As I get older, I find the murders, one of the least interesting thing about her, her staying on in Fall River and attempting to carve out some kind of life for herself.
The slop jars didn't contain anything more than the washing water left in a pitcher, contrary to many speakers on the subject. Most bedrooms had a pitcher of water and a bowl for washing in. On the floor would be a metal, covered pail, and the dirty water (the slops) were put in there for throwing out in the morning. The chamber pot would have been poured into the earth lavatory outside.
Bridget went upstairs with neighbor but she didnt notice Abbys body, the neighbor spotted it. So could very well be that Lizzie didnt notice it when Bridget was unlocking front door & heard giggling, either from another room in 1st floor, or up the stairs behind her
I have listened to many speakers and films and posted like this. I heard only once that Emma's buggy had been seen very early in the morning when it was dark around the house and that there were two raincoats in the basement and only one was found. Emma swore to her mother that she would take care of lizzy. I really believe Emma had more to do with all this than we think. Emma wouldnt let her step mother take away from lizzy. She was spoiled not just by the father. Strange that their mothers brother just happened to be there too.
This is what keeps me fascinated by this case. There were other ppl in the house and the uncle seems very suspicious. It’s hard to be sure who did it! A true mystery!
The picture portrayed is not Lizzie, but her older sister, Emma. I have read many books on the Borden family and stayed twice at the murder house overnight. It was great fun and quite interesting, especially in the basement. The people who came as guests as I did were fun, loving curious people who were enjoyable to spend time with. No spiritual or ghostly affirmations appeared, it was a very normal night. Oh well!
Small point about the slop pail in the backyard.... Slop pails were not chamber pots as this speaker suggests. They were used to dispose of waste water used in the bedroom where there would be a pitcher and bowl for washing hands, cleaning teeth, etc. Dirty water, slops, would be carried in a can with a lid and disposed of downstairs somewhere.
Oh that's right -- several sources report there was a two-seater privy in the cellar. So wouldn't they pour their slops in there? I would assume so, but ...
Wonderful Speaker, thoroughly fascinating, funny and thoroughly... thorough! Thank you for this most complete overview. Greg's sense of humor is a howl! L0L, anonymousmom PS ! I heard (RU-vid's Shauna Rae) that an Old Ax/Hatchet Still With some Gilt on it ! was found on the roof of a very nearby garage or out-building, like, by some chance or another, I don't recall, when but my mind says pre-DNA... such a mystery .
It was stated in many other lectures about Lizzie Borden, that the other Bordens in their town were the relatives of Lizzie and her family. They lived in the grander homes on "The Hill" for wealthier families.
Of course, Lizzie committed the murders the first kill had more blows than the second because she had rage towards her stepmother. the fact that she tried to buy poison the day before that but that didn’t work out, she said that Abby was out because she got a note and was visiting some sick friends which was a complete lie. The fact that she had the motive and the opportunity and the only one that was in the house during both murders and she heard nothing? no offense, but anyone that thinks that she did not commit the murders this is a pretty black-and-white case you’re not looking at it enough.
No joke, but the other day I went on a PC Zaraya Board wheel and asked it WHO KILLED MR. AND MRS. BORDEN? The wheel went to SISTER and then to UNCLE. I'm not making this stuff up!
If the windows were being clean. Inside and out. Is it possible. Someone could have gotten in and out? Did the police see if anything in house was stolen or missing. The uncle visit was strange , his ally could have been lies. The blood not on her in such a short time and no real modern wash up. No blood trail splatter getting to wash up. ???
The next door neighbor could have done it. Easily slip next door twice . Like while Lizzie was in back yard, & not be seen, screen side door unlatched. In real life all kinds of crime hapoen by peopke you don't expect, while family members are always the 1st suspects.
Interesting article, however, the picture of Lizzie is not Lizzie but her sister Emma. I have stayed in the murder house twice and have had plenty of fun with the other guests there. Very entertaining and full of people who are not only interested in the case, but want to have a fun evening and morning
The woman in the picture is not Lizzie, but her older sister, Emma. I haveen stayed at the murder house twice overnight and it was fun, the people were enjoyable, and the atmosphere was anything but scary. Nice way to spend one summer nights . I think I hmost of the Borden books and that picture is definitely not Mrs. Churchill ei
The song My Ain Countrie was sung at Lizzie's funeral, and Greg Williams says it was the first and fourth verse that was sung. However, this song only has three verses.
police could not find the bloody dress on murder day because Lizzie was WEARNG it UNDERNEATH a clean dress; the murder weapon was also concealed under her heavy skirts, strapped to her leg
Wai wai, she washed the dress or burned it. They found a broken ax head in an ash bucket in the basement. I stayed overnight in the house, it's truly haunted. There are ghost cats and I took pics in the basement one right after another and you can clearly see Andrew Bordens ghost face move side to side. They tour guide had me help reenact the murder, playing the part of the mom. I had to fall and lay on the ground face first right where her body was found. (One of the more creepier things I've ever done)
Not possible. The type of dress she wore would have been too fitted and took all too long to get in and out of, abd she sure as Hell didnt simply wear a slip (a flimsy evening gown) in those days. Wardrobe was a process. Mr. Bordens coat was found stuffed under his head, despite the fact the couch already had a built in pillow. He was 6'4 and the coat was black. A perfect murder gown for someome approximately 5'3
@@tenebrisrex333 good one. But she came later and burned a dress that she said had paint on it. They believe it may have been blood instead of paint. I thought she may have put it in the barn where she said she was for 20 minutes. I don't know if she was really even in the barn, they said it still had cobwebs like no one has been in there a long time. The only other theory is that the investigators didn't do a good search?
46:45 Just in an aside: Andrew's body is positioned not as if he'd been lying prone (even if he'd been lying with his booted feet off & away from the sofa or even extended all the way onto the floor, they would be farther to the right in the photo). Instead, it very much appears (to me) that he'd been sitting up, perhaps speaking to someone who suddenly swung a hatchet and felled him with a single blow so that he did not try to defend himself. To me it looks like he fell backwards from a sitting position into the half-prone position he was found / photographed. UNLESS someone moved the body before the photo was taken, of course. But why would the police photographer do that? Who would move the body to place his feet into an otherwise natural sitting position, nearly flat on the floor at the center of the sofa? And why? Some think his killer snuck from the kitchen and struck from the doorway behind him, as he lay sleeping. But that and the blood spatter on the picture above the sofa (but unreported on the door frame?) don't account for his position either, at least not in this 100% amateur CSI's indirectly informed opinion. Your thoughts??
The photos of Andrew and Abby Borden are not true , modern style crime scene photos. Both were moved after being found to examine their wounds and to see if they were really dead and get a cursory idea of how they died . Then , the photos were taken . Andrew Borden’s position on the sofa is not how he was originally found-he was pulled up, possibly to a sitting position, then put back as closely as possible to his original position. The modern crime scene protocol of not moving or touching anything at a murder scene had yet to be developed . Unfortunately, his original position after being killed can not now be determined. Fingerprint technology was still in the future as well.
@@gloriamontgomery6900 Too bad they were moved before the photographer arrived. Andrew's position is odd so it'd be helpful to know what his original position was. His coat without question played a part. No way he'd have wadded it up and used it as a make-shift pillow like that. It was put there by the killer, who undoubtedly wore it to protect themselves from getting blood on them. No other reasonable explanation.
WOW!! Thank you for posting this. Police Det.'s did their own investigation and the cut off AX blade matched exactly with a cut Mark in Mrs. Borden's scarf. You could tell that the AX handle was sawed off, it didn't just brake off, the bottom half was probably burned. Why roll it in the ashes ect? to make it look older and maybe to take the 'new?' finish off the blade? The police Det.'s also used a spray bottle down in the basement at the dry sink and found traces of blood on the metal bowl and on the wall, also found blood traces on the wooden boards where the couch was where Mr. Borden lay dead. They did sound tests to see if you were in the house would you hear a heavy body drop to the floor and the answer was yes. They thought that maybe the dress had gotten blood on it during the Mrs. Borden's murder but when it had come to Mr. Borden maybe the person who killed him may have been in the nude then went to the basement to wash up and dress. What would Lizzy have been doing 'painting'? Both Lizzy and sister saw daddy buying homes for the step mother's realitives and buy and giving other property's away and when they stated they each wanted a home or whatever their father ignored it. They saw that they would likely not get a dime in their dad's 'WILL'. Of course there wouldn't be a 'WILL' found on Mr. Borden because the sisters probably distoryed it so the step mother's realitives wouldn't get a dime. I do believe that the father had relations with Lizzy, she gave him her class ring and this probably angered the sister who swore to her mom to protect her sister. Maybe Mr. Borden had relations with both kids, we'll never know. Of course I have no hard proof that Lizzy did it on her own or had the help of her sister, the maid ect BUT!!! I do think it IS KNOWN WHO KILLED THEM...Why won't they release the files on the case?!? (IF they still exist) Did Lizzy do it? I guess we'll never know. It's just sad all around. If she was so 'innocent' then why did all those folks shun her? I like many others have tried to study the case for years but at this point would it really matter who did it? Whomever did it is long gone and let's just let them rest in peace. Personally I believe in God and I leave it up to Him. Again thank you for posting this. That man was very knowledgeable and kind to share this with us and I thank him to. Me personally...I think OJ did it.😉 (Kidding of course!)
I'm fairly certain, that photograph is not Alice Russell, but of another friend of the Borden girls, Mrs. Churchill okay, he's mixed up his Mrs. Churchill and Alice Russell. rookie mistake.
Why are you celebrating a murderer's birthday she did plan that she was crazy back in that day things moved a lot slower so the maid going out to do the windows was going to take her all day Lizzie Borden knew what she was doing she killed those people premeditated Cold Blood
I think that whoever did it had to have already known how to use a hatchet because that's not easy to do if you don't usually swing one. I don't think Lizzie would have used one so she would not have had the physical strength. But then again, we don't know and we can only guess.
Crazy folks have alot of strength. Look at mom's who see their kid under a heavy tree or something like that and they somehow pick up the thing and move it off their child.
Adult Emma looks nothing like the young emmas. Unless her nose and eyes completely changed. The ears look almost the same but...the later looks like a totally different person. Anyone wanna chime in on that? I dont see how that later photo could be the same person
You know this they don't know if Lizzie Borden if it did that it's a shame how they keep talking about it like that without any proof personally I think she was innocent I think she was a great person what's hot in her whole life for something she probably didn't do all I can say is God bless her I know she was never married if I was around at that time I would have married her because she's a great person I I feel so sorry for her God bless her wherever she is I think people should just leave her alone they don't know the truth now I don't either I know she was home around a lot longer before I was born I would have liked to have known her God bless her Michael
Who was she? Good question. Not one person can answer that. We can all just assume. No one knows what happened for certain. We can only go by the false stories we're told which do contain mistakes and made up info I'm sure.
If Lizzy had planned to kill them in advance w/out the aide of the maid wouldnt she have planned better by sending her on some chore out back away from potential hearing of the deed at least a scream or struggle? I think it somewhat obvious the two were in cahoots. Was the maid any better off financially after this?
YES the maid was well off, so was the lawyer and remember the doors were LOCKED BIG TIME. Lizzy probably killed the step mom while wearing a dress got blood on it that she latter burned. Why would she paint in good clothes and what did she paint? She probably killed the dad while nude then the maid helped her get cleaned up and dressed in the basement. The handle on the AX was sawed off and the blade fit perfectly in the cut found in the step mom's scarf. Moderen day Dets. found blood on the metal bowl used as a dry sink and on the walls in the basement and on the boards where the couch was after they'd sprayed their chemicals. Also look how the wounds are, looks like the person was right handed.
Actually it was a rumor, from what I read this is not true, she ended up in Montana, married a man also named Sullivan, and spent the rest of her life in poverty.
@@ghostcityshelton9378, Lizzie didn't paint in the dress. The painters painted. Lizzie supposedly rushed downstairs to show her father or Emma or both her new dress and accidentally brushed up against the fresh paint on the wall or stair rail. There is an ALFRED HITCHCOCK PRESENTS episode, "The Older Sister", where it is suggested that Emma was actually the guilty party.
If you read the maids witness statement , once she'd let Andrew in at 10.45am , Lizzie tried to interest her in a fabric sale in town. As she felt unwell, she declined & went to her attic bedroom. Also, when letting Andrew in the front door, she stated she really struggled with the lock & heard Lizzie laughing at her on the landing: where Lizzie should have been able to see Abby's body on the Guest Room floor. The body was found face down half under the bed & was pulled out for photographs. Abbys nose & forehead were bruised. It was thought a first glancing blow to the side of her head, sent her to the floor & she was trying to crawl away from the rest of the 12 blows.
@@sarahholland2600, that's what the maid SAID. That doesn't mean she wasn't in on it, or that she didn't lie on the stand to protect Lizzie. In fact, I read somewhere that the maid was given a large sum of money by Lizzie to return to her country and that she confessed to one of her family members that she had protected Lizzie on the witness stand. There is no way that the maid didn't hear Mrs. Borden fall to the floor. Lizzie's and Emma's Uncle John claimed he didn't noticed the large crowd gathered outside of the Borden's home when he returned when, in fact, a man who guarded the Borden's front door saw Uncle John fight his way through the crowd, walk to the backyard and picked two pears from the pear tree. I am pretty sure that Lizzie, Uncle John and the maid were all in on the murders and/or cover-up. To be honest, I'm not convinced that Emma wasn't aware of the plan. Her trip to Fairhaven sure was convenient timing. . .
March 27, 2020: 1) Friend, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God; for many false prophets have gone out into the world; and 2) If you will declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. Romans 10:9
Jesus was a human being like you using restrooms like you shit like you drink like you he was nothing but a messenger of god’jesus said am going to your god which is also ma god so god has no god but Jesus did it worship the lord of Jesus Allah the one and only no mom no father no son only one the most merciful the most gracious
I think the maid did it. Just because she said she was cleaning windows doesn’t mean she hadn’t already killed her- and just because she said I was sick and taking a nap, doesn’t mean she didn’t kill Mister first.
Doubtful but I think the maid lied for Lizzie...I've been to that house there is NO WAY Lizzie could have not noticed Mrs. Bordens body..Plus What Maid especially back then would go take a nap without informing her employer ? She would at the very least told her she was done with the windows and was going to lay down....If Lizzie is on the Top of the landing When Andrewcomes home there is NO WAY SHE DIDN'T SEE ABBY!
The maid was seen cleaning the outside windows, by the maid next door, when Abby died at approx 9.30. ( they went off undigested breakfast in her stomach contents & the blood being congealed already when she was found, just after Andrew died). Just after Andrew returned at 10.45, Lizzie tried to get the maid to go to a fabric sale. She declined, as she felt unwell, then went to her attic bedroom. 15 mins later Lizzie shouted for her, saying Andrew was dead. The maid had just heard the town clock strike 11. The Police discounted the maid early on. Lizzie trying to get rid of her is a big red flag.
I find it odd that the demeanor of Lizzy B.had not been spoke of very much ,her reaction to there deaths Seemed icee and no hysterically shocked her family was murdered ??? I wonder if she really did do it!🤔🤔.
I've studied the case for years and personally I think Lizzy, her sister, and the maid did it. (And also I believe Lizzy's lawyer was in on it too !!!)Yes the sister was conveniently out of town when it happened but she'd sworn to protect her sister and she did. Follow the MONEY, find the killer (s). The 'WILL' was conveniently never found, Lizzy sure did get a lawyer FAST huh? Why to this day do they keep certain 'records' sealed? I think those records were destoryed years ago. The AX that was found in the basement matched perfectly the cut made in Mrs. Borden's scarf, modern Dets. found that out and sprayed down in the basement and found blood in the dry sink bowl and wall and on the boards where the couch would have been. The 1st murder Mrs. Borden was done when the person was wearing clothes, (remember the 'paint' reson for burning the dress? What would Lizzy have been painting?) and when Mr. Borden was killed the Dets.thought it could have been someone doing it in the nude, then they quickly got cleaned up and dressed in the basement. I'll bet the maid helped her clean up and get dressed with all the stuff they wore back then. Also Mrs. Borden was a big women and would have made a very loud noise when she hit the floor. With no 'WILL'how did Lizzy's sister get all of the money and then slip it with her sister? 🤔
Confused by " Andrew Borden " was a Multimillionaire " His Estate when he died was 265,000 which would = about 6 million today but no where near a multimillionaire .
Andrew Borden WAS NOT A MILLIONAIRE ,,, His Estate was around 1/4 of a Million at his time of death.. IF HE HAD DIED IN 2018 Yeah He would have been one. That's what was confusing I believe the Man said he was a Mutimillionaire when he died and NO HE WASN'T .
CJ carp excuse me. But what exactly do you think a multimillionaire is supposed to be worth? The turm means more than one Fucktard. And they are putting it into today's value system. They were on a complete different system. OMG LMMFAO
Excellent presentation! Greg Williams was a marvelous speaker, very engaging. He was extremely fair to Lizzie and described exculpatory evidence that others often omit. I was especially interested in his discussion of the famous mutton and “Summer Sickness.” I do think he dismissed Bridget Sullivan as a suspect rather easily. She was not treated with respect by her employers who couldn’t be bothered to call her by her right name, and was required to do heavy labor while ill during a heat wave. I have read that when very ill, Bridget sent for a friend intending to confide a secret, yet when the friend arrived, the crisis had passed and Bridget never revealed the secret. Others here have criticized Williams' use of real-values (as opposed to nominal figures) in describing Andrew Borden's wealth, but I don’t think it is that big a deal. His audience wasn’t a bunch of professional economists. His presentation has also been described as disrespectfully lighthearted. All the principals in the matter are deceased and have been for more than ninety years. There are no descendants. There really isn’t a reason for anyone to be offended except in the most general way.
Too self-serving with underhanded political put downs that shouldn't be addressed in historical matters. The speaker behaves as though he was bored and didn't really want to be there. Yawn.
Is the name "Bridgett" funny? Or her nickname "Maggie"? Is the murder funny? Is this a historic lecture or a stand up comedy attempt? Are many of the audience members daft or is a laugh track played after every slide? I should have watched the slide show with the sound off as the pictures are interesting whereas the sound is annoying as hell. Lizzy was probably sexually abused by her father since a young age and that is why she had a deep hatred for her dad. Most laughter incited by the pictures of the skulls.
I have to come in again you're a terrible man what do you believe in the murders or not makes no difference the way that you portray it and the way that you handle yourself you need to be in prison my friend your nuts you're in comprehensible
I don't know who you are and I don't know that much about the Lizzie Borden case and I don't even care to you are not a comedian and you try to act like you're funny about something that is not you're full of s*** dude I like the punch you in the face
