“By the time Mclaren got their first win since Hamilton left, Hamilton was already a seven-time world champion.” That really puts into perspective how much of a master stroke Hamilton’s move was.
Yes, but we have to be honest a put some facts into this. First and the most important. Rules changes at 2014. Mercedes knews very much earlier how new engines will be looks like then other teams. Also influence of Martin Whitmarsh and departure of Ronn had big role of McLaren fall and we cannot forget very poor years with Honda power. So yeah, in those years it does not looked like very smart move. Even in his first season with Mercedes in 2013, he won only one race. His achievement with Mercedes are stunning and he deserve all of respect, but this decision could been also very bad as it shows up as very very good.
@@flasbaaa So how exactly did Merc know about the engine before the others? The engine design is agreed by a committee that includes the usual 3/4 plus attended by Porsche and I believe some US manufacturers too. Im fact the whole change to 'road relevant' engines was prompted by Red Bull's supplier Renault with a threat to leave without a change! Merc *may* have got on with the new design sooner than Renault but that was down to Renault's incompetence rather than Merc having so mythical advantage.
@@Euclides287 dude 😎😎🆒🆒🆒😎 Lulu's are like "Yeah 2012, i knew Sir Lewis Hamilton will win with Mercs" Same goes to Riccardo as well , people were considered McLaren move as Lulu's merc move never turned out good for them
It was funny because he'd been on Top Gear and even Clarkson said about the move "Isn't it like moving from Manchester United to West Ham?" Think he is eating his words right now.
I still remember reading in sunday newspaper that he was leaving mclaren I told myself he will ruin his career Even the Kaiser failed to perform good enough He proved us wrong
At first, it seemed like an odd move, but people seem to forget that they weren't rubbish in 2013 at all, finishing in second in the constructor's. What a move this turned out to be. Lewis and Mercedes have built such a symbiosis that it's hard to mention one without mentioning the other.
@A Z ditto with RB and Max's win in 2020, they deliberately crippled the Mercs by cutting out the floor, fully knowing it would hurt Mercs/Aston more than any other high-rake car.
@@cp3190 It's not that straightforward. Ricciardo tried a similar move when he left Red Bull for Renault and failed. Engine suppliers are not always better than their costumer teams.
Hamilton F1 story and journey feels like a Hollywood movie. His rise so rapid and his success was so immediate that he surpassed the high expectations everyone had for him.
Highly doubt that ever being an option for Charles. George will already be well established at Mercedes by then, he won’t want to go there and squabble over who gets to be the #1 driver.
@@PH-jv4ik Vettel would still be winning titles since Rosberg and Alonso relations could fall apart faster than Hamilton-Rosberg or Hamilton-Alonso relations
It was only Mercedes success really, as they were going to win every title from 2014-2020 with, or without Lulu, their engine was just so dominant a monkey could have won in those cars.
Schumacher making Ferrari superior again with his team was the greatest era in the sport, Lewis is good, but Schumacher joined a team who had no perspective and turned it around, at Mercedes it was Schumacher and Rosberg who did the legwork, Lewis just capitalized, so no, He ain’t the goat, and never will be
Ron Dennis also offered a salary reduction initially. I do believe in the very end (last few days before the Merc announcement) he offered to match Merc's offer. Lauda told Lewis very plainly: Follow the money. Merc was Mclaren's biggest contributor, and with purchasing Brawn a few years before it and Brawn/Schumacher/Costa laying the foundations, they where going to go for titles in 2014. Factory support for Mclaren was only going to drop off more and more.
@@soundscape26 Ricciardo didn't trust Renault back in 2019, which was way too naive of him but in hindsight it could've been worse considering Rossi coming in could still screw up Ricciardo's career (still unlikely) in an alternate timeline, Ocon signs for McLaren instead of Renault (I'd lowkey like that ngl)
Its funny how people claim Lewis only drove the best cars to the championship (as the comments here already show), but easily forget how laughable this move was at the time.
The 2006 Honda talks are somewhat of a surprise to me. I'm sure Rubens Barrichello and Jenson Button both had contracts in place for 2007 as Rubens was signed on a multi-year deal to get him away from Ferrari and Jenson famously argued away from Williams for Honda for 06 and beyond. I wonder who would have been turfed out?
Minor detail i know but didn't Jenson want to Move to BMW Williams in 2005? The CRB (where have we heard that before - Piastri *cough cough) stated Button had a Concreate Contract with Honda. Glad it worked out like it did.
@@gregellis7493 that was all sorted by the end of 2005. That's why these Hamilton talks are confusing me in 2006. Both Button and Barrichello would have had contracts for 2007.
@@elaldo2382 I haven't seen the video yet. So Button wanted to Move to Williams in 2006? Is that why Honda moved for lewis that year? Lewis won his F2 championship in 06. So Williams would of had Button and Rosberg in 2006? Yes I've said 2006 a lot of times here lol
@@gregellis7493 the video is showing evidence that Hamilton was talking to Honda in 2006 about a race seat for 2007 to put pressure on Mclaren who were taking too long to decide if they'd promote him alongside Alonso. If Honda had won out he would have been driving the Earth car in 2007. Difficult to imagine but with both Button and Barrichello having contracts for 2007, I can only imagine this would have ended up back in the CRB as well
@@OSD_in_Deptheh they haven't been competitive throughout a season since 07. And If it weren't for schumi magic they wouldn't have been challenging since the 70s
@@harry4454 and if it wasn't for Hamilton or Rosberg, Mercedes would still be nothing in F1. Drivers are a large part of the teams success. Ferrari are still the most successful team in F1 and that's fact, means fuck all if the success hasn't been recent xD
@@ishshah8695 oh for sure drivers are a huge part and I think ferrari are the most iconic team they are the most successful for titles but I think to win 8 titles in a row is just utterly insane and I would assume Merc in the next 5-10 years would have outpassed ferrari
Poor J. Villeneuve. That reminds me, a great video would be who's had the biggest drop off in pace/form in F1 history? Villeneuve ? Riccardo? Any others?
@@karl8805 Paul di Resta is an average driver, even in DTM and WEC. Nico Rosberg would have won 4 titles, Vettel 6 titles and Verstappen would have been chamipion one year earlier in 2020.
@@teknikairaoulolgandessabek4102 so was bottas, yet he had 0 race wins, 0 fastest laps, never beat ham, never got pole, never got a podium, then merc happened and it made him number 2 driver many times....
No mentioning of how Lauda not only was the mastermind behind bring Lewis to Merc and making them the force to beat, but also being the mastermind behind bring Michael Schumacher to Ferrari, which lead to them being the force on the grid… and funny to think that Toto almost was the one telling Merc not to sign LH
And that is what it means to make the right decisions at the right time. I honestly think that if not for akward timings Alonso could have been in Hamiltons shoes. And the live example for that is Ricciardo.. Strange how life works
Alonso´s issue isnt timing, it´s burning bridges. He can´t get a seat in any of the top 3 teams because of his actions or words, not his driving ability
@leonf1fan1998 Remember what happened in Hungary 2007 😗? That's why Mercedes don't want Alonso. In fact Norbert Haug wanted to fire him on the spot, but Ron Dennis negotiated with Norbert and he eventually relented. Alonso and Ron terminated Alonso's McLaren contract at the end of '07.
This is one of those moves that worked out perfectly with all moving parts. From Niki, Lewis, Toto, Michael Schumacher, etc. I doubt it would’ve been the same if you take out one person from the lineup
If Nikki Lauda walked up and told me the deal was done...even if I hadn't heard of said deal or signed anything or didn't even want to, I would just take his word for it. Anything that man says he had put his mind to and it will happen. You're better just accepting that.
one got the feeling that not much would have changed for Mercedes though. Still the same championship wins just with different drivers. This signing was the turning point for Lewis Hamilton, not for Mercedes.
no. thatsabsolute bs. without lewis, ferrari and seb would have had 2-3 chips, why are we acting like lewis didnt/woesnt make the difference between '17 '18 and '19
@@muntublackson4757 your opinion man, all good. For me its a no. Mercedes outperform Ferrari in the car developement on the second part of the seasons you are mentioning and this is the reason they got the championship.
@@xamsedalabay6809 look dude i dont want to argue. If you think that Mercedes whould be championship-less without Hamilton thats fine with me. I follow F1 25 years now and I have an opinion of my own. Geaorge Russell jumped in that Mercedes for a week, in an ill fitting cockpit and practicaly got the win. You can be a Hamilton fan but you cant deny the reality. Mercedes was the car to be in in the hybrid era.
Even while viewing this with the optics during 2012 I find it surprising that Mercedes felt 30 million (around 40 million today) was a steep asking price. Hamilton was in the prime of his career, a former champion, proven race winner, marketable already at that stage, all while in unreliable and sometimes uncompetitive machinery. Since his debut he's never been within at least an earshott of the world title up the that point, just seems foolish to think of saving money in a sport that demands you to go all in to see the rewards.
Anyone making a move like that back in 2012 would have been considered crazy. Had Button, Vettel or Alonso made that move, the same feedback would have been given.
I'd absolutely have loved to see Lewis driving then 2021 mclaren, I think he would've won probably around 6 races that season at least if he was in the mcl35m
Yep sad part of F1. I love Seb but there's no doubt that Lewis is a contender for GOAT. I'm happy that Vettel managed to compete against a talent like Lewis even though it could've been very different if Vettel won one with Ferrari.
That comes with greatness. Senna was the most hated driver in F1 the year he tragically past away. Shumacher was the villian in most people's eyes by the time he retired for the first time in 2006. Then Vettel, then Hamilton and now Max is the target since he's the one winning without being challenged by anybody.
Easily. Without Hamilton entrance into F1 especially with Mclaren, Alonso would have been a 4 time champion before 2010. It's clear Alonso still think about that to this day.
Mercedes were worse than *Lotus,* and *McLaren* was the 2nd best team in F1 when Hamilton decided to leave for a *midfield team* at end of 2012. That's why everyone, including his *world champion teammate* and team principal came out and said he was making a career suicide move.
Stop being such a fanboy, Mercedes and Ross brawn were always going to improve, you make it out to be like it was a minardi, and that Mercedes weren’t pouring their millions in. No I’m sorry, I was incorrect with the amount, billions.
@@motorsportfan3202 IIRC the funding from Daimler only makes up a fraction of the Mercedes F1 team's budget. And while Mercedes did look like they were gonna improve back then, I highly doubt anyone predicted the "8 straight years of dominance" kind of success.
This story gives off serious Ricciardo/Renault vibes. I’m sure Danny looked back at this situation and saw how taking a huge risk can have huge payoffs. Just didn’t work out the same way it did for Hamilton.
Weird to think, a start at BAR/Honda would have made no difference on his championship tally... only maybe his win tally. Just don't think there would have been the same buzz around him
Four single events, not of his making, cost him four world titles. His losses alone would make for a legendary driver legacy. Had Mclaren pitted Lewis earlier at the ‘07 Chinese GP before his tires wore down to the white cords showing through and his car slid off the track and into a bizarre gravel trap, in the wet on pit entry…. Had his left front tire not delaminated, crashing him out from a 2nd place scoring position, at the end of the ‘10 Spanish GP (thanks to @Gaming for correcting me on this)…. Had his seemingly bullet proof Mercedes engine not blown up from the lead in ’16 near the end of the Malaysian GP…. Had Latifi not crashed and or the stewards FOLLOWED PROTOCOL on race restart in ‘21 at Abu Dhabi (Max was 12 seconds behind before the crash and was never going to catch Lewis)…. He would be an 11 times WDC. Think about that…..
@@user-ck7jv1hn8k I think I had just wiped those later Mclaren years from memory as they were so frustrating. Kind of like Kimi’s time at Mac. Thanks for the correction!
Messed up? LOL no. They would have been fine with nearly any driver. Their engineers are geniuses who created the greatest race car of all time. Give them the credit they deserve FFS
Mercedes would have won the constructors and the drivers the same number of times even without LH. We are underestimating the role of machine when it comes to competitive racing between different cars. Put him in a Williams and he will not win. No doubt he is one of the best drivers but not signing it would not have affected Mercedes. it would have been bad for LH though just as wrong selections affected other top drivers of the era.
The car is a big part, but the formidable driver/team parings require a great driver working to develop the car with great engineers. Edit: They also require great management
Mercedes made Hamilton, the car was so much faster initially that MB had to turn the engine down to keep FIA at bay. Throw in the illegal tire test in 2013 which helped them tremendously with dialing in the 2014 car, tokens and testing/development bans and you have MB domination. As for a driver developing a car those days are long gone as sensors, computers, etc. can tell an engineer how a car is behaving far more accurately than a driver can. It’s an engineering championship first and foremost now. Been following F1 since the mid 70s but F1has lost the plot the turbo hybrid era. Would love to see a return to the smaller simple v8s with simple front and rear wings, etc. simplify the car (thus reducing costs) and make the driver count more.
Explain to me that if Mercedes had signed Alonso, Vettel or Riccardo any other good driver, how would that have changed the outcome of Merc not winning the championships it won. And at no point I am saying LH is bad or incapable. Let is discuss a scenario where LH had joined Ferrari and Vettel had joined Mercedes. Would he have not succeeded to the same extent? Just for info, been watching F1 since 1997 season. Merceds was dominant for 5 seasons the way Ferrari was in 2001 to 2004
Imagine if the move didn't happen...we would be talking about Rosberg as the GOAT of F1 and German drivers dominance being almost undisputed in the 21 st century. Amazing how one move can change so much, even the best drivers still need great teams to accomplish everything they do week after week. Hamilton could have suffered all the misfortunes at Mclaren an be labelled a fluke if he didn't move teams!
Curious to see if Audi’s F1 story will be similar to Mercedes’s story, and if a switch to another team from a prodigy driver (maybe Max Verstappen, Charles Leclerc or Lando Norris) will change the fate of the entire team
That Lewis Hamilton signing was the most important thing Mercedes could of ever done as Hamilton was the real GOAT and not Schumacher who Hamilton replaced and that Hamilton was the best driver transfer in F1s History as he was the Real Deal and Lewis always means business on the track also is the most followed and famous driver and is very much loved.
@@doghat1619 yes on tyres he had no business being on. He literally lost a title because mclaren kept him out until the car was on its canvas in wet conditions
It's not surprising he downplays anyone else's involvement, even a great like Lauda. Ultimately it was little more than dumb luck, taking a single title and year after year of failure and moving right before Merc built a car seconds a lap faster than everyone else. Mercs rise was as fast as it was out of the blue, nailing arguably the largest rule change in F1 history. Turning a 1 or possibly 2 title career guy into a run of dominance unrivaled.
I remember him saying "Isn't it like going from Man Utd to West Ham?" If he'd have said Paris Saint Germain instead of West Ham' he would have basically gotten then analogy perfectly right. 🤣
2025 & soon it'll be: Ferrari red's th' colour, F1 Grand Prix's th' name; Then y'hear Sir 'LionHeart' holler, "Y'know, winning is my game!" 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ***sung to Chelsea FC's mantra: "Blue is th' colour, Football is the game; We're all here together, And winning is our aim!"
Well if they had Messer up Rosberg would be 5 time Champion so Its Not that Crazy… he would have won 2014/2015/2016 with ease 2017/2018 seb 2019 & 2020 mercedes again. so Rosberg, if he would stay after 2016 in this scenario…
I think no one really expected Mclaren to be that shit after Hamilton left , they got a works engine deal with Honda and still unable to do anything. while Red Bull showing them right in their faces that they are the issue.
if my math is correct...Schumi paid 50 mill per year without performance > 30 mill for Lewis with real stats, how is Lewis costing Mercedes more? Makes no sense.
Long may his success continue for as long as he chooses to stay in F1. We want to see good drivers stay in the sport and compete at a high level with the likes of Max and GR. I wonder what would’ve happened if Nico had stayed on would’ve been very interesting to watch.
If they hadn't signed Hamilton I still don't see why they wouldn't have won every championship between 2015 and 2019. Rosberg could have had as many championships as Vettel! As Frank Dernie noticed as a 12-year-old, the champion driver is generally the better of the two drivers who have the best car. As long as you've got at least one driver capable of winning the championship - which Mercedes already did even before they signed Hamilton - you're fine on the driver front. It's going to depend on the car.
Not to sound like a hater, but if Merc knew they’d have 5 seasons (14-16, 19-20) of uncontested victories and 2 seasons of contested wins (17-18), they probably just would have kept Schumacher with Nico. No way Schumi would have turned that down.
wouldn't have mattered much really for Mercedes. Would've won 2014-2016 and 2019-2020 anyways. And that is assuming putting a tool next to Rosberg/Bottas. Could've also very well won 2017-2018 as Rosberg would've stayed on bad he been the team's main driver.
With the new engine rules and regulations, and how well Mercedes executed them compared to the rest of the field, i truly believe Mercedes would have done just fine without Louis, they had Nico, I'm sure he would have stuck around had Louis not come to Mercedes. The question at this point is, would have Louis Hamilton been as successful as he is without Mercedes???
@@ax2643 i really appreciate what Mercedes was able to do with their engines for the past years, I'm sure Hamilton had his share at it, but what I'm questioning is, Hamilton's ability to win without the Mercedes advantage. I'm just asking a legitimate question.
Your headline is wrong should have read "How Hamilton nearly missed out on signing with Mercedes" Imagine they signed Vettel, Alonso or even retained Schumacher or maybe signed Rosberg sooner .... How different history would have been.
