Heracross's biggest issue is speed, which is nullified by Baton Pass'ing Agility to it. With lead Zapdos with Substitute, and Marowak as a partner, its unique coverage and defensive utility allows it the potential to sweep or clean up teams within a dozen or so turns, when you're running Swords Dance 3 Attacks, particularly with Guts. That has always been the way I've had the most success with Heracross and why I've come back to it recently after not having used it for a very very long time. I also tried pairing Gyarados and Heracross back then on a non-Baton Pass team, but as you know, with Offense, unless you have Blissey, you struggle for reliable switch-ins, which somewhat forces you to use Snorlax, with its particular limitations. I found that that sort of team in this generation doesn't have as much capability to pull off a run away sweep as soon as a mon gets in, nor even just blow a hole in the opposition they won't be recovering from---so what's the point of that kind of offense in gen3ou? I've yet to find the definitive team for this couple that is unmistakeably offense. I am a big Gyarados believer because of its non-weakness to Ice Beam, capacity to shut down Skarmory, and ability to sweep teams, but I still rarely find opportunities to fit it over Salamence because the latter's speed and access to Rock Slide allows it to threaten things Adamant HP Flying Gyarados cannot. With no reliable way to my knowledge of removing the likes of Zapdos and Aerodactyl, I could not design a team that got the most out of this Gyarados set without being boring balance. I have tried Gyarados with Rest on Superman because of its defensive profile and offensive threat, and I think it has a lot of potential there, since you can cover its weaknesses with Flygon, Blissey, and even your own Zapdos without ceding too much momentum.
I wish moxie gyara existed in earlier gens where it would’ve been legitimately good instead of gen 5 when it was left in the absolute dust power creep wise.
Gen 2 and 3 Gyarados was just a hair short of the power it needed to work in the way its designed. Even if it had Physical Waterfall that would have helped a lot in Gen 3.
@@tylerd1297 Physical waterfall would be huge. I couldn't help but laugh at the part where BKC talks about how gyra sometimes slots in HP rock to hit aero. A WATER type slotting in ROCK coverage to hit a ROCK type. That in a vacuum is so funny to me in a sad way 😂😂😅😢
I've actually been playing the game now, gen 3 OU ladder with mixed offense teams. Let alone Heracross the whole archetype seems to be somewhat inconsistent. Still, pink salac hera sweeps are so satisfying when they happen.
@@yourdagan Yhea I remember a video about that somewhere, but it's a nice learning experience anyway, instead of building tss without knowing what im doing, I go bulkier over time when I realize starmie destroys me haha.
I've been playing a ton of ADV recently with the goal of using EVERYTHING that has some sort of relevancy or available set on the tier list from Arcanine to Banette to Cradily to Zangoose, and out of everything that has always been ranked OU, Gyarados has become in my opinion The Worst. I know BKC dislikes Snorlax these days, but I think Utility Snorlax still has a pretty solid little niche for supporting offense teams, and while CurseLax is a bad sweeper, it's a workable one. Gyarados, meanwhile, was such a letdown to use that I have it ranked in D tier below AZUMARILL, with my C tier meanwhile full of UU/BL Pokemon like Raikou & Camerupt. It's just so weak, and so restrictive on teambuilding with its typing and set. Once in a while it's a threat, both for you and for an opponent, but it's on the level where things like Entei or Rhydon also have equivalent occasions of being useful.
I agree with everything you said. I honestly think even rhydon is more satisfying. U have the same defensive role a bulky metagross but u get owned by waters and hp grass. Terrible ik but nothings better than mega horning a claydol that thinks its safe or just subbing on a switch to a ground immune when u have stab slide. gyara is just great into metagross and swampert but at that point u might as well use milotic i feel
