I’m cranking first kick every single time now. This is invaluable instruction. I did miss the verbal detail at 10:55 though the first couple of times and thought I had an electrical issue. “Points must be open for the light to come on!” You guys are the undisputed experts on these bikes.
Been adjusting Honda ignition contact points and timing since 1970. Several things wrong here. The wire terminal on the left set of contact points is installed incorrectly. It should be on the other side of the insulator. The 'T and LT' marks were not explained. FInding TDC is easier if you remove the intake tappet cover and observe the intake valve opening and closing as you approach TDC. But the major error here is disregarding the contact points gap. Gap controls dwell, or the time the ignition coil has to recharge. It is very important. The other factor that will affect ignition timing is slop in the breaker plate. You should always loosen the 6mm screws and check for up and down or side-to-side slop. I always push the plate upward, and then maintain this position when moving the plate and tightening the screws. This is necessary to keep the contact points gap consistent whenever theplate is loosened to making timing adjustments. Set the left gap to 0.35 mm, max. Rotate the breaker plate to adjust the ignition timing. For the right cylinder, you simply adjust the contact point gap to set the timing. After working on thousands of CB350s, 360s and 450s, I can recommend keeping the left cylinder gap at no more than 0.35 mm, or you will have a difficult time getting the right cylinder timed while maintaining the all-important contact point gap of 0.30 to 0.40 mm.
I agree, a lot of gaps left out which are important. Hipster moto science in full swing. Plus, turning the motor backwards is a big no no, ad it can slip a cam tooth.
Could u help my fix my CB125K ? i have adjusted the points serveral times but it has no power down low , only 5000 rpm+ When i set my points the the F mark it wont run , i need to adjust is about 20 degrees before it fires up .
Never thought I would be working on points in 2018, but here I am! After watching the video AND reading the comments, I was able to adjust them smoothly, and my 1971 SL350 fired up on the first kick! Thanks guys, the video is much appreciated
Quick suggestion to minimize oil spilling - have the bike on the CENTER STAND (not the kick stand), and place a spacer (e.g., 3/3" thick board) under the left leg of the center stand so the bike tilts slightly to the right before you remove the stator cover.
Wow, really impressed with this tutorial. I will be using this in my small engines class to explain breaker points ignition basics. I always get questions on it and this is a good way to explain it. Wish more videos on here were made at this production quality level. Thanks again!
Such a valuable video. I've read the manual but watching someone do it really pulls it all together. For everyone learning on their own this is awesome.
Thanks very much for this video! It made my struggles to get my cb500t up and running close to perfect! If you take suggestions for future videos i would very much like to see how you set valve clearence on a cb450 or cb500t :)
Great video. A few comments if I may. The points usually come with a protective coating, oil or whatever, and it is a good idea to clean them before use. Running a clean business card between them seems to work. I use a little alcohol.If the breaker plate is off take a good look at the points cam. If it is badly worn or scored it will quickly wear out the points rubbing block or give you problems trying to set the timing. Worn parts are a problem on older machines.The points are gapped before timing setting as this effects the dwell or time the points are closed in degrees of engine rotation. During the time the points are closed the ignition coil charges. Honda recommends a point gap of 0.012" to 0.016" or 0.3-0.4mm for the CB350.Timing may also be set with a VOM or points checker but your system is dead on. Thanks for great video.
As I recall, Honda had 2 models of the 350 engine, one was 179 degrees apart in firing, and the other was something odd but I don't recall (they fired like one right after the other). My friend had one of the latter and could not figure out why his bike ran so poorly (the Honda dealer had done the tuneup). I fixed it for him and he said, "It's not run this well since it was new." Also, I found that ANY looseness in the cam chain made setting the points difficult. In the manual adjusted cam chains one could remove almost all the slop, but in the hydraulic ones not. I found that if one only rotates the engine only in the direction of operation (not back and forth), then any cam chain slop is not a problem and points can be set very precisely.
this is the best and most well explained video or tutorial I have ever seen. Although I no longer need it as I upgraded to a Dynatek S yesterday, but thank you.
Thank you! Don't hesitate to ever reach out for support, we have a huge and growing knowledge base on our website and youtube channel on how to do the work and get your bike running fantastic. We also have a technical support line open on monday and tuesday from 12-6 if you truly get stuck!
There are some instances where you have to. Replacing the valve shims on my motorcycle required me to rotate it backwards very slowly in order to get everything back in place.
You described the point gap as "irrelevant". The gap determines your dwell. It is relevant as the amount of time the points are closed is how the strength of the magnetic field in the coil is generated. When the points open allows the field to collapse initiating the spark. Additionally when given a range for point gap it is set at the upper limit because as the shoe wears the point gap decreases but stays within range and dwell limits. It is relevant.
+Sean Vierling Sir you are absolutely correct. However since these Hondas use one coil and one set of points per cylinder that is triggered by the camshaft running at 1/2 engine speed they have ample dwell time regardless of the gap value. Had this been a single set of points in a multi-cylinder engine with a distributor (I.E. an old American V8) then the dwell angle value is a very relevant, especially as RPM's increase. Actually I thought GM's way of setting points with a dwell meter back in the day was pretty clever, over setting just gap. Thanks for the input!
The opening is relevant. You must have sufficient opening . If not, during opening of the point, the ark will influens in a bad manner. For example, For maximum power from the coil, the arc has to shut down as fast as possible. A longer arc, will prevent this occuring. The arc can be unstable" the firing time vil alter a bit. The Points will not last as long as they should. Therefor is the dwell importent. .
Common Motor Collective I agree the gap matters. My 1971 CB175 ran better after I adjusted the points gap, which was too small. Before the idle was erratic.
Hi, guys!! Your videos are absolute GOLD!! Thank you very much for these!! I wonder if you could do a cb450 k (etc.) vid showing how to adjust the valve tappet clearance as there is no video on it online and probably many noobs like me have the same uncertainties about it. All the best, Ric
Can a bad point timing cause a filter to sputter and not put out a lot of power through the exhaust? I have a 450 and the left filter sputters and the exhaust is weaker compared to the right side. Thank you for putting out these videos Brendan!
That felt pad under the timing cam should be greased up to keep the cam and points from wearing out to soon. It should run on the cam and be very well soaked with oil. Other than that. Pretty good tutorial on getting started. The dwell is important on points ignition systems. But you would need a dwell meter to get those right. Any old gear head in your neighborhood should have one. But since they haven't used it in years they won't be able to find it.
the dwell or time the points are closed is the amount of time the coil has to charge the magnetic fields ... so point gap is very important for a good spark
You can also usa a multimeter. Put it in the Ohm position and hold each end to one side of the contact breaker. When they are closed the reading will be a low figure. The moment the contacts slightly open, the multimeter will display a 1 (infinit resistance). That moment the spark plugs spark. Now adjust the base plate to have it at the correct moment.
when i moved the plate, the timing did not adjust. I also have spark even when the points are closed. Do I have something shorted or is my basket case of a bike likely modified with some form of electronic ignition? Timing is too far advanced and can't seem to change it. Bike sputters when kicking and doesn't start, kicks back really hard. It's a 72 sl125 in Thailand with a shitty sheng-wey carb. Thing ran before miraculously but has been down for months now. No idea what killed it, but I bet it lost spark and the mechanics here just tried to bypass the mechanical ignition system. Is this even possible? I'm so confused.
So, I remember back then, I'm 61, the praise leaped upon the Japanese bikes, Honda in particular, about how maintenance free they were. Yes, they solved the oil leak problem that Harley, Triumph, BSA, and Norton, etc had. However, setting points every 1,500 miles is ridiculous. Even the fore mentioned brands didn't have that schedule. How could one take any sort of a long trip if that were the case?
hi i try to restore a honda cb 360 1975 but the old owner change the original rectifier and put a new one but was a regulator rectifier 6 wires , but dont start . cant i fix it making better conection or buy a new one original
You are very wrong about the point gap not being important. This controls the amount of saturation time for the coils and could lessen the coil output (dwell).
Yes you are correct about point gap affecting dwell, and In general this is true. Very important with a ignition system with a single coil, single set of points in a distributor of a multi cylinder engine. However the architecture of these Honda motorcycle systems allow for a massive amounts of dwell even when the point gap is way off. With the each cylinder having its own set of points, individual coils along with the points being driven by the camshaft vs. crankshaft the degrees of dwell is well into triple digits allowing plenty of time to charge each coil. This method was developed to make it easier for the average person to perform this standard tune up service.
nice job guys, even though i've done this a bunch of times, I learned some new tips from this video! Keep up the good work, would love to see more maintenance tutorials
From someone as knowledgeable as you about these CB bikes, it would be great to get your opinion on converting the bike over to electronic ignition - if they make a conversion kit setup. Wouldn't that make for a better running bike?
It can improve ignition but in my experience the point system works fine if it is done correctly, I had to remove my electronic ignition due to one of the pick ups failing. My advise is keep the points. I reverted back and glad I did.
not a word on dwell angle which is about getting the spark voltage correct ( points gap which you did not do) points gap + charging time for condensors
Man! You said a couple of ounces may come out when you remove the cover... I got 1-2 quarts. I’m new to vintage bikes so I’m not sure what’s going on. Any help would be appreciated. But these videos are super helpful In explaining the how to process. Thanks a lot.
Welp.. looks like I have been running on one cylinder. Right side never kicked off during my test.. come to think of it, I was having backfire on that side. Points come tomorrow, new bike by this weekend. Wish me luck!
Hi Brendon. Have you ever come across this problem. I can’t get the points cover on? The bottom of the left hand points are lower than the cover! I’m stumped. I may have to cut a hole in the aluminium cover. This follows a top end dismantle and rebuild
Really well done video. Thank you. I have a quick question however: I purchased a continuity light (assume it's the same as your testing light), and it never turns off or on when rotating the engine... It is simply always on. This is my first experience using continuity lights so I'm pretty confused why my light doesn't turn on and off like yours does. Do you have any idea what I may be doing wrong? Thank you again.
Just to know, does it matter how long the light stays on after getting past the fire point? Only important that it only turns on at the exact correct moment?
At the points, at the 6 o'clock position is usually a felt piece that goes between the two posts. I see that you aren't running them...are they required?
great video thank you. I was not getting the light on but had not turned the switch to run. I then got left side lined up with the light but the light will not come on on the right, any ideas?
Trying to kick over my CB250 K0 think timing needs adjusting Guys in the shop recently fitted new points but I don't reckon they set timing correctly. I rode bike regularly a few years back on kickstart - fine every time. My husband used to nurture the bike but he passed on a year ago so I'm handling spanners now ..... steep learning curve but I'm determined. My sweet man mentioned carb clean / rebuild. This may sound like a stupid question but did you remove both spark plugs at the beginning of setting timing or just the left?
So im new to bikes, on my recently purchased 1969 CB350 there is a dimple where ur slot/line in the stator is located. Do I remove this dimple of coating or is that just the way it is on this one?
I have gotten a 1971 cl350 recently. Ever since ive had it the left cylinder will only half run at idle and thats pretty much it.. it backfires and blows a little smoke when i downshift. Coil has been replaced and so has the spark plug. Carb has been rebuilt but the diaphragms havent been replaced. Any suggestions on the problem? 23k miles and points dont look to far from new
Old post, but I’ll reply in case someone else is reading. It could also mean that the points wires are assembled incorrectly. If the points never open, the spark plug can never fire. If the plug is firing, then you have the timing light connected incorrectly. An easy way to check assembly is to disconnect the wire from the harness where it feeds the point, manually wedge something like a plastic knife into the point gap and using a multimeter set to ohms, measure from the supply wire (yellow/blue) to the ground, the fixed side of the point, or points backing plate. If you have continuity, the isolators that mount the points return springs are damaged or improperly installed.
Hello all, I'm having some trouble adjusting my points. I'm trying to do it exactly how this video explains, however. i'm using a test light just as he is in the video, but when my point closes is when my light turns on, and when it opens it turns off. I'm trying to figure out why my light is operating in the exact opposite manner. I'm uncomfortable calling my points adjusted until i figure this problem out. Thanks -G
also put the grease directly on the rubbing blocks or there is a chance it can be flicked onto the contacts causing a misfire and arcing..good vids though
I'd recommend only using a very small amount and its good practice to kick the engine over 10-15 times before starting it so the rubbing block will spread it more evenly. If you don't there's a chance of it flinging.
When you lined up the LF, you turned it backwards and forwards to show correct lining up on the compression stroke. Problem (for me) is you then turned it back to before the mark, then lined it up with only a 1/4 turn. Backlash ! Supposed to go round a whole turn, two for me, to eliminate backlash. You may have done that though when you restarted the timing. I'll delete this if you have.
I've got a 68 250 that I'm currently sorting out. Original everything and that is half my problems heh. But eventually I'll bput a 350 topend on it and do some work to the engine. And another reason why electronic ignition will be going in as soon as possible lol
Are there downsides to not using the Honda recommended method for setting static timing? If this works as well as it seems, it's surprising it's not a standard way to set timing.
PLEASE HELP!! I have a 1974 Honda cb360 when I got it it was only running on one cylinder I set the timing and it runs great at idle speed but when I went to take it for ride it started spitting and sputtering around 4k rpms and when I hit 5k the left cylinder started kicking out
Hi, I'm having a problem with my honda cb125. I cleaned the contacts of the ignition today, put everything back with no problems but the bike doesn't start! What could it be? Please help me!
Hello and thank you for your videos. I replaced a damaged piston on a 1972 cb350 twin a couple weeks ago and now I can't get it to start again. How can I check I got the timing right? I installed the camshaft with know pointing upward in the twelve o'clock position and sprocket with line perpendicular flat to engine, while index mark on stator was at LT position. Valves are adjusted to tolerances, still nothing. Did I probably miss something? Is there truth to this left piston on LT should NOT be on compression stroke or position is just position? The motor feels funny when I crank it and cylinders have a LOT of compression, almost too much although I'm no expert. Thanks for any help, I will set points next week but will probably have to take top end apart again.
Hmmm reach out to our support through our tech support phone calls on the website. You could be having a few issues going on but we'd need to get more information before we could help. On our support page theres a spot to sign up for a time for us to call you I'd recommend doing that.
Should you be able to rotate the engine back that easily? When trying to line up my marks, if I overshoot, I cannot and am forced to rotate through another cycle. I also have to hold it in place else it rotates through another 90 degrees or so. Working on a '75 CB360T.
