Great video, Tony! And, for what it was worth, when I saw that you posted a half hour video on trucks, I couldn't wait to get off work today to watch it. Totally worth it! Great info! Thanks, man!
After watching this video 10 times I had to purchase tensor 4.25 because all your recommendations were sold out and there was no way I could get my hands on any of the trucks you talked about!
Yeah, that's a big problem this year. Out of all the trucks mentioned in this video, the only ones which have had a consistent supply in the UK this year have been the Paris trucks. Between issues at factories and issues with cargo shipping, there's not a lot of trucks around right now!
I hope there will be more videos (or in form of podcasts etc.) of this kind! It's really interesting, even if its nearly impossible for me to get this stuff, since germany has even less options, especially right now. So, please do more stuff like this, doesn't matter if you are just ranting about something :D
Honestly, I'm surprised there's any audience for this sort of long-form stuff; I thought everyone would look at the length of the video and give it a miss! I definitely have some more subjects I've got in mind, so maybe I'll film a few more for you in the future.
If there are people who like to talk/nerd over something in length, then there are people who like to listen to it. Either to get another perspective or to learn. I want to get into freestyling (sadly getting a new setup for freestyling isnt that easy, atleast the one I want to try), therefore every bit of information is interesting. Bonus points if it's delivered in an interesting and funny way.
What are you looking at getting? I know a LOT of stuff is out of stock right now. I just sold the last two Felix Jonsson decks in Europe this morning, and almost all the trucks in this video are totally out of stock all across the UK now. Sick of this pandemic on so many levels!
First of all, something that is available in germany. Through you and Mike Osterman, a deck with no or a really mellow concave makes the most sense to me and I want to start off with a symmetrical shape if possible. I'm not sure which deck size I want, therefore I thought 7.5 would be a good start (my normal deck is 8.0). In terms of trucks...I guess anything I can get that isn't bad? I'm not sure which style I will be going with, so something that works for everything seems like the best idea, atleast for now. For wheels, probably Seismic Focus 97a (the one thing that's actually available here). Since im a student, I dont really want to import something, unless shipping isnt that expensive. In the end I'm a beginner without a lot of experience and any kind of tips are greatly appreciated.
There's not a lot of truly bidirectional boards - lots which come close, but many have slightly different nose angles or shapes. Off the top of my head, I can think of four I can guarantee are bidirectional - the Moonshine Gale (7.3" x 28"), Lillis (7.3" x 28.5"), and Jonsson (7.6" x 29.5") decks, and the Mode Postcard (7.4" x 29.4"). Of those, all the Moonshine decks are sold out in Europe (I'm expecting more stock in about 3 weeks... providing the pandemic doesn't get in the way again), and the Mode has HUGE concave in comparison to the rest. The Gale has zero concave, and the Lillis and Jonsson are both from Moonshine's super-mellow concave mould. There's also Marius' Cirus deck, which is 7.25" x 28.5", has absolutely zero concave (
I haven’t purchased new trucks quite yet, but I’m leaning toward Paris after this video. Would this still be one of your top recommendations for a mid/high setup?
I truly went into this video thinking I was going to switch to Indy because they were the least likely to bend and that they were going to last for ages. I had no idea that reality was the exact opposite.
@@coolhandluke212 Honestly... it depends. I'm still running Paris 108s on my Kill Your Idols as a tall stationary setup that I can still use as a carve-friendly pub run board. But if you wanted a rock-solid, absolutely no-turn mid-to-tall truck? Go for the Sure Grip Invaders. I've got a video review of them on this channel, and they are SOLID.
No worries. I don't know if there's much of an audience for such painfully in-depth and long-winded stuff but I figured it was worth putting it out there for those who needed it.
@@FreestyleTricktips I suspect it's a small, but growing audience. If all we cared about was the size of the audience we'd be reviewing video games or something. :)
I'm pretty sure that even if I did that I'd end up doing long-form reviews of niche Playstation games and peripherals from the 90s; I'm not entirely sure which one has the smaller audience nowadays!
End of the video: tony tries knocking the independent 109 t hanger off the board using a Air-soft gun Me: well Ig grip tape is definitely abrasive not just on your shoes but even on trucks. I remember I used independent reverse kingpin with the T-hanger trucks. That was what I used all the time so I wouldn’t have to constantly buy kingpin nuts. (I crank my trucks down my truck as tight as they can go)
I love the Paris trucks...really good stability....and as dar as indys go if you run a wider 7.75 or 8" freestyle board their street truck hold up alot better than the t-hanger ones
Yeah, that's true on the larger Indys, but it's still not saying much, especially when you consider how strong they USED to be. In the last five years I've seen axles and pivots shear off completely on 139s and 149s. That never used to happen in the 90s & 2000s. And they still have the wobbly kingpin and stretched mounting holes issues, too.
since different trucks vary in axle placement/wheelbase, do you think different trucks effect rail tricks considering it changes how close/far the wheels sit alongside the rail taper?
It's entirely possible, and not something I'd considered too greatly, if I'm honest. That said, I think the bigger complication would be the truck geometry - a swept pivot like the Fultrack, Racetrack RT-S, Sure-Grip, or Gullwing means that the axle is far less likely to twist underneath you while you're in rail, increasing stability massively compared to a straight pivot like the Indy 109.
It's entirely possible, and not something I'd considered too greatly, if I'm honest. That said, I think the bigger complication would be the truck geometry - a swept pivot like the Fultrack, Racetrack RT-S, Sure-Grip, or Gullwing means that the axle is far less likely to twist underneath you while you're in rail, increasing stability massively compared to a straight pivot like the Indy 109.
As an independent rider, reynolds hallows, I had to check right away and on 2 sets of trucks one of which was used for 4 years the pins were still good
Out of interest, do you run your trucks fairly loose? If the hangar is able to flop around a lot, the kingpin is unlikely to be levered about much (but you'll probably get impact marks on the side of the kingpin or on the "ring" of the hangar that goes around it if the truck is too loose). Personally, I half-seriously believe that the skateboard industry is encouraging people to run trucks looser than they should to hide bad engineering and lower-grade materials. It wouldn't be the first time something like that has happened!
@@FreestyleTricktips Firstly, holy engagement XD. I know this was an older video so I didn't expect a response and am delighted to have received such a well thought out one. That would make a lot of sense, I run them fairly loose. I also tend to replace my bushings every few set of bearings. Being in Colorado the polyurethane gets chewed up. So I imagine that's given them some longevity too. I'll have to try a different brand next setup and try running things tighter. Thanks for all the LITERALLY AMAZING content over the years. There are some trick tips you can only find here. Random question but do you consider boneless tricks oldschool or freestyle?
@@MrDrProfessorMidget Hah! I started this to teach, not just to "make content" (I refuse to even monetise this stuff on principle), and what sort of teacher wouldn't answer questions?! My general rule of thumb is if the hangar is able to move without resistance at all, you've got the wrong bushings in there. And if the nut is so tight you can see more than one thread, or is so loose that the top of the kingpin is below the top of the nut, you've got the wrong bushings in there. A correctly set up truck (for your weight, style, intended use) should never flop and always return to centre cleanly. Too many people have trucks that don't do that, meaning they don't get the best performance from the truck. It's *almost* always better to run softer bushings tighter instead of harder bushings looser, no matter what amount of turn you're looking for. Of course, if you're actively squashing the bushing to death, you should probably reconsider. As for bonelesses... I don't even consider them tricks, if I'm honest. They're a cop-out. Anything with a foot on the ground is a lesser version of something that has the same motion but without the footplant. But if I'm being less harsh and looking at it historically... bonelesses are one of the few things that were invented by what we'd now call a "street skater" (Garry Scott Davis - he did them on banks), and later were taken to ramps. They never had a place in freestyle in the 80s; hell, if you so much as pushed, it was considered a step-off and a failure. It seems like the fact freestyle and all non-ollie street skating was abandoned, belittled and mocked for over a decade has led people to get everything mixed up into one pejorative "old school" category (a term which I refuse to use for various reasons), leading to some stuff (like the boneless) which was never even remotely associated with freestyle to be thrown into the same pot as fingerflips, caspers and the like. Frankly, I wish that had never happened, but I acknowledge that Pandora's box has been opened and it'd take far too much work to put the boneless back in there. However, it's important to understand that even if you love the boneless (which even I'll agree with contextually - they're fun in ramps), they're definitely the weakest and most stupid thing you can do in freestyle. Recent judging reforms have even declared that any footplant trick can only ever score 1 point, regardless of complexity. They're just not a serious or difficult thing to do.
Hah! Good dodge there. Still breaks my heart seeing people struggle with those floppy things whenever I see new freestylers pop up on Instagram. Such a waste of money.
I assume that you didn't talk about the aces because Ace is famous for being super turny and loosey goosey! Probably not the best option for a freestyle truck if you're carvy and slippy.
Ace actually perform similarly to Indys in terms of steering performance - only they're stronger. The major reason I skipped over the Ace is because they're a different truck size to everything else and if you're looking at using a 7.6" deck they're pretty much the only game in town. Not a lot of comparisons to be made!
Honestly, not surprised about the Independents. I often see people swear by them, then try riding them and pretty much feel they're less accurate. And I'm a beginner. I shouldn't even notice that type of stuff, but I do. That encouraged me to get Ventures and Tensors instead. And I'm sure Tensor has pretty weak metal too, being aluminium of sorts and lightweight. But dang, not surprised about Indys.
It's been a long time since I've tried Tensors. I know they do (or did) some freestyle sized ones, but I was never a fan of their geometry. Venture were/are great trucks, though. Again, not ridden any for years, but they were a solid choice 15 years ago. And I can't believe it's been that long since I tried them last. Damn. Time flies by!
Great video. Very informative. I really enjoy stuff like this. It's nice to get a better understanding of the different options. I wonder if Mode is shipping with Bullet trucks now because Terry watched this....🤔
Hah. Terry and I have talked about Indy in the past. He went from Fultracks to Indy and doesn't understand why I have such a problem with them. I'd laugh if he's finally come around to my side of the table but hasn't been willing to admit it yet!
@@FreestyleTricktips i actually use to use to use bullet trucks on my freestyle skateboard (even if the base plate is like the size of my finger you can still do pogos and 50/50s (since I was only skateboarding hand me downs skateboard decks starting out) and bullet truck pretty stable (ps when you did your how to set up a freestyle skateboard i’d love to see whats you opinion on the per welder deck compared to the kill your idols(or any freestyle deck)
@@gamesincharacter5106 I finally got the chance to strip and inspect some Bullets while I was in Romania back in May; unsurprisingly, I wasn't too impressed. You can tell they're made by NHS as they have a lot of the same flaws as the Indys do (namely bad/sloppy tooling). The Welinder? Great graphic, terrible shape. It's basically a rectangle. I don't know where mine's gone - it must be in storage upstairs - but I don't think it was ever particularly good, even by 80s standards. And considering the price of a Powell reissue, you're better off with almost any other single kick available today. Hell, you could even get the Denny Riordon reissue (offsetskatesupply.co.uk/product/toxic-denny-riordon-7-3-x-27-75/), and it's still cheaper, higher quality and better to skate than the Welinder ones.
whats the optimal width differential for a truck/wheel combo in comparison to the width of your deck? .25 inches? .375 inches? or as close to matching it as possible?
Honestly, I'm not sure. I need to figure out the most accurate way to measure a wheels' axle coverage to measure this sort of thing. As a general starting point, I always say a truck should have an axle no less than 0.35" smaller than the width of the deck; any less than that, and you won't be able to cover the axle nuts sufficiently. And as far as the full undercarriage width... it depends on what style of trick you want to do. If you're landing to rail a lot, it helps to have the setup leaning more towards the wheels in rail. If you're doing things in rail like railwhips and toespins, a more flush setup is the goal. But either way, the board needs to lean slightly - emphasis on slightly! - towards the wheels when in rail; a totally flush setup has a tendency to fall out of rail so that the board lands grip-side-down all the time.
@@FreestyleTricktips oh, i have 7 inch trucks that i’ve been barely fitting on my 7.6. I’m using 4 wheel spacers and 36mm width wheels and that brings my trucks/wheels .375 inches less than the width of my deck. Thats About 7.25 in total. You’re saying thats too small? I was on the fence about it
@@_Maxten Personally, I think that's way too small. Felix Jonsson sets up his 7.6" deck like that... but then he barely does any rail tricks at all. I recommend a 7.25" axle - not undercarriage, just the axle - for a 7.6" deck. I think the average modern freestyle wheel gives you about 0.15" of axle coverage, so when you add the wheels you're probably looking at 7.55" from edge to edge with something like an Ace 11. That works out nicely on a 7.6".
Really great video. I use Tremendous trucks +100a Minilogo, they seem a little too hard for turning. But good for one wheelies and going to rail. I want to turn more, what bushing should i choose?
I use 95a bushings myself (Tracker Superballs, which have been out of stock pretty much everywhere for ages; 95a Khiro barrel+cone would be my recommendation right now). You might struggle to do a one wheelie as easily with 95a bushings, but they're a lot better for rolling tricks in general.
all the other indys are great. mine do not have splined kingpins and they are 169. I think they care less because not many people do freestyle and most cruisers aren't that skinny. they look better than all the other trucks though.
If you have traditional kingpins in yours, they're old stock, pre-China. That'll be why they're better - my non-splined ones (both the old freestyle size 101s and the 126 and 136 I had in the late 90s/early 2000s) are also good trucks. I would never recommend a modern set to anyone, regardless of size.
@@FreestyleTricktips yeah i got them from skatewarehouse last christmas which is after they moved to china so i guess they could've been old ones. I'm thinking about getting into freestyle which is going to be a little weird since i skate a 10.5 inch deck.
@@numberthread2493 They'd have to be SUPER old stock - 139s started moving to splined kingpins in 2004. I think I recall hearing somewhere that 169s and 215s were US-made longer than the rest of the trucks, though - they're much slower sellers so they didn't bother moving the production over until recently. That's why there was a huge drought of 215s for a long time; Indy were finalising the moulds in China. I highly recommend you don't try freestyling on a 10.5" boat. That's going to be far too heavy and clunky. The good thing is that the wider your "normal" deck is, the easier it is to keep the movements/habits separate. I swap between a 7.3" for freestyle, 9" for ramps, a very different 9" for slalom, and a 10.something" for longboarding on a regular basis; it's only when the decks are fairly similar (like swapping from a 7.6" to an 8") that things get confusing.
@@numberthread2493 oh, man. That's going to be life-changing. Whether you end up on a 7.25" or a 7.6" (those are the two most common and best sizes for freestyle decks nowadays), it'll feel so much easier. You'll be able to do tre flips without sucking down protein shakes first!
I realized that some trucks makes a shorter wheelbase and other trucks a longer WB. Compared my Paris to my Tremendous there was some difference ( maybe 3mm for a truck) skating felt different. Can be a good thing:)
Aye, that's a valid point, but it's a hard one to quantify. I really need to build some form of jig to measure that shift. I have an idea as to how to do it, I just need someone to put it together for me!
@@FreestyleTricktips yep it's a hard One. I think that I got 2 truck brands that are on each end of the scale. Hope you understand. Practicing my english here:)
They're great little trucks. Sadly they've been out of stock in the UK since March or April now, with no sign of any Gullwing trucks (of any model or size) appearing any time soon. It sucks.
Question with the Indy’s. After watching I’ve looked at both my freestyle Indy’s and my street ventures and haven’t found the wobble with the king pin. Wondering if maybe your Indy’s are the stage 10 because I’m sure mine are stage 11. Also curious if maybe the Indy’s you buy in North America are maybe built better. Either way I agree with a lot of the points. Indy’s are just loved and have a massive cult it’s kinda weird. Need a set of tracker fultrack low trucks when I can get some. Great video though
Have a look around the kingpin itself, even if it's not wobbling; a lot of Indys will have a small but noticeable gap around the kingpin. That's enough to lead to the hole widening out over time. And yes, these are stage 11s. There may be something in your idea about North American vs European Indys, though. A few 80s skaters I know swear blind that companies (including NHS) shipped the defects and dodgy stock to Europe back then; I wouldn't be entirely surprised to hear that was still happening now. "America First", and all that!
Freestyle Tricktips I’ll give another look. I have actually chatted with a guy who told me his buddy worked at the Indy factory for a bit, and apparently they cheaped out on the pivot cups. I believe he said they cost 2 cents less. Definetly not buying a set of indys anytime soon
Hah. That sounds about right. This is what happens when you have money men making decisions; I saw it at *UNNAMED SURF-INSPIRED LONGBOARD BRAND*, too. "We could make this setup with a 10" axle, but if we reduce it to 9", we can get more in a shipping container, so the cost per unit will be lower!" Order's placed for six hundred longboards, no testing, not passed by anyone who skates, and when the boards turn up, they get wheelbite on the side of the deck the second you lean in either direction. The whole lot had to be rebuilt at huge cost - causing a massive delay - just because someone wanted to save literal cents per board.
@@FreestyleTricktips Back in the 80s Bayer shipped blood products that they knew were tainted with HIV to France. A bunch of people died of AIDS because of it. All so Bayer could make more money. So, what you are saying wouldn't surprise me. A lot of the people running these corporations are psychopaths.
Bennett Vectors are an odd truck. I didn't include them here because they're basically unobtainable, for one - if you find a set, you're lucky. But for freestyle... the square hangar makes no handed pogos incredibly painful (if you can do them at all), they need specially-sized bushings, and they're designed to turn like crazy, which is the opposite of what most freestylers want. I wouldn't say they're bad - if your skating fits a certain style, they might be the best truck you'll ever use. But they're definitely niche.
Erm... you do? That's a fairly common thing and has been for a while. Landyachtz's Dinghy is a really good example of that sort of setup: landyachtz.com/collections/dinghy-cruiser-skateboard
Hi, tracker has full track dart and classic full tracks in stock 7 inch axle. What is the difference between the two and which one would you recommend?
They're fundamentally the exact same truck (and, incidentally, neither is a 7" axle - they're both 6.9". Never trust manufacturer's measurements, as they're never correct!). The major difference is the "Dart" uses the re-tooled baseplate from the 90s with the modern hole pattern, while the "classic" uses the original 80s moulds for the baseplate. Everything else - the hangar, the geometry, the feeling - is the same. So if you can use the old school holes (i.e. if you're skating a reissue, which you really shouldn't be, but hey), it doesn't make any difference which you choose. Well, that said, there's a semi-circular hollow at the pivot end of the Dart style Fultrack that's REALLY useful for opening bottles, so that's something else to consider. Not that I've ever used it to open a beer when on the road. Nope.
@@darkwingduck7212 I'm not sure I'd call either truck a "mid", to be honest. They're both fairly low. Using Fultracks with no risers and 55mm wheels is a surefire way to get *deep* wheelbite!
Honestly, that's like asking "how long's a piece of string?" There's no one single answer. It's going to depend a lot on what tricks you want to do, what trucks you're using, and how wide the board is. General rules to follow: 1) as the deck gets wider, you'll need more risers to compensate; wide setups are unstable in rail without the extra height. 2) if you want to focus on rail tricks, add large risers to make it easier to land on or stay in rail. If you want to focus on shuvits, remove the risers, as a tall setup is more likely to flip. 3) if you're using low trucks and want to be more comfortable in truck tricks (50-50s and pogos), use tall risers. It'll give you more space to stand on.
Honestly, I try mostly not to think about them if I can. The street trucks really weren't great last time I tried them (which is admittedly over a decade ago at this point!), and I've never even seen a pair of the freestyle ones, let alone tested them. They might be great, but based on my experiences with the larger trucks, I wouldn't put any money on it.
Some folks have tried. I forget the sizing on them - I'm pretty sure they're a bit too small - but they're not overly strong. They turn well compared to most plastic "cruiser" trucks, though.
Hey Tony, I am a Freestyle Skateboarder with a small Freestyle skateboarding channel and I was wandering if you could challenge me with a Freestyle trick or Freestyle line to try for a video I was wanting to make. Thx
Hey Jace, pretty sure I already replied to this - don't know where the hell the original reply has gone! Here's a challenge for you - do one line with no bails, step-offs or edits with one trick from each basic trick category from freestyletricktips.com/tricktips/ - so one kickflip, one shuvit, one truck trick, one casper, one fingerflip, one rail trick, one wheelie (held for at least three seconds!) and one piece of footwork. Throw in an impossible if you're feeling up to it, too. If you can manage that, then you've got a pretty well-rounded trick bag.
Hm, not sure. I'd have to dig a set out and find out - I thought the measurements were on www.freestylepodcast.com/truck-information/ but apparently not.
Honestly? It's just part of the "EVERYTHING HAS TO BE AS LIGHT AS POSSIBLE" craze. From a skate industry perspective, it's great, because they can charge more for things which do break faster. But from a skater's perspective, it's impossibly dumb. Total waste of money on so many levels.
@@Mr007666 They actually existed all the way back in the 70s and 80s, and they're universally terrible! They had a sort of criss-cross framework inside, and inevitably, once you wore through the top layer, you exposed the big pockets where there was less material, and things started breaking off fast.
Such is the nature of RU-vid, unfortunately - this is actually why I generally prefer written posts over video. There's a lot of stuff on here (the website, not my channel!) that's long outdated, but it sticks around for years. That said, none of these trucks have been officially discontinued. Tracker still have listings for Fultracks and 106mm Racetracks, and Gullwing's distributor still has a page for the 7" Mission 1. The problem right now is *still* pandemic-related; a lot of non-core products have gone on the backburner while production capacity is low and costs are still high. Hopefully we'll see a return to some degree of normality within the next 12 months.
Hi I’m using a street 8.0 width deck with a 8.0 axle thunder truck. After putting on the offset wheels, the wheels are just slightly protruding out from deck width. Is this setup ideal for rail tricks? Or should I get another 7.62 thunder trucks with more washers on? Please advise thanks! 🙏
Yeah, that's not going to work for rail tricks. You need a truck with an axle which is about 0.35" narrower than the deck width. Those smaller Thunders should work, but I'd recommend dropping the deck width a tiny bit to 7.9" to get the best fit with them.
"Sorry the video was so long, it was absolutely vital and much overdue... that I describe, in great detail, as thoroughly as possible... How Independent *must* be torn down ONCE AND FOR ALL from aloft their cursed false throne of treachery, deceit and lies! "Kingpins" indeed **spits** more like impotent lackeys, pedalling useless imposter crap to the clueless masses. The chocolate teapot of trucks, careful not to look at them or breathe on them during installation, or they might crumble into a pathetic aluminium dust. 0/10." -Tony Gale (paraphrased 😅)
I'm with you on Ace but Tensor are a bit of an odd choice. Admittedly, I've not skated them in about ten years, but I remember they didn't turn very sharp back then. Good for ledge skating, but not for carving.
@@FreestyleTricktips For some reason, I'm starting to think you don't like Independent! Tell us how you really feel. I don't have a freestyle board. I think the Independent ones are the T hanger ones? I guess they don't make the more traditional looking ones in that narrow of a size. I wonder if street skaters have issues with the loose king pins or if it happens from doing things like pogos that street skaters don't do. I'm assuming you skate your trucks relatively tight? I don't know much about freestyle skateboarding. So, I have no idea what people normally do for that as far as tight or loose trucks.
@@idmhead0160 Most freestylers lock the trucks down so much they might as well weld them together. Mine still turn. I think I'm in the sweet spot for kingpin issues - many modern street skaters have their trucks so floppy that they don't notice a wobbly kingpin (the truck just flops around anyway), and many freestylers have the truck so tight that the kingpin has no chance to move. Meanwhile., I'm looking for a stable, controlled turn with good return-to-centre - i.e. a truck which actually behaves like a skateboard truck should - and all the flaws with the modern Indy truck really comes to the surface in that scenario.
