In Defense of Deen/Stay Night (A Newcomer's Guide to Fate) 

When you're told to start with the Deen adaption but ended up watching Fate/Kaleid instead

Something important that everyone forgets when talking about this adaptation is that Studio Deen are the ones responsible for giving us the legendary voice actors for the characters we love. There's a timeline where Deen didn't make the adaptation and we didn't get all the voice actors we love.

Man, I really like Shirou. Watching Kiritsugu pass his dream onto him- where in Fate he took it to the max. UBW is a contrast, where acceptance that not everyone can be saved was made clear to Shirou. what an emotional rollercoaster. Cant wait for HF.

"Do NOT watch Fate Zero first." Me: Too late

if ufotable gave fate route the brotherhood treatment, i would be happy.

Honestly Arkada, you're not alone, because I share a very similar opinion with you and I am backing you up. Yes as an adaptation of the Fate route, 2006 is damn flawed, but so far it's still the only anime adaptation for the Fate route, which IMO has the most equal understandings for the characters as well as the best overall worldbuilding. It's the more standard type of story which could get fans acquainted to Fate before they go into the more deeper waters of Fate, and also has the most "complete" resolution of the routes. There are plotholes and spoilers due to the lack of depth for the other 2 routes, which I will admit was a flaw, but in the end I still stand that 2006 is the best beginner spot in Fate for anime fans overall too. You're not alone.

As much as I agree UFOTable had the better works, I can't hate on Studio Deen's one because if anything at all, it was what got me so interested in the Fate Series. After all, I'm not too fond of visual novels so I'm even more grateful that the 2006 version existed. ^_^

I actually liked the 2006 adaptation

I wonder how many people in the comments just watched Fate/Zero and now assume they know everything about the Nasuverse and call everything else in it, "trash"

Watch all the Fate anime! You really can't go wrong but no matter what you watch you should check out the VN.

I watched Deen/stay night first and I’m so glad that I did so. When I watched Zero, I knew the ending, which added a layer of tragedy to it that made it even better in my opinion. Now I’m watching UBW.

I watched Fate Zero... before realising it was a prequel to Fate Stay Night. Jumping into Fate Zero requires you to take so much information in

sorry...but I have a confession to make. I watched fate/Zero first. in fact I went: zero, ubw, then stay night. honestly though, no regrets.

I hope Ufotable eventually remakes Arturia's perspective with last episode attached. I don't think it has to resemble the original Fate route as long as it hits the same general basic information points somewhere along the way. Since fate as a route is designed to be mostly infodump and set up for rules and stories and motivations for later routes, they would have to change that in the first place. But i think it would be a good challenge for Nasu to try and write. Tsukihime is much easier to adapt(like Sakaki shounen's manga adaption which is awesome) because Arc is the clear and present focal point of the series, so even if the farside isn't detailed, you can still have a wholesome story by including elements from other routes. FSN doesn't really work in that manner. By the way, you forgot that people should read Sakaki Shounen's Tsukihime manga adaption at some point too, as Fate Zero directly references Tsukihime elements and to get perspective on that, you'd have to either suffer through JC staff Tsukihime to get a weak experience or read the visual novel which is not ideal at this point.

You are not alone. Deen's F/SN brought me into this universe. While it was not as well animated as Ufotable's work, I think it got more scrutiny than it deserves. The plot is good - keeps the tension most of time. And the animation holds itself pretty well, considering it's age. Would recommend anyone to watch it first.

I really wish I had finished Heaven's Feel before watching Fate/Zero. I'm barely into the route and it's already had some revelations I would've thought were mindblowing had I not known them from Zero. Listen to this man. DO NOT WATCH ZERO FIRST. Play the game. Watch Deen. Watch a playthrough on youtube if it has to come to that. Just don't ruin the story for yourself by watching Zero first.

Shirou Emiya: People die when they are killed Dr Gilgamesh: Hold my wine

As someone who was lucky enough to have started with the VN, I totally agree. I used to shit all over the Deen anime on the internet and real life, even stopped one of my friends from watching it, probably killing his interest for the entire franchise in the process (I know, I'm an ass). Now that the UBW anime exists and the Heaven's Feel trilogy is on its way, I decided to revisit the Deen.anime with fresh eyes and yeah, not only is it necessary for people who want the full story without doing any reading, it's actually got some surprising attention to detail and holds up quite well in places (For instance, I used to hate that they showed that Berserker fight, but in hindsight it's got some cool foreshadowing for Heaven's Feel in it.). I think the reason I hated it so much is that, back in the day, it was all that there was, and I was afraid that anime-only people would be missing out on all the things that make F/SN great. I'd still recommend skipping Deen's version of the Caster arc (ideally watching the VN's Fate Caster scene on RU-vid instead or something) so you don't spoil yourself horribly for UBW and Heaven's Feel, but outside of that this is absolutely the best way to go about getting into Fate/Stay Night, barring just reading the VN, of course. "Starting with Fate/Zero is like beginning Star Wars with Episode 1!" THANK YOU. I've been saying this exact thing for years.

I watched Deen’s adaptations first. Maybe that’s why ufotable’s UBW seemed unsatisfying (story wise). Also Saber’s character development was beter in deen’s adaptation.

Thank you for making this, this was super helpful! I've wanted to get into Fate for years, but whenever I ask an anime fan about the watching order, no one really knows where to start. Not even TV Tropes could answer this one. And you're my favorite anime reviewer, so at last, I have a watching order that I trust!

I'm not sure about this, because I did watch Zero first. I loved it, then I went to watch the Stay Night stuff. After that I decided to go back and see Zero again and (besides noticing a few things I hadn't before) I really didn't feel any different towards it, or Fate in general.

Not notification squad - just always lurking on RU-vid squad

"Starting from Zero is like watching Star Wars but from Episode One." Heck, I only knew about Star Wars after watching Episode III in theaters, but then a local TV station aired all 5 other movies in release orders, so I know a little bit more about the universe.

Every time a friend of mine or anyone wants to know how to get into the Fate franchise, I send them this video.

Starting with Zero is like starting with phantom meanace (like I did when I was a kid) edit: well fuck, he said it himself

DEEN Stay Night was my entree into fate in 06...i was one of those people just tuning into the premiere in Japan because i had seen pictures of Arturia online and i wanted to see what her anime was liket. I was not into Type Moon at the time, even though i had seen the non existent JC staff Tsukihime adaption years before that(i didn't make the connection between the two's origins until later). Fate Stay Night 06 still plays a special place in my heart and ignited by love for everything Type Moon, Arturia and everything in between. Sure it was flawed and DEEN really didn't put a lot of effort in, but it was still enjoyable. I even liked UBW DEEN movie for what its worth.

I personally would like to thank you GR, in this Quarantine I was looking for something good to watch and I thought “well...if there’s anytime to get into Fate, the time’s now.” While thinking of what to watch first, I remembered watching this video and a few other videos you made years ago saying “start with Deen.” So that’s where I started, and I regret nothing. The Deen series is honestly not that bad, it’s not great or anything but it felt like an okay beginning, then I watched Zero and loved it, then UBW and also loved it, and I just finished Apocrypha and it was good (Mordred and her master should’ve been the MCs). Overall, I’m now part of the fandom thanks to you, I took your advice and ran with it. Now I’ve got no regrets and can’t wait to see the Heaven’s Feel movies

This can't be said enough, Read the VN!!!!

Aight people, round up, for I am about to ask the hardest question ever. Which one is more convoluted, the Fate series, or Kingdom Hearts? ᵃˡˢᵒ ʷʰᵉʳᵉ ᵗʰᵃᵗ ʳᵃᵖ ᵃᵗ ᵗʰᵒ Also also, WATCH CARNIVAL PHANTASM AND READ THE ILLYA MANGA

I'm think I might watch Deen/stay night

With my recent and strangely curious tendencies of the franchise, it is oddly appropriate how you've come to make this video for people like me who are interested in watching the anime but not knowing where to start with it. Thanks man, I'll definitely get started in the order you've described. Not only was I going to start with that particular adaptation, but now I have a better idea where to run to next after I'm done watching it. Props mate and have a good day

"Deen/Stay Night" was the show that hooked me and made me a fan of the Fate series. It will always have a place on my shelf.

Thing is, Fate/Zero spoils you less of UBW or F/sn than F/sn or UBW spoil you of Fate/Zero. If a person were to watch F/sn first, they wouldn't have the crushing suspense of not knowing who will win the Grail War, who will win the battle between Saber and Lancer, or what Kotomine Kirei will do. Having watched Fate/Zero first, Kotomine's entire character was a shock to me every time he did something, it was great, but if I were to watch F/sn first I wouldn't have the same reaction. Heck, Fate/Zero explains the Grail Wars better than any other Fate anime. It is also the anime that's the easiest to recommend to a person who isn't familiar with Fate. There's a difference between recommending an anime where the main plot is Shirou wanting to fuck the servant he summoned and recommending an anime where the main plot is a full blown war waged by various mage families for a pseudo-miracle making device.

Finally! I'm glad someone else shares my opinions on Deen/Stay Night, a big anituber at that. Sure, D/SN is not perfect by any means, the ending is a mesh of the 3 routes plus original stuff, and the production values are nowhere near today's quality. BUT! Like Arkada said, D/SN is the best start, imo. F/Z was created AFTER F/SN with the mindset that you already know what happened in F/SN, to show the futility of the characters in a tragic way. And that's the point of F/Z. D/SN gives us the basics, the necessary knowledge required to advance to the rest, premise-wise, story-wise and character-wise. The 1st route in the F/SN VN is the Fate route... what D/SN adapts, and while it's not an amazing adaptation, it HAD to not be one. Having a perfect adaptation of the Fate roue wouldn't have worked. Completing the Fate route in the VN leaves much incompletion and questions, but that you can quickly see answered by playing UBW and then HF. But anime don't have that freedom. Meanwhile, watching a perfect Fate route adaptation would leave a sense of incompletion, but you wouldn't be able to check a UBW anime because, well, there wasn't any. So changes were necessary to give an ending that felt the most complete possible, to a story that originally isn't complete to begin with. If anything, what Deen did is very commendable. They gave an ending to something that didn't have a proper one, bc you could continue to two other stories to fill the gaps left in the 1st story. Deen/Stay Night has its issues, of course, but it is the best starting point for anime watchers. Playing the VN is best, but not everyone can play through 50+ hours of a VN. For anime-onlies, D/SN is the best start, imo.

Ironically I started out with Zero but then dropped it because the first episode which felt like two episodes, was boring. THen later on after hearing more and more about it, I picked up Deen's version since it seemed like a decent place to start and it explain things really well. but then I watched Zero without realizing that it was a prequel, then UBW. After all of that, got too impatient and decieded to read the VN for HF, Fate HA and even the recent Fate Apoc. Good franchise really

I'm one of the few that enjoyed Deen/Stay Night. It what got me into the series in the first place.

I remember watching this anime when I was 7 and that’s how I got introduced to the franchise and it’s been my favorite franchise ever since.

I started with apocrypha because I didn't know what a fate was and just saw "best girl" on the preview card on Netflix Then I watched UBW, then zero

it was by accident when I bought a bootleg of studio deens F/SN, and I fell in love with the lore and the characters, and lately I've been binge watching the rest of the series again, UBW and heavens feel, then zero and apocrypha.

Just read the VN you casuals.

Thank goodness I watched Deen/Stay Night first

Last time I was so early, was when Fate/apocrypha ep 1 subbed came out ;)

2:17 man I’m so jealous that you have a physical copy of this VN I can’t wait to get the fate stay night remastered when it comes out later this year.

“Do not watch fate zero first”Watched fate zero first before watching this video. Well shit.

I completely agree with your order of watching. I personnaly followed it when I first entered the "Nasuverse". I want to thank you for insisting on the importance of Deen/Stay Night. Of course the show isn't perfect, it has some flaws, and I would rehabilitate it only under certain conditions, because it suffers from technical weaknesses, pacing issues and slowness in general. BUT sometimes, one forgets all the qualities of Deen's adaptation of Fate, notably the magnificent score of Kenji Kawai, the subtle and full treatment of a superb and cruel love story, and the most affectuous presentation of Saber, an exceptionnal goddess that inhabits my dreams for months now, since I discovered the anime. Thanks for this video, and please continue your great job ! -- A belgian physicist otaku :D

TL;DW - Fate/Stay Night (2006) > Fate/Zero > Unlimited Blade Works > Heavens Feel Other adaptations such as Grand Order or Apocrypha can be watched at any time after Fate/Stay Night (2006), because they take place in entirely different timelines.

i was browsing netflix a year or so ago. I saw a interesting title of an anime: Fate/Zero. I said, what the hell why not? Thus my journey into Fate began. I am so sorry. that said, i do agree with you GR! i had no idea what was going on and felt like i was missing a ton of context.

Deen's Fate/Stay Night was excellent, I enjoyed it thoroughly! It's a perfect starting place.

UFOtable's UBW assumes you've seen F/Z, while F/Z assumes you've seen Deen Stay Night. Deen Stay Night in turn drops a sprinkling of plot points from other routes that weren't adapted at the time, so they all spoil each other to some extent and there isn't really a 'perfect' way to watch this franchise. I ended up starting with F/Z simply because if there are going to be spoilers no matter what, I'd rather have a good anime spoil a mediocre one rather than the other way around.

If there is one thing I can say about Deen's Stay night, Nothing beats Arturia's theme and I mean nothing

I mean TBF Deen/Stay Night got me into the series all those years ago and you get to listen to that great version of Disillusion

finally a dude that though still isnt a big fan of that series still says to watch finally someone is smart thank god

But won't Zero spoil HF aswell?

Just read the Visual Novel. No matter the adaptation there will always be details left out when adapting a Visual Novel to an Anime due to the very nature of it.

when video says not to do one thing...and you already did it *suddenly you don't own me starts playing*

Me from 2024 telling you that fate stay night visual novel is getting an English localisation but also has plans to check out Deen stay night

I started watching this recently and thankfully began with Deen/Stay Night and would agree it's an ideal starting point if you're new to the franchise. I watched the first three episodes of Unlimited Blade Works yesterday but I'm leaving it there and will start Fate/Zero tonight, once that's done I'll return to UBW and after that I want to watch Fate/Apocrypha.

Started with Zero and personally I still enjoyed the original Fate/Stay Night anime. Currently on episode 3 of UBW and already loving it. But no matter what, definitely watch Deen/Stay Night because if you look past the animation and the amount of flaws in the story, you will find yourself enjoying it.

The ending still makes me cry and it hit even harder after my first breakup LOL

Nice to see that you still defend watching the Deen adaptation. I know a few people who have never bothered with it just because "it's old" or they've "heard it's crap" and similar things, so it lifts my spirit to know that you have the sense about you to still consider it worth watching.

newcomers but u basically spoil all of fate zero ? nice

me:saber is my waifu friends: Dude saber just die me:people are die when they got kill

Oh thanks.You saved me by telling me in what order to watch this anime.

I appreciate this video because I watched the first episode of Fate/Zero 2 year ago, and I didnt understand jack shit about it. It made me drop the series and anything related to Fate. So now I know where to start, Thank you. :)

yay a fellow VN reader that agrees newbies should start with D/Sn. You should watch it for its goddamn soundtrack

"Don't watch Fate:Zero first!" Too late. I already watched it first. I'm currently watching Fate:Stay Night. It's okay but even without the knowledge of Fate:Stay Night; I enjoyed Zero soo much more. The main character especially in my opinion was much more interesting.

I had no problem watching Zero first. It shows a man passing his heroic legacy to a survivor.

I tried to watch Fate/Zero based on commenters' recommendations a few years back when it came ou, tand I was very confused and had no idea what I was watching. Now that I watched Deen/Stay Night based on your recommendation, I feel like I'm watching a completely different series! Thank you!

I hate when people say to watch Fate/Zero first. Watching prequels first is a terrible idea

Been wanting to get into the Fate series of things for a while, this will be helpful thanks :D

I agree that if you’re truly invested in getting into Fate, watch 2006 or read the VN. However, if you’re just kind of a casual viewer (or trying to get someone else into Fate like I do a lot), I would never recommend either. To get someone into it, the show needs to hook them in early, and neither the VN or 2006 anime can do that. If you’re already determined to get into the show, you already have that hook, but otherwise, that can best be found in Fate/Zero or UBW.

I love the animation of fate by Deen. I wouldn't have been as intrested if i had started with ufotable fate. Idk it had a very mysterious feel with the opening, ost and lighting and the fact that it was my 1st fate so i didn't understand anything and played the vn so i enjoyed everything fully.

Arkada as also someone who's HEAVILY invested into the nasuverse, I have to politely disagree with you on the optimal watch order. I do agree Deen Stay/Night should be first as it's the closest thing to the Fate route. However I would put Fate/Zero AFTER Heaven's feel all on the notion that the original light novel was written with the assumption the reader has read all 3 routes. For me it hurts the most because Sakura's backstory was the defining moment of heartbreak for me in the series, Fate/Zero has spoiled that to the mass populous and none of them, in my opinion, will experience the same amount of sadness that was realizing the happy cheerful girl was a broken mess. How you read 2 full routes getting a sense that Sakura was pure and then getting hit with her full tragedy. So ya, I would recommend Deen Stay Night, ufotable UBW, ufotable Heaven's Feel, then Fate/Zero as the best way to experience fate.

I thought Deen's adoption was not perfect but was enjoyable and was a good way for me to get into the series as it mashed up the three routes which let me dip my feet into the pool by focusing on the fate route mainly

Deen/Stay night was great to me. I appreciate all the fate adaptations

I cannot emphasize how much I agree with this opinion.

"Don't watch Fate/Zero first." *Me who saw Fate/Zero first before watching this.* "....Fuck"

It seems the comments have a decent amount of diversity, but I'll still put in my two cents. I agree that Fate/Stay Night 2006 should be watched first (for anime-onlys) and I'm actually part of the minority that enjoyed the series enough to finish it through. However, I'm not to appreciative of making the act of watching Fate/Zero first a taboo, and some have already taken that to heart. Of course, I don't think it was your intention to antagonize those who started off with Fate/Zero, so I won't flame you for something you didn't do. I watched the Fate Series in this order: Fate/Zero, Fate/Stay Night 2006, Fate/Stay Night: Unlimited Blade Works by ufotable, (this is also when I watched Kara no Kyoukai, but that's in the broader Nasuverse), tried Fate/kaleid, Fate/Grand Order, the new Fate/Apocrypha I don't think there's anything wrong with beginning with Fate/Zero first, as there's still a underlying problem with people starting with Fate/Stay Night (2006). First of all, the viewer might not even finish the adaption due to its various problems, most of which are seen right away in DEEN's botched interpretation of Shirou. We already know this. But the problem lies in that Fate/Stay Night (2006) has a different kind of audience, or rather a different audience demographic, than Fate/Zero (this is assuming we exclude people who read the visual novels as this is for anime only). Now obviously, the audiences overlap due to being the same franchise, but the sheer difference in the tone of F/SN 06 and F/Z, F/SN UBW, and F/SN HF means that people who would actually appreciate the rest of the series won't even give them the light of day if they don't power through F/SN 06. And the people who do enjoy and finish it are met with Fate's typical long expositions, which they might actually get bored of. This separation in tone is unfortunate as DEEN seemed to want to take the material seriously as shown from using the remix of This Illusion, disillusion, as it's opening, but still fell into multiple cliche pitfalls. Fate/Zero may hold spoilers (and while I am not one who cares about spoilers, that's a topic for another day), but those are really only glimpses into the various routes, and do not contain enjoyment breaking spoilers, unless finding out Sakura is "bad" without any context is truly intolerable for Heaven's Feel. If anything, it encourages viewers of Fate/Zero to anticipate the upcoming Heaven's Feel Movies. Fate/Zero also meant for a mature audience, and takes them seriously, and presents a multitude of fascinating clashing ideals while Fate/Stay Night 2006 is rather generic in its appeal towards a teenage audience. My point is that people will want to see something in the series that fits to them, and if they choose Fate/Zero to start from because they like the tone, a certain character, or just how dang beautiful it is, they totally can do that, especially if they would not feel encouragement from Fate/Stay Night 2006.

Thank you for this I alwyas wanted to watch the series but didn't know where to start

id say if you have access and are into it start with the visual novel first. If you cant for whatever reason follow tristans advice and start with deen stay night

I would.....*cough* suggest to read before anything else Tsukihime ,Plus DISC and Kagetsu Tohya *cough*

I disagree. Fate/Zero spoils so much from fate stay night. The suspense and surprises of stay night are diminished when you've seen Zero. Especially when it comes to plot points concerning Sakura and Kirei. Fate/zero should be viewed last even if that means viewing it after the heaven's feel. As you said Zero is a Greek tragedy and thus is meant to be viewed with knowledge of the events of the of the 5th war. As a person who was never read the VN, even I agree to view stay night in VN order then Zero

My God, this series seems more convoluted than MGS

I'm so glad i did this in the right order

I started with Fate/Zero... And I don't regret it.

I get what you mean, but I feel like Fate/Zero works the best as both an introduction AND a stand-alone story if a newbie isn't sure how into this giant crazy franchise they actually want to go. I also can't think of much that's important in Fate route that doesn't get covered or done better in the other two routes and/or Zero so I'd personally only recommend D/SN to completionists or as something entertaining to have on in the background [This is all obviously a moot point to anyone who wants to read the vn first and LBR, most people aren't gonna want to do that].

I knew nothing about the fate franchises and whenever the blurays i got it as a gift fate zero and i think that not knowing the tragedy of Emmia makes the anime so much more impactful but that maybe that i related to him more that way either way its my favorite anime.

I did exactly as suggested and I’m SO GLAD I DID. 😁 DEEN Fate/Stay Night > Fate/Zero (omg, the revelations blew me away) > Fate UBW > and now Heaven’s Feel I, II, & III (whenever 3 premieres).

As someone who DID get into the franchise with Fate/Zero, back before UBW even came out, I have to say that I actually felt like the story did a GREAT job communicating how pointless and tragic everything was on its own. Not that I disagree with you entirely. It probably would've been better to start with Deen's F/SN if I had known (still having trouble finding it actually), but it's not as big a deal to start with F/Z as you make it out to be.

UBW was what got me in to anime. It was on Netflix and it piqued my curiosity. That was about 15 months ago, and anime has basically taken over my life since. The only thing I had watched before that was Evangelion.

I agree with everything you're saying about why Deen adapted the Fate route the way they did. Being the first route and the introduction to the world of Stay Night made the Fate route the most logical choice but they needed to add at least some elements of the other routes because there's so many key events that occur in them. Such as that filler with Sakura which was put in so she and Caster would actually have a role in a storyline they barely appeared in in the original VN version. Caster only has an active role in UBW while Sakura gets involved in the war only during HF. At the time, there was no way of knowing the other routes would get the chance to be animated. I'm very glad I watched both Deen and Zero before UBW.

Saying that Zero is the first chronologically is incredibly stupid because Nasu himself has gone and said that Zero is an alternate timeline to the 4th war that happened in Stay Night, this is made even more clear considering the differences between the 4th war in SN where Saber pretty much stomped everyone except Gilgamesh and the one in Zero where the Servants were roughly equal

Am I the only one who likes stay night better, its mainly because nostalgia.

You're not alone. I thought it was better than Fate/Zero.

A nice alteration to this watching sequence would be to watch the Deen adaptation of UBW, followed by zero, and then Ufotabled UBW. It gives you the crash course that deen supplies, but quickly gets you on to the visually euphoric ufotable adaptations

Glad you made this video, I've wanted to check out this series after finding one of the opening songs on youtube and loving it. But between all of the visual novels (which I really don't feel like reading), anime and games(???) I had no idea how to even start. Thank you.

anyone playing fate grand order I honestly love the story

The route fate/zero spoils the most is heavens feel. So watching fate/zero anywhere besides either first or last defeats the purpose. That being said, while fate/zero works as a good starting point it ALSO cannot be completely appreciated without knowing everything from fate/stay night. So in summary: READ THE FUCKING VISUAL NOVEL.

Heh. Been meaning to start this series, but had no idea WHERE to start. Thanks, Arkarda!

Thank you, I needed this video