Is Paul the Founder of Christianity? 

Imagine creating a religion about a person you never met but only hallucinated meeting them?

It takes an agnostic atheist to explain Paul's gospel better than I ever heard explained in church, and he doesn't even believe it! 😂

Awww sweet, I didn't know if we would have any while Bart was gone

This helps answer so many questions I have had about Paul ever since I was a little kid raised in the Fire & Brimestone type of Baptist church. Very interesting, since I have always sensed there was 2 different " "religions" being taught between Paul & Jesus. Very different!

Megan’s glasses are great!! Bart is always giving super information.

I have followed Bart Herman on RU-vid for years. I found this particular offering especially informative.

I sometimes almost don't watch some of these because the answer seems so obvious. "Is the Gospel of John Anti-Semetic?" YES. "Is Paul the Founder of Christianity?" YES. But Bart's degree of insight always sheds new light on things I've taken for granted. I appreciate how he looks beyond the knee-jerk answer to provide a broader, fairer answer.

A personal thank you to Bart Ehrman for his amazing work in making Biblical scholarship accessible to a mainstream audience. I am an MA student in theology and your books were among my main primers into the subject, your work and that of J.D Crossan is what I recommend everybody as great introductory texts into early Christianity and New Testament studies!

Always eager for the next MJPodcast! Megan and Dr. Ehrman are a great team!

43:47 Matthew 11:11 Suggests that Jesus who has foresight, didn't mention anyone of future importance, felt that John was quite important. In fact, John was the first person in the Christian Greek Scriptures to mention Jesus.

I have enjoyed all of these podcasts but this was ,for me, far and away the most interesting .Paul's influence (for better or worse),not only on Christians, but on all of us has been immense. I say that as an atheist. We all live in a world which bears his stamp. Ta for this.

I'm thrilled to see this - as an Ehrman blog subscriber I always wanted to ask him this. As I was evolving away from Christianity I sort of thought, if there's anything attributed to Jesus that felt actually prophetic, it was his talk about "false prophets" - and then here's Paul, changing the fundamental teaching of Jesus: instead of "walk this way," Paul's teaching is "you just have to repent and acknowledge." It infuriated me that people could do horrible acts and then just wash their guilt away - it's like an organized crime gateway drug. Anyway - valuable topic. Thank you!

I come from a religious tradition (Ebionites) where we reject the beliefs and teachings of Paul. We accept James the Just as the leader of Yeshua's movement after his death. We focus solely on the Jewish teachings of Yeshua, and as a result, our outlook on the world, and towards people of other religions, is completely different to that of mainstream Christianity, especially of Evangelicals

I love these, thanks for posting them

Amazing work, thank you sooooo much. God bless you both

This is fascinating. I look forward to the course.

This was such a great listen. Thanks Bart for actually addressing these topics.

Doc, one of your most enthusiastic listener from Pakistan 🇵🇰👍

👏🙂 Yay, another episode. Great video

Great topic! I've thought about this a lot and it's good to hear the good Dr's opinion.

Thanks Megan and Dr Bart E. to enlighten us.

I love Megan's voice and Bart's rationale. Grettings from Chile, South America

Amazing content as always, thank you

Great discussion as always, I would also be interested in a comparative analysis of each of your disciplines.

I love this series with Dr. Ehrman. Read and loved his new Armageddon book.

Another banger of a topic, great work!

I’m so glad you have an internet presence. Thank you for this fascinating content.

Thank you for your soapbox stand today Bart, it was very needed. Too bad it couldn't be heard on every street corner on the planet,

I think the New Testament's reliance on Pauline works indicates that the church of Christ (as we know it) was founded by gentiles, not Jews, and so they looked to Paul for their right to exist. Jewish proto-Christians may not have considered Paul authoritative at all (which would open up a realm of possibilities), but eventually they were out- numbered by gentiles, so Paul's letters won out (perhaps long after Paul was gone).

Also, the existence and popularity of the "red letter bible" (since 1899, with the words of Jesus printed in red ink) attests to the fact that many Christians consider the words of Jesus far more important than anything else in the NT, including Paul's words.

Excellent presentation 🙏

Enjoyed this discussion, supporting my personal thoughts on the importance of Paul. Interesting insight in the Soapbox.

I think its fair to say that Paul the MAIN founder of SURVIVING Christianity.

I look forward to every episode of this. Such a great podcast!

You guys are so awesome!

Thanks for the soapbox today - excellent video.

Another great episode. After reading Amos 3-5, I’d love to hear Bart’s thoughts on the verses and the context

thanks Megan and Bart another fine episode.

2nd time ive listened!! Cant wait for next week 🖒

Excellent information. Very logical and put things in perspective. Great job.

I like hearing Bart say that Paul probably wrote hundreds of letters over his lifetime, and all we have are seven authentic ones. I've thought that for a long time. What has been missed from Paul's full view since we only have a tiny glimpse into his thinking, but created a whole religion on this sliver.

How important was Paul in his own time, and how important was his mission? Three of the most important churches in Antiquity were Antioch, Rome and Alexandria. Neither of them had been founded by Paul.

Thank you. Watching from Alaska.

Thank you very much, so very clear. So much material for thought

This is great because we heard about Paul from Dr Tabor last time

Considering the authors of the New Testament never met Jesus, and largely told the story they wanted to tell rather than something that is historically accurate, as the Johannine community shows, I think it is fair to say the authors of the New Testament are the Founders of Christianity. Since Paul wrote most of the books of the New Testament, I think it is fair to say that Paul and maybe Luke are the Founders of Christianity. Paul seems to be more like a modern Televangelist than an accurate story teller. His account of meeting Jesus sounds like Oral Roberts meeting a 900 foot tall Jesus who told him to build the City of Faith Medical and Research Center. I'm not a mythicist, but since the only things that remain of Jesus' life were those things written down in the New Testament, I'm not sure the actual historical Jesus, a poor Jewish preacher who was preaching to Jews who somehow ran afoul of the Romans, had all that much to do with modern Christianity, a largely Gentile religion that seems to be based more on Greek and Roman ideas than Jewish ideas. I don't think the real life Jesus is any more relevant to the New Testament or Christian Religions than the real life Abraham Lincoln is to Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter.

Worth watching, even if only to hear Megan speak the word "Bart"! Also, worthwhile discussion on Pauline History & Theology.

Paul had Luke for biographer. Luke's Gospel shows how creative he can be. How many Founders didn't have biographers? When missionaries came to India, they found a Christian Church already there. That Church attributed its foundation to Doubting Thomas.

Ehrman is very intelligent teacher, I admire his abilities.

Megan + Bart = Dream team! 😊

happy holidays dr B.

He does great courses as well, great teacher

I hope that Bart will at some point explain what “salvation” could possibly have meant to Jews, but more especially to Pagans. What exactly would his converts think they were being “saved” FROM? Jews would, I suppose, be hoping for the establishment of God’s kingdom, a new and perfect Israel that would encompass all Torah-observant Jews under the rule of His Anointed; Pagans wouldn’t be expecting or hoping to be “saved” from anything, would they? Would anybody in the Empire have any sense at all of the later Christian notion of being “born in sin” or “living in sin” and needing “salvation from sin”? That seems completely anachronistic. Did Paul make that all up from scratch? Or is he saying “You can be “saved” from death - you can live forever in a perfect world? It’s confusing. I try to imagine an Evangelical preacher of today telling a crowd of first-century Jews or Pagans that “salvation” can be theirs if they accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior, and them being completely puzzled. Salvation? What from? 🤔🤔🤔

I see Paul as the Brigham Young of Christianity. He didn't found it, but after the original founder died prematurely, he expanded it into the religion we know today.

Excellent work everyone

amazing episode!

Was Paul the founder? Well, it depends what you mean by founder. Clearly there was a church/group before Paul.After all, he was persecuting them! On the other hand… the original church was not evangelizing gentiles…. And gentiles eventually exclusively dominated the church. So, effectively Paul DID found what ultimately became the church

Megan is really on the roll interviewing Bart Ehrman!

Man, I just read Amos 3-5 and wow, that's some words I've never heard people really echo before, maybe bits and pieces, but wow. It makes me wonder how many church people see choirs as a detestable thing.

I love this channel. It helps me understand Christianity and serves to make my faith stronger!

Finally! Say, would the term "Pauline Heresy" be considered a strong opinion? I have a copy of Jefferson's Bible. I also have a Red Letter Bible.

He is the founder of todays Christianity

🔥 *Missing Questions*🔥 ✨1-Did Jesus warn his followers from person who will destroy the Law and will be called least? See Matthew 5 17-20 ✨ 2-Did Saul be called Paul? Did Paul means the least? Is Paul derives from the Roman family name Paulus or Paullus, from the Latin adjective meaning "small", "humble", *"least"* or "little"? ✨3-How did Jesus describ his enemy's work plan in Matthew 13 24-30? The enemy who sowed bad seeds in Jesus's good wheat field, Is Paul that enemy who corrupted teachings of Jesus Christ.

Many pastors want to keep their flock blind and ignorant, then Bart Ehrman come to enlighten. I am a Christian yet these help me to see wider. Thanks

Loved the soapbox! I dislike anyone using a tiny snippet, out of context, to make a point. Pick up any book, and use the same method to make any point that one wants. I think the same can be said for trying to use one line from a movie and using it to explain the message of the entire movie. And don’t get me started on rating a book based on what one heard was the message. Read the book first… end of my rant

Yes he is. Paul was the true founder of Christianity. Paul was the one who got Christianity rolling. Paul is the reason Christianity became a European religion.

Thank you for this wonderful talk and explanation

The Church is so much more than St.Paul. The answer is we don't know about the other founders, missionaries and the growth of early Christianity. The Catholic Church bases its dogmas on the Magisterium, the Tradition and the Bible. Protestants being entirely dependent upon the Bible are inclined to over-emphasise the role of Paul. Paul was a great Apostle and Saint and Christian priest who celebrated the mass. We have his own testimony to that.

I've jut thought its interesting that we only have 7 of Paul's letters, given the significance of the number 7 in Christianity. I wonder why those were chosen in particular? and by whom?

I have been following Bart Ehrman for a few years now and have learned so much about Christianity. He is geniune and teaches about the bible from the perspective of one who was a very dedicated follower of Christ. The Soapbox discussion was enlightening, I knew about the command regarding a fine be paid if a man caused a woman to lose a baby, fetus, child in her womb. Not given the same value as the life of the mother. The verses in Numbers (5: 11-31) were a bit of a shock. God will end a pregnancy if the woman concieved a child with someone other than her husband, also put the woman under a curse. So much in the bible that is easy to read over without really thinking about what is says. Per these verses in Numbers God is good with killing an illegitimate child in the womb, it does not have a right to life in God's eyes. My thoughts regarding life in the womb kind of comes down to how far along is the child developed? Seems any logical person would consider that a baby one day before its birth can suffer the same as that same baby the day after its birth. So for me, I don't want that pain capable creature to suffer any more than I want a puppy or kitten to suffer. A late term abortion requires the baby to be born, seems we as civilized people would make arrangements to allow that life to continue and not condone the torture it will feel when it is dismembered, this has nothing to do with the bible.

There was a teaching of Jesus that was pre-crucification and a teaching of Paul that was post-crucification. Jesus taught being born again from water and spirit and Paul taught salvation from the blood of the lamb of God on the cross. It would seem to me that the crucifix would be the image of the Beast.

What always trips me up, is salvation for what/from what? And I know he went over this but at least for me it’s a difficult point to remember. Why do they all need salvation in the first place? Especially before hell theology.

There's a great scene in the movie "The Last Temptation of Christ" where Jesus has a conversation with Paul. It's during the period when he's dying on the cross and he experiences his "last temptation". I won't ruin it by saying more, but it's a great scene in a very interesting movie that focuses more on Jesus' human experience than his divinity.

Thank you for another illuminating talk. I grew up a Catholic and attended a Jesuit University but have learned more about the authentic roots of Christianity from your Teaching Company lectures and books than anywhere else. I will have to look up that Exodus passage and use it in my next abortion debate with a pro-lifer!

I've been giving the example from Exodus (concerning a miscarriage) for years. People's eyes glaze over and they act as if I have not said a word.

Wondering if anyone's ever read, "The Jesus Mysteries: Was the "Original Jesus" a Pagan God"? The subtitle is a little cheesy and it kept me from reading the book for some time, but boy, when I did, I found it very interesting and illuminating! I highly recommend it. Too often Christians and their teachers are staring at Jesus' finger pointing to the moon, rather than looking at the moon to which Jesus was pointing. I think Professor Ehrman's kind of thing is focusing on the finger, too, but that's OK as that is his area, Biblical history, rather than theology or Christian mysticism. Thoughts?

Fascinating subject. Excellent video. Thank you for explaining everything so clearly. Paul had so many enemies, yet Paul's variant of Judaism became orthodox Christianity. Was Paul successful because he was more persuasive than all the others? Or was it because Paul performed miracles and miracles happened wherever he went? Did signs and wonders differentiate Paul from his opponents? Did the miracles convince believers that Paul had been taught directly by Jesus? (that Paul was more than a Muhammad or a Joseph Smith, merely asking people to believe he was given messages from a supernatural being?) I note the Marcionites were a variant of Paul's Christianity, but it seems that the leading second century Christians in Rome were not ready to take Paul's Christianity one step further and ditch the OT.

I love & follow Jesus because i'm muslim 😊

Please make that Soapbox section into a quick RU-vid Short!

Idea/suggestion: How about an encyclopedia of Christianity based on the teachings of Mr. Ehrman? How about if Mr. Ehrman writes an encyclopedia of Christianities? Should his students undertake such a project? How about a detailed time-line on the history of Christianity, including the versions of Christianity that were defeated?

Yes. Jesus was NOT EVER a Christian. In fact, even Peter was not a Christian, nor any of the close associates of Jesus (whoever they were) were "Christian". Further, the idea of Christianity was not completed with Paul, but later extended and refined by others, such that people often confuse pseudepigrapha with Paul's apparently original writings. Be careful what you all call "Christianity". Some of it is nothing more than christianISM.

I see Paul as the most successful early promoter.

Dear Dr. Ehrman, huge fan of yours and enjoyed reading your books. They are very thoughtful and enlightening! Love all your videos and debates over the years. My question for this topic is, could Paul have met Jesus alive during his ministry? Since Paul was a Pharisees, and the gospels have clearly mentioned them followed Jesus many times, while being unnamed.

Bart, I’ve never taken any of your classes, but I would like to ask if the audio and video of your classes will be recorded differently than this video? I have super fast internet and the quality of your video and audio is inferior to Megan’s. I’m not just complaining but I am hearing disabled and both the audio and video quality is very important. Thanks for your info.

Paul is to Christianity what Ray Kroc is to McDonald's

Bad math, Bart! If Paul's ministry lasted for around 30 years, and he founded, say, 20 churches, and wrote each church, say, 2 letters per year, that does not mean he wrote a total of 30 X 20 X 2, or 1200 letters. After all, he didn't found 20 churches all at once, in the first year of his ministry. Twenty churches in 30 years is an average of one church every 1.5 years. He devotes a year and a half to Church #1, then goes off to preach elsewhere. At that point, he begins sending 2 letters/year to Church #1. So Church #1 gets 2 letters/year over the remaining years of Paul's ministry, i.e., over 28.5 years. That would be 57 letters for Church #1. Following that pattern, Church #2 would get 2 X 27, or 54, letters. Church #3 would get 51, #4 48, #5 45, and so on, until #20, which didn't get any at all. All that means the total would be more like 570 letters. Sorry, but I love math!

Great poscast Bart & Megan! Regarding the soapbox content, Bart paraphrases a verse from Psalms (139?): "You knew me before I was in my mother's womb". Although a similar phrase appears in Jeremiah 1:5 (totally different context), I have failed to find such a statement in Psalms. In Psalms 139:16 the psalmist merely states that God knew him from conception and not before conception. If the whole point Bart is making is that people gets all sorts of (bad) ideas because of what they are told the Bible says, why paraphrase the verse instead of read it? Is anybody else looked into those verses?

Wow, great place to be visiting. That’s definitely a place I would love to visit.

Excellent, important question. I just wonder about the silent voices , those of women who offered the first churches, in their homes, long before the first built churches by then, in men's hands. What did they find in the message, that spoke to them; we can only guess, but they provided the first spaces, the "meal", were deaconesses, and cleaned up.... Because like the well known, more active gods & goddesses, Hestia was little mentioned, god of the hearth & home. And more honored daily than all the others. Loved the soapbox BTW. Oh, did you know Hermes, the messenger/ communication god, was also known as "The Good Shepherd"? He, too, was worshipped daily in the home, on the roadside, in many ways not so much in temples. The most human, and friend, to mankind. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-vYMhcEFrzrU.html Hermes: The Immortal Guide. YT. I also love that Paul's (or whoever), the beautiful words about LOVE used in so many wedding ceremonies today, his letter to the polis/church of Corinth, was an ancient trading city, a port, full of "sailors" hint hint, whose patron deity was, Aphrodite (Venus). On the other hand, perhaps the Pauline doctrine was not Christian at all. Less inspired by God, than by a single man's vision. This the question, all wrong. THE founder, leaves us with no other answers. It's said that, " Western Civilization is like a family; whose Father was Greek; whose Mother was Hebrew, and they packed up the Family and moved to Rome. " Cheers! And some commentors . . . Get your head out of the Bible sometimes! Take a breath, lol!

The Jesus story began in 48 AD with the first of the Pauline Epistles (which comprise nearly half of the New Testament books) when Paul realized the Daniel 9:25 prophesy of a messiah expired without fulfilling so he made one up decades later and set the story decades in the past matching Jewish expectations of the messiah to make the prophesy seem true. The fulfillment of the Daniel 9:25 prophecy written in 444 BC was the test of the true messiah. By 48 AD it was known that the prophecy of a messiah coming in "seven weeks and threescore and two weeks" had not occurred on the prophesied date. It was the 69th Week and the 70th Week was soon to come. The prophesied messiah was expected and the anticipation set off a messiah craze. "Seven weeks and threescore and two weeks" is, 7 plus 60 plus 2 equals 69 total weeks. One prophetic week equals seven biblical years of 360 days (the Julian calendar was created centuries later), so 7 times 69 equals 483 total biblical years beginning with Artaxerxes' decree in 444 BC. Those 483 biblical years equal 173,880 days, or 476 Julian years. Therefore the Messiah would come and be "cut off" in AD 33. One prophetic week equaling seven Biblical years is something “Daniel” invented in about 165 BC, effectively an admission that Jeremiah 25:11-12 failed. Paul made up the entire Jesus story and added historical figures, locations, and events to add authenticity. In the Galatians "road to Damascus" conversion vision tale written in 48 AD he claimed to have gone to the Arabian desert to study the Old Testament for 17 years to align with the Daniel 9:25 prophecy. Paul's goal was to garner support for the insurrection against the Romans which began in 46 AD led by two brothers, Jacob and Simon, in the Judea province. The revolt, mainly in the Galilee, began as sporadic insurgency until it climaxed in 48 AD when it was quickly put down by Roman authorities. Both Simon and Jacob were executed. He created the fiction of having witnessed the risen messiah. He wanted to show that the messiah had come as prophesied but was murdered by the Romans. This was to entice the Gentiles to aid in the Jews' rebellion against the Romans. Instead, he created one of the world's most popular religions that is based on the literal worship of ritual human sacrifice, rape, and cannibalism. The Gospel authors copied, and embellished, Paul's fiction. None of the Gospel authors, or any other writers, were witnesses to the Bible figure known as Jesus.

Hard-hitting reality check with that Amos reference Everybody go read it! And quote the appropriate verses whenever someone tries to get you to go to church

Paul’s conversion from a persecutor of Christians to one of the greatest believers who ever lived is one of the most compelling narratives in the Bible.

Super - thank you!

Does anyone find this podcast at bit quiet? I like to listen to podcasts while driving, but I'm having trouble with this one.

The answer is right in the chrisitian bible And they conversed there in the church a whole year; and they taught a great multitude, so that at Antioch the disciples were first named Christians. (act of the apostle 11:26)

I have a question that I'm unsure if Bart answered it here or not, which gospel is most likely the most similar to the stories about Jesus that would have been heard by Paul that led to his conversion?

As we know there were no writings about Christianity before Paul's letters. How come there were established Christian communities before Paul's conversion in several places around Asia Minor and some parts of Europe? Paul discusses several aspects of the religion with those communities. It tells us that those alleged Christians knew a good deal about Christianity but maybe not right.

Thank you.

Interesting material, Mr Ehrman. My first and only question relating to Pauline teaching: PAul introduced the idea of universal salvation outside of rabbinic law/Torah adherence. After the sacrifice of Jesus, ALL could be saved. Now, does this mean that Jews themselves must believe in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ to receive salvation, or does being a practicing, devoted Jew enough?

I’d be curious to hear Ehrman’s interpretation of the Ordeal of the bitter water (Numbers 5:11-31). The NIV translators seemed to think that this was about abortion.