Highlights from the Rivals 2 Top 6 at Genesis X. This special pre-release event was featured as one of our Kickstarter goals. Edited and compiled by LilFox15. Full bracket here: www.start.gg/tournament/genes...
Nothing inspires joy in my heart more than watching leffen lose repeatedly to avoidable rivals cheese and then fleeing to the internet to complain about an alpha more balanced than any smash game. Gotta love it
What's with the hate boner for Leffen? Even the devs said the character is overtuned and Leffen's just saying what every other top player thought of the balance.
First impressions of rivals 2 gameplay from a very uneducated rivals 1 player: - The stages being smaller and how the di and teching work make the combo game on stage really potent - It might just be the game being new but the offstage throw cheese looks like a valid strategy. I think it would be really cool if you could break out of a throw by holding the same direction, kinda how the pummel works - Parrying seems to be forgotten, most likely because of the new tools added. It’ll be interesting to see how parry use develops - Offstage play is really interesting cause of the new mechanics. I think it would be cool if every character could wall jump out of special fall to get their resources back like rivals 1, making it easier for recovery mixups with ledge and less missed recoveries Overall this game looks amazing and I can’t wait to try it
Throw cheese might get tweaks but throughout the set, Dan was commentating on how to properly break out of the grab before the cheese happens. It's certainly more of a "game is new and unfinished" than it being completely broken.
"hold the same direction to escape the throw" seriously nerf throws. If you're at the top of the stage, of course you want to throw up. its not really a "read" or "50/50", it practically removes the best throw option at any given time. the pummel 50/50 is interesting but I don't think the same thing could be applied to throws.
Having played the game, I wanna say that parrying isnt really forgotten, but its riskier since it takes longer to start and leaves you open for a punish.
@@kodycox6780 grab isn't the problem, its everything else. The fact that he has so many chances to gamble the grab because kragg never dies, gets barely any hitstun, and has projectiles to zone is what gives him all the opportunities to use the grab. Everything else needs to be tuned down except for the grab
@@hoecage8781kragg is just plain stupid. Needs to lose a jump because he can recover from even below the blastline. Zoners rush down heavy grappler combo character with a wall/instant recovery.
Kragg does seem a bit overtuned, and pressing B isn’t what solves all of the issues. Pressing B opens up for a pummel and possibly a punish or even an aerial command grab. What a character, buff kragg
I loved watching this, but I kinda wish we were able to see more representation from other characters, I get that balancing a game is hard, but having more than half of the matches have a Kragg in it just makes me a bit worried
@@idk_what_im_doing04 I would argue it's still a little bit of both. I dont think he could be bad and have 4 Kragg in top 6. He is probably strong, but it's way too early to call him op or the best character, or god tier.
The camera looks so much better. I feel like the changes they need to make for kragg: 1. Make his Cargo dthrow send forward like Ult DK 2. Nerf his fair They could make his cargo uthrow not be a combo throw anymore but idk if that’s necessary.
fair has already been nerfed, it feels like, idk if you played rivals 1 but it seems like it doesn't slap as hard also it DEFINITELY doesn't need further nerf, if anything cargo throw/sidespecial need nerfs (please keep them i'm a kragg player)
@@dragonstar_-ui2sk the only reason I mention fair is just because of how atrociously early it seems people have died to it. Though it could be because of atrociously bad DI too lmao. I play mollo but i would’ve thought this Kraggs fair was stronger than rivals fair
@@Beastmd it definitely seemed less oppressive, as a kragg player I often 0-death diamond and above rank lightweights with a combo that leads into triple fair, and though i'm not super competitive, looking at the tournaments for rivals 1 sure makes it seem like fair is much stronger in the first game
fair seems fine, cargo d-throw could could be nerfed a bit, but I think this is just a case of the big guy being easy and strong with no counterplay developed yet
I have such high hopes for this game, every sspect of this is passion for the platformer fighter genre, headed by creative and ambitious devs. Buying this day 1
the fact that leffen got reverse 3-0'd because he got hit with pillar uptilt upair not once but twice is funny as hell to me that's the day 1 bro, cant be getting hit by that almost 9 years after the game comes out
The thing is, when the game is new, heavy and simple characters are the meta, in a way People were not edgeguarding Kragg well for exemple, so the Kraggs eliminated the others
@@ColoredCrowthis exactly. I can't remember who it was but I remember seeing a vid explain this exact concept. In almost every fighting game the heavy and simple like characters like Grapplers or Kragg tend to dominate early on since they're the easiest to pick up and the counterplay to them isn't figured out yet. Once the meta settles though they tend to go from top tier to mid tier or even bottom tier.
There's no such thing as "meta" the way people describe it. Of course the best players are going to make their character look dominant, that's personal preference, not a character being broken.
Where can I see the entire tournament? I don't really care for these tiny clips, I'd rather see everything as it happens. I searched on Twitch but I can't find it.
watching back the clips i think the reason why leffen didn’t win is because he thought rivals played like smash. rivals and smash are very separate entities. in smash (melee and smash 4 especially), you have a good degree of freedom of movement, which is where player expression really shines, but you don’t have a good degree of combo expression (hence the term “true combos”, the existence of chain grabs, ladder combos, shine’s set knockback, and some other things). the same goes for most traditional fighting games, this move will always lead into that move, etc. rivals is special because it doesn’t have any true combos, you need to adapt to your opponent’s DI or rely much more heavily on reads/tech chases for longer strings. it’s actually a huge part of what makes rivals not only special, but consistently interesting. this is also why the pummel system is the way it is. a lot of the time leffen died it’s because he’s not used to the sheer amount of options that rivals 2 gives you, even in disadvantage. that’s why he got cheesed by kragg about four (maybe more) times, he thought an outcome was guaranteed and was proven wrong each time. just some thoughts on the game so far, i’m super excited for its release.
In melee you have a really strong DI and also SDI, + the crouch cancel is way stronger. I would argue you have more defensive options in melee compared to Rivals. And even tho there is some "true combo" starting from shine for example, most of the combos are very DIable and aren't true in the way you are describing it (this move always lead into this etc). But I agree he doesn't really play Rivals 2, he plays melee in Rivals 2. You can see it in the way he almost doesn't use special move except for needle, and he doesn't know anything about Kragg cheese and especially the pillar. But he is new to the game so it's not surprising. It's just funny to see him complain after only 1 tourney, like he already solved the game and the match-ups.
@@PureSangheili To be fair, in Rivals you have really strong DI as well, and though I'm not sure they've changed that in Rivals 2 I'd be very confused if they did. I'd say that they're more comparable. I'm not sure about the crouch cancel point, as in I don't think I know enough to prove or disprove it. But sure. That's fair enough. In terms of defensive options, I still generally think Rivals generally has more - if not onstage, then at least offstage. Stuff like Maypul's side special into wall cling benefits her recovery immensely, and we even see a Kragg make it from really far offstage 11:58 during the tournament. But we can both agree it is rather funny to see him complain. I don't think bro used side special once the entire time.
@tthedash I know you have a strong DI in ROA too. I was just talking about it cause you were talking about the combo game in ROA being really different from smash games. But it's really different only from smash games since Brawl, not melee. Melee and Rivals combo games are kinda similar. I do agree about the offstage defensive options of Rivals. But to be fair I dont really like ROA off stage game. So I'm glad they nerfed it in Rivals 2 to compensate the ledge grab. I'm kinda annoyed when I have to push away again and again a character because they can always up B -> walljump -> up B. And I dont like it in Ultimate either, where 98% of character can comeback from really far away. It's fine when it's only few of them. And it's not you but I'm surprised by people talking about nerfing Kragg's fair instead of his up air. From what I'm seeing his up air looks really obnoxious and it combos into itself way to easily. Even tho once again, even if Kragg is probably strong, it's too early to call him the best. Especially since we had 2 char added to the game for Genesis, and 2 others coming for the release.
@@PureSangheili You know what, I think this is perfectly fair. In a general sense, Melee and Rivals do have very similar combo games, and the moves I pointed out were more of the exception and not the rule. Even things like chain-grab are only true because you quickly react to the opponent's options. I, conversely, am a big fan of ROA offstage game, but I'm also super glad they nerfed it in Rivals 2 to compensate for the ledge grab. I am also not a big fan of how easily the characters in ultimate can recover, I feel like if you're going to have a recovery go that far you should at least have to work for it more. I'm cautiously optimistic about Kragg, to be honest. I've always found him to be a character with a lower skill floor compared to the other fighters in ROA, so this tournament result made sense to me. I don't think Kragg is overpowered, but people haven't been able to get their hands on the game for long enough to succeed with other character.
because Zeebee is an actual rivals 1 kragg main while I0n is mainly a p+ knuckles main but has the fundies to get to top 8, so that's why Zeebee's kragg is so different.
Krag cargo to down throw look really broken lol even if the guy can press b u can just play mind game on the plummel to get it a 30% and kill , that's insane lol
@@666blaziken I just hate every time a KO is the result of "nah I got there first". I actually really like Rivals 1 having no ledges at all, and making the ledge and recovery game be extremely dynamic and scrambly. I'm still curious what a platform fighter with no ledge invincibility at all would look like.
