I'm German and lived in different parts of Germany and made holidays all around Germany. It was NEVER an issue to take left overs from the restaurant to home. BUT please don't call it doggy bag or Hundepaket. Just ask politely if they can wrap the left overs for you and they will do it for you.
I even know restaurants that have a roll of aluminium foil on every table, for exactly this purpose. ;-) It is commonly referred to as "Schwächelfolie" (roughly translates to "ailing foil"). So instead of being offended, we even laugh about it...
I was born in the mid-1970s, and in my experience, it was unusual to do so decades ago - say, the 1980s or so. Our 7th grade English textbook even explained the concept of doggie bags as an example of cultural differences between the US and Germany. However, taking home leftovers has long since become perfectly normal, and nobody bats an eye about it anywhere here.
2 года назад
@@berlinflight_tv I was born in the mid-1960s, and my experience is completely opposite to yours. I *know* we took leftovers, and it was never a problem. Well, not in the restaurants my family patronized.
Which, I mean... that's what I'd like with *most* topics. Just a pro-intellectual approach of most topics, interested in actually understanding a thing.
yeah, the war is usually discussed at length and in depth in school and abolutely not a taboo. However, don't expect germans to remain friendly if you decide its funny to call them nazies, even as a joke.
When hearing the word "doggy bag", I thought of the kind of plastic bag that is used to take up dog poo. If I were the owner of a restaurant, I would be offended as heck that you just compared my food with dog poo.
As an American I've literally never asked for a "doggy bag." I also think it sounds weird as hell and could certainly understand the confusion if I was to use it overseas.
@@fireskorpion396 don't remember. Well, charging for a bag is quiet common in germany. And the Restaurant has to buy the containment. It's rational, but stingy.
Up until 1 minute ago I would have definitely been very offended if someone had asked me for a Hundetüte. Mainly because I had no idea what a doggy bag is.
@@MartinBrenner Yup. Why pretend it's for your (nonexistent) dog? Although there is a - probably apocryphal - story of an American tourist asking for a doggy bag in an upmarket German restaurant....and being rather surprised when they opened the bag and found it full of juicy bones... ;)
That might be the hidden truth behind the tip. Don't ask to take it home for your dog, just tell them you want it for yourself. A lot of elderly or other people who can't eat large portions usually also bring their own Tupperware to the restaurants around here.
If you raise the subject of WW2 (or Third Reich) expect it to become a deep discussion about history and relation to current politics, possibly in YOUR country.
Concerning the war: I'm German and I never had problems discussing the war /3. Reich. Only in the UK (where I have been frequently in the 70s/80s in my 20s - YES I'm old!) I experienced quite often people greeting me with "Heil Hitler" or lifted their arm for the "Hitlergruß" and sometimes sang the first verse of the national anthem. I never gave a reason for that behavior except beein German. That kind of scared me then...
Das kann ich bestätigen. Aber bei mir war es wenn ich in Holland war. Da bin ich des öfteren mit erhobenem Arm begrüßt worden, von Fremden auf der Straße. Und es sind immer junge Leute.
I have been there in the 70ties for only 2 weeks as a boy. My hosts were very nice to me. Much more wealthy than my family. 😊 Only in Coventry , where we were regarded to be Dutch, because of our Northern accent... we did not tell everybody that we were German.😊 Well, maybe we were regarded to be Dutch in general. Nobody treated me like you were treated. An English girl really liked me mutch... till she knew how young I was. 😢
About being late: To me and most of my friends it matters where you meet. If you meet in public space I already find it quite annoying to wait 10 minutes. If youre meeting at someones home its not such a big deal, because having to wait for people at home is not that inconvenient.
It used to be a rule to show up to an invitation at someone's home rather fifteen minutes late than 5 minutes early. The idea being to give them time to get ready with whatever they were preparing for their guests.
Honestly, when being invited to someone's home, say, for a party or something, I find being late a few minutes to be considerate in case they have some last minute preparations to finish.
@@marccuypers9928 It's only when I invite people for an elaborate meal that has to be prepared - and eaten - a point, that I really hate when they're not 5 minutes early or punctual to the minute. Because then you sit at your table with a perfectly cooked meal and all the hassle to make it just so was for nought.
@@capslock9031 What I usually do in this case is meet for drinks first, then do the finishing touches to the meal (sear the steak, say, or cook up the risotto) with your guests present.
I agree on every single point. As two additions to the hand shaking issue: especially during the pandemic, it has become much more common not to shake hands. And in addition, you might just want to watch what your opposite is doing.
I remember an incident where TV host Stefan Raab met someone on-camera who clearly didn't like him. He extended his hand but the other guy ignored it on purpose, Raab then proceeded to leave his hand extended for the rest of the encounter.
The handshake discussion always quite irritates me. I'm as german as I could be, but at least in my region handshakes are usual for some formal buiseness meetings and between some men. In all other situations it's most often quite rude. Because in the end ein fester Händedruck is kind of a demonstration of power, isn't it? I don't demonstrate the strength in my hands to a girl I meet, or her mother. Or my mother. And so on....
Yes, the handshake thing has changed a lot within the last two years. IMHO pretty much the only positive thing to come out of the pandemic. ;-) Around here, it has been mostly replaced by a fist bump, even in more formal business environments. Even our general manager at work uses it when greeting employees.
I seem to remember when they aired the German translation of Fawlty Towers, they thought "Don't Mention the War" too sensitive, an d left the whole episode out - only to get annoyed letters from German viewers who wanted to know why their favourite episode was dropped...
I was thinking the same thing! After all, I always thought that "Don't mention the war!" did _not_ mean "Avoid acknowledging that the Second World War happened", but simply "Be sensitive about talking about it!". In other words, it's not _mentioning_ the war that they were warning against, but being _stuck_ in the war!
My brain immediately went to Faulty Towers as well. It was one of the most enduring catchphrases of the show and not doubt played a big part in the stereotype.
In my teenage years, 15 years ago in Germany, we always greeted eachother with a handshake calling eachothers by our family names. But it was more a mocking of the adults than anything else.
2 года назад
If I'm in the mood, I might greet a close friend with "Guten Tag Herr Klein!" :D And my teenage years ended at about the time you were born… ;-)
@ I thought a bit more about it. I'm born in 1988 my teenage years were 20 years ago. The faster and faster passing of time the older I get never stops to amaze me.
2 года назад
@@kruesae22 My teenage years ended about three years earlier, in 1985. :D And yes, time will speed up even more in your next 20. ;-)
@@kruesae22 "In my teenage years, 15 years ago [...]" _Oh, he's quite old..._ "I'm born in 1988 my teenage years were 20 years ago." _Oh, he's younger than me. I'm quite old..._
In my teenage years we also called each other by the family names (or a shortened version of it), not just when greeting but in general (only the guys though, for the girls it was always the first names). It was not about mocking the adults, but somehow that was the "cool" thing to do back then. Today it feels very cringe when I think back on it... The handshake did remain until this day though ^^
it really sounds like those myths the average Joe has about a foreign land they've never been to, but their cousin has a friend who is married to the sister of a German Shepherd's owner and that's how they know 100% sure
About being late, I think for some people it might be confusing how late "being late" is and again it depends on the occasion. Generally anything longer than 15 Minutes is considered noticeable late, if its a very punctual thing more than 5 Minutes even. At a very relaxed party with many guests at a home where nothing like a proper dinner is planned, turning up half an hour later is also not a big deal. And in contrast to other countries, when people invite you at 8, they do expect you to be there around 8, none of that "nobody shows up at 8" stuff. And you also don't have to wait in the car or something to be punctual, as long as you don't expect everything to be ready, don't hesitate to come in earlier. In general, just give the person a heads up via text or a call that you're going to be late and it's usually fine, even in business context (altho it probably still makes a bad impression). Things happen. (Ofc, thats my personal experience, your mileage may vary)
But this counts not at all for business meetings. Better arrive 5 - 10 min earlyer there, as we start just in time, and w/o any smalltalk, right to the topic.
Great video as always. I love the fact that unlike some youtuber creators you always do your research, don't spread wrong information about Germany and aren't "shocked" about many things and you don't use clickbaity titles. I love your channel and watch every video that comes out. In my opinion you deserve at least a million more viewers.
I don't mind talking about the war. Just don't give me that "We beat you in the war" nonsense. Neither me nor you were alive back then. On top it's massively disrespectful to treat the war like a f'n football match.
And it should not be small talk at a party. Not the topic you talk about 3 minutes after you meet a person (unless it's your tour gide and you got questions).
As a native German this is so weird to hear. All of them were unheard of to me lol Well, so to anyone wanting to visit Germany. Just be yourself and don't worry about things like that.
When someone is more than 15 mins late to an appointment I would ring and ask if everything was alright. I'd be concerned that they might have had an accident, forgotten the appointment or are lost. I do expect a call when someone knows they will be more than 15 mins late. I think I'm like the average German that way.
As a German I absolutely second all the points being made. Except for point 5 I would say, if you know you cannot make it in time, kust call/text someone. It still is a way to show your respect to the host.
Regarding point 4 - Imagine you are on a holiday in the USA and ask them "How does it feel to still live on the stolen land of millions of murdered indians?" I think Americans would not love you?
I think the war one might be outdated rather than just inaccurate. Nowadays it's been three generations, but there was a time where any discussion about the war involved people who had lived through it and that would have been a bit of a natural minefield. Like it's not good manners to explain to your host how you killed his countrymen or to ask if he'd killed any of yours...
I mean, that would have been outdated decades ago. By the 80s young people would have all been born in the post-war period. The last survivors are in their 80s and 90s now, and rather unlikely conversation partners.
The Elysee Treaties were passed less than 20 years after the war. From then on, there have been regular exchanges between France and Germany, city twinning, school exchanges etc. The irony is that it's England, which unlike Poland or France was never occupied by Germany, that's still obsessed with concepts of WWII enmity, whereas other countries have moved on.
My grandparents, my godfather and also my uncle and aunt were telling stories about the First and Second World War back in the 1970s. I was a child growing up in the north of Western Germany. So it was not taboo at all.
Fascism in germany is still very real to this day and the topic is still supressed. See my comment above. It's not about talking about world war 2 with germans is a problem. The creepy thing is that germans close their eyes and ears if you want to talk about fascism right in front of their doorstep.
That I believe is the case. When I was growing up there, 50 years ago (and therefore just 25 years after the war), when many of the living older generation had survived the war, or fought in it, it was a topic they really didn't like to discuss.
The doggy bag situation has changed over the years. 30 years ago it would still have been perceived as stingy or at least bad manners to take home leftovers. Today, with sustainability being on everyone's mind, it's much more common.
I really think the punctuality thing is quite a myth. We moved to Leipzig from the US last summer, and I've noticed that arrival times for my German friends are not always on time. Probably better than Americans, but not as punctual as I thought. And I learned that punctuality at a doctor's office only means that you have to be there on time, not that the doctor will see you on time!
I have had two comical conversations in Germany about WW2. The first was when I was young, well 20 years old, (1972) I met a father and his son also cycling, He asked me in English How I liked Germany. I answered and to be polite, I asked had he ever been to England. He answered, "No, but I have flown over it." He was a bomber navigator. The second was with an older friend, now dead. He was injured in Stalingrad and sent back to Germany to recover. Once recovered, he was sent back to the Eastern front. The train taking him there stopped normally in the station where he was to get out. He left the train and saw about, what seemed to be, 1,000 Russians. He decided to surrender.
I like what you said about asking to have leftovers at a restaurant wrapped up, it sounds much nicer than asking for a doggie bag. Apart from it not translating too well to German, does it not imply that the food is not so great but good enough for my dog.
I worked for a German company for many years. My real name clearly reflects my German ancestry . I recall having conversations with older colleagues about their service in the war. Our conversations were not in anyway political or judgemental but rather an exchange of personal experiences. It was helpful that these colleagues knew that I had relatives on both sides, although those on the German side were more distantly related. I also recall stories, from my grandmother, about the hyperinflation after WWI.
To the thing about eating with your hands I just want to add that germans really like their bread and buns and whereas you might conceivably be able to eat bread with knife and fork that just isn't possible with a bun and literally every way (there are numerous) to eat a bun requires you to eat it with your hands after preparing your bun/bite with a knife.
When talking about stuff from a bakery, don't forget about pastries (Stückchen/Teilchen, whatever they are called where you are from). Nobody would ever think about using a knife and fork to eat them.
2 года назад
You can do whatever you like in Germany. Anything you like. There's just this thing called "consequences"… :D
it's also worth pointing out that since the pandemic basically nobody shakes hands anymore and if you try to offer a handshake you will just make things very awkward.
As a German I did not even know people thought these things about us, especially the waving/greetings. It's so extremely common to just say "hello, hey, whats up, yo, the head nod, the list goes on" to complete strangers while on walks or whatever even
In some areas it even boils down to a single word that *is* an entire greeting with all bells and whistles. Take the "Gude" in the Frankfurt area, or "Moin" in northern Germany. :-D
@@Colaholiker for the "Moin" you have to know that this is the abbreviation of "morjen dach" or "Guten Tag", which is just "Have a good Day" in english. Because of that you can also use it in the Evening, it has nothing to do with morning
About the handshakes: It was quite strange for me when I started to work on the assembly line of a car factory as a student here. There it really is custom to shake the hands of every other worker in your team at the start of every shift. But beside this I never met with strict handshake rules.
the thing about leftovers is especially funny to me because my mum used to order more to take home in addition to the leftovers when we went to get fried rice and/or friend noodles. We did that for a few years and then I joined Karate lessons, turns out one of the teachers there is one of the owners of that restaurant we used to go to and he recognized me as someone who loves their food. I should go there again, I haven't had good fried noodles in way too long :)
Bit of a side thing, but regarding punctuality and parties, I will say when I first heard that apparently in some countries "when the party starts a 8 nobody actually shows up at 8" it boggled my mind. When I'm invited to something I'll of course do my best to show up at the time they said it starts. And maybe things vary, but in my experience people usually wait to get things started, so letting them know if you're gonna be late is common courtesy. Even if it is just 5 minutes.
Interestingly enough, many Germans handle parties the same way. Nobody shows up exactly on the dot, at least in my experience. Being 5-15 minutes late is perfectly normal for many in that context, since the host still has to get things ready etc, and everybody arriving at the same time would be kind of chaotic.
This is a cultural difference - monochronic vs. polychronic cultures. Germany is quite far to the monochronic side of things, so yes, 8 o'clock pretty much means 8 o'clock. If you tried to apply that logic in a polychronic culture (Italy, Spain etc.), you'd be considered rude.
@@ospero7681 It's context dependent. Dinner? Be reasonably punctual. Party? Arrival will be staggered. mono/polychromic is a useful model, but it's a spectrum, not a dichotomy.
In regards to hand shaking: In my area it mostly depends on how familiar you are with the other person and how much time has passed since you have last seen it. With Business acquaintances I mostly shake hands every day. With Family only if I don't see them for half a year. Most others are somewhere in between.
Good points! Two items, "leave leftovers behind" and "use knife+fork instead of your hands", remind me of my dinner education back in the 60s. Then, they were totally true and unbreachable. "Knigge" etiquette would expel you from society! Today, both rules are obsolete, though I still recall from a visit to Wall Street in 1977 the disbelief that all these business people would return from their "hands-on" McDonalds lunch meals taintless... I'd still be very uptight on any WWII mentionings, well aware of the havoc that those movies have played on us, including Saving Private Ryan.
Well, then your dinner education in the 60s was simply wrong, since there are - for a long, long time already, read: way before the 60s - some foods which were traditionally eaten with your fingers. And what exactly does Knigge say about those? Knigge says that those are easy to spot, since you will actually have a finger bowl ("Fingerschale") set besides your plate for that type of food, to clean your fingers after using them for eating. If there is no finger bowl, THEN it's very bad behaviour to eat something with your fingers (at least in an official setting like a posh restaurant).
About being late. When i was young, growing up in a university town it was quite common to mention CT or ST on the invitation or when being told about the invitation. Meaning Cum Tempore (with time) or Sine Tempore. The first meant relaxed on time rules, quite specifically 15 minutes late is on time (the "akademische Viertelstündchen", academic quarter of an hour), ST meant to be please precisely on time, in that case it is good to be there 5 minutes early. Nowadays those terms are not really used anymore.
It's completely normal to take things home from the restaurant. I do it often to avoid waste. Especially if you ordered meat that you can't eat at the moment, please take it home and eat it there, so the death of the animal has a purpose.
5: I used to think I should never be late then I found out about the „akademische Viertelstunde“ which is apparently only used at university where lectures & tutorials start up to 15 minutes later than in the timetable (I went to a Fachhochschule where lectures started on time). So don’t get annoyed if anyone turns up 15 minutes late for an appointment, it’s only the „akademische Viertelstunde“ being used!
@@countluke2334 And it is mostly not up to 15min but exactly 15min. And it will be noted in the timeplans. My boss expects anyone to be at a meeting at most 1min late or he will get grumpy !
Something to add on the topic of Nazis: this is something we all learn extensively about in school (about half our history lessons are devoted to late 19th to early 20th century German history, with some very extensive discussion about how Hitler was able to rise to power). There are memorials to the victims everywhere. Museums everywhere. We actively remember Nazi Germany so that it won't happen again. So, no: talking about the war and the Nazis is not something to be discouraged in any way. Making jokes about how Germans are Nazis obviously gets lame really fast, but just raising the subject usually leads to an interested conversation. Especially with the (now not so recent) rise of the AfD (our new far-right party) and ongoing scandals about Nazis in the police and elsewhere, this topic is absolutely worthy of conversation.
If I invite people to my place, I usually expect them to be a little late and if they show up on time, that will upset me because most of the time I won‘t have completed all my preparations in time or if I have, all that preparing and perfecting will have stressed me out so much that I really want a few moments to just relax before taking on the arduous task of being a host. I am German by the way. There are people like me here too who are somewhat time blind to the point of being chronically late to almost everything🙈 I am totally fine with people being like 15 minutes late. I will just scroll through RU-vid while I wait and probably enjoy the free unplanned time I get.
I should have added, it's called "das akademische viertel". We had a lot of academics in our family - my father and both my uncles were university professors.
@@Ilogunde ... and I should also add that my father was rather invested in punctuality, so much so that he was once rather upset at my mother being late even though her taxi had a breakdown. One of a number of his ideas that I disagreed with.
Allem stimme ich zu, bis auf den 5. Punkt. Pünktlichkeit unter Freunden ist ein Zeichen von Respekt, so wird es hier allermeistens empfunden; unglaubliche Unpünktlichkeit dagegen als Ärgernis, außer, wenn der Gast Bescheid gibt, dass er sich verspätet.
Ich würde sagen, es kommt da wirklich auf die Umstände an. Unter Freunden kommt es nach meiner Erfahrung durchaus auch vor, dass man eher relaxed in Bezug auf Pünktlichkeit ist, vor allem, wenn sich mehrere Freunde irgendwo treffen. Bei guten Freunden bin ich persönlich da viel toleranter als bei zB Geschäftspartnern oder Handwerkern. Was stimmt, ist dass verschiedene Menschen verschiedene Erwartungen haben und im Zweifel sollte man die Geduld des anderen nicht strapazieren, wenn man sich nicht sicher ist, wie er/sie mit Unpünktlichkeit umgeht.
I just re-watched the video, and I find it quite informative! Not only have I learned about certain non-taboos about Germany (you _can_ be late, if time doesn't depend on it!), but I also learned a new _English_ word: "doggy-bag", for something to store unused food! I also learned that some _Narr_ advises people against eating pretzels with your hands! What am I supposed to do? Use a fork on it? Thanks for the video!
I like talking about the war. Mostly English and Americans feel uncomfortable when I tell them that everything they see was rebuilt after the war because the Allies bombed all houses. Or that it is normal to find WWII bombs once a week.
If you're going to be late, and you know that, it's considered very polite, If you Just get in Touch with the others Person(s) and say that, so they don't have to worry. If it's a party or a similar Situation, that's Not really necessary, but in Most it's the easiest way. (My opinion as a German) What ist considered very rude, is to say you come, and then don't.
Good video. About doogy bag: I'm German and at first I thought that's about dog poo. To ask for bags for dog poo in a restaurant is definitely weired. There're so many places in the public where you can get them for free. As you said, it's ok to e.g. ask for aluminium foil to take leftovers at home. But I think most Germans will misunterstand "doggy bag", so better not say that. By the way: Look carefully at the menu. Sometimes it's just a general sentence somewhere that they offer smaller portions for a few EUR less if you prefer that. Just one exception: All you can eat offers, sometimes called "Buffet" in German. I assume that's similar in other countries, for financial reasons.
"Don't be late" is a matter of being reliable and dependable. It is not just a matter of politeness but an indication whether one actually cares about meeting the other one/s at the agreed time. If one can't make it on time, then give a message or call.
All of these seem rather old fashioned to me. Like they were good tips 50 years ago but completely outdated now. For example 50 years ago a lot of germans had a Nazi past. Like they were in the SS or in the Nazi Party etc. It would have been a good tip not to mention the war back then but most germans were born way after the war today so it's a less sensitive topic.
No, it's the opposite. Because its so long ago it is so weired. So many UK and US people are coming up with the topic TODAY, about every second one, first reaction if they hear you are german, is mentionint Hitler or the Nazis. It's not like Germans would feel offended, but annoyed. Remember Prince Harry in the Nazi costume 20 years ago ? Don't show up this way in Cologne Carneval. Or you get questions about gas chambers in prisons. Stupid things like that. It's like you talk with French all the time about Napoleon just to start a small talk. It's annoying, boring, not funny. Well andrew put it in nice words.
@@Delibro I am an American myself, and even _I_ don't seem to know why my countrymen keep mentioning the war! What kind of ghost is haunting the conversations?
People definetly shake hands more often in Germany than in the UK, especially in professional setting.... at my former office, people would walk round every morning to shake hands with everyone when they arrived. I found that a bit unusual.
Number 4 has changed, so it might be an older advise. When I went to school in the late 80es and early 90es there was exactly the break. Older teachers would not touch the topic at all. Even in history there was the common saying "Hitler did not exist" because after WW1 and the fall of the Emperor we returned to the Egyptians, Greeks and Romans. Also in other subjects like German literature was carefully selected to avoid the topic in my lower grades, although there would have been perfect adolescent literature about the topic. Most famously maybe Morton Rhue's "The Wave". Same applied to Music, Religion (yes, we have that as a school class), etc. From my 9th or 10th grade on that changed. Our new and younger (not necessarily young - her eldest son was basically 1 year below me) German teacher was shocked that we had not read The Wave 2 years earlier. Later would follow adult targeted literature about the war and the Nazis or the years after and the impact on the people by authors like Alfred Andersch, Günther Grass or Siegfried Lenz. And class by class the 3rd Reich became an issue. We reached present day in history, we analyzed music and lyrics of the 3rd Reich in music we discussed the role of the church in religion. I'd say it was a question if the teachers graduated from university before or after 1969...
What you wrote seems very odd to me. For starters, teachers don't set the curriculum. Also, I did go to school in the eighties and nineties and what I (barely) remember is that history classes moved through history at a plodding pace and only reached the twentieth century in the later years of my school life. I do not recall classes ever jumping back to Ancient times, but it seemed like the world wars were covered in excruciating detail and there was basically no time spent on modern history after the war.
Yes and no. In some subjects they do. Because the curriculum for German will only say "adolescence literature" or "poetry" or "communication theory" for a certain age. But it is up to the teacher to decide which authors are chosen, etc. In history I thought this step back was normal. I mean you start in year 7 with Egypt, Greece and Rome - the first time in history that something big happens. Then, of course with some centuries taking 2 weeks and others half a year you get through times and usually it is then around year 10 you reach presence - if you don't stop 1918 at least. For those going into apprenticeship that means one run through history. Then the ones like me, who go to the "Oberstufe" - call it "high school" as American or GCSE-A as British - will have another 3 years (back then, today sometimes only 2 because they dropped year 13 on some schools) to do it over again, but this time with much more experience. Especially the ancient times you had in a still very child-targeted manner aged 13 and now with 17 can learn new things from the same topic. The second run during the last 3 years was in any point more demanding and on a higher level than the first one. Which seems normal to me, because you learnt other stuff in other subjects like politics or geography meanwhile, which you can now use in history as well.
@@Fuckyoubloodymoron Teachers technically don't set the curriculum but realistically, it's not something that would be commonly checked. My mother (who is now in her 50's) has told me that her high school history teacher pretty much reduced the history of the holocaust to a passing mention whilst going into great and excrutiating detail on the injustices that germans who had lived in the Sudetenland had to suffer when they were forcibly expulsed after the end of the war.
No. It's not. "The Boat" might be considered a war movie, but was not about Nazis or Hitler. "The Downfall" might be one of the only movies where Hitler was portraied at all. Well, the point is more, if Americans start talking about the Nazis 1 Minute after they meet you, they consider it small talk, and that's the only topic they know about Germany at all. It's people you consider too stupid to know about German reunion, the geography or any other topic. Germans don't like small talk at all. Cause the approach is "I don't want to learn anyhting, I just want to talk with somebody, I don't like silence". And take the war as a topic for such a thing, is inappropriate.
"Never, ever, ever cross the street on a red light". Well, during the day with lots of kids around - perhaps. In central Berlin or Frankfurt, however, I don't think so.
Last time I commented about my country after being prompted to in the video, people saw my comment as an invitation to tell me about every stereotype they knew about it, so this time I’ll just say: Thanks for the video!
@@holger_p I'm not sure why you'd say that. People replied to my comment with the silliest, dumbest things they could think of. Not sure how that makes me someone who doesn't "feel like talking".
@@martinc.720 that's how i read your comment. Last time you got unwanted reaction, that's why you don't say anything anymore, except thank you. It means you will never try answering/talking again.
@@martinc.720 Well, just wanted to let you know, this is what I read from it. Of course nobody ever knows the intention, why somebody wrote something. I don't even know why country you refer to as "my country". Maybe you also think that's obvious, without telling. You make a big mystery around you.
#3 eating with hands: apart from the obvious exceptions (junk food, something on-the-go like pretzels), even at a [formal] table or maybe even in restaurants eating poultry (not as fillet but when still attached to the bone) with your hands is compatible with established eating etiquettes, there should be a bowl with warm citrus water though as well to wash your hands afterwards
You are absolutely right! It is not that uptight anymore over here. Sounds like rules that were right with my grandparents in the 1950s and perhaps elderly people will expect it still today. But about being late: there is what we call "the academic quarter" - if you are meeting with friends and are late for up to 15 minutes, you are considered to be on time 😜 Love your show, by the way. I also studies languages but never had the chance to live abroad, so you give me a little of that experience.
I think the shaking hand thing might be more of an Eastern German one. At least in the small Brandenburg town I grew up in, it was very common (and to me as a Western German "immigrant" very weird), to shake everyone's hands if you came to an event, even in larger groups and even among friends.
Год назад
About time and being late: I think the main issue is that in many cultures saying "10 minutes" doesn't mean _exactly_ 10 minutes counted against the clock, but more like "in a while". And often when you say "x starts at 18:00" it doesn't mean it's 6PM sharp, like a train schedule that is going to depart if you're not there, but more like "from 6PM on". I agree that calling 5mins later is a bit too much, but I've been scolded by several _different_ people, all German natives, for being too loose with my time counting.
On the birthday party thing: If you are invited for coffee and cake at 16:00, you should probably be there at around 16:00. But if you are invited to a party at 20:00, most people will be there after 20:30 or even 21:00.
About the War thing: There is no problem in raising the subject, but it should, just like every other topic, be in a context and not brought up completely out of the blue. You hear politicians talking about this, when the timing is right. There are also remembrance days and it is tought in schools, so why should it be a taboo to talk about it?
It is totally fine to take your food home anywhere. "Hey, ich würde gerne zahlen und können Sie mir den Rest bitte einpacken?" Or something like that. No one really cares.
punctuality yeah sure official business and for class and to the doctors appointment be punctual but I am just currently thinking about my Birthdays, usually I say come at 3 in the invitation, but (with prior talking about it they don't just show up) my friends show up at all times between the day before and 6pm because they have to work... so really... the 3pm was just a suggestion in that case... maybe I am unusual there lol
But don't give your friends a notice, when they probably show up to your birthdayparty? "I can't do it on the specific day, so one day early, or one day late?" "I have to work until X, so don't expect me before Y; but I will show up for sure!"
@@michelaushamburg6766 oh yeah they ask/tell me beforehand of course!
2 года назад
Doctor's appointmen? Depends. Most doctor's I've been I had to wait quite a while *past* the time of my appointment, so while I still (stupidly) try to be there on time, I won't actually sweat it. Now, this one dentist I had, there were hardly any waiting times. *One* time I had to wait I think over an hour… but it turned out an emergency had come in a short time before my appointment. IIRC a girl (can't recall her age or if I even learned that) came in with a broken jaw? Something of that magnitude.
@ at doctors, the worst thing that'll happen if you're late to a usually appointment, that they'll take a patient before you and you end up waiting longer. But yeah, seeing how you end up waiting a ton anyway, its usually not a big thing and probably even saves you waiting time if the appointments before you run late. As long as you don't annoy the doctor's aides with it and they put you last 😂
Spot on, as usual. With the exception of # 5, though. There is a German proverb: "Fünf Minuten vor der Zeit ist des Soldaten Pünktlichkeit." Be punctual if you can. It is considered a matter of basic politeness. I hate being kept waiting, that is why I try not to do this to others.
I feel like the "don't mention the war" thing is partly owed to the fact that "talking about the war" isn't a binary yes/no thing. You can do it appropriately or you can do it annoyingly. My dad was born during the war (1943), and even though there are things I suspect have carried over as a trauma from his childhood, he jokes about it A LOT. As do I, but only about certain things such as the ridiculousness of the Nazis' propaganda and conduct. If you came up to me and went "So how many people did your grandpa kill during the war, lol" (and yes, that's the sanitized variant - there's a more offensive version that I'm not gonna mention here), I'm not going to want to talk to you all that much. But if you want to have a normal conversation about the war, even a lighthearted one - sure, go right ahead. I wasn't there, I know as much as you do, probably, and I'm always happy to have a level-headed conversation on any topic.
For me (25y and German) it is totally fine if you happen to be 10-15 minutes late or maybe even up to 1 hour, but maybe just send a short text that you are running late possibly including a reason and about what time you will arrive. That way I know if I should wait with preparing the dinner or if I can use the time to go and buy tickets for the movie we want to see or grab a coffee instead of waiting for you.
Lol, number two is a pain. Down here in Brazil, if you go to your local, you "have to" say hi to all the neighbours you know, even if they're deep in conversation or watching TV. I'm just trying to be polite by not interrupting people, and it turns out I was being a bit "rude". When you're more friendly with people you "should" even greet everyone with a handshake, even if you don't personally know them. This is in neighborhood bars that have a few tables around, in busier places it'll be different...
German here. My old man would yell at me for eating a rotisserie chicken with knife and fork. According to him, not using your hands in the messiest way possible is culinary heresy.
But a chicken you "destroy" with the power of your fingers. A Burger you just bite with your jaws. You get messie in the face. That's a little different szenario. Nobody just bites in the grilled chicken, even when using hands.
Which I find strange as it’s not transmitted by touch. You’d have to put your hand in your mouth straight away to get infected and even then it’s not a sure-fire guarantee you’d get sick…
I once was in Nuremberg and had a particularly bad meal that I didn’t like… A friend took us to an Italian restaurant after a day of searching online for a good place for a pizza… We got there after walking across the entire city of Nuremberg, passing quite a few pizza restaurants. We ask for the menus. No menus, they tell us what they have. We ask what type of beer they have. No bear, only wine. We ask for coke. No coke, only wine or water. We ask for white wine. No white wine, only red. We ask for still water. No still, only carbonated. We ask what pizza they have. No pizza, only schnitzel, tuna, or steak. I order the schnitzel. Sorry, we’re out of schnitzel today… It was all we could do to keep from laughing in the waiters face… I wound up getting a steak that was incredibly rare, which is something I have a hard time getting down. I’m not such a huge fan of meat anyway, but when it’s so rare it’s double trouble. Anyway, I ate what I could and only had gotten down about half of it, gagging all the way. They decide to wrap it up for me, without me having asked mind you. So they gave me a haphazardly wrapped steak, leaking blood all over the place. Not wanting to be rude, I took it and put it into my pocket until we could find a place to throw it away, but not before blood dripped all down my legs… We later read in the newspaper that that restaurant was shut down for being a front for the mob. Figures. 😂
Regarding being late: It is true though that you are expected to be on time and not as in some countries you are expected to be there like at least half an hour late. So if you are invited to a birthday party, its not a problem to be late but its polite to write a text that you'll be x minutes late so the host knows when to expect you.
I suspect the handshake thing is just kind of outdated? Both my granddads always greet(ed) me at the door with a handshake when I visit(ed), whereas none of my same-age friends or acquaintances do.
About the birthday party, I totally agree with the punctuality expectations of Germans, it has loosened with the younger generation BUT if whoever birthday you go to, make sure not to say "I've brought you a gift" I made that mistake with my mother-in-law who speaks limited english.... use the word (present) instead.😇
Can confirm, you can absolutely take food back from a restaurant if you ask politely, something like "Können Sie mir den Rest bitte einpacken?" ("Could you please bag the leftovers for me?"). Just don't expect everyone to know the term doggy bag just because they speak english, it doesn't seem to be commonly taught vocabular and might cause confusion (for instance, this was literally my first time hearing that term and if I previously heard it without explanation, I might have assumed that it refers to those plastic bags that you use to clean up your dogs poo when you go on a walk with it).
When I was a child in the 90ies, it was normal for me to greet my close relatives (grandparents, uncle/aunt, later cousins) with a handshake though we lived in the same little town and I saw them frequently. I did not do this with my friends and now, it seems very weird to me but well, I guess my family is weird. About being late: I would find it impolite to let someone wait outside, but so much when someone visits me at home.
"Never mention the war" reminds me of that great scene with John Cleese in Falty Towers. Due to the huge cultural impact of that TV series I would not be surprised it that idea comes from there. As for the doggy bag: This has changed a lot over the past years. When I was a kid and we first heard about that concept, it was considered to be a really weird behaviour. Not necessarily rude but very stingy and petty. And to a certain degree it still is up to today. You can ask to pack the leftovers if you are alone, with the family or close friends. But dont expect to see the lady/guy ever again if you did that on a date or even during a business meeting. However, the rising awareness of problems related to food waste may make it more and more normal to take leftovers back home.
I think the war thing might have applied in the 50's and 60's because there were still a lot of germans around who had been part of the Third Reich and just wanted to forget about it and move on, rather than being forced to ruminate the same old questions of "how could this happen?" or "Did you know what was going on in the camps?" or "Why didn't you do something?" over and over again. These days, pretty much everyone who had even the slightest bit of responsibility in this has already died of old age which makes the topic much easier to talk about.
For the last point: we have a timespan of "an academical quarter hour" (german: akademische Viertelstunde) that is a usual time messurement that can be accepted of being to late. But after that quarter hour - or exactly 15 minutes - you get problems ;-)
Also the myth that germans don't tip. In fact: Waitstaff usually make minimum wage (ca. 12 €), which is way more than the hourly wage in e.g. the US, but still isn't much - considering the cost of living. If you don't tip on a bill that is more than 20€, most people will think you are stingy. Rounding up to the nearest € is very common for smaller bills. If you can afford a 10% tip that is seen as good ettiquette, when good service is provided, if not it is considered generous, but never improper. More then 12% is considered generous. More than 15% is considered very generous. More than 20% is highly unusual and might lead to second questions from staff, but they would still appreciate it. I think rounding up to the next € for bills 15€ or lower and giving 10% for higher bills is a good way to go (in Bars and Restaurants) if you are happy with the service. If not, rounding up to the next € may still be the right thing to do. If you are struggling financially or you are really unhappy with the service not tipping may also be ok. Tipping is in Germany as in most cultures a very controversial subject, not just with waitstaff but in the service industry in general. So there are different opinions on who to tip and what percentage. PS: You usually indicate your tip in Germany by telling the person serving you the total amount (bill + tip). So if a bill comes to 10€ and you wanna tip 10% (=0.10€) you would hand the money (e.g. a 20€-bill) over and say "10.10€" and would get the change for that (e.g. 9.90€) [my opinion as a student in lawschool and barkeeper in Germany]
Number five is really important for me. If you are late, you don't value my time and I will not meet you again, especially if we never met before, but if you do call and let me know before it is too late then it is okay for me! With all the other five things I'm more relaxed, but I tend to shake hands if I meet somebody. Mentioning the war is totally fine with me, but expect a honest discussion of the topic, because it is more compilcated than just blame everything on Germany.
Sometimes I feel like Americans and brits forget that places like Germany aren't really that different - we have a western monoculture to some degree that people widely recognize, so you can't really screw up too much. The doggybag thing sounds like an honest misunderstanding based on the fact that not everyone calls it that and my first thought, even as a native English speaker, is that it refers to a bag for dog poop.
I was friends with a German for a while. I had him over to the Netherlands for a short stay. I asked him about WW2. We had a long, deep, fruitful and emotional discussion about it. I discovered he was born in 1940 and his real first name was Adolf (he used his second name Otto). So yeah, he felt guilty about that. I hope I convinced him that he should not feel guilty as he was a baby when all the nonsense happened. He died young. I still think a lot about that evening and wonder if people from his generation feel guilty as well. Please don't.
Being late... hm. Well, you can be late with good reasons. There are always things that can happen so you cannot make it on time, regardless of how careful you are. And it is not always possible to give notice... though that depends on the attitude to modern mobile technology. And, yes, in a private, informal, friendly situation it is not such a faux-pas than in a business or official meeting. Though even there valid excuses are... valid. But that said: personally I HATE it when you have made any sort of appointment, and people just don't show up on time. It may be just me, but I'm not someone who can just busy himself with some sort of make-do or last minute clean-up. When I'm expecting someone at a specific time, then I am ready at that time. And if this person then doesn't show up... I'm left hanging. I just can't start anything while knowing I have to drop it in a second's notice.
Genau! Wenn ich eine Verabredung habe (Hausaufgabenhilfe; zusammen einkaufen gehen; Spieleabend; ...), dann erwarte ich, dass die Person höchstens 15 Minuten später auftaucht. Man kann schließlich schon mal den Bus verpassen. Wenn's später wird, erwarte ich eine Benachrichtigung, z.B. "Ich schaff' es erst eine Stunde später. Ist das trotzdem ok?" Dann kann ich mich darauf einrichten und umplanen. Wenn man sich zum Kino-(Theater-/Buchlesung-/...)besuch eine Viertelstunde vor Beginn verabredet hat, ist es auch wichtig, allerhöchstens 15 Minuten zu spät aufzutauchen.
@@michelaushamburg6766 I'll never forget (and likely nor will my boss) the day we arrived at a customer and were greeted "company XYZ, punctual today". Ouch!
I also got once a phone call asking where the hell I was. But I was about a month late, because I had to ask: Is it really already August? (It was a appointment at the first weekend in August.)
the doggie bag thing might be that you don't get enough food to take home, which is true compared to American portion sizes, where it's almost expected that you will get 2 meals out of it.
Being late is not a big deal IF it's communicated beforehand or you're meeting as a group. At least in my opinion. There might be exceptions if e.g. you know that dinner will be ready or it's crucial to be on time for a movie, bus etc that cannot wait. Also, in the Ruhrpott are it's fine to ask for doggy bags. Most restaurants are prepared to bag your left overs.
About the trope to not ever talk about the war: it's Fawlty Tower's fault. From the perspective of a German who lived in England I can say that being greeted with a Hitler Gruß is shocking when you first arrive in England. After a while, maybe around the 30.000th time you've been told the same 3 jokes it does get old. At least I was never beaten to a pulp for being German, like a colleague's friend was.
Punctuality is an issue for Germans living abroad. I was living in France for long and any time I was a little late people told me as a German I should not. - Well, only the first time it‘s funny.
Of course Covid completely cabooshed the hand-shaking, it remains to be seen whether it will return at all in professional environments in the future. The last time I did a handshake was Feb 2020, when meeting a new optician. A few months later they had a sign up, among all their other distancing requirements, stating that they would be greeting clients with friendly words rather than a handshake (and a pictogram of a hand with a line through it).
I've noticed that in professional settings the fist bumb has really established itself, which makes sense as its a very close motion and with a closed fist you show your intentions very well. I still think it weird in a hilarious sort of way when someone in a suit gives you a fist bumb but honestly, seeing how much less bacteria is transfered that way, I do hope it's here to stay. I personally would have hoped that wer would have collectively adapted some kind of clasped hands/ bow like in Asian countries as a formal way of waving your hand without any contact, but well. I did really hate the elbow Shakes/ bumbs or however they are called, because especially with Corona they still bring you so close together into personal space. Uncomfortable with strangers and worse in terms of infection risk imo.
Not sure if it's true, but I once read that history teaching in UK schools centres very much on WW2, the Battle of Britain and such. This would explain why a gentle reminder about how best to discuss it with Germans might be in order. Also, some Brits (including royals) seem to have a weird fascination with the Nazis which is quite irritating to us. I believe George Harrison of Beatles fame, for reasons known only to himself, had a whole Nazi room in one of his stately homes.
1. In most cases. Asking for the Food to be Packaged to take it Home is Perfectly Fine. It is however not Welcome in some Higher Class Restaurants. This is not so much about being Rude. Its just that many Families especially from Wealthier Families are often Worried about being seen as Poor. And also pls dont Ask for a Doggybag. (Because this is what we call the Plastic Bags You are supposed to take along and Collect Your Dogs Poop in when walking Your Dog...) Instead just ask them if they could Package the Food for You to take Home. Many Restaurants actually even have Food Constainers usually used for Takeaways to Specifically to Package Food for You take Home. 2. Hahahaha. This one is from my Region. (I am from Northrhinewestfalia or NRW for Short. Albeit this one is more Specific to the Coal Mining Regions) And if You meet someone for any halfwat Official Reason. You are Expected to Shake Hands. (Not with your Family tough lol... Only in more Official Meetings) Not doing so is Considered Rude and depending on the Relation even Offensive. And No I am not Kidding. We do it even at Work EVERY SINGLE DAY. Some Politician of the Greens actually made a Joke about it. Saying that we would spend more time Shaking Hands than actually Working. He meant it in an Offensive Way. (I mean we are part of the Coal Industry and he is a Green.) But we really dont care. We do actually Value this small Tradition. Albeit it has Fallen Considerably out of Favor after and during Covid. And is only Slowly making a Comeback. 3. Oh this one is Old. My Grandparents used to tell me this. But frankly this one stopped being a thing before I left Middle School. And this was over 20 Years ago.... But it was actually a think in the Past. And if You think its Weird and Wrong to Eat a Pretzel using Fork and Knife. Eat a frigging Berliner with Fork and Knife xD And Yes. I actually once Ate a Döner Kebab this way. Albeit as I said. Already during Middle School most of us Ignored that Rule which really even at this Point came Solely from our Grandparents with even our Parents not usually thinking it to be reasonable xD 4. Uhh this one is Dangerous. In General Yes. Its not an Issue to Talk about this Topic by Default. But it can have very Unwelcome or Awkward Consequences to Talk about this Topic. Especially if You are either Hostile about it Yourself or if You are simply Ill Informed about it. Because in both cases be Warned. Alot of us Germans are very Able to tell You in your Face that You are Wrong. Repeatedly. And Loudly. So Yeah. In this case as Rewboss Says. Show some Sensitivity here. And if You want to Talk about this. Make sure You either Ask about it in a Non Hostile Way. Or be Informed enough to actually hold a Conversation on it. 5. Punctuality is considered a Virtue. And especially among Older Folks its actually still considered exceedingly Importand. But like with so many others of these. This is something that was Considered Super Importand by Grandparents. Was considered far more Relaxed by my Parents. And is almost entirely Ignored by Generation. (Unfortunately the Younger Generation is also very Lax about this on actual Business Appointments...) In General. Most of these are not exactly Wrong. Its just that they are Severely Outdated by Now xD I actually know most of these Rules and have had to Obey them. Just that this was basicly 30 Years ago as a Kid xD
