thing is the future cap had to stay hidden despite he knew eveything that'll happen. The husband of peggy steve grew old and showed up at the end of endgame where he gave falcon the shield and at the same time the young cap went back to time to marry peggy. That creates a perfect loop of events. Why cant you see that. even Russow's confirmed this theory
A couple of things. The interview of Peggy, we saw, was dated in 1953. So Steve and Peggy's children would be in their 60's today. So any lineage for super soldiers would have to be Steve's grandchildren. We also don't know if the super soldier abilities, pass on to multiple generations of family members. The grandchildren could be heroes just based on the human genes that Peggy and Steve passed down in their family lineage. They were both exceptional individuals, without any special serum.
"My only regret is that you didnt get to live yours." When I saw endgame. It made sense to me he went back in time and got with her. But as everyone knew he was dead. He couldnt go back as Captain America. So I'm pretty sure he hid his real identity and a lot of his physical features to be with peggy. Hence. Never really living his life as Captain America. Then probably around the time the young captain comes out of hibernation, he returns to his timeline as the old captain america. Also to everyone clamoring about how he went for his niece. The young captain doesnt know shes related. He cant see the future hence doesnt know he eventually goes back in time.
@@caity_strophic I'm saying he couldn't go back as captain America. To everyone there, Cap flew that bomber Into the ice and is stuck/dead there. Cap wanted to be with Peggy and live a normal life but if everyone knew he survived/came back. He'd feel obligated to live up to being Captain America and couldn't spend actual time with Peggy.
Why are they contradicting themselves even though Endgame clearly states that when you go back in time no many what it creates another timeline just like DBZ?
Well Steve and Sharon aren’t blood related. Also, I don’t think Sharon and Peggy are blood related either because Peggy has no siblings (who lived to have kids), no cousins with the name Carter, so we actually have no idea how Sharon exists to be her niece, she just is somehow
The Cap who got frozen in ice stayed frozen and the cap from future married peggy carter. The only thing is the future cap had to stay hidden despite he knew eveything that'll happen. The husband of peggy steve grew old and showed up at the end of endgame where he gave falcon the shield and at the same time the young cap went back to time to marry peggy. That creates a perfect loop of events. Why cant you see that. even Russow's confirmed this theory.
@@ishaquemia121 The Russos don't agree with the screenwriters on this one, actually. By the logic of the movie, there are no time loops so Cap can't be the father in the main timeline. Cap lived his life out in an alternate timeline and used his quantum GPS to return to our timeline.
@@BillH2949 For that last point, if he used the device to get back to the original timeline, he shouldve appeared on the platform instead of randomly being on the bench that somehow no one saw before hand.
@@beepbooprandomcommenter2214 old steve lived with peggy from main timeline,that's why he appears at the bench,he went back in time and lived his life with her.
So, they now accidentally confirmed that MCU main timeline that we've been followed through years is actually a part of alternate timeline that Cap was created
The screenwriters and the directors are split on this. The screenwriters want Cap to be the father of Peggy’s kids but the directors realize that if that were true, it would break the logic of the movie’s time travel.
I haven't seen the tv series with Peggy Carter, but the movies NEVER mention the name of her husband, and in Endgame, the picture of Steve on her desk is his "before" shot, taken in boot camp. That picture made me think that Steve was, in fact, her husband - once the mechanics of time travel had been worked out.
"Changing the past doesnt affect the future" and yet somehow going back in time caused 2 captain americas according to them. I dont care what the writers say. The directors say otherwise and until kevin feigi says it then I wont believe it
TheRealCSD i believe it possible So there are multiple timelines, MCU is one of them and when a steve travel back in time, he joins into a random timeline to met peggy, and that random timeline could be our timeline and then the story keep moving on so the random timeline steve could travel in time and do the same thing to another timeline
Ridiculous! How could that be? From what we saw in Endgame, time travel to the past in the MCU doesn't change anything in the current timeline, but creates a new one. So when Cap goes in the past and lives his life with Peggy, that is in another timeline. In this timeline, Cap is not the father of Peggy's children. It cant be!! unless the writers breaks the very rule they created. It wont be a loophole, but a complete breakdown of their system.
@@digitalg00dtimes58 Couldn't have been. The only way that is possible is if cap knew about time travel before the time of him and Peggy, and planned to come back to that even before his plane crash and all. Which he didn't. So no, that isn't possible when he didn't know any such thing was even a remote possibility in the futurrm
I'm not saying that he planned it. Just that he was destined "somehow" to find himself back in his own time to complete the the time paradox. But really the writers just managed to find a way to make it work.
"Did they somehow have an idea that time travel would come into play in the MCU years down the road?" -- Apparently written by someone who does not read comics
For those of you trying to understand how Steve was able to live his life in the past without causing a timeline split, read my slightly BIG explanation down below: The way how I see it, time-travel itself doesn’t cause a time-split right away. In order for that to happen something major must be changed, like Thanos coming to the future and being killed or Loki taking the Tesseract during the botched stone heist. However, as explained by Banner, if someone were to say “take the Infinity stones and then return them the second they were taken”, then the timeline would be preserved. Meaning that in order for the timeline to continue, nothing major could be changed. That is how Steve was able to live a life with Peggy and stay in the main timeline. In fact, I believe that time itself accepted this as a paradox, meaning that predestination is real and that any changes just result in new universes. The price for Steve getting to marry the love of his life meant allowing future events to happen as they would
You missed the most important loop hole.... While it explains why old man Cap wasn't in the time machine when he "came back", this actually means that the reality we've been following isn't the original, since old man Cap already went through all of this and decided to retire in this, our Marvel Universe, reality
No...no. He returned to the original timeline. How? He must’ve aquired Pym Particles from that alternate timeline that he created. Was it ever established in the film that they HAD to return on the pad that they used to time travel with? Him returning on the bench was simply done for dramatic effect
Old news and has been debunked by the directors. While the idea sounds sweet and romantic, it doesn’t follow the time travel rules that the writers themselves created for the film. Otherwise they could have killed baby Thanos, etc. Cap lived with Peggy in another timeline. Now if we want to argue there are multiple timelines/realities where Cap goes back in time to be with Peggy then he could be the father of her kids in this timeline, but it still wouldn’t be our Cap.
Agree, except for that last part. It would still be our Steve in the alternate timeline that was shown at the end of Endgame. He can't go back and change things in the main timeline.
@@SS-mk2yp ...mainly it wouldn't be our "old Peggy". If... Caps went back in time, into the timeline where they already messed around to fetch the stones (and e.g. let Loki loose), he could there keep hopping through that timeline until he dances with Peggy... they do the doodle-woodle, have children if they want to. But that would still all be the alternate timeline. He could be a hero and all (e.g. saving that version of Bucky from Hydra), grow old until that timeline's Tony Stark is an adult and tell him about the time-travelling device, help him figure out the mobius thingy (if he was told and by then recalls any of it) and tell him about alternative timelines, so Tony (or even his father if the old man is not assasinated by Bucky!) can figure out how to manipulate the device to send old Cap to our universe (when his Peggy passed away, obviously) so he could tell the others everything was good and hand over his shield. That wouldn't change the fatherhood in our main timeline, tho. ...but I gotta admit, I always hoped there was a reason why we never got to see Peggy's husband in these pictures ^^;; With the established time-travel rules, it simply wouldn't make sense to be a time-travelling Caps, tho... :'(
@@thekueken yes, its wouldnt be the old version of Peggy that we say in TWS (maybe even Ant Man? Who knows) but she would still be the same Peggy from Agent Carter...with the exception that she won't end up with Daniel Sousa, as it was implied in the show.
@@SS-mk2yp Yeah, Agent Carter Peggy would very likely be the common root for both older Peggys... (I think someone mentioned some car or something in front of the house they danced in gave the scene a timestamp, which would set it with certainty after the events of Agent Carter.)
The Cap who got frozen in ice stayed frozen and the cap from future married peggy carter. The only thing is the future cap had to stay hidden despite he knew eveything that'll happen. The husband of peggy steve grew old and showed up at the end of endgame where he gave falcon the shield and at the same time the young cap went back to time to marry peggy. That creates a perfect loop of events. Why cant you see that. even Russow's confirmed this theory
The father was always Steve. That’s how him staying in the past didn’t change things Think of Banner’s description of time travel...how if you travel back the past becomes your future. Steve travelled back because he always travelled back. He didn’t replace anyone, because there was no one to replace. His timeline just went 40s - 21st century - 50s And he knew he had to stay out of the way - being found out WOULD have changed things (unless, say, Howard knew all along). Fortunately by 2012 and the Battle of New York, it’s safe to say he’d have been too old to help anyway
Sharon is from a timeline where Cap and Peggy didn't have kids together. They would've made a scene with Peggy telling Cap about their kids and Sharon in WS because they would've changed alot in the MCU, so he was in the clear in CW. Since he went back in time and changed 70 years of history this could've also resulted in Sharon never existing or she could be changed to their nephew
You people will believe anything. Steve is NOT Peggy's husband in WS. Steve is in an alternate timeline. If you guys can't accept this then you never will. Steve is NOT her husband in the main MCU timeline. They explain this in the movie.
What gets me is she's all like I've lived my life but you never got to live yours. If she did have her life and kids with him surely she would have said something in her hospital bed like you don't forget that
She was a spy her whole life and knew if she told him anything then it may not play out like it did (hence her kids never being born) so she had a very good reason not to say anything. Now there are plenty of other reasons this idea is shaky, but that's not one of them.
@@LeBronJames-StatPadderMan Oh i wasn't saying she would keep the secret because she was a spy, I was saying she would be good at keeping a secret because she was a spy. The reasoning would be because if Steve WAS her husband and the father of her children then telling him could affect that and therefore she wouldn't tell him so he would go through what he did to get back to them. Now I'm not saying this doesn't have issues, I outline plenty in some of my other posts, but I'm just saying that she would have a VERY good reason to not tell him at that time.
The thing is, even Markus and Mcfeely have different view from Russo brothers about time traveling. Although the movie offers new concept of time traveling with new alternative reality, Markus and Mcfeely still slipped the "Doraemon" or "Back to the Future" concept a bit. Please check their interview about old cap. You'll see the difference :)
While I don't fully back any ideas unless they are in movies or comics I do side with the writers on this theory. It's like a time loop instead of a new branch. Steve was always meant to survive and was always meant to stay in the past
I still honestly think the best way they could handle that is to have Susan and Johnny Storm of the Fantastic Four be Captain America and Peggy Carter's kids that would be an awesome tie-in for the MCU in my opinion and you could do a lot with that, it could also explain how two members of the Fantastic Four end up the way they do because they partially have super soldier in them
Oh please. Sousa was toxic in that he veiled his misogynistic tendencies really well. He never really trusted Peggy and believed the worst of her when his idea of her fell through. He’s what you would call a nice boy these days. And let me tell you that fuckboys are better in that they’re upfront about what they want and mean. Niceboys? They’ll hook you in before letting you down.
Doesn't matter why the screenwriters confirm; unlike the author of a book, they don't have final say. They can bemoan the fact all they want, the view of the director or directors is what sticks in the end, because *that's the movie that gets made.*
This contradicts though what the Russo Brothers have said. They said that Cap travelled to another timeline which ended up different because he married (a version of) Peggy. Now they wanna claim that Cap married Peggy even in the main timeline. Who do I believe now :-/?
Some time travel sci-fi theories say that even if you travel back in time you can’t really change the past anyway. You might make minor changes, but they just stand in place of something that already happened. The original event still occurs, but maybe with just a different person in its place. You definitely can’t change something to such an extent that it rewrites history. So if we’re going with that theory, then Steve taking the place of Peggy’s original husband isn’t that time altering. It’s not like they pick up and move to New Zealand and Peggy never helps create SHIELD. Peggy still has her kids (albeit different DNA) and her family tree is still intact. She still helps create and run SHIELD. The events from Agent Carter still take place. Steve going back in time creates a few small ripples, but not huge tsunamis that completely reshape the MCU’s history.
Makes me wonder, at any point, as Steve is making love to Peggy, does he say, "I can do this all day."? If so, I imagine Peggy would respond, "I certainly hope so."
Guys you have to think about this. I understand it. There was a time loop, which caused Peggy to live with Steve back then, and let Steve live in present day. This means that there were 2 Captain America’s. One living in his original time, and one living in the present. Because Endgame happened, that Captain America will always go back in time over and over again. He went back in time to a time period after the events of The First Avenger, so the other Captain America would then be frozen in ice So basically the Agent Carter show never existed after Endgame happened. Not just in that time period, but any time period
The problem with this is that it breaks their own rules that they established in the film. Steve going back in time would have created an alternate timeline, not affected his own. The only way around this is to say that in the main timeline, the old Steve at the end is Steve from an alternate timeline that traveled back in time at some point and created the main timeline that we know. But it can't be the exact same Steve that they sent back. There only explanation I see is that there are two timelines where Steve made the same choice.
They are Steve’s kids and have always been. Look at it this way, as Steve is sitting there at her side an older Steve is down the hall trying to avoid running into himself since he knows exactly when he visits Carter in the hospital that day. This “older Steve” has been there with Carter very slowly growing older with her and is witnessing the Avengers coming together as a group. He doesn’t show up until the lake scene where he passes on the shield to Falcon.
Yeah it would! But I read something else that said agent carter was a cliff hanger and said they were trying to make it about S.H.E.I.L.D and it didn't work out so they canceled the rest and made a cliff hanger for it. Sadly😔
This is a really dumb explanation. In endgame it is established that the past cannot be changed so the original children of Peggy could never be Cap’s. When he goes back in time he could create a new timeline where he has children but the children spoken of in Winter Soldier were not his based on the logic when Bruce explains time travel.
He has ALWAYS been the husband of Peggy Carter and father of her children. When Steve met with Peggy as she was on her death bed (in Winter Solider) she knew that he was an earlier version of Steve that had no idea what was going to happen in the past. So she spoke the dialog that the husband Steve told her she would say. Steve and Peggy knew that there could be no evidence of him being with her after he had supposedly died. Remember, Peggy was a master spy, so at this point in his life, Steve had no need to be in the public light. He could have grown a mustache or beard, colored his hair, etc. I got the impression from Peggy's life in SHIELD on the TV show she was probably tired of the spy life too, so they probably lived a quiet life away from all but a few close friends. I suspect they may not have ever told their children about who Steve really was.
