Love my CZ527 in 204 Ruger. Home loaded 39gr Blitzkings at 3,750fps 👌 Great for long range vermin. 223 also very effective with a variety of bullets up to 77gr TMK’s
I really appreciate what you said @11:15 . Selfishness is a characteristic we all have and need to identify so as to be dealt with. Its the root cause of many problems in life not just conservationists or hunters. I enjoy your reasonable and responsible opinions.
Thank you Ron for another informative and entertaining podcast. I bought an Interarms Mark X Mauser action in 7x57 Mauser as my second rifle after my Model 94 almost 50 years ago. What a fun cartridge to shoot. I spent many hours pouring over Hornady, Sierra and Nosler reloading manuals at the reloading bench working to get the most accurate load I could for that particular rifle. In the end I found the Hornady 139 gr. and the 154 gr. bullets to be the most accurate. I don't recall the powder I used but the loads I finally settled on gave me 3 shot groups that could be covered with a $0.50 piece at 100 yards. Still have the rifle and and 20 rounds of each load.
Thanks Matt. I understand why you love that 7x57. It's an oldie but goodie. I've taken a lot of game over the years with that 139-gr. Hornady bullet, too.
My son (15 years old) has been using a 204 AR I assembled for him for the last three years for shooting prairie dogs in SD. It's a great round and is accurate as can be. He took a coyote at about 200 yards with it last year.
Ron, Here in the Northern Rockies we did very well for many years without the wolves. Only in the last 30 years or so have the wolves, of which are a much larger variant that was here originally taken up residency through active fish and game reintroduction’s. Hunter kept the population’s in check and there was ample game available to the public. In the last 15 years the deer and elk populations have plummeted. I’m seeing wolves on my mountain now for the first time and the Elk are vanishing fast. Land use hasn’t changed much in the last 50 years nor has hunting pressure but the wolves have.
I’ve always wanted a 204. Any cartridge that hits that 4000fps mark really intrigues me. Every time I’ve got it in my head to buy one something comes up or I talk myself into something else. It’s hard to justify it when I have a few 223’s already. I’m just waiting for the day I walk into my local gun shop and he has a sweet deal on a good used one sitting there I can’t turn down.
I was going to add a comment but this is the same thing I would say. I eventually want one but I want a few other things first it’s about 5 or 6 on the list right now.
@🍀Witheringexistence🍀 No, Withering, rifling is not worn down by friction from fast bullets so much as by the heat blast from the powder charge. The rapid heating and then cooling of the steel just ahead of the throat starts to crack it. Some chemical reactions contribute. But farther down the barrel rifling stays crisp and deep for a long, long time. An old, money-saving trick machinists use is to "set back" a barrel and rechamber to extend the barrel life. In essence they remove the worn throat area.
One interesting idea Weatherby incorporated into his chamber dimensions was a longer throat length of the chamber. This permitted using more powder that increased velocities and lessened the effect of the higher chamber pressures of his cartridges. This lessened accuracy only slightly for the benefit of higher velocities. His rifles gained most fame from Holy Wood celebrities and other noted famous people using his hunting rifles. Weatherby designed stocks using high-grade woods and added embellishments of engraving and exotic woods and carvings. Many of his first rifles use FN actions stamped Weatherby and Monti Carlo stocks he was famous for using. He also produced rifles in non Weatherby cartridges as well. 🤔🙂
In your video you said that the .22 LR has burned all the powder by about 16 inches of barrel and then begins to slow down. I have heard others make same statement. But not all .22 ammo is loaded to the same velocity so it seems to me that the best barrel length for velocity should also vary. I decided to do a test. I shot each of my three .22LR rifles six times from the same box of CCI Blazer high velocity ammo over the chronograph. Of course, this test will only be accurate on my guns with Blazer ammo. Your results may vary. My results show the 16-inch barrel is not necessarily the fastest. Here are my numbers: Ruger 10/22, 16 “ TacSol barrel - 1224 fps Ruger 10/22 stainless 18” barrel - 1230 fps Tikka T1x 20” barrel - 1270 fps
The question about pistol cartridges and powder burning and bullet at about 15:00. 1) It is not "powder burning" which accelerates the bullet, it is gas pressure (for example in air rifles bullets are accelerated without any powder burning at all). Real ball powder (and even "flakes" used in pistol cartridges) do not fully burn up for a very long time, because they burn on the surface of the particles and the area of the surfaces decreases as they burn, and as temperature starts to decrease because of the less intensive burn and gas expansion the burn rate further decreases. So all weapons spew a lot of tiny particles of unburned powder all around the bullet path. But let's say all powder burned up. The gas which used to be the powder has not disappeared, it is still there, under pressure, still pushing the bullet. As it further expands the pressure falls but it is still way above the pressure in front of the bullet. That pressure is proportional to the energy transferred to the bullet per a unit (say, an inch) of barrel length . 2) The main thing trying to stop a bullet in the barrel is the friction against the walls of the barrel. When a bullet goes supersonic there is also air pressure buildup in front of the bullet. You can see when the resistance factors overcome the gas pressure for pistol cartridges (and 223) on ballisticsbytheinch dot com. Open up the energy graph for the cartridge and you can see when the energy curves flatten, that is where extra barrel length does not make any sense. For example, for a regular 9x19 it happens at ~14". But even the last few inches before that give little extra energy, how much you are willing to waste is your choice. Especially given that for 9x19 it happens at supersonic speeds, while the inefficient pistol bullets are not optimized for supersonic flight at all and lose that energy right away. So for me the reasonable maximum is what WW2-era engineers have chosen for "machine pistols"/"submachine guns" - 10-11". Too bad the dumb NFA requires 16". For rifle cartridges it usually happens much further. SAAMI uses 15-foot barrels for rifle cartridges to show the maximum possible speed at a given bullet weight (so, maximum muzzle energy). All real magnum cartridges are really a waste for typical 22" hunting rifles, let alone carbines. Better powder (with multihole particles for example) and/or higher max pressures (a la 277FURY) would be a much better solution than just more powder in a bigger casing.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors You are welcome to use the info in any of your videos or podcasts, of course. A LOT of people terribly misunderstand internal ballistics, and it is not that hard. It needs to be taught. I am not sure podcasts is such a great idea though, visual materials is a great thing and for podcasts you have to minimize them. Thanks for showing the native bow and arrow. Although was it a steel arrow tip? ;)
@@PaulVerhoeven2 Is BBTI yours? I've always loved that site, and it's one of the few I found so worthy as to donate money to. Thanks for all the excellent work, and for leaving it up.
@@Keifsanderson It is not mine. But I find it a great resource and greatly appreciate its creators, too bad they do not have more rifle calibers, only 223.
@@PaulVerhoeven2 Agreed. BBTI seems like a great resource for someone else in the community to continue. I imagine the concept of that website would support a good chunk of a RU-vid channel.
If we’re going to beat the drum for the 7x57 we also need to shed some light on the 6.5x55! I know the creedmore has stolen any thunder it had but the Swede’s made it through 2 world wars and are still taking moose with the “OG” 6.5!
7x57 factory ammo used to be loaded down a bit because most of the rifles available in that caliber were military surplus "small ring" actions. Too, some of the countroes of manufacture for Mauser rifles had inconsistent metallurgy.
Many share your feeling, sha6mm, but let's not let our feelings overpower solid numbers and reality. I know people who assume that they're in the wilderness as soon as they leave the city and see empty fields, even if said field has been plowed, sprayed or grazed for the past 150 years. F&G in most States allow the taking of various small predators such as coyotes, skunks and red fox without limit or closed seasons. Wolves, bears and cougars, are managed as big game with seasons and limits, but controlled via depredations permits. Often F&G handles depredation complaints by directly targeting certain predators in the area of the livestock killing. Federal agents even "euthanize" rampaging wolves, cougars, sometimes grizzlies that are killing livestock, harassing homeowners, etc. I visited with a man and his wife once who were monitoring wolves in one of our "reintroduction" states and they claimed the Feds killed many, many rogue wolves (livestock killers) each year and that each wolf was costing taxpayers about $1 million to "manage" over its lifetime. How much of this is accurate vs. embellished I don't know, but suffice to say predator management is much more active and complicated than many of us know. Many predators are beyond the purview of State F&G, too.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors-Podcast I have had long conservations with the Iowa DNR about out upland game and the predator vs prey problem. Iowa like South Dakota use to harvest one million pheasants a year today 250,000 is all. I can not tell you the last time I have seen a coon dog box in a truck and in the 1970’s they were very common. The DNR always says we need more Habitat but they use it as a crutch for not setting seasons that could have a positive impact like longer trapping season or legal spot lighting of Varmints. Minnesota use to have a population well under 1200 Wolfs in the state and the DNR said if they ever exceeded 1200 they would have to be managed well today they are just under 2700 and had gone as high as 3000 but the Courts and the DNR both were not looking out for the best interest of the public IMHO. So does Wolf have more value than a Deer as one wolf eats 20 deer annually so 2700x20= 54,000 deer ? Minnesota Moose population went from 9000 in 2006 to fewer than 4000 today. No I don’t believe Predators are managed correctly and yes the Federal Government has prevented local F&G in some cases. No I don’t want all predators exterminated but managed for the benefit of Man and No things will never be like before we came to this Country. Take Care Ron & Who knows I hope some day I can buy you a Drink of your choice !
@@sha6mm wildlife management is actually extremely complicated, far more than just predator/prey. Habitat, seasonal weather conditions, population densities, disease etc all come into play. To make it worse there are factors which can have major effects which aren't obvious and I suspect some not known about. Nature, left to itself, has cyclic populations. People don't care to have starving/diseased animals around, or a lack of game animals and interfere with the cycling.
Would love for them to come out with a cartridge that does exactly what a 22-250 does, only new, lighter, slower so we can get the youngins to buy it. Tell them it’s for long range and lighter recoil! Lol (Edited) did not mean to be so confusing, I meant it sarcastically as in I don’t need another varmint round, the 22-250 they came up with in the 20s is better then a 204, if I wanted 4000+fps with less pelt damage I’d buy and use a 17 Remington. I just don’t see the benefit of new when old is better, cheaper and available. I really like(and own rifles in): 22lr 223/556 22-250 243 6.5x55 270 7mm 300sav/308/30-06/300wm 45-70+p lever action loads
Interesting idea, D Con, but of course it can't work. In order to engineer a cartridge to do exactly what the 22-250 does, you'd have to make it equally fast with same weight bullets. You might be able to accomplish this with slightly less powder with a more efficient burning rate for a particular projectile mass and you might get a slightly more efficient burn with a particular case shape, but ultimately you'd need to match the MV. Recoil would be the same. You could match the MV and trajectory curve with a smaller caliber by matching bullet B.C. and MV, but that would require a quite long bullet in .204".
I carried an Assault Rifle for 4 Years in The Service. The Term "Assault Rifle"refers to A Select Fire weapon that can go between Semi, And Full Automatic at the Flip of A Switch. Hitler coined the Term when shown a New weapon designed specifically for The Human Wave Tactics Regularly Employed by The Russians on The Eastern Front. The " STG -43. The AR-15 and it's peers, can only fire one shot per pull of the trigger, and like you said, are just Self Loading Rifles, ( that look mean.).
Reducing predators bak to balance things is always the answer, we were put in charge of the wild kingdom of animals going back to Adam. Most people with no knowledge and no experience want to leave the predators out of balance, not the outdoorsman with a good understanding of these ecosystems.
Mr. Spomer, I've been following you for some time now and I love all of the caliber reviews. I've searched for a complete review on the 204 Ruger, but couldn't find one. I've seen a couple of request for the same 204 Ruger in your comments. Please direct me If you have already done a complete review? I like your education/experience with ballistics etc. I've used my 204 Ruger to cull deer, hogs & varmints. I'm down in deep South Texas between Laredo & Freer Texas which is part of the Golden Triangle of deer hunting in Texas. We have a fairly large ranch surrounded by other large ranches. I frequently take two rifles into the deer blind & use each for a specific purpose one being the 204 Ruger & the other a larger caliber (got to dig into the gun safe). I only shoot deer & hogs inside of 150yds with the 204 Ruger and shoot them in the neck/skull area for humanin kills and I have to say that I've seen them hit the ground through the scope, it surprised me the first time I shot a hog with it and saw his rear hit the ground through the scope. Please take the time to produce a review on the 204 Ruger as many people like me can follow your style of presenting caliber detailed information. David, from South Texas!
Just checking back Ron... I've had some awesome experiences with the 204 Ruger, but want to hear what you have to say? I've been shooting the 40gr Hornady due to the ballistics...
Weatherbie's showroom wasn't too far from where I grew up in South Central Los Angeles. I remember walking by his Showroom and marveling at all of the wild game on the walls, that was in the 1960tys. it was on Manchester Blvd / Firestone.
Diminishing returns means you're still getting added benefit just not as much as you were before. What Ron is referring to is no returns or negative returns when a barrel reaches a point where you get no added benefit
If your using anything but an AR-15 the 22-250 is a better choice, if you are using an AR-15 and want to step up your game a bit convert it to 224 Valkyrie.
One of the big things about predators vs hunting. Hunters want a trophy for the wall and meat in the freezer. Predators need food to survive and the easiest ones for them to catch are sick or old. So they pull out ones that might just use food that the healthy ones could make better use of.
I have a .204 and a .223, and I can tell you there is a place for both. If I had to chose between the two I would probably pick the .223. As silly as it seems the .223 is more versatile and cheaper to shoot. However, there is something about this little fire cracker .204 that is amazingly effective against ground squirrels, Prairie Dogs, and the like.
@@royjohnson465 you would have to check your specific rifle to confirm. I would not want to give you misleading information. My understanding is you can shoot .223 in a 5.56, but maybe not the other way around. Someone more knowledgeable or your specific rifle will tell you if you can.
@@JoeAroner-SIWAYTV Thank you!! I heard the 223 Wylde handles both. The 223 Wylde is a hybrid "rifle chamber" designed to allow 22 caliber barrels to fire safely both the 223 Remington and 5.56 NATO with better accuracy. >>>While the 223 Remington and 5.56 NATO "rifle chambers" have slightly different dimensions "BUT" the two "cartridges" have identical exterior dimensions.>>"more accurate"
Hi Ron.. What bullets would you use for long range varmint hunting? What about 55 grn bullets? What twist would you want for the .243 with 55 grn bullets may I ask in say a 22 inch barrel let's say? Thanks so much! Regards from south central Indiana. Tim
Ron qbout 8 years ago I got my first 25-06. Found it to be a great cartridge. The 25-05 gets over looked way to often. 3 years ago I was blessed to be the second owner to a custom built 244. Now most , (I didn't at the time) know it's the 7x57 case to a 6mm. I hand load mine with a 95gr sst and wow does it work well on northern Michigan whitetails. I'm always on the lookout for a 6mm Remington but to few an far between. That's one I wish they would revive. I have enough room in my rifle to seat a 108gr hornady and going to see if my rifle will hold a group. The man that built it was a master gunsmith and had this barrel made for 100 gr bullets like the 243 win. Ever heard of anyone building a 6mm remington A.I ?? With a 1.9.5 twist I think that would be a great combination. Ur thoughts???
Lyle, I, too, am a 6mm Rem. fan. I like the 244 Rem. title even more! If only they'd given the initial rifles a 1:9 twist barrel... But, as you've discovered, we can do that now. Adding the Ackley flare might increase powder volume 10%. Ackley showed 3,452 fps MV for his 244 AI in Vol. 1 Handbook for Shooters and Reloaders. Oddly, he included data for the 244 Rem Improved Mashburn which hit 3,450 fps with 100 grain bullets. He didn't specify barrel length for recording either data. I think if you're wildcatting the 6mm you might want to extend your rifle's magazine box so you can take advantage of the new 105 to 115-gr. bullets. Throat the barrel to match. Good luck.
Ron, the 223 rem cartridge you show next to the 204 Ruger in the thumbnail photo for this video seems to be the same size or maybe a bit larger than the 204. isn't the 204 built on the 222 Rem mag? correct me if I'm wrong but the 222 rem mag is longer.
The whole predatory population subject becomes very complicated, depending on the territory. Territories around Yellowstone now have predators that are not indigenous so you could make the argument that there are no healthy numbers of those types of predators. I believe in the ability to hunt all creatures as long as they are not endangered. Many of these predators are dangerous to people and that needs to be dealt with. In addition you can also argue that healthy deer, sheep, and elk populations help the outfitter that has to put food on his family's table. I would like to see the lodge loosened up a bit for predatory hunting. I think it's best in serving the community
Been thinking about adding a 204 to the collection. It got me thinking about cartridges like the 222 Remington and the 17 Remington, and why those aren't more popular than they are. I did have a chance at an older Winchester Model 70 chambered in 225 Winchester, but it was a few hundred more than I wanted to spend and reloading components are hard to come by. It's unfortunate because the ballistics look pretty solid.
"204 to the collection. It got me thinking about cartridges like the 222 Remington and the 17 Remington, and why those aren't more popular than they are." Because there is .223 which is mass-produced by everybody and very cheap compared to the 3 you have listed. And there are 40gr bullets for it if you want the extra speed. 223 and 308 are like large planets which clear the space around them, and in general around 22 there is no 21 or 23 cal, and around 30 there is no 29 or 31 cal.
Not like I've detail compared the ballistics side-by-side.. however... I have to imagine Hornady, with their .223 Rem 35gr NTX loading @ 4000fps... pretty much took away whatever future/continuing market the .204 Ruger perhaps would have had.
The northern Rockies are islands surrounded by a sea of humanity. The state has quit a LOT of the winter elk feeding program. There is a lot of pressure from the uber-rich residents around Jackson to close the National Elk Refuge so that land can e developed.\ The Elk feeding areas draw and hold elk and the wolves do hang around them. The Yellowstone North Herd has dropped from an average of 17,000 elk to less than 3500. The problem is that the "balance" point populations of elk are a lot lower than prior to wolf reintroduction
Would love to have one , but the price and availability of ammo makes it unreasonable for me. 223 rem all day if I want to get out past 200 range of my 22lr shooting.
Im thinking BS i've shot my 22 lrs with 16, 18, 20, and 24 inch barrels I've went to 24s because they are more accurate. I have my fathers b42 and it has a 26 inch barrel and it is deadly out over 100 yards with any ammo even the Trash remington. It will shoot golf balls @ 100 yards open sights. and any ammo, i've found 99% of my other are very picky about ammo. I love my 204 it's wicked fast and very accurate...
Excellent wildlife management info and interesting part about barrel length. Also seems like after 22 long rifle next step up may as well be 243 winchester
But for the price of ammo and availability. I finally found some fory $38 plus tax a box at a local gun/ammo shop here in Ohio. Contrast that with the 87¢ a shot for some 55gr varmint tipped stuff I got from ammo seek....
Yes Bell shot elephant in the brain. He also body shot them, finding and recovering the ivory...the only thing he took....by following the vultures. Every time 7x57....Bell this...Bell that. No Saint, not a particular great example.
I was super sad to see Lapua drop the 7mm Mauser brass. I used it as a good source of 6mm Rem brass. The 6mm Remington is another great round that has fallen into obscurity. As far as Barnes X bullets I have many boxes of them I bought, when I was young and dumb, and jumped on the copper bullet bandwagon. I shot two whitetails with them and probably will never shoot another one. The bullet came out the same size it went in almost no wound channel at all. The first deer was a doe shot at about 30yds and the only reason I found it was a white belly in a clear-cut. She ran over 400yds. The next deer shot was the largest buck I've ever seen while hunting. Shot him at about 20yds in a hardwood thicket. We tracked him for about a quarter of a mile and lost his track. Wish I had my bow instead of a Barnes X!
When talking about predators and game animals, don't forget about the Auto insurance industry. They don't care if you enjoy hunting. They do care about paying to have your vehicle repaired from game animal collision. Want your hunting back? Focus on Auto insurance.
In BC they want to increase cow and calf moose tags to decrease the wolf population (lowering their food supply) in an attempt to help protect caribou populations. Very strange concept that no hunters and local natives agree with here.
@@joeyindahl2593 maybe the thought process is that with a lesser food supply they won't reproduce as much? I don't know... sounds odd to me, though it is interesting. I'd love to hear what the experts say about it.
@@marcmoore4115 wolves aren't smart enough to stop breeding due to the lack of available food, the population will decline by wolves starving. After a few years maybe it will work, but it is a lot more effective to just have a solid predator management program.
