Is Mexico Really better than Guarma? 

Welp….based off the poll. This is gonna be interesting. Can i save myself by saying “its just an opinion”? Lol😅

What alot of people don't talk about is Guarma didn't just destroy Arthur's health, it also destroyed Dutch and Javier's mental state.

The problem is comparing these settings as though they are equivalent moments, simply because they both take place outside of the United States. They serve different purposes in their respective plots. Guarma is a short chapter that acts as the fulcum about which Arthur's story turns on a dime. It's the point where everything changes dramatically. Mexico on the other hand is about inverting John's predicament in order to explore the darker side of his character. He's no longer backed up by decent, well intentioned people like Leigh Johnson or Bonnie and Drew MacFarlane. He's completely alone, in the middle of a political situation he barely understands. It's naturally going to be a longer, slower burn.

I believe the reason Abraham never faces John on his actions is because all Abraham cares about is the fact that John saved him and Abraham only cares about himself, and could probably care less about anyone else, as his people are expendable to him

I liked how you can actually go back to Mexico, unlike Guarma

Short answer is yes.

I really liked the Mexico part of RDR1. Guarma in RDR2 was just pure insanity, it was so different and unexpected and jarring. It was like a fever dream.

When you go to Mexico, you get a badass poncho. When you go to Guarma, all you get is a lame plantation sunhat. Even the one armed man that was captured has a clean shaven upper lip but Arthur isn't allowed to shave at all on that island. Heck, just adding a new horse breed to Guarma that Arthur can take back with him like the Cuban Criollo or a stripper clip loading Mauser Model 1893, a relic from the Spanish-American war that is an upgrade to the bolt action Krag Arthur would have by Ch 3. From a gameplay perspective, the loss of autonomy and the fact that you gain almost nothing from this adventure in the exotic makes Guarma just such a drag to actually play though. Sure it may serve a story purpose, but for a good long chuck of it, the only thing the player can do is press "w" to walk forward, a literal walking simulator.

John at his worst in Mexico? Why? IMO both factions were corrupt and John shouldn’t have held allegiance to either side. He was there for Javier and bill then he gtfo

As a Mexican I have a bias so, Poncho John frfr

Mexico, it’s not even close

Thank you for these videos brother. You single handedly got me to replay the game for a 5th time, 600 hours and I still don't mind playing this masterpiece of a game all over again.

They should of made it so you fight on the Colonel side first. Then Abraham's second. All the while Landon Ricketts gives you that ear full in-between!

if Arthur went to mexico he would have lived longer and we would have hours more of gameplay 😅

i would pay for a Sadie DLC right after Micah´s Death, and she could go to mexico and do missions there and in New Austin, after all she wanted to go south america and mexico its on the way

I love your videos keep them up

Mexico was a great place for Rdr1 cuz it also symbolizes the Wild West greatly

Going back to Guarma makes no sense for Arthur or John. Maybe R* could've done some kinda DLC for story mode where we somehow worked for Fussar transporting stuff back and forth but even that is a stretch. Guarma would make more sense in online tbh because our characters could've met Fussar somehow and started working for him however. I've been all around the Guarma map through the use of glitches and it is a BIG map. Wasted land if you ask me. Lot of it is low poly of course but still you can travel quite far before just falling off the map into the ocean. It sucks that Vuarma was rushed and we couldn't explore more but for the story it made sense for us to get the hell outta there quickly. Mexico in RDR 1 was much more enjoyable obviously. Maybe when R* start to work on RDRO again (if ever...) they can incorporate Mexico or even Guarma. Would be a lot of people back to RDRO I know that. From a business aspect it makes sense and if I was the CEO it would be happening post haste.

While you're rescuing Abraham from El presidio, He'll ask John what is his name. After John responds, Abraham gets mad and ask John if he's the "gringo who was fighting along De Santa and his men", and will talk about having the chance of shooting John right there as they were riding the same horse. John just responded in that cynical way: "We'll, try to resist the urge"... So yeah, I think the only reason Abraham forgave John, is obvious. Reyes do not care about his people, and he shows that everytime he has a chance. He even talk about his "Epic Escaping from El presidio, where him alone defeated all men to get away". while still being rescued from John. In the end of the day, Reyes did not care about his people, and only thought just as the same as Allende. If anything would get him power and the status of a great leader, he would do, or even forgive to keep going, like John Marston.

Guarma was a legitimate and genuine surprise in the game. I loved it and was utterly shocked at the boat scene. Amazing voice acting and cinematography

The Mexico section for John the revolution was never John's fight thats why he was at bat for both sides him getting involved with the revolution was the means to achieving Javier and Bill, the guarma section for arthur seems like it's the driving factor to the TB hitting arthur as hard as it did because being on the ship for however long could have played some factor into the progression of the TB and then arthur being dehydrated, overheated, scared, exhausted and just tired or the running took a major toll on Arthur you can see that arthur is exhausted when him and the others are running through the jungle to get away from the soldiers not to mention when you go to help Leon save the workers that are going to get hanged the beating that arthur took from the interrogator surly didn't help with his health and the stress of the whole thing surely screwed arthur up even more, the stress of losing a father figure, watching another father figure lose his mind, seeing a close friend get killed right in front of you has to definitely take a major toll on a man

I was really confused and its great you mentioned that John is going back and forth in the revolution like does no one care John was betraying both sides?

Mexico is important to rdr to make the map big enough to explore guarma is important for completely different reasons but both games need those sections

People hated the Mexico storyline back then. I’m sure that same crowd people who loves Mexico story would respect the Guarma storyline

Cowboy culture and the lawlessness of the "West" existed in Mexico (particularly what would become their Northern states and Southwestern U.S. states) centuries before Americans settled there. Therefore its more appropriate to have Mexico than Guarma (Cuba) which has little ties to that culture and history.

I think a HUGE factor, for me and a lot of others, is being able to go back to these places. Mexico, once accessed in the story, became part of the world. It used the same mechanics as every other part of the game and had some fun new things to discover, and at the end of it all, after the story was done, was still there in the world. It was still governed by the same rules as the rest of the game. Guarma is an important story point, but so isolated from everything else in the game that it just doesnt feel like part of the game at all. While offering a vastly different biome with new animals and people and culture, it severely limits the mechanics and gameplay. It plays so differently, and doesn't encourage exploration, despite having a beautiful new map. It's linear, where the rest of the game is up to you in how you play. And to cap it off, you can't visit it again. It's not part of the world. It's not part of the game. It's part of the story, and that's it. I personally don't think Guarma and Mexico deserve any comparison beyond the fact that they take place outside of R*'s continental United States. Guarma, in my eyes, is more like RDR's Beecher's Hope, in that the game limits gameplay, slows WAAAAAY down, and is more interested in telling the story than it is selling exciting action.

One thing I always liked was seeing how Micah and Arthur are still happy to see each other when they meet back up on Guarma. Brief as it may be.

As someone who played both games, I never felt the Mexico part in the 1st game detracted from the main story. However, I can't say the same for Guarma. It was great and all, but kind of felt unrelated.

Who else thinks hosea would have died in Guarma if he didnt die at the bank

Guarma is the point at which it becomes clear to everyone that its all over and its just about survival now. Everything leading up to it was the gang moving further and further east despite wanting to go back west eventually. Its so far removed from where they started and such an extreme setting comparatively to reflect the characters feelings imo.

i will say after finishing the game and replaying it but its definitely not as bad as it was when i first played it. the final mission, i thought, was always enjoyable.

Guarma was the most boring part of the game. Can’t even travel

I think that Mexico was important in highlighting John’s isolation, intended or not, as well as giving him a broader scope of the world to truly realize just how much he loved his family. Guarma was the turning point for Arthur in re-aligning his values and loyalty

The point you bring up around 12:00 for me is why I think Mexico was better. The entire time I was in Guarma I more/less crashed through the missions because I so badly wanted to get back to the mainland and see what was going on and personally because of this I was less immersed in the setting of Guarma. It was only on my second playthrough that I got to really see the details that Guarma highlighted like Dutch’s further descent into insanity and Arthur’s health deteriorating.

Guarma is arthurs final gut punch an incredibly important point he realizes its over and where the player can absorb and reconsilidate the previous mission.

also arthur sways his gun a lot in deadeye on guarma

good video man

got a typo in your thumbnail this time

Mexican revolution was historically and culturally the embodiment of the wild west with gunfighting outlaws running around on horseback, whereas the Spanish American war wasn't so much as the Caribbean is so far separated from countries like Mexico.

bro said Ghorma

I feel like something a lot of people get caught up on in Mexico is John playing both sides, and ignore the fact that John could see there was a severe lack of loyalty in the Mexican government, even amongst themselves. Allende and De Santa clearly see John as just disposable help, and De Santa goes even further by setting up Espinoza and John on what is basically a suicide mission with greenhorn troops in order to further his political standing within the army. They don't even value their own soldiers, why would John think they would keep their promises to him? Of course he would try his luck elsewhere.

Just opened the video... YES

ill be forever biased to 1 just because johns inflection is better and he doesnt sound like a homely overreactive dad but has the cold intimidating psycho rizz arthur is kind of the opposite, he's more performative verbally and hick with his speech habits but even when he's being menacing ("i TOLD you you'd regret messing with ME"), he has a more manic prideful sense of self (or early game when he gets TB) despite ending being way more empathetic than he portrays himself, while john is a joke in 2 all the way up to 1907 then off screen becomes a cold, deadpan, articulate psycho in 1. he is more grey too i take that back. and yeah i know this isn't about john 1 vs 2 but idc i'm forever biased to 1 because john was acted so well

Both chapters are good though Mexico is absolutely iconic. Both are ultimately necessary to progress in the protagonists’ goal - survival for Arthur and reuniting with the family for John. I think Guarma is also just as important for Bill, Javier and Micah. Dutch, Micah, Bill, Javier and Arthur are all potentially the worst of the gang. Arthur’s honor can go up or down since Guarma. What matters is how the player plays him . He can die a flawed but a man that tried to save others out of loyalty or a horrible murderer, a thief and a selfish outlaw if his honor is low, same as Bill, Javier, Micah and Dutch who all change after Guarma. I tend to think that each of the lower ranked members became disillusioned with Dutch after Guarma, each for their specific reasons. Arthur is starting to become disillusioned with Dutch by this point. He had doubts before but now he witnessed Dutch betraying his own beliefs. Javier and Bill started to lose faith in the crazed Dutch, and even Micah shown glimpses of doubt in Dutch. As for Reyes not threatening John, I think he pardoned him because he helped him significantly and made the rebels’ deaths meaningful, or that he didn’t care. However, Reyes kept an eye on John and knew that he’d be hunted down by John should he betray him, just like De Santa, Espinoza, Allende, Williamson and Escuella were. It wasn’t worth the risk, because John was dangerous and it’s possible, though I might be reaching that Reyes researched John’s past and learned how he killed dozens of men just to get back at a rat who has killed his best friend and betrayed their gang.

thumbnail: atur + sickness

The old woman Dutch kills had a knife to Dutch so she wasn’t that innocent. Bronte wasn’t that shocking, Bronte was dead before fed to the gators so John’s reaction felt overly dramatic. Nonetheless Dutch definitely really went off the deep end, and this is my favorite game of all time.

I like that you can go back to Mexico in red dead redemption but not Guama in red dead redemption 2 I think

I think by you explaining John's moral proclivities and how his time in Mexico highlighted them, you answered the question. Mexico was better than Guarma in terms of the story in my opinion. The way John was written was incredible and will remain one of the most memorable rockstar anti heroes to date.

ATHUR'S + SICKNESS

When John first arrives in Mexico, and if you head to Landon, the first thing John does is shoot three people just for playing around with his hat.

Is this even a real question?

I did all the army missions in Mexico i could, untill they turned on john... did it make me feel any better? No... lol

Idk if anyone has mentioned it here but the fact that guarma was supposed to be this massive place you could return to later in the game which got cut somewhere in development is most definitely the reason why guarma is so lacking gameplay wise. Its still impressive they managed to put so much story in the few missions we get there. A massive open world returnable guarma wouldve been better though :p

Here’s the thing for the Mexico fans.. if Mexico had the rdr 2 treatment it would’ve been better than Guarma. But as it stands 5 seconds of Guarma goes farther than 5 hours of rdr 1 Mexico. And I played 1 first.

i feel like mexico was a good chapter to show that john wasn't better than the men he was hunting, he was one of them for years. i think it helps illustrate it as more morally grey especially since we only knew vaguely what he did in the gang until the second game released. he was just as deadly and foolish as them and he probably would've been the first to say it too

pfft he misspelt arthur in the title

Guarma at least doesn't take too long in the grand scheme of the game, and it's vital in seeing s different side to all the characters. I despise the Mexico portion becsuse other than Rickets there is nothing really of substance. You just get shown over and over about how horrible it is and how terrible the tyrants there are. Like Rdr2 has a lot of messed up stuff happen, but at least it is more tastefully done, the mexico portion is just uncomfortable to sit through, especially all of the voilence and abuse against women. And then they do the "both sides are bad" thing with Rayes being a massive jackass in his own right, making the ending seem hollow. Bill and Javiar aren't even in it for the whole thing until right at the end where the game remembers they exist, which feels like an utter waste of their characters.

I don’t have to watch the video to say yes. I’ll watch it though because your voice makes me tingle… Wait what

Keep in mind how much content was cut from Guarma. If you read about all the amazing stuff that was left out, Guarma may have been better than Mexico

Guarma in a story lighting? Probably more important than Mexico for the story however gameplay wise is the worst. Chapter 5 will always be one of the worst while for Mexico I think is the best part of Red Dead 1.

Not even a debate

ngl the fact that john’s not interacting with good people makes it in my eyes reasonable that he has loyalty to no one in mexico, burning down towns and aiding an oppressive government obviously isn’t a good thing but its not like john enjoyed doing it he just deemed it necessary to get what he wanted

Mexico is awesome

Didn’t watch the video because of how utterly ridiculous the title sounds. Guarma is just filler and is arguably the most boring Chapter in RDR2. Mexico is a key part of RDR1 and takes up over a third of the game.

can't even revist guarma so.

Athur💀

lol anyone who is mad that a rd character that’s a outlaw does bad things is funny

Guarma is like Pittsburgh in the Last of Us. Extremely repetitive and doesn't add anything to the story

I hate the way he pronounces “Saint Denis”. It is not “Son Doni” it is Saint Denny’s just minus the ‘s

It's lucky he didn't die from covid out there.

Way better

Yes Mexico is 100 percent better

Mexico was much better than guarma. The story, the gameplay, everything.

Under one hour gang 👇

lmao people defend RDR 2 so hard Stop huffing so much copium

Bad pacing. You do not make the story rather interesting then toss some main characters on an island for a b plot and act like its genius. This would have been fine at a slower moment.

Respectfully, anybody that says that Arthur Morgan is better than John Marston is wrong.

I thought both were pretty boring

John Marston > Arthur Morgan Javier Esquela > John Martson

Abraham was a joke

Mexico in rdr1 is just a great experience. It’s almost like when John crosses into Mexico, he completely leaves his morals at the border

Id rather have mexico then Guarma, why ffs they even modeled Guarma island when you cant even visit it in multiplayer and the chapter is small asf