Some “Historical Accuracy” ideas that I’m curious to know: 1) The accuracy of weapon modifications/customization and special ammo types 2) The accuracy of heists and bank robberies within the time period the game is set 3) The accuracy of industrial towns and it’s people (Saint Denis) I’ll probably have more as I continue watching your channel. I really like the idea of what you have been doing and they have always been entertaining. Keep up the good work.
"1) The accuracy of weapon modifications/customization and special ammo types" Much like today, if you could find a competent gunsmith and pay him enough, he'd probably do just about anything within his abilities. There's nothing really wild about the modifications that are available. Adding optics isn't a big deal, albeit the mounting system that we see in game would need to be treated like it's fine china instead of using it to melee people with. For some reason... all guns appear to be sans rifling in the game and only have it after you purchase it... which doesn't make sense. Barrel length? Again, not an issue. Having a longer barrel than anything the company puts out would have to be custom made, which is possible but would be obscenely expensive and require a lathe and an exceptional gunsmith (or custom order from the firearm manufacturer). Shorter would be very easy to cut, recrown the muzzle, put sights back on, ect. Finishes? You can do electroplating on individual parts. Now as for ammunition... You're not going to get any decent amount of explosive filler that is sensitive enough to detonate on target but not in the gun with anything from the 1890s in the size of things like handgun ammunition. Field artillery? Yeah, no problem. As far as incendiary, that might work in a shotgun if you could get some reloader that knew what they were doing and chemicals like magnesium. Irish nationalists managed to develop a primitive form of white phosphorous in the 19th century at some point, but... the question is would it work well and be safe? The answer is almost certainly "No" and "Hell no." Split-top bullets are basically just carving an X into the top of cast lead or jacketed rounds, and that's been done since about that time period. High velocity would just be the same caliber and cartridge but a lighter bullet weight and made being hard cast or jacketed. Express? More powder charge, heavier/longer bullet and likely either solid copper or lead.
Haha nicely done with this mate. I was always curious to everything you just answered for me. I know we have made advances in our weaponry over time but I wasn’t sure how far back some of this dated. Thank you.
@@sniperdude4956 It was an interesting time period. I mean, the self-contained metallic cartridge was still a relatively new invention at the time the game takes place. A lot of people think WWI was the jump start in firearms innovation, and a lot did come about because of the war... but a lot of the designs were based on concepts and designs already in the works or from previous models before the war. I mean, from just prior to the turn of the century before this game took place, we see some of the first commercially available and successful autoloading pistols to within 20 years America making the Colt 1911 its military service handgun. Maxim started work on his Maxim machine gun prior to commercially available smokeless powder being made (so, yes, a machine gun utilizing black powder... would've been bad enough to try and shoot something without having a cloud of smoke envelope you, but the amount of carbon fouling you would've gotten from black powder... man...) to water and air cooled machine guns and even man-portable machine guns and machine guns in airplanes. By the way, tracers were also developed around the start of the war. As were some forms of primitive incendiary rounds. A bit out of the time period of the game, but not by much.
Either way, I'll take it. Great show. Loved Bryan Cranston since he played the dentist back on Seinfeld. If you haven't seen those clips, do yourself a favor and watch them. Solid gold, I tell ya.
It would be easier to compare forts if you included RDR1 along with RDO. Fort Mercer is pretty isolated and abandoned unlike the Presidio and the town of Escalara found in Nuevo Paraíso. There are plenty of books and websites devoted to Spanish forts (presidios) including www.militarymuseum.org/Presidios.html which explain their layout and purpose pretty well.
@@ManvsHistory Naybe a side bit about some of the battlefields too? Was all that metal really left to just rot in the field. I'd think those cannons would've been salvaged.
Oh and the Bastille Saloon is a real life place with a fascinating history. Its clearly the LeLaurie Mansion on Royal Street. The suppose most haunted house in New Orleans. It was owned by the infamous Madame Delphine LeLaurie, the woman who tortured slaves to death for years until she was caught and fled. After the house was burned down, it was rebuild and used in various roles and in 1898 it was indeed a saloon/restaurant. Now that is detail.
The blue and white hotel that you see just as you leave Saint Denis from the North is a replica of the Commander's Palace which is a restaurant here in New Orleans. Not only is Braithwaite a town in Louisiana, the grounds and big house are based off Oak Alley plantation out in Vacherie.
I was in a posse online,one of the members called for help over the headset.He was getting jumped in the saloon by 5 NPCs at once,so me and four other members of the posse had to storm the saloon and save the member of the posse who was being beaten by the NPCs.
100 years later and the best advice still rings true: "Just be chill." But the real question everyone wants answered: How often did saloon fights involve someone being thrown through a window only to run back inside and quickly be thrown out the other window in a slapstick-esque fashion?
Or the guy gets up after being thrown through the window, turns around and is immediately knocked backwards over a hitching post into a horses water trough
Nobody got thrown through plate glass windows in the Old West because there were (essentially) no plate glass windows in the Old West. Float glass hadn't been invented so each pane was laboriously blown and then rolled out by hand and finished with chipping hammers and polishers. Plate glass was very expensive even on the East coast, much more wavy and yellow compared to modern float glass, and impossible to transport safely by wagon. Imagine the size of a shop window - now imagine carrying it on a wagon across rugged terrain for many hundreds of miles, and you get zero dollars if it cracks at any point. You get the idea. If a saloon had glass on the front at all in the late 1800s, it was small, thick, discolored panes easily transported and later stuck together by a local glazier using lead glazing. Same as most people used in the period. You couldn't see through it, but it provided light during the day and enticed people off the dark streets at night.
I live in Arizona and often visit Tombstone. One of the saloons there was kept with all of the old stuff for people to see, including a barber's chair.
6:25 - Old West Faro's dealer edge is indeed razor thin, but the dealer could also cheat much easier and more covertly than in poker or blackjack. It was such a common thing to run a slightly rigged faro layout that most of the famous gunslingers did it at one point or another.
If you're traveling across Washington state, the Brick in Roslyn is absolutely worth a stop for an Old West saloon aficionado. The current building was rebuilt in 1898 using local bricks, hence the name. The old school bar and barstools are cool, but the standout feature has to be the 23-foot spittoon with running water along the base of the bar. The water still flows, but I don't recommend spitting in it. The 86'd list at the Brick is somewhat notorious and lengthy, with just a few names crossed off. I asked a bartender once what someone would do to get on the list and heard the usual tales of too much hooch and too many poor decisions by former customers happening once too often. Then I asked how you got off the list, noting some of the names crossed off. "You die," she said. So yeah, don't spit in the spittoon.
@@ManvsHistory It was a big bummer when the annual Spittoon Boat Races and Nautical Ball had to be cancelled this year. Covid claims another treasured tradition.
You love the 18-19 hundreds history and this game to the point we're you make a video about how historically accurate the god damn salons are, you are a legend
The saloon in Valentine does have real door as noticed when you have the bar fight with bill Charles and javier after that mission you can see the windows boarded up and door shut for repairs
The whince and recoil everytime you read something insane on those old articles is great! Also much more glad to see you dive more on the history than gameplay aspects or mechanics themselves as one is far more interesting to me anyway. Keep up the great work!
If you make it to Ft. Worth let me know. I'll bring you to the White Elephant Saloon. There is a historical marker out front telling how the last gunfight of the old west took place there.
I plan on doing a Tales of the West on Luke Short's shootout there (well, right outside, but close enough!). I love Luke. Totally underappreciated gunslinger. A dangerous, dangerous man.
7:08 I herd the sound of an electrical zap or maybe a match lighting or like to thin pieces of wood slapping together an I was wearing headphones and thought the broke until I when back and the sound happened again at the same spot anyways like ur channel and loved this video
Great vid, I’d be interested in seeing one about the historical accuracy of the army in rdr2, such as the uniforms, weaponry, and even those goofy haircuts they have.
They would’ve had mustaches or clean shaven ,since beards weren’t the trend in the span am war And have used a bolt action(krag Jorgensen) and a double action army revolver or a cattleman(single action army) Mainly dark blue shirt and beige /orange (if the dye goes wrong) pants
Expectation: Old West outfits, revolvers and old wood rifles, old cloth saddles on morgans and kentucky saddlers, cowboys chillin at the saloon Reality: Lime green glitched bolt action rifles, golden bounty hunter suits, golden delgado saddles, masks on horses, white arabian horses as common as tennessee walkers, lemats with explosive ammo
Love the attention to detail R☆ gives each saloon in game. You can feel the atmosphere in them all according to the part of town, or the town itself that you choose to visit, by the way the patrons react to you. Say , 'La Bastille' in St. Denis compared to Smithfields in Valentine. Not unlike real life in many instances, back to the wall, especially online is not a bad posture to take. At least you barely made your chair before getting griefed. Usually it's all you can do to get your drink and take two steps from the bar. Anyways, another great video professor and look forward to the next. " Shave and a haircut, two bits"....
While I do generally think historically accurate is better, I'm glad Rockstar went with the wide saloons we see in film instead of the thin kinds that were actually prevalent in history. Like you said it gives us more space to meander and mingle, it provided an excellent set piece for two of the greatest missions in chapter II of the story, and it's more accurate to what Red Dead Redemption II is trying to portray, since Red Dead Redemption II isn't a historically accurate 19th century west game, it's a *western* game, and wide saloons are pretty iconic to westerns.
Great vid, love the new role playing/ re-enacting, adds a lot to the stories. Do note though that there’s a sharp static sound at 7:09 in the video. Could be the new mic?
Thanks Mann Face. Glad you liked the 're-enacting'. I thought it was a fun change. Yes, I heard that too at 7:09. This was my first use of the mic, so I've got some things to tweak.
Very interesting and informative vid, things certainly haven't changed much with bars through the ages. Wherever alcohol is prevalent there will always be trouble. Most likely the local brothel helped to calm the men down when they were fired up on liqueur, good money in both establishments I'd say.
7:48 Lol You was probably chilled about it but I felt upset as if I was playing. Edit: 8:52 I LOVE the historical reenactments using Game's modern graphics.
Damn as a young man I never thought I’d say “the best lesson I’ve ever gotten about pride came from a news article in a paper that came out 200 years before I was born”
Red Dead Series Games i guess you’ve either never played storymode or you just only played the main story and didn’t bother to do side missions or explore everything that singleplayer had to offer
Interessting Video :) one edit to the size and how many people fit into a saloon. In germany we got the "Karl May Festspiele" two Nature-Theater Western Shows around the novels of german author Karl May. We got two locations in "Bad Segeberg" and "Elspe". In Elspe they rebuilt the Towncenter of an old west town. Centralbuilding is the massive Saloon in the middel. Two floors, two stages, 450 seats and a Bar with a total length of 16! meters. This massive building was once in the towncenter of Bisbee, Arizona and in the 1970s it got rebuild in germany. Its rare original, very long Bar, was often used as a set for (western) movies
Hey Thomas! Never heard of this 'Centralbuilding', but I'd love to come visit it someday. However, what you're describing is, in the old west, a 'dance hall' or 'theater'- not a saloon. It's confusing of course because they all had bars inside of them- which sounds like they should be called saloons, but the bar area was more so the concessions stand than the purpose. Think of it like a bar in a hotel. The hotel has a bar, not the bar has a hotel. Hope that makes sense? Either way, it's a legit western dance hall/theater, which is still awesome. Wanted to mention that I've been to Germany several times and loved it- especially Bavaria. Fussen was awesome. Also loved Rothenburg ob der Tauber after the tourists leave.
@@ManvsHistory well look up google picsearch "elspe festival saloon" i would love to hear from an expert what kind of buiding it is. Yes there are pretty cool medival towns. Most of them are rich on old buildings and history
@@thomasnieswandt8805 Just looked it up. That's a dance hall/ theater. But it certainly does have a bar, which all the big dance halls and theaters did. Historically you'd pay for your ticket and get a voucher for one free drink. In dance halls, the girls would dance on stage, then they'd clear that big open space and dance with the customers. Each customer had to buy a chip (ivory token) for a dance. Then give the ship to the girl they wanted to dance with. Usually you could get 5 chips/ $1. After each song the girls would encourage the guys to buy them drinks, bc they received commission on each drink/bottle they sold. What's funny is that the customers would buy the girls shots of whiskey, but the bartender would pour the girls shots of tea , and the customer a shot of whiskey. This kept the girls sober and brought the saloon more money. These establishments brought in an obscene amount of money. It was the perfect storm of music, alcohol, and women. Note: These girls weren't prostitutes, they were just dancers. So the men would fall in love with them all the time, and pay money hand over fist to dance, drink, and talk with them.
@@thomasnieswandt8805 Definitely! It's still from the wild west, and it has the bar and everything. Truth be told, these were way more fun than saloons. And if a cowboy had the choice, he'd hit the dance hall instead.
Another amazing video sir! The only thing I'm curious about is the popularity of pianos in salons. I can only imagine how expensive a basic upright piano would have been back then. Time wise, would we have even seen them in salons back then? Or would they have only been in the fancy two-bits? I will be in Valentine sippin on 50 cent beer until I get an answer.
Howdy! Love your channel and I’m glad to see you growing I’m curious to see if you could possibly do Gunbelts? I’m curious to see if the “double belt” style was common or if it was another Hollywood trope. Plus I’m curious to see the prices and styles they had during the 1800’s compared to RDO
Thanks Mekilo. I thought it might make for a great video(s) to do a few reenactments of things I found in the papers back then. Some are hilarious. Not sure if others would like to see them, but I think it might be fun.
The only thing I try and make “realistic” about the ‘shine shack, is it’s a remodeled storage place, or basement if you will lol. The troubles of building and spending $$ on resources back then to build that underground structure is “unrealistic”; Just as the person just explained on this comment. And yeah, having all those people coming through is no doubt sketchy as hell and somebodies gonna rat, or jack your shit! Lol. And let’s face it, Mr. French (Marcel) isn’t the type to hold it down! It should at least included security, like 3 dudes well-armed down there guarding the perimeter. Would be mob boss style; and a way to make sure those NPCs don’t narc, lol.
Did some Saloons have barbershops like in Valentine? Also what about the history of men’s(and I suppose women’s) grooming at the turn of century or the Wild West? The era of flamboyant mustaches and facial hair, and the beginning of a lot hairstyles that are now classics today like the side part and the fade/undercut. The fade/side part/middle part would of been a sophisticated/rich man’s hairstyle while the undercut was considered the poor man’s substitute and a sign you couldn’t patronize a skilled barber?
I don’t know if someone has asked this or not but was it common for a cowboy town like Valentine to have two establishments? Because there is a “Saloon” on the Main Street but there is another one across from the gun store on the road coming from the rail station. By the way love your content. I like history a lot and the way you present it is awesome. Very entertaining while giving great history. It’s also awesome how much information you give. I do have an Idea maybe, About stage coaches and how the term riding “shotgun” got started. But anyways keep up the awesome content.
My grate uncle was killed at the red dog saloon in Juno Alaska they have Wyatt earps gun there that he forgot it’s all the wall pretty cool but any ways my grate uncle was hit with a full whiskey bottle and they don’t brake like in the movies nope he went home and died in his sleep to bleeding
Man vs. History ya the caribou and moose is what we hunted there a lot my dad was Subsistence up there out side of delta junction and I would go every year to help with the hunts
yo im surprised you havent done the historically accuracy of the haircuts in RDR. Could i straight up go into a barber shop back then and ask for a fresh fade like in the game?
"Don't get furious because a sot calls you a cur, because you won't treat him or drink with him. The cur belongs to the canine family and your upright position and two legs prove that you do not, and that man who gave you the pet name is stating what is not true". This needs to be on a plaque somewhere!
GTA Online has their Nightclub mega business... I hope one day Red Dead Online gives us Saloons. We can stock Maggie's Moonshine, feed people with the by-products of Cripps' Tannery, make some small profit from renting rooms, throw in some gambling tables and maybe unusable but heavily implied prostitute services.
@@ManvsHistory Rockstar used to go against the system, now they are that system. I wouldn't be doing the devil's tango out of my own perverted needs but for immersion of being in the wild west. Or atleast the dying one portrayed in the game.
My favorite is the Saloon in Valentine, no, not the usual place where you'd make a brawl, the smaller one, although there isn't much, you'd just want to order a beer and have a talk with the bartender, there's also a scent of nostalgia of something I don't really know, but I can smell it.
