How Bad Was Shaggy X Velma? 

I recall the days when people shipped Daphne with Scooby. It's real and disgusting.

Scooby is a dog , that’s pretty spot on for his species at times ( my first dog acted very jealous whenever my friends interacted with me.)

Seriously

parasocial relationships are a pain ain't it

HE'S A DOG! This is a natural dog response to get jealous!

I was looking for a coment like this😂

Like, this is, only 1% of my power Scoob.

Why do you think his greatest love story is with an alien.

That and Velma is gay as hell

ShaggyXGoogie (Shaggoo), OTP

At least it's more original than two girls fighting over a man.

Right?? Like Scooby isn’t a clingy ex. He would be overjoyed if Shaggy got a girlfriend.

​​@@nervousbreakdown711Not in Mystery Inc. He was clingy af. Then again the show also implied that Shaggy and Fred dated at some point. The Freddie scene.

@@nervousbreakdown711 but he is still a dog, and dogs can be quite territorial when it comes to their owners.

Scooby is an intelligent dog. It stops being cute when Scooby acted like Shaggy was a bro who broke the bro code. Like you're not even human! ​@@valentinkambushev4968

He didn't get that PHD from Trump University

Which honestly makes no sense especially when you compare him to Fred

​@micah459 I mean everybody has their type.Not to mention something about a dude who is always himself no matter the situation is cool

And he does it, without even trying. It honestly feels like a superpower, at this point.

Him and Velma's sister make a better couple. And even Scooby liked her.

Same, as annoying as the shenanigans this ship was I do still love how the show handled it

Another Gotham fan in the wild? Yeah, Selina and Bruce in that show are complicated ship. Still don't like them replacing Selina's actress in the finale.

@@kidanarchy2105They replaced her to make her look older. The actress also didn’t want to play herself older for some reason.

Baby BatCat honestly justified whatever relationship Bruce and Selina have in the comics and cartoons to me because instead of simply having a sexualized thrill of the chase dynamic it set up a loyal friendship between them. I especially love that line when she tells Bruce near the finale that she’ll be there for him whenever he needs her.

@@spectralight8412 I think Long Halloween has the best BatCat dynamic in the comics. It's a lot more than the thrill of the chase.

It's probably the most realistically dog thing he's ever done honestly. Dogs can get very jealous and overly-sensitive

​@@MrXemnas1992Cats act like you married them more than dogs. Dogs it depends on he breed.

Or that time he gave Shaggy the cold shoulder because he went to the prom with Velma instead of staying home watching a stupid horror movie marathon with him. He even started talking to a puppet.

Because it was a bad relationship

If you have a pet it’s normal like if you got another pet and spend even a minute with the new one the og pet will despise it.

Damn 😂

They’re not wrong

I remember that!~ 🥺

That actually makes sense

Wrong. In the 80s, everyone thpught Fred was gay.

Well being closeted doesn't help.

Tbh it's an equally bad problem on both sides

Yeah, I usually took her side in this debacle

Worse, this love triangle character assassinated Scooby.

@@ThePorpoisepower I mean sure, but this still applies even if she was just straight. Velma was overreaching because she didn't get set any borders.

99% of the time I agree. But sometimes you need to hear an ultimatum like that over something like alchohol/gambling.

@@kyleellis1825 True, there are always exceptions. What I said mostly holds for things that are not harming yourself or anyone else.

@@Nyahahameha Yeah and I agree with that sentiment. I'm just worried when I hear absolutes.

@@kyleellis1825 Honestly, I'm usually the same way. Thanks for the correction. :)

Scooby is a dog-don’t forget that simply because he can talk. He doesn’t really have anyone else but Shaggy because he’s Shaggy’s dog. Its natural for him to be jealous that Shaggy is no longer spending as much time with him, just as it’s natural for any dog to get upset when their owner is spending less time with them. What wasn’t cool was Shaggy giving in to Scooby’s demands. He should’ve told Scooby that he still spends plenty of time with him and that he needs to get over it. Instead, he gave in.

not excusing scooby, but I think it’s a bit different shaggy dating a girl outside of the group compared to one inside the group- the group is together all the time so there’s not many breaks in the time shaggy and scooby get to spend together when there’s a relationship added to the mix

He didn't like her even before he found out she was possessed. Probably because, being a dog, he smelt something off about her. Dogs usually get defensive when smell something off.

Shipping the characters together is why I refused to watch this series in the first place. Just let men & women be friends & let the fans ship in their own heads.

@@LikaLaruku I went into the show blind and was a bit put off by it. That being said, I didn't *mind* it, because it was honestly a different take on Mystery Inc (in a series, vs a movie) as a whole, which has been done and redone so many different times. But... I wouldn't have minded just friendships, once again.

3rd favorite person. It's was explicitly stated that his second favorite person was Shaggy's baby sister.

Fucking TRUUUUUUUE!

Yes,they are all nerds even though Daphne and Fred seem like a jock and a cheerleader couple

​@@BeaAdelineManlangitIronically enough, apparently Shaggys canonically the jock of the group cuz he was apart of track and field in their highschool days in the first iteration of scooby doo.

You might be able to convince me that Fred enjoys a good TableTop session but Daphne, neh, she's a social butterfly, she don't got time for that nerd shit. And no, watching Marvel movies doesn't make you a nerd, it just makes you the lowest common denominator.

​@@RenoRebornDaphne travels around in a van to solve mysteries as a teenage amateur detective with nerdy friends and a dog. She's nerd-adjacent. She's just well-socialized and fashionable. She would go to a gala, but she would also ditch said gala to chase a man in a fish suit through an abandoned amusement park in her gown and heels with her nerdy friends and dog. She would also probably use her mascara case mirror to blind a perpetrator and escape an underground prison based on which way her hair was blowing. If you're around nerds long enough, get along with them, and sometimes act like them, you would probably turn around with your nerdy friend group too. The Mystery Gang members sometimes remind me of Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys. Nancy wasn't conventionally nerdy, but she definitely appealed to nerds.

Honestly that's why I love this chanel. Most of the ships I like in media are problematic in some way (at least for the twitter standarts) but that's what makes them so interesting to me.

hell even in this same comment section there a ton of comments with hundreds of likes playing the "blaming game". This channel was truly a blessing from the algorithm

@@kaisim980 Shaggy and Velma both made mistakes, Shaggy doesn't seem to care about how Velma feels, while also making her feel like he's ashamed to be with her. While Velma is trying to change Shaggy, and she makes him afraid to tell her how he feels about things. Scooby doo also made things harder, but I forgive him because he's a dog.

Not to mention that after it ended, it was rarely mentioned.

​@@valentinkambushev4968It ended right at the time social media was starting to be picked up by everyone, 2.5 style. 2012ish? What's Up and Messenger were starting to become a thing? So it got off the radar.

@@valentinkambushev4968 I think was it. It does get mentioned by Velma offhandedly, but Mystery Inc. Velma was at her most savage. Everyone was catching straight heat whenever she was on the scene. Everything else, from the mystery of the day to the overarching plot with the disk, the series was so jam packed that when they dropped this ship it REALLY fell off. Not to mention, Freddy and Daphne also had shipping drama, but this show finally gave Fred such an engaging (himbo) personality that it was tolerable and even became part of the hijinks.

Why they were even a thing? All i renember is Velma forcing Shaggy to be her boyfriend, like what?

You know a show is actually good when it's biggest flaw is just brushed aside and generally forgotten

I would have loved if, in "Mystery Incorporated", they referenced Crystal. Shaggy had the love of his life, flat out leave through no fault of his own. Pair that with Velma's first romantic relationship (with or without her being LGBT)... and the teenage drama practically writes itself. ----- Or the creators of Scooby Doo material should make a movie where Crystal comes back. I would hijack an armored vehicle to fund that movie.

The ladies love power levels.

this just makes me think of Dingo's Scoob and Shag comic

Man Could Pull Abella Danger With 1% Of His Power.

Velma was basically making shaggy choose between his new girlfriend and his adopted special needs child.

Everyone was wrong here Everyone was harmed

@@kyleellis1825 Man, as a disabled person, I fucking hate the term “special needs”, that shit sounds so fucking infantilising.

@@thefallencore3 and as one myself, I far prefer it to the other terms. I'm still able to do most things, I just have special needs in getting them done.

Scooby is an Alien in some iterations.

How many times did Scooby save him over the years and how many times did Velma and the others leave Shaggy and a dog to explore the most dangerous spots alone?

SECONDED!

Why the fuck is her name "Hotdog Water"? 🤮

Thirded

Way more healthier!

Real

In this show. I shudder recalling one older show being very Daphne X Shaggy. Sacrilege thinking about it.

@@ninab.4540 Then there's the library episode of Mystery incorporated.

⁠​⁠​⁠​⁠@@ninab.4540 honestly if we have to pair the whole group together into two straight couples I’d go with Shaggy & Daphne and Fred & Velma for the sake of something different and more interesting.

​@@oreotaku4017We've had Shaggy X Daphne already but the show was shortlived. Fred X Velma was never done, and Velma X Daphne shippers have their caveat in the worst medium possible.

Yeah Marshy (hotdog water) was a exgirlfriend of her but at the end of the show they begane to date again (they weren't aloud to be open gay because the show was made even earlier then adventure time and the show was only aloud to be gay at the end of last season)

Well yeah, she didn't know she was lesbian

@@disgustof-riley8338 I am so sick of this lie being regurgitated. Velma was not a lesbian in the show nor was she ever in the past shows movies.

​@@zSteve1231 I always thought she was aroace or bi

@@tega8404 Bi, I understand since she been Queer washed in modern shows since the studios need one LBGT character in a show, but aroace? She always had a least one crush on a guy in previous shows.

@@zSteve1231The producer confirmed she was in mystery inc, why does your word on the matter supersede theirs? She was also shown having interest in Marcie, and the writers intentionally alluded to their mutual interest despite them not saying it plainly. I swear the people who use the lack of on screen verbal confirmation as proof that it never existed are intentionally overlooking how difficult it is to air media, especially media aimed at a younger audience, with explicitly queer characters. The writers did their best to allude to it, and confirmed it in interviews that it was intentional. This version of Velma was written to be a lesbian, it doesn't retroactively change the past Velma, but that is how she is canonically in this show.

Oh hey lmtfc didn't expect you here.

Bro, it isn’t lesbian if she’s also attracted to guys.

​@@Doomzdeh bi

they even got them on camera!

Well he sure wasn't like her friend! His first reaction to them dating wasn't "hey congratulations I'm so happy for you", it was "are you _cheating_ on me?" Forcing her to compete for relationship, but when Shaggy falls for a random girl suddenly he's the ultimate wingman.

@@DDarkestKnight I think Velma constantly downplaying Scooby into an animal is what causes Scooby to hate her so much. Velma is kinda being a bit racist to Scooby the whole show. Scooby is cognizant and completely and totally emotionally aware and Velma keeps treating him as “the dog”

​@@venomouskoala0690Fair enough. But that doesn't mean Scooby should take his anger out on Shaggy. Shaggy's the victim.

Honestly that was my interpretation of it like Velma constantly treated Scooby as just a pet and not shaggy’s best friend also she was constantly trying to change shaggy into something he wasn’t it’s understandable for Scooby to not like them dating even if he went overboard ships were really the only problem with mystery inc personally felt like shaggy/daphne would have worked better in this interpretation that’s just me though

@@venomouskoala0690 Bull. Because he doesn't even hate her he just gets weirdly jealous and territorial when she tries to date Shaggy. Like she's the other love interest and his rival, in the "you can't love him like I do" kind of way. If Shaggy acted like Scooby did when he dates Nova that would be *weird* . Probably weirder. There's no sense of racism here Scooby is a dog. It doesn't matter if he can speak perfect English now he's still classified as a pet and her feelings shouldn't be coming in 2nd to his.

I agree that's big ol 🚩for me. They're called "mans best friend for a reason", a real partner would understand the connection they have with their dog, had it be me, Velma would be single so quick.

She wasnt saying "the dog or me" just because she doesnt like dogs. She said it because Shaggy made it clear that he either will not or cannot be fair and attentive to both of them at the same time. The idea that anyone should always choose the dog, sentient or not, context be damned, is just not right. Someone who forces their partner to choose between them and the dog out of greed or jealousy is someone who is not worth being in a relationship with. But if the reason they gave this ultimatum is because their partner kept stringing them along, claiming they want to be in a relationship but then neglecting them and even hiding their love for the sake of a dog? Yeah the ultimatum would be justified.

​@@botanicalitus4194 Did I not already imply all that?? I just said IN GENERAL IRL, usually it's smart to pick the dog. NOT in-show.

@@imnotwhatiseem1727 They're specifically not talking about the show but questioning the basis on the dog always being right. Situations are nuanced and in SOME situations there can be an extreme reached where it's needed to make them realize where the priorities lie.

An intelligent dog with no human rights and is entirely dependent on Shaggy and whoever he marries? Velma has proven in this version of the show that she considers Scooby as little more than a pet and not like an intelligent member of the gang. She's frankyl speciest towards him for 2 seasons. Scooby was being rational is his defense of his home and knew he would lose all rights as an intelligent being if Velma moved in.

Stop watching Velma. Let it die.

AKA the most "yes i like Vanilla" ship on CN

Hopefully It Comes

Agree. It would be interesting to see his perspective on these two.

The most “nothing” cartoon couple ever

​@@alysssabearYou've never heard of BamBam x Pebbles? They had their wacky races era cartoon but everyone remembers the 90s movies.

No, Velma being gay makes sense and definitely explains her actions, it doesn’t justify them, but it explains it. She constantly tries to force Shaggy into being the ideal man, because she thinks that then maybe it would work and she’d be actually happy in the relationship, what she doesn’t really see yet is that it can’t work because 1. They’re incompatible and 2. She’s gay so he can never even be her perfect partner to begin with. Toxicity isn’t a normal trait for lesbians, but her not knowing how to actually act in a relationship with a guy and basing it all on stuff that she has seen on tv and what people tell her, makes total sense with her being gay.

@@thefallencore3 I didn’t say it didn’t make sense, I said her sexuality isn’t an excuse for her being toxic. Further, notice how you’re trying- very hard - to absolve the character of responsibility for the choices they made. According to you, her toxicity isn’t a character flaw, it’s because she’s gay. She’s not a bad person, who treats people badly, she’s just gay. Because, y’know, that’s just what gay people do. That’s just how you go about things when you’re in the closet, standard ops. Do you see what I mean? Velma is toxic AND gay. That behavior, that flaw, isn’t just going to disappear the moment she starts clam-jousting with Hotdog Water. And if abuse stats are anything to go by, she’ll probably get a helluva lot worse. STOP. DEFENDING. VELMA. This is not the hill you want to die on.

@@thefallencore3 Velma legit isn’t a lesbian. I don’t care what some writer said after the series already ended. She was getting frisky and passionate with Shaggy. Sure didn’t seem like she was having doubts at the time. Velma’s personality is very in-control. She likes knowing what she’s talking about, and takes pride in her intelligence. Attributing it to her somehow not actually wanting to jump Shaggy’s bones is ludicrous.

Let Shaggy be ace and Velma be a lesbian. Let them be queer besties!

​@@nervousbreakdown711I'm still waiting for either Fred or Daphne to be canonically bi so then Ace?Shag can form the invisible fence joke in visual form. *And it works* (Basically the ace carrying the bi on their back. Ace people are commonly said to be on the fence while bis get ignored unless they're rich. Make a joke that the villian doesn't see them as they hide in a corner and the joke lands)

@@nervousbreakdown711I love that take actually

@@ninab.4540 They'd make Daphne bi because writing a man that openly likes men is still a no-no.

Same

And we see them in a relationship FIRST, then we see them as friends. So we don't have to spend whole episodes cringing at how they're ruining their friendship. We just jump to them making things better

What is not of equal blame

Scooby is a dog, less than 10 years old, and has never gotten proper behvaiorial training on his emotions in the way a human should have. Scooby is basically a special needs child and Velma is a genius... supposedly.

Fred and Daphne don't get involved until the 90's and the live action movie/zombie island/johnny bravo crossover. It was Daphne/Shaggy in the original run and by 13 ghosts of scooby doo, they were almost married. It was only changed back to friends at the last minute. That's why Flim Flam is around, he was supposed to be the kid they essentially adopted.

What are next week's lotto numbers, I'm uh _testing a hypothesis_ let's go with that.

At least Classic Velma is finally canonically gay after 60 years.

​@@ninab.4540 Not really classic Velma

​@@YungandRekless545In the recent movie when she crushed hard on the villain making the costumes, that's Classic Velma.

I would have liked Velma to have a redemption arch & then getting with the nerd girl from hot dog water.

​@@ninab.4540Why do you say "finally" like she wasn't gay out of nowhere

Mystery Inc was good but people forget: it was still a cartoon made for kids.

Even worse, this love triangle completely character assassinated Scooby.

I can agree. This ruins the characters in so many ways. It's best to give them other people to fall for instead of each other.

He's a dog They get jealous That's the most dog like thing he can do​@@kidprime6863

I wish JelloApocalypse would make more videos like his Scooby-Doo video. It was great!

Same, I shipped Daphne and Fred so much. Them vaguely fitting into a conventional ship and calling them that waters dkwn their character. Fred isn't just the jock, he's smart in a trap-sy way, is the leader and has a quite interesting story regarding his parents and their connection to the previous mystery inc. Same way that Daphne is way more than the pretty girl. Daphne and Fred was a lot more than just the jock and pretty girl. And thats what makes conventional ships work because characers should be 3 dimensional making the ship different to other ships in other fandoms that may also follow the jock and pretty girl trope.

Best parody, sure.

Yeah like, sorry but an animal relies on you, for basic care and affection. A break up is hard, but being abandoned by the person you've dedicated your life to would be worse. Especially if it can talk and tells you you're their best friend.

Scooby is his dog.

Finish the video

Yeah, I kinda understand why cause Velma in this series seemed a bit pushy and just trying a bit too much in my opinion on changing Shaggy's behavior. It kinda felt a bit of a 180 change then helping to improve the skills he had.

@@vaporean_boylove.0w083 I legitimately was just making a joke I haven't actually seen Mr Incorporated I keep hearing that it's a really good show but everything that I have seen in terms of clips from the Velma character in the show is just super fucking unlikable like they turned her into a major bitch.

Did you watch the video?

​@snowmann. Huh? The what now? 😂

In this context he constantly ghosted his girlfriend to eat junk with food with his friend ,who was petty about thier relationship. Not exactly the same as a partner forcing u to get rid of your pet.

Apparently they wanted Velma to be sesbian and they were not allowed, guess someone got petty about it.

Yeah, I do find the framing of the fans and even the show that it's weird/insulting for Shaggy to have a closer relationship with Scooby than he does Velma to be...kind of weird? Like not romantically but what they have is a friendship between two people. Scooby is the main character of the franchise, is essentially written as a person and they even provide a reason for it to boot. Even compared to other versions of Scooby, MI Scooby is one of the most intelligent, basically written as one of the teenagers. It's weird that when it comes to this situation, suddenly Scooby is "just a pet". Admittedly I do think the show's writing is a bit amatonormative. Velma's arc and later relationship with Hot Dog Water is really cool, but I was disappointed to hear an interview that described Shaggy as too immature for a romantic relationship. I don't really care whether Shaggy could be AroAce or not, but it is a bit disappointing to hear Being In A Romantic Relationship=Maturity, as if one day it inevitably has to happen.

@@gota7738 I think you're reading too deep into this. "If you're immature your relationships are not going to go well" was the message they wanted to send.

@@mr.cauliflower3536 Oh for sure, I don't think they intended anything more. I even think the comments about "the dog" is about the inherent joke in framing it as a conventional "love triangle". It just gets weird when the show throws digs at Shaggy for treating Scooby like a person in this situation, while it also recognises Scooby as a person most of the time. It's just a little inconsistency that they probably didn't think about. As for the amatonormative comment, I definitely don't think that's an intentional statement. However given that obviously did think about heteronormativity to the point of building it into Velma's character arc, it's noticeable to me that they didn't give the same thought to Shaggy's situation. The question of whether Shaggy is only pursuing romance out of social expectation and not out of any desire, and that he may always value platonic friendships over romantic relationships, doesn't seem to have come up in the writing room. Shaggy's failure at romance is treated as a sign of his immaturity that he'll just have to grow out of, as he does try and fail to initiate romantic relationships later, without the closure Velma got. And I don't think they thought about any of that, but sometimes what you do say and show you've thought about calls attention to what you haven't. Which is fine, it just comes with writing denser and more complicated stories that invite thought.

@@gota7738 He definitely did that out of immaturity. A mature person would face the problems instead of avoiding them. Whether it is because they are not happy with their partner's beheviour, or because they're just not happy with being in a relationship at all, is irrelevant.

@@mr.cauliflower3536 Absolutely! I don't think their relationship would have been written any differently. My ramble was more promoted by an interview quote that made me reflect on how the Friend vs Romance conflict was framed and what the show's stance was, or wether it had one.

Scooby is basically a special needs child. It's more like the new girlfriend asking shaggy to choose between her and the kid.

It’s like the only reason why it’s a hard watch for me. I wouldn’t mind so much if it wasn’t so prominent. Velma’s my favorite character in the show and they had no idea how to write a queer girl

​​@@nervousbreakdown711She was closeted in the show proper. They just couldn't reveal it.

Ditto

Im trying to watch these dudes unmask a fraudulent ghoul then there is Velma forcing shaggy to wear unbendable pants that nobody uses.

Yes I thought that ending was sad for her sisters . They were not even evil !

All the people saying Shaddy is ace, yet here you are, actually understanding Shaggy's true sexuality.